NFT: "Yankees make a strong offer for Machado" - MLB.com

Another RH power bat a bit excessive

For Machado

Yanks will never include Sheffield. Especially for a player who they could easily lose after the season. He is their best prospect and could be a #2 behind Sevy for years.

2 He is adamant about playing ss and the yanks like Didi. Didi is a great Yankee and will be our ss for years. They even moved Torres to another position so they could keep Didi at SS.

Baltimore does not want to Trade Machado to Yanks and have to play against him. Unless they get a huge haul back. We are talking Sheffield, Andjuar and others.

plus overpaying for Machado does not give us room to get a SP which Cash has said will happen.

He will go to NL.

It's fun for me to try and think along with Cashman from now until the trade deadline. Here's what I think is happening.

He thinks it's highly unlikely he can trade for a difference making pitcher at a price he's willing to live with.

It's likely he can trade for an innings eater who is league average at best without giving up much more than rule 5 guys who they won't protect. But that won't impact the post season.

He thinks Machado can impact the division race and the post season and the long term. He upgrades the defense at 3B upgrades the offense at 3B and doesn't strike out much.

Driving up the price helps the Orioles so that's not his goal. But driving up the price will eliminate the Red Sox because they're out of trade chips. Eliminating the Red Sox is probably much more important to him than the Orioles getting a few better players.

The Yankees literally could trade for any player in baseball if they wanted to. No team has more trade chips between MLB and MiLB. But that means making everyone available in trades which the Yankees wouldn't and shouldn't do.

It must be fun to be Brian Cashman even with all the pressure that comes with the job.

Why would the Yankees want the Orioles to get a better price? That's counter productive.

that the Yankees will sign Machado after the season ends. If the Yankees are offering them the best package for him they'd be pretty stupid to turn that down for 2 1/2 months of 2018. That's all they can control. Of course the Orioles are pretty stupid or they wouldn't be in this situation.

In comment 14011455 superspynyg said:

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Yanks will never include Sheffield. Especially for a player who they could easily lose after the season. He is their best prospect and could be a #2 behind Sevy for years. 2 He is adamant about playing ss and the yanks like Didi. Didi is a great Yankee and will be our ss for years. They even moved Torres to another position so they could keep Didi at SS. Baltimore does not want to Trade Machado to Yanks and have to play against him. Unless they get a huge haul back. We are talking Sheffield, Andjuar and others. plus overpaying for Machado does not give us room to get a SP which Cash has said will happen. He will go to NL.

I heard it reported yesterday on WFAN where Machado said he would play 3B for the Yanks.

Evidently his people got to him and let him know his comments didn't do himself any favors. He obviously wants to be paid like a SS and that was the main reason for his comment.

Teams hold highly desired players who want the to trade them are asking a lot. They will come down. But only one team can get each highly desired player.

Is he a better fielding 3rd baseman than Andujar? He's certainly not a better fielding shortstop than Didi. And the Yankees would pay with prospects for another right handed slugger of which they already have a adequate supply (Sanchez, Judge, Stanton) And maybe we can add Frazier to this list. I don't like trading promising prospects for players that are not essential.

it's being reported by multiple sources, including Jon Heyman, so I don't doubt there's something to it...but it hasn't been Cashman's style to telegraph his moves in recent years.

I suspect the Orioles are trying to get other suitors to bump up their offers. Hence the nugget about the Yanks not including the guy they really want (Sheffield)

no SS quotes? Do you not hunk that would be worked out prior to trading for him? Do you not think he�s only saying that to maximize his next contract?

I don�t want to trade for him but if it were to happen he�s clearly playing 3B.

In comment 14011455 superspynyg said:

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Yanks will never include Sheffield. Especially for a player who they could easily lose after the season. He is their best prospect and could be a #2 behind Sevy for years. 2 He is adamant about playing ss and the yanks like Didi. Didi is a great Yankee and will be our ss for years. They even moved Torres to another position so they could keep Didi at SS. Baltimore does not want to Trade Machado to Yanks and have to play against him. Unless they get a huge haul back. We are talking Sheffield, Andjuar and others. plus overpaying for Machado does not give us room to get a SP which Cash has said will happen. He will go to NL.

You have a lot of opinions in here that don't seem to be facts.

You are right. The Yanks supposedly aren't including Sheffield. Machado is a half year rental. No way the Yanks would give up Sheffield for a half year rental.

The SS thing is overblown. If he comes here he is playing 3B. He has no say. Didi may not be here for years to come. He is 30 and may demand a big contract. If that is the case then he very well may NOT be our SS of the future.

You are wrong on the Orioles not wanting to trade Machado to the Yanks. Their owner signed off on that already as there are no limitations to where he could be traded, even the Yanks. And your proposed trade of Sheffield plus is ridiculius for a half year rental.

Why are you assuming we overpay for Machado? If Machado had multiple years left then yes but he doesn't and we'd still have plenty of players to use in trades to acquire another SP. Plus, what SP is available that gets you excited? The market for SP right now sucks.

Why will he go to the NL? Trading him to an AL team doesn't mean he'll be with that team next year. He's a FA.

In comment 14011470 mfsd said:

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it's being reported by multiple sources, including Jon Heyman, so I don't doubt there's something to it...but it hasn't been Cashman's style to telegraph his moves in recent years. I suspect the Orioles are trying to get other suitors to bump up their offers. Hence the nugget about the Yanks not including the guy they really want (Sheffield)

umm gray was definitely telegraphed and the stanton deal was just like this, yankees make a phone call people say they are interested and no one believes it and then it happens...

but if he somehow trades Andujar for a #2 pitcher and also get Machado (without giving up Sheffield), how can anyone complain?

That's a whole lot of IFs and very unlikely, but holy shit would that be a haul.

In comment 14011475 nygiants16 said:

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In comment 14011470 mfsd said: Quote: it's being reported by multiple sources, including Jon Heyman, so I don't doubt there's something to it...but it hasn't been Cashman's style to telegraph his moves in recent years. I suspect the Orioles are trying to get other suitors to bump up their offers. Hence the nugget about the Yanks not including the guy they really want (Sheffield) umm gray was definitely telegraphed and the stanton deal was just like this, yankees make a phone call people say they are interested and no one believes it and then it happens...

true about Gray - I could be wrong, but in both cases I don't think it was the Yanks leaking the news. As others have posted recently, i suspect it's often the agents too trying to influence the process (what agent wouldn't want his guy getting traded to the Yankees?)

...and see if they need/want to pick up Machado in free agency.

Fulmer went for Cespedes, Daniel Norris for David Price. Both about as highly regarded as Sheffield, and Machado is a better player than either one.

The issue is that the Yankees are hurting for pitching - Machado is a mere luxury - and promoting Sheffield is probably the best personnel move for a pitcher they can hope to make.

In comment 14011467 GeofromNJ said:

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Is he a better fielding 3rd baseman than Andujar? He's certainly not a better fielding shortstop than Didi. And the Yankees would pay with prospects for another right handed slugger of which they already have a adequate supply (Sanchez, Judge, Stanton) And maybe we can add Frazier to this list. I don't like trading promising prospects for players that are not essential.

Yes, he absolutely is better at third base than Andujar.

people dont realize how good machado is

he's signficantly better than andujar and is only three years older than him

In comment 14011467 GeofromNJ said:

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Is he a better fielding 3rd baseman than Andujar? He's certainly not a better fielding shortstop than Didi. And the Yankees would pay with prospects for another right handed slugger of which they already have a adequate supply (Sanchez, Judge, Stanton) And maybe we can add Frazier to this list. I don't like trading promising prospects for players that are not essential.

Machado is a better fielding third baseman than Andujar. I don't think that's disputable. He's also a better hitter but it all comes down to what it's going to cost.

a rental is the key factor here. To me, that lowers the value of players/prospects the O's can expect to get back. If Cash is serious about bringing him in, then he should be seriously working on a contract to avoid Manny hitting the open market from day one?

gives the Yankees a strong, maybe elite, defensive infield. Bird is pretty average, but Torres and Didi are above average and Machado is elite.

Manny would also be a substantial improvement offensively at 3B, even though Andujar has been very good. Manny is an elite offensive player, one of the top handful in all of baseball.

The issue though is one of marginal improvement. The Yankees have one of the best two or three offenses in baseball; with everyone healthy and producing roughly in line with expectations it might be the best. Machado makes them the best offense in baseball, perhaps by a substantial margin. But the difference from Andujar to Machado, offensively and defensively, may actually be less than the difference between Sonny Gray and a league average pitcher in terms of wins and losses. They are 8-10 in games Gray starts, 52-21 in those he doesn't.

But I don't think that Cashman is really interested in trading for Machado now.

I agree he is trying to drive up the prospect cost for Machado outside of Boston's ability to pay. However, at the same time, the Yanks WANT Machado to get traded for a more basic reason.

Once Machado is traded, the team getting him CANNOT make a tender off at the end of the season- meaning that even if the Yanks spend a HUGE amount of money to sign him (let's conservatively estimate $300M), there will be no draft pick loss or IFA pool loss.

If Machado were to stay with the O's the team signing him would lose a huge amount of IFA money and at least one draft pick.

Thus, Cashman wants Machado to get moved- but doesn't want him to go to Boston. He is also is "telegraphing" the Yanks real interest to Machado so when FA comes around, Machado will remember that the Yanks want him.

Just my opinion, but I believe that is what the Yanks are doing here. I just don't see this as being real interest.

The nuance about the pick/pool $ isn�t one that�s obvious to most.

In comment 14011451 Wreckingcrew said:

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Another RH power bat a bit excessive

I think that the Yanks have come to the realization that in the shift era, lefty bats in Yankee Stadium are significantly devalued.

The shift has really hurt lefty pull hitters- dramatically cutting into their BA and taking away a number of hits that would normally make it through the INF. In Yankee Stadium, that tiny RF means that there is even less room for a lefty hitter to get hits- unless they hit a HR.

As we saw with Giambi and Tex, when lefty hitters get pull happy trying to hit HR, they tend to be worse off.

Teams do not shift as regularly or as often with righty hitters. Add in that when they do, LF and left-center in Yankee Stadium is a fairly large area. That still leaves room for the righty hitter to get base hits without having to pull the ball for HR.

Therefore, given the Yanks strong use of analytics, it is quite likely that their numbers people have figured this out and recommended that the Yanks get more righty bats.

It also doesn't hurt that Boston's rotation has a LOT of LHP (Sale, Price, Rodriguez, Pomeranz).

