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NFT: Baseball attendance down by 6.6%

Les in TO : 6/15/2018 4:01 pm
Good article in the WSJ today on decline in baseball attendance. Down9%overalland about7% on a per game basis factoring in
rained out games. So it’s not only the NFL that is dealing with fan interest decline.
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Cost is too high for all pro sports  
Bobby Humphrey's Earpad : 6/15/2018 4:04 pm : link
.
Haven’t read it but not surprising  
UConn4523 : 6/15/2018 4:05 pm : link
it’s so damn expensive and time consuming to go to games. Watching at home is a great experience. MLB also does a horrible job marketing it’s stars.
BHEP nails it  
wigs in nyc : 6/15/2018 4:05 pm : link
It's hard to justify going to a game, when there's no extra cost in HD, with surround sound, and my own beer at home.
RE: Cost is too high for all pro sports  
superspynyg : 6/15/2018 4:08 pm : link
In comment 13992194 Bobby Humphrey's Earpad said:
Quote:
.


Agreed . The goa. Should be to get people in the stands. Lower prices dramatically.
Is NFL attendance sown?  
pjcas18 : 6/15/2018 4:08 pm : link
i thought attendance was steady but viewership was down.

there is a difference.

Serious question, I don't know the answer.
Also PSLs are killing sports  
superspynyg : 6/15/2018 4:08 pm : link
Greedy owners.
.  
pjcas18 : 6/15/2018 4:08 pm : link
*down*
Add in weather at games played & tax code change  
njm : 6/15/2018 4:10 pm : link
Cost is certainly a factor, but who wants to sit in 45 degree overcast weather to watch them squeeze in a game? And the tickets are non-deductible now as an entertainment expense

Yep  
Csonka : 6/15/2018 4:11 pm : link
It was a treat to go to a baseball or football game when the alternative was my 25" TV. Now it's a treat to stay home and avoid the cost, travel time, weather and hassle.
...  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 6/15/2018 4:14 pm : link
I'd rather sit on my couch in my mancave with a couple of brews than attend most sporting events.
no longer America's pastime  
fanofthejets : 6/15/2018 4:14 pm : link
Well a lot of the NFL fan interest decline is self inflicted

With baseball, I just get the idea the game itself does not captivate the imagination of the youth of America as it once did. It is more methodical and cerebral and that just doesn't appeal to a dumber, more impatient generation.
Can’t comment on the article since I don’t have a subscription  
Jim in Fairfax : 6/15/2018 4:14 pm : link
But the two big factors are weather and tanking.

Weather you can’t control — just a very bad spring weather wise. But the tanking is the new factor. 6 teams currently have records under .400, which will easily break the record if it holds. Funnily enough, fans don’t want to go to games that are uncompetitive and watch teams with no stars.
It's cost....but it's also all the shitty teams  
Greg from LI : 6/15/2018 4:14 pm : link
Most of the American League is trash this year
I can agree that I'd rather see a football game at home  
Greg from LI : 6/15/2018 4:15 pm : link
But baseball is meant to be watched live
...  
christian : 6/15/2018 4:17 pm : link
Yawn. Revisit in August.

Cold spring in East coast.
Cost is crazy.  
section125 : 6/15/2018 4:18 pm : link
I think the weather is right behind the expense of attending a game as the reasons. As mentioned who wants to attend an outside game early April in rain and cold.

Also, the number of teams virtually tanking and dumping stars to save money. Example is the Marlins. They are not a well attended team anyway and then sending all the good players away really kills the attendance further. Baltimore playing so poorly.
I’m wondering what  
Burt64 : 6/15/2018 4:20 pm : link
The next logical step is.

I wonder if they would ever be so bold as to not air the game live in the local market. If you want to see it live, you have to go. Otherwise it’s aired on say a 10 minute delay.
I mean  
NewFakeDannyHeep : 6/15/2018 4:20 pm : link
I'm definitely not going to pay to watch the Mets right now.
It's cost/convenience/entertainment value elsewhere  
Eric on Li : 6/15/2018 4:21 pm : link
you can watch the game on TV and it's a great experience in its' own right. The declining ratings for all of these sports isn't specific to sports - everything on TV has declined for the past decade+. The TV rights are still extremely valuable as well as the streaming.

