for display only
Big Blue Interactive The Corner Forum  
Back to the Corner

Archived Thread

NFT: Westworld Season 2, Ep9

Tony in Tampa : 6/18/2018 7:29 am
-MiB appears to be a host whose consciousness has been downloaded from William. At least that’s what his profile shows when his wife displays it on their computer. He is: “Subject 2” so we can presume that he is the second attempt after James Delos. If so it raise questions about what he has been searching for all along and what is the game he’s been driven to play. But it also explains why he was able to survive all the gunshots from Ep7 that should have been fatal. The fact that her husband was less of the William she fell in love with and more of an evil, theme park creation looks to be the cause of his wife’s suicide.

-In what seems to be a mistake driven by MiB’s hatred of Ford and wanting to stop being manipulated in “Ford’s game” MiB kills his daughter Emily who he thought was a host sent by Ford. The Emily host could not have known things about his profile-of which he had told no one-but then he finds his profile card in her hands after he shoots her. It’s left to be seen if he actually shot his real daughter who was only trying to save him from himself or another manipulation.

-One cool reveal: Cowboy hats are brain scanners.

-Teddy’s dead, again. In apparent conflict between his love for Deloris and not being able to live with the monster that she has turned him into (and the monster that she has turned into), he ends it all.

-Bernard appears to delete the Ford package from his system, but we’ll see.

-Clementine is a new weapon for Delos and Charlotte.

-For the second week we have a main character express deep feelings for Maeve as she lays on the gurney apparently dying. Last week Sizemore, this week Ford-who it turns out sees Maeve as his favorite creation and has love for her as a daughter. Looks like the “go to the mainland” code we saw on Bernard’s pad from S1 was Fords way of protecting Maeve but she defied it to save her daughter. Ford is visibly upset by the condition that Maeve is in but gives her the instructions to comeback and fight on. I guess this is similar to the verbal commands he said to Teddy when he was sitting at the bar room table with Ford and MiB in S1. A depleted Teddy was able to rejuvenate himself after a Ford command. Looks from the previews that Maeve will be up and kicking ass next week.

On to the S2 finale.
thought  
Pascal4554 : 6/18/2018 9:20 am : link
it was another solid episode. Teddy killing himself was a big surprise for me. Very curious as to how things will wrap up in the finale.

The whole MiB story line is not that compelling to me this season for some reason. I just don't find the MiB as interesting as Ford trying to help the hosts escape and the hosts waking up to their situation.
How long has it been since the massacre?  
since1925 : 6/18/2018 9:53 am : link
If one of my family members went to that park and never returned, I (and the rest of the outside world) might have enough curiosity to see what is going on.

Many board members and employees have been slaughtered. Yet, no one for the outside world has showed up to ask any questions.

Don't the guards or para-military guys have families that have a slight interest in them returning home after work?
RE: How long has it been since the massacre?  
Tony in Tampa : 6/18/2018 10:07 am : link
In comment 13993415 since1925 said:
Quote:
If one of my family members went to that park and never returned, I (and the rest of the outside world) might have enough curiosity to see what is going on.

Many board members and employees have been slaughtered. Yet, no one for the outside world has showed up to ask any questions.

Don't the guards or para-military guys have families that have a slight interest in them returning home after work?

True. I take it in this time of the WW parks there is no press/social media?
the Delos mercenaries are yet again the worst mercenaries ever  
Greg from LI : 6/18/2018 10:34 am : link
a 70something year old man who's been shot about 5 times can swipe a weapon from one of them and kill them all?
Also more stupidly written scenes:  
Tony in Tampa : 6/18/2018 10:39 am : link
Bernard is afraid that he might be forced by Ford to hurt Elsie or be stopped by from erasing Ford from his system so he zip ties one hand to the staring wheel.

But when he’s done and Elsie sees him he just decides to cut off the zip tie with a knife. What good was the zip tie as a restraint if he always had the option to cut it off?
hahahaha....my wife noticed that too  
Greg from LI : 6/18/2018 10:46 am : link
I have to say, Westworld is really stumbling towards the finish here with these past few episodes.
RE: the Delos mercenaries are yet again the worst mercenaries ever  
since1925 : 6/18/2018 11:27 am : link
In comment 13993435 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
a 70something year old man who's been shot about 5 times can swipe a weapon from one of them and kill them all?


