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Webb: "McAdoo planned to start me final 3 games last year"

Mr. Bungle : 8/7/2018 2:34 pm
Quote:
Former Giants coach Ben McAdoo told Davis Webb last season that he planned to start the rookie quarterback for the final three games, Webb told WFAN on Tuesday.

Of course, the Giants fired McAdoo before he had the chance to implement his plan.

Talking to Chris Carlin and Maggie Gray, Webb said he was doing film breakdowns in November for Geno Smith, whom McAdoo had just named the starting QB for the upcoming game against Oakland, ending Eli Manning's 210-game starting streak.

Then, "...Coach McAdoo walked in and said, 'Hey, the next three weeks, you're in,'" Webb said at Giants training camp in East Rutherford, New Jersey.


link - ( New Window )
Has there ever been another coach in the NFL that crashed  
jcn56 : 8/7/2018 2:37 pm : link
and burned faster and harder than McAdoo? It's like the whole thing started to unravel early on, and it went down in flames faster than a 747 with no engines.
RE: Has there ever been another coach in the NFL that crashed  
elgoman : 8/7/2018 2:45 pm : link
In comment 14031669 jcn56 said:
Quote:
and burned faster and harder than McAdoo? It's like the whole thing started to unravel early on, and it went down in flames faster than a 747 with no engines.


McAdoo led this team to the playoffs in his first year. Then the team is decimated in 2017 by injuries, partly caused by Eli's inaccurate hospital balls, and Giants fans scapegoat McAdoo.

I have a thought experiment: if Geno or Webb play all of 2017 in place of Eli, OBJ is likely never injured, we win more than 3 games before saving 22 million for FAs by cutting Eli.
Thinking shouldn't need to be an experiment.  
Bill L : 8/7/2018 2:47 pm : link
Most people just do it. At any rate, it failed.
He never gave him reps with the 1st team in practice  
schabadoo : 8/7/2018 2:50 pm : link
But was going to start him. Odd.
RE: RE: Has there ever been another coach in the NFL that crashed  
jcn56 : 8/7/2018 2:51 pm : link
In comment 14031680 elgoman said:
Quote:
In comment 14031669 jcn56 said:


Quote:


and burned faster and harder than McAdoo? It's like the whole thing started to unravel early on, and it went down in flames faster than a 747 with no engines.



McAdoo led this team to the playoffs in his first year. Then the team is decimated in 2017 by injuries, partly caused by Eli's inaccurate hospital balls, and Giants fans scapegoat McAdoo.

I have a thought experiment: if Geno or Webb play all of 2017 in place of Eli, OBJ is likely never injured, we win more than 3 games before saving 22 million for FAs by cutting Eli.


Correct - good team in 16 goes into full tailspin, resulting in the Giants dismissing a coach in mid season for the first time in ages.

He had definitely lost the team though - and pretty badly, by all accounts. I can't remember the last time things went so bad, so quickly for an NFL coach.
It may take Webb 10 years of starting  
dep026 : 8/7/2018 2:51 pm : link
To throw more TDS than interviews he has done already.
For a guy whose father was a coach  
arniefez : 8/7/2018 2:52 pm : link
and who just lost the coach and GM that drafted him this was an incredible mistake. He's obviously learned nothing being around Eli Manning. The Sons of Wellington will hold this against him forever. He went against the family in public. He just became Fredo.
RE: For a guy whose father was a coach  
dep026 : 8/7/2018 2:54 pm : link
In comment 14031700 arniefez said:
Quote:
and who just lost the coach and GM that drafted him this was an incredible mistake. He's obviously learned nothing being around Eli Manning. The Sons of Wellington will hold this against him forever. He went against the family in public. He just became Fredo.


An avid Webb I know said he hasnít been good in camp so far. Thinks with a year, Lauletta will pass him soon.
RE: Has there ever been another coach in the NFL that crashed  
Greg from LI : 8/7/2018 2:58 pm : link
In comment 14031669 jcn56 said:
Quote:
and burned faster and harder than McAdoo? It's like the whole thing started to unravel early on, and it went down in flames faster than a 747 with no engines.


Josh McDaniels, maybe. Won his first 6 games as head coach, then went 5-17 the rest of his tenure and was fired with 4 games remaining in his second season.
If that was the plan...  
Giantfan in skinland : 8/7/2018 3:01 pm : link
just highlights how clueless/tone deaf the Giants were about this whole thing.

As others have said, the reaction would have been 1000% less severe if the Giants had come out at any point and just said this was really about seeing Davis Webb. They never did, so the whole thing left people thinking this was just bungled management from top to bottom and that the idea really was to evaluate Geno Smith.

I do wonder if "you're in" may have meant more that they would be getting him into the game, though not necessarily starting. Given that they hadn't gotten him ANY practice reps, that certainly seems more plausible to me.
From  
AcidTest : 8/7/2018 3:02 pm : link
what I've read, Webb has been excellent in camp. But preseason is almost here, and that of course is when we will learn a whole lot more. My own view is that neither Webb or Lauletta will probably succeed Eli long term. But I give Webb a greater chance because of his arm strength and insane work ethic.
So instead of being concerned about our future  
BestFeature : 8/7/2018 3:04 pm : link
Mara buckled to the pressure of the white trash segment of the Giants fan population that wanted Eli in their for sentimental reasons? Honestly, I can't imagine anyone with half a brain that would want Eli to play meaningless games over Webb. And don't tell me Webb wasn't ready. You learn on the field.
LOL...  
FatMan in Charlotte : 8/7/2018 3:04 pm : link
Here's a thought - how about fucking can the idea of thinking. You suck hard at it:

Quote:
McAdoo led this team to the playoffs in his first year. Then the team is decimated in 2017 by injuries, partly caused by Eli's inaccurate hospital balls, and Giants fans scapegoat McAdoo.

I have a thought experiment: if Geno or Webb play all of 2017 in place of Eli, OBJ is likely never injured, we win more than 3 games before saving 22 million for FAs by cutting Eli.


So the WR's were injured because of Eli? "Inaccurate hospital balls"

There are balls in this thread- the ones you're sucking.
BM lost the team and quite early on  
JonC : 8/7/2018 3:06 pm : link
beyond that, it doesn't really matter very much as he sealed his own fate.
I think we should be grateful to him  
Bill L : 8/7/2018 3:09 pm : link
we are an immeasurably stronger team going froward because of him whether you look at management, coach, draft pick, and new and even current players. He was the inferno in our trial by fire that led to us being a phoenix in NY
Itís all water under the bridge now,  
Simms11 : 8/7/2018 3:09 pm : link
but itís most definitely for the best. McAdoo was so inflexible and seemed arrogant in the fact that he would not adjust his offense and tried to make it work still given the dire circumstances. He also didnít deL well with players or the media. I think youíre seeing a complete 180 from McAdoo with Shurmur. Will it change in the win/loss column? Only time will tell, but I think the change will be beneficial non-the-less.
mcadoo problem  
giantfan2000 : 8/7/2018 3:24 pm : link
is he was nice and told Eli what he was planning

he should have just waited till the next game when of course Eli would have made another throw that turn into pick 6
and then took him out of the game ..

RE: So instead of being concerned about our future  
schabadoo : 8/7/2018 3:28 pm : link
In comment 14031719 BestFeature said:
Quote:
Mara buckled to the pressure of the white trash segment of the Giants fan population that wanted Eli in their for sentimental reasons? Honestly, I can't imagine anyone with half a brain that would want Eli to play meaningless games over Webb. And don't tell me Webb wasn't ready. You learn on the field.


Someone please tell me if this is a parody post. It's getting so hard to tell.
.  
Go Terps : 8/7/2018 3:30 pm : link
My interpretation of the fan backlash was that it came about due to the organizational clumsiness with which it was handled. What bothered me was:

1. Eli was completely sandbagged by the announcement that he would be benched
2. Eli was forced to answer questions about it in front of his locker while his moron teammates (I remember dipshit JPP being one of them) laughed like idiots in the background. Besides the disrespect for a guy that has done more than all of them combined, it was telling that the locker room for a 2-9 team sounded like a fucking frat party.

I have no problem with benching any player at any time - no one on a 2-9 team should feel safe in their jobs. McAdoo wasn't there for the good years so it's understandable to an extent that he wouldn't hold Eli to a particularly high esteem.

Eli wasn't above benching, but he deserved better than the way it was handled - and the guys that should have ensured he was treated with the respect he deserved were Mara and Reese. They failed, and for me as a fan the whole episode degraded my confidence in ownership.

McAdoo was horrific last year, but I lay the blame at the players' (many of whom are still here) feet more than I do on him. Last year with the Giants was as bad a sports fan experience as I've ever had. I'm hoping for a good end to Eli's career, but I couldn't give a shit about any of the other players that were on the team last year. There isn't a single player from that group I'll miss when they're gone.
In hindsight  
Chris684 : 8/7/2018 3:30 pm : link
After the loss to the Chargers and an 0-5 record, Webb should have been elevated to number 2 QB and increased practice reps.

If that happened, he should have seen 2nd half action against both the Rams and 49ers.

Instead of the whole debacle with Geno, the Giants could have announced as an organization, that due to the opportunity to evaluate a young QB, Eli's last start of the streak would be @ home vs. Philly.

Webb would have had 2 full games on tape. The streak would have ended with dignity.

But it is what it is, it's in the past now.
it's too  
Les in TO : 8/7/2018 3:32 pm : link
bad the Eli Fanboy social media mob forced Jints Central (TM - bw in dc) to start Eli for those last four meaningless games of the season. the right thing to do for the team would have been to see what Webb had as a starter, given the only implications of those remaining games were draft position.
RE: .  
Mr. Bungle : 8/7/2018 3:35 pm : link
In comment 14031769 Go Terps said:
Quote:
Eli was forced to answer questions about it in front of his locker while his moron teammates (I remember dipshit JPP being one of them) laughed like idiots in the background. Besides the disrespect for a guy that has done more than all of them combined, it was telling that the locker room for a 2-9 team sounded like a fucking frat party.

Bobby Hart, too.

Such an historically unlikable team last year.
RE: it's too  
schabadoo : 8/7/2018 3:38 pm : link
In comment 14031772 Les in TO said:
Quote:
bad the Eli Fanboy social media mob forced Jints Central (TM - bw in dc) to start Eli for those last four meaningless games of the season. the right thing to do for the team would have been to see what Webb had as a starter, given the only implications of those remaining games were draft position.


'12/20/17: The Giants finally gave Webb first-team work in practice for the first time since the start of the regular season.'

Yet he was being groomed to start at some point.
RE: it's too  
mdc1 : 8/7/2018 3:39 pm : link
In comment 14031772 Les in TO said:
Quote:
bad the Eli Fanboy social media mob forced Jints Central (TM - bw in dc) to start Eli for those last four meaningless games of the season. the right thing to do for the team would have been to see what Webb had as a starter, given the only implications of those remaining games were draft position.


If Webb is the great talent so many believe, wouldn't that have been risky for Eli if he lit up the field? The strategy win or lose is to ride Eli and horse into retirement. By then, Webb will have neck issues from looking down at the clipboard.
RE: RE: .  
Go Terps : 8/7/2018 3:40 pm : link
In comment 14031776 Mr. Bungle said:
Quote:
In comment 14031769 Go Terps said:


Quote:


Eli was forced to answer questions about it in front of his locker while his moron teammates (I remember dipshit JPP being one of them) laughed like idiots in the background. Besides the disrespect for a guy that has done more than all of them combined, it was telling that the locker room for a 2-9 team sounded like a fucking frat party.


Bobby Hart, too.

Such an historically unlikable team last year.


The 2017 Giants can be summed up by the fact that they were so shitty it took them into the 4th quarter of the 3rd game to score their second TD of the season. And yet despite that incompetence they incurred unsportsmanlike conduct penalties on both of those TDs. Neither of those TDs gave them a lead, by the way.

Just a team of losers.
RE: RE: Has there ever been another coach in the NFL that crashed  
Mike from SI : 8/7/2018 3:40 pm : link
In comment 14031680 elgoman said:
Quote:
In comment 14031669 jcn56 said:


Quote:


and burned faster and harder than McAdoo? It's like the whole thing started to unravel early on, and it went down in flames faster than a 747 with no engines.



McAdoo led this team to the playoffs in his first year. Then the team is decimated in 2017 by injuries, partly caused by Eli's inaccurate hospital balls, and Giants fans scapegoat McAdoo.

I have a thought experiment: if Geno or Webb play all of 2017 in place of Eli, OBJ is likely never injured, we win more than 3 games before saving 22 million for FAs by cutting Eli.


