Its a shame how the Mets have potentially ruined Degrom's Cy Young season. If they gave him any run support he would be a unanimous choice. He is that good this year. I hope the votes look past his record and give it to him. He deserves it.
Its a shame how the Mets have potentially ruined Degrom's Cy Young season. If they gave him any run support he would be a unanimous choice. He is that good this year. I hope the votes look past his record and give it to him. He deserves it.
Felix Hernandez won a Cy Young with a 13-12 record and a 2.27 ERA 8 years ago. If DeGrom finishes with a 1.77 ERA he pretty much has to win.
Scherzer is still going to have a strong case because of the K's and I believe his WHIP is also lower than deGrom's. Even if deGrom finishes with a sub-2 ERA, he's not a lock.
Here's hoping we can get through a couple of innings before reaching for the mute button.
I like ARod as a studio analyst but in the booth he never shuts up. Actually all three of them never do. It's like a chat fest and sometimes they forget a game is actually going on.
You are not winning. CY with 8 wins. He also needs his ERA to be a half run lower than Scherzers. So basically he really can’t afford even one bad game
Scherzer has a 2.19 ERA... he can't win because it's not under 1?
deGrom is absolutely not a lock.
Scherzer is leading the majors in wins, games started, innings pitched, strikeouts, and is leading the NL in WHIP, k/9 and k/bb.
That’s not what I said. If deGrom is 0.50 better in era it’s bascially going to trump everything else by a wide margin for me (assuming IP is relatively the same).
Everything is just hanging... not seeing that same bite he had before. But I don't think he's hurt either. And if it was a pitch tipping issue, I think they would have rounded that up by now. I'm stumped.. maybe just a rough patch.
a two week break. Like what Boston just did with Sale. It’s pretty clear he’s fatigued, the fastball is down a few ticks, the slider is flat. I’m concerned they’re going to run him into the ground
Always felt he had the third best velocity behind Thor and Wheeler, and he still might... but its gotta be nice to be able to pump 98s when you want to.
It's not going to trump everything else by a "wide margin" in the eye of the voters, though.
It's very close. Neither guy is even remotely close to a lock and deGrom's only chance is to be half a run or better.
If Scherzer has an era down near 2 and is still leading the league in all of those categories I think he's going to win it.
What matters more than runs allowed? Ks are cool and all but they aren’t worth more in the outs column. If he’s getting more outs per runs scored that’s literally all that matters. WHIP favors Scherzer but it’s the same as Ks - are those base runners scoring or aren’t they?
I was being facetious saying he’s a lock. To your point it’s impossible to know what voter uses what criteria but I think but that’s really the only reason why I’d have any doubt. He’s been the best pitcher in baseball at doing his primary job - keeping runs from happening. His team sucking behind him should be irrelevant.
It's not going to trump everything else by a "wide margin" in the eye of the voters, though.
It's very close. Neither guy is even remotely close to a lock and deGrom's only chance is to be half a run or better.
If Scherzer has an era down near 2 and is still leading the league in all of those categories I think he's going to win it.
What matters more than runs allowed? Ks are cool and all but they aren’t worth more in the outs column. If he’s getting more outs per runs scored that’s literally all that matters. WHIP favors Scherzer but it’s the same as Ks - are those base runners scoring or aren’t they?
I was being facetious saying he’s a lock. To your point it’s impossible to know what voter uses what criteria but I think but that’s really the only reason why I’d have any doubt. He’s been the best pitcher in baseball at doing his primary job - keeping runs from happening. His team sucking behind him should be irrelevant.
Allowing runs shouldn't be solely on the pitcher. It takes 9 guys in the field. A pitcher shouldn't be penalized if he has 8 statues behind him which is why fWAR pulls from FIP more than ERA. I agree with Arc. Sherzer is the favorite for now and I'm an obvious deGrom homer.
He’s likely just fatigued. They need to give him a break
I hate to be coldhearted, but he is 24, why should he be fatigued any more than anyone else? This has been going on since the AS break and he had a nice break then.
a two week break. Like what Boston just did with Sale. It’s pretty clear he’s fatigued, the fastball is down a few ticks, the slider is flat. I’m concerned they’re going to run him into the ground
They can't afford to shut him down for two weeks.
I'm not sure he is fatigued either. He's not a frail guy like Sale, he's a big strong, young guy. Plus he's hitting 95-96 here in the 1st inning. It's not like he's down in the low 90's.
As well. He's 13-3 with a 2.28 ERA and a 1.000 WHIP. He's been spectacular and although I hate the Phillies, he definitely deserves credit for the season he's having, and on a team that is in the mix to win the division.
A lot will come down to the last 6 weeks or so of the season, obviously.
It's not going to trump everything else by a "wide margin" in the eye of the voters, though.
It's very close. Neither guy is even remotely close to a lock and deGrom's only chance is to be half a run or better.
If Scherzer has an era down near 2 and is still leading the league in all of those categories I think he's going to win it.
What matters more than runs allowed? Ks are cool and all but they aren’t worth more in the outs column. If he’s getting more outs per runs scored that’s literally all that matters. WHIP favors Scherzer but it’s the same as Ks - are those base runners scoring or aren’t they?
I was being facetious saying he’s a lock. To your point it’s impossible to know what voter uses what criteria but I think but that’s really the only reason why I’d have any doubt. He’s been the best pitcher in baseball at doing his primary job - keeping runs from happening. His team sucking behind him should be irrelevant.
Of course the primary objective is to prevent runs from scoring but when the disparity there isn't that major and one guy is leading the league in so many other categories, I think the scale is tipped in his favor.
deGrom is having an absolutely fantastic year. But I think the voters will still ultimately choose Scherzer unless the disparity in ERA is a half run+.. which I don't think it will be come seasons end.
a two week break. Like what Boston just did with Sale. It’s pretty clear he’s fatigued, the fastball is down a few ticks, the slider is flat. I’m concerned they’re going to run him into the ground
They can't afford to shut him down for two weeks.
I'm not sure he is fatigued either. He's not a frail guy like Sale, he's a big strong, young guy. Plus he's hitting 95-96 here in the 1st inning. It's not like he's down in the low 90's.
