Go on the record: is this season over?

we needed to go 3-4 at worst over the 1st 7 tough games. Schedule gets easier after that, and I think we'll improve.

But now I'm less optimistic we can go 3-4 to start.

SB first touch run it was over.

2-3 might be more realistic. Any chance that leads to a one and done scenario with the coach and GM??
I mean 2-14 and 3-13 (again)?

So by that definition, the season is over.

The stat displayed last night, 1 in 9 teams that start 0-2 make the playoffs.

This is not the "1" team. The OL is putrid. With a line like that, this is not a team that can rebound and knock out 9 wins in the final 14 games.

Say goodnight Gracie.

In comment 14081492 Gross Blau Oberst said:

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The story line of this being a win now year has really distorted the state of the Giants. Not sure if this was a media invention or a fan one that just took legs and grew. Regardless, it was always way off target and for many created a false sense of expectations for the Giants. THIS IS YEAR 1 OF AT LEAST A 2 YEAR REBUILD. I know, some BBI posters advocate their is no such thing as a rebuilding the NFL and that it is always "Win Now". What a bunch of horse hockey pucks that thinking amounts to. The previous front office created such a talent void, that a 2 year reload / rebuild is absolutely essential. You could not correct all of the broken pieces on 1 year. Once again, the OL is the teams Achilles' heel and makes all other positions on offense look putrid. Some on BBI still don't get just how much the OL impacts the QB, RB, WRs and TEs and all offensive schemes. For those of you who don't understand that, please continue to rant on that Eli is the blame. Some ignorance cannot be corrected. Back to the original question. 8-8 is still likely, and the second half of the season will look much better than the first. No playoffs in 2018. that was never a realistic goal. However the improved play in the second half of the season will make believers out of some that the 2018 NYG could be a playoff team. For the playoffs, look to 2019.

This “win now” was an excuse by management to keep a poor QB around and draft a RB. The plan was to surround Eli with a lot of talent and to give him all the support he would need to be successful. It just didn’t work out the way they thought it would.Eli has looked done for awhile now.

We're NOT making the playoffs, but from 3-13 to playoffs with a full regime change was never likely but too many here don't think clearly in terms of the actual game. We see Collins and Jackrabbit and Snacks and Odell and think that's what wins games, names we can recognize who have won recognition. This is a broken team with a leftover rag tag bunch of failed draft picks and FA signings that is being made over. I think Gettelman isn't stupid enough to know he'd wave a wand and fix it during one off season. It's a decade of poor drafting and personnel decisions, it's going to take time to fix it. His is philosophically the opposite of Reese, and that clean out will take time.

It's NOT over from the stand point that we are going to watch young players hopefully grow into the next leaders of this team for the next 5-10 years. Barkley, Hernandez, Odell, B.J. Hill, Lorenzo Carter, Eli Apple, Wayne Gallman, Engram, Shephard are all going to hopefully keep improving and be the core of this team for its next run. So over from a we have a shot at the playoffs? Yes, it was never going to be that kind of season and I won't go into why because it's too thorny and painful right now. We have holes to fill at RT, RG, OC, DE, OLB, CB, FS, TE (one who can actually block) and QB. If you want to throw a return guy in too for good measure have at it, because we don't have one of those either.

There are potentially some strong pieces but the foundation is rotten and our OL and DL have to be rebuilt completely (Snacks is pushing 30 too sadly) in terms of starters AND depth. Tomlinson is meh so far, as his Hill but I expect improvement and we have no depth. At LB we probably have two bona fide starters once Carter develops, Ogletree is young enough to be around for a bit but we need another fast ILB and 2 OLB/Edge types who can generate pressure. Right now we have zero. It looks to me, honestly, like DG is bringing in vets, pros who have been around to show the kids how to do it. Those guys are cheap, short term fixes until he can start drafting and using FA his way from the jump. I think guys like Barwin, Mauro, BW Webb, Riley, Kareem Martin, Jonathan Stewart, Nate Solder are not long term fits they are professionals who can impart how to stay in the league and they are at least competitive enough to make us a tough out once in a while.

