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NFT: Mets Minors 7/19/2018- Another stinker

DanMetroMan : 7/19/2018 7:35 am
AAA Flexen
AA Knapp
A+ Taylor
Columbia TBD
BK Smith
Kingsport Peden
GCL TBD
DSL1 TBD
DSL2 TBD

AAA
Kaczmarski 3-5, 2 2b, K
McNeil 1-4, 2b, BB, K
Alonso 0-5, 2 k's (Really poor showing at the AAA level so far)
Crismatt 2.2 innings 7 hits 6 runs 2 walks 1 k
Bautista 2 innings 1 hit 1 run 1 walk 2 k's

AA
Mazeika 0-3, BB (awful season)
Tebow 1-4 2b, 3 k's
Blackham 1 inning 1 hit 0 runs 0 walks 3 k's (last 10 appearances 1 ER allowed)

A+
Vasquez 0-5, K (.483 OPS at A+)
Carpio 1-5, 2b, 2 k's
Sanchez 2-4
Peterson 3 innings 6 hits 5 runs 0 walks 3 k's (He's been truly awful at A+ 30.1 innings 41 hits 13 walks 17 k's 6.82 era)


BK
JMM 2-4, 2 HR, BB
Adolph 1-5, K
Chambers 0-4, 2 k's
Meyer 2-3, 2b, K
Cortes 0-2, 2 BB, 2 k's (0 extra base hits over 11 games, OPS down to .473)
Dirocie 2-4, BB, K
James 6 innings 3 hits 2 runs 2 walks 5 k's
Hill 2 innings 1 hit 1 run 1 walk 4 k's

Kingsport
Granadillo 2-5, 2 k's
Vientos 2-4, HR, K
Newton 1-3, BB, K (left the game with a foot injury)
Kelenic 0-4, BB, K (Average down to .207, BABIP only .200, he will be fine)
Santana 1-4, 2b
Garay 2-5, HR, 2 k's
Hernandez 0-3, BB, 3 k's (he's awful)
Butto 5 innings 8 hits 3 runs 3 walks 5 k's

GCL
Cespedes 1-4, HR, K (rehab, played 1b)
Mauricio 1-4, 2b, K
Consuegra 2-4, 2b

DSL
Loyo 1-3, 2b
Hernandez 0-4, 2 k's (he's been disappointing so far)
Trade the big league talent (ie Degrom, Syndergaard; Familia)  
superspynyg : 7/19/2018 8:03 am : link
And restock your farm. Mets can be back in a few years.

/  
DanMetroMan : 7/19/2018 9:04 am : link
Law has Kelenic 46 in his top 50, Gimenez and Alonso didn't make it and not particularly close as they weren't HM either, Dunn surprisingly was.
Problem is  
spike : 7/19/2018 9:05 am : link
They stink at developing positional talent
Kelenic  
Csonka : 7/19/2018 9:12 am : link
Is there a big difference going from the GCL to the APP?
RE: Kelenic  
DanMetroMan : 7/19/2018 9:13 am : link
In comment 14016020 Csonka said:
Quote:
Is there a big difference going from the GCL to the APP?


No. And he's not particularly young for the level. He's being BABIP'ed to death right now. Zero percent concerned.
.  
DanMetroMan : 7/19/2018 9:17 am : link
TJ Rivera... exhibit 59595959595959595 that people should hold their horses projecting players will return from TJ in X amount of time #Mets
RE: /  
Metnut : 7/19/2018 9:20 am : link
In comment 14016011 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
Law has Kelenic 46 in his top 50, Gimenez and Alonso didn't make it and not particularly close as they weren't HM either, Dunn surprisingly was.


Watch apologists for the front office say that we now have 4 top 100 prospects including a top 50 prospect.

In all seriousness, glad to see that he likes Kelenic so much. He's never been a fan of Alonso and Alonso's AAA performance is a little bit concerning. I guess we'll have to leave him there and see if he can turn it around. I still hope Alonso gets hot and we see him in Queens this year. Would be a waste of a lost season not to give him a look.

McNeil keeps getting on base and hitting. Seeing him up in Queens is one of the things I'm most looking forward to in the second half.
BP Mets organizational review  
DanMetroMan : 7/19/2018 9:30 am : link

STAFF PREF LISTS
Alex Rosen

Andres Gimenez, SS
Peter Alonso, 1B
Jarred Kelenic, OF
Mark Vientos, 3B
David Peterson, LHP
Thomas Szapucki, LHP
Jeff McNeil, 2B
Justin Dunn, RHP
Shervyen Newton, SS
Ronny Mauricio, SS
Jarrett Seidler

Andres Gimenez, SS
Peter Alonso, 1B
Jarred Kelenic, OF
Mark Vientos, 3B
David Peterson, LHP
Jeff McNeil, 2B/other
Thomas Szapucki, LHP
Justin Dunn, RHP
Ronny Mauricio, SS or somewhere else
Jeffrey Paternostro

Andres Gimenez, SS
Peter Alonso, 1B
Jarred Kelenic, OF
Mark Vientos, 3B
David Peterson, LHP
Justin Dunn, RHP
Ronny Mauricio, SS
Shervyen Newton, SS
Thomas Szapucki, LHP
Jeff McNeil, only a 2B apparently
Tyler Oringer