That’s down 2-3 mph from where he normally sits. So yes that’s concerning. They can afford to shut him down for two weeks. They’re not catching Boston, they have a five game wild card lead, and they’re in a weak part of the schedule. What they truly cannot afford is to have him keep pitching like this and be a complete unknown going into October.
a two week break. Like what Boston just did with Sale. It’s pretty clear he’s fatigued, the fastball is down a few ticks, the slider is flat. I’m concerned they’re going to run him into the ground
They can't afford to shut him down for two weeks.
I'm not sure he is fatigued either. He's not a frail guy like Sale, he's a big strong, young guy. Plus he's hitting 95-96 here in the 1st inning. It's not like he's down in the low 90's.
That’s down 2-3 mph from where he normally sits. So yes that’s concerning. They can afford to shut him down for two weeks. They’re not catching Boston, they have a five game wild card lead, and they’re in a weak part of the schedule. What they truly cannot afford is to have him keep pitching like this and be a complete unknown going into October.
I agree - I think everything right now should be done under the assumption that this team is going to be in the play-in. The division got away @ Fenway - I'd like to think there's still a chance but I just don't think it's going to happen. It's more important to make sure guys like Sevy are 100% (or close) going into October.
NYY are pretty much a lock for WC1 at this point. I don't know what the exact odds are, but I'm sure they're very high.
a two week break. Like what Boston just did with Sale. It’s pretty clear he’s fatigued, the fastball is down a few ticks, the slider is flat. I’m concerned they’re going to run him into the ground
They can't afford to shut him down for two weeks.
I'm not sure he is fatigued either. He's not a frail guy like Sale, he's a big strong, young guy. Plus he's hitting 95-96 here in the 1st inning. It's not like he's down in the low 90's.
That’s down 2-3 mph from where he normally sits. So yes that’s concerning. They can afford to shut him down for two weeks. They’re not catching Boston, they have a five game wild card lead, and they’re in a weak part of the schedule. What they truly cannot afford is to have him keep pitching like this and be a complete unknown going into October.
I think I saw that if deGrom gets a win tonight, it'd be the second time this year he got wins in back to back starts. That's crazy. I haven't watched a lot of the Mets, but he should easily win the Cy Young award.
in the first half. Now it’s getting taken out of the ballpark, I don’t think this gets solved by just continuing to run him out there. If we were closer to Boston I might think differently but they can afford to be cautious here.
It was only the first inning. He's hitting 98 now and was there consistently late in his last couple of starts as well.
I think it's more a release point/control issue. In the 1st half he was painting with every pitch. Putting them exactly where he wanted. He's still got good movement and velocity, but he's not hitting the spots he wants or had been.
I also disagree with being in a good enough spot to just rest him a couple of weeks. The A's are charging and I wouldn't count them out of the Divison race with the Stros. Last thing I want is a one game road WC game at Houston.
The Yanks can't assume anything at this point and every game is important for them to win. Plus while many fans have given up on catching the Sox I really doubt the Yanks team and brass have.
It's not going to trump everything else by a "wide margin" in the eye of the voters, though.
It's very close. Neither guy is even remotely close to a lock and deGrom's only chance is to be half a run or better.
If Scherzer has an era down near 2 and is still leading the league in all of those categories I think he's going to win it.
What matters more than runs allowed? Ks are cool and all but they aren’t worth more in the outs column. If he’s getting more outs per runs scored that’s literally all that matters. WHIP favors Scherzer but it’s the same as Ks - are those base runners scoring or aren’t they?
I was being facetious saying he’s a lock. To your point it’s impossible to know what voter uses what criteria but I think but that’s really the only reason why I’d have any doubt. He’s been the best pitcher in baseball at doing his primary job - keeping runs from happening. His team sucking behind him should be irrelevant.
Allowing runs shouldn't be solely on the pitcher. It takes 9 guys in the field. A pitcher shouldn't be penalized if he has 8 statues behind him which is why fWAR pulls from FIP more than ERA. I agree with Arc. Sherzer is the favorite for now and I'm an obvious deGrom homer.
I'm not following the logic of "FIP is more important than ERA, the guy with the worse FIP (and xfip) is the favorite".
Im saying peripheral wise they are very close so the edge is going to go to the guy with the more wins.. more innings... etc IMO. Yes, deGrom has a better FIP too but I think Sherzer is the winner if the season ended today.
Obviously, not allowing runs is a huge and will always matter but FIP is a better indicator of how well a pitcher is actually pitching. As mentioned... Runs allowed is really a team stat as there are other factors involved. But I really dont want to eat up a Mets/Yankees thread discussing this further.
I’m not talking about shutting him down until October.
No, I get you didn't mean that. I just don't think they can even afford that.
If they think it is a fatigue issue I could see something like giving him an extra day before a start, but unless it's an arm issue, I think they keep running him out there because they need him.
Oddly enough, it seemed to do the same in his last start too. Not sure why - it seems like he doesn't have a feel for it early in games and it's hanging.
Severino on the DL for a couple weeks and give him some rest. He's clearly slowing down and can use a couple starts off. This Mets lineup is one of the worst lineups I've ever seen and he can't even get them out
Again up in the zone. The long ball is killing Sevy.
Not up near enough IMO. It looked to me to be right down the middle not even belt high.
Well after another look it did appear to be about belt high but still not up near enough. That one he can handle but up higher he can't.
Trying to work and watch at the same time, I thought that pitch was supposed to be lower and he left it too high - maybe Romine was calling for up and out of the zone in which case, yeah, not high enough. Right at the sweet spot of the barrel.
RE: Is he tipping pitches? Or, has he reverted to how he started 2016? Â
This version of Joey Bats tales one of his only nasty sliders and crushed a 100 on the black. Tipping pitches?
Or is the this the raw stuff and no command Sevy that started 2016 like garabage and lost his rotation spot?
They need to figure it out now, because this line the Mets trotted our sucks ass, yet, it’s 4-2
No they already addressed that. It has to be fatigue. The Sox did it with Sale. What’s the point in continuing to run him out there? The division is gone and even if it wasn’t he’s not effective period. This isn’t just l one or two bad starts. Something is wrong.
There wasn't any conclusive shot showing the tag was applied.
Embarrassing.
Agree, awful
Oh come on now. It absolutely was conclusive. He had the tag on Conforto left leg. Just because the incompetent announcers were looking at the arm and not the left leg doesn’t make it fact. He had the tag on when the foot popped up.