This would also come into play in the post-season as well. Keep in mind that few teams use the shift more than the Astros. Having fewer batters to use the shift against takes away some of the defensive preparations a team can make. Obviously, they will still be aware of the percentages for the INF zones that a batter hits the ball to and position accordingly, but if you can reduce a team's ability to take away half the field in a shift, you help your team's offensive chances.

ideally (from my perspective) they drive the price up so that Boston can't get him and then get trumped by Milwaukee or, more likely, LAD, both of whom have plenty of ammunition and who could really use the bat.

If they sign him in the offseason so be it. They actually won't lose the pool money (as I understand it) so long as they don't exceed the luxury tax this season. But right now he's a luxury, while pitching is a need.

who might be a likely deal for the Yankees. Have to keep that in mind.

firat off the top bidders are nl teams so why wouod the yankees drive up the price? why would they want the orioles to get more?

even if the red sox were in it who cares? even if you drive up the price the red sox still get machado and the orioles get more it is lose lose

without affecting their MLB roster. The farm is pretty barren.

In comment 14011563 Greg from LI said:

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without affecting their MLB roster. The farm is pretty barren.

so then they are not going to get him anyway, red sox are not going to give up players off of their roster just because the yankees make a good offer and orioles are not going to trade him to the red sox for a shit package

that being a LH hitting at YS with the shift in play has completely changed the value of LH hitting for him. As Rich pointed out Boston having 4 LH starters plays into that too but thats not permanent thats right now.

As far as Cashman somehow manipulating the Orioles to trade Machado that's nonsense. If the Yankees hung a flag at Camden Yards saying we don't want Manny the Orioles would still trade him somewhere. Even the Orioles aren't that dumb.

Cashman has been after Manny since the winter, maybe even before that. This isn't a drill he's going to everything he can to make this happen. That tells us he doesn't think he's got a shot at pitching this year. There will be FA pitchers when the season is over and trades made in the winter. If there's no market there's not much else he can do.

if you don't know what the price is to begin with. The Yanks are not doing this to fuck the Red Sox because they don't know what the Red Sox offer is. They are doing this because they feel Machado would improve their team and they are okay with the package they have put forth. The Yanks interest in Machado has been well known prior to Boston having any interest at all. If anything, I can say Boston drove the price up on us but we don't know if that is true. All I am saying is that is a more likely situation than us knowing this tiny window that exists where we make it too expensive for Boston but too cheap for another team. And if that is true then why did we even need to get involved. If that was the case than one of these other teams would have a better offer than the Red Sox without our help.

team doesnt need Mechado

whether Devers is in the package or not. If not Devers, it would probably be centered around Groome (even though he's hurt) and/or Mata. We can certainly trump the latter package easily.

why not move Didi to 2nd and Torres to 3rd. Didi has a strong arm that would help with the DP and Torres has good hands and a decent arm.

Cashman is not "driving up the price" for the O's. He is playing the media to do his work for him.

He has managed to get details like the O's interest in Sheffield and the Yanks refusal to deal Sheffield in the media. By so doing, he actually puts a cap on the price for Machado. However, by not denying or acknowledging what the Yanks are willing to offer- but letting names like Frazier, German and others be thrown about, it effectively removes Boston because they can't match that.

In the end, Cashman WANTS the O's to deal Machado for reasons outlined above. At the same time, he doesn't want to raise the O's expectations so high that it becomes impossible to get him traded. Thus, the use of the media to set the parameters of the deal.

Sometimes people have to understand that just because they read something on the Internet does not make it true. That is the old-fashioned "black and white" thinking that some want to see the world through. Reality is a mix- more hues of grey. The same is true for Internet rumors.

When you see the Yanks supposed interest- ask yourself why the rumor is there, not whether it fits a preconception that you have.

In comment 14011582 Jeever said:

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why not move Didi to 2nd and Torres to 3rd. Didi has a strong arm that would help with the DP and Torres has good hands and a decent arm.

No offense but wtf? Machado would play 3B.

In comment 14011584 rich in DC said:

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Cashman is not "driving up the price" for the O's. He is playing the media to do his work for him. He has managed to get details like the O's interest in Sheffield and the Yanks refusal to deal Sheffield in the media. By so doing, he actually puts a cap on the price for Machado. However, by not denying or acknowledging what the Yanks are willing to offer- but letting names like Frazier, German and others be thrown about, it effectively removes Boston because they can't match that. In the end, Cashman WANTS the O's to deal Machado for reasons outlined above. At the same time, he doesn't want to raise the O's expectations so high that it becomes impossible to get him traded. Thus, the use of the media to set the parameters of the deal. Sometimes people have to understand that just because they read something on the Internet does not make it true. That is the old-fashioned "black and white" thinking that some want to see the world through. Reality is a mix- more hues of grey. The same is true for Internet rumors. When you see the Yanks supposed interest- ask yourself why the rumor is there, not whether it fits a preconception that you have.

Baltimore is moving Machado no matter what. The Yanks aren't facilitating this trade.

It seems like a remote possibility, but for as good a Boston looks, and as awful as Devers has been, it isn�t out of the realm of reason that they could offer Devers.

Again, highly unlikely. But I could see it. It would make Boston an absolute nightmare to deal with.

In fact, if I were Boston, I�d really consider it. They have a lot of payroll and a lot of mouths to feed in the near future, but also some expiring $ in the next 1-2 years.

Pedroia
Nunez
Rusney Castillo
Moreland
Pearce
Hanley
Sandoval (mostly)

All coming off in next 2 years. Also lots of mouths to start feeding a lot more, but it�s a recipe for flexibility.

Side note: BOY OH BOY is that David Price contract awful. It makes me happy.

who will get a colossal payday (and deservedly so). They will also have to pay Sale, and so long as he is healthy that will be a substantial outlay. They have flexibility, but not THAT much.

We are a couple years behind them, but Sanchez, Severino and Judge will eventually need to be paid too.

The Yankees could still top that offer if they so desired.

Sure, the Sox can�t just add. But the players I listed account for more than $60M annually right now.

2 more arb years on Mookie. $15M option on Sale gets them through next year. Decisions to make on Porcello/Pomeranz/Kimbrel. I have to imagine JD likely opts out after next year.

My only point is that if Boston wanted to make Machado among their 3-4 highest priorities, they can make it happen.

In comment 14011596 Greg from LI said:

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The Yankees could still top that offer if they so desired.

Absolutely true. I�m just saying that the �price enforcer� role could actually be a real thing. There were posts that dismissed it summarily.

you actually believe that stuff? That Brain Cashman is some kind of master mind that the rest of MLB GM's can't compete with and that he's single handedly manipulating the media to control what Baltimore does with their trade? Put the kool aid down. Cashman has a lot of chips but so do plenty of other teams. We'll see over the next 2 + weeks how it shakes out.

Machado really makes no sense for Boston with Bogaerts and Devers already there - I don't see them making a serious push for him.

If he comes here, he's not going to leave. I 100% believe if Cashman makes a deal for Machado that he is going to be paid to stay in the Bronx beyond this year. So, I'm less worried about the rental aspect of it.

I still don't really see how it makes sense if Andujar isn't part of the deal. Didi could be moved - I don't see him here beyond next year when he's arb eligible.

I still don't think Manny is really a necessary addition - but at the same time, keeping him away from teams we're competing with adds value, and perhaps the SP market just isn't favorable enough to make sense.

I trust Cashman to do something that makes sense. I just hope Sheffield isn't a part of any deal because I think he can help this year. Even if it's as a LHP out of the pen.

If there isn't an attractive deal for a starter available, then what deal IS available to strengthen the team? If they can get this one done without paying a king's ransom, you could absolutely make the case that it would be worth it rather than sitting tight and hoping that a deal for a starter materializes.

In comment 14011616 Greg from LI said:

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If there isn't an attractive deal for a starter available, then what deal IS available to strengthen the team? If they can get this one done without paying a king's ransom, you could absolutely make the case that it would be worth it rather than sitting tight and hoping that a deal for a starter materializes.

Alternatively, the deal for a starter could require the inclusion of Andujar, thus opening up the need for Machado. I'm also of the belief that if they trade for Machado, it will include either a contract extension or a verbal understanding that one will be reached in the near future.

In comment 14011616 Greg from LI said:

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If there isn't an attractive deal for a starter available, then what deal IS available to strengthen the team? If they can get this one done without paying a king's ransom, you could absolutely make the case that it would be worth it rather than sitting tight and hoping that a deal for a starter materializes.

I agree with you here. I'd also hope if Cash can't get a good deal for a starter he looks to get another big chip for the pen. Lock that sucker down, and come playoff time we could win with our top three now, with German either being #4 or also coming out of the pen as a semi long man.

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Bowden claiming that "potential players involved" are Frazier, Swanson and Chance Adams. I have no idea if thats the offer the #Yankees made or not.


I'm not sure whether that is true or not. I like Swanson and Adams, but that is dealing from depth. Frazier is clearly the one that stings.

If Frazier is the biggest piece we have to part with to get Machado, I would do it (provided he's here long-term, which I imagine he and the Yanks both want)

Since this past offseason. At that point Angelos didn�t want to trade him to the Yanks. Now that they�re bound to trade him, we�ll see.

If you can trade for Machado without giving up a high-end prospect other than Frazier, who's kind of blocked here anyway, and keep Sheffield? Absolutely.

What I would be interested to then see is whether Machado continues to insist on playing SS, which then likely puts Didi on the trade market, or whether he agrees to move back to 3B, putting Andujar on the market.

I hope Machado is fine with 3B because he's really not a good defensive SS. Didi is much better.

I'd hate to lose Andujar, but if that's the case, then they probably have to move him next.

OBP guy and a terrible base stealer. We can upgrade.

But I'll say it again - even a bad SS who can really hit is a plus. The Yankees won plenty with Jeter, and he was a generally terrible SS. I'd prefer to go Didi/Machado, but I could live with Machado/Andujar.

Especially at the up the middle positions (CF, SS, C). If you can find an defender who is adequate at best but an excellent hitter at those positions, it gives you a big edge. Bernie, Jeter, and Po were all below-average at their positions but they all were among the very best hitters at those positions.

In comment 14011622 Milton said:

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I'm also of the belief that if they trade for Machado, it will include either a contract extension or a verbal understanding that one will be reached in the near future.

No way any long-term agreement (or verbal understanding) between Manny and the Yanks will happen at this point.

Machado is having a monster year and Scott Boras is his agent. Both Machado and Boris will want to test the market at year's end, regardless of what the Yanks offer.

