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NFT: Yankee trade talk: your one target and what do you give up?

Milton : 6/28/2018 4:49 am
In today's off-day exercise, you get to pick one and only one player to target for a trade and you have to say what you would give up in return. You can shoot for the moon with a guy like DeGrom and be willing to give up some premium value in return (if you're being reasonable) or target one of the half-year rentals like Hamels and offer up a lot less (but it will still take more than just a limited package like Adams and Mckinney). What does the algorithm in your head project as the best do-able deal for the Yankees? My current thinking (subject to change on a daily basis)...
Target: Syndergaard
Compensation: Frazier, Drury, Sheffield, Abreu.

I know, I know, that's a lot to give up. But if it's not painful, it's not realistic.

From the Yankees perspective
--They are getting a proven, top-of-the-rotation, 25-year old with 3 1/2 years left of team control who will slot right in as the #2 starter behind Severino (and they didn't have to give up Torres, Andujar, or Florial). Think about how huge it would be to have two young aces under team control until 2022! The only downside is Syndergaard's history of injuries, but that's all part of the equation that makes him available for a manageable/reasonable price tag.
--They are giving up two young position players who have proven they belong in the Majors, but are buried on the Yankees depth chart; and two of their top pitching prospects, one in Triple A, the other in single A. It's the pitchers that make it painful for the Yankees, but no pain, no gain; and while the two check in as the team's top two pitching prospects according to MLB. com, I'm not convinced they're all that more likely to reach stardom than some of the other arms in the system like Medina, Loaisiga, Stephan, Sauer, Schmidt, Whitlock, and more. Sheffield tops the list based on probability of success, not necessarily upside.

From the Mets perspective
--They are getting two young, starting quality position players under team control (Frazier for five more years, Drury for three) and two very highly regarded pitching prospects, one of whom is ready to make his major league debut (and should slot in right away as a mid-rotation guy), the other just a year or two away (with a fastball that reaches triple digits and two other plus pitches). How often do you get that combination of production and potential without having to give up your veteran #1 starter (DeGrom)?
--They are giving up something that no team ever wants to give up, a young, proven, top-of-rotation pitcher still with years of team control. And to their cross-town rival.

p.s.--I'm not sure how often teams package more than four players in a trade for just one in return, but I would be willing to add another player or two to sweeten the deal: i.e., German, Adams, Acevedo, or one of the established middle-relievers (hopefully not Green or Holder, I love them, but not enough to stand in the way of a deal for Syndergaard).
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If you think Sheffield is ready to plug in  
UConn4523 : 6/28/2018 6:40 am : link
to the middle of the rotation why would we even bother with this trade? If Sheffield isn’t ready then fine, but I’m this scenario it doesn’t seem like a wise move. Add in the fact that Syndergaard is still hurt and it makes me more skeptical.
RE: If you think Sheffield is ready to plug in  
Milton : 6/28/2018 7:13 am : link
In comment 14001227 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
to the middle of the rotation why would we even bother with this trade?
Because I'm not satisfied adding to the middle of the rotation, I want to add to the top of the rotation. That's where the hole exists. Someone who can push Tanaka into the #3 spot, not someone who will fall in behind Tanaka.
I say no trades  
02/03/2008 : 6/28/2018 7:19 am : link
CC and Tanaka have already proven they can pitch in the post season and three man rotation is all you need.
Substitute DeGrom  
Eman11 : 6/28/2018 7:33 am : link
For Syndergaard and I'm in. Thor hasn't proven he's a top flight, no doubt Ace to me and if I'm giving up Frazier and the rest, I want an Ace.

To me he's a thrower who's more interested in what the gun says and striking everyone out than pitching effectively like Sevy does.

He's a six inning pitcher at best and no more unless he changes and from what I can see he doesn't seem like a guy that wants to. Maybe a change of scenery would change that but I wouldn't count on it.
I too wouldn’t rather deGrom  
beatrixkiddo : 6/28/2018 7:47 am : link
Than Syndergaard in that scenario. Yanks giving up way to much, for a guy with injury history, and while a great pitcher and young, he hasn’t shown Ace level stuff.

