Today's starting lineups. Iniesta on the bench and Asensio starting for him. Still can't figure out why David Silva is playing. He's been really bad. Also Nacho getting the start over Carvajal who doesn't seem fully fit. He's been bad also.
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Espana XI - De Gea, Nacho, Piqué, Ramos, Alba, Busquets, Koke, Asensio, Isco, Silva, Diego Costa
Russia XI - Akinfeev, Fernandes, Kudryashov, Kutepov, Ignasevich, Zhirkov, Samedov, Kuzyaev, Golovin, Zobnin, Dzyuba
be hesitant labelling them the team to beat. They've had a pretty easy road and haven't been all that convincing. Even today it's not like they had a ton of chances.
I'd put my money on France.
We must have been watching a different game today. They've given up four shots on target all tournament.
I've certainly been bullish on the French. Maybe they're on a collision course. But Brazil has Casemiro go out and now Fernandinho will step in. They have an unreal roster and a manager with a good plan
As for who looks to go far, I like Belgium. France did not look dominating the other day - fast but vulnerable. Uruguay does look to be the real deal. I didn't think Croatia looked so hot, either.
I just do not trust England. That leaves Brazil who I do not think beats Belgium.
I would not have given Russia two thoughts, but their defense looked solid against Spain.
So one side of the bracket is loaded and the other is meh.
I really think they just tried to maintain possession and figured they'd get some easy goals, but they never did a lot of give and go's or tried to push for chances until Iniesta entered the game. They essentially let Russia "hang around".
Russia did defend well, but they were content to sit back and play for penalties. Akineev actually came out and said this in his postmatch interview saying he was exhausted.
I really think they just tried to maintain possession and figured they'd get some easy goals, but they never did a lot of give and go's or tried to push for chances until Iniesta entered the game. They essentially let Russia "hang around".
Russia did defend well, but they were content to sit back and play for penalties. Akineev actually came out and said this in his postmatch interview saying he was exhausted.
Spain moved side to side, nothing forward - like Man United's team under Van Gaal. Nothing penetrating to try and beat the parked bus.
usually problem re-loading their roster but much of this generation of very familiar names just played their last World Cup match. One or two might still be around in four year but guys like Chicharito, Guardado, Vela, Ochoa, Peralta, the dos Santos brothers, and a few others are in their late 20's and early 30's. Rafa is pushing 40 but he's obviously the exception.
completing 90% of them was marveled at by a couple of announcers yesterday, but that was a sign of not pushing forward and instead passing back in forth in front of the defense.
I didn't get Spain's strategy and I thought they failed to get the ball into Diego Costa on numerous occasions. It can be argued that the offense picked up when Aspas came on, but Costa was basically creating his own opportunities by going out on the wing to get the ball at times because there was no service to him in the center. It reminded me a bit of Brazil's play in the previous Would Cup where I think they thought they would win matches just by having flair and because they were Brazil. Spain looked like they figured if they did the tiki-taka passing the goals would magically appear.
1. Spain came into yesterday's match showing terrible vulnerability to counterattacks in the group stage and in the previous two friendlies (under Lopetegui, not Hierro). It was something that Hierro fixed for yesterday despite Russia having a dangerous weapon with the monstrous striker Dzyuba, who had shown himself to be impossible to handle in the group stage.
Well Spain handled him. He was ineffectual in the Spain penalty area...even Pique's ridiculously dumb handball couldn't be attributed to Dzyuba causing a huge amount of problems. Outside of Pique's blunder Russia never came close to troubling De Gea, and you got the feeling that would have been the case if they played for 500 minutes. So it has to be said - Hierro successfully applied a tourniquet to Spain's biggest problem: extreme vulnerability on the counter.
Winning in elimination rounds is about keeping clean sheets and save for one individual error unrelated to tactics Spain did that over 120 minutes against the most creative team they'd faced in the tournament to this point. I'll paraphrase a quote from Pep Guardiola (whose influence in the game today is so massive, even in this tournament where he is not a participant): "My job is to get my players to the final third - in that area it's up to them and their talent to create the goals." That's what happened yesterday. I don't know that Spain underestimated Russia as much as they simply lacked the ideas to break them down. But when you render a team completely impotent like Spain did to Russia yesterday, I think you've done something right. It's about keeping clean sheets (just like it was in '10 and '12 when people complained about boring Spain), and the one reason they did not yesterday is something for which Pique has to answer.