I'm still not over these guys attacking the cowboy fortress in dune buggies. Get an armored vehicle, a Bradley or Stryker, hell, an up armored HumVee would have done the trick.
Not too thrilled with the turn in MiB's storyline  
DieHard : 6/18/2018 11:59 am : link
I thought they were going to do something similar to David Fincher's "The Game," where the seemingly unredeemable guy gets massively humbled, but reconnects with the world in the process. They may yet go down that road, especially if the Emily he killed turns out to be a host, but if he really killed her, there's no going back. So that means we're back to square one with his character -- always a dark, obsessive, self-absorbed guy at heart. Not that compelling.

It's been a strange season -- there's been some interesting ideas and moments, but character and plot points don't seem to have much weight. Teddy's big decision is only hinted at with two very brief scenes. The Native American subplot is cool, but why wait until Episode 8 to delve into it? One minute Ford is saying that it's not his story anymore, and the next he's basically pushing Bernard and Maeve forward. The biggest secret of the season (what's in the valley beyond) is just tossed out by Bernard in conversation? Maybe next week ties up a lot of this stuff, but I'm still guessing about what the point of it all is, unlike season 1.
This was a pretty meh episode  
Gary from The East End : Admin : 6/18/2018 12:02 pm : link
At this point, I can't say I really care what happens to any of the characters. They all pretty much suck.

RE: RE: the Delos mercenaries are yet again the worst mercenaries ever  
Pete in 'Vliet : 6/18/2018 12:07 pm : link
In comment 13993488 since1925 said:
Quote:
In comment 13993435 Greg from LI said:


Quote:


a 70something year old man who's been shot about 5 times can swipe a weapon from one of them and kill them all?



I'm still not over these guys attacking the cowboy fortress in dune buggies. Get an armored vehicle, a Bradley or Stryker, hell, an up armored HumVee would have done the trick.


They didn't have any of those vehicles or many men for that matter. The attack on the fort was before any back-up or rescue team arrived. If there were going to get any help they needed to secure Abernathy. It was purley a desperation move by Charlotte and the remaining security in the park.

The whole point of the attck was to make a distraction in order to nab Abernathy, so can could persaude Delos to send in reinforcements (and maybe some humvees or whatever). It was working fine (only a few were shot down by the confederates) until Delores sprung her trap. Still, I bet Charlotte work call it a success. She got Abernathy, could start to extract the data, and got a larger security team to arrive.
RE: the Delos mercenaries are yet again the worst mercenaries ever  
Giantology : 6/18/2018 12:13 pm : link
In comment 13993435 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
a 70something year old man who's been shot about 5 times can swipe a weapon from one of them and kill them all?


Well you're leaving out the important detail that the security team that came upon them recognized him as "the boss" - thus why they're not expecting him to suddenly grab a gun and start shooting.

People seem to misunderstand that the teams/mercs/soldiers out there in the the time since the massacre is not Delos' top response team. Its been mentioned several times that Delos would not send in proper rescue and reinforcements until Abernathy's unit was recovered.
RE: RE: the Delos mercenaries are yet again the worst mercenaries ever  
Tony in Tampa : 6/18/2018 12:40 pm : link
In comment 13993545 Giantology said:
Quote:
In comment 13993435 Greg from LI said:


Quote:


a 70something year old man who's been shot about 5 times can swipe a weapon from one of them and kill them all?



Well you're leaving out the important detail that the security team that came upon them recognized him as "the boss" - thus why they're not expecting him to suddenly grab a gun and start shooting.

People seem to misunderstand that the teams/mercs/soldiers out there in the the time since the massacre is not Delos' top response team. Its been mentioned several times that Delos would not send in proper rescue and reinforcements until Abernathy's unit was recovered.

