I like what the Knicks are doing. Perry/Fizdale appears to finally be adding some credibility & patience to this franchise. Both Perry & Mills have been stressing the importance of not skipping steps during the rebuilding process, but the NBA is a veteran league still. Young players (if the pan out) and that is a big if, need to be supplemented by veteran stars to truly compete.
With all this said, next year is a very strong FA class and NYK will have cap room for a max contract to pair with KP. Hopefully guys like Frank & Knox can develop as well. My question is this, who is worth it? Back in 2010 moves were forced to save face, it was not an option to maintain cap flexibility, instead overpaying for Amare & forcing the Melo trade. It didn’t work.
Nothing sets you back more than overpaying in the NBA, it destroys teams.
Is Kyrie worth it? It reminds me of McDyess with his knee history. It could be very risky.
Jimmy Butler? Can he be a piece that helps contend for a title? I don’t know.
Klay Thompson? Eh.
Kawhi Leonard? Feels destined for LA.
Kevin Durant? Probably a pipe dream.
I know the Knicks can’t star chase, but stars are needed to win in the NBA. Developing through the draft is great, but it’s unlikely we will hit on all picks & you could be looking at another 4-5 years at minimum.
How would you spend next years cap money, if at all?
And Timmy is probably going to cost a first rounder to get rid of him. I still think our best option is to make a deal the OKC for Melo and then buyout Melo. Lee baker and Thomas or Hardaway and Thomas. I would offer a 2022 1st rounder if they took hardaway and Lee. I think Knicks will be good by 2021 so if it means sacrificing a pick in the 20’s to maximize the tank this year for a high lottery pick and the ability to go for 2 maxes I would do it.
It is easier to trade Lee than any of the others
Now ur set for 2019
Klay is a nice player but is also a NO. He would turn 30 during his first year with Knicks. He is the 3rd option on a very good team. Without Curry, he won't get the same open looks.
Durant and Kawhi would be great but Knicks have no chance.
Kyrie is a risk but I think Knicks could get him. He would also be only 27.I'd do it.
Kyrie, Porzingas, THJR and the young guys would be a legit contender in the East. Once you are a contender, it is easier to attract free agents.
Cousins might also be a possibility.
Klay was the second option on a team that won a championship and then won 73 games the following season. The Warriors were good before Durant got there, and Klay Thompson was a huge part of that. I think he should be the prime target if Durant isn’t keen to come here.
kp-17
thjr-17
lee-12
frank-4
thomas 1
knox-4
19 first-4-7
78 million
roughly 31 million under
cap projected 109
a noah stretch gets you to 43
you need to somehow get to around 60 million to get 2 max slots...
It is easier to trade Lee than any of the others
Now ur set for 2019
OKC would never do this.
kp-17
thjr-17
lee-12
frank-4
thomas 1
knox-4
19 first-4-7
78 million
roughly 31 million under
cap projected 109
a noah stretch gets you to 43
you need to somehow get to around 60 million to get 2 max slots...
At that point, if you have a second max guy you really want, you can attach an asset to send Tim packing or a sign and trade around Tim with the team losing the player. Lee, you either dump for nothing or you can even stretch him too.
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noah-19
kp-17
thjr-17
lee-12
frank-4
thomas 1
knox-4
19 first-4-7
78 million
roughly 31 million under
cap projected 109
a noah stretch gets you to 43
you need to somehow get to around 60 million to get 2 max slots...
At that point, if you have a second max guy you really want, you can attach an asset to send Tim packing or a sign and trade around Tim with the team losing the player. Lee, you either dump for nothing or you can even stretch him too.
can only stretch 1 player at a time...
but yeah not crazy to thunk knicks can get 2 max
if you didnt have to give up frank, knox or kp to get him i think you do it...
you then go into free agent meetings with butler and kp
if you didnt have to give up frank, knox or kp to get him i think you do it...
you then go into free agent meetings with butler and kp
Without giving up Frank, Knox, or KP they would have to give up the 2019 first in the trade. I am not sure it would be worth it to give up a potential top 3 pick when you could potentially just wait until next summer and make a run at Butler as a free agent.
