Gruden, who loves all QBs, couldn't take Hackenberg for more than a month - wow!
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The Raiders acquired Hackenberg from the New York Jets on May 22 in exchange for a conditional seventh-round draft pick in 2019. Oakland will now keep the pick, per NFL Network Insider Ian Rapoport.
Chris Simms (who's opinion I can take or leave, but did play as a QB under Gruden) says basically Gruden loves having lots of QB's (more than most teams) in the QB room early in the offseason then whittles them down. It's just his thing, he thinks the more guys you have in the room the easier the installment.
RE: RE: Is it just me or do the Raiders have many QBs?
Chris Simms (who's opinion I can take or leave, but did play as a QB under Gruden) says basically Gruden loves having lots of QB's (more than most teams) in the QB room early in the offseason then whittles them down. It's just his thing, he thinks the more guys you have in the room the easier the installment.
I enjoy listening to Chris Simms. He tells it like it is.
RE: RE: RE: Is it just me or do the Raiders have many QBs?
Chris Simms (who's opinion I can take or leave, but did play as a QB under Gruden) says basically Gruden loves having lots of QB's (more than most teams) in the QB room early in the offseason then whittles them down. It's just his thing, he thinks the more guys you have in the room the easier the installment.
I enjoy listening to Chris Simms. He tells it like it is.
I'm not the biggest fan of his talent evaluations, like his Dad, it all seems to be about the physical freaks.
for him, or was it conditional? Even though it was "only" a 7th rounder, why would you even give that up for a guy who was SO BAD, that the Jets couldn't even trust him enough to give him reps in preseason games!
I cannot think of another QB drafted that high who, in 2 seasons, never even saw preseason action. It makes me question the Raiders judgement in thinking this guy was even worth a 7th rounder.
O'Brien (and his staff) left, in came Franklin & the kid hasn't been the same since. Wouldn't be surprised if the Texans take a flyer as OB might be the only one who can resurrect this kid at this point!
for him, or was it conditional? Even though it was "only" a 7th rounder, why would you even give that up for a guy who was SO BAD, that the Jets couldn't even trust him enough to give him reps in preseason games!
I cannot think of another QB drafted that high who, in 2 seasons, never even saw preseason action. It makes me question the Raiders judgement in thinking this guy was even worth a 7th rounder.
A 7th rounder is the NFL equivalent of a $1 bill. Players drafted that late are almost always disposable.
Even if it wasn't conditional, if the Raiders thought there was a remote possibility that he might pan out, and there was any interest from another team, it was worth it for them to spend the 7th to see him up close.
I agree that Hackenberg stinks, but that's the state of the NFL as far as QBs go, the massive desperation to find NFL level QB talent has people buying lottery tickets.
The guy showed promise early in his Penn State career but began regressing in college and hasn't been able to reverse the trend since. Incredibly maddening and erratic. Joke of a 2nd round pick
RE: Kid was an outstanding QB under O'Brien at PSU
O'Brien (and his staff) left, in came Franklin & the kid hasn't been the same since. Wouldn't be surprised if the Texans take a flyer as OB might be the only one who can resurrect this kid at this point!
Hackenberg pretty much put the blame of his shitty college performance on Franklin, should have been a red flag right there. Not sure why Hackenberg didn't pursue a graduate transfer instead of leaving for the NFL early, but clearly, he does not have the goods.
RE: Kid was an outstanding QB under O'Brien at PSU
O'Brien (and his staff) left, in came Franklin & the kid hasn't been the same since. Wouldn't be surprised if the Texans take a flyer as OB might be the only one who can resurrect this kid at this point!
At some point it's time to stop blaming Franklin and conclude the kid just isn't any good.
coaches have to ask themselves what it even means to resurrect a guy.
A guy like Kerry Collins was salvaged, but he already had promise.
Trying to take a scrub and make him a salvageable backup seems like a waste of time to me, considering how many excellent backup options there already are.