Now, if you want to say that the call is absurd because it’s not the intent of replay, I’d agree with you. This crap has gotten ridiculous. Plays like that are certainly not what replay was intended for, but, here were I guess. I agree the call was terrible, but different reasons I guess...
Might be the worst starting first baseman for the Yankees in decades. Can't hit a good fastball consistently and is still susceptible to the slider down. How long can the Yankees afford to wait on him? He'a 2.15 or so lifetime hitter with over 500 at bats. At this juncture, he's the worst hitter in this lineup and should be batting 9th. Cannot believe that Boone had him in the cleanup spot and 5th so often this season.
And I suppose Hicks asked for time and it wasn't given. And I don't have a problem with it. Too many times the pitchers starts and the ump gives the time call/...
There wasn't any conclusive shot showing the tag was applied.
Embarrassing.
Agree, awful
Oh come on now. It absolutely was conclusive. He had the tag on Conforto left leg. Just because the incompetent announcers were looking at the arm and not the left leg doesn’t make it fact. He had the tag on when the foot popped up.
Now, if you want to say that the call is absurd because it’s not the intent of replay, I’d agree with you. This crap has gotten ridiculous. Plays like that are certainly not what replay was intended for, but, here were I guess. I agree the call was terrible, but different reasons I guess...
I agree with you all around there Big Blue.
Gleyber is real good with the tags and I thought he did keep the tag on the leg.
I don't like the ticky tack use of replay there either, and I can't imagine that's the type of thing they intended when putting replay in. Unfortunately now that it's here, we're going to keep getting those types of calls.
the most embarrassing game of the season. This Mets lineup is seriously one of the worst I've ever seen and they are basically taking batting practice.
At this point just let Cole throw the rest of the game and DFA him immediately after.
There are some pitching options but no one that really seems ready to help. Sheffield is not on the 40 man right now. Anyone else that can probably help this year is.
Can’t they watch the tape and figure something out?
It’s more than likely he’s tipping pitches, maybe even before the wind-up, hitter are squaring up the high octane fastball like they are sitting on it and not even flinching at the slider. What the heck is going on?
Can’t they watch the tape and figure something out?
It’s more than likely he’s tipping pitches, maybe even before the wind-up, hitter are squaring up the high octane fastball like they are sitting on it and not even flinching at the slider. What the heck is going on?
I have to think if he's tipping pitches, they would have figured that out by now. This has been going on for weeks and that had to be one of the very first things they looked at.
I honestly just think it's fatigue. I'd give him 2 weeks and see how he responds to it.
He's pitching poorly right now - no way around it. So, trotting him out there every 5 days isn't helping any.
Britton really needs to get it together. He has not been good.
To this met team is just as embarrassing as the 6 losses to Baltimore. I get Degrom is good. But this met line up is one of the worst in baseball. Time to panic on severino he stinks
I honestly think I'd rather die than ever have to hear that broadcast team again.
Haha. I wouldn't go that far but I pray I never have to hear them again. Whatever happened to just calling the damn game and analyzing what's going on?
Too many of these guys now never stop talking and think we tune in to listen to their stories. It's like they think the game isn't interesting enough and they have to try and entertain us, which they fail horribly at.
using Cole in a one run game. I don’t understand that.
Why has Tommy Kahnle been seemingly banished? I know he went through velocity issues but there’s no way he isn’t a better option than Cole at this point.
I've been asking about Kahnle too - I don't understand why he doesn't seem to be an option at all. It looked like he had a pretty good stretch @ SWB - got called up for a day and got sent back down. Can he really be worse than AJ Cole is right now? George Kontos?
using Cole in a one run game. I don’t understand that.
Why has Tommy Kahnle been seemingly banished? I know he went through velocity issues but there’s no way he isn’t a better option than Cole at this point.
I don't understand the Cole part either but honestly I've stopped trying to understand these moves. There's been so many I don't understand I've chalked it up to a rookie manager finding his way and now I just hope they work out.
I'm tired of getting frustrated by them and trying to get answers or others opinions only to be called whiny for voicing an opinion on Boone's moves.
No idea about Kahnle but I'd imagine it's still a velocity issue or maybe he hasn't been back down there for ten days yet? I'm not sure the exact day then sent him back down.
Last Night the Red Sox would have come in and brushed the Mets aside, piling up runs and hits, while stifling the Mets' bats. That's been the story all season ----the Red Sox just get the job done especially against lesser teams -- they seem to own Baltimore this year, while the Yankees "play down" to the level of their competition. The Red Sox core group of young players plus JD Martinez make them formidable opponents, while the Yankees don't seem to have the "killer instinct". Hope is the Yanks get a healthy Judge back (and he learns to lay off the low outside breaking pitches) and the rest of the team gets on a roll late in the season. Very tough American League playoffs this year.
out Boone in RAB this morning on the Cole relief. The whining for Warren is only somewhat warranted. While he is certainly better than Cole, Warren was not Warren any more. He had been a bit shaky this year.
As for Severino - he(Sevy) says he is definitely not tired and pretty emphatic about it.
I think Kahnle's problem is he has lost his control. Too many walks. Yes speed is down to 95-96 vs 97-98.
RE: The Difference Between the Yankees and Red Sox Â
Last Night the Red Sox would have come in and brushed the Mets aside, piling up runs and hits, while stifling the Mets' bats. That's been the story all season ----the Red Sox just get the job done especially against lesser teams -- they seem to own Baltimore this year, while the Yankees "play down" to the level of their competition. The Red Sox core group of young players plus JD Martinez make them formidable opponents, while the Yankees don't seem to have the "killer instinct". Hope is the Yanks get a healthy Judge back (and he learns to lay off the low outside breaking pitches) and the rest of the team gets on a roll late in the season. Very tough American League playoffs this year.
I don’t know if the Sox would of done anything against degrom. But Red Sox pitchers would not be getting lit up like a Christmas tree against this pitiful met lineup. 15 hits for the Mets last night 15 hits. That’s ridiculous have to mets had 15 hits in a game this season?? Some of these losses the Yankees have had since early July have been god awful. If they would of taken care of business against these garbage teams they could be in striking distance for th division and now they better be worried about Oakland 3.5 games in nothing that team doesn’t lose either and Seattle is playing well to only saving grace is these teams play each other a lot but Yankees could Very well blow the Home field for that game.
out Boone in RAB this morning on the Cole relief. The whining for Warren is only somewhat warranted. While he is certainly better than Cole, Warren was not Warren any more. He had been a bit shaky this year.