I expect half of this roster to be gone again next year, and I don't expect most of the DB/WR types we added this off season to remain past maybe Lattimer. We have a rotten core, and it is a work in progress and hopefully we can watch some young guys grow into leaders and key contributors and keep adding them next year and the year after and so on. The entire philosophy of player acquisition is new, the scouting rules are new, the player development and TYPES of players we look for is new so this organizational shift will be seismic but slow. We're hungry for a winner and a glimpse of something after 5-6 years of dreck. It's a full gutting, lots more will be tossed into the yard and hauled off before we get this house in order.

I for one am excited for the future, but it's hard to be with so many holes and two dreadful outcomes. I'm going to be watching Odell, Saquon, Hernandez, Lattimer, Shepard, Engram, Hill, Tomlinson, Carter, Apple and even Rosas for signs of good things to come. They will be the core, just watch them and chart their progress and keep eyes on the college ranks and pending FAs. It's team building time, not trophy talk time.

Use to play with a guy who if he d hit a bad shot early in the day, let's say an OB on the #2 hole, he be proned to say something like, "Well there goes that round. "

I hated that, and I especially hated pulling his name as my partner for the Saturday morning Nassau and skins game.

Often BBI makes me remember him.

Are our chances of making the playoffs over? Yes.

I didn't think this was a playoff team before the season, but now forget playoffs, we're going to be counting our wins on one hand again.

Sad.

Yes, I think we don't stand a shot. I've lowered my expectations and will be happy if this team gets 5-6 wins, shows guts, OL improves even to average, and can at least keep games close like they have been.

In comment 14081550 lax counsel said:

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In comment 14081528 allstarjim said: Quote: In comment 14081518 The_Boss said: Quote: on the 3rd play of the 2nd game. Fucking pathetic. Blow hard for Bosa!!!!! If they have the #1 pick and use it on Bosa or any non-QB I will personally drive to Met Life Stadium (from Florida) and shove my remote control right up Gettleman's ass. Unfortunately, there is no qb worth a top 5 pick in this years class at this juncture. At someone posted in another thread, the best qb in the 2018 class would have been the 5th best in 2018 Which is why all of us change folks were screaming for a qb last year at 2. The play in 2018 is to trade back and accumulate assets to make a run at a qb in 2020 or 2021 which should be much better classes. Also to go on record, not only is this season lost, I fear 2019 may be as well.

Honestly, you're a smart guy, I'm sure. Why in the world would you think, with less than a quarter of the college football season completed, and with no combine yet, would anyone have enough information to make such a definitive statement? Anybody that makes a sweeping statement like that in mid-September doesn't have a clue as to what they are talking about and I couldn't care less about their opinion, as they have already revealed themselves to be full of shit.

Even if the playoffs were always a stretch though, it sure would be valuable for that core you described to play some meaningful games in the second half of the season. That's really my only focus right now. Find a way to win a few before the bye week so at least this group can come out in the second half feeling like they have a chance, even if it isn't a realistic one.

There's still a ton of work to be done on this roster, that much is obvious now. But it'd be nice to not have a dead season by the time we reach October. Find a way to win this week.

This season was never about a championship run. It is about rebuilding the gigantic pile of absolute shit left by Reese, Ross, and McAdoo. And the rebuild will take time.

This team stinks now, but there are several good young players who will grow as the season progresses. And more of them will be added next year.

5-11. At best.

First and foremost all you guys saying it's over and bailing on this team are in panic mode. Please stop. Realize the people that made the decisions actually KNOW MORE THAN ALL OF US and you, as fans, have to trust them and look at the results when things finish up, not how they are right now.

In Game 1, the Giants played a super bowl contender and basically could've won the game if some things broke their way. They lost. This same destroyed the Pats yesterday.

In Game 2, they lost to a very good defense who always plays well at home and our D surrendered 1 big play, followed by a few other game changers while they were outschemed tremendously on offense. I, for once, agreed with Collinsworth's assessment. Of course we lost, but this game could've went differently if the protections were more in line with what was coming.

I still think they need to get it going, and get all the new pieces working together. There are 2 completely new units learning to play with each other and they need to mesh. 2 games will not do this. They will get it.

I think once they get it together, this team gets on a roll. I don't care what other teams records look like now - every week in the NFL different stuff happens and all sorts of factors can contribute to a team getting on a roll.

