Hope he gets another chance in the league. He does have a good football mind. Maybe not HC material now but I think he has a lot to offer and was humbled by his NYG experience.
Surprisingly honest and self reflective by McAdoo. To wit:
“I learned that my “survive and advance” philosophy of handling the media needs to be overhauled. I grew up in this business seeing media as the enemy. To me, press conferences became the only thing where I was not in it to win it; I just wanted them to be over. I asked one of my friends in the game about it, and he said, “You’re smart. But when you answer questions from the press, you sound like an oaf.”
You really have to wonder how this person got hired Â
to be head coach of the NY Giants. What a colossal failure by the people who interviewed him and thought this person has the skill set for the this position in the city.
After his round of rehab the image PR I have three thoughts. If he hired a PR person to help him with this boy are they bad at his job. If he thinks he sounds like a person who has learned from his mistakes he couldn't be less self aware. I have a better chance of winning Powerball than he does being a head coach in the NFL again.
He's going to need a real good friend with a lot of organizational power to get back in the league period. Even as a positional coach.
RE: You really have to wonder how this person got hired Â
to be head coach of the NY Giants. What a colossal failure by the people who interviewed him and thought this person has the skill set for the this position in the city.
After his round of rehab the image PR I have three thoughts. If he hired a PR person to help him with this boy are they bad at his job. If he thinks he sounds like a person who has learned from his mistakes he couldn't be less self aware. I have a better chance of winning Powerball than he does being a head coach in the NFL again.
He's going to need a real good friend with a lot of organizational power to get back in the league period. Even as a positional coach.
Hiring him as the OC was the mistake, WCO + Eli = WTF? Would love to know the decision process behind this.
Funny thing, if McApoo wasn't our OC, we probably would not have drafted obj.
RE: RE: You really have to wonder how this person got hired Â
to be head coach of the NY Giants. What a colossal failure by the people who interviewed him and thought this person has the skill set for the this position in the city.
After his round of rehab the image PR I have three thoughts. If he hired a PR person to help him with this boy are they bad at his job. If he thinks he sounds like a person who has learned from his mistakes he couldn't be less self aware. I have a better chance of winning Powerball than he does being a head coach in the NFL again.
He's going to need a real good friend with a lot of organizational power to get back in the league period. Even as a positional coach.
Hiring him as the OC was the mistake, WCO + Eli = WTF? Would love to know the decision process behind this.
Funny thing, if McApoo wasn't our OC, we probably would not have drafted obj.
He was fine as an OC, and terrible at being a Head Coach. When he was just the OC, we did pretty well offensively.
to be head coach of the NY Giants. What a colossal failure by the people who interviewed him and thought this person has the skill set for the this position in the city.
That to me is the biggest failure in all of this.
Did he just bullshit his way through the hiring interview? If he did, I have to give him credit for being able to put himself over like that.
Did the employer (Giants in this case) know he was this flawed and still hired him anyway? This on its own, is incredibly egregious and shows to you how some hiring "searches" with people can be looked as a sham.
I just think he has an extreme lack of self-awareness Â
He's compiled 209 pages of other people telling him what was wrong with him and the answers to many of the questions still deflect accountability. I wonder if that's the source of many of his problems coaching because that can make you resistant to empathizing with others or being receptive to others' pov...you can see it in some of the areas in the interview like the need to better relate to players, media etc.
was that any new awareness did not come from introspection so much as all these people telling him about his flaws. At least he had the sense to ask them, but it does seem like every criticism he has on himself and every area where he sees the need to improve results from what someone else has told him he he needs to improve.
He's compiled 209 pages of other people telling him what was wrong with him and the answers to many of the questions still deflect accountability. I wonder if that's the source of many of his problems coaching because that can make you resistant to empathizing with others or being receptive to others' pov...you can see it in some of the areas in the interview like the need to better relate to players, media etc.
I agree with this. It is definitely a lack of self-awareness. In all these interviews and articles that have come out the past few days from good ole Ben, he never really says that he was at fault.
Take a look at Shurmur for example. Leading to being named as HC, he reflected on his time with the Browns and some of the mistakes he made. He was humbled that when given his next opportunity as HC, it would be different this time around. Maybe Ben will see this a few years down the road, but I would be extremely shocked if he is ever a HC in pro football again. He would probably be better suited going the college route.
this is probably said in jest, but this wasn't the issue:
Quote:
opu never can completely tell from
Beezer : 11:50 am : link : reply
something like this, but ... apparently the oversized suit at his intro presser was serious foreshadowing.
