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NFT: Yankee trade talk: your one target and what do you give up?

Milton : 6/28/2018 4:49 am
In today's off-day exercise, you get to pick one and only one player to target for a trade and you have to say what you would give up in return. You can shoot for the moon with a guy like DeGrom and be willing to give up some premium value in return (if you're being reasonable) or target one of the half-year rentals like Hamels and offer up a lot less (but it will still take more than just a limited package like Adams and Mckinney). What does the algorithm in your head project as the best do-able deal for the Yankees? My current thinking (subject to change on a daily basis)...
Target: Syndergaard
Compensation: Frazier, Drury, Sheffield, Abreu.

I know, I know, that's a lot to give up. But if it's not painful, it's not realistic.

From the Yankees perspective
--They are getting a proven, top-of-the-rotation, 25-year old with 3 1/2 years left of team control who will slot right in as the #2 starter behind Severino (and they didn't have to give up Torres, Andujar, or Florial). Think about how huge it would be to have two young aces under team control until 2022! The only downside is Syndergaard's history of injuries, but that's all part of the equation that makes him available for a manageable/reasonable price tag.
--They are giving up two young position players who have proven they belong in the Majors, but are buried on the Yankees depth chart; and two of their top pitching prospects, one in Triple A, the other in single A. It's the pitchers that make it painful for the Yankees, but no pain, no gain; and while the two check in as the team's top two pitching prospects according to MLB. com, I'm not convinced they're all that more likely to reach stardom than some of the other arms in the system like Medina, Loaisiga, Stephan, Sauer, Schmidt, Whitlock, and more. Sheffield tops the list based on probability of success, not necessarily upside.

From the Mets perspective
--They are getting two young, starting quality position players under team control (Frazier for five more years, Drury for three) and two very highly regarded pitching prospects, one of whom is ready to make his major league debut (and should slot in right away as a mid-rotation guy), the other just a year or two away (with a fastball that reaches triple digits and two other plus pitches). How often do you get that combination of production and potential without having to give up your veteran #1 starter (DeGrom)?
--They are giving up something that no team ever wants to give up, a young, proven, top-of-rotation pitcher still with years of team control. And to their cross-town rival.

p.s.--I'm not sure how often teams package more than four players in a trade for just one in return, but I would be willing to add another player or two to sweeten the deal: i.e., German, Adams, Acevedo, or one of the established middle-relievers (hopefully not Green or Holder, I love them, but not enough to stand in the way of a deal for Syndergaard).
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FatMan, to be clear, I'd want Eovaldi for this pennant race,  
yatqb : 6/28/2018 3:27 pm : link
not for the long term. He'd cost less than Happ or other middling starters, and hopefully next year we can land Corbin and have Sheffield ready for the rotation.
RE: If Snell is on the market...  
DanMetroMan : 6/28/2018 3:27 pm : link
In comment 14001804 Dunedin81 said:
Quote:
someone will have the ability and the wherewithal to trump us. Well, I think. Other systems have more star power in their farms, but I'm not sure how many of those teams are really in the market for a front-end starter. Boston could certainly use one, but they have no one to deal. Houston could move a high-end guy like Tucker, but their need is really for bullpen help. Chicago doesn't have much of a farm at this point. So where would Snell go?


With his years of control "every" team in baseball would be in on him, not just 2018 contenders. Costs nothing, lots of control = even the Mets would likely inquire (yes their farm sucks) just giving an example.
Jim  
DanMetroMan : 6/28/2018 3:29 pm : link
Bowden (who knows nothing) suggested such a deal would be something like Frazier, Sheffield and Swanson aka huge price. (this isn't a rumor, he "imagined" a possible package.
The Brewers could be in play...  
Dunedin81 : 6/28/2018 3:31 pm : link
strong farm, some star power, and a need for dependable starting pitching.
Stearns  
DanMetroMan : 6/28/2018 3:33 pm : link
is a really smart, aggressive guy (of course the Mets let him walk), then again Jon Daniels used to be the belle of the ball and the Rangers now suck so... but yeah the Brewers are supposedly talking to everyone.
Cashman will trade for someone.  
Dave in Hoboken : 6/28/2018 3:35 pm : link
Not sure who, but there's no way he goes into this postseason with this rotation as currently constituted. I trust Cashman to make the best deal possible for the team. They're going to have to give up some pieces, but if it's for the right guy and right situation, I see Cashman doing it and making a real solid trade for the franchise. He's been killing it. I trust him. No reason for any Yankees fan to not trust him at this point.
RE: If Snell is on the market...  
Tesla : 6/28/2018 3:36 pm : link
In comment 14001804 Dunedin81 said:
Quote:
someone will have the ability and the wherewithal to trump us. Well, I think. Other systems have more star power in their farms, but I'm not sure how many of those teams are really in the market for a front-end starter. Boston could certainly use one, but they have no one to deal. Houston could move a high-end guy like Tucker, but their need is really for bullpen help. Chicago doesn't have much of a farm at this point. So where would Snell go?