This guy has got to be a dupe of the idiot who used to consistently argue that Eli was getting all our WR injured.
RE: RE: Has there ever been another coach in the NFL that crashed  
Hsilwek92 : 8/7/2018 3:40 pm : link
In comment 14031680 elgoman said:
Quote:
In comment 14031669 jcn56 said:


Quote:


and burned faster and harder than McAdoo? It's like the whole thing started to unravel early on, and it went down in flames faster than a 747 with no engines.



McAdoo led this team to the playoffs in his first year. Then the team is decimated in 2017 by injuries, partly caused by Eli's inaccurate hospital balls, and Giants fans scapegoat McAdoo.

I have a thought experiment: if Geno or Webb play all of 2017 in place of Eli, OBJ is likely never injured, we win more than 3 games before saving 22 million for FAs by cutting Eli.


Idiotic. Donít post on a football thread again.
RE: RE: RE: .  
Britt in VA : 8/7/2018 3:43 pm : link
In comment 14031785 Go Terps said:
Quote:
In comment 14031776 Mr. Bungle said:


Quote:


In comment 14031769 Go Terps said:


Quote:


Eli was forced to answer questions about it in front of his locker while his moron teammates (I remember dipshit JPP being one of them) laughed like idiots in the background. Besides the disrespect for a guy that has done more than all of them combined, it was telling that the locker room for a 2-9 team sounded like a fucking frat party.


Bobby Hart, too.

Such an historically unlikable team last year.



The 2017 Giants can be summed up by the fact that they were so shitty it took them into the 4th quarter of the 3rd game to score their second TD of the season. And yet despite that incompetence they incurred unsportsmanlike conduct penalties on both of those TDs. Neither of those TDs gave them a lead, by the way.

Just a team of losers.


They also didn't get their first rushing TD until October 1st, which was a 14 yard rushing TD by... Eli.
RE: RE: RE: .  
Mr. Bungle : 8/7/2018 3:45 pm : link
In comment 14031785 Go Terps said:
Quote:
The 2017 Giants can be summed up by the fact that they were so shitty it took them into the 4th quarter of the 3rd game to score their second TD of the season. And yet despite that incompetence they incurred unsportsmanlike conduct penalties on both of those TDs. Neither of those TDs gave them a lead, by the way.

Just a team of losers.

Off the top of my head, are you referring to rookie Evan Engram scoring his first NFL TD...and proceeding to grab his crotch?

Let's hope that kind of shit is behind him.
Which I believe was their 3rd TD of the season.  
Britt in VA : 8/7/2018 3:45 pm : link
.
It's sad..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 8/7/2018 3:48 pm : link
that this fucking guy continues to call people who don't bash Eli "fanboys".

A fucking trainwreck.

Quote:
it's too
Les in TO : 3:32 pm : link : reply
bad the Eli Fanboy social media mob forced Jints Central (TM - bw in dc) to start Eli for those last four meaningless games of the season. the right thing to do for the team would have been to see what Webb had as a starter, given the only implications of those remaining games were draft position.


RE: It's sad..  
Giantfan in skinland : 8/7/2018 3:54 pm : link
In comment 14031800 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
that this fucking guy continues to call people who don't bash Eli "fanboys".

A fucking trainwreck.



Quote:


it's too
Les in TO : 3:32 pm : link : reply
bad the Eli Fanboy social media mob forced Jints Central (TM - bw in dc) to start Eli for those last four meaningless games of the season. the right thing to do for the team would have been to see what Webb had as a starter, given the only implications of those remaining games were draft position.




The craziest part in all of this is that I think the majority of fans agreed with playing Webb...even after the whole Eli fiasco. As I said above, the big issue seemed to be that they put Geno in and didn't seem to have any plan to get Webb ready. So just kind of mind boggling that after all the other ways Mara and the Giants whiffed on this, that they also didn't realize that by simply saying Eli is still our guy, but the plan is to get Webb in to get a look at him...they probably defuse the situation greatly.
RE: RE: RE: RE: .  
Fox : 8/7/2018 4:00 pm : link
In comment 14031794 Mr. Bungle said:
Quote:
In comment 14031785 Go Terps said:


Quote:


The 2017 Giants can be summed up by the fact that they were so shitty it took them into the 4th quarter of the 3rd game to score their second TD of the season. And yet despite that incompetence they incurred unsportsmanlike conduct penalties on both of those TDs. Neither of those TDs gave them a lead, by the way.

Just a team of losers.


Off the top of my head, are you referring to rookie Evan Engram scoring his first NFL TD...and proceeding to grab his crotch?

Let's hope that kind of shit is behind him.


Engram said that sort of thing wouldn't happen again, and it didn't as far as I can recall. Let's hope that continues. He was one of the many guys that were playing hard until the bitter end.

I get where Terps is coming from and largely feel the same way, but I'm not ready to dismiss every guy on last year's roster not named Eli Manning, simply for being on the roster. Too many guys quit, but far from all of them.
RE: .  
Eric on Li : 8/7/2018 4:05 pm : link
In comment 14031769 Go Terps said:
Quote:

McAdoo was horrific last year, but I lay the blame at the players' (many of whom are still here) feet more than I do on him.


That's a kind of an odd statement. I personally don't blame Bobby Hart for ruining the season. I blame the idiots that thought it was a not only a good idea to draft and roster him for multiple seasons but declare him the starting RT. Parse that between Mcadoo/Reese/Mara however but it's not on the players for signing themselves and under-investing in critical places.
This horse is dead but since we're here again  
arniefez : 8/7/2018 4:07 pm : link
1. It would have been fine to go to Eli and say the season is lost we're playing the rookie to see what he has. No one has the NYG QB job for life.

2. It would have been fine to start Eli and say nothing to him and if the Giants fell behind and the offense was doing nothing to take Eli out of the game and see what the rookie has.

3. It would have never been fine to bench Eli Manning for Geno Smith who is Geno Smith and was a free agent when the season ended.

4. It would never have been fine to pre determine that Eli would come out at half time no matter what the score was to keep his streak alive.

Some combination of Mara, Reese & McAdoo decided on 3 & 4. All three of them deserve everything that's been said about them for doing that.
RE: So instead of being concerned about our future  
Rocky369 : 8/7/2018 4:12 pm : link
In comment 14031719 BestFeature said:
Quote:
Mara buckled to the pressure of the white trash segment of the Giants fan population that wanted Eli in their for sentimental reasons? Honestly, I can't imagine anyone with half a brain that would want Eli to play meaningless games over Webb. And don't tell me Webb wasn't ready. You learn on the field.
How in the utter fuck could you possibly question anyone about having half a brain?
RE: This horse is dead but since we're here again  
Britt in VA : 8/7/2018 4:12 pm : link
In comment 14031820 arniefez said:
Quote:
1. It would have been fine to go to Eli and say the season is lost we're playing the rookie to see what he has. No one has the NYG QB job for life.

2. It would have been fine to start Eli and say nothing to him and if the Giants fell behind and the offense was doing nothing to take Eli out of the game and see what the rookie has.

3. It would have never been fine to bench Eli Manning for Geno Smith who is Geno Smith and was a free agent when the season ended.

4. It would never have been fine to pre determine that Eli would come out at half time no matter what the score was to keep his streak alive.

Some combination of Mara, Reese & McAdoo decided on 3 & 4. All three of them deserve everything that's been said about them for doing that.


This is a good and reasonable post, and I'd like to talk about #2 specifically...

This is standard operating procedure for how to work a rookie in to let him see live action, and is pretty much how every team does it.

Why there needed to be a "plan" to begin with is why McAdoo was an incompetent boob.

Eli keeps his streak, which he has earned, and Webb gets meaningful reps. Win/win, everybody is happy.
RE: It's sad..  
Les in TO : 8/7/2018 4:17 pm : link
In comment 14031800 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
that this fucking guy continues to call people who don't bash Eli "fanboys".

A fucking trainwreck.



Quote:


it's too
Les in TO : 3:32 pm : link : reply
bad the Eli Fanboy social media mob forced Jints Central (TM - bw in dc) to start Eli for those last four meaningless games of the season. the right thing to do for the team would have been to see what Webb had as a starter, given the only implications of those remaining games were draft position.


I see those anger management classes are working well for you.

an eli fanboy is someone who irrationally puts their love of Eli ahead of the love of the Giants. you can be a fan of Eli and also recognize that when the Giants are eliminated from playoff contention, Eli is past the age of normal expiry date for QBs not named Tom Brady or Warren Moon , and there is a reasonable chance the Giants would have a top pick in what was regarded as a strong QB class, there is every reason to give Webb some meaningful action to see what we've got. a lot of BBIers fall into this Eli fan, not fanboy, category and I have no issues with them.

however, there is a vocal mob of Eli fanboy posters who feel that Eli and Eli alone gets to decide when to retire and that all issues with the team are the fault of his receivers, backs, line, coaching, defense, Reese, Ross etc. ...any views to the contrary are seen as "bashing" their God and gets attacked with religious fervor.
RE: This horse is dead but since we're here again  
Les in TO : 8/7/2018 4:22 pm : link
In comment 14031820 arniefez said:
Quote:
1. It would have been fine to go to Eli and say the season is lost we're playing the rookie to see what he has. No one has the NYG QB job for life.

2. It would have been fine to start Eli and say nothing to him and if the Giants fell behind and the offense was doing nothing to take Eli out of the game and see what the rookie has.

3. It would have never been fine to bench Eli Manning for Geno Smith who is Geno Smith and was a free agent when the season ended.

4. It would never have been fine to pre determine that Eli would come out at half time no matter what the score was to keep his streak alive.

Some combination of Mara, Reese & McAdoo decided on 3 & 4. All three of them deserve everything that's been said about them for doing that.
good post, but there was no easy or cost-less way to execute on the plan given the existence of the streak and the Eli fanatics. Option #1 (the clean bandaid approach) would have risked raising the ire of the Eli mob and generated just as much controversy for ending the streak due to a non-injury related reason (especially if Webb stunk). and option #2 could have been seen as a "benching"....if Webb performed well in garbage time, could have also generated a controversy.
Funny but  
mrvax : 8/7/2018 4:22 pm : link
I remember Geno Smith saying something similar a few months ago. How McAdoo wanted Smith to start the last few games because he deserved it.

Is either Webb or Smith full of it?
Let's also remember Ben and Jerry's words from the night Webb  
Britt in VA : 8/7/2018 4:27 pm : link
was drafted... This was a 3rd round project pick that needed to sit and learn for a couple of years, and hopefully would not see the field until year 3.

He wasn't ready, which was reflected directly by the fact that they guy didn't take a single snap with the 1st team well into December, nor was he ever elevated to second on the depth chart.

He wasn't ready. But I know that is also lost on some.
The thing most will remember for the longest  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 8/7/2018 4:36 pm : link
Is Mcadoo broke Eli's historic iron man streak for Geno f*cking Smith.
RE: The thing most will remember for the longest  
Britt in VA : 8/7/2018 4:38 pm : link
In comment 14031856 Coach Red Beaulieu said:
Quote:
Is Mcadoo broke Eli's historic iron man streak for Geno f*cking Smith.


Eli Manning hadn't missed a start since high school or college, so we're talking like 20 years without missing a start, and he's a healthy scratch for Geno Smith.
RE: Has there ever been another coach in the NFL that crashed  
njm : 8/7/2018 4:49 pm : link
In comment 14031669 jcn56 said:
Quote:
and burned faster and harder than McAdoo? It's like the whole thing started to unravel early on, and it went down in flames faster than a 747 with no engines.


Yes.. "He who shall not be named"
Handley was a dumpster fire from day 1  
Greg from LI : 8/7/2018 4:52 pm : link
.
RE: RE: .  
Mad Mike : 8/7/2018 4:57 pm : link
In comment 14031816 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
That's a kind of an odd statement. I personally don't blame Bobby Hart for ruining the season. I blame the idiots that thought it was a not only a good idea to draft and roster him for multiple seasons but declare him the starting RT. Parse that between Mcadoo/Reese/Mara however but it's not on the players for signing themselves and under-investing in critical places.

Sometimes finding fault with the players is the whole point.
Thank you FMIC.  
Giant John : 8/7/2018 5:08 pm : link
Hospital balls? Where does this crap come from?
RE: RE: The thing most will remember for the longest  
Gatorade Dunk : 8/7/2018 5:11 pm : link
In comment 14031859 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
In comment 14031856 Coach Red Beaulieu said:


Quote:


Is Mcadoo broke Eli's historic iron man streak for Geno f*cking Smith.