Debt, deGrom, Tanaka would be an unreal 1,2,3. Factor in our bullpen and that sounds enticing to me. I really like Frazier and want him to be.a part of this teams future however, I would really like to see what Sheffield can do in the bigs too before trading him. A lefty starter, he’ll a lefty arm in general is a big need down the road with CC likely done, and Montgomery still in recovery.
To get DeGrom would (at the very least) require...  
Milton : 6/28/2018 8:09 am : link
...replacing Drury with Andujar. Which may be a reasonable sacrifice, but I'd think long and hard before I'd give up Andujar. If he ever figures out the strike zone, there's not telling how high his ceiling is. He could be a perennial top ten OPS guy.
p.s.--Torres and Andujar coming up as fellow rookies reminds me a little of when Fred Lynn and Jim Rice debuted the same year. Lynn had more hype as a rookie, but Rice had the Hall of Fame career; and I wonder if the same could be true of Torres and Andujar.
No  
Sec 103 : 6/28/2018 8:12 am : link
!!!
Sheffield is a late season call up  
superspynyg : 6/28/2018 8:18 am : link
and then gets a shot at the starting rotation in ST. The same thing they did with Severino a few years back.

We still need a SP for the 2nd half and playoffs. I don't want to give up a top prospect or a big package without getting someone controllable for a year or two past this season.

I have 2 untouchables: Florial and Sheffield. There is only 1 player I would give Sheffield up for that is DeGrom. He is under contract through 2020 and he is a top 5 pitcher.
Other than that I still like Fulmer from Det. I think that if he gets out of there and on a team with a winning culture he will have Verlander/Cole turn around.

People I will part with: Adams, Drury, Austin, Montgomery, Wade to name a few.
RE: To get DeGrom would (at the very least) require...  
Eman11 : 6/28/2018 8:19 am : link
In comment 14001248 Milton said:
Quote:
...replacing Drury with Andujar. Which may be a reasonable sacrifice, but I'd think long and hard before I'd give up Andujar. If he ever figures out the strike zone, there's not telling how high his ceiling is. He could be a perennial top ten OPS guy.
p.s.--Torres and Andujar coming up as fellow rookies reminds me a little of when Fred Lynn and Jim Rice debuted the same year. Lynn had more hype as a rookie, but Rice had the Hall of Fame career; and I wonder if the same could be true of Torres and Andujar.


I don't want to give up Andular either and I don't want Syndergaard. Keep Drury in the trade for DeGrom and throw in another top prospect on top of your offer for Thor and I'm in.

Even though I like Frazier a lot and want to keep him, to get DeGrom I'd
part with him. Not for Thor though.
I'd talk to Sabean first & see what they'd want  
TheMick7 : 6/28/2018 8:53 am : link
for Bumgarner. If the pieces are equal in terms of deGrom/Bumgarner (which I don't think it will be,Mets will ask for much more to justify a trade w/Yankees),I'd go w/MadBum,a lefty who has proven to be a big game pitcher in post season!
RE: I'd talk to Sabean first & see what they'd want  
Heisenberg : 6/28/2018 8:56 am : link
In comment 14001261 TheMick7 said:
Quote:
for Bumgarner. If the pieces are equal in terms of deGrom/Bumgarner (which I don't think it will be,Mets will ask for much more to justify a trade w/Yankees),I'd go w/MadBum,a lefty who has proven to be a big game pitcher in post season!


This is the guy I want too, but the problem is that he's back now and the Giants are 8-2 over their last 10. He's probably not available.
Go after Jon Gray  
CromartiesKid21 : 6/28/2018 9:04 am : link
Might be our Gerrit Cole type that elevates his play away from Coors. Plus his xfip shows hes been very unlucky
I don't see either DeGrom or Bumgarner as being available...  
Milton : 6/28/2018 9:06 am : link
And if they were, the asking price would be outrageous, so those two aren't in the mix (as I see it at least).
I agree with the concerns about asking price but  
Heisenberg : 6/28/2018 9:17 am : link
the thing is that I don't think it makes sense to play around in the middle of the market. If that's what's available, then maybe just stick with what we have. I guess, I'd describe my stance as "ace or nothing". Don't trade a bunch of prospects for a guy that isn't a legit upgrade over CC or Tanaka.
RE: I don't see either DeGrom or Bumgarner as being available...  
Eman11 : 6/28/2018 9:18 am : link
In comment 14001266 Milton said:
Quote:
And if they were, the asking price would be outrageous, so those two aren't in the mix (as I see it at least).