But why would Snell be on the market? He's got 4 years of team control left....can't see Tampa offering him in a trade now.
RE: Jim  
rich in DC : 6/28/2018 3:44 pm : link
In comment 14001814 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
Bowden (who knows nothing) suggested such a deal would be something like Frazier, Sheffield and Swanson aka huge price. (this isn't a rumor, he "imagined" a possible package.


Which is why he is probably working at ESPN instead of with a ML team...
RE: RE: If Snell is on the market...  
Dunedin81 : 6/28/2018 3:54 pm : link
In comment 14001820 Tesla said:
Quote:
In comment 14001804 Dunedin81 said:


Quote:


someone will have the ability and the wherewithal to trump us. Well, I think. Other systems have more star power in their farms, but I'm not sure how many of those teams are really in the market for a front-end starter. Boston could certainly use one, but they have no one to deal. Houston could move a high-end guy like Tucker, but their need is really for bullpen help. Chicago doesn't have much of a farm at this point. So where would Snell go?



But why would Snell be on the market? He's got 4 years of team control left....can't see Tampa offering him in a trade now.


It's a weak pitching market and Tampa's not likely to be competitive for a couple years. NYY could have held onto Andrew Miller, who had a couple more years left on his deal, but with a paucity of stud relief pitchers on the market and a couple teams - Chicago and Cleveland - with glaring bullpen needs they maximized value. It's the same reason the Mets would even consider trading deGrom or Syndergaard (even if they don't end up doing it).

Say they wait a couple years to deal Snell and he has injury problems, or he looks more like an okay 4 than a legit 2 and there are half a dozen better starters on the block. When you have an opportunity to maximize value, sometimes it makes sense to take it. If they dealt Archer a couple years ago the return would have been monstrous. Now he looks like a league average pitcher and he turns 30 this year.
RE: Would it be  
Spirit of '86 : 6/28/2018 3:57 pm : link
In comment 14001275 mmf551 said:
Quote:
insane for the Yankees to offer up Sanchez and Sheffield? Or Sanchez and Drury?

I'm not sold on Gary for the long term, and that was before his awful start to the season


I agree about Gary. but why include anything else. I'd look at Sanchez for Thor even up. with Judge and Stanton manning DH for the next 10 years, and Gary inflexible at a young age, where will he play and hit in three years?
RE: RE: Would it be  
DanMetroMan : 6/28/2018 4:00 pm : link
In comment 14001836 Spirit of '86 said:
Quote:
In comment 14001275 mmf551 said:


Quote:


insane for the Yankees to offer up Sanchez and Sheffield? Or Sanchez and Drury?

I'm not sold on Gary for the long term, and that was before his awful start to the season



I agree about Gary. but why include anything else. I'd look at Sanchez for Thor even up. with Judge and Stanton manning DH for the next 10 years, and Gary inflexible at a young age, where will he play and hit in three years?


All due respect but if YOU see these concerns why wouldn't the Mets? And their top prospect is a 1b (and 1b only).
Why do I..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 6/28/2018 4:02 pm : link
often come away with the impression that people downplay Sanchez constantly?

You win with players like Sanchez a lot more than you lose.
RE: Why do I..  
DanMetroMan : 6/28/2018 4:09 pm : link
In comment 14001839 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
often come away with the impression that people downplay Sanchez constantly?

You win with players like Sanchez a lot more than you lose.


By fWAR 3rd best catcher in baseball since his debut and that's with far less games played than the top 2 (part of that is his own durability) but still.
RE: Ex-Yankee  
Stan in LA : 6/28/2018 4:28 pm : link
In comment 14001803 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
Kirby Yates is having a monster first half

Also an ex-Indian, ex-Angel, ex-Rays, etc...
RE: RE: Ex-Yankee  
DanMetroMan : 6/28/2018 4:30 pm : link
In comment 14001873 Stan in LA said:
Quote:
In comment 14001803 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


Kirby Yates is having a monster first half


Also an ex-Indian, ex-Angel, ex-Rays, etc...