This team has the talent, the players, and the skill guys to get it going and I foresee a quick turnaround.

I still say 9-7, 10-6 are a possibility.

before the season began because of the OL and the lack of speed in back 7 on defense. I'm not sure they'll get to 5 which is fine. For me if they don't make the playoffs may as well lose them all. If it takes several catastrophic seasons for the the Tisch family to force the Mara Bros back to the GY/Ernie business model so be it. Because the John and Chris Mara show is a shit show.

Hopefully you're right.

But I never expected them to make the playoffs and if they did by chance I wouldn't have expected a victory. All I wanted was improvement each week. not major but improvement. The defense took a step back the offense fell off a cliff, Flowers disease is contagious not only to other linemen but to full backs and TE as well. Eli has happy feet and they already have their new meme of him.


I've fallen and I can't get up, at least not behind this OL///// - ( New Window )

at the conclusion of the last season. It may be over for 2019, too. This team is no where near ready to compete with anybody.

they will get better. defense has played pretty well both weeks -

O-Line will determine whether this team is even close re: the hunt for Wild Card.

...

if Shurmur is as good a coach as I think, he will get things figured out. Some of this is talent, but some is scheme

For me the question is whether or not the next 5 years are lost. Remember, the owners just hired this crew. Last night I kept wondering, how did DG land us in “QB hell” after he spent so much time and effort trying to avoid it?

It is too bad because most of the teams on the schedule are not complete and flawed enough for a Giants team with a mediocre O Line to compete. I think bw in dc for one alluded to this among others. Because our O Line is very bad, the running game is easily stifled and Shurmur is stuck in an endless array of third and longs. Barkley is capable of being a very productive weapon in all phases of the offense. He is being wasted behind this line. I will continue to watch and hope to see improvement. I will take solace in the great plays the 2018 Giants will make. Without at least a mediocre front line, the offense is easily handled by the opposing defense. This 2018 Giants team should not have lost to Dallas....

Yes.

I said last night was a must win and am sticking to that. We failed miserably.

It's going to be another long, depressing year of Giants football.

I gave this team the benefit of the doubt for far too long. No more. I've been fooled too many times finding ways to believe maybe things could get better out of wishful thinking - but things are so, so far away from getting better.

The New York Giants are officially a fucking mess.

A great majority of the roster is mere filler until such time as the team can create cap space and gather up some very high draft picks.

As Joey noted, they dumped more than half the team- but didn't have many draft picks (6, plus the supplemental pick they used from next year's draft).

Notice a common theme from the draft- the Giants picked a guy who had a well known medical condition that probably ensured that he would not play this year (McIntosh-5th rounder) and a QB who was always destined to red-shirt his rookie season (Lauletta). Add in a CB with a shoulder injury the team was aware of and probably knew would require surgery that would end his season (Beal).

What does that tell you?

It tells you that the plan was not to bring in a bunch of guys for now- but to build for later. Barkley, Hill, Hernandez and Carter will all be here the next time the Giants are good after several years of rebuilding. OBJ will probably still be playing at a star level. After that...

The Giants can create a massive amount of cap space, if they want to, after this season. Notice that Solder is the only FA signing that they can't dump this off-season (for financial reasons). They could probably target OL and DB with that money and then focus their draft on pass rush, a franchise QB- if one is there, and then depth guys all over.

That kind of off-season gives you the core going forward for skill players- but also probably requires one more solid off-season of FA and drafting to build the depth of the team into a contender.

Does that make the season over?

and the future doesn't look so good either. I won't miss a snap, but I'm going to spend a lot of Monday's very cranky.

with more time spent together, then yes it's over. At least we can start looking forward to further rebuilding the O-line this coming off season.

In comment 14081566 Breeze_94 said:

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Giants will be 2-2 after these next 2 games

You are either related to Eli Manning or need to put the crack pipe down.

