NFT: NHL Preseason: NY Rangers @ NJ Devils - 7:00 PM on MSG

Malhotra was a guy who was supposed to have 2C upside even though he wasn't a big scorer in juniors. A Dirk Graham type.

might be the hardest sport to project, similar to baseball, but maybe even harder to project than baseball.

You're drafting 17/18 year old kids and trying to see how they'll grow, mature, and develop to play against grown men.

If you look at every draft there are a lot of 1st round picks who never make the NHL. Even in the top 10. Or at least never become established in the NHL.

These stats* below are just starts, not considering quality in any way.

From the 2014 NHL draft, so kids had 4 seasons to make the NHL, there are 7 players with less than 60 NHL games played.

14 with less than 100 (around 40% of the draft class 1st round).

From the 2013 NHL draft, so kids had 5 season to make the NHL, there are also 7 players with less than 60 NHL games played.

10 with less than 100 (one third of the draft class 1st round)

From the 2012 NHL draft, do kids had 6 seasons to make the NHL - dream is pretty much over now, 4 players with less than 60 games played.

7 with less than 100 (around 23% of that draft's 1st round will likely never play 100 games in the league).

From the 2011 NHL draft, do kids had 7 seasons to make the NHL - dream is almost certainly dead now, 6 players with less than 60 games played.

7 with less than 100 (around 23% of that draft's 1st round will likely never play 100 games in the league).


*all stats from hockeydb

What's scary is I just read that Marc Bergevin compared Jack Hughes to Nail Yakupov. WTF?

I see Hughes play and I see Patrick Kane, the Canadiens GM sees Nail Yakupov. Sadly, right now at least, more people agree with me than him.

And who knows, maybe neither is right.

The last time the Rangers had multiple top ten picks in a two year period, they ended up with Pavel Brendl, Jamie Lundmark, and Malhotra.

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In comment 14083897 BrettNYG10 said:

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with any luck you'll get to experience it too.

Lundmark was supposed to be the high floor/lower ceiling guy that was a hedge against the boom or bust potential of Brendl, but neither of them amounted to much of anything.

In fairness, that was a terrible draft. Outside of the Sedins, and Havlat to a much lesser extent, none of the first rounders amounted to much.

from 2012.

there were other contributors later in the draft like Forsberg (still can't believe the Caps traded him), Vasilevsky, and others) that may be the worst top 10 ever.

the best players are the D, Reilly, Trouba, and Dumba.

Outside of Galchenyuk who has his own well documented issues.

no stars though.

DeAngelo also a pleasant surprise, was their best defenseman imo.

Lundqvist gave up 5 goals in a period and a half

Chytil got injured but came back

Kreider-Zibanejad-Zuccarello
Vesey-Hayes-Buchnevich
Namestnikov-Chytil-Spooner
Beleskey-Lias-Fast
Holland/Lettieri---still need to see more from Lindqvist and Meskanen

McLeod waived


Skjei-Shattenkirk
Staal (sigh)-McQuaid
Smith-DeAngelo
Claesson/O'Gara

Pionk sent down to Hartford (numbers game)


Lundqvist
Tokarski

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In comment 14086012 Greg from LI said:

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I would as well, but I actually liked what I saw from Tokarski tonight. Granted he didn't face a lot of shots, but he played well. The one goal against him wasn't even his fault. Gilmour gave the puck away in front of the net.

over DeAngelo and O'Gara.

Pionk looked really good in the world cup, which is a more wide open style game, but I think he's ready to be a consistent NHL contributor, only thing O'Gara offers over him is size, he doesn't have close to the offensive game.

And if DeAneglo beats out Pionk it's a "scholarship" type situation, right now, based on results, Pionk is just a better player.

And I'm not saying the Rangers won't do this, but I wouldn't keep Andersson around to be the 4th line C and get 8-9 minutes per game.

As I said earlier, the team is going nowhere this season and they need to determine once and for all whether or not DeAngelo has any future here.