The issue was having a good season and going from looking like Joe Dirt to Gordon Gecko.
If he stayed in the oversized suit and sported the porn stache, who knows, but he might not turned into a cliche-ridden jackass who couldn't read a room or his players
But don’t feel sorry for me. I’m blessed. I’m the son of a coal miner from southwestern Pennsylvania, and growing up, I thought I’d probably be a coal miner too. But I ascended in the football business to be the head coach of the New York Football Giants! I’m one of the most fortunate people in the world.
something like this, but ... apparently the oversized suit at his intro presser was serious foreshadowing.
It really was. As much as some downplayed it, you get hired for one of the most prominent jobs in the media capital of the world, and that’s the best you come up with for your first public appearance?
But don’t feel sorry for me. I’m blessed. I’m the son of a coal miner from southwestern Pennsylvania, and growing up, I thought I’d probably be a coal miner too. But I ascended in the football business to be the head coach of the New York Football Giants! I’m one of the most fortunate people in the world.
Nice to see somebody not playing the victim.
yup, he actually demonstrated some awareness of his weaknesses in that article (player management, media relations) and owned the decision with the QBs - didn't blame Mara or Reese.
something like this, but ... apparently the oversized suit at his intro presser was serious foreshadowing.
He was clearly a misfit for our HC position. Heh life with its ironic narrative devices. Or maybe McAdoo was subconsciously signifying he was a misfit for the job.
he's clearly a smart guy. He will figure it out, maybe go the college route to get back to the NFL. What is clear is he was a BAD fit as NYG HC. That's on ownership for not figuring this out. Early returns look like they got it right this time.
he's clearly a smart guy. He will figure it out, maybe go the college route to get back to the NFL. What is clear is he was a BAD fit as NYG HC. That's on ownership for not figuring this out. Early returns look like they got it right this time.
It's unfortunate it happened to the Giants and set us back some (hopefully only 1 season) but we seem to have righted the ship; at least with the DG hire.
RE: You really have to wonder how this person got hired Â
and I think it's a good one - that his QB benching explanation is a little self serving -- that here was plenty of film on Geno to see what you had and none on Davis Webb
That the only possible reason to play Geno was to save his job and not to help the team's future out --
MacAdoo is still blowing arrogant smoke up our asses -- and can not accept/admit that he selfishly broke Eli's string to try to save his own ass
and I think it's a good one - that his QB benching explanation is a little self serving -- that here was plenty of film on Geno to see what you had and none on Davis Webb
That the only possible reason to play Geno was to save his job and not to help the team's future out --
MacAdoo is still blowing arrogant smoke up our asses -- and can not accept/admit that he selfishly broke Eli's string to try to save his own ass
there was plenty of film on Geno to see what you had and none on Davis Webb
That the only possible reason to play Geno was to save his job and not to help the team's future out
And also, Geno was a free agent after the 2017 season. So even if Geno did play well and jumpstart the Giants to victories, it was going to be no use to the Giants going forward, because Geno would have used it to sign elsewhere, where he could compete for a starting job.
It was nothing short of completely, absolutely ludicrous to start Geno Smith at that point and place in time under the guise of "seeing what we had in Geno."
and I think it's a good one - that his QB benching explanation is a little self serving -- that here was plenty of film on Geno to see what you had and none on Davis Webb
That the only possible reason to play Geno was to save his job and not to help the team's future out --
MacAdoo is still blowing arrogant smoke up our asses -- and can not accept/admit that he selfishly broke Eli's string to try to save his own ass
That is what really pisses me off about all of it.
I knew someone who interviewed for a position he had no Â
experience doing and was able to get the job. It was in the IT field and crammed the first month reading everything he needed to know to keep it and stayed on for over 10 years. Sometimes you just nail the interview. Sometimes the people interviewing for the position know less then they should when hiring someone.I no this shouldn't be the case for a head coach of a big city pro football team. Maybe Reese saw the improvement in the offense the 2 years he was OC and took a chance on him for HC. The offense went from 28 ranked to 13 in 2014 then to 6 ranked in 2015.