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and it is a reasonable deal, they should go after butler, if it guarantees you irving...
if you didnt have to give up frank, knox or kp to get him i think you do it...
you then go into free agent meetings with butler and kp
Without giving up Frank, Knox, or KP they would have to give up the 2019 first in the trade. I am not sure it would be worth it to give up a potential top 3 pick when you could potentially just wait until next summer and make a run at Butler as a free agent.
if it guaranteed you irving and butler, and you got to keep your core together?
irving
frank
butler
knox
kp
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In comment 14006763 nygiants16 said:
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and it is a reasonable deal, they should go after butler, if it guarantees you irving...
if you didnt have to give up frank, knox or kp to get him i think you do it...
you then go into free agent meetings with butler and kp
Without giving up Frank, Knox, or KP they would have to give up the 2019 first in the trade. I am not sure it would be worth it to give up a potential top 3 pick when you could potentially just wait until next summer and make a run at Butler as a free agent.
if it guaranteed you irving and butler, and you got to keep your core together?
irving
frank
butler
knox
kp
I think I would rather have KP, Frank, Knox, and RJ Barrett/Zion Williamson with the opportunity to bring in 2 max guys next summer in free agency. It would be similar to what the Lakers are doing, yeah they didn't get two max guys yet but they have Lebron and thus far are showing patience to wait to add the second guy next summer.
Personally id rather wait and take my 1% chance with KD and go from there. Might still end up with Irving/Butler and keeping our assets. It would probably cost less assets to move the THJR deal then it would take to acquire Butler.
Plus i see no way we can get butler without giving up Frank and/or Knox along with the 2019 first.
Personally id rather wait and take my 1% chance with KD and go from there. Might still end up with Irving/Butler and keeping our assets. It would probably cost less assets to move the THJR deal then it would take to acquire Butler.
Plus i see no way we can get butler without giving up Frank and/or Knox along with the 2019 first.
that is why i said inly if it didnt cost a ton because right now you do not have 2 maxes, you have 1 and maybe a half...
this would guarantee you room for 2..
Kyrie, when healthy, is a superstar. But his injuries concern me.
Kyrie, when healthy, is a superstar. But his injuries concern me.
Another reason I think there might be some actual legs to it is that Bill Simmons has had Kevin Durant on his podcast 4 or 5 times, and has also had Kleiman on by himself. Simmons has mentioned multiple times that Durant wants to be the one to "save the Knicks." He seems like he has a pretty good relationship with Durant, so I doubt he would just be saying that if unless he was actually hearing it to be a thing.
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I don't think KD is the pipe dream people are making it out to be. Rich Kleiman, his business partner, is a big time Knicks fan & is very close to Mills. I'm not saying the Knicks are the favorites at all, but I don't think it's completely crazy.
Kyrie, when healthy, is a superstar. But his injuries concern me.
Another reason I think there might be some actual legs to it is that Bill Simmons has had Kevin Durant on his podcast 4 or 5 times, and has also had Kleiman on by himself. Simmons has mentioned multiple times that Durant wants to be the one to "save the Knicks." He seems like he has a pretty good relationship with Durant, so I doubt he would just be saying that if unless he was actually hearing it to be a thing.
Mike, I listened to those podcasts too. Again, I don't think the NYK are favorites or anything, but they'll get a meeting & if they have a nice foundation, i.e. KP, Knox, etc. & are able to land another superstar like Irving or Butler, they'll be an appealing option. Imagine being the man who turned the Knicks around? He'd be a freaking legend.
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I don't think KD is the pipe dream people are making it out to be. Rich Kleiman, his business partner, is a big time Knicks fan & is very close to Mills. I'm not saying the Knicks are the favorites at all, but I don't think it's completely crazy.
Kyrie, when healthy, is a superstar. But his injuries concern me.
Another reason I think there might be some actual legs to it is that Bill Simmons has had Kevin Durant on his podcast 4 or 5 times, and has also had Kleiman on by himself. Simmons has mentioned multiple times that Durant wants to be the one to "save the Knicks." He seems like he has a pretty good relationship with Durant, so I doubt he would just be saying that if unless he was actually hearing it to be a thing.