And the players are the reason they didn't score more. Which leads me to...
2. For all his quality, Isco was a problem for Spain in this tournament and especially yesterday. I think I heard that of his 150+ passes yesterday only 11 or 12 went forward. By comparison Iniesta had 13 in his limited time. Isco has immense talent, but he lacked the tactical and positional understanding needed for Spain to function in the final third.
Someone with Isco's ability figures to be important in Spain's immediate future (though he'll already be 30 in Qatar), but if that is so it will require some changes in approach for whomever the new manager is.
3. I've said it many times since 2014, but yesterday only reinforces the excellence and influence of Xavi - IMO the greatest midfielder in history and perhaps the most overall influential single player ever. Already today I've heard both Graham Hunter and Maradona mention the impact Xavi had, and the vacuum left in his wake.
be hesitant labelling them the team to beat. They've had a pretty easy road and haven't been all that convincing. Even today it's not like they had a ton of chances.
I'd put my money on France.
We must have been watching a different game today. They've given up four shots on target all tournament.
I've certainly been bullish on the French. Maybe they're on a collision course. But Brazil has Casemiro go out and now Fernandinho will step in. They have an unreal roster and a manager with a good plan
They had a really solid 2-0 win today, but Mexico actually had more possession over the whole 90 and gave up 13 shots. This was also the best they've looked. The group stage was a struggle for them.
fair point about keeping clean sheets, but this was Spain vs. Russia. Not Spain vs. a top power.
It would be like a powerful offensive college team taking on Harvard and taking the air out of the ball.
When you're the superior team, you should attack and not let the inferior team hang around. We've bemoaned when the giants have done that.
In my eyes, Spain did exactly that. Sure, they neutralized any counterattacks, but they also failed to attack and create chances. Ironically, it looked like both teams played not to lose, with different strategies. Russia was probably correct in doing so. Spain? Should have just rode superior talent.
Brazil or France, assuming Brazil do not get tripped up by Belgium? Â
completing 90% of them was marveled at by a couple of announcers yesterday, but that was a sign of not pushing forward and instead passing back in forth in front of the defense.
I didn't get Spain's strategy and I thought they failed to get the ball into Diego Costa on numerous occasions. It can be argued that the offense picked up when Aspas came on, but Costa was basically creating his own opportunities by going out on the wing to get the ball at times because there was no service to him in the center. It reminded me a bit of Brazil's play in the previous Would Cup where I think they thought they would win matches just by having flair and because they were Brazil. Spain looked like they figured if they did the tiki-taka passing the goals would magically appear.
=+1
In addition I was dumbfounded--and I'm repeating myself from my comment on Sunday's thread--that Isco was playing more of a holding MF role, low and to the center of the pitch even if nominally he was listed as wing on the left. He was content to possess and dump off on passes in the run of play that were entirely non-threatening. That began to change when Dyubov (?) notched the Piqué penalty.
Belgium, Brasil/France (toss-up) have to be considered the strongest heading into the quarers, then you have quasi dark horses in Uruguay, England...but don't sleep on the Swiss: granted it was the opening game in Group, but they have the only goal conceded by Brasil. If they can get by Sweden without Lichteiner and Schar, both under suspension, they will be a tough out.
sorry I will say this a million times
it is so obvious that Russian team is doping their players .. during the Spain match Russian team were flying all over the field with unlimited energy
there is photo of Dzyuba during Spain game where you can clearly see a hole in his arm like he just recently got a shot.
Russia cheated getting Sochi Olympics -- cheated in those Olympics
why would it be any different in World Cup ?
I also went with the Swiss over Sweden, England over Colombia, Â
didn't win that game because they doped. They won because they defended well enough to force penalties.
They are the lowest ranked team in the tournament and one of the top ranked teams kept playing keep away instead of driving to create scoring chances.
Russia was out possessed almost 80-20 - they weren't particularly fresh at the end of the game and Spain ended up getting a few late chances. If they did that the full 90 minutes, I imagine Russia would've lost 3-1 or worse.
They matchup very well with them and I think the speed on the wings serving the ball to Falcao will get them through. I'm looking forward to that match though. I think it will end up being one of the more exciting ones.
fair point about keeping clean sheets, but this was Spain vs. Russia. Not Spain vs. a top power.
It would be like a powerful offensive college team taking on Harvard and taking the air out of the ball.