RE: RE: You really have to wonder how this person got hired Â
to be head coach of the NY Giants. What a colossal failure by the people who interviewed him and thought this person has the skill set for the this position in the city.
After his round of rehab the image PR I have three thoughts. If he hired a PR person to help him with this boy are they bad at his job. If he thinks he sounds like a person who has learned from his mistakes he couldn't be less self aware. I have a better chance of winning Powerball than he does being a head coach in the NFL again.
He's going to need a real good friend with a lot of organizational power to get back in the league period. Even as a positional coach.
Hiring him as the OC was the mistake, WCO + Eli = WTF? Would love to know the decision process behind this.
Funny thing, if McApoo wasn't our OC, we probably would not have drafted obj.
Jerry Reese
Quote:
“I’m kind of surprised to hear him say that,” Gilbride said when asked about general manager Jerry Reese saying it was time for a change. “No one had figured that offense out for 24 years. To think that they figured it out this year would be pretty ludicrous. I think it was pretty obvious what the problems were. We had a confluence of injuries, we were very weak on the offensive line. We had some guys who struggled. We started six different offensive tailbacks, three different fullbacks, three different right guards, four different centers … You’re not going to have anything (with that). You can say it’s the offense, but it’s pretty clear what the problem was.”
he's clearly a smart guy. He will figure it out, maybe go the college route to get back to the NFL. What is clear is he was a BAD fit as NYG HC. That's on ownership for not figuring this out. Early returns look like they got it right this time.
Huh? I didn't come away from thinking, 'McAdoo might be a horrible coach, but he's a smart guy.'
I lived through the guy who can’t be named, and he was terrible but I absolutely believe McAdoo was every bit as bad. At least the guy who shall not be named had the decency to slither away and keep his name out of the press. But not Benny in the big suit. He has to prattle on about how he let down Odell and his 209 page book about himself.
McAdoo took something away from the Giants organization and the fans with the way he fucked up Eli’s streak. I’m a middle aged man and I don’t have many - if any - illusions left. But I had the illusion of the Giants being something special. That’s gone and yes, ultimately it is Mara who deserves the blame for letting that shit show happen. But McAdoos shitty little hands were holding the knife and many of those in the know reported that McAdoo was for a long time killing Eli behind his back. So fuck Ben McAdoo. I don’t give a rats ass if he ever works again. He’s an idiot and liar and filthy piece of shit in my book. Like some of the others here,I don’t know how suck an enormous fool and such an obvious idiot got such an extraordinary job. If this ass clown ever does get hired in the NFL I pray it’s with the Dallas Cowboys. Fuck him.
RE: This fucking jackwad needs to go away for good Â
I lived through the guy who can’t be named, and he was terrible but I absolutely believe McAdoo was every bit as bad. At least the guy who shall not be named had the decency to slither away and keep his name out of the press. But not Benny in the big suit. He has to prattle on about how he let down Odell and his 209 page book about himself.
McAdoo took something away from the Giants organization and the fans with the way he fucked up Eli’s streak. I’m a middle aged man and I don’t have many - if any - illusions left. But I had the illusion of the Giants being something special. That’s gone and yes, ultimately it is Mara who deserves the blame for letting that shit show happen. But McAdoos shitty little hands were holding the knife and many of those in the know reported that McAdoo was for a long time killing Eli behind his back. So fuck Ben McAdoo. I don’t give a rats ass if he ever works again. He’s an idiot and liar and filthy piece of shit in my book. Like some of the others here,I don’t know how suck an enormous fool and such an obvious idiot got such an extraordinary job. If this ass clown ever does get hired in the NFL I pray it’s with the Dallas Cowboys. Fuck him.
you still thought the giants were special after the way they treated phil simms at the end of the 93 season?
RE: RE: This fucking jackwad needs to go away for good Â
McAdoo took something away from the Giants organization and the fans with the way he fucked up Eli’s streak.
He really didn't. I really have a hard time buying that most or even many honestly care about that. He's in a two-way tie for 9th place all time on consecutive games. The streak was merely a trivia nugget and a way to complement the guy. It's not like he was going to challenge for the record.
