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NFT: MLB Game Thread - Mets @ Yankees - deGrom vs. Severino

adamg : 8/13/2018 4:06 pm
SS Rosario
RF Nimmo
LF Conforto
1B Flores
2B McNeil
3B Frazier
CF Jackson
DH Bautista
C Mesoraco

LF Gardner
DH Stanton
SS Gregorius
CF Hicks
3B Andujar
1B Bird
2B Torres
RF Walker
C Romine

And Sevy and deGrom on the mound. Let's go Yanks!
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RE: RE: Axisa basically calls  
rich in DC : 8/14/2018 10:02 am : link
In comment 14038702 bigbluehoya said:
Quote:
In comment 14038671 section125 said:


Quote:


out Boone in RAB this morning on the Cole relief. The whining for Warren is only somewhat warranted. While he is certainly better than Cole, Warren was not Warren any more. He had been a bit shaky this year.

As for Severino - he(Sevy) says he is definitely not tired and pretty emphatic about it.

I think Kahnle's problem is he has lost his control. Too many walks. Yes speed is down to 95-96 vs 97-98.



I said it last night, but I’m still confounded by it this morning.

I try to pick my spots carefully and sparingly when it comes to hammering managerial decisions, but using Cole in last night’s spot is pretty infuriating.

Usually, even if I would have done things differently, I can sympathize with the angle the manager was seeing. This one was really not excusable.


I think people are engaging in 20-20 hindsight on Cole and not being honest with themselves- especially one poster with a VERY anti-Boone agenda that they have been hammering away on ALL SEASON.

Going into last night's game, Cole had been very good, though he had a rough outing against Texas. Coming into last night's outing, in his last 23 and 2/3 IP, Cole had only given up 19 hits and 7 walks (that's a WHIP just about 1.10, which is fine), with 31 K and an ERA near 3.00.

That's NOT a bad reliever- and you are not going to use your best relievers when you are down 2 runs after a series in which the bullpen was overused because the SP was bad.

The decision to go with Cole was completely justifiable- he did have a bad outing against Texas, but had been solid for about a month before that, so there was no reason to believe that the Texas game was anything more than a blip in an otherwise solid month.

The Yanks had an untested Kontos, and were not likely to bring in Britton into that situation. Betances was probably available, but you aren't going to bring him into a game when you are down 2 in the 7th when you have no off-days in the near future.

Chapman was certainly not coming in at that point. Gray had pitched the day before (badly) and was likely not available anyway. Green had just pitched the 6th- and they probably didn't want to go multiple innings with Green likely to be needed in the next series. Holder had gone 2 innings on Sunday and was probably not available either.

The only remaining possible reliever would have been DRobertson. Again, look at the situation- the Yanks rely heavily on Robertson, and were not going to use him in a game where they are already 2 runs down and no off-days coming up.

Boone made the best decision that was available to him- outside of the bad outing on Friday against Texas, Cole had been rather good- but Cole is also pretty low in the bullpen pecking order. Boone was trying to get Cole to get them one inning and see if the offense could do something. It didn't work out- it happens.

Losing to a bad team like the Mets sucks, but let's not pretend that Boone lost the game because Cole spit the bit. The Yanks lost the game because something isn't right with Severino, who gave up 4 runs to a terrible Mets offense. Cole came in with the Yanks behind 4-2, with deGrom still on the mound and in full control of the game.

The decision was the right one at the time- and in hindsight probably still is. The Yanks avoided using Robertson, Holder, Betances- and only used Green for one inning- meaning that the regulars in the pen are fully rested and prepared for the Rays.

It gets VERY tiresome to see the CONSTANT moaning about decisions that if people spent less time jumping on the agenda-driven bandwagon against Boone led by one-poster here, and actually put some real thought into the decision, would realize that Boone was right.
It was a one run game  
Kyle in NY : 8/14/2018 10:23 am : link
when Cole came in and it's become pretty clear that whatever he did earlier in the season was a fluke. He's struggled beyond just the Texas game. He has a career 4.82 ERA in a decent sized sample. That's what he is.

He shouldn't be pitching in a one run game, period. Whether it's a lead or a deficit. He was willing to use Britton with a two run deficit in the 9th, so why can't he come in earlier? And why is he allowed to stay in to give up not one, not two, but three home runs?
Rich  
bigbluehoya : 8/14/2018 10:30 am : link
I’m 100% on the same page about the literally constant Boone-bitching, but I have to disagree on this one.

He was brought on in a 1-run game in the 6th against a bad team. To me, that absolutely needs to be considered a medium-to-high leverage spot.

Leaving him in for the 7th after he had allowed it to be a 2-fun game was a “made-our-bed-now-we-sleep-in-it” thing that I can live with.