He can't scout start pitching so he tries to buy his way out of it with a lineup. Gets a GM who can scout starting pitchers. The guy has had many years here and cannot build a consistent winner. All of you want to backflips because he has done a decent to good job with our youth over the last two years, but does that explain how the heck we have been to 1 world series in 15 years with the highest payroll in an unregulated salaried sport. If he trades for Machado, he should be fired, especially if its a rental.

.

In comment 14011713 Essex said:

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He can't scout start pitching so he tries to buy his way out of it with a lineup. Gets a GM who can scout starting pitchers. The guy has had many years here and cannot build a consistent winner. All of you want to backflips because he has done a decent to good job with our youth over the last two years, but does that explain how the heck we have been to 1 world series in 15 years with the highest payroll in an unregulated salaried sport. If he trades for Machado, he should be fired, especially if its a rental.

Hahah, what a ridiculous post.

LOL, some of the expectations are absolutely absurd.

This is an excellent team right now. Yes, there are a few small holes. No team is perfect. But the Yankees don't have the highest payroll right now, so I don't know where you're getting that from and Cashman did a tremendous job of rebuilding.

This team is positioned to be a major factor for a while. What teams out there are fielding "consistent winners" moreso than the Yanks are?

In comment 14011726 robbieballs2003 said:

Quote:

In comment 14011713 Essex said: Quote: He can't scout start pitching so he tries to buy his way out of it with a lineup. Gets a GM who can scout starting pitchers. The guy has had many years here and cannot build a consistent winner. All of you want to backflips because he has done a decent to good job with our youth over the last two years, but does that explain how the heck we have been to 1 world series in 15 years with the highest payroll in an unregulated salaried sport. If he trades for Machado, he should be fired, especially if its a rental. Hahah, what a ridiculous post.

Right?

Good lord... absolute fucking insanity.

last losing season was...

*checks notes*

...1992.

And the bats coming alive would keep the trolls away until at least game time...

Also, if they could switch Andujar for Frazier in that package. That would be ideal.

In comment 14011735 bceagle05 said:

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last losing season was... *checks notes* ...1992.

Haha. I guess that's not considered a "consistent winner" to some people.

In comment 14011730 arcarsenal said:

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This team is positioned to be a major factor for a while. What teams out there are fielding "consistent winners" moreso than the Yanks are?

$1000000 says his response is Boston, the team that finished last twice in the last 5-6 seasons, but everyone forgets about it because of the massive, MASSIVE fluke that was 2013. Biggest fluke baseball champion I've ever seen, chock-full of scrubs having career seasons.

In comment 14011737 adamg said:

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And the bats coming alive would keep the trolls away until at least game time... Also, if they could switch Andujar for Frazier in that package. That would be ideal.

Why would putting Andujar over Frazier into a deal be ideal? I'm curious.

It is no guarantee that even if we get Machado that he resigns with us so Andujar is insurance and can still be flipped for a SP in the future as part of a package. Andujar has proven himself as a rookie in the majors which is more than can be said for Frazier at this point. And where would Frazier play if he is kept? The OF is already crowded.

In comment 14011654 arcarsenal said:

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If Frazier is the biggest piece we have to part with to get Machado, I would do it (provided he's here long-term, which I imagine he and the Yanks both want)

I'm just the opposite. I'm not in favor of giving up years of Clint Frazier being your starting LF, for a 1/2 season rental. I can see Swanson and Adams. Swanson may have reached his pinnacle, and Adams has regressed this year.

In comment 14011744 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

In comment 14011730 arcarsenal said: Quote: This team is positioned to be a major factor for a while. What teams out there are fielding "consistent winners" moreso than the Yanks are? $1000000 says his response is Boston, the team that finished last twice in the last 5-6 seasons, but everyone forgets about it because of the massive, MASSIVE fluke that was 2013. Biggest fluke baseball champion I've ever seen, chock-full of scrubs having career seasons.

Yeah, I have a feeling that's who he's going to say. That 2013 team sucked. I still can't believe that team won the WS.

Boston also has a higher payroll than NYY.

There are like 5-6 teams with higher payrolls. So that part of his post was also complete horse shit.

In comment 14011747 Beer Man said:

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In comment 14011654 arcarsenal said: Quote: If Frazier is the biggest piece we have to part with to get Machado, I would do it (provided he's here long-term, which I imagine he and the Yanks both want) I'm just the opposite. I'm not in favor of giving up years of Clint Frazier being your starting LF, for a 1/2 season rental. I can see Swanson and Adams. Swanson may have reached his pinnacle, and Adams has regressed this year.

Where is Frazier playing, though? He's still blocked. Gardy and Hicks are both going to be back next year. Stanton and Judge aren't going anywhere.

Then lauding Boston would be a weird thing to do, since they haven't produced a good starter since Jon Lester over a decade ago.

I will never forgive the Dodgers for bailing them out by taking Gonzalez, Crawford, and Beckett (and their massive contracts) off their hands.

Decent outfielders are probably the easiest thing to find in baseball. The Yankees will also still have McKinney in the system, and I wouldn't rule out Wade as an OF possibility in the future.

In comment 14011757 arcarsenal said:

Quote:

In comment 14011747 Beer Man said: Quote: In comment 14011654 arcarsenal said: Quote: If Frazier is the biggest piece we have to part with to get Machado, I would do it (provided he's here long-term, which I imagine he and the Yanks both want) I'm just the opposite. I'm not in favor of giving up years of Clint Frazier being your starting LF, for a 1/2 season rental. I can see Swanson and Adams. Swanson may have reached his pinnacle, and Adams has regressed this year. Where is Frazier playing, though? He's still blocked. Gardy and Hicks are both going to be back next year. Stanton and Judge aren't going anywhere.

I'm not 100% sure Gardy will be back next year. I can definitely see the Yanks offering him a CC like 1 year deal or maybe even a club option for a 2nd year. Problem is I think Gardy wants to play longer and is looking for 3 year deal or two guaranteed at nice money.

I think it could be a very similar situation to what happened with Todd Frazier and the Yanks. They offered areal nice one year deal to come back this year but he wanted more years and while his per year is less, the total deal is higher.

Not sure if something of the sort was posted in here:

The offer was Drury, Tate, Adams, and Josh Rogers.

It's moving closer to done.

In comment 14011765 Eman11 said:

Quote:

In comment 14011757 arcarsenal said: Quote: In comment 14011747 Beer Man said: Quote: In comment 14011654 arcarsenal said: Quote: If Frazier is the biggest piece we have to part with to get Machado, I would do it (provided he's here long-term, which I imagine he and the Yanks both want) I'm just the opposite. I'm not in favor of giving up years of Clint Frazier being your starting LF, for a 1/2 season rental. I can see Swanson and Adams. Swanson may have reached his pinnacle, and Adams has regressed this year. Where is Frazier playing, though? He's still blocked. Gardy and Hicks are both going to be back next year. Stanton and Judge aren't going anywhere. I'm not 100% sure Gardy will be back next year. I can definitely see the Yanks offering him a CC like 1 year deal or maybe even a club option for a 2nd year. Problem is I think Gardy wants to play longer and is looking for 3 year deal or two guaranteed at nice money. I think it could be a very similar situation to what happened with Todd Frazier and the Yanks. They offered areal nice one year deal to come back this year but he wanted more years and while his per year is less, the total deal is higher.

Why wouldn't they just pick up the team option?

In comment 14011766 ajr2456 said:

Quote:

Not sure if something of the sort was posted in here: The offer was Drury, Tate, Adams, and Josh Rogers. It's moving closer to done.

Holy shit, if that's the deal, it's even more of a no-brainer.

Tate is likely going to be a reliever if he makes MLB. Drury is a man lost in the shuffle in NY. Rogers is a guy whose current performance likely exceeds his MLB ability by a fair margin and is Rule V eligible after the season. Wouldn't hesitate for a second to say yes to that.

In comment 14011713 Essex said:

Quote:

He can't scout start pitching so he tries to buy his way out of it with a lineup. Gets a GM who can scout starting pitchers. The guy has had many years here and cannot build a consistent winner. All of you want to backflips because he has done a decent to good job with our youth over the last two years, but does that explain how the heck we have been to 1 world series in 15 years with the highest payroll in an unregulated salaried sport. If he trades for Machado, he should be fired, especially if its a rental.

Jesus wha ridiculously ignorant post.

Name a team who has won a World Series with all home grown, starting pitching in the last 5 years? Hell, make it the last 2? I�ll wait...

Also, the minors have produced a hell of a lot of good relief talent. Guess that�s not Cashman�s doing at all, huh?

Theo Epstein won a World Series with the Cubs, not by drafting starting pitching, exactly the opposite. He accumulated talent and traded it for established, starting pitchers or signed them as FA�s.

The bottoms line is, it doesn�t matter a damn if the pitcher was aquired or developed. As long as they�re helping the Yankees win games, that�s what matters.

In comment 14011766 ajr2456 said:

Quote:

Not sure if something of the sort was posted in here: The offer was Drury, Tate, Adams, and Josh Rogers. It's moving closer to done.

If that's the deal, sign me up.

I like Andujar and glad he won't be traded. Unless he's part of another deal this allows them to send him to AAA, and still be insurance in case Machado doesn't sign long term.

Machado would no don't be an upgrade and while I wasn't high on trading for him as a rental, this is a deal I'd do in a heartbeat.

In comment 14011770 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

In comment 14011766 ajr2456 said: Quote: Not sure if something of the sort was posted in here: The offer was Drury, Tate, Adams, and Josh Rogers. It's moving closer to done. Holy shit, if that's the deal, it's even more of a no-brainer.

if this is the deal, cashman has a full arsenal to go after a pitcher...

this would be an absolute steal

In comment 14011766 ajr2456 said:

Quote:

Not sure if something of the sort was posted in here: The offer was Drury, Tate, Adams, and Josh Rogers. It's moving closer to done.

Thanks for sharing, ajr.

I can�t imagine that package would get it done. Not sure how any sound-minded NYY fan could complain if it ever came to pass.

said sheffield and frazier would not be included

Yeah, if that's what's offered and is going to get this done or close it is an absolute no-brainer. Wouldn't even think twice.

In comment 14011778 bigbluehoya said:

Quote:

In comment 14011766 ajr2456 said: Quote: Not sure if something of the sort was posted in here: The offer was Drury, Tate, Adams, and Josh Rogers. It's moving closer to done. Thanks for sharing, ajr. I can�t imagine that package would get it done. Not sure how any sound-minded NYY fan could complain if it ever came to pass.