RE: RE: RE: You really have to wonder how this person got hired Â
“I’m kind of surprised to hear him say that,” Gilbride said when asked about general manager Jerry Reese saying it was time for a change. “No one had figured that offense out for 24 years. To think that they figured it out this year would be pretty ludicrous. I think it was pretty obvious what the problems were. We had a confluence of injuries, we were very weak on the offensive line. We had some guys who struggled. We started six different offensive tailbacks, three different fullbacks, three different right guards, four different centers … You’re not going to have anything (with that). You can say it’s the offense, but it’s pretty clear what the problem was.”
link - ( New Window ) [/quote]
Makes me sick to see them throw SB winning coaches Gilbride, Fewell and Coughlin under the bus, instead of helping them improve their careers.
For all those years did they think they had a great roster held back by bad coaching? F that.
You used to think the Giants were a classy organization until they took away Eli s streak, wow!
Are you forgetting some of the bad football that streak entailed; it s about winning, not consecutive games played.
I m a pretty big Giants fan, but I never gave one hootabout that streak. Also as much of a fan of Eli I have always been and still am, I find it incredible and annoying how much differently he is treated by some fans than any of the other great Giants that have played.
Benching to get a look at another quarterback was the best move for this team. Their mistake was not going forward with the plan and play Geno and Webb the rest of the way.
It was the way Eli was treated. And I wasn’t just me, I’ve never seen such outcry and universal condemnation surrounding the benching of a player. Yeah, it was a dark day in Giants history and yes, I blame McAdoo, Reese and Mara Tisch. Anyway.
I find it incredible and annoying how much differently he is treated by some fans than any of the other great Giants that have played.
The key word in there is "great", and I have a complete opposite take. I can't believe how differently he is treated NEGATIVELY vs. other great Giants.
When was the last time you had a group of posters continually questioning a great Giant? when is the last time you had people denigrating accomplishments of great Giants?
Do people come on here and say Strahan was overrated, now or when he was playing? Do people rip on LT? Do people talk about how inconsistent Hampton or Tiki was?
From what I've seen on BBI, Eli is one of the only players period who has routine discussions about his play. Heck, even in the aftermath of the SB wins, you had people saying we were lucky. That Asante Samuel had a sure INT slip through his hands. That Mark Sanchez was as much of a leader as Eli.
Ridiculous crap like that has existed for years.
RE: RE: RE: RE: You really have to wonder how this person got hired Â
Hope he gets another chance in the league. He does have a good football mind. Maybe not HC material now but I think he has a lot to offer and was humbled by his NYG experience.
“I learned that my “survive and advance” philosophy of handling the media needs to be overhauled. I grew up in this business seeing media as the enemy. To me, press conferences became the only thing where I was not in it to win it; I just wanted them to be over. I asked one of my friends in the game about it, and he said, “You’re smart. But when you answer questions from the press, you sound like an oaf.”
After his round of rehab the image PR I have three thoughts. If he hired a PR person to help him with this boy are they bad at his job. If he thinks he sounds like a person who has learned from his mistakes he couldn't be less self aware. I have a better chance of winning Powerball than he does being a head coach in the NFL again.
He's going to need a real good friend with a lot of organizational power to get back in the league period. Even as a positional coach.
After his round of rehab the image PR I have three thoughts. If he hired a PR person to help him with this boy are they bad at his job. If he thinks he sounds like a person who has learned from his mistakes he couldn't be less self aware. I have a better chance of winning Powerball than he does being a head coach in the NFL again.
He's going to need a real good friend with a lot of organizational power to get back in the league period. Even as a positional coach.
Hiring him as the OC was the mistake, WCO + Eli = WTF? Would love to know the decision process behind this.
Funny thing, if McApoo wasn't our OC, we probably would not have drafted obj.
Quote:
to be head coach of the NY Giants. What a colossal failure by the people who interviewed him and thought this person has the skill set for the this position in the city.
After his round of rehab the image PR I have three thoughts. If he hired a PR person to help him with this boy are they bad at his job. If he thinks he sounds like a person who has learned from his mistakes he couldn't be less self aware. I have a better chance of winning Powerball than he does being a head coach in the NFL again.
He's going to need a real good friend with a lot of organizational power to get back in the league period. Even as a positional coach.
Hiring him as the OC was the mistake, WCO + Eli = WTF? Would love to know the decision process behind this.
Funny thing, if McApoo wasn't our OC, we probably would not have drafted obj.
He was fine as an OC, and terrible at being a Head Coach. When he was just the OC, we did pretty well offensively.
