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For draft QB guy, Webbs performance stung

joeinpa : 8/10/2018 7:49 am
I wanted a quarterback, not because I believed Eli was done, but because of the importance of that position going forward.

Wanting a quarterback even as a Penn State fan, I was disappointed in the Giants pick.

I rationalized by accepting the premise that the quarterbacks coming out, just weren't worth that value, although Mayfield was pretty impressive last night.

I also believed the Giants wouldn't pass on a quarterback out of loyalty to Eli, and that maybe they believed Webb was just as good a prospect.

Last night being his first extended action, I don t think it s an overreaction for fans to watch and think, "What the hell?"

Regardless of what shills like Paul Dottino say, you need more than a great attitude and work ethic to be an NFL quarterback.

Hopefully it was first game jitters. But the speed of a game is much different than practice, and last night he looked overwhelmed.

And yes, I m one of those guys that will be upset, if Darnold flashes tonight like Mayfield did.

And if you re honest it will bother some of you too.


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No  
crick n NC : 8/10/2018 7:54 am : link
Because Webb was not the reason the giants did not take a qb. Besides, it takes a lot longer to see if someone is cut out for this league. A simple flash in an exhibition game? Some players can look good for a whole season then crumble. Let's not decide the future since we have no idea
Really??  
FatMan in Charlotte : 8/10/2018 7:56 am : link
I actually came away impressed with Lauletta, but again it is only preseason.

You know who actually impressed me the most last night? Barkley. Everyone knew he was getting the first touch and he took it 40 yards.

Not sure how Darnold plays would take away from that, but I'm never ceased to be amazed by what narratives people create.
^^^^  
Tuckrule : 8/10/2018 7:57 am : link
I agree with this. Amazes me what people choose to see and not see. On the contrary Webb looked very good vs the pats last preseason. Lets not overreact to a quarter of football
No it will not bother me  
GeorgeAdams33 : 8/10/2018 7:59 am : link
I am happy to have Eli starting for us for the rest of his career. He looks great and we don't need to replace him. Barkley is more valuable to us than a backup QB. We have a chance to win another trophy.
if he had gone 30-35  
Peter from NH (formerly CT) : 8/10/2018 8:01 am : link
for 270 and two TDs, people who wanted a QB would be saying, "it's only one preseason game against backups" etc, etc.

He didn't play well. He wasn't particularly helped by his receivers either.

A lot of QBs don't play well in their first extended action. Guy threw the ball high and was clearly amped up. That has not been the case in training camp. He clearly has the arm talent. Now we have to see if the game slows down for him. We forget how bad Eli looked at the beginning of his career.

Time will tell.
I am more worried about the depth  
Peter from NH (formerly CT) : 8/10/2018 8:05 am : link
of our receiving corp. I didn't see great hands or separation last night.
Decent crop in next year's draft  
jeff57 : 8/10/2018 8:07 am : link
Probably not as good as this year's, but more to choose from.
RE: No  
jeff57 : 8/10/2018 8:08 am : link
In comment 14034881 crick n NC said:
Quote:
Because Webb was not the reason the giants did not take a qb. Besides, it takes a lot longer to see if someone is cut out for this league. A simple flash in an exhibition game? Some players can look good for a whole season then crumble. Let's not decide the future since we have no idea

Between last year's and this year's performances, I think there's enough to say he's not a starting NFL QB.
I was talking  
crick n NC : 8/10/2018 8:10 am : link
About the OP saying it would sting if darnold flashed. Webb has a lot of work to do obviously. The problems are in his brain.
RE: Decent crop in next year's draft  
Jim in Tampa : 8/10/2018 8:11 am : link
In comment 14034899 jeff57 said:
Quote:
Probably not as good as this year's, but more to choose from.


Are you saying that the "QB crop" will be decent in the upcoming draft? Because from all I've read, it's considered to be a below average group.