Andres Gimenez, SS
Peter Alonso, 1B/DH
Jarred Kelenic, OF
David Peterson, LHP
Justin Dunn, RHP
Mark Vientos, 3B
Jeff McNeil, 2B/IF?
Thomas Szapucki, LHP
Ronny Mauricio, SS
Shervyen Newton, SS
Link - ( New Window )
I wouldnt worry about Alonso  
Shecky : 7/19/2018 9:52 am : link
Just pressing, trying to make it to the big show before hes ready. In a normal organization, Id say its a good struggle to learn from, but...
If they are serious about Ces at 1B  
Rob in Rockaway : 7/19/2018 9:57 am : link
I don't know what the hell they will do about Alonso or Smith for that matter.
Didn't McNeil  
pjcas18 : 7/19/2018 9:57 am : link
play LF last night?

So in the 5 or so days since Micky's "famous" "he's just a 2B" comment, he's played 3B and LF.

It seriously seems like Callaway pissed someone off and they have a vendetta against him and are out to make him look foolish.

Or this is just Mets 101. Not sure which is worse.
RE: If they are serious about Ces at 1B  
Metnut : 7/19/2018 10:08 am : link
In comment 14016042 Rob in Rockaway said:
Quote:
I don't know what the hell they will do about Alonso or Smith for that matter.


I've done a 180 on the DH in the NL the past few years. Bring on the DH! Do it ASAP
..  
Named Later : 7/19/2018 10:09 am : link
Re : Law's top 50
I see where the Braves have placed FIVE players on the list, including 2 pitchers in the top 20.

I haven't checked the Phillies on the Top 50, but their Low A Lakewood team is tearing up the Sally League.

This is who we're competing against in the near future.
Dodgers  
DanMetroMan : 7/19/2018 10:14 am : link
really made a great trade. Dodgers did exceedingly well here. They have Kemp, Bellinger, Puig, Pederson, Taylor who can all play the OF and Vertugo is close they also have Peters/Kendall who would both rank in the Mets top 5 OF prospects pretty easily (not that that's saying much). Giving up Diaz doesn't hurt them much at all.

It would be akin to a contending Mets team dealing 1 of Gimenez, Alonso, or Kelenic plus "extra" guys for an MVP caliber talent, rental or not.
Kind of like the Mets  
pjcas18 : 7/19/2018 10:40 am : link
getting Cespedes for Fulmer.

I doubt Machado has the same impact for the Dodgers that Cespedes had for the Mets, but that of course is hind sight.
Changes in the compensation rule have really affected "rental" trades  
Vanzetti : 7/19/2018 11:37 am : link
In the past, if the Dodgers offered Machado arbitration and he signed somewhere else, they would have gotten a "sandwich" first rounder and the first round pick of the team who signed him or their second rounder if the new team was bottom 15 (unlikely).

So, if teams know they can get back two first rounders, they are going to be willing to offer a lot more for a "rental." Mets would never get Wheeler for Beltran. Nor would they get TDA, Thor and Beccera for a one-rental on Dickey.

That's why it makes very little sense to trade Degrom, Thor, or Flores. Imagine you trade Degrom and you get back TDA and Beccera. That would just be giving the guy away and getting a package of TDA and Beccera would actually be a "good" return for Degrom.

The thing I don't get is why did the small market teams ever agree to the change in compensation? The rule change so benefits big money teams like the Yankees and Dodgers.
More info on Christian James start at BKN  
tony stg : 7/19/2018 12:26 pm : link
Take away the first 3 batters and he was scoreless for 6 innings. First 3 batters were an E5 - HBP (maybe in retaliation for the 3 BKN batters hit in the top of the 1st?) - 3 run HR. Settled down fairly nicely after that. Twice had 2 on - no out situations and got out of those with no runs scored.

Honestly best thing you can say about this org is it's  
Eric on Li : 7/19/2018 1:38 pm : link
not exactly a high compliment, but it's true. This is not the Marlins job. It's probably not even the Braves or Phillies jobs 3-4 years ago.

The minors aren't loaded, but they have talent and will have another high pick next year. Plus hopefully a little more depth after the deadline.

The infield and BP each need to be totally reconfigured but 2 aces and a solid OF isn't a bad place to start.

The biggest problem with the franchise is that organizationally the management structure and development structure IS completely broken. They need to hire a GM capable of completely updating the way they do everything. And more importantly they need to be willing to do that.
Honestly best thing you can say about this org is it's "not barren"  
Eric on Li : 7/19/2018 1:39 pm : link
(is how that previous comment subject should read)
They  
DanMetroMan : 7/19/2018 1:50 pm : link
have done a very poor job backfilling the SP.

Zack Wheeler MLB debut- 6/18/2013
Steven Matz 6/28/2015
Harvey 7/26/2012
Thor 5/12/2015

8 drafts=roughly 320 players taken.

