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NFT: Yanks talk 7/2 - Braves on deck, an off the wall trade idea

Greg from LI : 7/2/2018 11:28 am
The upstart Braves come to the Bronx for a three game set. While much ink has been spilled over the Braves' young talent, now that I'm looking at their stats, what jumps out at you is the out-of-nowhere numbers being posted by some guys who have been washed-up has beens for a while: Kurt Suzuki, Nick Markakis, and Anibal Sanchez, tonight's scheduled starter.

Suzuki never hit much until going to the Braves last year at the age of 33. He's hit .284/.351/.515 as a Brave - what the hell? Who knew Nick Markakis was even still in MLB?? Yet he here is posting career-best numbers at 34. Sanchez posted sterling ERAs of 4.99, 5.87, and 6.41 the past three seasons in Detroit, but somehow has a 2.68 this year. Time for some market corrections.

Regarding trades for starters.....maybe the Yankees do need to deal for a 2018 Met pitcher. Just not the ones you're thinking of. Could Matt Harvey, of all people, be a good bargain pickup? His last five starts for the Reds have been very good: 29.1 IP, 21 H, 11 R, 21K/7 BB, 3.38 ERA, .955 WHIP. Fangraphs had a little writeup about him today suggesting his rebound isn't smoke and mirrors.

What a kick in the balls to the Mets if Harvey ended up helping the Yanks to a title, huh?
Fangraphs on Harvey - ( New Window )
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Why is Sonny Gray so bad, anyway  
Greg from LI : 7/2/2018 12:30 pm : link
I know his detractors like to deny it, but he actually was a rather good starter in Oakland. Some regression would be explainable, but he's become basically the worst starter in the AL. Maybe all of MLB, I don't know, I don't pay close enough attention to the NL to know.
RE: I don't think the Mets will deal with the Yankees either  
Greg from LI : 7/2/2018 12:31 pm : link
In comment 14004527 bceagle05 said:
Quote:
Cashman was making that point the other day, likely with a purpose. He said when they made the decision to "fight another day" and trade Miller and Chapman, they were open to trading them anywhere, even the Red Sox.


Frankly, as arrogant as this sounds, that's why the Yankees are the Yankees and the Mets are the Mets.

Also, a fair deal for deGrom is STILL pretty steep, perhaps steeper than Cashman is willing to pay anyway.
bceagle  
figgy2989 : 7/2/2018 12:32 pm : link
And that is why Mets fans don't trust ownership, they have taken less on deals on the past as not to help the Yanks. When you have two franchise players, if they do decide to trade them, you better get a haul of a return no matter who the trade partner is. If it is leaked (which you know it will be), that they made a trade and there was a better offer on the table from the Yanks...

Fuck it, I am getting pissed just thinking about it.
Call our pal Jeter  
xman : 7/2/2018 12:35 pm : link
and see what he has to offer. At least he might trade Realmuto
.  
arcarsenal : 7/2/2018 12:36 pm : link
Gray seems like one of those guys who just gets lost between the ears. He has stuff to succeed - and we've seen it on occasion. He was fantastic in Toronto a few weeks ago and once in a while, he has outings where you say "ah, there it is!" but then he just has these absolutely non-competitive outings like we saw on Saturday where you feel like you just can't trust him anywhere.

I guess the bottom line at this point is that there's no way he can be trusted in a postseason game barring some miraculous turnaround.
RE: Why is Sonny Gray so bad, anyway  
Heisenberg : 7/2/2018 12:36 pm : link
In comment 14004530 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
I know his detractors like to deny it, but he actually was a rather good starter in Oakland. Some regression would be explainable, but he's become basically the worst starter in the AL. Maybe all of MLB, I don't know, I don't pay close enough attention to the NL to know.


Ed Whitson syndrome
You're right about the Yankee trade tax from Toronto  
Heisenberg : 7/2/2018 12:41 pm : link
Toronto would probably ask for more than we wanted to give.

