This goes to a handful of people complaining that SB's other 3 (usually they add 1 to help their point) went for 4 yards. Same people were talking about all offseason how SB won't be able to get 3 or 4 yards and will try to get 40 every time. Now 2 of the 3 carries went for 3 or 4 yards and these same people are complaining that he didn't go for 40 every time. Do people just say anything that fits their agenda without trying to be consistent?
Sorry, I will delete this if it's duplicate.
1. RB goes 100 yards on first play from scrimmage and then zero yards for 19 next carries, averaging 5 yards per play.
2. RB has 20 carries each exactly 5 yards per play.
Both backs average 5 yards a carry - but the respective runners' impact on the game couldn't be more different.
The "worry" I read about Saquon before the draft is that he his game stats are closer to example 1 style runner rather than example 2.
PS: I have no idea whether the concern is valid.
1. RB goes 100 yards on first play from scrimmage and then zero yards for 19 next carries, averaging 5 yards per play.
2. RB has 20 carries each exactly 5 yards per play.
Both backs average 5 yards a carry - but the respective runners' impact on the game couldn't be more different.
The "worry" I read about Saquon before the draft is that he his game stats are closer to example 1 style runner rather than example 2.
PS: I have no idea whether the concern is valid.
I agree with you, but scenario 1 is still better than being bottled up on that first plays and having 0 yards for the game. You want a guy that when the other team has a great game plan to stop him and has great players that he's still a threat to break one. I remember in 2008 or so we played Adrian Peterson and we stopped him the whole game and then he took one to the house for like 80. I was puffing my chest out, but in the end that's what great RBs do. There's never been one great RB that didn't have a poor game but it's nice to have an RB that even during a poor game can break one huge run. OBJ is the same thing as a WR. He's had plenty of games where outside of one big play his stats weren't amazing (the 2015 Pats game is coming to mind). Also, I don't think that was the case yesterday with Barkley he didn't seem to have anywhere to go and 3 routine runs is not nearly enough of a sample size to judge. Some people want to say that 1 run isn't enough to say he's great but the best RBs in NFL history have gone for 4 yards total on 3 successive runs. A select few RBs could have done even once what Barkley did on his 39 yarder.
But the concern is that Barkley will lose yards instead of getting 3 or 4 yards. Two of the three runs he gained those 3 or 4 yards. Most thumpers have A LOT of those types of runs.
What's the concern? He took the 3-4 yard gains everyone has been
clamoring for.
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And I believe Eli has said it too
What's the concern? He took the 3-4 yard gains everyone has been
clamoring for.
OK I misunderstood.
However, as one who wanted a quarterback, but am also a Penn State fan that saw almost everyone of Barkley s runs from scrimmage the past two seasons, what we saw last night, was a small sample of his college career.
Big plays, mixed in with small gains and losses. To be fair, Penn State did not have the line to pound it between the tackles.
I still believe the Giants made a mistake taking a running back instead of a quarterback. But if I m proven correct, it won t be because Barkley underperformed. It will be because no running back can be as important to a team as a franchise quarterback.
Which is why my personal opinion is that the evaluation of Barkley s selection is somewhat contingent on how Darnold s career unfolds.
FMIC disagrees with my take, and I see his point, the draft selection success should be judged solely on the peosupof the player drafted. By that standard I am confident Giants will have been proven correct.
But there are people in the business who also see it my way
Its always what ifs or theres greener grass someplace else. And they know more than anyone. Fucking assholes.
Just be happy we got a legit talent will likely be one of the great ambassadors of the NY Giants franchise and shut the hell up already. Every time one of these qbs throws a tight spiral were gonna hear about it. Jerkoffs.
Wanting a quarterback does not preclude a fan from fanatically rooting for Barkley.
Your response is way too angry for someone who states they could care less how those quarterbacks past on play.
I absolutely hate that argument, especially at the QB position. Its perfectly fine to have preferred a QB, but there are many people on this site making things up about what Barkley should and shouldnt be doing because they are so blinded by their own draft preference.
AP had speed and power but wasn't ever that nimble.
If you can't see how that kind of ability is going to mean great things for him than you need your eyes or brain checked.
From a team construction standpoint he wasn't necessarily the best pick, that being said, if you don't think Saquon is going to instantly be one of the best all around backs in the league I hope you find the taste of crow delicious.
This!
Oh by the way his first four carries in his professional career.
Blah blah blah web should retire Eli didn't put touchdowns on the board and Darnold was 66% in his first drive.
Darnold 66% in first drive. That made me laugh out loud.
Barkley sucks, should have drafted Bridgewater...~
I absolutely hate that argument, especially at the QB position. Its perfectly fine to have preferred a QB, but there are many people on this site making things up about what Barkley should and shouldnt be doing because they are so blinded by their own draft preference.
isn't it human nature if they were convicted the Giants should take a quarterback, that their anger would flare up when they see that quarterback play well, even in a preseason game.