Couple things:
1) Mall cops defending an attack on the food court would have done a more effective job than WW security teams

2) Even in the later timeline when I pressume the forces led by the Irish commando were from Delso and took over during Deloris's attack, they didn't fare any better.
RE: Not too thrilled with the turn in MiB's storyline  
Tony in Tampa : 6/18/2018 1:01 pm : link
In comment 13993517 DieHard said:
Quote:
I thought they were going to do something similar to David Fincher's "The Game," where the seemingly unredeemable guy gets massively humbled, but reconnects with the world in the process. They may yet go down that road, especially if the Emily he killed turns out to be a host, but if he really killed her, there's no going back. So that means we're back to square one with his character -- always a dark, obsessive, self-absorbed guy at heart. Not that compelling.
Die Hard, I agree

For me the show is at a cross roads. Last season was great. I was excited that they took the 1973 movie and amped it up with modern special effects and modern concepts. It raised ethical and moral questions like: What does it mean to be sentient and do humans have the right create lifelike beings with memories in order to kill and torture them for the sake of entertainment.

This season the Nolan’s have gone a different way with the rebellion. IMO, some of it works and some does not. But they have also taken the multiple timelines technique which was used as a clever twist in S1 and made it the core of S2. I don’t think it works that well as the primary focus of the show. It is both confusing and seems to replace real plot/story development in order to be tricky. It’s almost like the Nolan’s have sold the shows soul just to outwit the Reddit crowd.

We’ll see if things get better for S3. My guess is if things stay the same as S2, S4 is in jeopardy.


It's been a strange season -- there's been some interesting ideas and moments, but character and plot points don't seem to have much weight. Teddy's big decision is only hinted at with two very brief scenes. The Native American subplot is cool, but why wait until Episode 8 to delve into it? One minute Ford is saying that it's not his story anymore, and the next he's basically pushing Bernard and Maeve forward. The biggest secret of the season (what's in the valley beyond) is just tossed out by Bernard in conversation? Maybe next week ties up a lot of this stuff, but I'm still guessing about what the point of it all is, unlike season 1.


DieHard, I agree

For me the show is at a cross roads. Last season was great. I was excited that they took the 1973 movie and amped it up with modern special effects and modern concepts. It raised ethical and moral questions like: What does it mean to be sentient and do humans have the right create lifelike beings with memories in order to kill and torture them for the sake of entertainment?

This season the Nolan’s have gone a different way with the rebellion. IMO, some of it works and some does not. But they have also taken the multiple timelines technique which was used as a clever twist in S1 and made it the core of S2. I don’t think it works that well as the primary focus of the show. It is both confusing and seems to abandon real plot/story development in order to be tricky. It’s almost like the Nolan’s have sold the shows soul just to outwit the Reddit crowd.

We’ll see if things get better for S3. My guess is if things stay the same as S2, S4 is in jeopardy.
Big season 1 fan  
montanagiant : 6/18/2018 3:12 pm : link
They completely lost me this season
Question regarding the MIB  
Bleedin Blue : 6/18/2018 4:33 pm : link
If he is a host, as and others think, how is he able to age??
RE: Big season 1 fan  
giantsfaninphilly : 6/18/2018 6:10 pm : link
In comment 13993773 montanagiant said:
Quote:
They completely lost me this season


Same here. Season 1 was good, but I watched 2 episodes this season and gave up on it. The timeline jumping turned me off altogether. Trying to guess what I'm watching and when it's happening does nothing for me. If I have to scrutinize past episodes for clues in a Reddit thread I'm out.
RE: RE: Big season 1 fan  
montanagiant : 6/18/2018 7:14 pm : link
In comment 13994005 giantsfaninphilly said:
Quote:
In comment 13993773 montanagiant said:


Quote:


They completely lost me this season



Same here. Season 1 was good, but I watched 2 episodes this season and gave up on it. The timeline jumping turned me off altogether. Trying to guess what I'm watching and when it's happening does nothing for me. If I have to scrutinize past episodes for clues in a Reddit thread I'm out.

Yup, even Ed Harris has stated he watches the episodes this season and has no idea whats going on
I'm not sold that  
BigBlueDownTheShore : 6/19/2018 12:57 pm : link
the MIB is a host.
RE: I'm not sold that  
Tony in Tampa : 6/19/2018 3:28 pm : link
In comment 13994427 BigBlueDownTheShore said:
Quote:
the MIB is a host.


Yeah you could be right. When I posted that in starting the thread yesterday I thought that what the show was leaning to with the memory card-especially the subject 002 reference at the top of the screen that his wife was watching-was that he was a host.

