But he was the most consistent goaltender that ever played.
He crushed the NHL record for consecutive 30+ and 40+ win seasons. He also has the all time record for most 40+ win seasons. He was often very clutch in the playoffs as well.
But Brodeur's ability to average 70+ games a year for 12 years is singular. Also, such a goalie would have to be on a competitive team year in and year out to be able to average 40+ wins a year for a decade plus. Had he played his entire career under the OT rules it'd almost certainly be out of reach, but considering where the nearest active competitors are it may be there anyway.
statistically can't argue against Brodeur. Though Brodeur played until he was 42, Roy retired at 37.
But I don't think anyone has ever seen a better goalie performance than Tim Thomas in 2011. Maybe ever, definitely in my hockey watching history.
Tim Thomas had 849 shots against in those 24 games.
By comparison, Brodeur who has obviously had some stellar playoffs, most in a cup run (24 games also) was 622. That's a big difference.
He had some cup runs, one 25 games (loss), with just 507 SA, or a cup win with 530.
Now, I'm a firm believer in shots against is less meaningful than quality chances, but the goalie still needs to make the saves they should make.
Anyway, Brodeur is probably the best ever statistically even though I'm partial to Patrick Roy talent-wise, but no one touched Tim Thomas in 2011 for my vote - for one season, one playoffs - he's my guy.
maybe better. But Brodeur had some deep playoff runs, including Cup runs, where he simply carried the team on his back, after carrying them on his back for 70+ games in the regular season.
But Brodeur's ability to average 70+ games a year for 12 years is singular. Also, such a goalie would have to be on a competitive team year in and year out to be able to average 40+ wins a year for a decade plus. Had he played his entire career under the OT rules it'd almost certainly be out of reach, but considering where the nearest active competitors are it may be there anyway.
I agree - I'm certainly not predicting it happens anytime soon. The guy would have to have MAF's profile but actually be worthy of that spot (I love MAF and think he's been massively underrated throughout his career, but you don't pick him #1 overall). Start young, play on a dominant team, don't lose your spot to a rookie.
Lundqvist on the Pens throughout his career might have been someone who could beat it. Having the longevity and team quality for so long makes it hard to break. But I don't think it's impossible.
they're trending to even be later round picks in the draft.
Who was the last 1st round goalie to pan out?
Vasilevskiy? He wasn't the starter until he was 22, being behind Bishop.
At 23 he had his first 40 win season. He's going to be 24 and has 85 wins. To reach Brodeur he'd need to play until he's 40 (so 16 more seasons) and average 37.5 wins per season to tie Brodeur.
it's durability within seasons. Years at a time go by without a goalie playing 70+ games, and it's rare to see a goalie do it year in and year out. A competitive team is going to limit a franchise goalie's workload to save him for the playoffs. Brodeur played at a time where the trap could limit shots and wear and tear and allow him to play that often without quite the same amount of tread on the tires, while the game nowadays demands more of a goalie.
Is all the time he missed due to lockouts. The lockouts canceled exactly 150 games during the prime of his career. Let's say he would have started 130 of those games that is potentially another 85-90 wins.
Of course it will require a ton of luck, the right circumstances, etc. It'll probably take another 'generation' of goalies to break it (or get appropriately close).
Holtby matched Brodeur's record for a single season in 12 less games. Brodeur's four best single seasons by wins came post lockout. He was probably better in his late 20's/early 30's. Eight of the top ten came post-lockout. Wins are easier to come by - you won't need to play the 78 games Brodeur did to rack up the same number of wins.
It's not essentially mathematically impossible given the structure of the game like Cy Young's 511 wins is, for example. I don't think it's a single digit percent chance that someone breaks it over the next 50 years.
Brodeurs numbers of regular seaosn starts each year Â
I also don't think Gretzky's goal record is as unbeatable as others do. I'm not just picking on Brodeur, lol.
I think Gretzky's 92 goals and 215 points in one season (different seasons) are more unbreakable than Brodeur's win total IMO. But it will stand for a while. I don't think the goalie who will break it is in the NHL yet. So it's going to be a good 20 years.
But to Brett's point, Rinne had 42 wins this season in just 59 starts. Brodeur's highest win total was 48, but in 78 starts. Without ties, goalies today can break it.
Gretzky's records are so far beyond anyone else and the game is changing to make those records harder.
Gretzky has 9 of the top 10 highest assist seasons. 9 of 10 (including the top 8). the next closest player in terms of assists in a season is Lemieux with 49 less assists in that season.
getting 49 assists in a season is all-star caliber, 163 is insane.
Not to make this about Gretzky, but those elite Gretzky seasons are less likely to be broken than Brodeur's IMO.
I agree, I think you stated what I meant more eloquently than I did. Â
And he'll start his age 33 season next year 277 goals behind. So he has to average 28 goals a year until he's 43 to break it. Possible? Maybe. Highly implausible though.