Dunedin mentioned Richard and a reliever. Yates (on the Padres with Richard) history with the Yankees was relevant. It wasn't a Yankee swipe.
RE: Cashman will trade for someone.  
Eman11 : 6/28/2018 4:30 pm : link
In comment 14001819 Dave in Hoboken said:
Quote:
Not sure who, but there's no way he goes into this postseason with this rotation as currently constituted. I trust Cashman to make the best deal possible for the team. They're going to have to give up some pieces, but if it's for the right guy and right situation, I see Cashman doing it and making a real solid trade for the franchise. He's been killing it. I trust him. No reason for any Yankees fan to not trust him at this point.


I don't know about that Dave. I can see Cash adding a guy who can help us get to the postseason but I really don't see an Ace or top of the rotation guy being available that would be a definite, no questions asked better option in the playoffs than what we have.

I don't see a Happ or Fulmer beating out Sevy, Tanaka, or CC, to pitch in the postseason. We'd have to see the season play out to see who emerges as the better pitcher between Gray, German, Loasiga, and whatever innings guy they get.

I think Cash plays it smart if there's no Ace available, and gets a guy who helps in the regular season while not giving up too much. If he gets hot and pitches great, and beats out the other guys for postseason starts, all the better, but I don't see anyone outside of an Ace who cracks our top three.
RE: RE: Cashman will trade for someone.  
Dave in Hoboken : 6/28/2018 4:35 pm : link
In comment 14001875 Eman11 said:
Quote:
In comment 14001819 Dave in Hoboken said:


Quote:


Not sure who, but there's no way he goes into this postseason with this rotation as currently constituted. I trust Cashman to make the best deal possible for the team. They're going to have to give up some pieces, but if it's for the right guy and right situation, I see Cashman doing it and making a real solid trade for the franchise. He's been killing it. I trust him. No reason for any Yankees fan to not trust him at this point.



I don't know about that Dave. I can see Cash adding a guy who can help us get to the postseason but I really don't see an Ace or top of the rotation guy being available that would be a definite, no questions asked better option in the playoffs than what we have.

I don't see a Happ or Fulmer beating out Sevy, Tanaka, or CC, to pitch in the postseason. We'd have to see the season play out to see who emerges as the better pitcher between Gray, German, Loasiga, and whatever innings guy they get.

I think Cash plays it smart if there's no Ace available, and gets a guy who helps in the regular season while not giving up too much. If he gets hot and pitches great, and beats out the other guys for postseason starts, all the better, but I don't see anyone outside of an Ace who cracks our top three.


Think you kind of mis-read my post. Didn't say it was an absolute definite. I said if Cashman sees what is in his mind the right guy/situation, that I think he would do it.

Kay just read something on his show that a Yankee scout was at the Tigers game scouting Fulmer, FWIW. If Cashman can get a guy he likes for a price he can live with, I do think he does, especially with how close they came last season and where they are right now.

Not sure I agree that someone like a Fulmer can't beat out a CC or Tanaka. Eh. Let's see where CC and Tanaka are in September. Even before getting hurt, Tanaka was very much hit or miss thus far this season. Not saying it's a definite that one of those two can be beat out for the postseason, but I'm surely not going to rule it out 100% quite yet, either.
Cone pointed out on last night's broadcast  
bceagle05 : 6/28/2018 4:40 pm : link
that Lasagna and German haven't pitched many innings in recent years, and can't be counted on to carry the load the entire second half. Obviously Tanaka will kick one of them out of the rotation, but we still need one more guy to fill Monty's vacancy. It's possible that is Sheffield, but I'm not sure he'll be up here in time (before July 31) to solidify his role, and he has some innings limitations of his own. I think help via trade is definitely on the way.
RE: Cone pointed out on last night's broadcast  
Tesla : 6/28/2018 5:01 pm : link
In comment 14001885 bceagle05 said:
Quote:
that Lasagna and German haven't pitched many innings in recent years, and can't be counted on to carry the load the entire second half. Obviously Tanaka will kick one of them out of the rotation, but we still need one more guy to fill Monty's vacancy. It's possible that is Sheffield, but I'm not sure he'll be up here in time (before July 31) to solidify his role, and he has some innings limitations of his own. I think help via trade is definitely on the way.


