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Why trade Jones?

Kanavis : 9/17/2018 10:26 am
I know the salary cap implications have been discussed previously. And I know Jones was no all pro. But it now seems like a poor decision. It wasn't even clear that he was outplayed by Halapio during the preseason. Jones was OK last year. Even if you think Greco is suitable, he has much more experience at guard and might be needed there anyway.

It makes you wonder about some of their other decisions. Why was Clay ever our punt returner? He had a fumbling issue PRIOR to week one.

Thomas played well in preseason and now it looks like Harrison is playing every single snap on defense....something this coaching staff has said they wanted to avoid.

It makes you wonder if Webb actually should have been cut. Do you have any confidence in this crew's ability to evaluate players?

Jones is not the difference between a respectable season or not. But the team would be better off right now. If you needed the money for Beckham, find it somewhere else.
They have a number of personnel/talent problems  
JonC : 9/17/2018 10:29 am : link
It will take more than one offseason to fix them all. The 2018 season was bound to be rough seas ...
Simple Cost Benefit Analysis  
Capt. Don : 9/17/2018 10:30 am : link
The delta between Jones and Greco's salary vs. the delta between Jones and Greco's ability.

Salary difference was bigger.
Insecure  
Rflairr : 9/17/2018 10:31 am : link
Just like with Webb. The previous regime brought him in
RE: Insecure  
Capt. Don : 9/17/2018 10:33 am : link
In comment 14080765 Rflairr said:
Quote:
Just like with Webb. The previous regime brought him in


I think the Webb comparison is off.

Not one other team in the NFL thought he was worth a roster spot either.
$$$ - he wasn't any better than Greco so why pay him that much  
PatersonPlank : 9/17/2018 10:34 am : link
Use the money somewhere else. I'm ok with it. Plus now we have Pulley, the C from San Diego, he should be better than Jones ever was.
We wanted  
BigBlueDownTheShore : 9/17/2018 10:36 am : link
Hogmollies. Jones was just a piglet.
Doubts are certainly starting to creep in as regards the  
NYRiese : 9/17/2018 10:36 am : link
talent evaluation acumin of the newest regime.
I suspect the GM relies too heavily on "collaboration" and not enough on his gut instincts. Too many cooks may be spoiling the broth.
Halapio wasn't even the problem  
allstarjim : 9/17/2018 10:42 am : link
Not last night, and not in game 1.

Halapio deserved better than what happened to him last night, and he doesn't deserve any intimation that the team would've been better with Brett Jones.
RE: We wanted  
Kanavis : 9/17/2018 10:45 am : link
In comment 14080783 BigBlueDownTheShore said:
Quote:
Hogmollies. Jones was just a piglet.


LOL! Perhaps the Hogmollies aren't so good at recognizing blitzes and calling out protections.

As for Webb, perhaps it wasn't a valid comparison. But when you have a 3rd round pick, he is of the most value on a team where he has been working/studying for a year even if the system did change. It is hard for a team to role the dice on someone who will need to be there for at least a year to be comfortable. I am not saying he was better than Lauletta but it wasn't clear either way. If anything Webb played a bit better and has the requisite arm strength.

The teams issues are obviously far beyond these moves. But it does make you wonder about simply cutting anyone associated with the previous regime.
When your top 7 cap players,  
Doomster : 9/17/2018 10:50 am : link
represent 45% of the cap, that leaves 55% for the other 46 players plus the practice squad.....

And when those top 7, for the most part either don't play, or don't play up to their expectations, that is the formula for an 0-2 start....

This team was in cap hell, with 23.5M in dead money....

We overpaid for what is looking like an average LT....

We overpaid for Stewart, hell, why did we even get him?

So we had Jones, who supposedly could not crack the lineup, sitting as a backup, with almost a 3M cap hit....that's why.....

This is looking more and more like Giant teams of the past 7 seasons, where ownership/management blindly think we are just a few players away......we are more than just a few players away, and we have used the same strategy for the last 7 years, and it has put us in this position.....
" it now seems like a poor decision. "  
x meadowlander : 9/17/2018 10:52 am : link
No. It was OBVIOUS to every single one of us that it was a bizarrely stupid decision that was going to come back to bite the Giants in the ass.

We just figured it would take longer than 2 weeks.
Halapio is not part of the problem?  
Doomster : 9/17/2018 10:53 am : link
If you watched the game, he can't move anyone in run blocking.....