As for Severino - he(Sevy) says he is definitely not tired and pretty emphatic about it.
I think Kahnle's problem is he has lost his control. Too many walks. Yes speed is down to 95-96 vs 97-98.
I said it last night, but I’m still confounded by it this morning.
I try to pick my spots carefully and sparingly when it comes to hammering managerial decisions, but using Cole in last night’s spot is pretty infuriating.
Usually, even if I would have done things differently, I can sympathize with the angle the manager was seeing. This one was really not excusable.
out Boone in RAB this morning on the Cole relief. The whining for Warren is only somewhat warranted. While he is certainly better than Cole, Warren was not Warren any more. He had been a bit shaky this year.
As for Severino - he(Sevy) says he is definitely not tired and pretty emphatic about it.
I think Kahnle's problem is he has lost his control. Too many walks. Yes speed is down to 95-96 vs 97-98.
I said it last night, but I’m still confounded by it this morning.
I try to pick my spots carefully and sparingly when it comes to hammering managerial decisions, but using Cole in last night’s spot is pretty infuriating.
Usually, even if I would have done things differently, I can sympathize with the angle the manager was seeing. This one was really not excusable.
I think people are engaging in 20-20 hindsight on Cole and not being honest with themselves- especially one poster with a VERY anti-Boone agenda that they have been hammering away on ALL SEASON.
Going into last night's game, Cole had been very good, though he had a rough outing against Texas. Coming into last night's outing, in his last 23 and 2/3 IP, Cole had only given up 19 hits and 7 walks (that's a WHIP just about 1.10, which is fine), with 31 K and an ERA near 3.00.
That's NOT a bad reliever- and you are not going to use your best relievers when you are down 2 runs after a series in which the bullpen was overused because the SP was bad.
The decision to go with Cole was completely justifiable- he did have a bad outing against Texas, but had been solid for about a month before that, so there was no reason to believe that the Texas game was anything more than a blip in an otherwise solid month.
The Yanks had an untested Kontos, and were not likely to bring in Britton into that situation. Betances was probably available, but you aren't going to bring him into a game when you are down 2 in the 7th when you have no off-days in the near future.
Chapman was certainly not coming in at that point. Gray had pitched the day before (badly) and was likely not available anyway. Green had just pitched the 6th- and they probably didn't want to go multiple innings with Green likely to be needed in the next series. Holder had gone 2 innings on Sunday and was probably not available either.
The only remaining possible reliever would have been DRobertson. Again, look at the situation- the Yanks rely heavily on Robertson, and were not going to use him in a game where they are already 2 runs down and no off-days coming up.
Boone made the best decision that was available to him- outside of the bad outing on Friday against Texas, Cole had been rather good- but Cole is also pretty low in the bullpen pecking order. Boone was trying to get Cole to get them one inning and see if the offense could do something. It didn't work out- it happens.
Losing to a bad team like the Mets sucks, but let's not pretend that Boone lost the game because Cole spit the bit. The Yanks lost the game because something isn't right with Severino, who gave up 4 runs to a terrible Mets offense. Cole came in with the Yanks behind 4-2, with deGrom still on the mound and in full control of the game.
The decision was the right one at the time- and in hindsight probably still is. The Yanks avoided using Robertson, Holder, Betances- and only used Green for one inning- meaning that the regulars in the pen are fully rested and prepared for the Rays.
It gets VERY tiresome to see the CONSTANT moaning about decisions that if people spent less time jumping on the agenda-driven bandwagon against Boone led by one-poster here, and actually put some real thought into the decision, would realize that Boone was right.
when Cole came in and it's become pretty clear that whatever he did earlier in the season was a fluke. He's struggled beyond just the Texas game. He has a career 4.82 ERA in a decent sized sample. That's what he is.
He shouldn't be pitching in a one run game, period. Whether it's a lead or a deficit. He was willing to use Britton with a two run deficit in the 9th, so why can't he come in earlier? And why is he allowed to stay in to give up not one, not two, but three home runs?
Last Night the Red Sox would have come in and brushed the Mets aside, piling up runs and hits, while stifling the Mets' bats. That's been the story all season ----the Red Sox just get the job done especially against lesser teams -- they seem to own Baltimore this year, while the Yankees "play down" to the level of their competition. The Red Sox core group of young players plus JD Martinez make them formidable opponents, while the Yankees don't seem to have the "killer instinct". Hope is the Yanks get a healthy Judge back (and he learns to lay off the low outside breaking pitches) and the rest of the team gets on a roll late in the season. Very tough American League playoffs this year.
Take away Betts and Benintendi from the Sawx, as the Yankees have been missing Sanchez and Judge, and tell me how much they're "getting the job done"
I listed who was and was likely unavailable for that situation. The conclusion was that the only two "better" possibilities were Robertson and Betances.
In a serious question, WHY would Boone bring in either one in the 6th when behind? Betances had shown serious problems in going multiple innings and would likely only give them one inning. If you use Robertson for multiple innings, he might not be available again until Wednesday or Thursday.
The Yanks have no off days until the 20th. They don't have a strong multi-inning option outside of Robertson and Green- who had already pitched- and will likely need them to be available in the next two series.
Again, show me where the better option than Cole was in that situation. If you look at it in a context of more than one game, and put aside the distracting thought of wanting to beat the Mets, there was not a better logical option considering the need to preserve the pen for the next several days.
That you can definitively say we’re unavailable — Holder and Gray.
In a 9-man bullpen.
Green threw 14 pitches in the 5th, off of 2 days off if I’m not mistaken. A second inning would have been a reasonable option.
Britton
Robertson
Betances
Getting a combined 5 innings out of those 4 guys (assuming the game remained close) would not be a tremendous ask. And that’s ignoring the potential use of Chapman if they overcome a 1-run deficit in a game thAt deGrom clearly wasn’t long for.
Using those guys in the 6th inning of a winnable game is not some kind of tilt play that destroys you for days on end. Can’t do it every day, of course.