No one is that clairvoyant. Sorry.
I simply stated if Barkley becomes a super star back, and say Darnold become another Simms or Eli, Giants goofed
Don t see how that is an unreasonable take. Again, I think your name calling might more be motivated by the possibility that history might prove the Giants made the wrong pick, then you are at the other clowns you referred to.
I want Barkley to be good, thats it. I couldnt care less about Darnold.
I'm not giving you shit I'm just asking.
Perfect response
Only two runs longer last year...
You really can't get away with that often at the NFL level. What I saw yesterday was SB doing exactly what he should have done when there were no holes to waltz into. He correctly decided to take what was given on that play. He did very well based off limited carries.
But part of me believes Gettleman believes Giants can win now and didn t want to blow the opportunity with a rookie quarterback.
For me it s simple. The Barkley pick is tied to Darnold s success simply because Good quarterback trumps good running back. Great quarterback trumps great running back.
But if Giants win Super Bowl with Barkley and Jets never win one with Darnold, it would be silly to think Giants goofed regardless of how good Darnold is.
1. RB goes 100 yards on first play from scrimmage and then zero yards for 19 next carries, averaging 5 yards per play.
2. RB has 20 carries each exactly 5 yards per play.
Both backs average 5 yards a carry - but the respective runners' impact on the game couldn't be more different.
The "worry" I read about Saquon before the draft is that he his game stats are closer to example 1 style runner rather than example 2.
PS: I have no idea whether the concern is valid.
Bill: I have found median value to be a much more useful stat than average value in many areas of life.
If I'm reading correctly he had 3 more carries for -2, 3, 3.
He showed what his supporters and critics see in him. A dynamite long run, and a sprinkling of below average runs.
Quote:
yards per carry... take two different theoretical game stats:
1. RB goes 100 yards on first play from scrimmage and then zero yards for 19 next carries, averaging 5 yards per play.
2. RB has 20 carries each exactly 5 yards per play.
Both backs average 5 yards a carry - but the respective runners' impact on the game couldn't be more different.
The "worry" I read about Saquon before the draft is that he his game stats are closer to example 1 style runner rather than example 2.
PS: I have no idea whether the concern is valid.
Bill: I have found median value to be a much more useful stat than average value in many areas of life.
With small sample sizes that's often the case. At the same time I just can't disregard an 80 yard TD run no matter how poor the median number is.
If I'm reading correctly he had 3 more carries for -2, 3, 3.
He showed what his supporters and critics see in him. A dynamite long run, and a sprinkling of below average runs.
But his critics make it sound like his runs are losses when they're not long. I've heard numerous times that he needs to take 3-4 yard runs when there's nothing there and he did twice.
Drafting a QB at all costs is what poorly run teams do.
But part of me believes Gettleman believes Giants can win now and didn t want to blow the opportunity with a rookie quarterback.
For me it s simple. The Barkley pick is tied to Darnold s success simply because Good quarterback trumps good running back. Great quarterback trumps great running back.
But if Giants win Super Bowl with Barkley and Jets never win one with Darnold, it would be silly to think Giants goofed regardless of how good Darnold is.
Wait a minute, Joe. How do we know that Darnold was rated higher than Rosen & Allen on the Giants draft board?
I suspected the Giants would snag a QB but knew even before the draft that if they didn't take one of the top 4 it meant they did not see "FRANCHISE" written all over the guy. They know a lot more about grading QB prospects than I ever will. Since no QB, I'm glad they took Barkley.
I'm not sure what this is supposed to mean. Drafting a good player is drafting a good player. It's not throwing darts at a wall.
The Giants have several good years but fall short of a championship.
Darnold is outstanding, the Jets have several good years but falls short of a championship.
Nelson is outstanding and apparently the missing piece and the Colts go on to win two SupeBowls?
The Giants have several good years but fall short of a championship.
Darnold is outstanding, the Jets have several good years but falls short of a championship.
Nelson is outstanding and apparently the missing piece and the Colts go on to win two SupeBowls?
If the Colts will win two Super Bowls Nelson wouldn't be the main reason.
If Barkley is just good and Darnold is outstanding it was a bad pick. Arguably it was a bad pick regardless of how good Darnold is. If Barkley is just good he'll be a disappointment. He's compared with all time greats. I don't really care much about how good Nelson will be, I was dead set against drafting him. The fact that we got someone like Hernandez in the second round is why. I'd much rather have Barkley and Hernandez than Nelson and whoever else was available at RB. I may be proven wrong with time but that's an easy decision even in a very good RB class.
With small sample sizes that's often the case. At the same time I just can't disregard an 80 yard TD run no matter how poor the median number is.
Small sample sizes often distort average & median. One of my favorite applications for median over average is house prices in a specific area.