And he can't read defenses where he should be picking up stunts and he doesn't.....

He gets paid 555K for a reason.....

He will not be here next year....

RE: We wanted  
K-Gun? Pop-Gun : 9/17/2018 10:56 am : link
In comment 14080783 BigBlueDownTheShore said:
Quote:
Hogmollies. Jones was just a piglet.


Excessive focus on prototypes will lead to overlooking players who don't 'fit'.
RE: When your top 7 cap players,  
rich in DC : 9/17/2018 11:05 am : link
In comment 14080852 Doomster said:
Quote:
represent 45% of the cap, that leaves 55% for the other 46 players plus the practice squad.....

And when those top 7, for the most part either don't play, or don't play up to their expectations, that is the formula for an 0-2 start....

This team was in cap hell, with 23.5M in dead money....

We overpaid for what is looking like an average LT....

We overpaid for Stewart, hell, why did we even get him?

So we had Jones, who supposedly could not crack the lineup, sitting as a backup, with almost a 3M cap hit....that's why.....

This is looking more and more like Giant teams of the past 7 seasons, where ownership/management blindly think we are just a few players away......we are more than just a few players away, and we have used the same strategy for the last 7 years, and it has put us in this position.....


While your general point- too much of the cap tied up into a small group of players (and most of them no longer worth that money)- is correct, pointing at this off-season's FA spending is off-point.

Of the multitudes of FA they brought in this winter, Solder stands alone as the ONLY FA who cannot be cut this coming off-season. The Giants filled up on bodies to fill the roster, not on long term deals.

In other words, they were keeping their powder dry for another day. Most of the FA they signed this off-season will be cut or let walk away (many signed one-year deals) and the money will be re-allocated to better options.

Solder will be a relatively short term piece, but should be serviceable for 2 years after this one. That is important as they rebuild the OL. They will definitely focus on the right side in the off-season. However, they will be able to get upgrades at both spots because there will be money.

Once the Giants have a functional, at least league average OL, they can move forward with a young QB and use the big money savings and high draft picks on a pass rush and some DBs.
Trading solid OL  
Rflairr : 9/17/2018 11:28 am : link
Like you have an abundance of get ones. And a smart GM scooped him right up
RE: RE: Insecure  
Big Blue in MD : 9/17/2018 12:40 pm : link
In comment 14080774 Capt. Don said:
Quote:
In comment 14080765 Rflairr said:


Quote:


Just like with Webb. The previous regime brought him in



I think the Webb comparison is off.

Not one other team in the NFL thought he was worth a roster spot either.


Not true. At least a dozen teams looked to bring him on to their practice squads. The Jets paid him his entire salary. Also, as a point of note, keeping him on the practice squad makes sense. No other team is going to grab hum because they would have to cut someone and at this point he is not ready to play. Safe move by the Jets. Smart, too.
RE: RE: RE: Insecure  
Jay on the Island : 9/17/2018 12:54 pm : link
In comment 14081240 Big Blue in MD said:
Quote:
In comment 14080774 Capt. Don said:


Quote:


In comment 14080765 Rflairr said:


Quote:


Just like with Webb. The previous regime brought him in



I think the Webb comparison is off.

Not one other team in the NFL thought he was worth a roster spot either.



Not true. At least a dozen teams looked to bring him on to their practice squads. The Jets paid him his entire salary. Also, as a point of note, keeping him on the practice squad makes sense. No other team is going to grab hum because they would have to cut someone and at this point he is not ready to play. Safe move by the Jets. Smart, too.

The fact that no team was willing to claim him as their 3rd QB speaks volumes. He is making the league minimum and was a 3rd round pick just a year ago. Kurt Benkert, Nathan Peterman, Taylor Heinicke, Jeff Driskel, Cooper Rush, Mike White, Kevin Hogan, Tim Boyle, Brandon Weeden, Cody Kessler, Sean Mannion, Brandon Allen, David Fales, Taysom Hill, Nate Sudfeld, etc have roster spots.
RE: Halapio is not part of the problem?  
allstarjim : 9/17/2018 12:59 pm : link
In comment 14080868 Doomster said:
Quote:
If you watched the game, he can't move anyone in run blocking.....

And he can't read defenses where he should be picking up stunts and he doesn't.....

He gets paid 555K for a reason.....

He will not be here next year....


You are thinking of Omameh.
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