Britton needs to get his ass in gear. He's been terrible. 9 hits and 6 walks in 7.1 IP?
Yup. Not good. He looks like he's close - but he's still just a little off. If we have anything close to the old Zach Britton come October, he'll be a major weapon. But he's got to get right.
A lot of pitchers on this team do right now. Feels like a lot of guys are hitting a rough patch. Tanaka had a rough last start, Sevy has been struggling since the break basically. Chappy has struggled, Green hasn't been quite as good as he was in the first half, Cole turned into a turd, Holder got tagged badly @ Fenway. We just talked about Britton. Gray has been a disaster all year.
almost all the hits he gives up are weak ground balls. But more than you would think should find holes. Couple that with him not throwing enough strikes and it's a big problem. But I think with regular work he'll be good in time. Big change going from Buck to the Yankee brain trust information overload and not closing anymore.
This season is quite confusing. The past month or so has been filled with horrible losses. But the record is still on pace for 100 + wins and if they win the wild card game a date with Boston in the playoffs. That should be the entire focus for the next 44 games.
Hey Greg, Judge/Sanchez is a great comp this year 1650 combined OPS vs 2000 not even in the same ballpark substituting Jackie Bradley would make a better comp
...was very strange seeing Boone almost give up on the game with the Yankees trailing 4-3. deGrom is gutsy, but he was hittable yesterday. Didn't have his best stuff.
Lets Go Yanks
Its a shame how the Mets have potentially ruined Degrom's Cy Young season. If they gave him any run support he would be a unanimous choice. He is that good this year. I hope the votes look past his record and give it to him. He deserves it.
That said...
Let's go, Yanks! :)
Lets Go Yanks
Its a shame how the Mets have potentially ruined Degrom's Cy Young season. If they gave him any run support he would be a unanimous choice. He is that good this year. I hope the votes look past his record and give it to him. He deserves it.
Felix Hernandez won a Cy Young with a 13-12 record and a 2.27 ERA 8 years ago. If DeGrom finishes with a 1.77 ERA he pretty much has to win.
deGrom is absolutely not a lock.
Scherzer is leading the majors in wins, games started, innings pitched, strikeouts, and is leading the NL in WHIP, k/9 and k/bb.
Here's hoping we can get through a couple of innings before reaching for the mute button.
I like ARod as a studio analyst but in the booth he never shuts up. Actually all three of them never do. It's like a chat fest and sometimes they forget a game is actually going on.
I would think he’d need a couple rehab starts to build his innings back up, he’s been out awhile and wouldn’t be able to give much length
deGrom is absolutely not a lock.
Scherzer is leading the majors in wins, games started, innings pitched, strikeouts, and is leading the NL in WHIP, k/9 and k/bb.
That’s not what I said. If deGrom is 0.50 better in era it’s bascially going to trump everything else by a wide margin for me (assuming IP is relatively the same).
It's very close. Neither guy is even remotely close to a lock and deGrom's only chance is to be half a run or better.
If Scherzer has an era down near 2 and is still leading the league in all of those categories I think he's going to win it.
Seems to me it's a control issue. He's already hit 95 so I don't think his arm is the problem. Plus he was hitting 98-99 at the end of his last start.
That HR wasn't off a fastball either like the analyst said it was. The pitch was 87 mph so no way was it a heater.
lol. Good call.
It's very close. Neither guy is even remotely close to a lock and deGrom's only chance is to be half a run or better.
If Scherzer has an era down near 2 and is still leading the league in all of those categories I think he's going to win it.
What matters more than runs allowed? Ks are cool and all but they aren’t worth more in the outs column. If he’s getting more outs per runs scored that’s literally all that matters. WHIP favors Scherzer but it’s the same as Ks - are those base runners scoring or aren’t they?
I was being facetious saying he’s a lock. To your point it’s impossible to know what voter uses what criteria but I think but that’s really the only reason why I’d have any doubt. He’s been the best pitcher in baseball at doing his primary job - keeping runs from happening. His team sucking behind him should be irrelevant.
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It's not going to trump everything else by a "wide margin" in the eye of the voters, though.
It's very close. Neither guy is even remotely close to a lock and deGrom's only chance is to be half a run or better.
If Scherzer has an era down near 2 and is still leading the league in all of those categories I think he's going to win it.
What matters more than runs allowed? Ks are cool and all but they aren’t worth more in the outs column. If he’s getting more outs per runs scored that’s literally all that matters. WHIP favors Scherzer but it’s the same as Ks - are those base runners scoring or aren’t they?
I was being facetious saying he’s a lock. To your point it’s impossible to know what voter uses what criteria but I think but that’s really the only reason why I’d have any doubt. He’s been the best pitcher in baseball at doing his primary job - keeping runs from happening. His team sucking behind him should be irrelevant.
Allowing runs shouldn't be solely on the pitcher. It takes 9 guys in the field. A pitcher shouldn't be penalized if he has 8 statues behind him which is why fWAR pulls from FIP more than ERA. I agree with Arc. Sherzer is the favorite for now and I'm an obvious deGrom homer.
I hate to be coldhearted, but he is 24, why should he be fatigued any more than anyone else? This has been going on since the AS break and he had a nice break then.
They can't afford to shut him down for two weeks.
I'm not sure he is fatigued either. He's not a frail guy like Sale, he's a big strong, young guy. Plus he's hitting 95-96 here in the 1st inning. It's not like he's down in the low 90's.
Weird,
A lot will come down to the last 6 weeks or so of the season, obviously.
Weird,
Ask Matt den Dekker and Travis d'Arnaud.
Weird,
I had a customer of Dutch descent who had a similar name and that's how his name started as well.
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It's not going to trump everything else by a "wide margin" in the eye of the voters, though.
It's very close. Neither guy is even remotely close to a lock and deGrom's only chance is to be half a run or better.
If Scherzer has an era down near 2 and is still leading the league in all of those categories I think he's going to win it.
What matters more than runs allowed? Ks are cool and all but they aren’t worth more in the outs column. If he’s getting more outs per runs scored that’s literally all that matters. WHIP favors Scherzer but it’s the same as Ks - are those base runners scoring or aren’t they?