In comment 14081569 Boy Cord said:

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We are talking a three-year fix and the Giants success will be dependent upon finding a new QB. This year, we are going to have to be satisfied with small victories (i.e. player and coaching development). We need to look at players that will be building blocks for the future. Who will be on this team three years from now? Highly Likely to Likely (6): Barkley, OBJ, Hernandez, Tomlinson, Hill, Carter Questionmarks (7): Engram, Shephard, Apple, Lauletta, Gallman, Solder, Collins (McIntosh - who the heck knows) That's it and that sucks. The other talent on this team is aging or their contract will be up soon (OV, Jenkins, Harrison, Ogletree). What an awful roster. We are in for a minimum of three dark years (that includes this one). There are no guarantees. All I can say is our scouting and pro personnel departments better be on the top of their game. My level of confidence is low, primarily because of the last point.

Wow I was taking to a fellow Giants fan and this is exactly what I told him also. You know after another bad year they are going to be dumping high salary players but won’t start with the elephant in the room(Eli Manning).

Cards have Rosen
Bills have Allen
Browns have Mayfield

In comment 14081583 ThatLimerickGuy said:

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We hung tough with the best team in the NFL (Jaguars) and then lost by a TD on the road to a division rival in their home opener. The number of drama queens on here is ridiculous. New offensive systems always take 2-3 weeks to gel. The line will get more cohesive. Give it a minute. The thing you need to focus on is that the defense has played reasonably well. They will continue to improve as well. In the end will the Giants make the playoffs? Probably not, but the schedule makers didn't do the Giants any favors early in the year either. Texans and Saints (at Metlife) aren't exactly world beaters. Both suck actually. 2-2 isn't out of the realm of possibility. Pull up your panties guys and let's go.

if you think this was really a one score game and not padding stats after Dallas secured the game you are one of the blind Eli supporters. The Oline is bad but Eli is also part of the problem.

What does "over" mean? Depends on what people's expectations are.

I expected the team to struggle early in the season while they put in the new offense and defense, and while the line gets used to playing together. So far the defense is ahead of where I thought they'd be but the offense is behind. 0-2 doesn't surprise me at all. I'm thinking 1-5 or 2-6 is likely this season. I'm expecting a much better team in the second half.

This season isn't about contending for a Super Bowl, it's barely about contending for the playoffs. It wasn't ever about that. It was about laying the foundation for a contender in the years to come. That's what I'm watching for -- how good are the new players and coaches? Is the team improving? In that sense it's not over at all. But if you're thinking playoffs and Super Bowl, I think it was over before it started, despite all the hype about the Giants' weapons. Football isn't like that. Pretty much everything has to work or nothing works. So far, on offense, nothing works.

In comment 14081707 Red Dog said:

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This season was never about a championship run. It is about rebuilding the gigantic pile of absolute shit left by Reese, Ross, and McAdoo. And the rebuild will take time. This team stinks now, but there are several good young players who will grow as the season progresses. And more of them will be added next year.

Red Dog management’s( Gettleman)spin on not taking Darnold was we are in “win now” mode but what has Eli or this O-line shown that this would be possible. Eli has been bad for 4 of the past 5 seasons. The only is an issue but you need a different type of QB to play behind this OL. You need a young,accurate, athletic QB everything Eli isn’t.

while at my desk. This is just unreal.

I said several times I saw this as probably a 7-8 win team... maybe 9 if things REALLY broke right.

I don't think those were totally unrealistic expectations to have. I didn't think playoffs, Super Bowl... nothing like that.

I did think improvement would be evident, and so far, it actually is not. I think the Giants actually looked worse last night than they did in Week 1 - which is even more alarming.

This football team should not be this bad. Period. There's really no way around it. If we were going to suck again this year, we should have just cut bait with Eli before it started and drafted Darnold.

In comment 14081971 rich in DC said:

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A great majority of the roster is mere filler until such time as the team can create cap space and gather up some very high draft picks. As Joey noted, they dumped more than half the team- but didn't have many draft picks (6, plus the supplemental pick they used from next year's draft). Notice a common theme from the draft- the Giants picked a guy who had a well known medical condition that probably ensured that he would not play this year (McIntosh-5th rounder) and a QB who was always destined to red-shirt his rookie season (Lauletta). Add in a CB with a shoulder injury the team was aware of and probably knew would require surgery that would end his season (Beal). What does that tell you? It tells you that the plan was not to bring in a bunch of guys for now- but to build for later. Barkley, Hill, Hernandez and Carter will all be here the next time the Giants are good after several years of rebuilding. OBJ will probably still be playing at a star level. After that... The Giants can create a massive amount of cap space, if they want to, after this season. Notice that Solder is the only FA signing that they can't dump this off-season (for financial reasons). They could probably target OL and DB with that money and then focus their draft on pass rush, a franchise QB- if one is there, and then depth guys all over. That kind of off-season gives you the core going forward for skill players- but also probably requires one more solid off-season of FA and drafting to build the depth of the team into a contender.