Barkley highlight - ( New Window )
Mr. Objective bringing the logic, clearly.
Although the Saquon haters are no better.
...he lost 3 or 4 yards.
But Clevand was in his face within a split second after the hand-off!
Leonard Fournettte would have lost yardage on that play, too!
Here's my bottom-line: I was vehement about the need for QB, but now I'm gonna have a whole lotta fun watching Saquon Barkley running through and around defenses!
I love seeing SB congratulating the OL at the end.
I understand the staff wanted to help Barkley ease into things and avoid overuse/injury, but there is an element with young players finding their groove which comes with staying on the field. Its almost as if the Browns knew Barkley would get the ball when he was in. That said, he had one bad run and two runs of three yards each. Still not too bad against a team stacking the box.
...is going to be a zero problem for the Giants this season.
Why?
Because at some level I think the issue is misunderstood.
First of all, if there's an open hole inside for a run designed to GO inside, Barkley will run through it. Case closed.
Second, he will definitely bounce it outside if the hole is clogged, but so too would several other talented, quick-twitch running backs.
Third, I don't think there were many times at Penn State where the team had third-and-one and Saquon changed a play designed up the middle by bouncing outside and missing out on the first down conversion.
Fourth, Saquon Barkley is no dummy and he is sure to realize that sometimes the team just needs one yard and so you will see him surge straight ahead.
Fifth, if you are pissed at Sam Darnold having a fantastic first pre-season game with the Jets... well, then, take that up with Giants management.
And Sixth, the Giants decided to go with Barkley over QB (a decision I did not favor), so you might as well sit back and enjoy watching him run through and around opposing players. I certainly intend to do so!!!
Mentioned this before and will continue to do so when I read stuff like this...some facet of you on BBI would have looked great goose-stepping down the streets of Berlin in 1940...
Mentioned this before and will continue to do so when I read stuff like this...some facet of you on BBI would have looked great goose-stepping down the streets of Berlin in 1940...
👍
There's hardly a contingent of critique of Barkely. Just a sprinkling of comments and 1 or 2 agitators.
There was that much opposition to the Giants winning their last Super Bowl. I think Barkely is going to be safe and sound from the fans for the time being.
To keep saying it says less about your supposedly "objective" position, and more about making a ridiculous comparison to genocidal maniacs.
To consistently take a contrarian point isn't objective, it is just the opposite thinking. And when it is used to mock posters supposedly too gung ho, it ironically accomplishes the same thing.
Looked like a Bradshaw run to me, tbh
HOF. we are doomed lol . Hey Doc. Hope all is well.
Preseason w no OBJ and no game plan. Yeah. Im ok w Barkley. Also IMO the best QB in the draft was Mayfield. And Cleveland took him so Im more than fine w a real RB stud.
Quote:
13-18 for 96 yards, 1 TD..
HOF. we are doomed lol . Hey Doc. Hope all is well.
Preseason w no OBJ and no game plan. Yeah. Im ok w Barkley. Also IMO the best QB in the draft was Mayfield. And Cleveland took him so Im more than fine w a real RB stud.
Morning, my friend. Alls well and back atcha..You and I will ALWAYS look at preseason for what it is
Wanting a quarterback does not preclude a fan from fanatically rooting for Barkley.
Your response is way too angry for someone who states they could care less how those quarterbacks past on play.
Well, frankly i am tired of the whiny fans who did not get their way and for
Us to draft a QB. He is the guy who is here, I will root for him. For those that I have to hear he will get 5 runs of one yard and 1 good. Then you know what open the God damn holes he needs to get more than 1 yard. The one play he had a little space what did he do with it. The next 3 he had no where to go and he didnt. He gave credit to his blockers for his run, even though 80% was due to his vision and God given ability. Give this kid space and we all be talking about him like we did Odell his 1st year. All these BBI GMs know better than everyone. All they want is to say they were right. I feel at this point he is here, those that wanted him got what they wanted on the 1sr run and the naysayers got what they wanted the next 3. This is a good kid, a phenomenal athlete he is here, how about we hope he gets a chance to show his talent this year.
Wanting a quarterback does not preclude a fan from fanatically rooting for Barkley.
Your response is way too angry for someone who states they could care less how those quarterbacks past on play.
Well, frankly i am tired of the whiny fans who did not get their way and for
Us to draft a QB. He is the guy who is here, I will root for him. For those that I have to hear he will get 5 runs of one yard and 1 good. Then you know what open the God damn holes he needs to get more than 1 yard. The one play he had a little space what did he do with it. The next 3 he had no where to go and he didnt. He gave credit to his blockers for his run, even though 80% was due to his vision and God given ability. Give this kid space and we all be talking about him like we did Odell his 1st year. All these BBI GMs know better than everyone. All they want is to say they were right. I feel at this point he is here, those that wanted him got what they wanted on the 1sr run and the naysayers got what they wanted the next 3. This is a good kid, a phenomenal athlete he is here, how about we hope he gets a chance to show his talent this year.