I'm not sold on it either, but guy was spot on with the Gray and Stanton deals.

In comment 14011767 arcarsenal said:

Quote:

In comment 14011765 Eman11 said: Quote: In comment 14011757 arcarsenal said: Quote: In comment 14011747 Beer Man said: Quote: In comment 14011654 arcarsenal said: Quote: If Frazier is the biggest piece we have to part with to get Machado, I would do it (provided he's here long-term, which I imagine he and the Yanks both want) I'm just the opposite. I'm not in favor of giving up years of Clint Frazier being your starting LF, for a 1/2 season rental. I can see Swanson and Adams. Swanson may have reached his pinnacle, and Adams has regressed this year. Where is Frazier playing, though? He's still blocked. Gardy and Hicks are both going to be back next year. Stanton and Judge aren't going anywhere. I'm not 100% sure Gardy will be back next year. I can definitely see the Yanks offering him a CC like 1 year deal or maybe even a club option for a 2nd year. Problem is I think Gardy wants to play longer and is looking for 3 year deal or two guaranteed at nice money. I think it could be a very similar situation to what happened with Todd Frazier and the Yanks. They offered areal nice one year deal to come back this year but he wanted more years and while his per year is less, the total deal is higher. Why wouldn't they just pick up the team option?

Well they would if they felt he was worth it but I suspect they want to keep getting younger and don't see him being worth it by then. I think they'd love him for one more but not two.

I think maybe they would throw the team option of a 2nd year with a buyout in there as a sign of respect and also maybe enough to entice him to stay for one more year. Knowing if he plays well, he stays for year two. I just don't know if Gardy would take something like that.

Fuck Fenway and the bullshit effect it has on their hitters.

Benintendi: .260/.370/.435 road, .343/.400/.615 home. What's the big difference? All those cheap Fenway doubles off that stupid fucking wall: 17 2Bs at home, 8 on the road.

Moreland: .260/.345/.455 road, .303/.363/.566 home. Doubles? Same thing, 12 at home, 3 on the road.

Martinez, legitimately good as he is? .304/.377/.519 road, .361/.411/.797 home. 32 XBH at home, 18 on the road.

In comment 14011786 Eman11 said:

Quote:

In comment 14011767 arcarsenal said: Quote: In comment 14011765 Eman11 said: Quote: In comment 14011757 arcarsenal said: Quote: In comment 14011747 Beer Man said: Quote: In comment 14011654 arcarsenal said: Quote: If Frazier is the biggest piece we have to part with to get Machado, I would do it (provided he's here long-term, which I imagine he and the Yanks both want) I'm just the opposite. I'm not in favor of giving up years of Clint Frazier being your starting LF, for a 1/2 season rental. I can see Swanson and Adams. Swanson may have reached his pinnacle, and Adams has regressed this year. Where is Frazier playing, though? He's still blocked. Gardy and Hicks are both going to be back next year. Stanton and Judge aren't going anywhere. I'm not 100% sure Gardy will be back next year. I can definitely see the Yanks offering him a CC like 1 year deal or maybe even a club option for a 2nd year. Problem is I think Gardy wants to play longer and is looking for 3 year deal or two guaranteed at nice money. I think it could be a very similar situation to what happened with Todd Frazier and the Yanks. They offered areal nice one year deal to come back this year but he wanted more years and while his per year is less, the total deal is higher. Why wouldn't they just pick up the team option? Well they would if they felt he was worth it but I suspect they want to keep getting younger and don't see him being worth it by then. I think they'd love him for one more but not two. I think maybe they would throw the team option of a 2nd year with a buyout in there as a sign of respect and also maybe enough to entice him to stay for one more year. Knowing if he plays well, he stays for year two. I just don't know if Gardy would take something like that.

The option year is next year, though. I'm fairly certain they're going to pick it up and then probably let him walk after that.

without giving up Sheffield or Frazier? That would be insane - Baltimore must be kicking itself for not dealing him last season or this past offseason. Can't believe the Dodgers wouldn't top the rumored offers.

In comment 14011757 arcarsenal said:

Quote:

In comment 14011747 Beer Man said: Quote: In comment 14011654 arcarsenal said: Quote: If Frazier is the biggest piece we have to part with to get Machado, I would do it (provided he's here long-term, which I imagine he and the Yanks both want) I'm just the opposite. I'm not in favor of giving up years of Clint Frazier being your starting LF, for a 1/2 season rental. I can see Swanson and Adams. Swanson may have reached his pinnacle, and Adams has regressed this year. Where is Frazier playing, though? He's still blocked. Gardy and Hicks are both going to be back next year. Stanton and Judge aren't going anywhere.

Gardy is in the last year of his contract (although the team has an option for one more). IMO, after this season it is time to move on.

In comment 14011784 ajr2456 said:

Quote:

In comment 14011778 bigbluehoya said: Quote: In comment 14011766 ajr2456 said: Quote: Not sure if something of the sort was posted in here: The offer was Drury, Tate, Adams, and Josh Rogers. It's moving closer to done. Thanks for sharing, ajr. I can�t imagine that package would get it done. Not sure how any sound-minded NYY fan could complain if it ever came to pass. I'm not sold on it either, but guy was spot on with the Gray and Stanton deals.

Fingers crossed. I was originally ambivalent about the idea of trading for MM. If that is the price, I�m in hook/line/sinker and I want it done yesterday.

Thanks again for sharing what you�ve heard, regardless of what happens.

In comment 14011744 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

In comment 14011730 arcarsenal said: Quote: This team is positioned to be a major factor for a while. What teams out there are fielding "consistent winners" moreso than the Yanks are? $1000000 says his response is Boston, the team that finished last twice in the last 5-6 seasons, but everyone forgets about it because of the massive, MASSIVE fluke that was 2013. Biggest fluke baseball champion I've ever seen, chock-full of scrubs having career seasons.

The funny thing is I did not see Boston. And, the Yankees have not fielded consistent winners since probably 2012.
1. I have given Cashman credit for rebuilding team
2. I stand by the fact that he has done a poor job trading for, scouting, and developing starting pitching.
3. We have not won the Division since 2012 and only twice in this decade.
4. To say that we have lived up to the assets he has had is absurd. From 2003-2013 we were first in the Majors every year, many times by a large margin. We went to 2 world series and won 1. We have been second in the majors since 2013 through 2017 and have not won the division once in that time. This is the first year we are not in the top 2 and were 7th in opening day roster. If you are happy with the results given our allocation of resources, good for you. I think I have right not to be. The Dodgers who might not be number one have at least won their Division what four or five years in a row? We have not won it since 2012.
5. The bottom line is that all of you who fawn over Cashman that's your opinion, I just don't think the allocation of resources to bottom line result has been very good in the last 15 years. I think the numbers show it. I hope I eat crow and we win it this year, but I am pretty sure Manny Machado is not the answer to our problems. Almost like getting more playmakers isn't the answer to the Giants OL problems. You need to fix the problem is a design flaw in that outside Sevy we really cannot good innings out of our starting pitching, which makes our BP have to roll Aces almost every night when the score is close. That is not an easy formula.

In comment 14011766 ajr2456 said:

Quote:

Not sure if something of the sort was posted in here: The offer was Drury, Tate, Adams, and Josh Rogers. It's moving closer to done.

This is the first reported deal that actually seems to make sense and be in line what a pure rental player could get. I'm just surprised the O's wouldn't want more high risk/reward players - someone like a Luis Medina or a Clarke Schmidt.

I would be 100% behind that deal.

In comment 14011795 Beer Man said:

Quote:

In comment 14011757 arcarsenal said: Quote: In comment 14011747 Beer Man said: Quote: In comment 14011654 arcarsenal said: Quote: If Frazier is the biggest piece we have to part with to get Machado, I would do it (provided he's here long-term, which I imagine he and the Yanks both want) I'm just the opposite. I'm not in favor of giving up years of Clint Frazier being your starting LF, for a 1/2 season rental. I can see Swanson and Adams. Swanson may have reached his pinnacle, and Adams has regressed this year. Where is Frazier playing, though? He's still blocked. Gardy and Hicks are both going to be back next year. Stanton and Judge aren't going anywhere. Gardy is in the last year of his contract (although the team has an option for one more). IMO, after this season it is time to move on.

I'm fairly certain they're going to pick up his option.

In comment 14011802 arcarsenal said:

Quote:

I'm fairly certain they're going to pick up his option.

Not sure why everyone is so certain about picking up Gardner's option. It's essentially a $10 million option...and based on last years Free Agent market I can't see anyone paying a 36 year old Gardner $10 million a year. If the Yanks bring him back I think they declined the option and see if he takes $6 or $7 million to return.

In comment 14011791 arcarsenal said:

Quote:

In comment 14011786 Eman11 said: Quote: In comment 14011767 arcarsenal said: Quote: In comment 14011765 Eman11 said: Quote: In comment 14011757 arcarsenal said: Quote: In comment 14011747 Beer Man said: Quote: In comment 14011654 arcarsenal said: Quote: If Frazier is the biggest piece we have to part with to get Machado, I would do it (provided he's here long-term, which I imagine he and the Yanks both want) I'm just the opposite. I'm not in favor of giving up years of Clint Frazier being your starting LF, for a 1/2 season rental. I can see Swanson and Adams. Swanson may have reached his pinnacle, and Adams has regressed this year. Where is Frazier playing, though? He's still blocked. Gardy and Hicks are both going to be back next year. Stanton and Judge aren't going anywhere. I'm not 100% sure Gardy will be back next year. I can definitely see the Yanks offering him a CC like 1 year deal or maybe even a club option for a 2nd year. Problem is I think Gardy wants to play longer and is looking for 3 year deal or two guaranteed at nice money. I think it could be a very similar situation to what happened with Todd Frazier and the Yanks. They offered areal nice one year deal to come back this year but he wanted more years and while his per year is less, the total deal is higher. Why wouldn't they just pick up the team option? Well they would if they felt he was worth it but I suspect they want to keep getting younger and don't see him being worth it by then. I think they'd love him for one more but not two. I think maybe they would throw the team option of a 2nd year with a buyout in there as a sign of respect and also maybe enough to entice him to stay for one more year. Knowing if he plays well, he stays for year two. I just don't know if Gardy would take something like that. The option year is next year, though. I'm fairly certain they're going to pick it up and then probably let him walk after that.