NFL history isn't littered with a lot of guys who were considered lost causes who made an ascension to stardom that weren't already guys who played at a high level prior.
I cannot think of another QB drafted that high who, in 2 seasons, never even saw preseason action. It makes me question the Raiders judgement in thinking this guy was even worth a 7th rounder.
This year, the Bills picked Josh Allen in the first!
O'Brien (and his staff) left, in came Franklin & the kid hasn't been the same since. Wouldn't be surprised if the Texans take a flyer as OB might be the only one who can resurrect this kid at this point!
Hackenberg pretty much put the blame of his shitty college performance on Franklin, should have been a red flag right there. Not sure why Hackenberg didn't pursue a graduate transfer instead of leaving for the NFL early, but clearly, he does not have the goods.
Not sure I agree - given how he fared in the NFL, I don't think he would have done any better staying in college. He got drafted in the 2nd round!
You could call it lucky that someone would be so stupid, but at the same time him putting more film down was much more likely to hurt than to help him.
something horrific. I cannot believe he didn't go undrafted.
2013 58.9%
2014 55.8%
2015 53.5%
Yep. He's coming along nicely.
I watched a lot of him in 2013/2014. There are some comparisons to be made to Josh Allen. Allen has better footwork in the pocket, less stiff and statuesque. But the maddening inaccuracy and huh throws are definitely there
something horrific. I cannot believe he didn't go undrafted.
2013 58.9%
2014 55.8%
2015 53.5%
Yep. He's coming along nicely.
I watched a lot of him in 2013/2014. There are some comparisons to be made to Josh Allen. Allen has better footwork in the pocket, less stiff and statuesque. But the maddening inaccuracy and huh throws are definitely there
Being under 60% at the college level usually spells the end to a possible NFL career.
Hackenberg struggled with accuracy in high school all the way to the NFL.
His freshman year at Penn State was a huge anomaly because he had a stud NFL WR and two future NFL TEs to throw to. He also had another TE who would be in the NFL now if he didn't have to give up football due to chronic knee injuries.
He also had three OL who would go on to start multiple NFL games.
Even with that he still only completed 55% of his passes and had more INTs than TDs.
He likes to blame the coaching change, but that wasn't the problem. He just wasn't that good.
this draft, but the comparisons to that stiff Hackenberg are way off base. Yes, Hack has a good arm, but nowhere in Allen's league, and Allen is a far superior athlete. I get why teams would be wowed by Allen's potential, I just don't think his problems are easy to fix.
Hackenberg just wasn't very good. Very inaccurate, and his footwork was just awful. He had possibly the worst pocket awareness I have seen in a legitimate prospect. He was a brutally bad pick.
O'Brien (and his staff) left, in came Franklin & the kid hasn't been the same since. Wouldn't be surprised if the Texans take a flyer as OB might be the only one who can resurrect this kid at this point!
Hackenberg pretty much put the blame of his shitty college performance on Franklin, should have been a red flag right there. Not sure why Hackenberg didn't pursue a graduate transfer instead of leaving for the NFL early, but clearly, he does not have the goods.
Not sure I agree - given how he fared in the NFL, I don't think he would have done any better staying in college. He got drafted in the 2nd round!
You could call it lucky that someone would be so stupid, but at the same time him putting more film down was much more likely to hurt than to help him.
I'm not saying that would have been the solution for him, but many quarterbacks who leave school after only three years struggle as it is. Yeah, he was drafted in the second round, and two years later, he's struggling to stay on a team. Who knows, but given a fresh start somewhere else would have seemed like a better option to me.
& saw him a lot at Penn State. I was floored the Jets took him in the 2nd round.
Yea it was a terrible pick, but 2016 wasn't the deepest draft and was really starting to thin out midway through the 2nd round. If the Jets were going to take a shot at a project that was the time to do it.