Which QB or QBs available next year do you think will be "decent"?
Lauletta looked good.  
Britt in VA : 8/10/2018 8:12 am : link
.
RE: RE: Decent crop in next year's draft  
jeff57 : 8/10/2018 8:15 am : link
In comment 14034906 Jim in Tampa said:
Quote:
In comment 14034899 jeff57 said:


Quote:


Probably not as good as this year's, but more to choose from.



Are you saying that the "QB crop" will be decent in the upcoming draft? Because from all I've read, it's considered to be a below average group.

Which QB or QBs available next year do you think will be "decent"?


Herbert, Stidham, Lock and Patterson are good shots for the first round.
Agree with the OP  
Marty866b : 8/10/2018 8:17 am : link
Barkley is going to be terrific but the quarterback position is far so important. Webb in college threw a lot of wide receiver screens and check downs. Yesterday he couldn't even do them. Gettleman has built this team to win now thus the signing of a player like Stewart, trading for Ogletree, trading a pick for a punter, giving up our #3 next year for a supplemental pick,etc. Time will tell if he's right but I don't believe that this team has the talent to win more then 6-8 games this year.
Doesn't really matter  
rasbutant : 8/10/2018 8:19 am : link
Eli is the QB.

I still have faith in Webb even with the poor performance.  
robbieballs2003 : 8/10/2018 8:19 am : link
However, nothing is worse than saying we should have take a (insert position). Yes, Darnold was mentioned in this post but it sounds like you were okay with any QB. You don't draft positions. You draft people. I personally really like Josh Rosen and would have been happy with him if we went in that direction but love the Barkley pick. These QBs were so drastically different. I will never understand anybody saying we should have drafted a position. Put a name to it.
And I'm one who wanted them to take a QB at 2  
jeff57 : 8/10/2018 8:20 am : link
Barkley should be great, but I think they'll end up regretting not taking Rosen or Darnold.
I am not sure how anyone can watch how long it takes lauletta  
bhill410 : 8/10/2018 8:20 am : link
To release a ball and think that is going to fly in nfl. Not a scout by any means and that really was apparent
RE: Doesn't really matter  
jeff57 : 8/10/2018 8:20 am : link
In comment 14034918 rasbutant said:
Quote:
Eli is the QB.


In 2020?
It never ends.  
BigBlueHens : 8/10/2018 8:21 am : link
Because Baker looked good and Webb looked bad, it was a mistake drafting Barkley? After one preseason game?

I was a Baker guy if we went QB, but he was the only QB that wasn't available. Let's give Webb and Lauletta more than a quarter or two of football. Webb hasn't seen live action in a year.

Even if Darnold flashes, it is still one preseason game.
I'm come at this as one who desperately wanted...  
M.S. : 8/10/2018 8:22 am : link

...a QB with the #2 pick.

DESPERATELY.

But I'm sitting here knowing full well that the Giants didn't exactly get chopped liver with Saquon Barkley (his first touch says it all).

And as for Eli's ultimate replacement, you just never know how this plays out. It might not be Webb and it might not be Kyle Lauletta. It's just too early to tell.

As for Baker Mayfield, he did last night what he did at Oklahoma... a QB who's totally in control and who stands back there with a blood pressure of 0/0. Nothing phases this extremely talented play-maker.

Would I have preferred the Giants taking Mayfield over Barkley? Of course, they didn't have that option without a trade (which was inconceivable given all their needs)...

...but one part of me says yes, Mayfield over Barkely, and another part says, "I don't know."
Very predictable, the "take a qb crowd" claim victory  
PatersonPlank : 8/10/2018 8:27 am : link
After 3 qtrs of the first preseason game. Give Webb and Lauletta a chance, and I think Lauletta looked good. Also I like how they downplay Barkleys play as not meaning much, but amp up Webbs as being meaningful.