Ahh well if that's the case I think you're right. They pick it up. I thought he was an UFA after this year and my thoughts were based on that.

Always have. It's not an accident that he's the only guy who's been on the roster continuously since 2009. He's always provided them with plenty of bang for the buck. He also has a skill set they're light on - he battles pitchers like a sonofabitch, runs pitch counts up, is still their best base runner and outfield glove. And he's not showing signs of declining just yet, he's been the same ol' Gardy as usual this season.

I think they'd prefer to take it year to year with him, like they did with Pettitte and are doing now with CC, but I don't think it would be surprising if they picked up his option.

In comment 14011814 Tesla said:

Quote:

In comment 14011802 arcarsenal said: Quote: I'm fairly certain they're going to pick up his option. Not sure why everyone is so certain about picking up Gardner's option. It's essentially a $10 million option...and based on last years Free Agent market I can't see anyone paying a 36 year old Gardner $10 million a year. If the Yanks bring him back I think they declined the option and see if he takes $6 or $7 million to return.

Superb defensive OF with a .350 OBP and some sneaky/streaky power? $11M isn�t crazy. For what he�s been to the org, I doubt they�d dick him around to save $2-3M for a year.

If he took less AAV elsewhere, he�d get more term in exchange for sure.

they'll be able to clear out some money by replacing CC, Gardy and Robertson with cheap in-house alternatives - Sheffield, Frazier, Holder, etc. Bringing back Gardy at a lesser annual salary is a pretty good idea though.

In comment 14011814 Tesla said:

Quote:

In comment 14011802 arcarsenal said: Quote: I'm fairly certain they're going to pick up his option. Not sure why everyone is so certain about picking up Gardner's option. It's essentially a $10 million option...and based on last years Free Agent market I can't see anyone paying a 36 year old Gardner $10 million a year. If the Yanks bring him back I think they declined the option and see if he takes $6 or $7 million to return.

That's also a possibility. But I do think Gardner will be back next year one way or another. He's one of those guys whose value to the team sort of eclipses his production. He's a leader and this is a young team. I think they are going to want him back for one final year and then that'll be that.

In comment 14011820 bigbluehoya said:

Quote:

In comment 14011814 Tesla said: Quote: In comment 14011802 arcarsenal said: Quote: I'm fairly certain they're going to pick up his option. Not sure why everyone is so certain about picking up Gardner's option. It's essentially a $10 million option...and based on last years Free Agent market I can't see anyone paying a 36 year old Gardner $10 million a year. If the Yanks bring him back I think they declined the option and see if he takes $6 or $7 million to return. Superb defensive OF with a .350 OBP and some sneaky/streaky power? $11M isn�t crazy. For what he�s been to the org, I doubt they�d dick him around to save $2-3M for a year. If he took less AAV elsewhere, he�d get more term in exchange for sure.

Who plays center when Hicks inevitably gets injured though? I think Gardner makes sense to bring back but then that means Frazier is still the number 5 OF and most likely trade bait.

with left shoulder inflammation. I'm sure it isn't a big deal but if he was part of the deal the Red Sox had offered you'd have to imagine that Baltimore isn't agreeing to anything until they know he is healthy.

Gardy has lost a step or more, he's getting doubled up and that used to never happen. I think Wade is faster now.

I think you might have misinterpreted what I wrote. I was saying that pickup up the team option seems likely; $11M for 1 year is reasonable for what he brings and the role he plays.

In the event that he�s not back, I�m assuming super-utility Wade would be the backup CF.

In comment 14011839 bigbluehoya said:

Quote:

I think you might have misinterpreted what I wrote. I was saying that pickup up the team option seems likely; $11M for 1 year is reasonable for what he brings and the role he plays. In the event that he�s not back, I�m assuming super-utility Wade would be the backup CF.

Haha. I clicked on the wrong post. my post was in response to bceagle05's 1:03 post.

In comment 14011766 ajr2456 said:

Quote:

Not sure if something of the sort was posted in here: The offer was Drury, Tate, Adams, and Josh Rogers. It's moving closer to done.

If this offer is for real, Cashman should do that 100 times out of 100.

Rogers is a fringe swing guy, who on the right team might be a #5 SP. Tate has upside, but doesn't miss a lot of bats for a guy who throws in the high 90's and has good secondary pitches. Adams is a guy who until this spring looked like a legit ML SP. Not sure what happened- rumors of surgery to remove elbow chips in the off-season, but that should not have caused such a long term impact.

The only question in my mind is that the reports yesterday indicated that the Yanks were asking for Machado AND Britton. Is this offer just for Machado or both?

In comment 14011839 bigbluehoya said:

Quote:

I think you might have misinterpreted what I wrote. I was saying that pickup up the team option seems likely; $11M for 1 year is reasonable for what he brings and the role he plays. In the event that he�s not back, I�m assuming super-utility Wade would be the backup CF.

Might not work if the Yanks trade for Machado and/or sign him AND Hal wants to stay under the luxury tax line. Depends more on Hal than anything else.

In comment 14011848 rich in DC said:

Quote:

In comment 14011766 ajr2456 said: Quote: Not sure if something of the sort was posted in here: The offer was Drury, Tate, Adams, and Josh Rogers. It's moving closer to done. If this offer is for real, Cashman should do that 100 times out of 100. Rogers is a fringe swing guy, who on the right team might be a #5 SP. Tate has upside, but doesn't miss a lot of bats for a guy who throws in the high 90's and has good secondary pitches. Adams is a guy who until this spring looked like a legit ML SP. Not sure what happened- rumors of surgery to remove elbow chips in the off-season, but that should not have caused such a long term impact. The only question in my mind is that the reports yesterday indicated that the Yanks were asking for Machado AND Britton. Is this offer just for Machado or both?

I read that the Phillies were still interested in Britton. They feel the price tag on Machado is too high. It was reported that the Orioles would like to package both players but I don't think it has to be done that way.

In comment 14011848 rich in DC said:

Quote:

In comment 14011766 ajr2456 said: Quote: Not sure if something of the sort was posted in here: The offer was Drury, Tate, Adams, and Josh Rogers. It's moving closer to done. If this offer is for real, Cashman should do that 100 times out of 100. Rogers is a fringe swing guy, who on the right team might be a #5 SP. Tate has upside, but doesn't miss a lot of bats for a guy who throws in the high 90's and has good secondary pitches. Adams is a guy who until this spring looked like a legit ML SP. Not sure what happened- rumors of surgery to remove elbow chips in the off-season, but that should not have caused such a long term impact. The only question in my mind is that the reports yesterday indicated that the Yanks were asking for Machado AND Britton. Is this offer just for Machado or both?

I should have added that this also solves most of their Rule 5 decisions in one fell swoop- all three of Tate, Adams and Rogers would have to be added to the 40 man roster this winter or be exposed to Rule 5.

In comment 14011766 ajr2456 said:

Quote:

Not sure if something of the sort was posted in here: The offer was Drury, Tate, Adams, and Josh Rogers. It's moving closer to done.

Crap at that price I wouldn't even mind if Manny was just a rental lol

Trying...

In comment 14011839 bigbluehoya said:

Quote:

I think you might have misinterpreted what I wrote. I was saying that pickup up the team option seems likely; $11M for 1 year is reasonable for what he brings and the role he plays. In the event that he�s not back, I�m assuming super-utility Wade would be the backup CF.

Just a strange fact that might only interest me. If the Yanks don't trade for any older players and let all of their FA walk this winter, does anyone know who the two oldest remaining players on the roster would be?

Aroldis Chapman (2/28/88) and
Dellin Betances (3/23/88)

But Wade has to start proving that he can get on base with any regularity for that to be worthwhile.


Regarding Britton, I don't give a damn if they got him or not. He's nothing special anymore.

I'm not 100% confident that the Yankees pick up Gardner's option or that it guarantees him a starting position even if they do. The idea that there's nowhere for Frazier to play simply is untrue.

In comment 14011820 bigbluehoya said:

Quote:

In comment 14011814 Tesla said: Quote: In comment 14011802 arcarsenal said: Quote: I'm fairly certain they're going to pick up his option. Not sure why everyone is so certain about picking up Gardner's option. It's essentially a $10 million option...and based on last years Free Agent market I can't see anyone paying a 36 year old Gardner $10 million a year. If the Yanks bring him back I think they declined the option and see if he takes $6 or $7 million to return. Superb defensive OF with a .350 OBP and some sneaky/streaky power? $11M isn�t crazy. For what he�s been to the org, I doubt they�d dick him around to save $2-3M for a year. If he took less AAV elsewhere, he�d get more term in exchange for sure.

and IIRC, he has the best 1st to home and 2nd to home times in baseball. Great on the basepaths.

As of right now, there's nowhere for Frazier to play - so, no, it isn't "simply untrue" and I would bet that there's a better chance Gardner is back than not. Even if he isn't, Hicks will be - so, someone has to be a part-timer. I'm not convinced there's going to be a clear path for Frazier even next year. Obviously nothing is set in s

I'd prefer to keep him but if he helps us get a SP, I'd do it - and if he's the biggest piece in a deal for Machado I'm still pretty sure I'd do it.

I don't think Frazier necessarily is or should be considered untouchable.

Has had some big hits against the Yankees and I understand he's 21. But his numbers on both sides of the ball are pretty awful. He's a negative WAR player (even though I think WAR is a BS stat) and his OPS + is in the low 90's.

Sorry, that should say obviously nothing is set in stone*

make the trade for Manny is that basically saying they will trade Andujar? I have become a huge fan of his and would hate to see him go. I just don�t see where he plays long term though.

RH pitchers in this series. Hopefully after last night Wade starts every game.

In comment 14011871 arcarsenal said:

Quote:

As of right now, there's nowhere for Frazier to play - so, no, it isn't "simply untrue" and I would bet that there's a better chance Gardner is back than not. I don't think Frazier necessarily is or should be considered untouchable.

"As of right now" isn't all an intelligent decision should be based on. He's a 23 year-old prospect, not a loaf of bread that will spoil if it's not eaten by the end of the season or the trading deadline. Are they really going to be handing a starting OF spot in 2019 to a soon to be 35 year-old?

In comment 14011745 robbieballs2003 said:

Quote:

In comment 14011737 adamg said: Quote: And the bats coming alive would keep the trolls away until at least game time... Also, if they could switch Andujar for Frazier in that package. That would be ideal. Why would putting Andujar over Frazier into a deal be ideal? I'm curious. It is no guarantee that even if we get Machado that he resigns with us so Andujar is insurance and can still be flipped for a SP in the future as part of a package. Andujar has proven himself as a rookie in the majors which is more than can be said for Frazier at this point. And where would Frazier play if he is kept? The OF is already crowded.