Eli Manning hadn't missed a start since high school or college, so we're talking like 20 years without missing a start, and he's a healthy scratch for Geno Smith.

So when he was a backup his freshman year at Ole Miss, and when he redshirted the year before that, that counts as an active streak?

I don't really understand why fiction gets brought into this all the time.
RE: RE: RE: The thing most will remember for the longest  
Gatorade Dunk : 8/7/2018 5:13 pm : link
In comment 14031886 Gatorade Dunk said:
Quote:
In comment 14031859 Britt in VA said:


Quote:


In comment 14031856 Coach Red Beaulieu said:


Quote:


Is Mcadoo broke Eli's historic iron man streak for Geno f*cking Smith.



Eli Manning hadn't missed a start since high school or college, so we're talking like 20 years without missing a start, and he's a healthy scratch for Geno Smith.


So when he was a backup his freshman year at Ole Miss, and when he redshirted the year before that, that counts as an active streak?

I don't really understand why fiction gets brought into this all the time.

And that's without the 9 games he didn't start as a rookie. In other words, not at all 20 years without missing a start.
Due to injury.  
Britt in VA : 8/7/2018 5:23 pm : link
Better?
RE: Due to injury.  
Gatorade Dunk : 8/7/2018 5:38 pm : link
In comment 14031895 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
Better?

In that case, it's still intact! Better?
RE: The thing most will remember for the longest  
Les in TO : 8/7/2018 5:40 pm : link
In comment 14031856 Coach Red Beaulieu said:
Quote:
Is Mcadoo broke Eli's historic iron man streak for Geno f*cking Smith.
As Mara admitted, he talked to Reese on the Monday following the thanksgiving loss to the Skins and wanted to see both Smith and Webb get action for the remaining five games. So you can blame McAdoo for trying to have his cake and eat it too by trying to keep Eli's streak alive, but the decision to have Geno play came right from the top.
FWIW  
Bernie : 8/7/2018 5:48 pm : link
The presence of Eli's streak made this a muddy decision. I don't think it's a stretch to say that once the season was lost, the majority of Giants fans wanted to see what Webb could do, just not at the expense of Eli's streak. However, once the streak was broken and McAdoo was fired, they should have found ways to get Webb some playing time.

RE: For a guy whose father was a coach  
TMS : 8/7/2018 5:50 pm : link
In comment 14031700 arniefez said:
Quote:
and who just lost the coach and GM that drafted him this was an incredible mistake. He's obviously learned nothing being around Eli Manning. The Sons of Wellington will hold this against him forever. He went against the family in public. He just became Fredo.
Think what you are saying is Webb should have kept this story to himself for now at least. Could definitely backfire.
RE: RE: For a guy whose father was a coach  
ron mexico : 8/7/2018 5:57 pm : link
In comment 14031914 TMS said:
Quote:
In comment 14031700 arniefez said:


Quote:


and who just lost the coach and GM that drafted him this was an incredible mistake. He's obviously learned nothing being around Eli Manning. The Sons of Wellington will hold this against him forever. He went against the family in public. He just became Fredo.

Think what you are saying is Webb should have kept this story to himself for now at least. Could definitely backfire.


How? The whole idea was to get Webb playing time. I don't even understand why this is a sound byte. He is not saying he is better than Eli.
Les needs to stick to hockey  
JCin332 : 8/7/2018 6:10 pm : link
...
I don't understand this facination with Eli Manning's record  
GeofromNJ : 8/7/2018 6:18 pm : link
His record as a starter is 111-103. Keep in mind that the Giants nearly won the game that Smith started. Smith was 21-34 with 1 TD. He did fumble twice which cost the Giants the game, but he was elusive enough to avoid the constant pressure. Is Smith a good NFL quarterback? No. But he can perform adequately with an incompetent offensive line. The decision to start him was not asinine. I also agree with those who think that Webb was not ready. I would never have pulled Eli at halftime and inserted Webb. The results would have been embarrassing to say the least. With a more competent offensive line, healthy receivers, and Barkley, Eli should do fine this year. As for the future, I am not one who thinks that the next franchise quarterback is currently on the roster.
RE: RE: It's sad..  
Bill L : 8/7/2018 6:35 pm : link
In comment 14031832 Les in TO said:
Quote:
In comment 14031800 FatMan in Charlotte said:


Quote:


that this fucking guy continues to call people who don't bash Eli "fanboys".

A fucking trainwreck.



Quote:


it's too
Les in TO : 3:32 pm : link : reply
bad the Eli Fanboy social media mob forced Jints Central (TM - bw in dc) to start Eli for those last four meaningless games of the season. the right thing to do for the team would have been to see what Webb had as a starter, given the only implications of those remaining games were draft position.




I see those anger management classes are working well for you.

an eli fanboy is someone who irrationally puts their love of Eli ahead of the love of the Giants. you can be a fan of Eli and also recognize that when the Giants are eliminated from playoff contention, Eli is past the age of normal expiry date for QBs not named Tom Brady or Warren Moon , and there is a reasonable chance the Giants would have a top pick in what was regarded as a strong QB class, there is every reason to give Webb some meaningful action to see what we've got. a lot of BBIers fall into this Eli fan, not fanboy, category and I have no issues with them.

however, there is a vocal mob of Eli fanboy posters who feel that Eli and Eli alone gets to decide when to retire and that all issues with the team are the fault of his receivers, backs, line, coaching, defense, Reese, Ross etc. ...any views to the contrary are seen as "bashing" their God and gets attacked with religious fervor.
Youre more than equal but opposite, so stone-throwing Iíll becomes you.

*And*you have an errant take. Because itís manifestly obvious, and 100% chance and was always always the way t was going to be, that they would have taken Barkley with the first pick, as they did with the second. So your top pick comment has exactly zero relevance.
It's like it's not even possible to talk about Eli  
Ten Ton Hammer : 8/7/2018 6:49 pm : link
Without devolving into pee wee league name-calling.
McAdoo was bad..  
Sean : 8/7/2018 6:59 pm : link
but taking a step back and looking at it objectively - it was an impossible situation. Taking over a HOF coach & a legendary Giant QB on the back end of his career. Bound to fail.
What??  
FatMan in Charlotte : 8/7/2018 7:35 pm : link
Quote:
I don't understand this facination with Eli Manning's record
GeofromNJ : 6:18 pm : link : reply
His record as a starter is 111-103. Keep in mind that the Giants nearly won the game that Smith started. Smith was 21-34 with 1 TD. He did fumble twice which cost the Giants the game, but he was elusive enough to avoid the constant pressure. Is Smith a good NFL quarterback? No. But he can perform adequately with an incompetent offensive line. The decision to start him was not asinine.


They didn't almost beat the Raiders. They were losing by 10 early in the 4th quarter. Geno was directly responsible for the loss and that is ignoring the basic premise - - he shouldn't have started to begin with. It WAS asinine.

If Eli is benched, you don't bring in a useless guy like Geno that provides no glimpse to the future or hope for the present. You bring in Webb.

I'm not even sure how that's debatable?
A few thoughts  
Matt M. : 8/7/2018 7:58 pm : link
1) There is a big difference between saying he will start and next three weeks you're in. In where? He hadn't even been taking reps with the scout team.

2) As FatMan just said, starting Geno Smith was a big blunder. First, the season was already over for several weeks, so having the veteran backup no longer made sense. Second, Geno Smith was not an option to start the next season or beyond, so again elevating him in a lost season made no sense. Third, given the lack of weapons and his track record I don't think he gave them a better chance to win a game.

3) To build on that last point and what FatMan mentioned, he was a big reason they lost that game.

4) McAdoo made a mistake from day one by not getting Webb any reps even in the summer. Then, as soon as they were 5 or 6 losses in, not elevating Webb to #2 to start getting reps as a potential starter was more egregious.
RE: It's sad..  
Matt M. : 8/7/2018 8:00 pm : link
In comment 14031800 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
that this fucking guy continues to call people who don't bash Eli "fanboys".

A fucking trainwreck.



Quote:


it's too
Les in TO : 3:32 pm : link : reply
bad the Eli Fanboy social media mob forced Jints Central (TM - bw in dc) to start Eli for those last four meaningless games of the season. the right thing to do for the team would have been to see what Webb had as a starter, given the only implications of those remaining games were draft position.


Especially sad when you consider Spags exacerbated the problem by still not elevating Webb even to #2. How was Webb going to start when he hadn't even been practicing?
RE: So instead of being concerned about our future  
Matt M. : 8/7/2018 8:03 pm : link
In comment 14031719 BestFeature said:
Quote:
Mara buckled to the pressure of the white trash segment of the Giants fan population that wanted Eli in their for sentimental reasons? Honestly, I can't imagine anyone with half a brain that would want Eli to play meaningless games over Webb. And don't tell me Webb wasn't ready. You learn on the field.
At that point it had nothing to do with sentiment. Eli was the only QB who served any purpose. He was the only one who both gave them a chance to win and was prepared to play. Geno was practicing but half the QB Eli is and Webb hadn't practiced all year.
I said it then Iíll say it again  
djm : 8/7/2018 8:03 pm : link
Mara hasnít gotten nearly enough shit for this whole debacle.

Mara hired mcadoo. Never forget that. What we donít know is how badly MARA fuct up the whole qb during and immediately after the mcadoo ďdecision.Ē

Iíve moved on I have no choice. And I can rationalize the giants decision to eschew the first round qb for Barkley. Shurmur move... fine....But I still wonder how badly John Mara handled things here last season. The whole thing just looked like amateur hour and thatís being kind.

Thereís no excuse for last season, specifically last November.
RE: RE: Due to injury.  
Britt in VA : 8/7/2018 8:18 pm : link
In comment 14031905 Gatorade Dunk said:
Quote:
In comment 14031895 Britt in VA said:


Quote:


Better?


In that case, it's still intact! Better?


You're being obtuse.

From the moment he was given the starting job in HS, he never missed a start until he graduated.

From the moment he was given the starting job in College, he didn't miss a start until he graduated.

From the moment he was given the job as the Giants starting job, he didn't miss a start for 14 years.

If you refuse to see the significance of that, or think that's somehow "fiction", then it's not worth discussing.
But that's okay....  
Britt in VA : 8/7/2018 8:25 pm : link
The satisfaction that he's going to start the next two years (at least), knowing how badly that burns some of you up along with passing on QB at two, makes it all worth it.
RE: I said it then Iíll say it again  
Matt M. : 8/7/2018 8:32 pm : link
In comment 14031965 djm said:
Quote:
Mara hasnít gotten nearly enough shit for this whole debacle.

Mara hired mcadoo. Never forget that. What we donít know is how badly MARA fuct up the whole qb during and immediately after the mcadoo ďdecision.Ē

Iíve moved on I have no choice. And I can rationalize the giants decision to eschew the first round qb for Barkley. Shurmur move... fine....But I still wonder how badly John Mara handled things here last season. The whole thing just looked like amateur hour and thatís being kind.

Thereís no excuse for last season, specifically last November.
Very well said.
Terps  
joeinpa : 8/7/2018 8:41 pm : link
They were disrespectful because on a practice day the locker room was noisy while Eli was being interviewed?

Yikes! He s the quarterback of a 3 -13 team, and shared in the blame for that record. It was the right move to bench him. I doubt very much if other NFL players hold Eli in the same reverant manner as you do.

The locker room is always noisy during these week day interviews. I m sure many there felt his benching was over due.

It s about winning, not number of games played without missing. The past 6 seasons that streak was compromised of many losses and bad offensive performances.

Your post is very revealing of a type of loyalty I have rarely seen for a Giants player.
RE: RE: RE: Due to injury.  
Gatorade Dunk : 8/7/2018 8:47 pm : link
In comment 14031966 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
In comment 14031905 Gatorade Dunk said:


Quote:


In comment 14031895 Britt in VA said:


Quote:


Better?


In that case, it's still intact! Better?



You're being obtuse.

From the moment he was given the starting job in HS, he never missed a start until he graduated.

From the moment he was given the starting job in College, he didn't miss a start until he graduated.

From the moment he was given the job as the Giants starting job, he didn't miss a start for 14 years.

If you refuse to see the significance of that, or think that's somehow "fiction", then it's not worth discussing.

Right, I'm obtuse. If that's the best you can do when you get called out on your bullshit, I'll take it.