In a just world, they would just keep both Pionk and DeAngelo and push Staal out to sea on an ice floe.

In comment 14086355 Greg from LI said:

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As I said earlier, the team is going nowhere this season and they need to determine once and for all whether or not DeAngelo has any future here. In a just world, they would just keep both Pionk and DeAngelo and push Staal out to sea on an ice floe.

Agree, normally though you'd think new coach, no tie to old scholarships. Of course the GM is still here though.

Pionk will benefit more from playing with the NHL team IMO than he would by playing in Hartford, so in a perfect world it would be an open competition. but we know that's not always the case.

I didn't see the Philly game but BSB had good reviews for him.

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I think it�s fair to say DeAngelo has probably been the most noticeable defenseman on the ice in both of these preseason games. (We discussed him at length after the win over the Devils here.) He led all Rangers with 23:54 last night, including a staggering 7:57 on the power play and even 3:05 on the penalty kill. It�s amazing how refreshing it is to see David Quinn actually, you know, looking at young talent and giving them a shot despite mistakes made. DeAngelo had a few giveaways that turned into small fires, but that happens when you have the puck a lot. He had five shots, two takeaways, and three blocks. I thought he was fantastic, and I think he�s taken an enormous step above Neal Pionk for that single open spot I�m projecting to be open.

enough to have the "light bulb" finally come on and focus on hockey. He was drafted highly for a reason and maybe Quinn does give him more of a chance than AV.

who knows?

I haven't see any Rangers pre-season games.

Based on the last time I saw them both play Pionk was much more solid across the board.

I did see the MTL pre-season games and last night saw Max Domi punch an unwilling combatant in Aaron Ekblad (I struggle with the sucker punch label - many in the media are giving it - mainly because Ekblad was jostling with him and saw him nudging him to fight but Ekblad refused to engage), but man that reminded me sort of his father with that quick punch. I think he could get a couple games for it.

Sucker punch or not it doesn't matter IMO, if the other person doesn't drop their gloves or "accept the challenge" you don't fight. It's that simple. Most people who have been slashing you all game or harassing you will drop their gloves (except Claude Lemieux vs Cam Neely).

you be the judge.
Link - ( New Window )

That is 100% a sucker punch and absolutely suspension worthy.

No reason whatsoever to shed the glove there.

Pretty disgusting IMO.

In comment 14086418 bigbluehoya said:

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That is 100% a sucker punch and absolutely suspension worthy. No reason whatsoever to shed the glove there. Pretty disgusting IMO.

agree with all except sucker punch. You have to protect yourself there if you're Ekblad. Domi is squared off with him or at worst he knows Domi is trying to engage him. it's probably semantics but IMO a sucker punch is when the other person isn't looking or if it comes without warning/provocation.

The label doesn�t much matter to me. It�s not good stuff regardless.

Ekblad has a checkered history of head injuries if memory serves...really hate to see this.

In comment 14086442 bigbluehoya said:

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The label doesn�t much matter to me. It�s not good stuff regardless. Ekblad has a checkered history of head injuries if memory serves...really hate to see this.

He cleared concussion protocol and has no broken nose. So now worries on the Ekblad side, I do think when these two teams face each other (which I don't think happens until December) there will be some heavyweights in the lineup. Panthers were pissed.

* no worries

This quote from Drouin is interesting:

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"The two were arguing with one another," Jonathan Drouin said. "I saw a pretty big slash from Ekblad on Max, and Max just took matters into his own hands. It�s also Ekblad�s fault for not protecting himself."

I think it's fairer to say a player can better attempt to protect themself from a check, but a sucker punch (or, one you don't see coming, whichever) is by nature something one can't protect themself from. I find it interesting a lightweight like Drouin would opine on fighting protocol.

like I said above. Domi did not come out of nowhere. Ekblad and he were jostling/slashing/whatever each other and Domi had enough.

Domi was wrong to engage with someone that didn't drop their gloves and will face the consequences for that, but as a hockey player and a fan I think Ekblad should have seen it coming. And i don't consider it a "sucker punch".