Ideal was too strong. Obviously this was before the asshat info that it wouldn't take either one to get the deal done, so now I'm going away from this. But my thinking was simply that Andujar reminds me a bit too much of Starlin, so if you're straight swapping him for Machado (obviously assuming Machado is coming here for the long haul), you're improving the fielding on the corner spot and you're adding a top of the order bat. I do that and keep Frazier simply as a guy who might actually play on the team. I don't know if Andujar can be a front of the order bat with how few walks he gets. Although, he has been getting better seeing pitches lately, imo.

Getting Machado displaces Andujar's spot in the larger scheme of things is mostly what I meant. Rather have Frazier who might actually play. How much could Andujar play if he's behind Manny?

But trading him for a rental or a less than elite pitcher makes no sense when he very easily could be a starting OF in 2019.

In comment 14011887 shockeyisthebest8056 said:

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In comment 14011871 arcarsenal said: Quote: As of right now, there's nowhere for Frazier to play - so, no, it isn't "simply untrue" and I would bet that there's a better chance Gardner is back than not. I don't think Frazier necessarily is or should be considered untouchable. "As of right now" isn't all an intelligent decision should be based on. He's a 23 year-old prospect, not a loaf of bread that will spoil if it's not eaten by the end of the season or the trading deadline. Are they really going to be handing a starting OF spot in 2019 to a soon to be 35 year-old?

My point is it's all going to depend on whether or not Gardner is back, and we have no idea as of now whether he will or won't be - but Gardner is here now, and Frazier isn't getting PT. He's getting shuttled back and forth between here and SWB because there's nowhere for him to play. That's reality.

I didn't say he had to play this year or that he'd spoil if he didn't You're making an argument against nothing with comments like that.

I personally think Gardner will be back, but we'll see. If he is, there's still not going to be a clear opening for Frazier. It'll be 5 guys trying to fill 3 spots. If dealing Frazier can help improve the pitching, I wouldn't be against it.

Besides, as someone noted earlier, OFers aren't that difficult to find or acquire.

Machado does not mean that Machado is our starting 3B in 2019. Those are two different events. No decision has to be made on Andujar immediately if we get Machado. What if we get Machado, trade Andujar, and Machado signs somewhere else in the offseason? Who is our 3B then? Odds are if we trade for Machado that we will resign him long term but until he signs a contract that cannot be assumed.

Jon Heyman

2m2 minutes ago

don't know yanks offer for machado. do know it doesn't include Sheffield or Frazier. they have a long list of fine prospects, however. in any case, doesn't appear sides are close yet.

In comment 14011906 robbieballs2003 said:

Quote:

Machado does not mean that Machado is our starting 3B in 2019. Those are two different events. No decision has to be made on Andujar immediately if we get Machado. What if we get Machado, trade Andujar, and Machado signs somewhere else in the offseason? Who is our 3B then? Odds are if we trade for Machado that we will resign him long term but until he signs a contract that cannot be assumed.

I understand what you are saying, but let�s say the Yankees get Manny and sign him. What happens to Andujar at that point?

In comment 14011906 robbieballs2003 said:

Quote:

Machado does not mean that Machado is our starting 3B in 2019. Those are two different events. No decision has to be made on Andujar immediately if we get Machado. What if we get Machado, trade Andujar, and Machado signs somewhere else in the offseason? Who is our 3B then? Odds are if we trade for Machado that we will resign him long term but until he signs a contract that cannot be assumed.

Of course, but I'm assuming if a deal is made for him, there's probably some degree of confidence that he's going to be here long term.

I really don't think Machado will wind up coming here as a rental. Obviously he'll be encouraged to test the waters, but I'm guessing the FO would be confident they could offer him enough to stick around for the long-haul.

In comment 14011914 mattyblue said:

Quote:

In comment 14011906 robbieballs2003 said: Quote: Machado does not mean that Machado is our starting 3B in 2019. Those are two different events. No decision has to be made on Andujar immediately if we get Machado. What if we get Machado, trade Andujar, and Machado signs somewhere else in the offseason? Who is our 3B then? Odds are if we trade for Machado that we will resign him long term but until he signs a contract that cannot be assumed. I understand what you are saying, but let�s say the Yankees get Manny and sign him. What happens to Andujar at that point?

He goes down to AAA and is insurance in case something happens with Didi or Machado in terms of injuries. He is also insurance in case Machado leaves in FA. He is also a trade chip now as well.

Why are so many concerned with what is going to happen with Andujar? It isn't like his life is being sacrificed to please the Gods.

as others have said, Didi will be 30 when he is a FA and might demand a contract more expensive than we are willing to spend. So maybe Didi becomes the trade chip, Machado moves to SS, and Andujar stays at third.

My point is that nothing needs to be decided now.

In comment 14011917 robbieballs2003 said:

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In comment 14011914 mattyblue said: Quote: In comment 14011906 robbieballs2003 said: Quote: Machado does not mean that Machado is our starting 3B in 2019. Those are two different events. No decision has to be made on Andujar immediately if we get Machado. What if we get Machado, trade Andujar, and Machado signs somewhere else in the offseason? Who is our 3B then? Odds are if we trade for Machado that we will resign him long term but until he signs a contract that cannot be assumed. I understand what you are saying, but let�s say the Yankees get Manny and sign him. What happens to Andujar at that point? He goes down to AAA and is insurance in case something happens with Didi or Machado in terms of injuries. He is also insurance in case Machado leaves in FA. He is also a trade chip now as well. Why are so many concerned with what is going to happen with Andujar? It isn't like his life is being sacrificed to please the Gods.

yes i agree. btw andujar would not be sent down, DH at the very least IMO...problem is it could make stanton an everyday OF, but i still expect andujar to be on the 40 man. that is if he isnt traded. my guess is if the yanks make this move for MM, they feel they can a. extend him b. have a deal for a SP that includes andujar. its possible frazier never gets traded and remains on roster. andujar + for a SP and the above package of 4 for MM.

Jon Morosi
‏
Verified account


Trade Deadline #TBT: @Yankees talked about acquiring David Price from the #Tigers and Cole Hamels from the #Phillies, three years ago this month. Two prospects Brian Cashman would not trade: Luis Severino and Aaron Judge. @MLB @MLBNetwork

In comment 14011933 Dave in Hoboken said:

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Jon Morosi ‏ Verified account Trade Deadline #TBT: @Yankees talked about acquiring David Price from the #Tigers and Cole Hamels from the #Phillies, three years ago this month. Two prospects Brian Cashman would not trade: Luis Severino and Aaron Judge. @MLB @MLBNetwork

Damn skippy

In comment 14011933 Dave in Hoboken said:

Quote:

Jon Morosi ‏ Verified account Trade Deadline #TBT: @Yankees talked about acquiring David Price from the #Tigers and Cole Hamels from the #Phillies, three years ago this month. Two prospects Brian Cashman would not trade: Luis Severino and Aaron Judge. @MLB @MLBNetwork

Whatever. Cashman�s useless.

-Essex

In comment 14011926 BleedBlue said:

Quote:

In comment 14011917 robbieballs2003 said: Quote: In comment 14011914 mattyblue said: Quote: In comment 14011906 robbieballs2003 said: Quote: Machado does not mean that Machado is our starting 3B in 2019. Those are two different events. No decision has to be made on Andujar immediately if we get Machado. What if we get Machado, trade Andujar, and Machado signs somewhere else in the offseason? Who is our 3B then? Odds are if we trade for Machado that we will resign him long term but until he signs a contract that cannot be assumed. I understand what you are saying, but let�s say the Yankees get Manny and sign him. What happens to Andujar at that point? He goes down to AAA and is insurance in case something happens with Didi or Machado in terms of injuries. He is also insurance in case Machado leaves in FA. He is also a trade chip now as well. Why are so many concerned with what is going to happen with Andujar? It isn't like his life is being sacrificed to please the Gods. yes i agree. btw andujar would not be sent down, DH at the very least IMO...problem is it could make stanton an everyday OF, but i still expect andujar to be on the 40 man. that is if he isnt traded. my guess is if the yanks make this move for MM, they feel they can a. extend him b. have a deal for a SP that includes andujar. its possible frazier never gets traded and remains on roster. andujar + for a SP and the above package of 4 for MM.

DH? What about Stanton?????


Andujar goes down like Monica did on Bubba.

doesn't mean he is magically cured of whatever malaise afflicted his bat during his brief tenure in the majors, but he is much better than a .157 hitter and he has the ability to impact games with his speed to an extent that nobody else on the 40-man can. And he plays above average defense at a handful of positions.

if that asshat deal got it done. When the entire forum says that's a steal, it's probably too good to be true. Especially when we have quite a few people here who fall in the love with the prospects in general.

In comment 14011942 illmatic said:

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if that asshat deal got it done. When the entire forum says that's a steal, it's probably too good to be true. Especially when we have quite a few people here who fall in the love with the prospects in general.

point is that the Orioles waited too long to deal Manny and the price is going down because the Os want to trade him before they lose him to FA. It may bump up, but they are in dump mode and will be willing to trade for prospects.

but the ask is still high, because MVP-caliber players even as rentals have historically drawn a big return (though Cespedes and JD Martinez were not MVP-caliber players when traded). But Angelos is an obstacle, because he might sooner sit on a good but not great package than take what he can get.

is that Cashman can work in his usual stealth mode with other teams for pitching. Reporters now are focused on the "Manny to the Yankees" scenario as the major story. Now while this could happen,Cashman won't have as much focus on the pitching aspect & this is when he works best. Who knows,the Yankees might have been the ones planting the initial Manny rumors to serve as a deflection!

One thing really interferes with your analysis:

Levine and Trost were in charge for many of those down years. This is a matter of record. Their strategy, signings and intrusions are well documented.

Organizational reporting and a clear reporting line and clear decision rights from Cashman to Hal was first contractually established on October 10th, 2014.

2015, 2016 and 2017 were all on Cashman.

We agree that starting pitching FA have not gone so well for the Yankees with or without Cashman fully operating as a GM. Except for Pettite, Clemens, Hernandez, Tanaka, CC, Mussina and a few other HOF and near HOF pitchers.

