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NFT: Mets Game 2 Doubleheader vs Marlins

allstarjim : 9/13/2018 6:09 pm
Before we get to game 2, how about that finish to game 1!!! WOW! Bottom of the 9th, 2 outs, nobody on, down 3-2, Conforto and Frazier go back to back bombs to win it! So awesome.

Game 2:

RHP Jeff Brigham vs Vargas

Lineups yet to be announced.

#LGM...How about a 14-3 finish to get to .500! I know, crazy talk, but let's get crazy.
Pages: 1 2 3 <<Prev | Show All |
And to the point about Morton...  
ZGiants98 : 9/14/2018 1:38 pm : link
Sure it would be nice to do both but the Yankees would kill to have second starter even in the same hemisphere as Thor/Wheeler.. sometimes itís not just about payroll and you canít be elite in every area, including your 4th and 5th starters.. IMO the Mets offense should be the biggest priority followed by the pen but thatís just me. .
Agree PJ - I'm hoping the mets learned from not spending in 2013/2014  
Eric on Li : 9/14/2018 1:39 pm : link
because even though those teams were not ready to contend had they added 1 strong FA in their prime who got a reasonable deal - let's say Andrew Miller - think about how much that would have ended up helping the 2015 team. The Granderson signing is the perfect example of adding a good player at a reasonable price who didn't move the needle a ton on his own but ultimately made a huge difference once the team around him was good.

I don't think anyone is naive enough to believe the Mets would spend to bring in Harper/Machado, or that they'd even want to come here in the first place. But they can't do what they did in the first half of Sandy's tenure when they literally sat out entire offseasons. They also can't do what they did in the 2nd half of Sandy's tenure where they made bad moves in the offseason like Cuddyer/Bruce but that's another story.
Heís the one trade target Iíd focus on all offseason  
Shecky : 9/14/2018 1:41 pm : link
Nick Senzel
pass on Abreu - and that goes for almost anyone wrong side of 30  
Eric on Li : 9/14/2018 1:42 pm : link
especially if it's requiring top prospects. In salary swap deals around Bruce's contract or something like that maybe, but if I'm trading any of the top guys in the minors it's going to be for someone with at least 2-3 seasons in their 20's. And it's got to be a positive impact player on both O & D.
The way I look at it is the Mets should  
pjcas18 : 9/14/2018 1:50 pm : link
identify the biggest holes, and fill the ones through free agency capable of being filled through free agency.

If that means Machado/Harper the Mets should do it. Of course I know they won't.

I'm not saying be the Yankees, but I remember before the 2009 season, my father, a diehard Yankees fan and I, talking about free agency. He told me, watch, the Yankees will sign CC Sabathia, AJ Burnett, and Mark Teixeira. I said no f-ing way the Yankees sign all 3. One maybe two possible, not all 3.

What did the Yankees do? They filled holes and signed all 3.

I don't want the Mets to do that per se, but part of the benefits of being a supposed big market teams are a) you can compete for the high $$$ free agents and b) if you go after one and it doesn't work out or doesn't work out the whole length of the contract it shouldn't cripple you as a franchise.

the Mets have so many low dollar contracts right now, they should be taking advantage of it and adding the best free agents to augment their home grown core.

they're not doing that. Vargas, Bruce and Frazier are examples of "half-assing" it. Swarzak is half-assing it. AJ Ramos was stupid and half-assing it.

Cespedes was a calculated risk that I'm fine with and the insurance should help.

The Mets want to fix shit, sign Harper, Kimbrel and Morton.


RE: Heís the one trade target Iíd focus on all offseason  
Metnut : 9/14/2018 1:50 pm : link
In comment 14074930 Shecky said:
Quote:
Nick Senzel


LOVE Senzel. I can't think of a realistic offer that we could make for him that wouldn't gut us though.
RE: Heís the one trade target Iíd focus on all offseason  
Eric on Li : 9/14/2018 1:51 pm : link
In comment 14074930 Shecky said:
Quote:
Nick Senzel


with the caveat that prospect for prospect trades rarely happen, how would you feel about Kelenic for Senzel? Or are thinking more along the lines of Matz for Senzel? Either is interesting but with gimenez rosario, mcneil alonso not sure where they see him in that mix. Reds have him listed as an OF so I guess that would be an option?
Senzel  
Shecky : 9/14/2018 1:58 pm : link
Reds are sick of losing and think they are an arm away from getting closer to gettiver the hump. If they can sign Scooter for reasonable $$ they donít have room for Senzel. He wonít help them in 2019.