Jagr may have hit it if he didn’t go to the KHL for a few years. Â
Ovechkin probably won’t make it - but because he was an older draftee and because of the lockout, he didn’t hit NHL ice until he was 20.
If he was born a few weeks earlier and we didn’t have the lockout, it’s possible he has another 70-80 goals.
I don’t think either Brodeur’s wins or Gretzky’s 894 will be broken by anyone currently active. But I don’t think it’s that hard to imagine someone getting there.
What a run.
Wasn't he playing in Tampa a year or 2 ago? What is eligibility length in NHL?
He crushed the NHL record for consecutive 30+ and 40+ win seasons. He also has the all time record for most 40+ win seasons. He was often very clutch in the playoffs as well.
I think the wins record will be broken eventually. The OT rules make it easier to rack up wins.
But I don't think anyone has ever seen a better goalie performance than Tim Thomas in 2011. Maybe ever, definitely in my hockey watching history.
Tim Thomas had 849 shots against in those 24 games.
By comparison, Brodeur who has obviously had some stellar playoffs, most in a cup run (24 games also) was 622. That's a big difference.
He had some cup runs, one 25 games (loss), with just 507 SA, or a cup win with 530.
Now, I'm a firm believer in shots against is less meaningful than quality chances, but the goalie still needs to make the saves they should make.
Anyway, Brodeur is probably the best ever statistically even though I'm partial to Patrick Roy talent-wise, but no one touched Tim Thomas in 2011 for my vote - for one season, one playoffs - he's my guy.
Played on some shitty teams unfortunately for him, and not as long as some of the others.
But he's definitely in the conversation for best.
not many goalies have more than 6 vezina's if any.
Dryden? Plante? maybe.
I agree - I'm certainly not predicting it happens anytime soon. The guy would have to have MAF's profile but actually be worthy of that spot (I love MAF and think he's been massively underrated throughout his career, but you don't pick him #1 overall). Start young, play on a dominant team, don't lose your spot to a rookie.
Lundqvist on the Pens throughout his career might have been someone who could beat it. Having the longevity and team quality for so long makes it hard to break. But I don't think it's impossible.
they're trending to even be later round picks in the draft.
Who was the last 1st round goalie to pan out?
Vasilevskiy? He wasn't the starter until he was 22, being behind Bishop.
At 23 he had his first 40 win season. He's going to be 24 and has 85 wins. To reach Brodeur he'd need to play until he's 40 (so 16 more seasons) and average 37.5 wins per season to tie Brodeur.
Possible, but unlikely.
Holtby matched Brodeur's record for a single season in 12 less games. Brodeur's four best single seasons by wins came post lockout. He was probably better in his late 20's/early 30's. Eight of the top ten came post-lockout. Wins are easier to come by - you won't need to play the 78 games Brodeur did to rack up the same number of wins.
It's not essentially mathematically impossible given the structure of the game like Cy Young's 511 wins is, for example. I don't think it's a single digit percent chance that someone breaks it over the next 50 years.
1996 - 67
1997 - 70
1998 - 70
1999 - 72
2000 - 72
2001 - 73
2002 - 73
2003 - 75
2005 - 73
2006 - 78
2007 - 77
The physical toll of playing that many games each year combined with the consistent play will likely never be seen again.
I also don't think Gretzky's goal record is as unbeatable as others do. I'm not just picking on Brodeur, lol.
I also don't think Gretzky's goal record is as unbeatable as others do. I'm not just picking on Brodeur, lol.
I think Gretzky's 92 goals and 215 points in one season (different seasons) are more unbreakable than Brodeur's win total IMO. But it will stand for a while. I don't think the goalie who will break it is in the NHL yet. So it's going to be a good 20 years.
But to Brett's point, Rinne had 42 wins this season in just 59 starts. Brodeur's highest win total was 48, but in 78 starts. Without ties, goalies today can break it.
Gretzky's records are so far beyond anyone else and the game is changing to make those records harder.
Gretzky has 9 of the top 10 highest assist seasons. 9 of 10 (including the top 8). the next closest player in terms of assists in a season is Lemieux with 49 less assists in that season.
getting 49 assists in a season is all-star caliber, 163 is insane.
Not to make this about Gretzky, but those elite Gretzky seasons are less likely to be broken than Brodeur's IMO.
Gretzky also holds the record for most career SH goals.
The game has changed so much I'm not sure Gretzky could even play on the PK.
Unless they shrink goalie pads or make the net bigger I don't think we'll see another era like the Gretzky era. GPG is half what it was in 1985.
If he was born a few weeks earlier and we didn’t have the lockout, it’s possible he has another 70-80 goals.
I don’t think either Brodeur’s wins or Gretzky’s 894 will be broken by anyone currently active. But I don’t think it’s that hard to imagine someone getting there.