I've mostly thought that the pitching acquisition this year for Cashman would be more along the lines of Jaime Garcia. If this year's Jaime Garcia is Matt Harvey, I am down, I guess. I do agree that we will prob need options of guys to get 5 innings in the postseason. Harvey could do that and has some possibility for a little more. Hard to rely on him though.
Relying on a five and fly model in the postseason is dicey  
Greg from LI : 7/2/2018 12:43 pm : link
KC made it work for a few years, but you are betting that ALL of your relievers will be lights out game in and game out. That's tough to pull off, even with an excellent pen.
RE: bceagle  
rich in DC : 7/2/2018 12:43 pm : link
In comment 14004532 figgy2989 said:
Quote:
And that is why Mets fans don't trust ownership, they have taken less on deals on the past as not to help the Yanks. When you have two franchise players, if they do decide to trade them, you better get a haul of a return no matter who the trade partner is. If it is leaked (which you know it will be), that they made a trade and there was a better offer on the table from the Yanks...

Fuck it, I am getting pissed just thinking about it.


If you are a Mets fan, would you be willing to trade deGrom or Thor to the Braves- who may have the most impressive group of young arms around?

For example, would a Mets fan be willing to face deGrom for another 6-7 years in a Braves uniform in exchange for a package of something like: Kyle Wright, Koby Allard, Austin Riley and maybe Christian Pache?
Price  
DanMetroMan : 7/2/2018 12:44 pm : link
on realmuto is said to be enormous. As it should be.
.  
arcarsenal : 7/2/2018 12:44 pm : link
If I'm not mistaken, NYY/TOR actually have a fairly solid business relationship, no?

I don't think the Yankee tax would necessarily be too steep on Happ.

He's not a particularly exciting acquisition, but he does pitch well against BOS - which could be important when we see them again next month.

Putting Gray out there against the Red Sox is like the Red Sox putting Price on the mound against us. It's basically a forfeit.
Urena is pretty much a league average starter...  
Dunedin81 : 7/2/2018 12:48 pm : link
Idk what the ask is.

The issue with Gray is that he has been brilliant in a few starts this year, he still has the stuff. It is primarily a mental issue.
RE: .  
Greg from LI : 7/2/2018 12:50 pm : link
In comment 14004550 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
If I'm not mistaken, NYY/TOR actually have a fairly solid business relationship, no?


Actually, no. The only deals I can remember between the teams are: getting Mondesi in 2002, Clemens for Wells in 1999, Cone for three scrub minor leaguers in 1995. Going back into the 1980s, there was Jessie Barfield for Al Leiter in 1988 and whatever deal it was that sent Fred McGriff there when he was a teenager.
RE: RE: bceagle  
figgy2989 : 7/2/2018 12:54 pm : link
In comment 14004547 rich in DC said:
Quote:
In comment 14004532 figgy2989 said:


Quote:


And that is why Mets fans don't trust ownership, they have taken less on deals on the past as not to help the Yanks. When you have two franchise players, if they do decide to trade them, you better get a haul of a return no matter who the trade partner is. If it is leaked (which you know it will be), that they made a trade and there was a better offer on the table from the Yanks...

Fuck it, I am getting pissed just thinking about it.



If you are a Mets fan, would you be willing to trade deGrom or Thor to the Braves- who may have the most impressive group of young arms around?

For example, would a Mets fan be willing to face deGrom for another 6-7 years in a Braves uniform in exchange for a package of something like: Kyle Wright, Koby Allard, Austin Riley and maybe Christian Pache?


rich I just want this team to make a good move for once that sets them up for the future. As a Mets fan, I don't care who they trade them to as long as the return is worth it. To be honest, I would rather trade with the Yanks then anyone in our division as you don't want them coming back to beat you every year. However, if the Braves put together a package that included their top prospects and that is the best deal offered, then you have to take it.

Make no mistake about it, the Wilpon's pay attention to what is written about them and Jeff thinks he is always the "smartest man in the room", which is why he and Sandy had such a good working relationship.
fun fact  
Greg from LI : 7/2/2018 12:56 pm : link
Before Friday night, the Sawx hadn't lost a game by more than six runs all year. They've now lost two of three by 7 and 10 runs. :)
The Reds are going to try and trade Harvey  
arniefez : 7/2/2018 1:11 pm : link
why wouldn't they he's a free agent and will leave for nothing after this year. The Yankees have several MiLB pitchers who will be rule 5 eligible after this year. Too many to put all of them on 40 man. I'd be all in favor of the Yankees making a list of those pitchers and offering two off the list for someone like Harvey or Harvey himself. There is nothing to lose. Give him a few starts and if he craps the bed let him sit in the bullpen in September when the rosters expand and then he's gone once the season ends.
RE: RE: .  
arcarsenal : 7/2/2018 1:12 pm : link
In comment 14004558 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
In comment 14004550 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


If I'm not mistaken, NYY/TOR actually have a fairly solid business relationship, no?