I agree with this. Like Lebron, there have been rumblings that Durant isn’t all that happy in GS and if you read Lowe’s article from June he sounds like a guy that gets bored easily and wants to be challenged. That may sound silly since he took the easiest path to a ring but he wanted to be challenged in terms of his role, learning how to dominate without the offense running through him and taking advantage of his skills with those pieces there.
Once you win 3 rings, there’s nothing left to accomplish and i’d imagine that he’d want to go somewhere else and try and play with different guys that complement him in a new city and system (at some point, maybe not next year). The Knicks could offer him the chance to play in a fast-paced offense, with long defenders and some shooting. It’d be the perfect place for him to play the Lebron role and have the offense run through him. Not to mention he seems to care about his off the field business interests and other than SF, NY is the best place to do it.
I don’t see how the Lakers were in a better spot than the Knicks will be in next year. They’ll have the assets to go after another superstar if the opportunity arises and will be a year away from more cap space. What they have that the Lakers don’t is a guy on the cusp of superstardom who’s already a star and easily can slot in with anyone and the opportunity to create a legacy in NY that would rival Lebron’s in Cleveland. Durant is despised by OKC and isn’t beloved by Warrior fans in the way that their homegrown stars (especially Curry) are. He’ll never get the respect from his experience there that guys typically get with a resume like that.
Lowe’s Lebron article - ( New Window )
KD, the people around him, and the league have to realize how huge it would be to have him in NY, Lebron in LA, Curry & co in the Bay area, Harden in Houston, Simmons/Embiid in Philly, and a strong Boston team. That has to be the dream scenario for Silver, probably the only thing that could make it better is if Anthony Davis were to return for a homecoming in Chicago. It just makes too much sense for everyone for Durant to leave the Warriors after completing the 3peat.
Big on the Fiz hire (preferred Bud) but Fiz is a salesman. That's his thing. Doesn't mean he can't coach but he sells himself and his bravado quite well (see his ridiculously hot wife).
Knicks fans this year should be big warrior fans. If they win another, I find it more likely that they'll leave to go for a new challenge.
If KD & Dubs win a 3rd title, the odds increase that he looks to go elsewhere.
When you're good enough to reach the peak of the profession, most people at that level are very confident.
D'antoni's proven himself to be an excellent coach, as well. It's hard to find a way to dismiss what he's done with Houston.
god knows
i think he exagerates what he hears
I'd have to seriously consider that, since it would still leave the Knicks with a max next offseason.
Lonzo, Deng, Kuzma, 1sts.
Lonzo, Deng, Kuzma, 1sts.
lakera will not give up kuzma...
supposedly he said lillard only wants to go to lakers or knicks if portland does nlt add anyone...
lillard was pissed when they let ed davis go
wait so you pass on the oppurtunity to add onenof the top point guards in the game and still have max money to add a 3rd piece?
the object is to get stars, so you would rather wait and hope you draft one rather than getting a pkayer that is already one?
But again, Lillard has 0 leverage here.
But keeping the picks means you have a chance to get a top 3 pick next offseason which could develop into a 2nd star as well as (potentially) the cap room to add two other stars from: Irving/Butler/Thompson/Durant/etc.
If we are trotting a starting lineup of Kanter, Tim Hardaway, Lee and two 19 year olds out there for 60 games until KP gets back I don't see how they win more than 15 games without him. The team was a disaster after KP went down last year, and I don't see any reason that they would be substantially better.
On top of that you figure they will work KP back slowly and have him on some type of minutes restriction to start. So best case scenario they win half of their games with him, bringing the season total up to 25 or so? With teams like Dallas, Phoenix and Memphis looking to be improved this year I think we should be realistically expecting a top 5 pick.
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I’m not trading young pieces. Pass. Keep the rebuild coming. If you add him you probably won’t get a top 5 pick. Keep the pace, suck, add another young gun and move forward.
wait so you pass on the oppurtunity to add onenof the top point guards in the game and still have max money to add a 3rd piece?
the object is to get stars, so you would rather wait and hope you draft one rather than getting a pkayer that is already one?
It would take too much to get him. You are talking Frank, Knox, a 1st round pick and Lee. Maybe more.