When you're the superior team, you should attack and not let the inferior team hang around. We've bemoaned when the giants have done that.
In my eyes, Spain did exactly that. Sure, they neutralized any counterattacks, but they also failed to attack and create chances. Ironically, it looked like both teams played not to lose, with different strategies. Russia was probably correct in doing so. Spain? Should have just rode superior talent.
I agree that Spain needed to be more incisive going forward, no question. It's just that tactically I'm not as critical of them as many are being. Yesterday reminded me quite a bit of 2010, when Del Bosque was criticized for using Busquets instead of the more attacking Silva.
In truth the match should have been over when Spain went up 1-0. Pique's error was enormous, and I think is an under-discussed aspect of what happened.
Here is an excerpt from Michael Cox's preview of the Euro 2012 final:
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Spain will do their usual – relentless ball retention, moving it quickly between players, but rarely moving it forward with any speed. They’ll attempt to tire Italy in the first half, before attempting the breakthrough with greater penetration after half-time. It always feels like del Bosque would be happy with a 0-0 at the break (even against much weaker sides), safe in the knowledge Spain will have conserved energy, and have more options from the bench.
be hesitant labelling them the team to beat. They've had a pretty easy road and haven't been all that convincing. Even today it's not like they had a ton of chances.
I'd put my money on France.
We must have been watching a different game today. They've given up four shots on target all tournament.
I've certainly been bullish on the French. Maybe they're on a collision course. But Brazil has Casemiro go out and now Fernandinho will step in. They have an unreal roster and a manager with a good plan
They had a really solid 2-0 win today, but Mexico actually had more possession over the whole 90 and gave up 13 shots. This was also the best they've looked. The group stage was a struggle for them.
Yep, there was no intention to sell Colombia short. If James can get back on the pitch, he, Quadrado (who has been excellent this WC) and Falcao (same) are dangerous on the attack and legit defending in midfield.
When you look at England's play in group, it got by an offensively toothless Tunisia, routed USA-beater Panama (to oohs and ahhs) and played a meaningless scrub match between two knockout round qualifiers. England has yet to play a dangerous attacking team so its back line in this WC has to be considered unproven.
Brazil is doing what you want to do...getting better each match Â
They match-up very well with them and I think the speed on the wings serving the ball to Falcao will get them through. I'm looking forward to that match though. I think it will end up being one of the more exciting ones.
As I mentioned, not an overwhelming favorite on the match-up, felt like England had more team speed and scoring ability,but a good friend at work is a scouser born in Liverpool, so partially an emotional pick on my part.
Before the tournament I picked them to disappoint but I think I may have been wrong there.
This is a really good point. One of the things both Brazil and France has in common, is that neither of their teams are primarily from their domestic league. So it is certainly promising for both to see that they are playing better the more they are playing with each other.
Japan doesn't seem to have gotten the memo that they're to roll over Â
I'd bet on Uruguay. Then again, I thought Germany would win it all despite the red flags.
I'd put my money on France.
We must have been watching a different game today. They've given up four shots on target all tournament.
I've certainly been bullish on the French. Maybe they're on a collision course. But Brazil has Casemiro go out and now Fernandinho will step in. They have an unreal roster and a manager with a good plan
As for who looks to go far, I like Belgium. France did not look dominating the other day - fast but vulnerable. Uruguay does look to be the real deal. I didn't think Croatia looked so hot, either.
I just do not trust England. That leaves Brazil who I do not think beats Belgium.
I would not have given Russia two thoughts, but their defense looked solid against Spain.
So one side of the bracket is loaded and the other is meh.
I really think they just tried to maintain possession and figured they'd get some easy goals, but they never did a lot of give and go's or tried to push for chances until Iniesta entered the game. They essentially let Russia "hang around".
Russia did defend well, but they were content to sit back and play for penalties. Akineev actually came out and said this in his postmatch interview saying he was exhausted.
I really think they just tried to maintain possession and figured they'd get some easy goals, but they never did a lot of give and go's or tried to push for chances until Iniesta entered the game. They essentially let Russia "hang around".
Russia did defend well, but they were content to sit back and play for penalties. Akineev actually came out and said this in his postmatch interview saying he was exhausted.
Spain moved side to side, nothing forward - like Man United's team under Van Gaal. Nothing penetrating to try and beat the parked bus.