Doesn't make Domi any less wrong, and it's rare for a player liek Ekblad to dish out a slash like that and not be willing to engage especially with the size difference between Ekblad and Domi (the 6'4 Ekblad vs the maybe 5' 9" Domi), so Domi should face some discipline, but Drouin is 100% right.

IMO.

Apparently the league took it kind of lightly too, I don't know if Domi has a history, which they would consider if he did, but not even a regular season game?


Blain Potvin
‏ @Potsy_70
3h3 hours ago

Domi is suspended for the remaining 5 games of the preseason for the Ekblad incident

goal from Kovy, not sure how much he has left, but if this is any indication, quite a bit
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1) We'll suck if you go by record.

2) We'll be more entertaining than people expect. We still have good vets and we have promising young guys.

I'm actually excited for this season. I wish Kravtsov were there too.

In comment 14083518 pjcas18 said:

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was being scouted/drafted was way before my time of paying attention. but I don't think he was ever supposed to be a good offensive player or definitely not a great one. I think sometimes people hear "good two-way player" and think great we get a defensive guy or 3rd liner. But one of the best players of this era I have seen is Patrice Bergeron and I'm as amazed as his defensive zone play as I am with his offense. Not saying Andersson would be Bergeron, but I really don't think Marchand is a bad comp, but like Marchand, Andersson may need someone to distribute the puck to him. I think worst case with Andersson you get someone like Brendan Gallagher (but a much better skater) and best case you get a bigger, less asshole-ish, more skilled Marchand

Marchand now or Marchand 5 years ago? Marchand now is one of the best forwards in the NHL.

on his coach. And this is just my opinion from watching him play.

I know Marchand began to show signs of development under Julien, but IMO with Julien he'd still be a 60-point player, not playing on the PP 1st unit and spending more time in the penalty box.

If Quinn is like AV/Julien I think Andersson's offensive upside could be stifled a little, but if he's not oppressive with these youngsters and keeps them in spots to succeed while giving them some flexibility to be creative I think they can all thrive.

So I think Andersson (eventually) has Marchand 2017 - 2018 potential. He doesn't have a Bergeron or Pastrnak with him (as far as I know), but maybe that's Chytil and Kravtsov.

Right now I think Marchand, Bergeron and Pastrnak is as good a line as the NHL has had in a decade. PP units aren't sometimes even that good.

Maybe Toronto with Tavares puts something together, but both he and Matthews are centers, so unless it's a PP unit, I doubt it.

around a 20-20-40 player at his peak. I think the Rangers picked him because they believe he has more scoring potential than that.

was considered a "safe" picked because he already possessed the cliched "200 foot game" - which he does.

But that doesn't get you drafted at 7, it gets you drafted at 20 unless you have skill with it.

I think the Rangers made a good bet here.

He'll always be compared to players like Mittelstadt or Necas (the best of the bunch IMO) or Robert Thomas (also in the discussion), but I think Andersson gives up very little to them skill-wise.

But he's just not a toe drag dangler type, he's a high hockey IQ, max effort, guy with skill. IMO like Marchand or in Rangers lore, an Adam Graves type.

In comment 14088243 pjcas18 said:

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in Rangers lore, an Adam Graves type.

Adam Graves? ADAM GRAVES!

I bet you see the similarities.

my kind of player. gritty, will get the greasy goals, but you give him an open shot he'll beat your goalie.

He'll dish out punishment in the corners, probably play PK and even PP depending on the rest of the roster and he'll put up points. Where I disagree with some is I think he CAN be flashy even though flash isn't his whole game.

Should be a fun player for Rangers fans to watch, not fun like a Tarasenko or Gaudreau, but fun like Graves.

And chucking a silver medal in the stands is such a Lias Andersson thing to do it made me like him more.

Andersson, Chytil, Shestyorkin, Kravtsov, Miller, Lundqkvist.

Little concerned we might have trouble re-signing these guys in 2025.