When Tanaka comes back I'd love to see the Yankees use German/Loaisiga as "tandem starters" - use them together and only ask each of them to pitch 3-4 innings per start. They just might be able to form an extremely effective starting pitcher if used that way and helps cut down on their innings.
RE: 0%  
arcarsenal : 6/28/2018 5:31 pm : link
In comment 14001746 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
snark, but what does SF being buyers have to do with them selling off cost controlled RP? They are legit in the playoff race. Both Smith and Watson are under contract for next year for peanuts. Unless they fall apart it's very hard to see them giving up key parts of their BP when they are 4.5 out of first, 2 out of the WC. Tony Watson is owed 4 million dollars next year, and 6.5 over the next 2 if they pick up his option and Smith is making 2.5 and is team controlled for 2 more.


My point was = if they don't think they're a postseason team this year, it would make sense to deal a few assets to strengthen a weak farm system and add a couple of pieces. I don't think they're good enough to make any type of run this year and they don't have the chips to make any really major acquisitions - so, basically they are what they are for 2018 as far as I can tell - and that team probably isn't good enough to be a Wild Card. They're barely even above .500 right now.

Guys like Watson or Smith won't land elite prospects, but perhaps it would be more worthwhile to package them and try to add a little to their pipe.

Maybe they'd be 100% unwilling to deal them. What do I know. Just throwing it out there.
RE: Cone pointed out on last night's broadcast  
rich in DC : 6/28/2018 5:51 pm : link
In comment 14001885 bceagle05 said:
Quote:
that Lasagna and German haven't pitched many innings in recent years, and can't be counted on to carry the load the entire second half. Obviously Tanaka will kick one of them out of the rotation, but we still need one more guy to fill Monty's vacancy. It's possible that is Sheffield, but I'm not sure he'll be up here in time (before July 31) to solidify his role, and he has some innings limitations of his own. I think help via trade is definitely on the way.


Sheffield only have to be called up by August 31 to be post-season eligible. July 31 is the non-waiver trade deadline.

German threw 125 innings last year, so if the Yanks add the traditional 30+ innings to his workload, he would cap out around 155-160 IP. German has thrown 64 IP this season. He is about on pace for 130 or so. He should be fine from a workpace concern. The question the Yanks need to answer for themselves is whether German's tendency to have a single "blow up" inning in his starts should eliminate him from the rotation this season (though he should be a piece of the rotation going forward).

Remember that if German starts to decline, Sheffield is probably at the point where he could be called up almost immediately. With that said, the All Star break is about 2 and a half weeks away. That means about a 10 day layoff for the back end of the rotation.

Just a WAG on my part, but I would guess that if nothing drastic changes, the Yanks activate Tanaka next week and farm out Loaisiga. Then, the Yanks send German to AAA over the All Star break to allow him to make a start during the layoff. At that point, the Yanks could decide whether to give Sheffield some run or whether to recall German.

My guess is that the Yanks would call up Sheffield to determine whether he is the answer before the trade deadline. If he flops, they go back to German or look for a trade.

Something else to consider, Tanaka was not good in the first half last season, but was pretty good after the All Star break- and outstanding in the post-season. Gray was so-so as a Yankee after the trade- but had a bad playoff start against Cleveland, but a VERY good start against Houston.

The Yanks aren't looking for 7 great innings from their SP outside of Sevy. They only need 5 solid innings and then can go to their pen.
.  
arcarsenal : 6/28/2018 6:12 pm : link
Gray is such a wild card because it's so difficult to figure out what he is or how much he can be relied on.

Sometimes he looks brilliant - other times he's horrendous. A lot of pitchers have good and bad outings, obviously - but his are fairly extreme. And yeah, we know about the drastic home/road splits. It's just hard to figure out if he's a guy you can rely on to start a postseason game or not.

Right now, I'd trust Sevvy (duh), CC, and Tanaka in postseason games. But that's really it right now I think unless Gray can find a groove and be more consistent both at home and on the road.
RE: .  
Eman11 : 6/28/2018 7:14 pm : link
In comment 14001950 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
Gray is such a wild card because it's so difficult to figure out what he is or how much he can be relied on.

Sometimes he looks brilliant - other times he's horrendous. A lot of pitchers have good and bad outings, obviously - but his are fairly extreme. And yeah, we know about the drastic home/road splits. It's just hard to figure out if he's a guy you can rely on to start a postseason game or not.

Right now, I'd trust Sevvy (duh), CC, and Tanaka in postseason games. But that's really it right now I think unless Gray can find a groove and be more consistent both at home and on the road.


I agree with you arc. Unless an Ace becomes available which doesn't seem likely, there's really no one available out there I think is better than than those three.