Then I'm passing on a big package that includes the players you mentioned. I'm only going to give up that much for an Ace.

If I can't get one, I'm sitting tight and seeing what I can do from within first. Then if that doesn't work out I'm going for an established pro, innings eater type guy who won't cost nearly as much in either quantity or quality.
Would it be  
mmf551 : 6/28/2018 9:20 am : link
insane for the Yankees to offer up Sanchez and Sheffield? Or Sanchez and Drury?

I'm not sold on Gary for the long term, and that was before his awful start to the season
Prefer no trades  
Jay in Toronto : 6/28/2018 9:22 am : link
Hold a gun to my head Happ for a rental Sonny Gray plus to prospects rated in the teens.
Stay With The Youth Movement  
Jeffrey : 6/28/2018 9:22 am : link
If you are going to trade do it after this season when you can replace CC or Tanaka. Cashman finally got it right to go with a youth movement instead of chasing quick fixes and supertars. Now he has made the Gray trade, the Stanton trade and I fear he is slipping back into old habits. The kids brought fans back and raised interest. People are tired of seeing the youngsters traded for aging vets, high profile superstars or middle of the road players. Stay the course and give the young pitchers a chance to compete. Keep Frazier and the other high end prospects.
RE: Go after Jon Gray  
Justlurking : 6/28/2018 9:25 am : link
In comment 14001264 CromartiesKid21 said:
Quote:
Might be our Gerrit Cole type that elevates his play away from Coors. Plus his xfip shows hes been very unlucky


Jameson Taillon too.
RE: Prefer no trades  
Justlurking : 6/28/2018 9:25 am : link
In comment 14001277 Jay in Toronto said:
Quote:
Hold a gun to my head Happ for a rental Sonny Gray plus to prospects rated in the teens.


Funny - i said same to my buddy the other day. Gray should have some value as he's under control and Happ is a rental.
RE: Would it be  
Greg from LI : 6/28/2018 9:27 am : link
In comment 14001275 mmf551 said:
Quote:
insane for the Yankees to offer up Sanchez and Sheffield? Or Sanchez and Drury?

I'm not sold on Gary for the long term, and that was before his awful start to the season


Yes, that would be idiotic
RE: Stay With The Youth Movement  
Justlurking : 6/28/2018 9:28 am : link
In comment 14001279 Jeffrey said:
Quote:
If you are going to trade do it after this season when you can replace CC or Tanaka. Cashman finally got it right to go with a youth movement instead of chasing quick fixes and supertars. Now he has made the Gray trade, the Stanton trade and I fear he is slipping back into old habits. The kids brought fans back and raised interest. People are tired of seeing the youngsters traded for aging vets, high profile superstars or middle of the road players. Stay the course and give the young pitchers a chance to compete. Keep Frazier and the other high end prospects.


Agree to a point - theyre going to lose kids in the Rule 5 draft so they need to package a few to get something in return or risk losing quality assets for nothing.

I don't trade Gleyber/Miggy for anyone. Frazier needs to be a young under contract potential top 2 starter.

I trade anyone in the lower levels to get a frontline guy. People saying Florial is untouchable - but would trade Frazier - are insane.
Andujar  
allstarjim : 6/28/2018 9:31 am : link
Would need to come in the Thor deal. But not to worry, there is no way the Wilpons is going to deal Thor or deGrom to the Yankees. They would rather take an inferior deal with another team than see one of those two in pinstripes.
The  
DanMetroMan : 6/28/2018 9:32 am : link
Mets and Yankees will not link up on any major trade nor do they match-up particularly well without the Yankees hurting their big league roster. Not happening.
Not Sure Who I Would Target But.......  
varco : 6/28/2018 9:33 am : link
The Yankees have almost an embarrassment of riches in their minor league system and will inevitably lose some prospects to the Rule 5 draft as pressure on the 40 man roster increases. It would probably be wise to thin out the ranks periodically and obtain needed help for the rotation or other areas at the Major League level via trade....as long as they remain under the Luxury Tax threshold. Keep in mind that they will eventually have to "pay up" for their young stars. They need to keep the pipeline filled with young prospects.
Gardy, Gray and PTBNL  
Jeever : 6/28/2018 9:35 am : link
for Corbin.