It's only preseason.
The second line receivers  
wonderback : 8/10/2018 8:35 am : link
Is what we all should be worried about. They sucked, No separation and no hands.
RE: Very predictable, the  
M.S. : 8/10/2018 8:36 am : link
In comment 14034932 PatersonPlank said:
Quote:
After 3 qtrs of the first preseason game. Give Webb and Lauletta a chance, and I think Lauletta looked good. Also I like how they downplay Barkleys play as not meaning much, but amp up Webbs as being meaningful.

It's only preseason.

That first Barkley run with two consecutive jump cuts is something I just can't get enough of!!!
RE: Very predictable, the  
jeff57 : 8/10/2018 8:38 am : link
In comment 14034932 PatersonPlank said:
Quote:
After 3 qtrs of the first preseason game. Give Webb and Lauletta a chance, and I think Lauletta looked good. Also I like how they downplay Barkleys play as not meaning much, but amp up Webbs as being meaningful.

It's only preseason.


Barkley should be a great player. I'm not knocking him. But you win in this league with a franchise QB.
RE: if he had gone 30-35  
ColHowPepper : 8/10/2018 8:42 am : link
In comment 14034889 Peter from NH (formerly CT) said:
He didn't play well. He wasn't particularly helped by his receivers either[/quote]Nor did he help his receivers. Jerrell Adams may have let one seam pattern pass get through his hands, but it was high and hard. Others to Adams were just way high, no touch, no timing.

Even though NBC showed the replay two or three times, I still can't figure what happened on that flag pattern to Kalif Raymond. Banks said he couldn't locate the ball, it landed just along or outside the sideline just inside the goal line.

One thing I did NOT like about Webb last night was his demeanor, showing frustration and/or disgust when there were arguable drops. I get the frustration, but for a guy who has yet to show anything in this League to express (by facial expression and body language) dismay with his receivers, he's not going to win respect or effort from his teammates.
RE: I still have faith in Webb even with the poor performance.  
Jim in Tampa : 8/10/2018 8:45 am : link
In comment 14034920 robbieballs2003 said:
Quote:
However, nothing is worse than saying we should have take a (insert position). Yes, Darnold was mentioned in this post but it sounds like you were okay with any QB. You don't draft positions. You draft people. I personally really like Josh Rosen and would have been happy with him if we went in that direction but love the Barkley pick. These QBs were so drastically different. I will never understand anybody saying we should have drafted a position. Put a name to it.


I obviously can't speak for every BBI who wanted a QB, but I think I can answer your question.

I too liked Rosen the best of the top 4 QBs, but I also thought that if the Giants' front office agreed that drafting a QB at 2 was the right move AND they liked another QB better, then I would defer to their QB evaluation skills. Especially since many of the professional player evaluators (not the draft gurus, but NFL personnel guys) were divided on which QB to choose.
RE: It never ends.  
eric2425ny : 8/10/2018 8:45 am : link
In comment 14034925 BigBlueHens said:
Quote:
Because Baker looked good and Webb looked bad, it was a mistake drafting Barkley? After one preseason game?

I was a Baker guy if we went QB, but he was the only QB that wasn't available. Let's give Webb and Lauletta more than a quarter or two of football. Webb hasn't seen live action in a year.

Even if Darnold flashes, it is still one preseason game.


Exactly, we had no chance at Mayfield regardless. He was going #1 all along. The only thing that would be hard to see is one or two of the other top guys panning out and us passing on all of them (Darnold, Allen, Rosen). Now if we make another run with Eli and Barkley plays a big part in us being successful Im still fine with us passing on QB regardless of how those QBs turn out.
I liked Rosen the best because he came from a pro style offense.  
Britt in VA : 8/10/2018 8:46 am : link
That's also the main reason I wanted Lauletta in a later round.
Couple other things about Webb  
dep026 : 8/10/2018 8:46 am : link
1. The throw to Raymond for a TD was on the wrong shoulder. It looked like a corner route, and he just hit the wrong shoulder. But it was the right read and just missed - that wasnt the most concerning thing on that drive.... this is what worries me.