20 years. Hahahaha.
Well you can enjoy his new streak for the next two to three.  
Britt in VA : 8/7/2018 8:50 pm : link
.
I get a kick out of people that need  
UConn4523 : 8/7/2018 8:51 pm : link
to make sure they assign blame to the correct person. I donít care whoís fault any of it was. Hopefully the biggest problems are off the team. Mara getting more heat doesnít actually do anything. Whatís he going to do, sell the team out of embarrassment?
^ agree  
trueblueinpw : 8/7/2018 8:54 pm : link
Mara hasnít gotten nearly the blame he earned. His paws were all over the gutless mess that occurred last season.
RE: Well you can enjoy his new streak for the next two to three.  
Gatorade Dunk : 8/7/2018 8:54 pm : link
In comment 14031979 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
.

And I will. I'm a GIANTS fan. I root for every single player on the roster. I just don't build a shrine to one individual player like some do.

And it's two. Hard stop. That's the remainder of his contract. You might want to start coming to terms with that now because I suspect it'll take you a while.
RE: RE: RE: Due to injury.  
Les in TO : 8/7/2018 9:04 pm : link
In comment 14031966 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
In comment 14031905 Gatorade Dunk said:


Quote:


In comment 14031895 Britt in VA said:


Quote:


Better?


In that case, it's still intact! Better?



You're being obtuse.

From the moment he was given the starting job in HS, he never missed a start until he graduated.

From the moment he was given the starting job in College, he didn't miss a start until he graduated.

From the moment he was given the job as the Giants starting job, he didn't miss a start for 14 years.

If you refuse to see the significance of that, or think that's somehow "fiction", then it's not worth discussing.
durability is an important table stakes aspect of being successful and on that front Eli gets an A+. The key words being table stakes. Accuracy, arm strength, vision, brains athleticism footwork and heart are all aspects of success assuming the QB shows up consistently.
RE: So instead of being concerned about our future  
EricJ : 8/7/2018 9:17 pm : link
In comment 14031719 BestFeature said:
Quote:
Mara buckled to the pressure of the white trash segment of the Giants fan population that wanted Eli in their for sentimental reasons?


Dep...are you just going to sit there and let this guy call you white trash?
I listened to the interview  
steve in ky : 8/7/2018 9:17 pm : link
I'm more disappointed to hear him say that he watches "The Bachelor" than anything else he said.

But to the larger point. This is a new season with a new staff and some exciting new young players. Why do fans want to kick this old dead horse around? Just be happy McAdoo is in the rear view mirror and get ready to enjoy the new season. Go Giants!
RE: But that's okay....  
Jim in Tampa : 8/7/2018 9:59 pm : link
In comment 14031971 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
The satisfaction that he's going to start the next two years (at least), knowing how badly that burns some of you up along with passing on QB at two, makes it all worth it.


Wow! What a revealing post this is.

We are ALL Giants fans and we ALL want the Giants to win every game they play. And that means rooting for ALL their players to do well.

Before the draft I wanted the Giants to draft a QB, but I never felt any animosity towards those who disagreed and wanted Barkley or some other non-QB. I just felt they had a different take on how OUR team could improve. We had spirited pre-draft discussions on BBI and then the Giants made their choice.

But it's pretty clear by this post (and other posts) that Britt is holding a grudge against any BBIer who ever said a mean thing about his beloved Eli. As if making the observations that Eli hasn't played well recently and that he's also 37 are intended as personal insults to Eli's #1 fan.

I hope the Giants do well this year, but you should probably enjoy Eli while you still can. My guess is that with a tough first half of the season schedule the Giants will lose more than they win and Webb will take over in November. Then Eli will be cut at the end of the year.

And if that does happen I assure you the one thought that will never cross my mind isÖ ďknowing how badly this burns Britt in VA makes it all worth itĒ.
RE: For a guy whose father was a coach  
sb from NYT Forum : 8/7/2018 10:00 pm : link
In comment 14031700 arniefez said:
Quote:
and who just lost the coach and GM that drafted him this was an incredible mistake. He's obviously learned nothing being around Eli Manning. The Sons of Wellington will hold this against him forever. He went against the family in public. He just became Fredo.


I am having trouble understanding this post.
'and we ALL want the Giants to win every game they play'  
schabadoo : 8/7/2018 10:14 pm : link
You should've been here last December...
RE: 'and we ALL want the Giants to win every game they play'  
Jim in Tampa : 8/7/2018 10:27 pm : link
In comment 14032072 schabadoo said:
Quote:
You should've been here last December...


It goes without saying that once the Giants are officially eliminated (like last year) that rooting for draft position is acceptable.
RE: But that's okay....  
Jimmy Googs : 8/7/2018 10:33 pm : link
In comment 14031971 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
The satisfaction that he's going to start the next two years (at least), knowing how badly that burns some of you up along with passing on QB at two, makes it all worth it.


You simply couldnít hold it back, could you?. I was actually about to post an add-on to one of your reasonable and objective comments above until I read this stupid uncalled for post.

You openly make the above asinine remarks to stupidly show your clear bias in an attempt to demean everybody that disagrees with your opinions. We havenít even played a snap this season but the fact that Eli is the de facto starter is enough for you to take some ridiculous victory lap around BBI?? Our record is 0-0 but you are correct and everybody else is wrong.

What a moron...
RE: I said it then Iíll say it again  
bw in dc : 8/7/2018 10:40 pm : link
In comment 14031965 djm said:
Quote:
Mara hasnít gotten nearly enough shit for this whole debacle.

Mara hired mcadoo. Never forget that. What we donít know is how badly MARA fuct up the whole qb during and immediately after the mcadoo ďdecision.Ē



Well, I have.

I have chronicled this Eli ordeal in great detail and blame it all on Mara. He lied his ass off about what he knew. And he was intimately involved with the Eli decision. In fact, I think he helped orchestrate the entire thing. He just gets off the hook because last year was a disaster, heís the owner, and there was deep McAdoo and Reese fatigue...
RE: RE: For a guy whose father was a coach  
Mr. Bungle : 8/7/2018 10:59 pm : link
In comment 14032060 sb from NYT Forum said:
Quote:
In comment 14031700 arniefez said:


Quote:


and who just lost the coach and GM that drafted him this was an incredible mistake. He's obviously learned nothing being around Eli Manning. The Sons of Wellington will hold this against him forever. He went against the family in public. He just became Fredo.



I am having trouble understanding this post.

He's saying that Webb's dad was a football coach (who presumably knows organizational politics), and the regime that drafted Webb (Reese and McAdoo) are gone and the new regime has no loyalty to him, and still Webb was careless enough to implicate John Mara in the Eli fiasco.
...  
christian : 8/7/2018 11:01 pm : link
Spot on with the Mara blame. Like I've said before if you're going to fire someone if they get it wrong, you gotta help him do it right.

No one was their perfect self last November. Mara, Reese, Macadoo and even Manning.

Feels like more emotionally mature folks are in charge of football. I hope that brings out better in Mara.

On the field I really hope Manning plays a ton better and the team is in contention for a championship. I don't think he has it in him -- it would be great to be wrong.

RE: In hindsight  
02/03/2008 : 8/7/2018 11:13 pm : link
This! Most real fans would have been ok w Eli being benched if there was a real plan like this. The way it went down instead, looked like a clown show. If they handled it properly the fans would have been fine. Except for some of the tools who posted on this thread.

In comment 14031770 Chris684 said:
Quote:
After the loss to the Chargers and an 0-5 record, Webb should have been elevated to number 2 QB and increased practice reps.

If that happened, he should have seen 2nd half action against both the Rams and 49ers.

Instead of the whole debacle with Geno, the Giants could have announced as an organization, that due to the opportunity to evaluate a young QB, Eli's last start of the streak would be @ home vs. Philly.

Webb would have had 2 full games on tape. The streak would have ended with dignity.

But it is what it is, it's in the past now.
McAdoo was an abomination  
LauderdaleMatty : 8/7/2018 11:38 pm : link
Last year. That doesnít mean Eli doesnít deserve blame. A shit ton to go around. Reese and his shitty drafts; Shitty cap management and worse his decisions about the OL. Mara for even hiring McAdoo.

And if any of those who want to lay all the blame or most of it on Eli if you can see that no other coach on the NFL for YEARS runs 3 wides 90 % of the time. Ever? Never mind his mirage coaching job where the defense was the only reason he got 11íwins. The side of the ball that he did nothing to coach.

No one looked good last year. It was a shit show. Its actually amazing that some people canít admit McAdoo was a shitty coach still
Yeah, some of you guys go from thread to thread calling people fanboys  
Britt in VA : 8/8/2018 6:27 am : link
worshippers, and non-Giants fans/only Eli fans and I'm the one that can't hold back.

I've been a Giants fan since 1984, been on this site lurking since 2001 and posting since 2003. All well before Eli Manning.

Just because I can appreciate the career of arguably one of the greatest Giants QB's without trying to prematurely usher it to it's end doesn't make me less of a Giants fan.

Look in the mirror and think about what you post.
RE: RE: But that's okay....  
dorgan : 8/8/2018 7:21 am : link
In comment 14032086 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:

What a moron...



Irony.
I guess you guys have jackets  
Jimmy Googs : 8/8/2018 7:28 am : link
then...
It's funny....  
Britt in VA : 8/8/2018 7:32 am : link
like I said, you go from thread to thread, calling out fanboys and worshippers, unprovoked usually, and then act all offended or shocked when you get the response you're looking for.
Then, once you get somebody to take the bait....  
Britt in VA : 8/8/2018 7:34 am : link
the rest of the sharks smell the chum in the water and show up.

What you don't realize is you exhibit the exact behavior that you accuse everybody else of, just the opposite stance.

Have some self awareness, at least.
Not really. When someone goes to the extreme  
Jimmy Googs : 8/8/2018 7:39 am : link
on Eli I probably chime in and bring some reality to it to either bring them down/up a few notches. But I do both.

Whats really funny is you're one-sided. You try to play it as if you are objective, but you're not, as you simple cannot help in creating posts like you did on this one yesterday. So i chimed in...

RE: Not really. When someone goes to the extreme  
Britt in VA : 8/8/2018 7:43 am : link
In comment 14032195 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
on Eli I probably chime in and bring some reality to it to either bring them down/up a few notches. But I do both.

Whats really funny is you're one-sided. You try to play it as if you are objective, but you're not, as you simple cannot help in creating posts like you did on this one yesterday. So i chimed in...


Bring reality to the situation? What reality?

I know you think I'm tooting my own horn, but I've called this whole thing since mid-season before McAdoo was fired, consistently, including the Giants not valuing QB's as highly graded for the number 2 spot and that the org thought Eli still had something left, and I was a small minority on this site in doing so, while everybody else was speaking in absolutes... "Eli WILL be cut. Eli WILL restructure. Eli WILL be traded, Giants WILL take a QB at 2, blah, blah, blah...."

Which one ended up being reality?

And it wasn't emotion that led me to those conclusions. It was logic.
I was also one of the only ones that talked about the Giants....  
Britt in VA : 8/8/2018 7:45 am : link
taking Lauletta, and creating a QB competition with Webb while Eli continued to start. Toot toot.

And while I was wary of the Giants taking a QB at 2, I also said that I would be fine with it (every step of the way) because if they did, I know they would have conviction in taking that guy, that high.
But I guess none of that is reality.  
Britt in VA : 8/8/2018 7:46 am : link
.
RE: RE: Not really. When someone goes to the extreme  
Gatorade Dunk : 8/8/2018 7:47 am : link
In comment 14032196 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
In comment 14032195 Jimmy Googs said:


Quote:


on Eli I probably chime in and bring some reality to it to either bring them down/up a few notches. But I do both.

Whats really funny is you're one-sided. You try to play it as if you are objective, but you're not, as you simple cannot help in creating posts like you did on this one yesterday. So i chimed in...




Bring reality to the situation? What reality?

I know you think I'm tooting my own horn, but I've called this whole thing since mid-season before McAdoo was fired, consistently, including the Giants not valuing QB's as highly graded for the number 2 spot and that the org thought Eli still had something left, and I was a small minority on this site in doing so, while everybody else was speaking in absolutes... "Eli WILL be cut. Eli WILL restructure. Eli WILL be traded, Giants WILL take a QB at 2, blah, blah, blah...."

Which one ended up being reality?

And it wasn't emotion that led me to those conclusions. It was logic.

Was it also logic that caused you to post one of the most aggressive callout threads of the season last year after the Eagles game?

Yeah, you're objective.
RE: Then, once you get somebody to take the bait....  
Jimmy Googs : 8/8/2018 7:47 am : link
In comment 14032194 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
the rest of the sharks smell the chum in the water and show up.

What you don't realize is you exhibit the exact behavior that you accuse everybody else of, just the opposite stance.