I wouldnít think a prospect for prospect deal would be desired by either club, to be honest. I think reds would want Wheeler, if they can extend him. We would want Senzel. No clue if either side would make that deal - I would.

But Iíd push those talks hard. Starting yesterday. Lay the groundwork, get it done. Who knows, you talk the reds into believing theyíre ready enough and maybe they buy the bullshit. And decide to keep Senzel but arenít patient enough for India. You get an India for a Matz/Flores/Dom package and you laugh your ass off while getting the commish office on the line...
I still donít think itís that easy to just identify a guy and get him  
ZGiants98 : 9/14/2018 1:58 pm : link
Some offseason yes, others no. Even if the Mets had the money and made a decision to offer Machado or Harper 300 million they still would have only a slim shot. These are rare free agents that are amongst the best players in the sport who are also young. Will Machado even agree to play 3B? The Phillies, Braves, and countless other teams will all be interested. I honestly could see Harper wanting to come to the Mets more than Machado. Who knows though.
RE: RE: Heís the one trade target Iíd focus on all offseason  
Metnut : 9/14/2018 1:59 pm : link
In comment 14074948 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
In comment 14074930 Shecky said:


Quote:


Nick Senzel



with the caveat that prospect for prospect trades rarely happen, how would you feel about Kelenic for Senzel? Or are thinking more along the lines of Matz for Senzel? Either is interesting but with gimenez rosario, mcneil alonso not sure where they see him in that mix. Reds have him listed as an OF so I guess that would be an option?


I think that they would ask for at least for something like Giminez and Kelenic or Kay for Senzel. He's a top 10 prospect in baseball who's already raked at AA and AAA. He's MLB ready.

I'd seriously consider offering Giminez and Kelenic/Kay for him but not sure if Reds would even go for it. He could be our 3B for the next decade plus.
RE: Senzel  
ZGiants98 : 9/14/2018 2:00 pm : link
In comment 14074954 Shecky said:
Quote:
Reds are sick of losing and think they are an arm away from getting closer to gettiver the hump. If they can sign Scooter for reasonable $$ they donít have room for Senzel. He wonít help them in 2019.

I wouldnít think a prospect for prospect deal would be desired by either club, to be honest. I think reds would want Wheeler, if they can extend him. We would want Senzel. No clue if either side would make that deal - I would.

But Iíd push those talks hard. Starting yesterday. Lay the groundwork, get it done. Who knows, you talk the reds into believing theyíre ready enough and maybe they buy the bullshit. And decide to keep Senzel but arenít patient enough for India. You get an India for a Matz/Flores/Dom package and you laugh your ass off while getting the commish office on the line...


I like the idea of controlling a young 3B to grow with Alonso, Gimenez, and the rest of our young lineup but itís fristrating because by the time these guys are all peaking and in their primes the rotation will be long gone. Canít we ever have both units peaking at once? :(
RE: The way I look at it is the Mets should  
Eric on Li : 9/14/2018 2:02 pm : link
In comment 14074945 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
identify the biggest holes, and fill the ones through free agency capable of being filled through free agency.

If that means Machado/Harper the Mets should do it. Of course I know they won't.

I'm not saying be the Yankees, but I remember before the 2009 season, my father, a diehard Yankees fan and I, talking about free agency. He told me, watch, the Yankees will sign CC Sabathia, AJ Burnett, and Mark Teixeira. I said no f-ing way the Yankees sign all 3. One maybe two possible, not all 3.

What did the Yankees do? They filled holes and signed all 3.

I don't want the Mets to do that per se, but part of the benefits of being a supposed big market teams are a) you can compete for the high $$$ free agents and b) if you go after one and it doesn't work out or doesn't work out the whole length of the contract it shouldn't cripple you as a franchise.

the Mets have so many low dollar contracts right now, they should be taking advantage of it and adding the best free agents to augment their home grown core.

they're not doing that. Vargas, Bruce and Frazier are examples of "half-assing" it. Swarzak is half-assing it. AJ Ramos was stupid and half-assing it.

Cespedes was a calculated risk that I'm fine with and the insurance should help.

The Mets want to fix shit, sign Harper, Kimbrel and Morton.