I didn't get Spain's strategy and I thought they failed to get the ball into Diego Costa on numerous occasions. It can be argued that the offense picked up when Aspas came on, but Costa was basically creating his own opportunities by going out on the wing to get the ball at times because there was no service to him in the center. It reminded me a bit of Brazil's play in the previous Would Cup where I think they thought they would win matches just by having flair and because they were Brazil. Spain looked like they figured if they did the tiki-taka passing the goals would magically appear.
Well Spain handled him. He was ineffectual in the Spain penalty area...even Pique's ridiculously dumb handball couldn't be attributed to Dzyuba causing a huge amount of problems. Outside of Pique's blunder Russia never came close to troubling De Gea, and you got the feeling that would have been the case if they played for 500 minutes. So it has to be said - Hierro successfully applied a tourniquet to Spain's biggest problem: extreme vulnerability on the counter.
Winning in elimination rounds is about keeping clean sheets and save for one individual error unrelated to tactics Spain did that over 120 minutes against the most creative team they'd faced in the tournament to this point. I'll paraphrase a quote from Pep Guardiola (whose influence in the game today is so massive, even in this tournament where he is not a participant): "My job is to get my players to the final third - in that area it's up to them and their talent to create the goals." That's what happened yesterday. I don't know that Spain underestimated Russia as much as they simply lacked the ideas to break them down. But when you render a team completely impotent like Spain did to Russia yesterday, I think you've done something right. It's about keeping clean sheets (just like it was in '10 and '12 when people complained about boring Spain), and the one reason they did not yesterday is something for which Pique has to answer.
And the players are the reason they didn't score more. Which leads me to...
2. For all his quality, Isco was a problem for Spain in this tournament and especially yesterday. I think I heard that of his 150+ passes yesterday only 11 or 12 went forward. By comparison Iniesta had 13 in his limited time. Isco has immense talent, but he lacked the tactical and positional understanding needed for Spain to function in the final third.
Someone with Isco's ability figures to be important in Spain's immediate future (though he'll already be 30 in Qatar), but if that is so it will require some changes in approach for whomever the new manager is.
3. I've said it many times since 2014, but yesterday only reinforces the excellence and influence of Xavi - IMO the greatest midfielder in history and perhaps the most overall influential single player ever. Already today I've heard both Graham Hunter and Maradona mention the impact Xavi had, and the vacuum left in his wake.
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be hesitant labelling them the team to beat. They've had a pretty easy road and haven't been all that convincing. Even today it's not like they had a ton of chances.
I'd put my money on France.
We must have been watching a different game today. They've given up four shots on target all tournament.
I've certainly been bullish on the French. Maybe they're on a collision course. But Brazil has Casemiro go out and now Fernandinho will step in. They have an unreal roster and a manager with a good plan
They had a really solid 2-0 win today, but Mexico actually had more possession over the whole 90 and gave up 13 shots. This was also the best they've looked. The group stage was a struggle for them.
It would be like a powerful offensive college team taking on Harvard and taking the air out of the ball.
When you're the superior team, you should attack and not let the inferior team hang around. We've bemoaned when the giants have done that.
In my eyes, Spain did exactly that. Sure, they neutralized any counterattacks, but they also failed to attack and create chances. Ironically, it looked like both teams played not to lose, with different strategies. Russia was probably correct in doing so. Spain? Should have just rode superior talent.
I didn't get Spain's strategy and I thought they failed to get the ball into Diego Costa on numerous occasions. It can be argued that the offense picked up when Aspas came on, but Costa was basically creating his own opportunities by going out on the wing to get the ball at times because there was no service to him in the center. It reminded me a bit of Brazil's play in the previous Would Cup where I think they thought they would win matches just by having flair and because they were Brazil. Spain looked like they figured if they did the tiki-taka passing the goals would magically appear.
In addition I was dumbfounded--and I'm repeating myself from my comment on Sunday's thread--that Isco was playing more of a holding MF role, low and to the center of the pitch even if nominally he was listed as wing on the left. He was content to possess and dump off on passes in the run of play that were entirely non-threatening. That began to change when Dyubov (?) notched the Piqué penalty.
Belgium, Brasil/France (toss-up) have to be considered the strongest heading into the quarers, then you have quasi dark horses in Uruguay, England...but don't sleep on the Swiss: granted it was the opening game in Group, but they have the only goal conceded by Brasil. If they can get by Sweden without Lichteiner and Schar, both under suspension, they will be a tough out.
it is so obvious that Russian team is doping their players .. during the Spain match Russian team were flying all over the field with unlimited energy
there is photo of Dzyuba during Spain game where you can clearly see a hole in his arm like he just recently got a shot.