When Mac rolled out his own system, that's where the issues were really glaring.
That to me is the biggest failure in all of this.
Did he just bullshit his way through the hiring interview? If he did, I have to give him credit for being able to put himself over like that.
Did the employer (Giants in this case) know he was this flawed and still hired him anyway? This on its own, is incredibly egregious and shows to you how some hiring "searches" with people can be looked as a sham.
I agree with this. It is definitely a lack of self-awareness. In all these interviews and articles that have come out the past few days from good ole Ben, he never really says that he was at fault.
Take a look at Shurmur for example. Leading to being named as HC, he reflected on his time with the Browns and some of the mistakes he made. He was humbled that when given his next opportunity as HC, it would be different this time around. Maybe Ben will see this a few years down the road, but I would be extremely shocked if he is ever a HC in pro football again. He would probably be better suited going the college route.
Beezer : 11:50 am : link : reply
something like this, but ... apparently the oversized suit at his intro presser was serious foreshadowing.
The issue was having a good season and going from looking like Joe Dirt to Gordon Gecko.
If he stayed in the oversized suit and sported the porn stache, who knows, but he might not turned into a cliche-ridden jackass who couldn't read a room or his players
But don’t feel sorry for me. I’m blessed. I’m the son of a coal miner from southwestern Pennsylvania, and growing up, I thought I’d probably be a coal miner too. But I ascended in the football business to be the head coach of the New York Football Giants! I’m one of the most fortunate people in the world.
Nice to see somebody not playing the victim.
It really was. As much as some downplayed it, you get hired for one of the most prominent jobs in the media capital of the world, and that’s the best you come up with for your first public appearance?
That fucking suit.
But don’t feel sorry for me. I’m blessed. I’m the son of a coal miner from southwestern Pennsylvania, and growing up, I thought I’d probably be a coal miner too. But I ascended in the football business to be the head coach of the New York Football Giants! I’m one of the most fortunate people in the world.
Nice to see somebody not playing the victim.
He was clearly a misfit for our HC position. Heh life with its ironic narrative devices. Or maybe McAdoo was subconsciously signifying he was a misfit for the job.
Why is he clearly a smart guy?
He's going to need a real good friend with a lot of organizational power to get back in the league period. Even as a positional coach.
Oh stop it. This is beyond dramatic. He'll be somewhere next year.
That the only possible reason to play Geno was to save his job and not to help the team's future out --
MacAdoo is still blowing arrogant smoke up our asses -- and can not accept/admit that he selfishly broke Eli's string to try to save his own ass
Agree completely, another name that must not be mentioned. Conceded, arrogant, stubborn, and completely over his head in the HC position.
That the only possible reason to play Geno was to save his job and not to help the team's future out --
MacAdoo is still blowing arrogant smoke up our asses -- and can not accept/admit that he selfishly broke Eli's string to try to save his own ass
where did you see King's take?
Come on dude....collum wwas BAD.
That the only possible reason to play Geno was to save his job and not to help the team's future out
And also, Geno was a free agent after the 2017 season. So even if Geno did play well and jumpstart the Giants to victories, it was going to be no use to the Giants going forward, because Geno would have used it to sign elsewhere, where he could compete for a starting job.
It was nothing short of completely, absolutely ludicrous to start Geno Smith at that point and place in time under the guise of "seeing what we had in Geno."
That the only possible reason to play Geno was to save his job and not to help the team's future out --
MacAdoo is still blowing arrogant smoke up our asses -- and can not accept/admit that he selfishly broke Eli's string to try to save his own ass
That is what really pisses me off about all of it.
Quote:
to be head coach of the NY Giants. What a colossal failure by the people who interviewed him and thought this person has the skill set for the this position in the city.
After his round of rehab the image PR I have three thoughts. If he hired a PR person to help him with this boy are they bad at his job. If he thinks he sounds like a person who has learned from his mistakes he couldn't be less self aware. I have a better chance of winning Powerball than he does being a head coach in the NFL again.
He's going to need a real good friend with a lot of organizational power to get back in the league period. Even as a positional coach.
Hiring him as the OC was the mistake, WCO + Eli = WTF? Would love to know the decision process behind this.
Funny thing, if McApoo wasn't our OC, we probably would not have drafted obj.