Lefty starter would be great for Yankee Stadium. Moving Gardy opens up space in the OF and moves a contract. Moving Gray gets rid of the missing the plate by 3 feet while nibbling around the edges.
Milton still insisting on clearing the farm  
adamg : 6/28/2018 9:38 am : link
Eh?
RE: Gardy, Gray and PTBNL  
DanMetroMan : 6/28/2018 9:38 am : link
In comment 14001293 Jeever said:
Quote:
for Corbin.

Lefty starter would be great for Yankee Stadium. Moving Gardy opens up space in the OF and moves a contract. Moving Gray gets rid of the missing the plate by 3 feet while nibbling around the edges.


All due respect but this is ridiculous. Arizona is in 1st place and have Pollock, Peralta and Jay in the OF. There is a 0% chance they would do that.
I think the Yankees will sign Corbin this offseason  
Heisenberg : 6/28/2018 9:39 am : link
but are really unlikely to trade for him.
RE: RE: I don't see either DeGrom or Bumgarner as being available...  
Milton : 6/28/2018 9:42 am : link
In comment 14001273 Eman11 said:
Quote:
In comment 14001266 Milton said:


Quote:


And if they were, the asking price would be outrageous, so those two aren't in the mix (as I see it at least).



Then I'm passing on a big package that includes the players you mentioned. I'm only going to give up that much for an Ace.

If I can't get one, I'm sitting tight and seeing what I can do from within first. Then if that doesn't work out I'm going for an established pro, innings eater type guy who won't cost nearly as much in either quantity or quality.
For the most part, I agree with you, it's only in the value we place on Syndergaard that we differ. He may not be a time-tested, proven Ace, but he's a legit #2, who--at only 25-years of age--still has Ace-upside and 3 1/2 years of team control (DeGrom has 2 1/2 years and Bumgarner 1 1/2 years of team control). So while Syndergaard may not be as proven as are DeGrom and Bumgarner, he comes with advantages of his own; and he is possibly gettable for a reasonable (albeit painful) price tag.
Something's lost, but something's gained... - ( New Window )
RE: I think the Yankees will sign Corbin this offseason  
Milton : 6/28/2018 9:43 am : link
In comment 14001298 Heisenberg said:
Quote:
but are really unlikely to trade for him.
Arizona is in the thick of it, so Corbin won't be on the trade market.
RE: I think the Yankees will sign Corbin this offseason  
DanMetroMan : 6/28/2018 9:44 am : link
In comment 14001298 Heisenberg said:
Quote:
but are really unlikely to trade for him.


Would be a major upset if they don't... but Arizona isn't trading him for 2 veterans and a PTNL. First place teams don't trade their ace
RE: RE: I'd talk to Sabean first & see what they'd want  
TheMick7 : 6/28/2018 9:46 am : link
In comment 14001262 Heisenberg said:
Quote:
In comment 14001261 TheMick7 said:


Quote:


for Bumgarner. If the pieces are equal in terms of deGrom/Bumgarner (which I don't think it will be,Mets will ask for much more to justify a trade w/Yankees),I'd go w/MadBum,a lefty who has proven to be a big game pitcher in post season!



This is the guy I want too, but the problem is that he's back now and the Giants are 8-2 over their last 10. He's probably not available.


I agree It was in response to the question of who I'd target. The only hope is that between now & July 31st, they start losing! Otherwise,it's Happ/Hamels territory & if Hamels won't be traded w/o his $20 million option being enforced for next year, I'd go after Happ!
RE: I say no trades  
gmenatlarge : 6/28/2018 9:46 am : link
In comment 14001235 02/03/2008 said:
Quote:
CC and Tanaka have already proven they can pitch in the post season and three man rotation is all you need.


While CC has been good, he was running out of gas at the end of last year, I wouldn't have confidence he would last through the post-season.
I would be fine..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 6/28/2018 9:48 am : link
with moving Drury and Austin for a 3rd or 4th SP.