Are you seeking some professional help with this stigma?
RE: RE: RE: Not really. When someone goes to the extreme  
Britt in VA : 8/8/2018 7:48 am : link
In comment 14032200 Gatorade Dunk said:
Quote:
In comment 14032196 Britt in VA said:


Quote:


In comment 14032195 Jimmy Googs said:


Quote:


on Eli I probably chime in and bring some reality to it to either bring them down/up a few notches. But I do both.

Whats really funny is you're one-sided. You try to play it as if you are objective, but you're not, as you simple cannot help in creating posts like you did on this one yesterday. So i chimed in...




Bring reality to the situation? What reality?

I know you think I'm tooting my own horn, but I've called this whole thing since mid-season before McAdoo was fired, consistently, including the Giants not valuing QB's as highly graded for the number 2 spot and that the org thought Eli still had something left, and I was a small minority on this site in doing so, while everybody else was speaking in absolutes... "Eli WILL be cut. Eli WILL restructure. Eli WILL be traded, Giants WILL take a QB at 2, blah, blah, blah...."

Which one ended up being reality?

And it wasn't emotion that led me to those conclusions. It was logic.


Was it also logic that caused you to post one of the most aggressive callout threads of the season last year after the Eagles game?

Yeah, you're objective.


Link - ( New Window )
RE: RE: RE: RE: Not really. When someone goes to the extreme  
Gatorade Dunk : 8/8/2018 7:52 am : link
In comment 14032204 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
In comment 14032200 Gatorade Dunk said:


Quote:


In comment 14032196 Britt in VA said:


Quote:


In comment 14032195 Jimmy Googs said:


Quote:


on Eli I probably chime in and bring some reality to it to either bring them down/up a few notches. But I do both.

Whats really funny is you're one-sided. You try to play it as if you are objective, but you're not, as you simple cannot help in creating posts like you did on this one yesterday. So i chimed in...




Bring reality to the situation? What reality?

I know you think I'm tooting my own horn, but I've called this whole thing since mid-season before McAdoo was fired, consistently, including the Giants not valuing QB's as highly graded for the number 2 spot and that the org thought Eli still had something left, and I was a small minority on this site in doing so, while everybody else was speaking in absolutes... "Eli WILL be cut. Eli WILL restructure. Eli WILL be traded, Giants WILL take a QB at 2, blah, blah, blah...."

Which one ended up being reality?

And it wasn't emotion that led me to those conclusions. It was logic.


Was it also logic that caused you to post one of the most aggressive callout threads of the season last year after the Eagles game?

Yeah, you're objective.

Link - ( New Window )

Look, I'm not saying that you weren't right, but to act like you've only come at the topic from a place of logic rather than emotion is a bold-faced lie.
RE: RE: Not really. When someone goes to the extreme  
Jimmy Googs : 8/8/2018 7:52 am : link
In comment 14032196 Britt in VA said:
Quote:


I know you think I'm tooting my own horn...


why would we ever think that...
RE: I get a kick out of people that need  
christian : 8/8/2018 7:55 am : link
In comment 14031980 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
to make sure they assign blame to the correct person. I donít care whoís fault any of it was. Hopefully the biggest problems are off the team. Mara getting more heat doesnít actually do anything. Whatís he going to do, sell the team out of embarrassment?


Mara doesn't need to sell the team - he needs to learn how to handle the end of the line more effectively for people who've meant a great deal to his team.

It strongly remains to be seen if Manning was the victim of or a chief contributor to the awfulness of the 2017 team. Whether now or in a few years it's in the best interest of the team to basically do the exact opposite of how he handled Coughlin, Reese, and Manning's benching.

He has the misguided notion every story has a happy ending, which has resulted in just ugliness for his organization. He's got to be the one to pull the band aid, absorb the hurt feelings then move on. Not cook up what he thinks are compromises.
RE: RE: RE: Not really. When someone goes to the extreme  
Britt in VA : 8/8/2018 7:56 am : link
In comment 14032207 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
In comment 14032196 Britt in VA said:


Quote:




I know you think I'm tooting my own horn...



why would we ever think that...


Well you know what, dude? When somebody has argued with you tooth and nail for months, fighting you every step of the way and calling you a fanboy, worshipper, etc... It's a little hard not to point it out that yeah, you had a point the whole time.

The truth is, cutting Eli was never logical. Trading Eli was never logical. Asking Eli to restructure might have been a little more reasonable, but not a slam dunk. Forcing a QB at 2 at all costs if you didn't have conviction wasn't logical.

To me, THOSE were the more emotional stances. Eli was always going to finish out his contract here barring catastrophic injury. That was always the logical take.
Before to  
crick n NC : 8/8/2018 7:59 am : link
Long BBI will add a "No Eli threads" to it's forum policy. Probably a good thing.
Too  
crick n NC : 8/8/2018 8:00 am : link
.
LOL..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 8/8/2018 8:05 am : link
This probably would be a good thing:

Quote:
Before to
crick n NC : 7:59 am : link : reply
Long BBI will add a "No Eli threads" to it's forum policy. Probably a good thing.


Which speaks more to the fact that there is a fairly large segment of the site who uses these threads to show their disdain for Eli.

I still maintain it is one of the more bizarre phenomenon you'll see.
RE: Before to  
dorgan : 8/8/2018 8:09 am : link
In comment 14032215 crick n NC said:
Quote:
Long BBI will add a "No Eli threads" to it's forum policy. Probably a good thing.



LOL! His career is on the back nine, maybe they can hold off on the ban until he's in the clubhouse.

To get back on track here: In the next few weeks we'll start to get a good idea on whether or not Webb is a keeper. It won't be a definitive, but we'll have some idea on his abilities and progress to date.
For  
crick n NC : 8/8/2018 8:10 am : link
The record
I ❤ Eli
RE: RE: Before to  
Britt in VA : 8/8/2018 8:11 am : link
In comment 14032224 dorgan said:
Quote:
In comment 14032215 crick n NC said:


Quote:


Long BBI will add a "No Eli threads" to it's forum policy. Probably a good thing.




LOL! His career is on the back nine, maybe they can hold off on the ban until he's in the clubhouse.

To get back on track here: In the next few weeks we'll start to get a good idea on whether or not Webb is a keeper. It won't be a definitive, but we'll have some idea on his abilities and progress to date.


As mentioned before, I love the dynamic of that QB room right now.

The vet in Eli, and the competition between Webb and Lauletta. Should bring out the best in everybody.
You always wonder why a player  
dep026 : 8/8/2018 8:13 am : link
Would say something that sparks controversy. This wasnít smart on Webb. I am sure he doesnít know what happened between management so to bring in laundry like this isnít smart.

Not impressed by the sound bites this guy has been giving recently.
RE: You always wonder why a player  
dorgan : 8/8/2018 8:27 am : link
In comment 14032230 dep026 said:
Quote:
Would say something that sparks controversy. This wasnít smart on Webb. I am sure he doesnít know what happened between management so to bring in laundry like this isnít smart.

Not impressed by the sound bites this guy has been giving recently.


Was he responding to a question that was specific to that situation? Regardless, it wasn't the most guarded of statements. Seems like a subject that should remain in house.
RE: It's funny....  
Jim in Tampa : 8/8/2018 8:31 am : link
In comment 14032192 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
like I said, you go from thread to thread, calling out fanboys and worshippers, unprovoked usually, and then act all offended or shocked when you get the response you're looking for.


I know this response was to "Jimmy" and not to me, but I've got to say...Unprovoked my ass! The draft has been over for months and youíre the one who canít let it go.

The day before this thread you started a thread to share a Schefter tweet about Darnold that essentially said that Darnold may or may not start this year. Of course the tweet told us nothing definitive, but your whole purpose in starting the thread was to reopen the pre-draft QB debate and state your opinion that itís a good thing the Giants didnít choose Darnold @2, because would have been a ďrisky pickĒÖall because Darnold may or may not be ready to start this year. (As if any QB the Giants chose @2 would have started game 1 with Eli still on the roster.)

Itís YOU that chose to revisit the pre-draft debate for some bizarre reason. And when QB Snacks took YOUR bait and suggested that Darnold may have been the better choice (over Barkley) he was the one who was attacked on that thread, as if HE started the thread and HE was the one who couldnít move on.

You got what you wanted. You won. Itís time to stop trying to rub other posters noses in it, just because they have a different opinion on whatís best for the Giants.
RE: RE: RE: Before to  
Jimmy Googs : 8/8/2018 8:31 am : link
In comment 14032228 Britt in VA said:
Quote:


As mentioned before, I love the dynamic of that QB room right now.

The vet in Eli, and the competition between Webb and Lauletta. Should bring out the best in everybody.


I tend to agree, particularly for the wedd and Lauletta.

Eli though has still got to show us that he can stem the declining attributes that have come out in his game for the past few seasons. And practically speaking, that is not going to come from some spark he sees in two younger QBs throwing the ball.
** Webb  
Jimmy Googs : 8/8/2018 8:31 am : link
not wedd
RE: RE: RE: RE: Before to  
Britt in VA : 8/8/2018 8:36 am : link
In comment 14032240 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
In comment 14032228 Britt in VA said:


Quote:




As mentioned before, I love the dynamic of that QB room right now.

The vet in Eli, and the competition between Webb and Lauletta. Should bring out the best in everybody.



I tend to agree, particularly for the wedd and Lauletta.

Eli though has still got to show us that he can stem the declining attributes that have come out in his game for the past few seasons. And practically speaking, that is not going to come from some spark he sees in two younger QBs throwing the ball.


No, hopefully that spark will come from a revamped offensive line (crossing my fingers for average) and a dynamic RB for the first time in a LONG time.

That said, I also feel that Manning will be a good mentor to Webb and Lauletta, contrary to the thought that he couldn't be bothered to do it.
And logical moves regarding QB should be looked at  
Jimmy Googs : 8/8/2018 8:42 am : link
as - does the team have what it needs right now to be successful, meaning can it compete for an NFL championship.

The front office kept Eli because they felt either yes he is the right guy or the right guy, in their minds, was not available to them thru another avenue. So they are waiting for Eli to show them he isn't the right guy or when another option is in their reaches.

I subscribed to the view that Eli is no longer that right guy, and that it was worth it to go down a different avenue this year. They didn't and we got a kick-ass RB instead who should be very valuable to Eli and the next guy at QB. But I am all-in on Eli, SB and the Giants to hopefully do great this year. But it doesn't mean they will, nor that going down another avenue wasn't correct...
RE: RE: RE: RE: Before to  
crick n NC : 8/8/2018 8:48 am : link
In comment 14032240 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
In comment 14032228 Britt in VA said:


Quote:




As mentioned before, I love the dynamic of that QB room right now.

The vet in Eli, and the competition between Webb and Lauletta. Should bring out the best in everybody.



I tend to agree, particularly for the wedd and Lauletta.

Eli though has still got to show us that he can stem the declining attributes that have come out in his game for the past few seasons. And practically speaking, that is not going to come from some spark he sees in two younger QBs throwing the ball.


My whole issue with Eli's declining skills is this

Age will cause any player to decline, of course not all the same. However, in Manning's case it's hard to tell how much he's lost because of his OL and the scheme from last season. Now we've had a coach like gilbride say manning hasn't lost much physically. I feel if he thought manning had lost skill he would have said things differently.
Also  
crick n NC : 8/8/2018 8:50 am : link
I feel manning hasn't lost much physically. The question is, how is head? He's been beat up for quite a few seasons now.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Before to  
Jim in Tampa : 8/8/2018 8:50 am : link
In comment 14032244 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
I also feel that Manning will be a good mentor to Webb and Lauletta, contrary to the thought that he couldn't be bothered to do it.


I don't recall anyone ever suggesting that Manning "couldn't be bothered" to mentor the young QBs. Did you read this somewhere or is this just a perceived Eli slight?
Louis Riddick's interview re Manning  
Jim in Forest Hills : 8/8/2018 8:53 am : link
talks about when he watched film on Manning the past two years, he saw a guy that didn't want to pay the price anymore. I think he's referring to what we all saw, Eli kind of ducking after throws even when pressure wasn't there. I hope he has recovered from that. Hopefully some semblance of a running game and a healthy OBJ can bring him back.

So less of a physical decline than a mental one.
RE: Louis Riddick's interview re Manning  
dep026 : 8/8/2018 9:02 am : link
In comment 14032264 Jim in Forest Hills said:
Quote:
talks about when he watched film on Manning the past two years, he saw a guy that didn't want to pay the price anymore. I think he's referring to what we all saw, Eli kind of ducking after throws even when pressure wasn't there. I hope he has recovered from that. Hopefully some semblance of a running game and a healthy OBJ can bring him back.