Jerry Reese
link - ( New Window )
Huh? I didn't come away from thinking, 'McAdoo might be a horrible coach, but he's a smart guy.'
McAdoo took something away from the Giants organization and the fans with the way he fucked up Eli’s streak. I’m a middle aged man and I don’t have many - if any - illusions left. But I had the illusion of the Giants being something special. That’s gone and yes, ultimately it is Mara who deserves the blame for letting that shit show happen. But McAdoos shitty little hands were holding the knife and many of those in the know reported that McAdoo was for a long time killing Eli behind his back. So fuck Ben McAdoo. I don’t give a rats ass if he ever works again. He’s an idiot and liar and filthy piece of shit in my book. Like some of the others here,I don’t know how suck an enormous fool and such an obvious idiot got such an extraordinary job. If this ass clown ever does get hired in the NFL I pray it’s with the Dallas Cowboys. Fuck him.
McAdoo took something away from the Giants organization and the fans with the way he fucked up Eli’s streak. I’m a middle aged man and I don’t have many - if any - illusions left. But I had the illusion of the Giants being something special. That’s gone and yes, ultimately it is Mara who deserves the blame for letting that shit show happen. But McAdoos shitty little hands were holding the knife and many of those in the know reported that McAdoo was for a long time killing Eli behind his back. So fuck Ben McAdoo. I don’t give a rats ass if he ever works again. He’s an idiot and liar and filthy piece of shit in my book. Like some of the others here,I don’t know how suck an enormous fool and such an obvious idiot got such an extraordinary job. If this ass clown ever does get hired in the NFL I pray it’s with the Dallas Cowboys. Fuck him.
you still thought the giants were special after the way they treated phil simms at the end of the 93 season?
Well, yeah, I guess that was my first clue.
McAdoo took something away from the Giants organization and the fans with the way he fucked up Eli’s streak.
He really didn't. I really have a hard time buying that most or even many honestly care about that. He's in a two-way tie for 9th place all time on consecutive games. The streak was merely a trivia nugget and a way to complement the guy. It's not like he was going to challenge for the record.
Quote:
“I’m kind of surprised to hear him say that,” Gilbride said when asked about general manager Jerry Reese saying it was time for a change. “No one had figured that offense out for 24 years. To think that they figured it out this year would be pretty ludicrous. I think it was pretty obvious what the problems were. We had a confluence of injuries, we were very weak on the offensive line. We had some guys who struggled. We started six different offensive tailbacks, three different fullbacks, three different right guards, four different centers … You’re not going to have anything (with that). You can say it’s the offense, but it’s pretty clear what the problem was.”
link - ( New Window ) [/quote]
Makes me sick to see them throw SB winning coaches Gilbride, Fewell and Coughlin under the bus, instead of helping them improve their careers.
For all those years did they think they had a great roster held back by bad coaching? F that.
Are you forgetting some of the bad football that streak entailed; it s about winning, not consecutive games played.
I m a pretty big Giants fan, but I never gave one hootabout that streak. Also as much of a fan of Eli I have always been and still am, I find it incredible and annoying how much differently he is treated by some fans than any of the other great Giants that have played.
Benching to get a look at another quarterback was the best move for this team. Their mistake was not going forward with the plan and play Geno and Webb the rest of the way.
The key word in there is "great", and I have a complete opposite take. I can't believe how differently he is treated NEGATIVELY vs. other great Giants.
When was the last time you had a group of posters continually questioning a great Giant? when is the last time you had people denigrating accomplishments of great Giants?
Do people come on here and say Strahan was overrated, now or when he was playing? Do people rip on LT? Do people talk about how inconsistent Hampton or Tiki was?
From what I've seen on BBI, Eli is one of the only players period who has routine discussions about his play. Heck, even in the aftermath of the SB wins, you had people saying we were lucky. That Asante Samuel had a sure INT slip through his hands. That Mark Sanchez was as much of a leader as Eli.
Ridiculous crap like that has existed for years.
For all those years did they think they had a great roster held back by bad coaching? F that.
if gilbride, coughlin and fewell are so great, why were none of them offered coordinator or head coaching jobs after they were fired by the giants?
Consider the NFL, and how often failed head coaches can float around the league from job to job to job, consistently getting rehired.
Then consider that Kevin Gilbride couldn't buy a sniff at a head coaching job other than always being considered by the Raiders cesspool.