2. We are driving at the end of the half and we have one timeout. Webb gets flushed around the 40 yard line on first down. Checks down to Gallman in the middle of the field and gets 3 yards. We use a timeout. Thats a waste. You are better off just throwing it away, why? Well...

3. With 9 seconds left, he makes a horrid judgement in throwing to Shepard, who had no shot of going out of bounds. With a timeout, it would have been fine, but we left points off the board. He has got to be smarter than that.
Webb looked awful, Lauletta looked better than him  
mikeinbloomfield : 8/10/2018 8:47 am : link
I'd be interested in seeing Lauletta with the twos. Webb might have just had a bad game.

But its important to remember that the Giants didn't take a QB at 2 because they felt there wasn't a QB worth taking at 2. They may be right, we won't know for a long time.

As good as Mayfield was last night, he was not an option for the Giants.
You draft the best player(s)  
JonC : 8/10/2018 8:48 am : link
QB didn't meet the grade according to the pros. I'm ok with picking the best player overall in the draft rather than drafting a position of consensus lesser talent.

Patience.
RE: You draft the best player(s)  
crick n NC : 8/10/2018 8:49 am : link
In comment 14034968 JonC said:
Quote:
QB didn't meet the grade according to the pros. I'm ok with picking the best player overall in the draft rather than drafting a position of consensus lesser talent.

Patience.


👍
Lost in the Webb hysteria  
Chris684 : 8/10/2018 8:51 am : link
is that Lauletta looked good and Barkley showed you a glimpse of why he has a real chance to be a great player in this league.

Also, maybe Webb improves? That's not possible right now according to most, I know.
In Reality  
lax counsel : 8/10/2018 8:59 am : link
I dont think the Giants drafting or not drafting a qb had anything to do with Webb. I think it was more about trying to get a run out of Eli and genuinely not agreeing on a qb at 2. Maybe they are wrong maybe they are right, time will tell.
...  
christian : 8/10/2018 9:16 am : link
Time will tell (I suspect pretty quickly) if opting to stick with Manning for the short-term was good for the medium-term of the franchise.

If you believe Manning has championship type play left in him, it's the right choice. If you don't, it's tough to pass up the opportunity to pick one of the two best QBs in any draft. Whether that guy is seen as a can't miss or just a really good prospect.

One thing last night that was crystal clear to me -- the difference in hit the ground running talent between the 1st or 2nd most talented QB in a draft and the 5th or 6th most talented is stark.

Webb is an extremely important player on this roster.  
NYG07 : 8/10/2018 9:26 am : link
So many posters on here are completely dismissing the idea that Eli could struggle again this year. The organization made the decision to try and win again with Eli rather than rebuilding the team. We will see how it plays out.

As far as Webb, I was very disappointed. Zero touch, terrible accuracy. Hopefully he improves over these next couple pre-season games.
Ive been a big defender of Webb here,  
Section331 : 8/10/2018 9:40 am : link
but lets not sugarcoat it, he was beyond putrid last night. I havent seen throws that far off line from an NFL QBin some time. I hope it was merely nerves, but we need to be prepared for the realization that he isnt very good.

I liked what I saw from Lauretta, but Im not sure Id want to go into the season with an untested rookie as our #2.
RE: Ive been a big defender of Webb here,  
wonderback : 8/10/2018 9:50 am : link
In comment 14035068 Section331 said:
Quote:
but lets not sugarcoat it, he was beyond putrid last night. I havent seen throws that far off line from an NFL QBin some time. I hope it was merely nerves, but we need to be prepared for the realization that he isnt very good.

I liked what I saw from Lauretta, but Im not sure Id want to go into the season with an untested rookie as our #2.