In comment 14088286 BrettNYG10 said:

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Andersson, Chytil, Shestyorkin, Kravtsov, Miller, Lundqkvist. Little concerned we might have trouble re-signing these guys in 2025.

I think it's hard to really put a number on the total HOFers they have, some guys they haven't even drafted yet should be included because they're likely to be HOPers too.

Not even counting roster guys like Buchnevich and Hayes.

Just worried about the cap. Almost makes the five Cups we're going to win not even worth it.

Question: am I an asshole for hoping that Lundqvist's play craters this year so the Rangers finish dead last in the league and win the Jack Hughes Sweepstakes?

BTW, PJ, if you haven't seen this article about the USNTDP, I think you'll like it
Link - ( New Window )

thanks for sharing it.

Reminds me (on a much smaller scale) of my junior year in high school. We got a new coach, he was a former coach of Yale University's hockey program.

he had us play West Point JV team. And we were a young-ish high school team, very few seniors, and a lot of young juniors, I was 16 my junior year for example.

Anyway, other than physically, we did really well and it was a great experience. We tied the game and it was like winning the stanley cup.

One of my teammates was hit so hard he went to the wrong bench. We're "lucky" there was no concussion protocol then or he would have missed a lot of the season.

We also had games with a lot of the CT prep schools, Avon Old Farms, Gunnery, Choate, etc. Most of them were elite programs and/or had post-grad players, and we were a public high school.

Definitely helped galvanize us and prepare us for the season.

Anyway sounds like a similar concept tangentially to the what the USNTDP is doing.

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In comment 14088339 Greg from LI said:

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No, Leetch was at BC already. he was too much older than me for us to play, even though he was the town next to me (Cheshire) I never played him. I played against his younger brother though. And the Drury's. I've mentioned them a bunch. Ted was my age (hard to believe his son was just drafted). Chris a couple years younger than me. They want to Fairfield Prep though.

Dave Roberts (who played for the Blues for a few years was on Avon at the time though). Maybe other prospects/pros, but Roberts (probably an unknown to most fans) was their big name.

I don't remember what they were exactly, but I remember seeing Leetch's high school stats and they were absurd, like 90 points in 30 games or something.

was phenomenal in high school best backhand I've seen. He went top shelf with a backhand to beat our goalie once (my sophomore year maybe) from the top of the face off circle. Just a wicked shot.

That same game I was playing defense and our goalie was knocked around a little and I saw a loose puck in the crease and I dove to grab it, and when doing so I closed my hand on the puck and slid it out toward the corner and they called a penalty shot. Drury got stoned by our goalie, but back then you had to serve a penalty if they missed the shot. Our coach wanted to kill me. I didn't think I closed my hand, but also didn't really know that rule to be honest (I was a forward most of my career).

Ted Drury was not much of an NHLer, but great high school player, went to Harvard, and I think played on an Olympic team and then some decent time in the pros.

Also played against Roenick in youth hockey. he played for Ridgefield, CT for a couple years. He was defense and about half a head taller than everyone else and just about every time he had the puck he went coast to coast (we were 10/11 years old). We lost 8 or 9 to 1 in I think the only time we played him.

Craig Janney was another guy I played against, he went to Enfield High. I didn't actually play though, since I was a Freshman when he was a senior. I remember we played them at our home rink and he was late getting on the ice the were about to drop the puck and they opened the door to let him on. He stretched for a second, took the opening face off won it to himself and weaved around our D and score about 8 seconds into the game.

2nd face off he won again and our 6' 8" all-state defenseman came in an cross checked him high and knocked him out of the game. Borderline major, called a minor. We won the game 3 - 1 or something like that. Janney was an incredible high school player too.

I think that's about it for NHL players. I had some Olympians on my team and one who played with Kariya at Maine.

My team played against Eddie George in high school, but I was never on the field against him. I was not much of a football player and only played late in blowouts and on specials. He ran for like 300 yards against us. Didn't hurt that he was actually a postgrad who Fork Union was illegally using on the high school team, something that eventually resulted in them forfeiting all their wins.