I agree with almost all of this, other than to say I can understand passing on giving Harper the mega contract he will likely cost. Completely agree about the guys they half-assed it with needlessly, but I'd probably focus on the tier between those 2 categories of half ass and mega contracts. Recent offseason examples like Cain, Yelich, Ozuna, Chapman, Zobrist etc. All star level players who are well rounded and well paid, but don't require $100-200m.
Bruce swaps  
Shecky : 9/14/2018 2:04 pm : link
Thereís several to consider but he clearly needs to be moved.

A swap for Melancon seems like an absolute no brained for both sides and even almost fits dollar wise to the penny

Wouldnít like it, but King Felix swaps can even see. He seems cooked, but you can always hope for a CC type rebirth for one year or a move to the pen clicks. Unlikely.

Bruce plus salary (Vargas, Lagares, etc?) for Jordan Zimmerman flyer

Bruce plus for Pradowould be a really interesting option for Mets. Not sure how to make it fit for Marlins? Throw in a bunch of C prospect arms, Dom etc? Have to throw in cash regardless.
RE: Bruce swaps  
Eric on Li : 9/14/2018 2:07 pm : link
In comment 14074963 Shecky said:
Quote:
Thereís several to consider but he clearly needs to be moved.

A swap for Melancon seems like an absolute no brained for both sides and even almost fits dollar wise to the penny

Wouldnít like it, but King Felix swaps can even see. He seems cooked, but you can always hope for a CC type rebirth for one year or a move to the pen clicks. Unlikely.

Bruce plus salary (Vargas, Lagares, etc?) for Jordan Zimmerman flyer

Bruce plus for Pradowould be a really interesting option for Mets. Not sure how to make it fit for Marlins? Throw in a bunch of C prospect arms, Dom etc? Have to throw in cash regardless.


I'd be thrilled to get Prado for bench or Zimmerman for depth for Bruce. THRILLED. Those are the exact types of deals the Mets should be angling for around him. No issues with Melancon either, just can't be all they do in the BP.
I wouldnít offer the world for Senzel  
Shecky : 9/14/2018 2:10 pm : link
Reds are stuck. They want to move forward. They NEED to move forward. And theyíre best prospect is stuck behind an all star. And their recent #1 is buried behind him too. You want to contend, well unless you plan on using Senzel in a package for an available stud (none available), what do you do? You NEED an arm, a top arm, and we can fix that. No other team can or will be willing to.

Mets need a 3B for the future. Period. End of story. Rosario (and maybe eventually Vientos ) are the fallbacks as of today. Senzel fills that. Itís a great fit for both clubs. Donít mean it happens. But it could and should (at least in my meaningless humble opinion)

Lastly, the timing is perfect for the Mets. Senzel stock wonít be lower unless he gets 300ABs and fails miserably in his debut.
Shecky - what are thoughts on Mcneil at 3rd vs. 2nd?  
Eric on Li : 9/14/2018 2:16 pm : link
seemingly some combo of Rosario/Gimenez up the middle would be ideal long term, though if Mcneil entrenches himself at 2nd that obviously changes things.
Eric  
pjcas18 : 9/14/2018 2:17 pm : link
Yelich and Ozuna were trades though, so yes you strengthen your team, but you weaken your farm.

Free agents "only" cost $$$. So to me if your core is strong (which is where it has to start) you can supplement with free agents.

I'd have a limit to how high I'd go on Harper. $400M (on a 10 year deal like I've heard rumored is not in my plans - I'd do that for Trout, but not Harper), but 10 years $330M with an opt out after 5, I'd do something like that. If that or something in that area doesn't get it done, in no way would I feel like The Met are being cheap.

Harper and Machado are young proven super stars. those players make sense to over-spend for IMO.

Instead of adding Bruce, Frazier, and Swarzak for $33M, add one Harper for $33M and I bet your team is better with filling in the other two roles with lesser cost players.

Eric - agree with you 100%  
Shecky : 9/14/2018 2:17 pm : link
Bruce is fine if heís batting 7th or 8th. He is amazing around the kids. Iíd be OK carrying him. His salary isnít an albatross at all. He just adds nothing to the team in terms of filling any holes moving forward. Salary swap to fill a hole is so logical it hurts.