That's why I can see Cash going for a guy who can eat some innings the rest of the way and help get us to the postseason but not be able to get someone who he can count on for sure once there.

He'll be smart no doubt when he deals and an innings eater, reliable starter could be just the perfect guy. One who'll help but won't break the bank to get.
I think we're one good starter away  
Dave in Hoboken : 6/28/2018 7:19 pm : link
from a Championship. Just not sure if Tanaka and CC will prove to be enough in the postseason as #2 and #3 starters going up against stacked lineups in possibly Houston and Boston.
RE: I think we're one good starter away  
Eman11 : 6/28/2018 7:58 pm : link
In comment 14001982 Dave in Hoboken said:
Quote:
from a Championship. Just not sure if Tanaka and CC will prove to be enough in the postseason as #2 and #3 starters going up against stacked lineups in possibly Houston and Boston.


You may be right but I have more faith in them in the postseason than I do Haap or Fulmer. Those guys would help get us there IMO, but not guys I could confidently say would be better than Tanaka or CC once we got there.

Now if there's a chance for DeGrom that's a different story. He'd not only help us get to the postseason he would be absolutely great following up Sevy in a game two, and I'd be real comfortable with CC and Tanaka following him. I think that's a pipe dream though.
RE: I think we're one good starter away  
NoGainDayne : 6/28/2018 8:09 pm : link
In comment 14001982 Dave in Hoboken said:
Quote:
from a Championship. Just not sure if Tanaka and CC will prove to be enough in the postseason as #2 and #3 starters going up against stacked lineups in possibly Houston and Boston.


That's what makes this year so hard. Don't want to mortgage the future but the game is winning championships. And we definitely had the assets to grab Verlander and a great shot to win last year especially with him with us instead of Houston. Houston keeps adding pieces too ala Cole and we don't want to keep being a step behind them.
.  
arcarsenal : 6/28/2018 8:12 pm : link
I basically look at this like a balancing scale.

The better the pitcher is that we acquire, the better chance there is of winning a Championship this year (and possibly a little after depending on the player), but the smaller the long-term window gets because of the dent it'll put in the pipeline.

The cheaper we go, the less we increase our chances in this particular year, but the wider the long-term contending window should be.

deGrom probably isn't realistic - but that's the move that makes NYY favorites to win it all easily. However, it is going to clear out a huge chunk of this farm system.

Happ helps, probably still doesn't make NYY favorites, but also doesn't sacrifice much long-term.

I still think the best option is a mid-level starter, but hey - I'd be lying if I said it isn't fun to dream about having Sevvy and deGrom as a 1-2.
I still maintain  
rich in DC : 6/28/2018 8:41 pm : link
Sheffield will be better than any SP they can afford at the deadline.

They aren't going to get deGrom or Thor because the Mets won't deal with the Yanks. They aren't getting Bumgarner because SF is in the race.

Happ is nice, but not worth the "Yankee Premium" the Jays will charge. At best he's a #3 SP on the Yanks.

Just continue to develop Sheffield and German. Let Loaisiga develop further in AAA and wait for Stephan next year.

Don't "settle" for mid rotation unknowns in a trade at excessive prices.
RE: RE: I think we're one good starter away  
Dave in Hoboken : 6/28/2018 8:42 pm : link
In comment 14001992 Eman11 said:
Quote:
In comment 14001982 Dave in Hoboken said:


Quote:


from a Championship. Just not sure if Tanaka and CC will prove to be enough in the postseason as #2 and #3 starters going up against stacked lineups in possibly Houston and Boston.



You may be right but I have more faith in them in the postseason than I do Haap or Fulmer. Those guys would help get us there IMO, but not guys I could confidently say would be better than Tanaka or CC once we got there.

Now if there's a chance for DeGrom that's a different story. He'd not only help us get to the postseason he would be absolutely great following up Sevy in a game two, and I'd be real comfortable with CC and Tanaka following him. I think that's a pipe dream though.


Not sure how I feel about that. Tanaka hasn't exactly been tearing it up even pre-injury. So, him as the #2 starter in the postseason kind of scares me alittle bit. I feel like both he and CC in the postseason will both kind of be 'toss-ups', as in they can either go out there and pitch gems, or get lit up. Remember, by the time the postseason rolls around, CC will be a bit more tired considering his age and it won't be hot/warm out anymore. Plus, they'll both be going up against great lineups.

Again, I want to emphasize that I'm not saying I 100% think they'll both be a problem/stink up the joint in the postseason, because I don't. But do I think both are a bit of a toss-up in the postseason this year as of right now? Yes. And, in the postseason you can't have both your 2 and 3 starters as toss-ups.