This would be interesting if true - but two of the guys they brought in, Solder and Omameh, can't really be cut next year and so far they stink.

Meanwhile, in the multi-year rebuild you're proposing - what age is Beckham by the time you've finally picked up a QB?

.

If they don't start to play "professionally" on the OL, It'll come super fast

This team will improve enough to win ANY game? They were so severely out coached vs Dallas ( a mediocre team at best) that they were non COMPETATIVE - again! They aren't close to playing winning football and when the losing and injuries start taking their toll ( C gone for the year, Apple likely out for awhile) they may get further away not closer. I think winning 2 or 3 games will be a big challenge this year.

Right now I don't see the wins anywhere.

right now. I don't see the Cowboys, Skins or Eagles being exponentially better than the Giants to the point that they won't split the series as the season goes on. However, the other games are pretty rough. Next week is as close to a must-win as could be though. This team could very well start collapsing after an 0-3 start. At 1-2 you're right back in the mix in the division.

But to the original question. No, it's not over yet. One game at a time. (unfortunately, my optimism lately has had some detrimental effects. haha)

It’s a fatal flaw. We’ve seen this before.

I can’t give up now. But it’s hard dealing with the constant and endless disappointment. Every week it’s a gut shot since September last season.

In comment 14082013 jlukes said:

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Cards have Rosen Bills have Allen Browns have Mayfield

Actually a good point. And seriously look around the nfl there aren’t many teams in desperate need of a qb, at least on paper and right now anyway. This will change in 2-3 seasons but for now, not many.

But, another loss or two and it is for sure.

.

In comment 14082476 B in ALB said:

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right now. I don't see the Cowboys, Skins or Eagles being exponentially better than the Giants to the point that they won't split the series as the season goes on. However, the other games are pretty rough. Next week is as close to a must-win as could be though. This team could very well start collapsing after an 0-3 start. At 1-2 you're right back in the mix in the division. But to the original question. No, it's not over yet. One game at a time. (unfortunately, my optimism lately has had some detrimental effects. haha)

I get your analysis but I think it is a bit of wishful/glass half full thinking. You know as much as the next guy that this game is won on the line of scrimmage. We cannot run block, we cannot pass protect, and we cannot even touch the QB on defense. That is not a formula for success in any division.

Now, about the weak division comment. That is fine if you are talking about how they will fare against the rest of the league but WE do not match up well against these teams. Dallas can obviously stop our offense and the Eagles have a better defense than the Cowboys.

In comment 14082747 EricJ said:

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In comment 14082476 B in ALB said: Quote: right now. I don't see the Cowboys, Skins or Eagles being exponentially better than the Giants to the point that they won't split the series as the season goes on. However, the other games are pretty rough. Next week is as close to a must-win as could be though. This team could very well start collapsing after an 0-3 start. At 1-2 you're right back in the mix in the division. But to the original question. No, it's not over yet. One game at a time. (unfortunately, my optimism lately has had some detrimental effects. haha) I get your analysis but I think it is a bit of wishful/glass half full thinking. You know as much as the next guy that this game is won on the line of scrimmage. We cannot run block, we cannot pass protect, and we cannot even touch the QB on defense. That is not a formula for success in any division. Now, about the weak division comment. That is fine if you are talking about how they will fare against the rest of the league but WE do not match up well against these teams. Dallas can obviously stop our offense and the Eagles have a better defense than the Cowboys.

I am not really sure where that splitting the div series stuff is coming from after getting man-handled by a weak Dallas team, while the Eagles are much better and the Redskins we don't know about but have looked much better than the G-men (who hasn't)!

the season is not over after 2 games. They are 1 game out of first. Lots of football still to be played.