Russia cheated getting Sochi Olympics -- cheated in those Olympics
why would it be any different in World Cup ?
They are the lowest ranked team in the tournament and one of the top ranked teams kept playing keep away instead of driving to create scoring chances.
Russia was out possessed almost 80-20 - they weren't particularly fresh at the end of the game and Spain ended up getting a few late chances. If they did that the full 90 minutes, I imagine Russia would've lost 3-1 or worse.
They matchup very well with them and I think the speed on the wings serving the ball to Falcao will get them through. I'm looking forward to that match though. I think it will end up being one of the more exciting ones.
It would be like a powerful offensive college team taking on Harvard and taking the air out of the ball.
When you're the superior team, you should attack and not let the inferior team hang around. We've bemoaned when the giants have done that.
In my eyes, Spain did exactly that. Sure, they neutralized any counterattacks, but they also failed to attack and create chances. Ironically, it looked like both teams played not to lose, with different strategies. Russia was probably correct in doing so. Spain? Should have just rode superior talent.
I agree that Spain needed to be more incisive going forward, no question. It's just that tactically I'm not as critical of them as many are being. Yesterday reminded me quite a bit of 2010, when Del Bosque was criticized for using Busquets instead of the more attacking Silva.
In truth the match should have been over when Spain went up 1-0. Pique's error was enormous, and I think is an under-discussed aspect of what happened.
Here is an excerpt from Michael Cox's preview of the Euro 2012 final:
He could have been writing that about yesterday.
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In comment 14004470 Jon in NYC said:
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be hesitant labelling them the team to beat. They've had a pretty easy road and haven't been all that convincing. Even today it's not like they had a ton of chances.
I'd put my money on France.
We must have been watching a different game today. They've given up four shots on target all tournament.
I've certainly been bullish on the French. Maybe they're on a collision course. But Brazil has Casemiro go out and now Fernandinho will step in. They have an unreal roster and a manager with a good plan
They had a really solid 2-0 win today, but Mexico actually had more possession over the whole 90 and gave up 13 shots. This was also the best they've looked. The group stage was a struggle for them.
One shot on target. Brazil put 10 on net
When you look at England's play in group, it got by an offensively toothless Tunisia, routed USA-beater Panama (to oohs and ahhs) and played a meaningless scrub match between two knockout round qualifiers. England has yet to play a dangerous attacking team so its back line in this WC has to be considered unproven.
They match-up very well with them and I think the speed on the wings serving the ball to Falcao will get them through. I'm looking forward to that match though. I think it will end up being one of the more exciting ones.
As I mentioned, not an overwhelming favorite on the match-up, felt like England had more team speed and scoring ability,but a good friend at work is a scouser born in Liverpool, so partially an emotional pick on my part.
who do you like on the Swiss vs Swedes?
much prefer to watch some take on their man, beat them and get past by dribbling, instead of endless sideways passing.
Maybe Belgium, France and Brazil are a better watch because they have dribblers who case a defence get all unbalanced.
They have a stout defense, Sommer is solid and though unspectacular by name recognition, their attack is very competent.
I wouldn't call them favorites, but they'll get by Sweden and have a chance against anyone else they face.
This is a really good point. One of the things both Brazil and France has in common, is that neither of their teams are primarily from their domestic league. So it is certainly promising for both to see that they are playing better the more they are playing with each other.
Belgium looks disjointed, which was the big concern with Martinez. Good at man management, not great with tactics.
Mertins and DeBruyne can score from outside the box at any moment.
Mexico also looked good until they gave up a goal.
good to see Kompany back and playing
It's never surprising to be disappointed by Belgium, but wow.
Strategically attack them.
From minute 1 Roberto Martinez must have felt like Apollo Creed's trainer - they don't think this is a damn exhibition, they think it's a damn fight.
I don't like the substitution of Fellani here.
Mertens was doing OK getting some crosses in. Fellani is way too one-dimensional
I don't like the substitution of Fellani here.
Mertens was doing OK getting some crosses in. Fellani is way too one-dimensional
If I saw Klinsmann on the street today in front of me I'd step on the fucking gas. Gutless piece of shit.