Like arc said, it really is a balancing act with this year and the future. But part of me thinks Cashman laid low last year at the trade deadline with Verlander (and perhaps any other pitchers that may have been available last July) with the mindset that if the team is at the top or near the top this upcoming trade deadline (which we are), that if there is a guy out there this year, he might be more likely to make a move for the right guy. The fact that the Yankees had a scout out there for Fullmer and Cashman said in an interview today that he's been in contact with alot of teams, including the Mets, are both interesting.

We'll see. Either way, I feel like we're in good hands with Cashman.
.  
arcarsenal : 6/28/2018 8:59 pm : link
I agree, Dave - I think at the end of the day, Cashman will make the right move. So, I'm going to have faith in that and see what he does. The one thing I do know is that he's going to make at least one. He knows this team can win a World Series this year.
I still remember  
arniefez : 6/28/2018 9:12 pm : link
when someone said Montero was going to be the best hitter the Yankees had produced since Mickey Mantle and someone else said Phil Hughes was going to win Cy Youngs plural and not to trade him for Santana.

Prospects are like backup QB's. Everyone's favorite and HOFers in waiting.

I haven't read the entire thread but I heard today that the Yankees offered Sanchez, Frazier & Sheffield for deGrom and the Mets turned it down. I have no idea if that's true. We do know from Cashman's public comments that he's been talking to the Mets.

If that is true and the Mets turned it down they're idiots. I'm not sure I like it from the Yankees side if we're speculating but for the Mets? They'll never get another offer like that for one of their players.
RE: I still remember  
arcarsenal : 6/28/2018 9:19 pm : link
In comment 14002021 arniefez said:
Quote:
when someone said Montero was going to be the best hitter the Yankees had produced since Mickey Mantle and someone else said Phil Hughes was going to win Cy Youngs plural and not to trade him for Santana.

Prospects are like backup QB's. Everyone's favorite and HOFers in waiting.

I haven't read the entire thread but I heard today that the Yankees offered Sanchez, Frazier & Sheffield for deGrom and the Mets turned it down. I have no idea if that's true. We do know from Cashman's public comments that he's been talking to the Mets.

If that is true and the Mets turned it down they're idiots. I'm not sure I like it from the Yankees side if we're speculating but for the Mets? They'll never get another offer like that for one of their players.


The Mets are petty - they're petrified of deGrom winning a World Series with the Yankees because of what the "perception" would be and they seem to care more about that than maximizing return and doing what's best for the future of the franchise.

It's basically a microcosm of why I stopped following them. Because it's not about winning there. It's about fucking bullshit.
Looking at my trade proposal from the other side...  
Milton : 6/28/2018 9:25 pm : link
If you were the Mets, would you accept Frazier, Drury, Sheffield, and Abreu in exchange for Syndergaard?

Because the more comments I read on this thread, the more convinced I am that Syndergaard is the only "potentially affordable" player who can give the Yankees the kind of 1-2 punch that the Astros have in Verlander and Cole (which is what we all want).

p.s.--If it's your belief that the Yankees are going to add a starting pitcher via trade one way or another, then I say go big or go home. No half-measures. DeGrom and Bumgarner are not on the table, same goes for Blake (no relation to Matt) Snell. And it may also be true that Syndergaard is also unavailable for a reasonable (albeit painful) price, but at least with him it's not a total fantasy to believe a deal can get done. And given the 3 1/2 years of team control at well below free market prices, the Yankees aren't sacrificing the future for the present, because he would be very much a part of their future.
I have nothing but respect for deGrom  
arniefez : 6/28/2018 9:29 pm : link
he's a top 5 MLB pitcher and a very solid citizen. I get the Mets are afraid he might help the Yankees. But he's 30 years old and as it was pointed out to me yesterday Sanchez is under team control for the next 4 seasons after this one. Frazier & Sheffield for 6 or 7 seasons. In a year or two the Mets are going to have to pay deGrom over 100 million dollars or lose him for nothing. He could choose not to sign and leave with no return even if they offer him the money. No one will ever give them a better offer with more long term upside if that rumor is true. The Mets should worry about winning and screw the Yankees. But it's the Wilpon's so it is what it is.
RE: Looking at my trade proposal from the other side...  
BigBlueShock : 6/28/2018 9:31 pm : link
In comment 14002026 Milton said:
Quote:
If you were the Mets, would you accept Frazier, Drury, Sheffield, and Abreu in exchange for Syndergaard?