The core thing is that the world has changed (way more entertainment options for both kids and adults) and the leagues have not done a good job continuing to expand their fanbases. They thought they were untouchable and now they are seeing they weren't. In the NFL's case they put short term growth ahead of the long term health of the game and then stopped growing while also pissing off most hardcore fans.
.  
Danny Kanell : 6/15/2018 4:22 pm : link
The weather has been abnormally bad in most of the Northeast / Midwest cities this spring. Especially here in the Northeast. I know I've personally said no to 3 Yankee games already this year from brokers I do business with because the weather was so shitty the day of. It wasn't worth the trek into the Bronx, even for free tickets and free booze.
Another tidbit from the article  
Les in TO : 6/15/2018 4:24 pm : link
The drop in per game attendance this year is the biggest since 1995which was the post lockout year
...  
christian : 6/15/2018 4:29 pm : link
When the pennant races kick up and Boston, New York, Chicago, Southern California, Houston and Seattle are in play the outlook will be very different.

And when the average MLB experience is south of $40 all in, it's pretty hard to pin on cost.
RE: ...  
Danny Kanell : 6/15/2018 4:38 pm : link
In comment 13992228 christian said:
Quote:
When the pennant races kick up and Boston, New York, Chicago, Southern California, Houston and Seattle are in play the outlook will be very different.

And when the average MLB experience is south of $40 all in, it's pretty hard to pin on cost.


$40 all in? That's what it costs just to park at alot of these stadiums.
RE: Is NFL attendance sown?  
Mad Mike : 6/15/2018 4:39 pm : link
In comment 13992199 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
i thought attendance was steady but viewership was down.

there is a difference.

Serious question, I don't know the answer.

It was down about 3% in 2017, after going up in 2016. And although all these leagues report tickets sold rather than turnstile attendance, presumably reported attendance in the NFL overstates actual attendance more than baseball because so many of the tickets are season tickets. If you're bummed about the Mets, you stop buying tickets, and your absence is reflected in lower ticket sales. If you were bummed about the Giants last year, maybe you found a friend or buyer, or maybe you just ate the tickets.
I miss the days of being able to  
MBavaro : 6/15/2018 4:42 pm : link
go to the Big O on a whim, pay $15 at the ticket booth, and sit a dozen rows up on the third base line.

This was less than 20 years ago....
RE: RE: ...  
Mad Mike : 6/15/2018 4:45 pm : link
In comment 13992232 Danny Kanell said:
Quote:
$40 all in? That's what it costs just to park at alot of these stadiums.

According to this link, almost every team can be attended for less than $40 per person, with one hot dog and one beer, and two people splitting parking. That said, they're taking the cheapest seats (and presumably cheapest beers and hot dogs as well). Obviously lots of fans don't like the cheap seats, though on the flip side, they're taking face value. Even at YS, it's typically pretty easy to find seats below face in the secondary market.
link - ( New Window )
I'd like to see this broken down by month  
Ron from Ninerland : 6/15/2018 4:52 pm : link
The weather in April was historically bad. How much did that factor in ?
...  
christian : 6/15/2018 5:02 pm : link
Purely anecdotal -- even in the heat of a pennant race last year tickets at Yankee Stadium tickets were below face for every series aside from Boston in every section 200 and above.

I'm a bleacher and cheap beer fan, so baseball is cheaper for me in the city than a movie.
I think it's because of the football players kneeling.  
yatqb : 6/15/2018 5:08 pm : link
.
RE: ...  
Bobby Humphrey's Earpad : 6/15/2018 5:10 pm : link
In comment 13992244 christian said:
Quote:
Purely anecdotal -- even in the heat of a pennant race last year tickets at Yankee Stadium tickets were below face for every series aside from Boston in every section 200 and above.

I'm a bleacher and cheap beer fan, so baseball is cheaper for me in the city than a movie.


When the Cubs were tanking, I was able to take the train from midtown Chicago to Addison and pay for a bleacher seat for a midweek game against the equally shitty Brewers for just over $40. Did not include beer or food.
RE: no longer America's pastime  
njm : 6/15/2018 5:14 pm : link
In comment 13992211 fanofthejets said:
Quote:
a dumber, more impatient generation.