Also Cashman gets a ton of credit and rightfully so, but the scouting and particularly player development folks were overhauled over the last few years and the results have been quite good. Eppler, Denbo and a number of the guys now in those positions have been some of the most effective in baseball at what they do.

another way to characterize it may be that they're not necessarily trying to drive the ask for Machado up so much as they're trying to drive the ask for some of the pitchers down by implying that they're not prioritizing pitching in their deadline moves.

was just on the MKS. I only heard half of the interview. He doesn't think the Yanks or red sux are getting him. He thinks that he will go to either Milwaukee, L.A. or Arizona.

barbeach: Keith: Thanks so much for doing these chats. Loved your book. If you�re Cashman, who are you NOT willing to part with to get Machado?
Keith Law: There�s no way I trade Sheffield, who could probably be their fifth starter in the second half, for two months of Machado. I�m not sure I�d trade him for any rental, really.

In comment 14011982 mitch300 said:

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was just on the MKS. I only heard half of the interview. He doesn't think the Yanks or red sux are getting him. He thinks that he will go to either Milwaukee, L.A. or Arizona.

he made it a point to say that it was his gut feeling and nothing more and that he was guessing...he also said yankees are very kuch in it

In comment 14011957 Dunedin81 said:

Quote:

but the ask is still high, because MVP-caliber players even as rentals have historically drawn a big return (though Cespedes and JD Martinez were not MVP-caliber players when traded). But Angelos is an obstacle, because he might sooner sit on a good but not great package than take what he can get.

Can't blame him if he does, but he will get a very good package for Manny. Maybe not "knock his socks off" very good, still very good.

Yep.

Imo, its fair to call out the period post the re-org on its own results and not lump them in with prior practices and preferences for long term contracts, older "stars" and guys who did not quite fit.

I point out that the cascade of tax deferements and Stadium financing payment terms also played a behind the scenes role in the new strategic direction

In comment 14011942 illmatic said:

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if that asshat deal got it done.

Yeah, you could fit an aircraft carrier through the gap between the Orioles wanting Sheffield and the Yankees giving up Drury, Adams, Tate, and Rogers.

In comment 14011994 Milton said:

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In comment 14011942 illmatic said: Quote: if that asshat deal got it done. Yeah, you could fit an aircraft carrier through the gap between the Orioles wanting Sheffield and the Yankees giving up Drury, Adams, Tate, and Rogers.

IDK, Drury is MLB-ready and potentially an above-average regular, and he has team control. Adams's star is on the way down, Tate (to an extent) on the way up, but each has been a top 100 prospect. And Rogers is a back end guy. It's not a terrible package.

In comment 14012000 Dunedin81 said:

Quote:

In comment 14011994 Milton said: Quote: In comment 14011942 illmatic said: Quote: if that asshat deal got it done. Yeah, you could fit an aircraft carrier through the gap between the Orioles wanting Sheffield and the Yankees giving up Drury, Adams, Tate, and Rogers. IDK, Drury is MLB-ready and potentially an above-average regular, and he has team control. Adams's star is on the way down, Tate (to an extent) on the way up, but each has been a top 100 prospect. And Rogers is a back end guy. It's not a terrible package.

Agreed, it's a bit of quantity over quality but not a terrible package. If they spice it up by subbing one of their high end arms in A ball or below (i.e. Medina, Schmidt, Sauer, Garcia) for Rogers it becomes a really solid offer.

In comment 14011937 Hsilwek92 said:

Quote:

In comment 14011933 Dave in Hoboken said: Quote: Jon Morosi � Verified account Trade Deadline #TBT: @Yankees talked about acquiring David Price from the #Tigers and Cole Hamels from the #Phillies, three years ago this month. Two prospects Brian Cashman would not trade: Luis Severino and Aaron Judge. @MLB @MLBNetwork Whatever. Cashman�s useless. -Essex

SO, Cashman is a genius for not trading Severino, who at the time was like on a streak of 7-0 with a 1.91 ERA and about to make his MLB Debut? Or not trading Judge who was one of the most intriguing prospects the scouts had seen. Please. My only point is the deference given to Cashman is insane given his results.

I also am not a guy who thinks it is a "matter of record" that he is just blameless for everything that went on prior to 2015, he was the GM for many years. What the level of interference was during those years nobody knows. And, of course, I have said he has done a good job of building the offense and the pen; what we need is not Machado, what we need is a pitcher who can get us some quality innings and let our BP alone. My biggest fear of this team is turning it over to the BP every night in the 5th or 6th inning and needing the BP to pitch lights out to preserve wins or keep us in games for our offense. That is a large task, one that I think we were fortunate enough to get away with last post-season, but I am unsure that we will get away with this post-season.

Gray is useless, CC is old and can give us quality starts in terms of productivity but we have to manage his innings for him to be effective and to have him be somewhat fresh in October, Tanaka is meh, inconsistent, averages about 5-6 innings a start and over the last two years have given us about a 4.5 era. Sevy is awesome and can give us quality starts with a good workload. That is where we need to focus, we can't hit our way out of that problem.

In comment 14012027 Essex said:

Quote:

In comment 14011937 Hsilwek92 said: Quote: In comment 14011933 Dave in Hoboken said: Quote: Jon Morosi � Verified account Trade Deadline #TBT: @Yankees talked about acquiring David Price from the #Tigers and Cole Hamels from the #Phillies, three years ago this month. Two prospects Brian Cashman would not trade: Luis Severino and Aaron Judge. @MLB @MLBNetwork Whatever. Cashman�s useless. -Essex SO, Cashman is a genius for not trading Severino, who at the time was like on a streak of 7-0 with a 1.91 ERA and about to make his MLB Debut? Or not trading Judge who was one of the most intriguing prospects the scouts had seen. Please. My only point is the deference given to Cashman is insane given his results. I also am not a guy who thinks it is a "matter of record" that he is just blameless for everything that went on prior to 2015, he was the GM for many years. What the level of interference was during those years nobody knows. And, of course, I have said he has done a good job of building the offense and the pen; what we need is not Machado, what we need is a pitcher who can get us some quality innings and let our BP alone. My biggest fear of this team is turning it over to the BP every night in the 5th or 6th inning and needing the BP to pitch lights out to preserve wins or keep us in games for our offense. That is a large task, one that I think we were fortunate enough to get away with last post-season, but I am unsure that we will get away with this post-season. Gray is useless, CC is old and can give us quality starts in terms of productivity but we have to manage his innings for him to be effective and to have him be somewhat fresh in October, Tanaka is meh, inconsistent, averages about 5-6 innings a start and over the last two years have given us about a 4.5 era. Sevy is awesome and can give us quality starts with a good workload. That is where we need to focus, we can't hit our way out of that problem.

Most reasonable fans wouldn't argue that the rotation gets dicey after Severino, but Tanaka definitely earned the benefit of the doubt after putting it to Houston in the ALCS last year. He�s still got the ability to pitch one hell of an individual game, but you have to take that with a pinch of blind faith if he doesn�t pick up his performance after the AS break.

With respect:

The Yankees ( entire fo for we do not know accountability prior to October 2014) have not done well with SP trades or FA. Neither have many at the top end scramble had more overall success with this category. Especially in the post steroids era elongated careers.
The likely answer and the original plan was to develop our own. Instead we got further faster than any fan or I suspect the Yankees did

And Boston using the other method of loading up fa and trades have done well. Temporarily.

So it is desirable to go get 1 to 2 SP sooner than planned ( no one planned grays performance or Montgomery getting injured).

But...that requires someone to trade with them. How is the lack of good SP trades anyone on the Yankees fault?

I tend to agree that absent a good trade I'd rather hold on to our best SP prospects.

Hopefully with this explanation we now violently agree.

Take care.

In comment 14012035 Bill2 said:

Quote:

With respect: The Yankees ( entire fo for we do not know accountability prior to October 2014) have not done well with SP trades or FA. Neither have many at the top end scramble had more overall success with this category. Especially in the post steroids era elongated careers. The likely answer and the original plan was to develop our own. Instead we got further faster than any fan or I suspect the Yankees did And Boston using the other method of loading up fa and trades have done well. Temporarily. So it is desirable to go get 1 to 2 SP sooner than planned ( no one planned grays performance or Montgomery getting injured). But...that requires someone to trade with them. How is the lack of good SP trades anyone on the Yankees fault? I tend to agree that absent a good trade I'd rather hold on to our best SP prospects. Hopefully with this explanation we now violently agree. Take care.

I think our only real area of disagreement is how much faith we have in Cashman. Many on here act like he is a rockstar GM and I just don't think that's the case. We can go back and forth on that point all night with the many moves he has succeeded with and the many that he hasn't, which is a waste of everyone's time. But, I respect your opinion and just will move on with my own about Cashman. At the end of the day, the only thing that matters is hoisting 28 up in the air this October/November.

Here is my concern:

I dont think the past moves make him good bad or indifferent. Had resources. Had mixed results given those resources. We were entertained.

The 96 to 2000 team was not his architecture.

The in between I dont know.

I have given patience to this latest era. I think it needs more. I think last years end point was a surprise and not a design. I dont think the new arms are ready. They most often lag position players in development time.

I hope I see Cashman hold to the strategy if nothing is there. We are almost at a dynasty.

I want to see if when the rubber meets the sky we believe in our way of competitive advantage or we turn into the PT Barnum Steinbrenner years.

So it's not the win loss of any one trade ( that's not always in control of anyone). I dont want to over rotate going for one year and then relying on the luxury tax re set to be foolish again.

Maybe we are saying the same things?

This was when it seem liked Levine & Trost were pushed into the background. Reading the linked article gives you an idea why hugging prospects always ends up with a lot of forgotten names too.

Quote:

Concerned by the lack of big-league help the Yankees have gotten from their farm system this season, Hal Steinbrenner called his lieutenants to a meeting in Tampa Tuesday to discuss the club's prospect development, according to sources. According to a source, the meeting, which included Hal and Hank Steinbrener, GM Brian Cashman and team president Randy Levine, was "a preliminary session and the beginning of a process in which they're evaluating the entire player development department and all that's been going on with their scouting, drafting and developing over the past seasons The Steinbrenners, the sources said, are mostly concerned with the failure of the farm system to deliver much help to the injury-ravaged Yanks this season. They are also worried about the system's ability to provide major-league ready players for the 2014 season, when the Yanks are both trying to get their payroll below $189 million to save on luxury tax and need replacements for departing players and insurance for aging stars.