You're right, he didn't play well. His receivers didn't help. They were putrid.
If you  
NikkiMac : 8/10/2018 10:03 am : link
Rewatch the game you will see that he was starting to calm down and get his feet right when he would drop back and was gaining confidence then he got pulled for Lauletta
RE: I am not sure how anyone can watch how long it takes lauletta  
Greg from LI : 8/10/2018 10:04 am : link
In comment 14034922 bhill410 said:
Quote:
To release a ball and think that is going to fly in nfl. Not a scout by any means and that really was apparent


Yeah, but he makes up for it with the zip he throws it with.....no, wait, he's got a noodle arm, never mind.
RE: RE: Doesn't really matter  
rasbutant : 8/10/2018 10:47 am : link
In comment 14034923 jeff57 said:
Quote:
In comment 14034918 rasbutant said:


Quote:


Eli is the QB.




In 2020?


I think so.

Just like Big Ben will be steelers QB and Rivers - Chargers, Maybe even Brees still, but probably not. Brady probably retires as well.
Come on Fatman  
joeinpa : 8/10/2018 11:06 am : link
When a fan expresses a concern it s not right or wrong, it just is. I m not creating a narrative, just stating I was disappointed in Webbs performance last night and if Darnold plays well it will increase the sting.

Not saying Webb can't play, not even stating my opinion has merit, just making an observation.
RE: RE: RE: Doesn't really matter  
jeff57 : 8/10/2018 11:07 am : link
In comment 14035236 rasbutant said:
Quote:
In comment 14034923 jeff57 said:


Quote:


In comment 14034918 rasbutant said:


Quote:


Eli is the QB.




In 2020?



I think so.

Just like Big Ben will be steelers QB and Rivers - Chargers, Maybe even Brees still, but probably not. Brady probably retires as well.

Seriously? I'll take that bet.
RE: Agree with the OP  
Jim in Forest Hills : 8/10/2018 12:05 pm : link
In comment 14034912 Marty866b said:
Quote:
Barkley is going to be terrific but the quarterback position is far so important. Webb in college threw a lot of wide receiver screens and check downs. Yesterday he couldn't even do them. Gettleman has built this team to win now thus the signing of a player like Stewart, trading for Ogletree, trading a pick for a punter, giving up our #3 next year for a supplemental pick,etc. Time will tell if he's right but I don't believe that this team has the talent to win more then 6-8 games this year.


Agree Marty. Even with a rejuvenated Eli, I didn't believe the Giants were a Superbowl team which is why I wanted a QB at 2.

And also seeing so many teams suffer for so long without a franchise QB year after year (Browns anyone?) the Giants had the chance to draft a potential without trading up was a tantalizing proposition. Even with understanding there are no guarantees.

Alas that time has passed and Barkley is in the fold. Hopefully he, Eli and Shurmur can get the Giants that 5th ring.
There has been a BBI mantra that Webb would have been a 1st  
baadbill : 8/10/2018 12:11 pm : link
round choice in this draft ... that Webb isnt just a 3rd round pick, but is the future replacement for Manning and next Giants QB to hoist the Lombardi.

This was only one preseason game. Maybe he will shake it off. But, regardless of the numbers, there just was no comparison between Webb and Mayfield. Everyone on planet earth watching last nights game saw with their own eyes why Mayfield was a first round pick and why Webb wasnt drafted until the third. Mayfield had poise and a quiet confidence. Webb had none.
I'm a glass half full guy  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 8/10/2018 1:37 pm : link
I'm hoping to see a lulzy multiple int fumble game from rat claws Darnold tonight. If that butthurt lazy selfish training camp holdout even plays!
One game in August  
djm : 8/10/2018 2:25 pm : link
.
rat claws Darnold....  
Britt in VA : 8/10/2018 2:27 pm : link
lol.
have the feeling giants are going to be kicking themselves  
micky : 8/10/2018 2:42 pm : link
and have regret on passing on taking a qb last draft for years after elis done
Of course you do....  
Britt in VA : 8/10/2018 2:45 pm : link
you've been saying that since before the draft, why would you feel any differently now?
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