Bruce, Vargas for Zimmerman and maybe some cash. Done
Wheeler for Senzel. Done
Give or take a couple bucks, thatís virtually salary neutral.
Sign Douche Harper for all I care with some of Wrightís savings

Rosario
Nimmo
Harper
Alonso
Conforto
McNeil
Senzel
Plaw

I like that balance. A lot
And it cost about $15mm more than current salary
Itís young
Itís fun
Kept farm 100% intact
If your offering up Wheeler  
ZGiants98 : 9/14/2018 2:20 pm : link
Then it sounds like your punting on 2019 and focusing more on 2021, 2022 and fielding all offers for guys whoís contracts are close to expiring. Not sure thatís a bad plan long term... not sure how fans would feel about it.
RE: Shecky - what are thoughts on Mcneil at 3rd vs. 2nd?  
Shecky : 9/14/2018 2:20 pm : link
In comment 14074969 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
seemingly some combo of Rosario/Gimenez up the middle would be ideal long term, though if Mcneil entrenches himself at 2nd that obviously changes things.


McNeil is fine at 2nd, but a problem if Alanso is next to him instead ofDom lol

Reality is, or expectTion/hope is Rosario is at 3B one day. He seems to move to his left incredibly well, to his right meh. Gimenez is much more natural

Real world. With young guys, never count on anything. Some will surprise to the upside, some to the downside. Some will be inconsistent have a five year plan, but be ready to make changes day to day.
.  
pjcas18 : 9/14/2018 2:25 pm : link
FYI...


MLB Trade Rumors
‏ @mlbtraderumors
25s25 seconds ago

Brothers Victor Victor Mesa and Victor Mesa Jr. have now been declared free agents by #MLB.

Victor Victor is widely considered the top overall talent on this year's international class.

Read more:
https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2018/09/victor-victor-mesa-free-agent-mlb-cuba.html Ö
RE: If your offering up Wheeler  
Shecky : 9/14/2018 2:25 pm : link
In comment 14074973 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
Then it sounds like your punting on 2019 and focusing more on 2021, 2022 and fielding all offers for guys whoís contracts are close to expiring. Not sure thatís a bad plan long term... not sure how fans would feel about it.


I personally donít like Wheeeler, made that known openly around here. So if you can move him at what I assume is peak value and get what I consider an amazing talent at a low in Senzel I donít view that as punting for 2019. Personally. I really, REALLY like the balance of that lineup thrown up above.

DeGrom/Thor as a 1-2 in the playoffs, with a good offense and good defense. I like my chances A LOT better in 2019. And love my chances moving past that as well. Just an opinion.
Might as well sell deGrom too  
ZGiants98 : 9/14/2018 2:26 pm : link
His value will never be higher coming off a Cy Young and heíll still be just 30. Load up on young SP prospects and revisit adding vets in a few years.
One could only dream PJ  
Shecky : 9/14/2018 2:26 pm : link
Weíre the Mets, we usually sign the much lesser talaneted relative. We excel at that
RE: Might as well sell deGrom too  
Shecky : 9/14/2018 2:28 pm : link
In comment 14074984 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
His value will never be higher coming off a Cy Young and heíll still be just 30. Load up on young SP prospects and revisit adding vets in a few years.


If 2019 went the direction of 18 and 17. Sure, youíve always got that option I donít exactly put wheeler in the same school, yet alone the same class as DeGrom. But certainly, if next years sucks balls, move him too
RE: RE: If your offering up Wheeler  
ZGiants98 : 9/14/2018 2:30 pm : link
In comment 14074981 Shecky said:
Quote:
In comment 14074973 ZGiants98 said:


Quote:


Then it sounds like your punting on 2019 and focusing more on 2021, 2022 and fielding all offers for guys whoís contracts are close to expiring. Not sure thatís a bad plan long term... not sure how fans would feel about it.



I personally donít like Wheeeler, made that known openly around here. So if you can move him at what I assume is peak value and get what I consider an amazing talent at a low in Senzel I donít view that as punting for 2019. Personally. I really, REALLY like the balance of that lineup thrown up above.

DeGrom/Thor as a 1-2 in the playoffs, with a good offense and good defense. I like my chances A LOT better in 2019. And love my chances moving past that as well. Just an opinion.


Unless you donít love his attitude, I donít know whatís not to like with Wheeler. This isnít a fluke. He has legitimately arrived. Heís an ace. I also credit him for all the work he put in over the last few years battling back from injury, rebuilding his delivery.... my God the guy was injecting himself in the stomach all offseason with shots to build up strength wasnít he?? He may be entitled a bit but he also appears to love being a Met. Iíd reward a guy like that rather than look to get rid of him. I do like Senzel though. Iíd like to get him without offering Wheelz.
RE: One could only dream PJ  
pjcas18 : 9/14/2018 2:33 pm : link
In comment 14074985 Shecky said:
Quote:
Weíre the Mets, we usually sign the much lesser talaneted relative. We excel at that


What's wrong with Gregory Guerrero? LOL.