Hal Steinbrenner calls Yankees high command, including Brian Cashman, to Tampa to discuss Bombers� barren farm - ( New Window )

In comment 14012044 Essex said:

Quote:

In comment 14012035 Bill2 said: Quote: With respect: The Yankees ( entire fo for we do not know accountability prior to October 2014) have not done well with SP trades or FA. Neither have many at the top end scramble had more overall success with this category. Especially in the post steroids era elongated careers. The likely answer and the original plan was to develop our own. Instead we got further faster than any fan or I suspect the Yankees did And Boston using the other method of loading up fa and trades have done well. Temporarily. So it is desirable to go get 1 to 2 SP sooner than planned ( no one planned grays performance or Montgomery getting injured). But...that requires someone to trade with them. How is the lack of good SP trades anyone on the Yankees fault? I tend to agree that absent a good trade I'd rather hold on to our best SP prospects. Hopefully with this explanation we now violently agree. Take care. I think our only real area of disagreement is how much faith we have in Cashman. Many on here act like he is a rockstar GM and I just don't think that's the case. We can go back and forth on that point all night with the many moves he has succeeded with and the many that he hasn't, which is a waste of everyone's time. But, I respect your opinion and just will move on with my own about Cashman. At the end of the day, the only thing that matters is hoisting 28 up in the air this October/November.

People are happy with moves he�s made that have ultimately made the team better. It�s an indisputable fact that he has. Nobody here�s saying he�s a �Rockstar� GM. You just have some sort of animus towards him that�s based on, what exactly? His inability to have the farm generate SP after SP? Guess what? That pretty much sums up EVERY GM in the league.

Also, if you�re going to say things like, �Find a GM who can develop SP.�, at least offer up an alternative. You bring literally nothing to the argument if you�re going to simply toss out a throw away line like that and then move on to continue your disdain fest.

So I ask, who�s the better alternative to Brian Cashman? Do you even have one? I mean you�re literally acting as if the Yankees have been winning in spite of Brian Cashman and, nothing could be further from the truth.

To "develop pitching?" Chien Ming Wang I seem to remember came out of nowhere and was highly productive in his 2/3 years before getting hurt. Ivan Nova....same thing. Neither of those guys were incredibly high on anybody's radar as far as what they wound up doing for us.

If youre referring to the vets like Kevin Brown, Randy Johnson, Jared Wright....I seem to remember those all being George directives.

Then there are giys like Jeff Weaver, Carl Pavano, AJ Burnett, Javy Vasquez and Sonny Gray. Gray, Vasquez were Cy Young candidates only a year or two prior to the Yanks acquiring them.

This whole narrative is even dumber now that I outlined it. Hughes? Injuries. Probably Joba was the only poorly handled pitcher from a plan stabd point.

are insane for not wanting Machado. He would automatically become the best all around hitter on the team. Also, it doesn't matter if it's another RHB if he has reverse splits.

Machado in 2018

.327 BA .403 OBP vs RHP
.277 BA .327 OBP vs LHP

However, Didi is the one who must go.

Didi, Gray, Adams, Florial, Tate, Austin, Wade , that's plenty for a guy who's leaving to come here anyway and more then another team could likely offer. Oriole's can afford to use Didi and Gray as rentals

Machado has explicitly said he wants to be a Yankee so why give anything to Baltimore in a trade when he would just sign here next year as a free agent?

In comment 14012378 dpinzow said:

Quote:

Machado has explicitly said he wants to be a Yankee so why give anything to Baltimore in a trade when he would just sign here next year as a free agent?

I definitely agree. No way I wanna give them a haul of guys let alone an Andujar, guy is basically my son.

In comment 14012380 DennyInDenville said:

Quote:

In comment 14012378 dpinzow said: Quote: Machado has explicitly said he wants to be a Yankee so why give anything to Baltimore in a trade when he would just sign here next year as a free agent? I definitely agree. No way I wanna give them a haul of guys let alone an Andujar, guy is basically my son.

I could see Andujar traded and Machado here next year, but I'd only trade Andujar for an ace

In comment 14012083 chopperhatch said:

Quote:

If youre referring to the vets like Kevin Brown, Randy Johnson, Jared Wright....I seem to remember those all being George directives. Then there are giys like Jeff Weaver, Carl Pavano, AJ Burnett, Javy Vasquez and Sonny Gray. Gray, Vasquez were Cy Young candidates only a year or two prior to the Yanks acquiring them. This whole narrative is even dumber now that I outlined it. Hughes?

My point has been about acquiring pitching and after listing these names, I am the one who is dumb about Cashman acquiring pitching talent? Got ya.

It will be a package of spare parts that have no other real use. The Yankees have no room for some prospects that would be top 20 or even top 10 in other organizations especially one as bad and baron as Baltimore. Adams, McKinney, Rodgers, Tate guys on that level aren't bringing back anything that will impact the MLB roster unless it's a rental. I don't think Frazier, Sheffield guys on that level will be traded for a rental.

If you ever wonder why people give you crap, you might consider this interaction:

Quote:

Let's get Manny DennyInDenville : 7/12/2018 10:03 pm : link : reply However, Didi is the one who must go. [bDidi, Gray, Adams, Florial, Tate, Austin, Wade , that's plenty for a guy who's leaving to come here anyway and more then another team could likely offer.[/b] Oriole's can afford to use Didi and Gray as rentals It makes no sense to trade for Machado dpinzow : 7/12/2018 11:02 pm : link : reply Machado has explicitly said he wants to be a Yankee so why give anything to Baltimore in a trade when he would just sign here next year as a free agent? RE: It makes no sense to trade for Machado DennyInDenville : 7/12/2018 11:03 pm : link : reply In comment 14012378 dpinzow said: Quote: Machado has explicitly said he wants to be a Yankee so why give anything to Baltimore in a trade when he would just sign here next year as a free agent? I definitely agree. No way I wanna give them a haul of guys let alone an Andujar, guy is basically my son.

It's hard to take you seriously when you propose sending 7 guys for a couple months of Machado, then immediately respond opposed to the idea of sending a "haul of guys" when it's suggested that's a bad idea.

It's like you're just jabbering a stream of consciousness - whatever ideas pop into your head in that moment.

I'm not trying to be mean, just trying to help you understand why sometimes people either ignore you or get after you a bit. Maybe it's better to not say anything when you don't really have a conviction about something.

wonder if he's starting to develop a better eye or more patience. He has 5 walks in the last 15 days, after only 10 walks the rest of the season. Is he learning to take a pitch outside the zone? If so, how much can his game improve? One of the things I've really liked about him is his aggressive swing - seems like he's swinging angry.

In comment 14012613 Dan in the Springs said:

Quote:

If you ever wonder why people give you crap, you might consider this interaction: Quote: Let's get Manny DennyInDenville : 7/12/2018 10:03 pm : link : reply However, Didi is the one who must go. [bDidi, Gray, Adams, Florial, Tate, Austin, Wade , that's plenty for a guy who's leaving to come here anyway and more then another team could likely offer.[/b] Oriole's can afford to use Didi and Gray as rentals It makes no sense to trade for Machado dpinzow : 7/12/2018 11:02 pm : link : reply Machado has explicitly said he wants to be a Yankee so why give anything to Baltimore in a trade when he would just sign here next year as a free agent? RE: It makes no sense to trade for Machado DennyInDenville : 7/12/2018 11:03 pm : link : reply In comment 14012378 dpinzow said: Quote: Machado has explicitly said he wants to be a Yankee so why give anything to Baltimore in a trade when he would just sign here next year as a free agent? I definitely agree. No way I wanna give them a haul of guys let alone an Andujar, guy is basically my son. It's hard to take you seriously when you propose sending 7 guys for a couple months of Machado, then immediately respond opposed to the idea of sending a "haul of guys" when it's suggested that's a bad idea. It's like you're just jabbering a stream of consciousness - whatever ideas pop into your head in that moment. I'm not trying to be mean, just trying to help you understand why sometimes people either ignore you or get after you a bit. Maybe it's better to not say anything when you don't really have a conviction about something.

Dupe

night on SNY sports nite Andy Martino or John Harper ( Can't remember which one) mentioned that Baltimore would like to trade him by the allstar break. We shall see.

are the serious contenders at this point.

Torres
Judge
Machado
Stanton
Bird
Sanchez
Didi
Hicks
Gardner

That's insane.

In comment 14012718 adamg said:

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Torres Judge Machado Stanton Bird Sanchez Didi Hicks Gardner That's insane.

Yep. Any one of those guys could carry a team to a win all by himself anytime. Eg Gardy with two HRs last night and three RBI's, Bird with three,four and three RBI's in his last three games.

I think they're dangerous with everyone back healthy and Andujar in there as well but Manny is an upgrade at the plate and 3B no question. Not only would he make getting out of the first inning even tougher on a pitcher, it would make the 2nd inning really tough as well with the bottom three no slouches either. There would be no breathing room for an opposing starter and put a ton of pressure on him practically every pitch.

Even Hicks has been playing like an All Star the last month or two. But Machado really would alter the top of the order in a way few people could.

However, I speak how I speak, and don't care if I sound stupid. It makes Denny Denny.

Now, I do hear what your saying.

Imo, they key to reading my posts (if you choose to) take them with a grain of salt, if you read something you really like, feel free to lmk and engage or give me a +1 to top off my dragon energy.

Happy Weekend Brother, have a great one.

but if you watched the game last night Kluber was working to get to him a few times almost like a pitcher's spot in the NL if everyone is healthy and the Yankees add Manny that will be impossible to pitch to most days. Even without Manny the regular lineup is terrific 1-9.

In comment 14012731 adamg said:

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Even Hicks has been playing like an All Star the last month or two. But Machado really would alter the top of the order in a way few people could.

No question about that and didn't mean to slight Manny's impact in any way. It makes the top of the lineup incredibly hard for a pitcher to get through and that effect would be felt down the rest of the it. Seeing the start of Yankee games would be must see TV.

It was just the first time in a while I saw our complete healthy lineup, and realized again how tough it is. Adding Manny makes its even tougher but if we don't get him, having Miggy in there it's still an imposing lineup. With how they're playing now it's easy to forget they're getting it done without two All Star guys in Torres and Sanchez.

and if they keep going that way he could play in a Triple A rehab game as early as this Sunday.

In comment 14012780 Dave in Hoboken said:

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and if they keep going that way he could play in a Triple A rehab game as early as this Sunday.

Not a big Kay guy but I was home by 3 today and have him on yes, to his credit it's been a really good listen/watch since there's no big Mike on tv

Long week. Goodness.

Glad el Gary is progressing well , Romine has been an admirable substitute all season.