Well, clearly true when you're talking about Jets fans.
For me  
lawguy9801 : 6/15/2018 5:22 pm : link
between work, kids' activities, the headache of getting from Long Island to Yankee Stadium, overpriced tickets and food, and the relative unimportance of one out of 162 regular season games, I have almost no time or desire to go.

Couple those things with the way the Yankees have conducted business at the new Yankee Stadium, and it's all been a huge turnoff for me. It's all about maximizing every last dollar at the expense of a positive and affordable experience for their fans. It's just galling to turn on a game and see empty seats right behind the plate because the people with those tickets, if anyone even used them, are inside at the various restaurants or bars. Overall, it's led to me following the team less and caring about them less.

I went from being a die-hard fan 15 years ago to almost not giving a shit at all about the Yankees.
With wage growth  
bubba0825 : 6/15/2018 5:24 pm : link
Stagnate over the past 15 years discretionary spending is starting to hit a tipping point IMO. Combined with technology and how in fan friendly the big 4 are it’s going to continue. The nba plays in smaller arena that have a large number of seats picked up by businesses so I think it will take longer for attendance to suffer
Attendance Was Far Less in Previous Decades  
Simms2McConkey : 6/15/2018 5:27 pm : link
In his autobiography, Marty Appel (former Yankees PR guy) wrote about declining interest and attendance in the 70s, when it was far cheaper to go to games. See a link below for proof (some of this can be attested to more weekday afternoon games, when many people are obviously working).

Relative to baseball's history, attendance is still in pretty good shape despite the decline.

I think a lot of it is weather-based -- I got free tickets to a Yankees-Orioles game in mid-April and didn't even want to go because it was 35 degrees out -- although my gut tells me that kids are probably less interested in the sport than they were, say, 20 years ago.
1970s Baseball Attendance - ( New Window )
RE: Attendance Was Far Less in Previous Decades  
lawguy9801 : 6/15/2018 5:33 pm : link
In comment 13992265 Simms2McConkey said:
Quote:
In his autobiography, Marty Appel (former Yankees PR guy) wrote about declining interest and attendance in the 70s, when it was far cheaper to go to games. See a link below for proof (some of this can be attested to more weekday afternoon games, when many people are obviously working).

Relative to baseball's history, attendance is still in pretty good shape despite the decline.

I think a lot of it is weather-based -- I got free tickets to a Yankees-Orioles game in mid-April and didn't even want to go because it was 35 degrees out -- although my gut tells me that kids are probably less interested in the sport than they were, say, 20 years ago. 1970s Baseball Attendance - ( New Window )


The Bronx was also a lot less safe in the 70s.
Baseball sucks  
XBRONX : 6/15/2018 5:38 pm : link
in person. Much better viewing on TV
RE: I’m wondering what  
Jay in Toronto : 6/15/2018 6:40 pm : link
In comment 13992217 Burt64 said:
Quote:
The next logical step is.

I wonder if they would ever be so bold as to not air the game live in the local market. If you want to see it live, you have to go. Otherwise it’s aired on say a 10 minute delay.


!0 minute delay is no big deal. If they will blackout, the long term impact would be to send viewers to the Net to get visitor team feed.
RE: I’m wondering what  
Mad Mike : 6/15/2018 6:41 pm : link
In comment 13992217 Burt64 said:
Quote:
The next logical step is.

I wonder if they would ever be so bold as to not air the game live in the local market. If you want to see it live, you have to go. Otherwise it’s aired on say a 10 minute delay.

I'm not sure bold is the word I would use, but no, they would never do that.
It’s crazy that  
Pete in MD : 6/15/2018 7:03 pm : link
they have to gouge you on cencessions too. We are literally paying money to watch your team play a game that most of us can play on our own, just at a lower level. But then you have to charge me $5 for a $0.50 hot dog and $8 for a $2 beer. Just charge normal prices and everything is cool. You have multi-millionaires who feel the need to squeeze every dime out of the mostly middle class fans who love their team.