RE: Senzel  
Jay on the Island : 9/14/2018 2:42 pm : link
In comment 14074954 Shecky said:
Quote:
Reds are sick of losing and think they are an arm away from getting closer to gettiver the hump. If they can sign Scooter for reasonable $$ they donít have room for Senzel. He wonít help them in 2019.

I wouldnít think a prospect for prospect deal would be desired by either club, to be honest. I think reds would want Wheeler, if they can extend him. We would want Senzel. No clue if either side would make that deal - I would.

But Iíd push those talks hard. Starting yesterday. Lay the groundwork, get it done. Who knows, you talk the reds into believing theyíre ready enough and maybe they buy the bullshit. And decide to keep Senzel but arenít patient enough for India. You get an India for a Matz/Flores/Dom package and you laugh your ass off while getting the commish office on the line...

Why won't Senzel help in 2019? He finished in AAA where he had an .887 OPS and a 149 wRC+
Reds  
DanMetroMan : 9/14/2018 2:44 pm : link
aren't really stuck. Senzel is playing OF in the AFL. The Mets and Reds also are an awful fit. Gimenez runs into the same issue Senzel does and they have Votto at 1b. I think the Reds are going to be a team to watch very shortly even with the Greene injury. Trammell looks legit/exciting, Senzel can really hit Gennett/Suarez are under the radar legit STARS, Peraza is above average, SP is an issue but Castillo has shown flashes, Santillan is close, Gutierrez is interesting. I think the Reds are a team on the rise.
RE: Reds  
Jay on the Island : 9/14/2018 2:49 pm : link
In comment 14075010 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
aren't really stuck. Senzel is playing OF in the AFL. The Mets and Reds also are an awful fit. Gimenez runs into the same issue Senzel does and they have Votto at 1b. I think the Reds are going to be a team to watch very shortly even with the Greene injury. Trammell looks legit/exciting, Senzel can really hit Gennett/Suarez are under the radar legit STARS, Peraza is above average, SP is an issue but Castillo has shown flashes, Santillan is close, Gutierrez is interesting. I think the Reds are a team on the rise.

Suarez might be the most underrated player in baseball. He is a legit stud 3B and they signed him to a ridiculously team friendly extension that will pay him well below market value. If they get some pitching help that team will be very dangerous in the near future.
RE: Reds  
Shecky : 9/14/2018 2:52 pm : link
In comment 14075010 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
aren't really stuck. Senzel is playing OF in the AFL. The Mets and Reds also are an awful fit. Gimenez runs into the same issue Senzel does and they have Votto at 1b. I think the Reds are going to be a team to watch very shortly even with the Greene injury. Trammell looks legit/exciting, Senzel can really hit Gennett/Suarez are under the radar legit STARS, Peraza is above average, SP is an issue but Castillo has shown flashes, Santillan is close, Gutierrez is interesting. I think the Reds are a team on the rise.
RE: RE: Reds  
Shecky : 9/14/2018 2:53 pm : link
In comment 14075014 Jay on the Island said:
Quote:
.


Suarez might be the most underrated player in baseball. He is a legit stud 3B and they signed him to a ridiculously team friendly extension that will pay him well below market value. If they get some pitching help that team will be very dangerous in the near future.
The  
DanMetroMan : 9/14/2018 2:53 pm : link
Mets don't have high end SP that would come anywhere near Senzel c'mon Shecky. Wheeler would be a rental, Mets aren't dealing DeGrom/Thor.
Senzel  
DanMetroMan : 9/14/2018 2:54 pm : link
is a consensus top 15 prospect in baseball.
lol dan  
Shecky : 9/14/2018 2:54 pm : link
I DONT CARE, I WANT SENZEL DAMMIT
Senzel  
DanMetroMan : 9/14/2018 2:56 pm : link
is an unbelievable fit for the Mets. The teams just don't match up unless you are dealing Thor in a blockbuster.
Reds/mets  
Shecky : 9/14/2018 3:00 pm : link
Thereís a fit, just got to find it

They need SP. we have it
We need a future 3b. They have it

Oh. And the Reds really want Wheeler ;)
RE: Eric  
Eric on Li : 9/14/2018 3:13 pm : link
In comment 14074971 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
Yelich and Ozuna were trades though, so yes you strengthen your team, but you weaken your farm.