So less of a physical decline than a mental one.


Is there a QB who wants to pay the price when they throw?more BSPN bulkshit from their new darling Louis Riddick. I am glad he was laughed out the door in his interview.
Just a perfect example of the disaster tenure  
Jay on the Island : 8/8/2018 9:28 am : link
of Ben McAdoo. He was going to start Webb without giving him any 1st team reps in practice, with a decimated receiving corps, terrible offensive line, and no running game.
Britt s comments are indicative of  
joeinpa : 8/8/2018 9:42 am : link
Something common here. Guys get so offended by opposing points of view, they end up rooting for the other guy to be wrong as much as they root for the Giants. Lol

I wanted quarterback, hope I end up being wrong. And really hope Webb turns out to be better or as good as the guys they passed.

To me..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 8/8/2018 10:02 am : link
the flip side of this is much more prevalent:

Quote:
Britt s comments are indicative of
joeinpa : 9:42 am : link : reply
Something common here. Guys get so offended by opposing points of view, they end up rooting for the other guy to be wrong as much as they root for the Giants. Lol


I'm rooting for the Giants. I'm rooting for a 2 time SB MVP to have one more glorious run like his brother did. I'm rooting for success and to add to the 4 SB trophies.

I see much more commonly a negative take on a player, coach, owner or the team in general and then THOSE posters seemingly would rather be proven right than for the team to excel. Or they run with narratives that simply don't hold water like saying our ownership is completely incompetent.

When you have posters who will go to great lengths to minimize the impact Eli (or any specific player) had on SB wins, what possible motivation is there to do that? We won 2 SB's vs. the Pats. That's what history will remember. They won't ridiculously say we won because Asante Samuel didn't intercept a 10 foot high pass or have a panel discussion on if the D or Eli Manning played the biggest part in the win.

You still have posters who keep saying that Darnold becoming a solid QB will nullify the Barkley pick and make it a bad one regardless of how Barkley's career turns out , and I wouldn't be surprised if many of those guys hope Darnold turns out better.

As a fan, I hope rooting against negative takes comes to fruition. I don't logically see how the flip side of that should ever be true.
I see one group of people who will be very sad if Eli performs poorly  
Bill L : 8/8/2018 10:14 am : link
if, despite little to no supporting evidence (taking into account the context of the team over the past couple seasons) he really is diminishing in skills. See another group of people who, if Eli is actually successful and top-notch, will be majorly pissed off.
RE: Britt s comments are indicative of  
Bill L : 8/8/2018 10:19 am : link
In comment 14032307 joeinpa said:
Quote:
Something common here. Guys get so offended by opposing points of view, they end up rooting for the other guy to be wrong as much as they root for the Giants. Lol
...

You are in a box here. Because the guys rooting for Eli and also rooting for the other guy (Eli despisers) to be wrong, have to also be rooting for the Giants to succeed . There is coincidence in their rooting. SO, the only guys who can root for the other guy to be wrong more than rooting for the Giants, have to root for Eli (and also by extension the Giants) to fail.
RE: RE: Britt s comments are indicative of  
Britt in VA : 8/8/2018 11:46 am : link
In comment 14032346 Bill L said:
Quote:
In comment 14032307 joeinpa said:


Quote:


Something common here. Guys get so offended by opposing points of view, they end up rooting for the other guy to be wrong as much as they root for the Giants. Lol
...



You are in a box here. Because the guys rooting for Eli and also rooting for the other guy (Eli despisers) to be wrong, have to also be rooting for the Giants to succeed . There is coincidence in their rooting. SO, the only guys who can root for the other guy to be wrong more than rooting for the Giants, have to root for Eli (and also by extension the Giants) to fail.


Exactly. Rooting for Eli IS rooting for the Giants.
RE: To me..  
Britt in VA : 8/8/2018 11:47 am : link
In comment 14032329 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
the flip side of this is much more prevalent:



Quote:


Britt s comments are indicative of
joeinpa : 9:42 am : link : reply
Something common here. Guys get so offended by opposing points of view, they end up rooting for the other guy to be wrong as much as they root for the Giants. Lol



I'm rooting for the Giants. I'm rooting for a 2 time SB MVP to have one more glorious run like his brother did. I'm rooting for success and to add to the 4 SB trophies.

I see much more commonly a negative take on a player, coach, owner or the team in general and then THOSE posters seemingly would rather be proven right than for the team to excel. Or they run with narratives that simply don't hold water like saying our ownership is completely incompetent.

When you have posters who will go to great lengths to minimize the impact Eli (or any specific player) had on SB wins, what possible motivation is there to do that? We won 2 SB's vs. the Pats. That's what history will remember. They won't ridiculously say we won because Asante Samuel didn't intercept a 10 foot high pass or have a panel discussion on if the D or Eli Manning played the biggest part in the win.

You still have posters who keep saying that Darnold becoming a solid QB will nullify the Barkley pick and make it a bad one regardless of how Barkley's career turns out , and I wouldn't be surprised if many of those guys hope Darnold turns out better.

As a fan, I hope rooting against negative takes comes to fruition. I don't logically see how the flip side of that should ever be true.


Sort of like the chicken and the egg.

In this case, on a Giants site, there had to be a reason for a staunch defense of the QB in the first place, didn't there?
"Rooting" vs. understanding  
Go Terps : 8/8/2018 12:17 pm : link
We're all rooting for the Giants. Who cares?

I'm interested in trying to understand what's actually happening and what needs to happen in order for this bad team to improve - a concept that sometimes runs counter to "rooting for the Giants".

The first time I can recall seeing the "rooting vs. reality" separation on BBI was Lavar Arrington. When he was in Washington that guy was (correctly) viewed as an overrated joke. But then when we got him all of a sudden the view started to change to where he was a really good player. Absolutely ridiculous, and a window into which BBI opinions were actually worth something and which weren't worth reading.

Or take the Barkley pick. We'll all be rooting for him - I personally can't wait to watch him play and hope the whole offense revolves around him. But since he was picked I have seen arguments how it can be just as difficult to draft a good running back later in the draft as it is a quarterback - that is something that was NEVER said anywhere before we selected him. Many posters bent (and continue to bend) reality to fit the narrative that the Giants are doing a good job.

There isn't a bigger fan of Eli Manning here than me. I backed him on BBI when most of the posters here wanted him gone in 2006-2007. But being a fan of his doesn't change the fundamental facts of his age and cost vs. the opportunity we had to drastically reduce both those metrics with a top prospect during this past draft. I want Eli to be the QB for the next 40 years. That's not reality, and that kind of thinking doesn't help my understanding of what's actually happening.

I don't care about who anyone roots for. When we start coloring our understanding of the game (or anything in life) with what we actually want to have happen, we reduce the value of our understanding.

Shit, you may not believe me but I root for Beckham to do well for this team. But who gives a shit what I root for?
They didn't do what I might've done,  
Dave in Hoboken : 8/8/2018 12:19 pm : link
but I'm still a Giants fan and have been since 1990 and I'm not going to stop rooting for them or root for them to fail because I had a difference of opinion from the GM. I hope we go 16-0 and win it all this year, just like every year. That'll never change.
about understanding....  
Britt in VA : 8/8/2018 12:28 pm : link
Quote:
There isn't a bigger fan of Eli Manning here than me. I backed him on BBI when most of the posters here wanted him gone in 2006-2007. But being a fan of his doesn't change the fundamental facts of his age and cost vs. the opportunity we had to drastically reduce both those metrics with a top prospect during this past draft. I want Eli to be the QB for the next 40 years. That's not reality, and that kind of thinking doesn't help my understanding of what's actually happening.

I don't care about who anyone roots for. When we start coloring our understanding of the game (or anything in life) with what we actually want to have happen, we reduce the value of our understanding.


What about when the belief of management aligns with your view on the situation? It's not just conjecture on a message board, these are the guys who are paid millions to make the decision, and their jobs rely on being right.

You believe that Eli's age and cost are prohibitive while the people in charge believe those things are not prohibitive to building a winning team, and that the current QB can be part of it. Is there understanding being colored?

Not a smartass question, I just seriously wonder. In your mind, do you stand by what you say and therefore believe they are wrong? Which is fine, but I don't know how you can say one side has understanding while the other does not.
their understanding.  
Britt in VA : 8/8/2018 12:29 pm : link
.
And maybe I didn't state that well, but correct me if I'm wrong....  
Britt in VA : 8/8/2018 12:31 pm : link
basically, you are saying that the Giants can't build a winning squad with Eli because he is too old and cost prohibitive to do so.

And anybody that doesn't align with that, including management, doesn't have as good of an understanding of the situation?
Britt  
Go Terps : 8/8/2018 12:37 pm : link
That's not what I'm saying at all. I'm not saying that I have an understanding and someone else doesn't.

I'm saying that what we are rooting for is irrelevant to any good discussion here. I'm saying that if we want to have good football conversations it's important to check what we're rooting for at the door.
the last several years  
PaulBlakeTSU : 8/8/2018 12:41 pm : link
Eli has made chicken shit out of chicken shit. The question I have been asking every year is: what quarterback is making chicken salad out of it, let alone coq au vin?

The only ones I could come up with were Aaron Rodgers and Russell Wilson and that is because they have exceptional scrambling ability.

I don't even think Brady would have looked good behind this line with this run game and carousel of WRs and TEs. I think back to that Chiefs game where the Chiefs D-line got instant pressure all game, he was terrible, and all the pundits said he was "done." Well, they fixed the line, gave him time to throw, Belichick put everyone in a position to succeed, and they were great the rest of the way.

But that pressure that Brady saw every play with that caused him to look like he had nothing left in the tank? That's what Eli has dealt with seemingly every game for the last several years, except with also a nonexistent run game.

Last year was an abomination of injuries. Even still, I don't know how to properly evaluate Eli when he has had zero time to throw against a defense that got pressure with four linemen and never concerned itself with getting beat on the ground.
RE: Britt  
Britt in VA : 8/8/2018 12:47 pm : link
In comment 14032483 Go Terps said:
Quote:
That's not what I'm saying at all. I'm not saying that I have an understanding and someone else doesn't.

I'm saying that what we are rooting for is irrelevant to any good discussion here. I'm saying that if we want to have good football conversations it's important to check what we're rooting for at the door.


Well, since we're all seemingly rooting for the same thing (hopefully the Giants winning), then I would think checking that at the door would be irrelevant to good discussion, because we're still all going to have different ideas of how the Giants get there, for instance QB vs. RB at #2 overall.
And I guess in re-reading that's what you are saying....  
Britt in VA : 8/8/2018 12:53 pm : link
but differing opinions on how to get there are exactly how you create good discussions, even if they become abrasive I guess.

It's the namecalling, labeling, and such that degrades good discussion. I'm guilty of it from time to time, too.
RE: I see one group of people who will be very sad if Eli performs poorly  
NYG07 : 8/8/2018 1:06 pm : link
In comment 14032339 Bill L said:
Quote:
if, despite little to no supporting evidence (taking into account the context of the team over the past couple seasons) he really is diminishing in skills. See another group of people who, if Eli is actually successful and top-notch, will be majorly pissed off.


I don't agree with this. I was heavily involved in these debates near the end of last season and into the offseason, siding with those that thought it was time to move on from Manning. Aside from maybe a couple people, we are not actively rooting for him to fail.

Also, to say there little to no supporting evidence of declining skills is not true. He had no running game and a terrible offensive line in 2014 and 2015 too, yet was far better than he was in 2016 and 2017. You can blame it entirely on McAdoo's scheme if you want, but there is at least some very real evidence.

I am not saying he can't succeed this year if the line holds and the running game is much improved, but to read comments like Eli will unquestionably be the starter for the next 2-3 years is the same thing as someone on the other side saying he is garbage and will be benched by week 3.

I can't imagine a sadder situation  
Jim in Forest Hills : 8/8/2018 1:08 pm : link
then watching a Giants game, seeing someone succeed or fail and then say to yourself "I was effing right! Joe Blow was effing wrong! Wait till I tell him on Monday!"
RE: I get a kick out of people that need  
djm : 8/8/2018 1:35 pm : link
In comment 14031980 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
to make sure they assign blame to the correct person. I donít care whoís fault any of it was. Hopefully the biggest problems are off the team. Mara getting more heat doesnít actually do anything. Whatís he going to do, sell the team out of embarrassment?


I love the Maraís or the family ownership here. I just think Mara should have asserted himself more (or less?) back when the NYG PR was as bad as its ever been. I donít want anyone drawn and quartered or held accountable I just donít want that shit to ever happen again here. Hopefully John learned a lesson. And hopefully he never hires a guy based on horse crap nostalgia and or the candidateís interview prowess.