I was being facetious saying he’s a lock. To your point it’s impossible to know what voter uses what criteria but I think but that’s really the only reason why I’d have any doubt. He’s been the best pitcher in baseball at doing his primary job - keeping runs from happening. His team sucking behind him should be irrelevant.
Of course the primary objective is to prevent runs from scoring but when the disparity there isn't that major and one guy is leading the league in so many other categories, I think the scale is tipped in his favor.
deGrom is having an absolutely fantastic year. But I think the voters will still ultimately choose Scherzer unless the disparity in ERA is a half run+.. which I don't think it will be come seasons end.
Boo. Just Booooooooooooooo. Awful, but accurate representation of the defensive effort displayed by this team in the past two weeks.
Todd Frazier would have dived on his teeth for that. Just piss poor.
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a two week break. Like what Boston just did with Sale. It’s pretty clear he’s fatigued, the fastball is down a few ticks, the slider is flat. I’m concerned they’re going to run him into the ground
They can't afford to shut him down for two weeks.
I'm not sure he is fatigued either. He's not a frail guy like Sale, he's a big strong, young guy. Plus he's hitting 95-96 here in the 1st inning. It's not like he's down in the low 90's.
That’s down 2-3 mph from where he normally sits. So yes that’s concerning. They can afford to shut him down for two weeks. They’re not catching Boston, they have a five game wild card lead, and they’re in a weak part of the schedule. What they truly cannot afford is to have him keep pitching like this and be a complete unknown going into October.
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In comment 14038435 Kyle in NY said:
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a two week break. Like what Boston just did with Sale. It’s pretty clear he’s fatigued, the fastball is down a few ticks, the slider is flat. I’m concerned they’re going to run him into the ground
They can't afford to shut him down for two weeks.
I'm not sure he is fatigued either. He's not a frail guy like Sale, he's a big strong, young guy. Plus he's hitting 95-96 here in the 1st inning. It's not like he's down in the low 90's.
That’s down 2-3 mph from where he normally sits. So yes that’s concerning. They can afford to shut him down for two weeks. They’re not catching Boston, they have a five game wild card lead, and they’re in a weak part of the schedule. What they truly cannot afford is to have him keep pitching like this and be a complete unknown going into October.
I agree - I think everything right now should be done under the assumption that this team is going to be in the play-in. The division got away @ Fenway - I'd like to think there's still a chance but I just don't think it's going to happen. It's more important to make sure guys like Sevy are 100% (or close) going into October.
NYY are pretty much a lock for WC1 at this point. I don't know what the exact odds are, but I'm sure they're very high.
Nice pitch to get Conforto.
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In comment 14038435 Kyle in NY said:
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a two week break. Like what Boston just did with Sale. It’s pretty clear he’s fatigued, the fastball is down a few ticks, the slider is flat. I’m concerned they’re going to run him into the ground
They can't afford to shut him down for two weeks.
I'm not sure he is fatigued either. He's not a frail guy like Sale, he's a big strong, young guy. Plus he's hitting 95-96 here in the 1st inning. It's not like he's down in the low 90's.
That’s down 2-3 mph from where he normally sits. So yes that’s concerning. They can afford to shut him down for two weeks. They’re not catching Boston, they have a five game wild card lead, and they’re in a weak part of the schedule. What they truly cannot afford is to have him keep pitching like this and be a complete unknown going into October.
Completely agree.
I think it's more a release point/control issue. In the 1st half he was painting with every pitch. Putting them exactly where he wanted. He's still got good movement and velocity, but he's not hitting the spots he wants or had been.
I also disagree with being in a good enough spot to just rest him a couple of weeks. The A's are charging and I wouldn't count them out of the Divison race with the Stros. Last thing I want is a one game road WC game at Houston.
The Yanks can't assume anything at this point and every game is important for them to win. Plus while many fans have given up on catching the Sox I really doubt the Yanks team and brass have.
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In comment 14038431 arcarsenal said:
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It's not going to trump everything else by a "wide margin" in the eye of the voters, though.
It's very close. Neither guy is even remotely close to a lock and deGrom's only chance is to be half a run or better.
If Scherzer has an era down near 2 and is still leading the league in all of those categories I think he's going to win it.
What matters more than runs allowed? Ks are cool and all but they aren’t worth more in the outs column. If he’s getting more outs per runs scored that’s literally all that matters. WHIP favors Scherzer but it’s the same as Ks - are those base runners scoring or aren’t they?
I was being facetious saying he’s a lock. To your point it’s impossible to know what voter uses what criteria but I think but that’s really the only reason why I’d have any doubt. He’s been the best pitcher in baseball at doing his primary job - keeping runs from happening. His team sucking behind him should be irrelevant.
Allowing runs shouldn't be solely on the pitcher. It takes 9 guys in the field. A pitcher shouldn't be penalized if he has 8 statues behind him which is why fWAR pulls from FIP more than ERA. I agree with Arc. Sherzer is the favorite for now and I'm an obvious deGrom homer.
I'm not following the logic of "FIP is more important than ERA, the guy with the worse FIP (and xfip) is the favorite".
No, I get you didn't mean that. I just don't think they can even afford that.
If they think it is a fatigue issue I could see something like giving him an extra day before a start, but unless it's an arm issue, I think they keep running him out there because they need him.
Haha, I was going to post exactly that at the end of my last post.
We're all fans of the same team and want the best for them. We just have different opinions on some things. No biggie.
Oddly enough, it seemed to do the same in his last start too. Not sure why - it seems like he doesn't have a feel for it early in games and it's hanging.
You let 2 non hitters take you deep?
Not up near enough IMO. It looked to me to be right down the middle not even belt high.
Severino won’t get through 5 tonight.
Good to see
Totally.
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Again up in the zone. The long ball is killing Sevy.
Not up near enough IMO. It looked to me to be right down the middle not even belt high.
Well after another look it did appear to be about belt high but still not up near enough. That one he can handle but up higher he can't.
Or is the this the raw stuff and no command Sevy that started 2016 like garabage and lost his rotation spot?
They need to figure it out now, because this line the Mets trotted our sucks ass, yet, it’s 4-2
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In comment 14038485 arcarsenal said:
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Again up in the zone. The long ball is killing Sevy.
Not up near enough IMO. It looked to me to be right down the middle not even belt high.