RE: Kid was an outstanding QB under O'Brien at PSU
O'Brien (and his staff) left, in came Franklin & the kid hasn't been the same since. Wouldn't be surprised if the Texans take a flyer as OB might be the only one who can resurrect this kid at this point!
O'Brien did a nice job with him but he also had a chance to draft Hack coming out of college and passed on him. Which tells you he doesn't want the trouble of coaching him up again just to maybe squeeze a mediocre performance out of a guy who would ordinarily be awful. Also he's got Deshaun Watson now so Hackenberg is probably the furthest thing from his mind
Now that we have Darnold turning into a phenom before our eyes and wowing the coaches with how well he's throwing and how rapidly he's learning things, we can all look back at Hackenberg and laugh.
& saw him a lot at Penn State. I was floored the Jets took him in the 2nd round.
Yea it was a terrible pick, but 2016 wasn't the deepest draft and was really starting to thin out midway through the 2nd round. If the Jets were going to take a shot at a project that was the time to do it.
You don't take projects in the 2nd round. Yes, 2016 wasn't a great draft, but there were still plenty of good players available when NYJ picked Hack. That said, I hope Darnold works out for you.
Chris Simms (who's opinion I can take or leave, but did play as a QB under Gruden) says basically Gruden loves having lots of QB's (more than most teams) in the QB room early in the offseason then whittles them down. It's just his thing, he thinks the more guys you have in the room the easier the installment.
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Chris Simms (who's opinion I can take or leave, but did play as a QB under Gruden) says basically Gruden loves having lots of QB's (more than most teams) in the QB room early in the offseason then whittles them down. It's just his thing, he thinks the more guys you have in the room the easier the installment.
I enjoy listening to Chris Simms. He tells it like it is.
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In comment 13989950 TommytheElephant said:
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Chris Simms (who's opinion I can take or leave, but did play as a QB under Gruden) says basically Gruden loves having lots of QB's (more than most teams) in the QB room early in the offseason then whittles them down. It's just his thing, he thinks the more guys you have in the room the easier the installment.
I enjoy listening to Chris Simms. He tells it like it is.
I'm not the biggest fan of his talent evaluations, like his Dad, it all seems to be about the physical freaks.
I cannot think of another QB drafted that high who, in 2 seasons, never even saw preseason action. It makes me question the Raiders judgement in thinking this guy was even worth a 7th rounder.
I cannot think of another QB drafted that high who, in 2 seasons, never even saw preseason action. It makes me question the Raiders judgement in thinking this guy was even worth a 7th rounder.
A 7th rounder is the NFL equivalent of a $1 bill. Players drafted that late are almost always disposable.
Even if it wasn't conditional, if the Raiders thought there was a remote possibility that he might pan out, and there was any interest from another team, it was worth it for them to spend the 7th to see him up close.
I agree that Hackenberg stinks, but that's the state of the NFL as far as QBs go, the massive desperation to find NFL level QB talent has people buying lottery tickets.
Hackenberg pretty much put the blame of his shitty college performance on Franklin, should have been a red flag right there. Not sure why Hackenberg didn't pursue a graduate transfer instead of leaving for the NFL early, but clearly, he does not have the goods.
At some point it's time to stop blaming Franklin and conclude the kid just isn't any good.
A guy like Kerry Collins was salvaged, but he already had promise.
Trying to take a scrub and make him a salvageable backup seems like a waste of time to me, considering how many excellent backup options there already are.
NFL history isn't littered with a lot of guys who were considered lost causes who made an ascension to stardom that weren't already guys who played at a high level prior.
I cannot think of another QB drafted that high who, in 2 seasons, never even saw preseason action. It makes me question the Raiders judgement in thinking this guy was even worth a 7th rounder.
This year, the Bills picked Josh Allen in the first!
2013 58.9%
2014 55.8%
2015 53.5%
Yep. He's coming along nicely.
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O'Brien (and his staff) left, in came Franklin & the kid hasn't been the same since. Wouldn't be surprised if the Texans take a flyer as OB might be the only one who can resurrect this kid at this point!