Quote:
after just a few preseason carries, its actually more ridiculous to start a thread about them and have other posters carry-on about it with their pitchforks in hand. And even if these posters have a so-called "agenda", so what...especially if its only a handful of posters as you state.
Mentioned this before and will continue to do so when I read stuff like this...some facet of you on BBI would have looked great goose-stepping down the streets of Berlin in 1940...
👍
Thx, glad you see it. Others above still not grasping the point...
They all HEARD about how shifty he is, but it only took one touch to realize they have to game plan this guy.
The rest of the time he was in, their attention was focused on him.
Meanwhile OBJ, Shep and Engram are on the sideline ecstatic about what his presence will do for them when Shurmur opens up the offense.
They all HEARD about how shifty he is, but it only took one touch to realize they have to game plan this guy.
The rest of the time he was in, their attention was focused on him.
Meanwhile OBJ, Shep and Engram are on the sideline ecstatic about what his presence will do for them when Shurmur opens up the offense.
I like how SB's run got hog mollies jacked on the sidelines. Hopefully we get some that Beast Mode effect from SB.
I'm calling out stupidity.
Otherwise you just look like a foolish bully and I am going to write what I did again and again...
Quote:
"a handful of people" that rightly, wrongly or indifferently have other views than you is why you goosestep...
I'm calling out stupidity.
You just wrote the above post saying you're calling people stupid.
which is it...yes/no?
Quote:
In comment 14036339 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
"a handful of people" that rightly, wrongly or indifferently have other views than you is why you goosestep...
I'm calling out stupidity.
You just wrote the above post saying you're calling people stupid.
which is it...yes/no?
First of all I didn't call anyone stupid. I said I'm calling out stupidity. I'm sure Einstein has said stupid thinks at some point. Second, I posted that AFTER you compared me with Nazis. My first post was harsh in regards to people using 3 carries as some black mark on his career because the only way someone can complain that a back that did everything you criticized him for not doing is if you have an agenda. "Saquon Barkley only looks for 40 yard runs, doesn't take 3 yard gains". Barkley takes a couple of 3 yards gains "Barkley didn't go for 40 yards he only got small gains". This all on 3 fucking carries.
And your comment is still dumb.
First of all I didn't call anyone stupid. I said I'm calling out stupidity. I'm sure Einstein has said stupid thinks at some point. Second, I posted that AFTER you compared me with Nazis. My first post was harsh in regards to people using 3 carries as some black mark on his career because the only way someone can complain that a back that did everything you criticized him for not doing is if you have an agenda. "Saquon Barkley only looks for 40 yard runs, doesn't take 3 yard gains". Barkley takes a couple of 3 yards gains "Barkley didn't go for 40 yards he only got small gains". This all on 3 fucking carries.
this sizes you up nicely in a nutshell...
I don't care that it was the Jets that drafted him.
Next, it's all about championships. If Barkley has a major role in helping the Giants win a Super Bowl, while Darnold has a HoF career but never wins a ring, you can't say we made the wrong choice.
Quote:
First of all I didn't call anyone stupid. I said I'm calling out stupidity. I'm sure Einstein has said stupid thinks at some point. Second, I posted that AFTER you compared me with Nazis. My first post was harsh in regards to people using 3 carries as some black mark on his career because the only way someone can complain that a back that did everything you criticized him for not doing is if you have an agenda. "Saquon Barkley only looks for 40 yard runs, doesn't take 3 yard gains". Barkley takes a couple of 3 yards gains "Barkley didn't go for 40 yards he only got small gains". This all on 3 fucking carries.
this sizes you up nicely in a nutshell...
Whatever you say buddy.
I don't care that it was the Jets that drafted him.
Next, it's all about championships. If Barkley has a major role in helping the Giants win a Super Bowl, while Darnold has a HoF career but never wins a ring, you can't say we made the wrong choice.
You're right it sounded like the Giants were split on who the next QB to take was Darnold or Allen. Honestly, it's possible the QB they would have taken will be great. But going by the history of the position it's more likely he wouldn't. Also, the 2018 draft isn't the last draft ever. It's possible we can get a great QB in a weak draft at a less than premium position next year. Look at Deshaun Watson, last year's class was supposed to suck and he wasn't had a top 2 pick. Both of those facts couple with the fact that Barkley is more of a sure thing and we almost certainly won't get a chance to draft someone like him next year convinced me that Barkley is the way to go. And I was a big time QB proponent. So much so that I was pissed when I heard Barkley's name called by Goodell.
Probably true. But I believe Gettleman knew what he was doing and that the odds are very good that Giants fans are going to be treated with watching a great running back break into the league. This offense should be a lot of fun to watch this year.