Actually, no. The only deals I can remember between the teams are: getting Mondesi in 2002, Clemens for Wells in 1999, Cone for three scrub minor leaguers in 1995. Going back into the 1980s, there was Jessie Barfield for Al Leiter in 1988 and whatever deal it was that sent Fred McGriff there when he was a teenager.


Someone said they did during the broadcast yesterday or the day before. I forget who it was. I guess they were wrong.
RE: .  
section125 : 7/2/2018 1:16 pm : link
In comment 14004550 arcarsenal said:
Quote:

Putting Gray out there against the Red Sox is like the Red Sox putting Price on the mound against us. It's basically a forfeit.


So you make sure Gray starts vs Price....18-15 is a good final score.
arc  
Greg from LI : 7/2/2018 1:27 pm : link
I can't swear that's a complete list, but those are the only notable trades between the teams that I can think of.

Now that I'm looking through transaction histories, I missed one - the Rob Refsnyder for Ryan McBroom blockbuster.
RE: RE: bceagle  
Jay on the Island : 7/2/2018 1:29 pm : link
In comment 14004547 rich in DC said:
Quote:
In comment 14004532 figgy2989 said:


Quote:


And that is why Mets fans don't trust ownership, they have taken less on deals on the past as not to help the Yanks. When you have two franchise players, if they do decide to trade them, you better get a haul of a return no matter who the trade partner is. If it is leaked (which you know it will be), that they made a trade and there was a better offer on the table from the Yanks...

Fuck it, I am getting pissed just thinking about it.



If you are a Mets fan, would you be willing to trade deGrom or Thor to the Braves- who may have the most impressive group of young arms around?

For example, would a Mets fan be willing to face deGrom for another 6-7 years in a Braves uniform in exchange for a package of something like: Kyle Wright, Koby Allard, Austin Riley and maybe Christian Pache?


The Braves are no longer interested in trading for a front line SP due to the breakout seasons of Foltynewicz and Newcomb. Soroka was pitching very well before going on the 60 day DL. Luiz Gohara, Max Fried, Kolby Allard, and Touki Toussaint are all ready or will be by seasons end. What the Braves need is another OF next year and a couple of relievers.
RE: RE: .  
arcarsenal : 7/2/2018 1:31 pm : link
In comment 14004588 section125 said:
Quote:
In comment 14004550 arcarsenal said:


Quote:



Putting Gray out there against the Red Sox is like the Red Sox putting Price on the mound against us. It's basically a forfeit.



So you make sure Gray starts vs Price....18-15 is a good final score.


LOL, I was going to say - just match Gray up against Price @ Fenway and we'll have a shot.
RE: arc  
arcarsenal : 7/2/2018 1:31 pm : link
In comment 14004600 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
I can't swear that's a complete list, but those are the only notable trades between the teams that I can think of.

Now that I'm looking through transaction histories, I missed one - the Rob Refsnyder for Ryan McBroom blockbuster.


You're probably right, I just took their word for it and assumed they were right. I can't even remember who the hell said it, I think it was during the Fox broadcast so it wasn't even anyone in the YES booth.
I'm really looking forward to beating up on the Braves  
Greg from LI : 7/2/2018 1:34 pm : link
'90s nostalgia week!
RE: Are you sure about that?  
njm : 7/2/2018 1:41 pm : link
In comment 14004485 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
We've endured more than a few horrific starts from Sonny Gray.