But none of the reviews have mentioned it and they seem to feel it was more just the tracking of his memories and atrocious behavior which showed pure evil at the park and that is why his wife offed herself.

To me having MiB be a host (or copied consciousness) would explain some of stuff like the countless gun shots he took, but I've been wrong with this show before.
Didn’t MiB get scanned  
NYdeuce : 6/19/2018 3:30 pm : link
by the Delos security and he came up as human?
I think they WANT you to think he's a host  
Greg from LI : 6/19/2018 3:31 pm : link
I mean, for an old man he's damned near indestructible, and of course they showed him digging at his arm at the end of this episode, looking for the port that hosts have, suggesting that even he doesn't know if he's still human.

I don't think he's a bot, though. If he were, Ford could control him, couldn't he?
RE: Didn’t MiB get scanned  
Greg from LI : 6/19/2018 3:31 pm : link
In comment 13994555 NYdeuce said:
Quote:
by the Delos security and he came up as human?


Yes, but so did Bernard.
RE: RE: Didn’t MiB get scanned  
NYdeuce : 6/19/2018 3:34 pm : link
In comment 13994557 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
In comment 13994555 NYdeuce said:


Quote:


by the Delos security and he came up as human?

Hmm must have forgot that. I hope he is not a host. They pulled that with Bernard and that was sufficient for me.

Yes, but so did Bernard.
RE: RE: Didn’t MiB get scanned  
NYdeuce : 6/19/2018 3:34 pm : link
In comment 13994557 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
In comment 13994555 NYdeuce said:


Quote:


by the Delos security and he came up as human?



Yes, but so did Bernard.


Hmm must have forgot that. I hope he is not a host. They pulled that with Bernard and that was sufficient for me.
RE: RE: Didn’t MiB get scanned  
Giants in 07 : 6/19/2018 3:45 pm : link
In comment 13994557 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
In comment 13994555 NYdeuce said:


Quote:


by the Delos security and he came up as human?



Yes, but so did Bernard.


No, he didn't. His thumb print contained DNA though, we see that as he enters the secret outpost with Charlotte.

MIB isn't a host, he just thinks he is. He's questioning his own reality just like the hosts did.
What I find most interesting is that  
BigBlueDownTheShore : 6/19/2018 4:06 pm : link
they showed the parallel between William and Dolores. William losing his wife to suicide because of the Man he becomes. Teddy killing himself because of the woman Delores becomes. Both headed to the same place to reunite once again.

They loved each other in the beginning, I wonder if this is a long drawn out story to get them back together. It was originally forbidden love.
RE: RE: I'm not sold that  
BigBlueDownTheShore : 6/19/2018 4:35 pm : link
In comment 13994552 Tony in Tampa said:
Quote:
In comment 13994427 BigBlueDownTheShore said:


Quote:


the MIB is a host.



Yeah you could be right. When I posted that in starting the thread yesterday I thought that what the show was leaning to with the memory card-especially the subject 002 reference at the top of the screen that his wife was watching-was that he was a host.

But none of the reviews have mentioned it and they seem to feel it was more just the tracking of his memories and atrocious behavior which showed pure evil at the park and that is why his wife offed herself.

To me having MiB be a host (or copied consciousness) would explain some of stuff like the countless gun shots he took, but I've been wrong with this show before.


Subject 2 could just refer to the second subject being captured in the cloud they are all traveling too. It would be fitting that Delos was #1 and William was #2 since he took over the company when Delos passed away.
RE: RE: RE: Didn’t MiB get scanned  
NYdeuce : 6/19/2018 7:35 pm : link
In comment 13994572 Giants in 07 said:
Quote:
In comment 13994557 Greg from LI said:


Quote:


In comment 13994555 NYdeuce said:


Quote:


by the Delos security and he came up as human?



Yes, but so did Bernard.



No, he didn't. His thumb print contained DNA though, we see that as he enters the secret outpost with Charlotte.

MIB isn't a host, he just thinks he is. He's questioning his own reality just like the hosts did.



MiB was scanned for Restraint Ordinance and came up clear, so at least we know he doesn’t have the explosive device in his spine. Regardless, him being a host in very unlikely IMO.
Back to the Corner