Hackenberg pretty much put the blame of his shitty college performance on Franklin, should have been a red flag right there. Not sure why Hackenberg didn't pursue a graduate transfer instead of leaving for the NFL early, but clearly, he does not have the goods.
Not sure I agree - given how he fared in the NFL, I don't think he would have done any better staying in college. He got drafted in the 2nd round!
You could call it lucky that someone would be so stupid, but at the same time him putting more film down was much more likely to hurt than to help him.
2013 58.9%
2014 55.8%
2015 53.5%
Yep. He's coming along nicely.
I watched a lot of him in 2013/2014. There are some comparisons to be made to Josh Allen. Allen has better footwork in the pocket, less stiff and statuesque. But the maddening inaccuracy and huh throws are definitely there
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something horrific. I cannot believe he didn't go undrafted.
2013 58.9%
2014 55.8%
2015 53.5%
Yep. He's coming along nicely.
I watched a lot of him in 2013/2014. There are some comparisons to be made to Josh Allen. Allen has better footwork in the pocket, less stiff and statuesque. But the maddening inaccuracy and huh throws are definitely there
Being under 60% at the college level usually spells the end to a possible NFL career.
His freshman year at Penn State was a huge anomaly because he had a stud NFL WR and two future NFL TEs to throw to. He also had another TE who would be in the NFL now if he didn't have to give up football due to chronic knee injuries.
He also had three OL who would go on to start multiple NFL games.
Even with that he still only completed 55% of his passes and had more INTs than TDs.
He likes to blame the coaching change, but that wasn't the problem. He just wasn't that good.
But still. He had a dream scenario for a freshman QB.
Hackenberg just wasn't very good. Very inaccurate, and his footwork was just awful. He had possibly the worst pocket awareness I have seen in a legitimate prospect. He was a brutally bad pick.
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In comment 13990077 TheMick7 said:
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O'Brien (and his staff) left, in came Franklin & the kid hasn't been the same since. Wouldn't be surprised if the Texans take a flyer as OB might be the only one who can resurrect this kid at this point!
Hackenberg pretty much put the blame of his shitty college performance on Franklin, should have been a red flag right there. Not sure why Hackenberg didn't pursue a graduate transfer instead of leaving for the NFL early, but clearly, he does not have the goods.
Not sure I agree - given how he fared in the NFL, I don't think he would have done any better staying in college. He got drafted in the 2nd round!
You could call it lucky that someone would be so stupid, but at the same time him putting more film down was much more likely to hurt than to help him.
I'm not saying that would have been the solution for him, but many quarterbacks who leave school after only three years struggle as it is. Yeah, he was drafted in the second round, and two years later, he's struggling to stay on a team. Who knows, but given a fresh start somewhere else would have seemed like a better option to me.
Yea it was a terrible pick, but 2016 wasn't the deepest draft and was really starting to thin out midway through the 2nd round. If the Jets were going to take a shot at a project that was the time to do it.
O'Brien did a nice job with him but he also had a chance to draft Hack coming out of college and passed on him. Which tells you he doesn't want the trouble of coaching him up again just to maybe squeeze a mediocre performance out of a guy who would ordinarily be awful. Also he's got Deshaun Watson now so Hackenberg is probably the furthest thing from his mind
Now that we have Darnold turning into a phenom before our eyes and wowing the coaches with how well he's throwing and how rapidly he's learning things, we can all look back at Hackenberg and laugh.
Quote:
& saw him a lot at Penn State. I was floored the Jets took him in the 2nd round.
Yea it was a terrible pick, but 2016 wasn't the deepest draft and was really starting to thin out midway through the 2nd round. If the Jets were going to take a shot at a project that was the time to do it.
You don't take projects in the 2nd round. Yes, 2016 wasn't a great draft, but there were still plenty of good players available when NYJ picked Hack. That said, I hope Darnold works out for you.