Well after another look it did appear to be about belt high but still not up near enough. That one he can handle but up higher he can't.
Trying to work and watch at the same time, I thought that pitch was supposed to be lower and he left it too high - maybe Romine was calling for up and out of the zone in which case, yeah, not high enough. Right at the sweet spot of the barrel.
Or is the this the raw stuff and no command Sevy that started 2016 like garabage and lost his rotation spot?
They need to figure it out now, because this line the Mets trotted our sucks ass, yet, it’s 4-2
No they already addressed that. It has to be fatigue. The Sox did it with Sale. What’s the point in continuing to run him out there? The division is gone and even if it wasn’t he’s not effective period. This isn’t just l one or two bad starts. Something is wrong.
Embarrassing.
Embarrassing.
Agree, awful
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There wasn't any conclusive shot showing the tag was applied.
Embarrassing.
Agree, awful
Oh come on now. It absolutely was conclusive. He had the tag on Conforto left leg. Just because the incompetent announcers were looking at the arm and not the left leg doesn’t make it fact. He had the tag on when the foot popped up.
Now, if you want to say that the call is absurd because it’s not the intent of replay, I’d agree with you. This crap has gotten ridiculous. Plays like that are certainly not what replay was intended for, but, here were I guess. I agree the call was terrible, but different reasons I guess...
And I suppose Hicks asked for time and it wasn't given. And I don't have a problem with it. Too many times the pitchers starts and the ump gives the time call/...
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In comment 14038515 Knineteen said:
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There wasn't any conclusive shot showing the tag was applied.
Embarrassing.
Agree, awful
Oh come on now. It absolutely was conclusive. He had the tag on Conforto left leg. Just because the incompetent announcers were looking at the arm and not the left leg doesn’t make it fact. He had the tag on when the foot popped up.
Now, if you want to say that the call is absurd because it’s not the intent of replay, I’d agree with you. This crap has gotten ridiculous. Plays like that are certainly not what replay was intended for, but, here were I guess. I agree the call was terrible, but different reasons I guess...
I agree with you all around there Big Blue.
Gleyber is real good with the tags and I thought he did keep the tag on the leg.
I don't like the ticky tack use of replay there either, and I can't imagine that's the type of thing they intended when putting replay in. Unfortunately now that it's here, we're going to keep getting those types of calls.
This was stupid.
Nice!
At this point just let Cole throw the rest of the game and DFA him immediately after.
Lets see if the bullpen can hang on or find a new way to lose it
Nice!
Pretty much the instant AJ Cole’s MLB career came to an end. He’s trash.
Yankees current 40 man roster - ( New Window )
Trust me, this game is far from over
This was stupid.
Managers of tresting one run deficits as high leverage spots is very confusing
Well, they are pretty. All 12 of them.
;)
McNeil adding two runs to his ERA tonight by airmailing a routine double play certainly didn't help his case. lol.
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same video of all deGrom's Ks every inning?
Well, they are pretty. All 12 of them.
No doubt.
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I’m glad the team scored some runs for Jake tonight but what this team has done to him this season is criminal.
McNeil adding two runs to his ERA tonight by airmailing a routine double play certainly didn't help his case. lol.
His error only added one earned run. Unless the scoring has changed.
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In comment 14038576 PhiPsi125 said:
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I’m glad the team scored some runs for Jake tonight but what this team has done to him this season is criminal.
McNeil adding two runs to his ERA tonight by airmailing a routine double play certainly didn't help his case. lol.
His error only added one earned run. Unless the scoring has changed.
Yes because you cant assume a double play... McNeil makes a routine play and no runs score that inning. deGrom's next pitch was a fly ball out.
Tomorrow is another day.
It’s more than likely he’s tipping pitches, maybe even before the wind-up, hitter are squaring up the high octane fastball like they are sitting on it and not even flinching at the slider. What the heck is going on?
Torres trying to do too much
It’s more than likely he’s tipping pitches, maybe even before the wind-up, hitter are squaring up the high octane fastball like they are sitting on it and not even flinching at the slider. What the heck is going on?
I have to think if he's tipping pitches, they would have figured that out by now. This has been going on for weeks and that had to be one of the very first things they looked at.
I honestly just think it's fatigue. I'd give him 2 weeks and see how he responds to it.
He's pitching poorly right now - no way around it. So, trotting him out there every 5 days isn't helping any.
Britton really needs to get it together. He has not been good.
Torres trying to do too much
Like catching the ball....takes his eyes off the ball again. Rookie mistake.
Third base would have been better.
Still trying to figure out what exactly Boone was doing with Cole in the 7th inning.
Haha. I wouldn't go that far but I pray I never have to hear them again. Whatever happened to just calling the damn game and analyzing what's going on?
Too many of these guys now never stop talking and think we tune in to listen to their stories. It's like they think the game isn't interesting enough and they have to try and entertain us, which they fail horribly at.
25 years between Olbermann games. Another 25 is too soon.
Why has Tommy Kahnle been seemingly banished? I know he went through velocity issues but there’s no way he isn’t a better option than Cole at this point.
Doesn't make sense.
Why has Tommy Kahnle been seemingly banished? I know he went through velocity issues but there’s no way he isn’t a better option than Cole at this point.
I don't understand the Cole part either but honestly I've stopped trying to understand these moves. There's been so many I don't understand I've chalked it up to a rookie manager finding his way and now I just hope they work out.
I'm tired of getting frustrated by them and trying to get answers or others opinions only to be called whiny for voicing an opinion on Boone's moves.
No idea about Kahnle but I'd imagine it's still a velocity issue or maybe he hasn't been back down there for ten days yet? I'm not sure the exact day then sent him back down.
As for Severino - he(Sevy) says he is definitely not tired and pretty emphatic about it.
I think Kahnle's problem is he has lost his control. Too many walks. Yes speed is down to 95-96 vs 97-98.
I don’t know if the Sox would of done anything against degrom. But Red Sox pitchers would not be getting lit up like a Christmas tree against this pitiful met lineup. 15 hits for the Mets last night 15 hits. That’s ridiculous have to mets had 15 hits in a game this season?? Some of these losses the Yankees have had since early July have been god awful. If they would of taken care of business against these garbage teams they could be in striking distance for th division and now they better be worried about Oakland 3.5 games in nothing that team doesn’t lose either and Seattle is playing well to only saving grace is these teams play each other a lot but Yankees could Very well blow the Home field for that game.