Eli is a qb that needs SOME things to be right in the offense. He doesnít need 99 Rams to make things work but he wonít be able to elevate chicken shit into chicken marsala. There are some Eli bashers and Eli defenders alike that donít see this.

Eli will be the least of out problems this season. Just like he was the least of our problems last season. Just about every qb going would have gone down with the nyg good ship lollipop in 2017. Maybe a guy like Watson or Brady or Wilson or Rodgers would have helped the team win more games. Certainly possible, perhaps probable. But just about every qb going needs a structured and sound offense in order to thrive. Thatís how the Nfl works. Mcadoo not only constructed and conducted a broken offense he never ever ever adjusted. Eli is a bit of a stiff qb that canít hide a bad offense. It was a recipe for disaster.
And cmon guys  
djm : 8/8/2018 1:40 pm : link
Donít sit here and ignore history. Every time the giants offense had at least some semblance of a running game, Eli delivered. Every. Single. Time! But now all of a sudden Eli is shot? Really? The giants coaching staff, GM and owner all are blinded by loyalty and love and refuse to see that Eli canít play anymore ? These same scouts and coaches and GM they are obsessed with winning all donít care about wins and losses they just want to appease John Mara? And Mara doesnít care either is that it?

Fun take. Itís horse shit rooted in some grassy knoll bullshit but hey, whatever keeps you going I guess.
RE: And cmon guys  
Les in TO : 8/8/2018 2:00 pm : link
In comment 14032538 djm said:
Quote:
Donít sit here and ignore history. Every time the giants offense had at least some semblance of a running game, Eli delivered. Every. Single. Time! But now all of a sudden Eli is shot? Really? The giants coaching staff, GM and owner all are blinded by loyalty and love and refuse to see that Eli canít play anymore ? These same scouts and coaches and GM they are obsessed with winning all donít care about wins and losses they just want to appease John Mara? And Mara doesnít care either is that it?

Fun take. Itís horse shit rooted in some grassy knoll bullshit but hey, whatever keeps you going I guess.
let's fact check that "every single time" opinion. The Giants had top 10 rushing attacks in 2005, 2006, 2008 and 2010 and were middle of the pack in 2009. How many playoff wins did we have in those five years where we had a semblance of a running game? How did Eli look in his playoff appearances in 2005, 2006 and 2008 when he had peak Tiki and Jacobs/Bradshaw/Ward behind a solid offensive line?
Honestly..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 8/8/2018 2:15 pm : link
why would you even ask about doing this exercise?? Is there a point made in trying to lay blame at peak Eli??

Quote:
How did Eli look in his playoff appearances in 2005, 2006 and 2008 when he had peak Tiki and Jacobs/Bradshaw/Ward behind a solid offensive line?


Eli had 2 SB's. One in the middle of that period and the other a few years later. In 2005 we won the division and trotted out 3 LB's that were literally on the street the week before. I was asked to play and politely declined to attend a sale on whitewall tires.

2006, Eli played decently and we lost a close game. The team was 8-8 and was in the bottom of the league in injuries. He didn't look bad in that game.

In 2008, that's an entire season of potential that was knee-capped. Literally.

Eli played terrible, but the offense after Plax was out wasn't good. The starting WR's were Hixon and Steve Smith.

so basically, in two games Eli looked bad, the team was missing key pieces and in the other game, he looked decent.

But again - why does this even have to be refuted?
RE: RE: And cmon guys  
dep026 : 8/8/2018 2:16 pm : link
In comment 14032557 Les in TO said:
Quote:
In comment 14032538 djm said:


Quote:


Donít sit here and ignore history. Every time the giants offense had at least some semblance of a running game, Eli delivered. Every. Single. Time! But now all of a sudden Eli is shot? Really? The giants coaching staff, GM and owner all are blinded by loyalty and love and refuse to see that Eli canít play anymore ? These same scouts and coaches and GM they are obsessed with winning all donít care about wins and losses they just want to appease John Mara? And Mara doesnít care either is that it?

Fun take. Itís horse shit rooted in some grassy knoll bullshit but hey, whatever keeps you going I guess.

let's fact check that "every single time" opinion. The Giants had top 10 rushing attacks in 2005, 2006, 2008 and 2010 and were middle of the pack in 2009. How many playoff wins did we have in those five years where we had a semblance of a running game? How did Eli look in his playoff appearances in 2005, 2006 and 2008 when he had peak Tiki and Jacobs/Bradshaw/Ward behind a solid offensive line?


We made the playoffs 3 of those 4 years. And between some poor play, injuries, and some guys almost shooting their nuts off... the seasons didnít end the way we wanted too.

But hey letís remember those years instead of 07 and 11. Itís funny how you openly root against Eli at this point.
Les  
djm : 8/8/2018 2:34 pm : link
So itís playoff wins or bust? Eli plays well or at least plays well enough to help the offense flourish if the running game is sound. This is a fact. Sometimes heís played well even when the running game isnít so sound. By the way he also led this team to two frigging super bowl titles. Do we ignore those seasons? Wtf.

Youíre a tough critic. Iím sure you will be as forgiving when the next nyg qb comes along and struggles all the time rather than occasionally, like Eli has.
Itís like well unless he wins playoff games  
dep026 : 8/8/2018 2:39 pm : link
Nothing else matters. But he has won playoff games. More so than he lost as well!

And last time I checked if winning playoff games is important.. whatís more important than winning the SB?
RE: Honestly..  
Les in TO : 8/8/2018 2:44 pm : link
In comment 14032566 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
why would you even ask about doing this exercise?? Is there a point made in trying to lay blame at peak Eli??



Quote:


How did Eli look in his playoff appearances in 2005, 2006 and 2008 when he had peak Tiki and Jacobs/Bradshaw/Ward behind a solid offensive line?



Eli had 2 SB's. One in the middle of that period and the other a few years later. In 2005 we won the division and trotted out 3 LB's that were literally on the street the week before. I was asked to play and politely declined to attend a sale on whitewall tires.

2006, Eli played decently and we lost a close game. The team was 8-8 and was in the bottom of the league in injuries. He didn't look bad in that game.

In 2008, that's an entire season of potential that was knee-capped. Literally.

Eli played terrible, but the offense after Plax was out wasn't good. The starting WR's were Hixon and Steve Smith.

so basically, in two games Eli looked bad, the team was missing key pieces and in the other game, he looked decent.

But again - why does this even have to be refuted?
djm stated that all Eli needs is a semblance of a running game and he delivers ďevery single timeĒ. That absolute statement is false. In the 2005 playoff game the Giants were shutout. Last time I checked linebackers play defense, not offense and the injuries to the LBswere no excuse for laying a goose egg on offense. The Giants needed Eli to have a big game and keep the depleted defense off the field but he crapped the bed. In 2006 Eli played ok but despite Tiki having a massive game they only put up 20. In 2008 Eli played like crap despite having a potent running attack. So no, a running game does not mean Eli will deliver.
subtle, very subtle  
Rocky369 : 8/8/2018 2:45 pm : link
In comment 14032566 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
I was asked to play and politely declined to attend a sale on whitewall tires.
you could say it was a leg thing, or a spiritual thing, or a psychological thing, or a heart attack.
Nopw there's a guy who will beat his dog if Eli plays great this seaso  
Bill L : 8/8/2018 2:47 pm : link
.
Funny is that Les cites 2005-2011 as some bad times for Eli....  
Britt in VA : 8/8/2018 2:47 pm : link
yet we made the playoffs 5-7 years and won two championships.

Not good or consistent enough for ol' Les.

He even cites the good offensive line play... We agree on one thing, Les: Good offensive line 2005-2011 equals 5 playoff appearances and two championships. 2012-2017 Bad offensive line equals one playoff appearance and no playoff wins.
Les..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 8/8/2018 2:49 pm : link
not having LB's meant we didn't have the ball.

In the 2005 game to Carolina, we had 41 yards rushing on 13 attempts. We ran 31 total offensive plays.

By contrast, the Panthers ran the ball 45 times and held a 43 to 17 advantage in TOP!! They had 30% more rushing plays then we had total plays.

Exactly how can you claim the Giants had a running game that day?
lol.  
Britt in VA : 8/8/2018 2:51 pm : link
.
Les  
djm : 8/8/2018 2:51 pm : link
You can extract your pound of flesh all you want. And you can revel and dance when a new qb is playing for nyg. And then you will kill that qb for another decade or less. Iíve seen fans like you before. Iím sure you just loved phil Simms when he played. Not after he retired, but during his career...
RE: Les..  
dep026 : 8/8/2018 2:51 pm : link
In comment 14032612 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
not having LB's meant we didn't have the ball.

In the 2005 game to Carolina, we had 41 yards rushing on 13 attempts. We ran 31 total offensive plays.

By contrast, the Panthers ran the ball 45 times and held a 43 to 17 advantage in TOP!! They had 30% more rushing plays then we had total plays.

Exactly how can you claim the Giants had a running game that day?


Doesnít fit his narrative.
Eli isnít perfect  
djm : 8/8/2018 2:55 pm : link
But he gives the giants a legit shot if the team is capable around him. If you think thatís an easy commodity to come by who am I to tell you youíre wrong. I disagree but maybe Iím the fool. All I know is Iíve been watching this team closely for over 35 years and can say with certainty that Eli is the best nyg qb ever. Fans that bash this guy all the time are nuts.
RE: Les..  
Les in TO : 8/8/2018 2:56 pm : link
In comment 14032612 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
not having LB's meant we didn't have the ball.

In the 2005 game to Carolina, we had 41 yards rushing on 13 attempts. We ran 31 total offensive plays.

By contrast, the Panthers ran the ball 45 times and held a 43 to 17 advantage in TOP!! They had 30% more rushing plays then we had total plays.

Exactly how can you claim the Giants had a running game that day?
when the giants did have the ball on offense, instead of giving their defense a breather by sustaining drives or narrowing the deficit, they did nothing. eli turned the ball over 4 times and threw for a measley 113 yards.
RE: RE: Louis Riddick's interview re Manning  
Ten Ton Hammer : 8/8/2018 2:57 pm : link
In comment 14032269 dep026 said:
Quote:
In comment 14032264 Jim in Forest Hills said:


Quote:


talks about when he watched film on Manning the past two years, he saw a guy that didn't want to pay the price anymore. I think he's referring to what we all saw, Eli kind of ducking after throws even when pressure wasn't there. I hope he has recovered from that. Hopefully some semblance of a running game and a healthy OBJ can bring him back.

So less of a physical decline than a mental one.



Is there a QB who wants to pay the price when they throw?more BSPN bulkshit from their new darling Louis Riddick. I am glad he was laughed out the door in his interview.


There's a pretty good example of what he's talking about in the 2011 playoff game at San Fran.

Also, in 2006....  
Britt in VA : 8/8/2018 2:57 pm : link
Didn't Eli lead a long, game tying drive with under 2 minutes to play, after which Jeff Garcia dinked and dunked down the field to let David Akers kick the game winner as time expired?
We weren't..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 8/8/2018 3:01 pm : link
winning the Panthers game. It would be like throwing any individual player under the bus for barely crossing midfield in the '85 loss to the Bears:

Quote:
when the giants did have the ball on offense, instead of giving their defense a breather by sustaining drives or narrowing the deficit, they did nothing. eli turned the ball over 4 times and threw for a measley 113 yards


Eli played terribly. Three guys who probably never played another NFL game allowed the Panthers to have free reign in the middle of the field. The Panthers, again with gusto, had 30% more rushing attempts than we had total plays. Don't minimize the magnitude of that stat. We weren't winning that game if Aaron Rodgers played.
Actually, excuse me, just looked it up....  
Britt in VA : 8/8/2018 3:03 pm : link
The Giants tied the score with 5 minutes left to play, on a 13 play, 80 yard TD drive including 3 third down conversions, including one on a series that started 1st and 30.

Five minutes remained in the game, and the offense never got the ball again. Garcia and Westbrook ran the clock all the way down to zero and Akers kicked the walkoff game winner.
And again..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 8/8/2018 3:03 pm : link
the questions begs itself:

Why are we answering this type of question? What point are you trying to get at? That Eli has never lost a playoff game or something?