Here are the pitchers the Mets have taken since 2011 2-8

Mazzoni, Verrett, Pill, Leathersich, Koch, Welch, Oswalt, Church, Meisner, Knapp, Prevost, Wieck, Wotell, Szapucki, Ingram, Taylor, Viall, McGeorge, Torres, Dibrell, O'Neil, Cobb, and 2018 SWR, Hill, Gilliam, Smith, Megill
realistically, who are the viable SP in the system?  
Eric on Li : 7/19/2018 1:57 pm : link
Dunn
Peterson
Kay
Szapucki (TJS)
Humphreys (TJS)

Maybe this year's 2nd rounder in 4-5 years? Obviously none of those guys are close to locks, but am I right that basically anybody else is a complete long shot at this point?
RE: They  
pjcas18 : 7/19/2018 2:00 pm : link
In comment 14016234 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
have done a very poor job backfilling the SP.

Zack Wheeler MLB debut- 6/18/2013
Steven Matz 6/28/2015
Harvey 7/26/2012
Thor 5/12/2015

8 drafts=roughly 320 players taken.

Here are the pitchers the Mets have taken since 2011 2-8

Mazzoni, Verrett, Pill, Leathersich, Koch, Welch, Oswalt, Church, Meisner, Knapp, Prevost, Wieck, Wotell, Szapucki, Ingram, Taylor, Viall, McGeorge, Torres, Dibrell, O'Neil, Cobb, and 2018 SWR, Hill, Gilliam, Smith, Megill


technically wouldn't players like Gsellman, Lugo count - they were in 2011, but they could backfill the list above.

and Lugo is older (28), bu Gsellman is still just 25 (just turned 25 yesterday)

Not disagreeing they've done a bad job, just saying to be more thorough they should be included.

I wouldn't nitpick about leaving Flexen off your list (since he wasn't drafted in rounds 2 - 8), and he looks like garbage, but Gsellman and Lugo I'd include.
PJ  
DanMetroMan : 7/19/2018 2:36 pm : link
That's round 2-8 ie highish picks where you hope to find good players vs later (ovviously)
Their  
DanMetroMan : 7/19/2018 2:50 pm : link
"high" pick college players also tend to suck immediately
Blake Tiberi 3rd round 2016-.689 career OPS in A-Ball
Quinn Brodey 3rd round 2017- .672 career OPS in A-Ball
Matt Winaker 5th round 2017- .722 OPS in A-ball
Colby Woodmansee 5th round 2016- released
Michael Paez 2016 4th round- .694 OPS

It's one thing to flame out but to immediately but awful is a scouting issue when it continues to happen

They also often don't seem to know what they have. Turner, McHugh (McHugh for an awful Eric Young Jr. in a 74 win season? Huh? Bowman is no great shakes but he gave the Cardinals some quality innings. I antipate them losing someone like Blackham and Blackham turning into Yates 2.0
Speaking of Tiberi  
pjcas18 : 7/19/2018 5:03 pm : link
Quote:

Michael Mayer
‏ @mikemayerMMO
1m1 minute ago

Michael Mayer Retweeted St. Lucie Mets

Tiberi promoted from Columbia. He was hitting .390 in his last 10 games and has .379 OBP this year.
RE: Their  
pjcas18 : 7/19/2018 5:11 pm : link
In comment 14016269 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
"high" pick college players also tend to suck immediately
Blake Tiberi 3rd round 2016-.689 career OPS in A-Ball
Quinn Brodey 3rd round 2017- .672 career OPS in A-Ball
Matt Winaker 5th round 2017- .722 OPS in A-ball
Colby Woodmansee 5th round 2016- released
Michael Paez 2016 4th round- .694 OPS

It's one thing to flame out but to immediately but awful is a scouting issue when it continues to happen

They also often don't seem to know what they have. Turner, McHugh (McHugh for an awful Eric Young Jr. in a 74 win season? Huh? Bowman is no great shakes but he gave the Cardinals some quality innings. I antipate them losing someone like Blackham and Blackham turning into Yates 2.0


Don't disagree with any of this, but I will point out Justin Turner was traded as a throw in in a trade by CIN and DFA'd by BAL after less than two seasons, so he was ditched by two teams before the Mets even got him.

And the Dodgers for all their foresight still only signed Turner to a minor league deal and it was like week or so before spring training. He was not what I'd call in demand.

So, on one hand they deserve some credit for claiming him, but i guess should lose credit for non-tendering him.

but like Murphy, Turner's ascent was not as predictable as revisionist history makes it seem.

Its time  
giantsFC : 7/19/2018 5:53 pm : link
the mets just start playing their draft picks right away in the show. Obviously sitting around in the minors for years is regressing them, if anything.

times are changing, younger guys are ready to play. I'd love to see the rewards sooner.
RE: RE: If they are serious about Ces at 1B  
spike : 7/19/2018 9:50 pm : link
In comment 14016051 Metnut said:
Quote:
In comment 14016042 Rob in Rockaway said:


Quote:


I don't know what the hell they will do about Alonso or Smith for that matter.



I've done a 180 on the DH in the NL the past few years. Bring on the DH! Do it ASAP


Mets have several DHs on the team (Bruce, FLores, gimpy Cabrera, Cespedes)
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