Not sure who the target should be, but that would be an OK move.

Otherwise, I really don't want to make moves
RE: Andujar  
gmenatlarge : 6/28/2018 9:48 am : link
In comment 14001288 allstarjim said:
Quote:
Would need to come in the Thor deal. But not to worry, there is no way the Wilpons is going to deal Thor or deGrom to the Yankees. They would rather take an inferior deal with another team than see one of those two in pinstripes.


Inferior deals are a Wilpon specialty!
You guys don't need a front of the rotation guy  
allstarjim : 6/28/2018 9:48 am : link
You need an reliable guy who can get outs and eat innings.

Cole Hamels is probably an ideal candidate. Two Padres' pitchers, Tyson Ross (having a good season) and Clayton Richard, wouldn't cost the prospect haul like Thor, and would provide stability to the rotation.
Giants  
DanMetroMan : 6/28/2018 9:51 am : link
are 2 games out of the WC now. Best pitcher moved may end up being Happ or someone not obviously available on 6/28. Teams will likely target guys like Clayton Richard (quietly a solid MLB SP), Tyson Ross (nice bounceback), Mike Minor etc
It is entirely true that the Yankees have an insanely deep farm...  
Dunedin81 : 6/28/2018 9:53 am : link
but keep in mind they've graduated two of their best positional prospects to the bigs and a third is out for half the year. Pitching is again quite deep, but outside of Sheffield the best of it is either in the bigs or a ways away (Medina, Schmidt, etc). So there are teams that can outdo them for headliner prospects, unless they're willing to move Andujar or Torres (which, presumably, they're not). Frazier could headline, but Houston could probably top a Frazier-centered package if they're willing to deal Kyle Tucker.
Ex-Yankee  
DanMetroMan : 6/28/2018 9:53 am : link
Ivan Nova is a candidate to be moved as well
RE: RE: I think the Yankees will sign Corbin this offseason  
Heisenberg : 6/28/2018 9:55 am : link
In comment 14001304 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
In comment 14001298 Heisenberg said:


Quote:


but are really unlikely to trade for him.



Would be a major upset if they don't... but Arizona isn't trading him for 2 veterans and a PTNL. First place teams don't trade their ace


Agreed. That was like a bad fantasy baseball offer.
RE: It is entirely true that the Yankees have an insanely deep farm...  
DanMetroMan : 6/28/2018 9:55 am : link
In comment 14001314 Dunedin81 said:
Quote:
but keep in mind they've graduated two of their best positional prospects to the bigs and a third is out for half the year. Pitching is again quite deep, but outside of Sheffield the best of it is either in the bigs or a ways away (Medina, Schmidt, etc). So there are teams that can outdo them for headliner prospects, unless they're willing to move Andujar or Torres (which, presumably, they're not). Frazier could headline, but Houston could probably top a Frazier-centered package if they're willing to deal Kyle Tucker.


This is exactly why it's going to be quite hard for the Yankees to land an "ace" (at least one with an ace resume pitching well). Teams don't trade these kind of pitchers without blue chip headliners. The scouting/analytics guys earn their money here... looking for a "Verlander" who can be "fixed" or a lesser name with good stuff who can get the job done. Happ is a very good target for the Yankees however.
.  
Bill2 : 6/28/2018 10:02 am : link
eh?

mid tier starter or two to absorb innings and let the kids stay within safe workloads?

1st baseman as insurance. strangely enough.

relief pitcher to replace Robertson at the end of the year and power through a playoff game if needed or minimize wear and tear on delicate or working under limits starters like Tanaka and the kids ( and to keep needed pieces from the Astros and Sox...or even to make the market higher in relief pitchers. Cashman bluffing to make the long term competitors pay dearly)

Back up catcher someplace in the minors just in case.

Buyers but for cement pieces for this and next year.

Id be stunned if the Yankees deal with the Mets, Baltimore or Pittsburgh.

Id be fine if they held steady and fine if they took small pieces.

I think Andujar, Bird, Frazier, Sanchez, Tanaka all have risk factors that make them GM killers. Potential could be great. As in All Star great. But all have gaps that deserve back up options in the minors.

Who knows? Maybe we really could a deal with the Mets or Baltimore.