As for Severino - he(Sevy) says he is definitely not tired and pretty emphatic about it.
I think Kahnle's problem is he has lost his control. Too many walks. Yes speed is down to 95-96 vs 97-98.
I said it last night, but I’m still confounded by it this morning.
I try to pick my spots carefully and sparingly when it comes to hammering managerial decisions, but using Cole in last night’s spot is pretty infuriating.
Usually, even if I would have done things differently, I can sympathize with the angle the manager was seeing. This one was really not excusable.
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out Boone in RAB this morning on the Cole relief. The whining for Warren is only somewhat warranted. While he is certainly better than Cole, Warren was not Warren any more. He had been a bit shaky this year.
As for Severino - he(Sevy) says he is definitely not tired and pretty emphatic about it.
I think Kahnle's problem is he has lost his control. Too many walks. Yes speed is down to 95-96 vs 97-98.
I said it last night, but I’m still confounded by it this morning.
I try to pick my spots carefully and sparingly when it comes to hammering managerial decisions, but using Cole in last night’s spot is pretty infuriating.
Usually, even if I would have done things differently, I can sympathize with the angle the manager was seeing. This one was really not excusable.
I think people are engaging in 20-20 hindsight on Cole and not being honest with themselves- especially one poster with a VERY anti-Boone agenda that they have been hammering away on ALL SEASON.
Going into last night's game, Cole had been very good, though he had a rough outing against Texas. Coming into last night's outing, in his last 23 and 2/3 IP, Cole had only given up 19 hits and 7 walks (that's a WHIP just about 1.10, which is fine), with 31 K and an ERA near 3.00.
That's NOT a bad reliever- and you are not going to use your best relievers when you are down 2 runs after a series in which the bullpen was overused because the SP was bad.
The decision to go with Cole was completely justifiable- he did have a bad outing against Texas, but had been solid for about a month before that, so there was no reason to believe that the Texas game was anything more than a blip in an otherwise solid month.
The Yanks had an untested Kontos, and were not likely to bring in Britton into that situation. Betances was probably available, but you aren't going to bring him into a game when you are down 2 in the 7th when you have no off-days in the near future.
Chapman was certainly not coming in at that point. Gray had pitched the day before (badly) and was likely not available anyway. Green had just pitched the 6th- and they probably didn't want to go multiple innings with Green likely to be needed in the next series. Holder had gone 2 innings on Sunday and was probably not available either.
The only remaining possible reliever would have been DRobertson. Again, look at the situation- the Yanks rely heavily on Robertson, and were not going to use him in a game where they are already 2 runs down and no off-days coming up.
Boone made the best decision that was available to him- outside of the bad outing on Friday against Texas, Cole had been rather good- but Cole is also pretty low in the bullpen pecking order. Boone was trying to get Cole to get them one inning and see if the offense could do something. It didn't work out- it happens.
Losing to a bad team like the Mets sucks, but let's not pretend that Boone lost the game because Cole spit the bit. The Yanks lost the game because something isn't right with Severino, who gave up 4 runs to a terrible Mets offense. Cole came in with the Yanks behind 4-2, with deGrom still on the mound and in full control of the game.
The decision was the right one at the time- and in hindsight probably still is. The Yanks avoided using Robertson, Holder, Betances- and only used Green for one inning- meaning that the regulars in the pen are fully rested and prepared for the Rays.
It gets VERY tiresome to see the CONSTANT moaning about decisions that if people spent less time jumping on the agenda-driven bandwagon against Boone led by one-poster here, and actually put some real thought into the decision, would realize that Boone was right.
He shouldn't be pitching in a one run game, period. Whether it's a lead or a deficit. He was willing to use Britton with a two run deficit in the 9th, so why can't he come in earlier? And why is he allowed to stay in to give up not one, not two, but three home runs?
He was brought on in a 1-run game in the 6th against a bad team. To me, that absolutely needs to be considered a medium-to-high leverage spot.
Leaving him in for the 7th after he had allowed it to be a 2-fun game was a “made-our-bed-now-we-sleep-in-it” thing that I can live with.
It’s the initial decision that bugs me. That situation is the exact type of thing that the top 2/3 of this bullpen was designed for.
Take away Betts and Benintendi from the Sawx, as the Yankees have been missing Sanchez and Judge, and tell me how much they're "getting the job done"
In a serious question, WHY would Boone bring in either one in the 6th when behind? Betances had shown serious problems in going multiple innings and would likely only give them one inning. If you use Robertson for multiple innings, he might not be available again until Wednesday or Thursday.
The Yanks have no off days until the 20th. They don't have a strong multi-inning option outside of Robertson and Green- who had already pitched- and will likely need them to be available in the next two series.
Again, show me where the better option than Cole was in that situation. If you look at it in a context of more than one game, and put aside the distracting thought of wanting to beat the Mets, there was not a better logical option considering the need to preserve the pen for the next several days.
In a 9-man bullpen.
Green threw 14 pitches in the 5th, off of 2 days off if I’m not mistaken. A second inning would have been a reasonable option.
Britton
Robertson
Betances
Getting a combined 5 innings out of those 4 guys (assuming the game remained close) would not be a tremendous ask. And that’s ignoring the potential use of Chapman if they overcome a 1-run deficit in a game thAt deGrom clearly wasn’t long for.
Using those guys in the 6th inning of a winnable game is not some kind of tilt play that destroys you for days on end. Can’t do it every day, of course.
Yup. Not good. He looks like he's close - but he's still just a little off. If we have anything close to the old Zach Britton come October, he'll be a major weapon. But he's got to get right.
A lot of pitchers on this team do right now. Feels like a lot of guys are hitting a rough patch. Tanaka had a rough last start, Sevy has been struggling since the break basically. Chappy has struggled, Green hasn't been quite as good as he was in the first half, Cole turned into a turd, Holder got tagged badly @ Fenway. We just talked about Britton. Gray has been a disaster all year.
Gotta get these guys back on track.
This season is quite confusing. The past month or so has been filled with horrible losses. But the record is still on pace for 100 + wins and if they win the wild card game a date with Boston in the playoffs. That should be the entire focus for the next 44 games.