Free agents "only" cost $$$. So to me if your core is strong (which is where it has to start) you can supplement with free agents.

I'd have a limit to how high I'd go on Harper. $400M (on a 10 year deal like I've heard rumored is not in my plans - I'd do that for Trout, but not Harper), but 10 years $330M with an opt out after 5, I'd do something like that. If that or something in that area doesn't get it done, in no way would I feel like The Met are being cheap.

Harper and Machado are young proven super stars. those players make sense to over-spend for IMO.

Instead of adding Bruce, Frazier, and Swarzak for $33M, add one Harper for $33M and I bet your team is better with filling in the other two roles with lesser cost players.


I get it - all things equal I'd prefer the FA route but they aren't, especially this year where there are really 2 good position player FA (who likely won't want to come here) and then a bunch of meh. Grandal is intriguing and I'd be on board with adding him via FA.

I thought Cain was a worthy risk via FA last year over giving up assets for Yelich/Ozuna despite his age but there's not really a comparable FA option out there this year. Definitely not at an open position of need like CF. Maybe AJ Pollock. That's where I see it more likely that the type of upgrade they need may need to come via trade. I'd be intrigued with a creative move along the lines of Shecky's idea with the Reds as well. I just don't think Harper or Machado are realistic, but who knows lightning struck with Beltran.
As  
DanMetroMan : 9/14/2018 3:21 pm : link
good as Wheeler has been, 6 years of Senzel blows away walk year Zack Wheeler. The Mets make that deal without thinking twice.
also 1 other note on trade route - looking back on Yelich deal  
Eric on Li : 9/14/2018 3:33 pm : link
Despite his amazing contract and supposedly half of MLB trying to deal for him, Milwaukee didn't pay an astronomical price for him. I'm by no means an expert, but other than Brinson (whose prospect star was already fading somewhat) the only notable player they got back is Monte Harrison who is generally ranked between 50-100 on most lists. He's a 23 year old OF in AA who posted a .715 OPS this year.

If Yelich were available this offseason instead of last (he's not) and he could be had for say Kelenic or Mauricio and 1 of our 4 main pitching prospects and a few other lesser pieces, I think we'd have to consider it. I don't know if anyone as good as Yelich will be available this year but I'd have my ears open to look for really good young players whose careers are still ascending anywhere they are avail. They are generally rarely available.
RE: As  
Eric on Li : 9/14/2018 3:34 pm : link
In comment 14075052 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
good as Wheeler has been, 6 years of Senzel blows away walk year Zack Wheeler. The Mets make that deal without thinking twice.


what if we throw in another top prospect ready to break into the big leagues, OF Dom Smith? ;)
RE: also 1 other note on trade route - looking back on Yelich deal  
DanMetroMan : 9/14/2018 3:36 pm : link
In comment 14075065 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
Despite his amazing contract and supposedly half of MLB trying to deal for him, Milwaukee didn't pay an astronomical price for him. I'm by no means an expert, but other than Brinson (whose prospect star was already fading somewhat) the only notable player they got back is Monte Harrison who is generally ranked between 50-100 on most lists. He's a 23 year old OF in AA who posted a .715 OPS this year.

If Yelich were available this offseason instead of last (he's not) and he could be had for say Kelenic or Mauricio and 1 of our 4 main pitching prospects and a few other lesser pieces, I think we'd have to consider it. I don't know if anyone as good as Yelich will be available this year but I'd have my ears open to look for really good young players whose careers are still ascending anywhere they are avail. They are generally rarely available.


It's silly (no disrespect) to compare any Marlins deal to anything a normal team would do. Everyone was trashing the Marlins returns (Ozuna deal was laughable given his contract). That being said Brinson at the time = Gimenez EASILY if not more highly thought of and Harrison was roughly in the Alonso range.
RE: RE: As  
DanMetroMan : 9/14/2018 3:37 pm : link
In comment 14075066 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
In comment 14075052 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


good as Wheeler has been, 6 years of Senzel blows away walk year Zack Wheeler. The Mets make that deal without thinking twice.



what if we throw in another top prospect ready to break into the big leagues, OF Dom Smith? ;)


I know you're kidding but Gimenez/Alonso don't even fit the Reds roster so it's extremely hard to see a trade beyond as I said a blockbuster involving Thor.
Should  
DanMetroMan : 9/14/2018 3:40 pm : link
also be noted that Brinson (again on talent alone was a top 25-ish prospect) is from Miami and Jeter reportedly thought they would be able to market him because of it.
I actually think Shecky is  
ZGiants98 : 9/14/2018 3:58 pm : link
Hinting to real discussions. Could be wrong.
RE: I actually think Shecky is  
DanMetroMan : 9/14/2018 4:01 pm : link
In comment 14075101 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
Hinting to real discussions. Could be wrong.