We have front office talent we could trade to be part of the advisors surrounding the Wilpons or DAngelos. Randy Levine straight up for DeGrom or Machado. We can add Ellsbury or Shreve if the Mets or Orioles insist. (but only one of them...we dont want a Division or City rival getting too strong).

Levine is really good at making comments about star talent after bruising arbitration processes. Very motivating FO guy. And he is also good at assuring aging stars never leave. Ellsbury might chip in 60 games a year and someone has to pitch innings when the game is likely lost already.

Hidden Gems just waiting for an entreprenurial owner
Clayton Richard  
DanMetroMan : 6/28/2018 10:05 am : link
quietly looks like a league average SP over the last year and a half, team that misses out on Happ probably looks at Richard.
RE: Milton still insisting on clearing the farm  
Milton : 6/28/2018 10:07 am : link
In comment 14001295 adamg said:
Quote:
Eh?
Insisting? That's a funny way to put it. And as I see it, I'm not clearing the farm, I'm finding a way for the Yankees to add a young, All-Star quality pitcher (who will be $-friendly through 2021) without having to clear it. What you see as half-empty, I see as half-full. They get to keep Torres and Andujar, they get to keep Florial, they get to keep Medina, Stephan, Whitlock, Loaisiga, Sauer, Schmidt, Perriera, Perez, Acevedo, Estrada, Adams (who may never be a starter, but could turn out to be a valuable relief pitcher). The success of the recent graduates like Sanchez, Severino, Judge, Torres, and Andujar means the farm system can withstand the hit from the loss of Frazier, Sheffield, etc. (just as it's withstood the loss of Mateo, Rutherford, Kaprielian, Fowler, Guzman, etc.)
one player the Yankees should consider trading now is Dellin Betances  
Giantsfan79 : 6/28/2018 10:09 am : link
he's going to be a free agent next year when he'll turn 31.

He's made about $10 million so far in his career which means he's going to want to max his earnings as this will be his only chance.

Chapman will still be signed for more years so the closer spot with the Yankees won't be open.

The Yankees aren't going to offer him a qualifying offer which will be in the $18 million a year range, which means no draft compensation for the Yankees

Some team is going to offer him big money.

Add him to a package for DeGrom and the Mets get a high end closer who they could flip for even more prospects, and the Yankees don't lose him for nothing. That might allow the Yankees to keep Sheffield or Frazier. An all star bullpen piece has good value.
As mentioned last night on the game thread  
bceagle05 : 6/28/2018 10:09 am : link
Justus Sheffield threw six shutout innings last night, with only one walk. Yankees have been monitoring his innings - quick hooks, extra days between starts - presumably so he has enough gas in the tank to get to the finish line with the big club. Hopefully he gives the rotation the jolt it needs - if not, he could be a weapon out of the pen come Sept./Oct.
I  
DanMetroMan : 6/28/2018 10:09 am : link
don't think MadBum is moved but it would be just like the Yankees to scoop up Loaisiga from SF and then include him in a deal back to SF for an ace lol
RE: one player the Yankees should consider trading now is Dellin Betances  
DanMetroMan : 6/28/2018 10:11 am : link
In comment 14001348 Giantsfan79 said:
Quote:
he's going to be a free agent next year when he'll turn 31.

He's made about $10 million so far in his career which means he's going to want to max his earnings as this will be his only chance.

Chapman will still be signed for more years so the closer spot with the Yankees won't be open.

The Yankees aren't going to offer him a qualifying offer which will be in the $18 million a year range, which means no draft compensation for the Yankees

Some team is going to offer him big money.

Add him to a package for DeGrom and the Mets get a high end closer who they could flip for even more prospects, and the Yankees don't lose him for nothing. That might allow the Yankees to keep Sheffield or Frazier. An all star bullpen piece has good value.


The Mets would have absolutely no interest in Betances. If they deal DeGrom it signals a rebuild. They aren't paying Betances for 1 year and then giving him an extension at 32 years old. Excellent pitcher but not a fit at all. If they deal DeGrom it's going to be for players with 5-6 years of control.
Andujar  
MookGiants : 6/28/2018 10:13 am : link
is a guy I would move if the right SP became available.
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