And Gray has been getting booed at home. Do we know with any certainty whatsoever how Harvey would handle that?
A horrible idea  
PaulN : 7/2/2018 2:16 pm : link
Worst idea I have heard. Just keep the young guys in there before we get that guy who has nothing left in the tank, it's not about handling New York, that talk is for morons. it is about his stuff, Sonny Gray does not have the stuff to win in this division, that is why he struggles, not because he can't handle new York, he struggles with his interviews because he can't handle New York. He does not have a put away pitch anymore, and neither does Harvey. He is where he belongs.
This all depends on what Harvey would fetch  
jcn56 : 7/2/2018 2:21 pm : link
Obviously if someone says Andujar you hang up the phone quicker than you picked it up, but if it's some single A prospect that isn't lighting the world on fire, why the hell not?
RE: A horrible idea  
arcarsenal : 7/2/2018 2:27 pm : link
In comment 14004655 PaulN said:
Quote:
Worst idea I have heard. Just keep the young guys in there before we get that guy who has nothing left in the tank, it's not about handling New York, that talk is for morons. it is about his stuff, Sonny Gray does not have the stuff to win in this division, that is why he struggles, not because he can't handle new York, he struggles with his interviews because he can't handle New York. He does not have a put away pitch anymore, and neither does Harvey. He is where he belongs.


Most of this is completely off-base.
Guess you missed the whole part about innings limits  
Greg from LI : 7/2/2018 2:57 pm : link
And how neither German nor Loaisiga has thrown more than 109 innings in their careers.
...  
MetsAreBack : 7/2/2018 3:13 pm : link
Quote:
What a kick in the balls to the Mets if Harvey ended up helping the Yanks to a title, huh?


Not really, I've become completely desensitized to all things Mets. When we're competitive in another 10 years I'm sure they'll hurt me again but once you've experienced the Benitez subway series meltdown 2000, Beltran Take, the 2007 Collapse, and the eerily similar to 2000 game 1 blown save + the 9th inning error to lose the 2015 WS... this ain't bothering us in the slightest.
Sonny Gray's problems are not his "stuff"  
arniefez : 7/2/2018 3:54 pm : link
unless stuff means the six inches between his ears.

As has been pointed out the Yankees have young pitchers who have thrown very limited innings in their careers and they have several pitchers in AA and AAA that will need to be added to the 40 man roster or left exposed to the rule 5 draft and there are a few position players they might need to protect too.

They are going to make trades for pitchers. My guess would be that they will be mid to back end pitchers to eat innings. That's exactly what they should do in my opinion.
How?  
Csonka : 7/2/2018 4:06 pm : link
Quote:
The Mets treated him like shit...
Dunedin81 : 11:42 am : link : reply
And while he deserved a good bit of the blame I don't think it was peculiarly a feature of NYC.


how exactly did the Mets treat him like shit???
Another fun fact  
Greg from LI : 7/2/2018 4:27 pm : link
Lefties have started 26 games against the Yankees. The Yanks have hit them to the tune of .266/.339/.524.
BTW  
Greg from LI : 7/2/2018 4:31 pm : link
Someone in the RAB comments says Boone just told reporters that Loaisiga's inning limit is around 100.
Maybe we could trade Gray for Harvey straight up  
DennyInDenville : 7/2/2018 4:34 pm : link
Use our middling 40 man rule 5 eligible guys we need to get rid of to add an extra reliver and send Shreeve packing

Otherwise I pass on Harvey, but if we can swap Gray for Harvey , sign me up!

Let's kill the Braves tonight!
.  
arcarsenal : 7/2/2018 4:35 pm : link
I'm guessing Boone is counting the 45 innings Lasagna tossed in Tampa/Trenton, right?

So that puts him around 60 and means he's probably only got like 7-8 starts left unless they want to use him as a reliever. But I haven't seen anything regarding that.
OK, here's the actual quote  
Greg from LI : 7/2/2018 4:37 pm : link

Jack Curry Verified account@JackCurryYES
31s31 seconds ago

Boone said he believes Loaisiga can give the Yankees "north of 100 innings" this season. But he wouldn't specify an innings total for the young pitcher who threw only 45 1/3 innings in the minors last season.
I'm probably dreaming  
TJ : 7/2/2018 4:38 pm : link
but I'm still hoping Sheffield can make the jump this year to reliable back end starter. Or maybe even Rogers? But Rogers may have the earnings limitless as Loaisiga.
Also from Curry  
Greg from LI : 7/2/2018 4:38 pm : link
The Yanks have signed Sevy's little brother, Rafael Severino. He's already 19, so don't hold your breath.
Sheffield and Rogers will both have to be added to the 40 man  
arniefez : 7/2/2018 4:47 pm : link
to be called up. Not impossible but still an organizational issue. I think they're only at 39 right now and Montgomery could be moved to the 60 to open another temporary spot.
Sheff will have to be added anyway...  
Dunedin81 : 7/2/2018 4:59 pm : link
Rogers is a candidate for either a call-up, a pre-Rule V trade, or both.
RE: RE: A horrible idea  
chopperhatch : 7/2/2018 5:11 pm : link
In comment 14004667 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
In comment 14004655 PaulN said:


Quote:


Worst idea I have heard. Just keep the young guys in there before we get that guy who has nothing left in the tank, it's not about handling New York, that talk is for morons. it is about his stuff, Sonny Gray does not have the stuff to win in this division, that is why he struggles, not because he can't handle new York, he struggles with his interviews because he can't handle New York. He does not have a put away pitch anymore, and neither does Harvey. He is where he belongs.



Most of this is completely off-base.


PaulN is one of the dumbest posters on BBI arc. I bet he even talks like the FleckthTheale guy.
He's far from dumb and there's enough personal bashing  
arniefez : 7/2/2018 5:18 pm : link
in the real world. No need to get personal he just looks at the game a different way. So do I sometimes. Everyone is allowed to consume their entertainment in a way that entertains them no? If we all agreed and said the same thing all the time how would that be fun?

I have my favorites and I have players that I don't want to root for too. If it was up to me I'd trade Gary Sanchez for a #2 pitcher. Is that smart? Probably not in baseball terms but I wouldn't have to watch Posada 2.0 chase balls to the back stop for the next 10 years.

Sorry for the rant. Done for the day.
Posada 2.0?  
bigbluehoya : 7/2/2018 5:22 pm : link
That would be just awful, wouldn’t it?

JFC.

Birds of a feather, I guess.
Posada 1.0 has four rings  
Greg from LI : 7/2/2018 5:24 pm : link
So yeah, good call Randal!
.  
arcarsenal : 7/2/2018 5:29 pm : link
I mean, he's obviously free to his opinion - but Sonny Gray's issue isn't his stuff, the young guys have innings limits, so we can't just "leave them in there" otherwise the rotation will be quite short come October, and lastly, the interviews stuff makes no sense.

SHRUG....
RE: RE: A horrible idea  
chopperhatch : 7/2/2018 5:30 pm : link
In comment 14004667 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
In comment 14004655 PaulN said:


Quote:


Worst idea I have heard. Just keep the young guys in there before we get that guy who has nothing left in the tank, it's not about handling New York, that talk is for morons. it is about his stuff, Sonny Gray does not have the stuff to win in this division, that is why he struggles, not because he can't handle new York, he struggles with his interviews because he can't handle New York. He does not have a put away pitch anymore, and neither does Harvey. He is where he belongs.



Most of this is completely off-base.


PaulN is one of the dumbest posters on BBI arc. I bet he even talks like the FleckthTheale guy.
.  
arcarsenal : 7/2/2018 5:54 pm : link
So nice, he said it twice! :)
Brian Cashman has doomed the Yankees because  
Hsilwek92 : 7/2/2018 6:05 pm : link
he fleeced too many teams in trades - PaulN
So, the Yanks signed Severino's brother?  
Dave in Hoboken : 7/2/2018 6:07 pm : link
Haven't read through this thread, so don't kill me if it's already been discussed:
Link - ( New Window )
RE: He's far from dumb and there's enough personal bashing  
DennyInDenville : 7/2/2018 6:22 pm : link
In comment 14004868 arniefez said:
Quote:
in the real world. No need to get personal he just looks at the game a different way. So do I sometimes. Everyone is allowed to consume their entertainment in a way that entertains them no? If we all agreed and said the same thing all the time how would that be fun?

I have my favorites and I have players that I don't want to root for too. If it was up to me I'd trade Gary Sanchez for a #2 pitcher. Is that smart? Probably not in baseball terms but I wouldn't have to watch Posada 2.0 chase balls to the back stop for the next 10 years.

Sorry for the rant. Done for the day.

That's a really good post, it's very true folks! Lots of real world drama, BBI is supposed to be an escape.. if somebody says something really stupid, it's much better for everyone reading the site to ignore it or address it without personal vitriol at the least. In my opinion. The only people who are catered to when insults happen are the very group of people doing most of the insults.

Great rant bro.

Let's play ball.
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