He's not. Senzel for Zack Wheeler is laughable in the Mets favor. A bad team trading a top 15 prospect for 1 year of Zack Wheeler? c'mon. It's absurd.
RE: RE: I actually think Shecky is  
ZGiants98 : 9/14/2018 4:06 pm : link
In comment 14075106 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
In comment 14075101 ZGiants98 said:


Quote:


Hinting to real discussions. Could be wrong.



He's not. Senzel for Zack Wheeler is laughable in the Mets favor. A bad team trading a top 15 prospect for 1 year of Zack Wheeler? c'mon. It's absurd.


No it would involve other players obviously... not commenting on it further though... Obviously I have no idea.
I think if I were the Reds  
ZGiants98 : 9/14/2018 4:11 pm : link
And I were serious about competing next year I actually would look to acquire somebody like Wheeler but giving up a top prospect would require a team extension on Wheelerís part. If Wheeler agrees, locking down an ace changes what a package could look like.
RE: I think if I were the Reds  
Jay on the Island : 9/14/2018 4:18 pm : link
In comment 14075118 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
And I were serious about competing next year I actually would look to acquire somebody like Wheeler but giving up a top prospect would require a team extension on Wheelerís part. If Wheeler agrees, locking down an ace changes what a package could look like.

yeah I could see a deal done contingent upon Wheeler signing an extension and a prospect thrown in.
RE: RE: also 1 other note on trade route - looking back on Yelich deal  
Eric on Li : 9/14/2018 6:14 pm : link
In comment 14075069 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
In comment 14075065 Eric on Li said:


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Despite his amazing contract and supposedly half of MLB trying to deal for him, Milwaukee didn't pay an astronomical price for him. I'm by no means an expert, but other than Brinson (whose prospect star was already fading somewhat) the only notable player they got back is Monte Harrison who is generally ranked between 50-100 on most lists. He's a 23 year old OF in AA who posted a .715 OPS this year.

If Yelich were available this offseason instead of last (he's not) and he could be had for say Kelenic or Mauricio and 1 of our 4 main pitching prospects and a few other lesser pieces, I think we'd have to consider it. I don't know if anyone as good as Yelich will be available this year but I'd have my ears open to look for really good young players whose careers are still ascending anywhere they are avail. They are generally rarely available.



It's silly (no disrespect) to compare any Marlins deal to anything a normal team would do. Everyone was trashing the Marlins returns (Ozuna deal was laughable given his contract). That being said Brinson at the time = Gimenez EASILY if not more highly thought of and Harrison was roughly in the Alonso range.


Respectfully I don't think it's accurate to say everyone trashed it. See below for Law's review last year, as the headline indicates he was positive on it for the Marlins. By a quick search Sickels was positive about it as well, so I don't think it was such an outlier opinion, but I'm half going by memory.

Not disagreeing that Brinson/Harrisson values may have been closer to Gimenez/Alonso. I'd imagine different orgs could have different thoughts on preference especially considering their individual positional depth. Some writers prefer Kelenic to Alonso/Gimenez so I'm not going to begin to guess how anyone who matters would value anyone specificly. My general point is simply that more often than not the expectation in all sports that any great player is going to demand a haul of the top 3 or 4 assets the other team has and yet more often than not teams seem able to hang on to the few guys they truly value most. The Karlsson trade for Ottawa is a very recent example of that. Even the Sale trade that's the gold standard quoted whenever an opposing fanbase brings up Degrom. Forgetting the Kopech injury, Moncada hasn't exactly lit the world on fire. So for someone like Yelich I would be willing to pay a fair price if the other team is shopping that player even if it means giving up 1 of our top handful of prospects. My own personal preference would be to steer clear of Gimenez or Alonso, but depending on who we are talking about trading for I'd even consider dealing them.
Law: Marlins finally get it right with prospects in Yelich trade - ( New Window )
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