And it’s funny that people think it’s so great that the Falcons and Ravens have lowered their concession prices. Don’t get me wrong, it’s a good thing to do but they don’t deserve a pat on the back. It’s like that comedian who said, “I finally got off of drugs.” After the applause he says, “Don’t give me credit, give the people credit who never got on drugs.”
I'm guilty also  
DennyInDenville : 6/15/2018 7:09 pm : link
I usually goto 10-20 games a year

The cost just adds up when you have 55 inch HDTVs selling for 300 bucks these days offering a cheaper more relaxing option if you live in jersey or anywhere

I'll still make myself goto atleast 2-4 games to support the Yankees, I will spend lots of money at the stadium they deserve my money, this team is great. Almost feel guilty adding to this statistic

NBA ratings  
Metnut : 6/15/2018 7:24 pm : link
and ticket prices keep going up while baseball attendance is falling and ratings are flat. Baseball needs to improve the pace of the game and add more action (less BBs and Ks) to reach the younger generations. Otherwise, it’ll just be a local sport where people only watch when the local team is making a run.
Weather has to be a material factor...  
bw in dc : 6/15/2018 7:28 pm : link
There have been more cancellations than last year’s total.

I have Nats tickets and have given away over half so far. Just haven’t caught the baseball bug yet - for some reason...
Cost is the primary reason  
Mark from Jersey : 6/15/2018 7:32 pm : link
why I do not go to more hockey or baseball games. Its just way too expensive. $100 a ticket for a decent ticket? Food parking, etc its a $500 day or more.
Rangers tickets are extremely expensive  
bubba0825 : 6/15/2018 8:04 pm : link
Even for a midweek game in January. I don’t understand the NBA love to me it’s borderline unwatchable considering how uncompetitive the league is
Baseball can boring in person  
moespree : 6/15/2018 8:49 pm : link
On top of that it's hot since it's summer and there's bugs and loudmouths. If that isn't bad enough there is the prolonged trek back to the car or train after the game with thousands of people all moving at once. I'll take the 50+ inch flat screen with central AC.
Very Soon  
Sammo85 : 6/15/2018 9:08 pm : link
The leagues will force a hand on the networks and finagle it to be where fans have to buy to watch any game on TV. It’s coming, question is how soon and how much.

I don't  
capegman : 6/15/2018 9:58 pm : link
go much because the parking in Boston is horrible to find and to pay for. I can get cheap tickets but that's actually less expensive than the parking and the food expenses usually.
As people have mentioned weather was historically bad in  
bhill410 : 6/15/2018 10:00 pm : link
April which largely accounts for this so imo kind of a non story. The White Sox had what 800 people in attendance For that one game? Think about how that will screw with averages
Yeah, lots of awful, cold, damp weather...  
manh george : 6/15/2018 10:09 pm : link
in the northeast, mid-Atlantic and parts of midwest right through most of May.

Also, lots of people taping either Fox or MSNBC and baseball at the same time. No political comment intended.
RE: RE: ...  
02/03/2008 : 6/15/2018 10:31 pm : link
Costs are too high even with a discount. Don’t see them cutting salaries or owners profits anytime soon.

$200 for four of us Yankees in B’more w kids getting in free w adult ticket purchase, plus beer, ice cream, parking, lunch etc. and that is a great deal. It adds up fast for most families and a 2hr rain delay. Not too big a deal for us, but still high for a day out and bored kids.

I’ll take my kids to a minor league game for less than half the cost and sit closer to the game.

Spectator sports in general are headed for a rude awakening.

Don’t want to pay a grand to take my boys to a Giants game all said and done to watch a poor NFL product. Can throw a heck of a party at my house and fast forward through all the commercials.

NHL games are outrageous too. Looked into Rangers tix mid season up in the 400s and said forget about it. Don’t care about basketball.

Too much greed in pro sports.

LJust take my kids to local college games and have just as much fun.


In comment 13992232 Danny Kanell said:
Quote:
In comment 13992228 christian said:


Quote:


When the pennant races kick up and Boston, New York, Chicago, Southern California, Houston and Seattle are in play the outlook will be very different.

And when the average MLB experience is south of $40 all in, it's pretty hard to pin on cost.



$40 all in? That's what it costs just to park at alot of these stadiums.
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