It is bizarre that a giants fan wants to point out playoff losses with the implied commentary that the QB ws the reason behind it.
RE: We weren't..  
Les in TO : 8/8/2018 3:05 pm : link
In comment 14032638 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
winning the Panthers game. It would be like throwing any individual player under the bus for barely crossing midfield in the '85 loss to the Bears:



Quote:


when the giants did have the ball on offense, instead of giving their defense a breather by sustaining drives or narrowing the deficit, they did nothing. eli turned the ball over 4 times and threw for a measley 113 yards



Eli played terribly. Three guys who probably never played another NFL game allowed the Panthers to have free reign in the middle of the field. The Panthers, again with gusto, had 30% more rushing attempts than we had total plays. Don't minimize the magnitude of that stat. We weren't winning that game if Aaron Rodgers played.
agree that we were likely not winning and would struggle on defense. but I and many others were surprised we lay down so easily and were shut out.
We laid down..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 8/8/2018 3:09 pm : link
easily because we ran a total of 31 plays and had the ball for 17 minutes. Tiki was the only RB to touch the ball.

I hate to sound like a broken record, but the Panthers had more rushing plays than we had total plays.

That isn't laying down, it is being dominated by a team who didn't have an entire unit out from injury.
Dude  
djm : 8/8/2018 3:12 pm : link
He had a bad game ! Move on ! Didnít Eli completely redeem himself by enabling giants fans to sit down with Dallas and packer fans and feel like as actually belong in the same room with them?

When I play poker with 3 idiot dallas fans i donít have to say a fucking word. Thatís why i love Eli.
I mean  
djm : 8/8/2018 3:17 pm : link
He the hell can a giants fan still focus any negative energy towards 2005??? Am I taking stupid pills?

2005 is a fun little season that led to the greatest moment in Nfl history. Get the hell over 23-0 already.

Jared Goff has had an eerily similar start to his career as Eli. He was a mess as a rookie then played very well in year two but got his ass kicked in the playoff game. I wonder if Les thinks Goff is hot garbage too. Iíd take Goff in a heartbeat.
RE: I mean  
Les in TO : 8/8/2018 3:55 pm : link
In comment 14032666 djm said:
Quote:
He the hell can a giants fan still focus any negative energy towards 2005??? Am I taking stupid pills?

2005 is a fun little season that led to the greatest moment in Nfl history. Get the hell over 23-0 already.

it goes beyond 2005, djm. I mentioned several other years where we had a top 10 running game and either missed the playoffs or were eliminated in the wild card, twice with absolutely awful performances by Eli (2005 and 2008). I hardly call that delivering when he had a running game every single time as you claimed. and it's why, this season, even with a high ceiling running back touched by the hand of God and investments in the offensive line, I'm far from convinced that we are going to have a winning record or advance beyond the first round of the playoffs.

I don't expect a super bowl victory every season as the standard for whether or not a QB "delivered". in 2002, the Giants lost in the awful wild card game against san Francisco. but that was not due to Kerry Collins. he was excellent,leading the giants in putting up 38 points, and if not for a terrible shockey drop and a botched call by the officials, it was likely a victory and a score in the 40s.
I rather 2 SB wins in 15 years  
dep026 : 8/8/2018 5:10 pm : link
Than O SBs and a few playoffs wins.

Ask dan Marino or Jim Kelly if they would give back a few playoff wins if it means a SB or 2.
But again..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 8/8/2018 5:24 pm : link
what are you really arguing?

Quote:
I don't expect a super bowl victory every season as the standard for whether or not a QB "delivered". in 2002, the Giants lost in the awful wild card game against san Francisco. but that was not due to Kerry Collins. he was excellent,leading the giants in putting up 38 points, and if not for a terrible shockey drop and a botched call by the officials, it was likely a victory and a score in the 40s.


Eli Manning has 2 SB MVP's. He delivered then. And you are using examples from 2005, 2006 and 2008 to say he didn't deliver? So what. Nobody is saying the guy is the best QB ever, even though great ones like Brady and Rodgers even have some clunker playoff games and losses in playoff games.

Eli's been part of 2 SB winners. Are the losses to show he isn't perfect? Who is actually saying that?

You aren't refuting any preconceived notions or arguments here. You are basically doing what you often do - entering a thread and calling people fanboys while pointing out Eli's negative play. And the question remains each time - Why?
RE: RE: I mean  
Mr. Bungle : 8/8/2018 6:18 pm : link
In comment 14032685 Les in TO said:
Quote:
I don't expect a super bowl victory every season as the standard for whether or not a QB "delivered". in 2002, the Giants lost in the awful wild card game against san Francisco. but that was not due to Kerry Collins. he was excellent,leading the giants in putting up 38 points.

How did Kerry Collins deliver in Super Bowl 35?
RE: RE: RE: I mean  
Britt in VA : 8/8/2018 6:57 pm : link
In comment 14032826 Mr. Bungle said:
Quote:
In comment 14032685 Les in TO said:


Quote:


I don't expect a super bowl victory every season as the standard for whether or not a QB "delivered". in 2002, the Giants lost in the awful wild card game against san Francisco. but that was not due to Kerry Collins. he was excellent,leading the giants in putting up 38 points.


How did Kerry Collins deliver in Super Bowl 35?


Ouch.
It's puzzling  
DieHard : 8/8/2018 7:17 pm : link
I've always said, Eli is a Rorschach test. You can see what you want to see, whether it's the clutch performances and moxie, or the inconsistency and non-playoff seasons. But if we're going by the criterion that Eli isn't good because he doesn't consistently deliver, well, OK. As FatMan said, unless you have Brady under center (and even he's not exempt from bad games), you can say the same about just about every other QB, which means that it's not a helpful yardstick.

Anyway, we're somehow conflating two arguments here: what's best at QB for the Giants moving forward (which is a valid debate) and the idea that Eli doesn't deserve the accolades his "fanboys" lavish on him. And for the latter, what's the point? To prove that a player on your favorite team isn't as accomplished as other fans think he is? To prove that certain fans can be a little bit irrational about their favorite players? Whatever floats your boat, I guess. Anyway, is it so unusual or horrific to be a steadfast fan of a player that has brought you great memories, even if you end up overrating his value? Don't see how that's any worse than over-emphasizing the times a player failed to deliver compared to when, you know, he did it. All the way. Twice.
Kerry Collins and the most overrated nyg offense ever  
djm : 8/8/2018 7:33 pm : link
2002.

Great. Want to go back on that season game by game and see how wonderful Kerry Collins truly was? Spoiler alertó he was the very embodiment of average. Tiki, shockey and toomer were brilliant that season save for a few too many tiki fumbles. Collins was a caretaker who hitched a ride. Good for him. Heís no Eli Manning.
Why are we digging back to 2005 to discuss Eli Manning?  
Ten Ton Hammer : 8/8/2018 7:41 pm : link
What is it you're trying to achieve here?
RE: Why are we digging back to 2005 to discuss Eli Manning?  
dep026 : 8/8/2018 8:00 pm : link
In comment 14032864 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
What is it you're trying to achieve here?


A point. No one knows what it is yet though...
...  
christian : 8/8/2018 8:00 pm : link
Terps -- great posts and solid perspective.

For me (not that anyone should really care), it's great to learn more about the game, bounce ideas, form perspectives, and take that knowledge into how I watch the game. Football is immensely more enjoyable for me because of BBI.

I learned when I was a kid and my "favorite" player Phil Simms got hurt and some dude I didn't even know who looked like Burt Reynolds to me took the team to the mountain top, that I rooted for the laundry not the player. 25 was just as exciting as any of the others.

As a middle aged guy, I hope I am wise enough to understand it's still the same game and same pleasure to enjoy the team winning, regardless of the characters in the laundry. I don't love knowing some of them are jerks, but it doesn't make (much) of a difference if the guy who scores is my "favorite" or an asshole 23-year-old I don't know much about.

The only thing I kind of cringe at during these discussions is when it turns into a pissing match of I was right you are wrong and I'm going to enjoy beating my chest because I essentially guessed the outcome. That's a weird take to me.
RE: But again..  
Les in TO : 8/8/2018 8:23 pm : link
In comment 14032800 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
what are you really arguing?



Quote:


I don't expect a super bowl victory every season as the standard for whether or not a QB "delivered". in 2002, the Giants lost in the awful wild card game against san Francisco. but that was not due to Kerry Collins. he was excellent,leading the giants in putting up 38 points, and if not for a terrible shockey drop and a botched call by the officials, it was likely a victory and a score in the 40s.



Eli Manning has 2 SB MVP's. He delivered then. And you are using examples from 2005, 2006 and 2008 to say he didn't deliver? So what. Nobody is saying the guy is the best QB ever, even though great ones like Brady and Rodgers even have some clunker playoff games and losses in playoff games.

Eli's been part of 2 SB winners. Are the losses to show he isn't perfect? Who is actually saying that?

You aren't refuting any preconceived notions or arguments here. You are basically doing what you often do - entering a thread and calling people fanboys while pointing out Eli's negative play. And the question remains each time - Why?
why? Because when people make false absolute statements like Eli delivers when he has a semblance of a running game every single time, I feel the need to point out the strong evidence to the contrary. He has delivered some major duds, even with strong supporting casts.
RE: RE: RE: RE: I mean  
Gatorade Dunk : 8/8/2018 8:30 pm : link
In comment 14032849 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
In comment 14032826 Mr. Bungle said:


Quote:


In comment 14032685 Les in TO said:


Quote:


I don't expect a super bowl victory every season as the standard for whether or not a QB "delivered". in 2002, the Giants lost in the awful wild card game against san Francisco. but that was not due to Kerry Collins. he was excellent,leading the giants in putting up 38 points.


How did Kerry Collins deliver in Super Bowl 35?



Ouch.

See, that loss should burn you. But it doesn't, because you're an Eli fan above a Giants fan. And that's just as weird a dynamic as those who you seem to think are rooting against #10. It's actually really bizarre.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: I mean  
Giantfan in skinland : 8/8/2018 8:51 pm : link
In comment 14032914 Gatorade Dunk said:
Quote:
In comment 14032849 Britt in VA said:


Quote:


In comment 14032826 Mr. Bungle said:


Quote:


In comment 14032685 Les in TO said:


Quote:


I don't expect a super bowl victory every season as the standard for whether or not a QB "delivered". in 2002, the Giants lost in the awful wild card game against san Francisco. but that was not due to Kerry Collins. he was excellent,leading the giants in putting up 38 points.


How did Kerry Collins deliver in Super Bowl 35?



Ouch.


See, that loss should burn you. But it doesn't, because you're an Eli fan above a Giants fan. And that's just as weird a dynamic as those who you seem to think are rooting against #10. It's actually really bizarre.


Or....That loss and some really other terrible ones burned many of us for long time. Right up until Eli Manning erased it with an incredible playoff run ending in the most amazing thing I've ever watched as a sports fan. So yeah...am I an Eli Fanboy? You bet your ass I am. Better question is why aren't you?
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: I mean  
Britt in VA : 8/8/2018 11:26 pm : link
In comment 14032914 Gatorade Dunk said:
Quote:
In comment 14032849 Britt in VA said:


Quote:


In comment 14032826 Mr. Bungle said:


Quote:


In comment 14032685 Les in TO said:


Quote:


I don't expect a super bowl victory every season as the standard for whether or not a QB "delivered". in 2002, the Giants lost in the awful wild card game against san Francisco. but that was not due to Kerry Collins. he was excellent,leading the giants in putting up 38 points.


How did Kerry Collins deliver in Super Bowl 35?



Ouch.


See, that loss should burn you. But it doesn't, because you're an Eli fan above a Giants fan. And that's just as weird a dynamic as those who you seem to think are rooting against #10. It's actually really bizarre.


You're god damned right that loss burned me. Are you kidding? It didn't because I'm an Eli fanboy? I didn't even know who Eli was when that loss happened. I can picture everything about that loss like yesterday, can you? I was just starting to date my now wife, and I made an ass of myself by smashing a bottle of champagne that we had bought earlier that day in case the Giants won against a brick wall outside her and her roommates apartment. I watched the 4th quarter by myself in her bedroom, drunk and angry. I jokingly (but seriously) boycotted Eddy's Ice Cream for a year because they had a Ravens Championship flavor.

And interestingly enough, I loved Kerry Collins! I was, I guess, a Kerry Collins fanboy by today's standards. I would have even been fine drafting Gallery (at the time) and passing on Eli... Can you imagine that?
I also had a Kerry Collins jersey.  
Britt in VA : 8/8/2018 11:27 pm : link
.
I'm a fan of the quarterback of the New York Giants.  
Britt in VA : 8/8/2018 11:28 pm : link
Especially a successful one.
Nothing ever changes in this circle-jerk debate  
Jimmy Googs : 8/9/2018 12:14 am : link
including the participants.

Hoping Eli and Giants have a successful year...




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