Because the more comments I read on this thread, the more convinced I am that Syndergaard is the only "potentially affordable" player who can give the Yankees the kind of 1-2 punch that the Astros have in Verlander and Cole (which is what we all want).

p.s.--If it's your belief that the Yankees are going to add a starting pitcher via trade one way or another, then I say go big or go home. No half-measures. DeGrom and Bumgarner are not on the table, same goes for Blake (no relation to Matt) Snell. And it may also be true that Syndergaard is also unavailable for a reasonable (albeit painful) price, but at least with him it's not a total fantasy to believe a deal can get done. And given the 3 1/2 years of team control at well below free market prices, the Yankees aren't sacrificing the future for the present, because he would be very much a part of their future.

No. That would not be enough to get the Mets to deal Noah to the Yankees. It’s likely not even close. Forget about the fact that the Mets won’t do business with the Yankees, which apparently continues to get ignored around here. People completely underestimate the going rate for young, cost controlled aces around here.
Sox winning....again.  
bceagle05 : 6/28/2018 9:37 pm : link
Angels are fucking useless.
RE: Looking at my trade proposal from the other side...  
Eman11 : 6/28/2018 9:56 pm : link
In comment 14002026 Milton said:
Quote:
If you were the Mets, would you accept Frazier, Drury, Sheffield, and Abreu in exchange for Syndergaard?

Because the more comments I read on this thread, the more convinced I am that Syndergaard is the only "potentially affordable" player who can give the Yankees the kind of 1-2 punch that the Astros have in Verlander and Cole (which is what we all want).

p.s.--If it's your belief that the Yankees are going to add a starting pitcher But I don't know what fun there is for s 4 year old doing the Lighthouse. The grounds around it and walking towards the inlet and the point, checking out the boats could be but walking those stairs in a cramped, hot as hell old Lighthouse isn't really fun IMO.

It's not like you get up to the top of Barney and there's an outside area to walk around. You pretty much just look out a window and take in the view. I think a kid would have more fun fishing or crabbing off a dock. via trade one way or another, then I say go big or go home. No half-measures. DeGrom and Bumgarner are not on the table, same goes for Blake (no relation to Matt) Snell. And it may also be true that Syndergaard is also unavailable for a reasonable (albeit painful) price, but at least with him it's not a total fantasy to believe a deal can get done. And given the 3 1/2 years of team control at well below free market prices, the Yankees aren't sacrificing the future for the present, because he would be very much a part of their future.


If I'm the Mets I'd jump at that because I think it's way too much for Syndergaard. It's a Yankee tax and then some IMO. Just look at what the Sox gave up for Sale, and compare it to this deal.

The Sox gave up top prospects and no major league players like Frazier and Drury and I think Sale is better than Thor. If we had to give up those two then less prospects get included because those two step right in now and start for th Mets.

deGrom isn't young and he isn't controlled for much longer  
arniefez : 6/28/2018 9:56 pm : link
two more years after this one and he's already 30. As far as Syndergaard goes he's thrown 90 innings since 2016. I doubt anyone offers enough for it to be worth the Mets while to trade him.
We are on a lucky streak where the prospects are all  
Jim in Hoboken : 6/29/2018 6:45 am : link
performing better than the veterans. Why on earth would you trade away prospects for less performance at a much higher salary? Can you imagine what this year would be without Torres and Andujar?

Sheffield should be untouchable, and Frazier shouldn’t be included in a trade unless it’s for a top of the rotation starter under control. Unless you are getting a healthy MadBum, nobody can guarantee postseason success, why not just go with youth?
I’m still likely in the minority  
UConn4523 : 6/29/2018 7:31 am : link
but I’d almost rather stay as is, even if it costs us a title this year, to have a bright future for the next decade. We are replacing CC next season, likely Gardner (which will be done internally if we don’t make a big trade) so we will have plenty of cash to spend on pitching. And I don’t want either Met pitcher for the package it would cost to get them, plain and simple.
I’m in favor of pretty much standing pat too  
arniefez : 6/29/2018 8:27 am : link
But keep in mind there are a lot of rule 5 eligible players in the system so trading the ones that won’t be on next years 40 man is probably smart.
RE: I’m in favor of pretty much standing pat too  
UConn4523 : 6/29/2018 8:33 am : link
In comment 14002130 arniefez said:
Quote:
But keep in mind there are a lot of rule 5 eligible players in the system so trading the ones that won’t be on next years 40 man is probably smart.