It’s the initial decision that bugs me. That situation is the exact type of thing that the top 2/3 of this bullpen was designed for.
RE: The Difference Between the Yankees and Red Sox  
Greg from LI : 8/14/2018 10:40 am : link
In comment 14038667 varco said:
Quote:
Last Night the Red Sox would have come in and brushed the Mets aside, piling up runs and hits, while stifling the Mets' bats. That's been the story all season ----the Red Sox just get the job done especially against lesser teams -- they seem to own Baltimore this year, while the Yankees "play down" to the level of their competition. The Red Sox core group of young players plus JD Martinez make them formidable opponents, while the Yankees don't seem to have the "killer instinct". Hope is the Yanks get a healthy Judge back (and he learns to lay off the low outside breaking pitches) and the rest of the team gets on a roll late in the season. Very tough American League playoffs this year.


Take away Betts and Benintendi from the Sawx, as the Yankees have been missing Sanchez and Judge, and tell me how much they're "getting the job done"
.  
arcarsenal : 8/14/2018 10:42 am : link
Cole had a 6.43 ERA in his 4 previous outings prior to last night. He was the wrong guy to use there. Full stop.
yeah, I was hoping that Cole might turn out to be some kind of  
Greg from LI : 8/14/2018 10:46 am : link
surprise diamond in the rough, but he had already proven before last night that his brief spell of effectiveness was a total fluke.
I will note again  
rich in DC : 8/14/2018 11:33 am : link
I listed who was and was likely unavailable for that situation. The conclusion was that the only two "better" possibilities were Robertson and Betances.

In a serious question, WHY would Boone bring in either one in the 6th when behind? Betances had shown serious problems in going multiple innings and would likely only give them one inning. If you use Robertson for multiple innings, he might not be available again until Wednesday or Thursday.

The Yanks have no off days until the 20th. They don't have a strong multi-inning option outside of Robertson and Green- who had already pitched- and will likely need them to be available in the next two series.

Again, show me where the better option than Cole was in that situation. If you look at it in a context of more than one game, and put aside the distracting thought of wanting to beat the Mets, there was not a better logical option considering the need to preserve the pen for the next several days.
There were 2 pitchers  
bigbluehoya : 8/14/2018 12:03 pm : link
That you can definitively say we’re unavailable — Holder and Gray.

In a 9-man bullpen.

Green threw 14 pitches in the 5th, off of 2 days off if I’m not mistaken. A second inning would have been a reasonable option.

Britton
Robertson
Betances

Getting a combined 5 innings out of those 4 guys (assuming the game remained close) would not be a tremendous ask. And that’s ignoring the potential use of Chapman if they overcome a 1-run deficit in a game thAt deGrom clearly wasn’t long for.

Using those guys in the 6th inning of a winnable game is not some kind of tilt play that destroys you for days on end. Can’t do it every day, of course.
.  
arcarsenal : 8/14/2018 12:53 pm : link
Robertson was the right guy to go to there, IMO.
By the way  
Greg from LI : 8/14/2018 1:01 pm : link
Britton needs to get his ass in gear. He's been terrible. 9 hits and 6 walks in 7.1 IP?
RE: By the way  
arcarsenal : 8/14/2018 1:25 pm : link
In comment 14038953 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
Britton needs to get his ass in gear. He's been terrible. 9 hits and 6 walks in 7.1 IP?


Yup. Not good. He looks like he's close - but he's still just a little off. If we have anything close to the old Zach Britton come October, he'll be a major weapon. But he's got to get right.

A lot of pitchers on this team do right now. Feels like a lot of guys are hitting a rough patch. Tanaka had a rough last start, Sevy has been struggling since the break basically. Chappy has struggled, Green hasn't been quite as good as he was in the first half, Cole turned into a turd, Holder got tagged badly @ Fenway. We just talked about Britton. Gray has been a disaster all year.

Gotta get these guys back on track.
Weird thing with Britton is  
arniefez : 8/14/2018 1:32 pm : link
almost all the hits he gives up are weak ground balls. But more than you would think should find holes. Couple that with him not throwing enough strikes and it's a big problem. But I think with regular work he'll be good in time. Big change going from Buck to the Yankee brain trust information overload and not closing anymore.

This season is quite confusing. The past month or so has been filled with horrible losses. But the record is still on pace for 100 + wins and if they win the wild card game a date with Boston in the playoffs. That should be the entire focus for the next 44 games.
yeah, big change going from Buck  
Greg from LI : 8/14/2018 1:35 pm : link
the loser who has won one playoff series in approximately 57 years of managing. He's such an ace!
So it's not a big change going from the Orioles to the Yankees?  
arniefez : 8/14/2018 2:40 pm : link
Not a big change from knowing you're the closer and when you're going to pitch to not being sure? Who knew? Seems like it would be for most players.
Betts Benintendi Comp  
Possum : 8/14/2018 2:44 pm : link
Hey Greg, Judge/Sanchez is a great comp this year 1650 combined OPS vs 2000 not even in the same ballpark substituting Jackie Bradley would make a better comp
As a Mets fan  
fanofthejets : 8/14/2018 5:17 pm : link
...was very strange seeing Boone almost give up on the game with the Yankees trailing 4-3. deGrom is gutsy, but he was hittable yesterday. Didn't have his best stuff.
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