The kid who dominated my Little League topped out in AA in the Cubs system.

and a lot of the dominant RB's being one man wrecking crews in high school.

In comment 14088204 pjcas18 said:

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on his coach. And this is just my opinion from watching him play. I know Marchand began to show signs of development under Julien, but IMO with Julien he'd still be a 60-point player, not playing on the PP 1st unit and spending more time in the penalty box. If Quinn is like AV/Julien I think Andersson's offensive upside could be stifled a little, but if he's not oppressive with these youngsters and keeps them in spots to succeed while giving them some flexibility to be creative I think they can all thrive. So I think Andersson (eventually) has Marchand 2017 - 2018 potential. He doesn't have a Bergeron or Pastrnak with him (as far as I know), but maybe that's Chytil and Kravtsov. Right now I think Marchand, Bergeron and Pastrnak is as good a line as the NHL has had in a decade. PP units aren't sometimes even that good. Maybe Toronto with Tavares puts something together, but both he and Matthews are centers, so unless it's a PP unit, I doubt it.

They are absolutely lethal. Three great talents with otherworldly chemistry and defensive acumen. None of those guys were drafted in the top of the first round. Bergeron was a 2nd rounder and Marchand was a 3rd rounder to boot. This is the NHL, it's hard to find superstars outside of the top 10. Amazing drafting.

In comment 14088219 Greg from LI said:

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around a 20-20-40 player at his peak. I think the Rangers picked him because they believe he has more scoring potential than that.

I think most people think he should at least be in the 50s in points. He's produced at every level. He's got extraordinarily high IQ to boot. As pjacs says he's just not a guy that will bring you out of your seat with dangles. I've heard Drury (Buffalo version) and Ryan O'Reilly comparisons.

In comment 14088416 pjcas18 said:

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and a lot of the dominant RB's being one man wrecking crews in high school.

This was the Virginia Prep League - at the time, we were the defending champions (which is why they cheated with him, they usually dominated the league and were pissed when we beat them the year before), and he was bigger than most of our linemen at 6'3" 220. It was a joke.

2017 Draft (thanks for the DRAFT DAY TRADE, GORTON. Gave us no time to prepare), but it seems like many in Blueshirt Nation were opposed to the Lias pick because of his limited upside. I think they posited that if we didn't lose Oscar Lindberg to Vegas, we probably wouldn't have taken Lias (which is bullshit.) It was the notion that Lias may end up being a very good third-line C or MAYBE a second-line guy, but he wouldn't have the big time potential that guys like Vilardi, Rasmussen, and Mittelstadt allegedly have. Yes, Lias was more NHL-ready than most of the prospects, but his ceiling was somewhere in the middle, which is not exactly what you want for in a top-10 pick. You want to swing for the fences if you're picking that high.


But IDK, Lias looks pretty damn good to me. He seems like a very well-rounded player and has way more upside than Lindberg.

In comment 14088455 Anakim said:

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2017 Draft (thanks for the DRAFT DAY TRADE, GORTON. Gave us no time to prepare), but it seems like many in Blueshirt Nation were opposed to the Lias pick because of his limited upside. I think they posited that if we didn't lose Oscar Lindberg to Vegas, we probably wouldn't have taken Lias (which is bullshit.) It was the notion that Lias may end up being a very good third-line C or MAYBE a second-line guy, but he wouldn't have the big time potential that guys like Vilardi, Rasmussen, and Mittelstadt allegedly have. Yes, Lias was more NHL-ready than most of the prospects, but his ceiling was somewhere in the middle, which is not exactly what you want for in a top-10 pick. You want to swing for the fences if you're picking that high. But IDK, Lias looks pretty damn good to me. He seems like a very well-rounded player and has way more upside than Lindberg.

Pierre lazily compared him to Lindberg during the draft I believe. Might have been Fast, or both. Anyway, it was based on them both being Swedish and sound defensively. It was a bullshit comparison from what I see. But that's where it comes from.