Definitely. I certainly don't mind trades, they should look to improve the team wherever possible, but i'm against any significant trades that involve our top prospects.
A Bit of a Different Angle for "Old Timers"  
varco : 6/29/2018 8:45 am : link
This discussion brings me back to my younger days (1950's - early 1960's), when the Yankees would always come up with a trade for Bud Daley, Art Ditmars or a Bobby Schantz from the then Kansas City A's to put them over the top. Think this group also included Don Larsen and "Bullet Bob" Turley. Usually the trade would involve someone like Jerry Lumpe or Earl Torguson or some other lesser players. Sometimes, Bud Daley or other players would go back and forth! Fans used to consider the A's as a major league portion of the Yankee farm system. Times have changed but it's still fun to remember. This would kind of upset the Topps baseball card collection, when Yankee players would be more valued than others. Good for a smile with your morning cup of coffee.
BTW I mentioned Freicer Perez as a potential 40-man guy...  
Dunedin81 : 6/29/2018 8:50 am : link
he just had surgery, presumably on his shoulder, so that seems unlikely now.
Thoughts  
Bill2 : 6/29/2018 9:00 am : link
I think most posters do not want to trade top prospects.


If Cashman agrees, that means the Yankees will more nearly target mid range SP, a relief pitcher and a good 1B who can hit left handed pitching. Maybe a high minors catcher?

All those pieces can help this year and next and the year after. Either as players or for trades.

But we need to remember that the Yankees know the makeup and the metrics of their players very well.

We don't know launch angle and velocity per pitch speed faced or who can hit a slider or curveball. We don't know spin rates and average late movement and command.

As someone mentioned, we fans thought Montero and Hughes were potential HOF decade long All Stars.

What I would watch for over the next few weeks is aligned "showcasing". Nothing detrimental to the teams record but clear and carefully selected chances to be noticed. So far, Loaisiga, Gallegos, Cessa, German, Warren, Holder, Shreve, Adams even Sheffield have had chances to shine. With mixed results. But as compared to a month ago (granted Tanaka and Drury injuries) the claim that the Yankees are stocked with guys on the verge has strengthened.

Conclusion: They have chips. They have the chips for a better than average gamble on a 2-3 SP and or a few cog players ( Relief, 1B, 3-5 Sp an option besides Kei at catcher).

They can also clear Rule 5 space by dealing for players lower in the minors who better fill in the pipeline

They do have enough room under the luxury tax calculation as each week passes.

We will know better after this weekend if the option to do nothing this year feels either more solid or weaker than it does now
varco  
Bill2 : 6/29/2018 9:02 am : link
now there is a man who really remembers the good old days
Bill2  
varco : 6/29/2018 10:16 am : link
Those were the days, my friend! Seems like any player immediately got better / more productive when then put on the pinstripes. Was like "scrap heap" to "top drawer" ---Enos Slaughter, Hector Lopez, Pedro Ramos, etc. The key at that time (and I believe mostly true today) was adding a complementary piece to a solid core.
Roger Maris  
Bill2 : 6/29/2018 11:16 am : link
was a trade from Kansas City to the Yankees.

KC was our AAAA team back then
Bill2 ---Great Pick Up  
varco : 6/29/2018 11:42 am : link
Get a Load of this transaction ---forgot all about it --some of the "usual suspects" were included ---

12-11-1959 Traded by Kansas City Athletics with Joe DeMaestri and Kent Hadley to New York Yankees in exchange for Don Larsen, Hank Bauer, Norm Siebern and Marv Throneberry (December 11, 1959).

Marv Throneberry!!!! There's a player who played for both NY Teams.

You are correct --KC (pre- Charley Finlay) were indeed a AAAA team for the Yanks.
RE: RE: Someone described Severino as a healthy Syndergaard...  
gmenatlarge : 7/9/2018 7:58 am : link
In comment 14001453 Eman11 said:
Quote:
In comment 14001420 Dunedin81 said:


Quote:


and that's not unreasonable as a comparison. Thor is as effective as anyone in baseball when he pitches, but he hasn't stayed healthy. Thor has one 30-start season to his name.



I can understand that comparison but Sevy is so much more of a complete pitcher than Thor. Sevy wants to get you out. He's not afraid to rely on his slider or change up if its dominant that night.

Thor seems to me to want to strike everyone out and is more a thrower than pitcher. He gets his pitch count up high too often for my liking by wanting the K so much.

I think the comparison is there because of their great velocity but it stops there for me.


When you can't stay on the field it's time to lose the "Thor" nickname!
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