Saquon Barkley is a terrific talent. I have zero doubts that he will be a great player in this league.
That being said, is there anyone still left on BBI who actually believes he was the correct pick for this franchise? I'm not being a smart ass, I'd legitimately like to hear why if you believe that.
This franchise has no real plan for the future right now. Gettleman has not earned the benefit of the doubt. He very clearly was wrong in his evaluation of the current team. He clearly believed they were ready to win now, which is obviously very far from the truth. He clearly believed Eli had a lot left in the tank. That doesn't seem to be the case.
The single most important job of a new GM is properly evaluating your current roster. A lot of people on BBI will say this is hindsight, but it's really not. Many of us on BBI didn't believe this team was ready to win now. A lot of our worst fears have been realized. Some will point to 2016 as a reason to go for it this year that they are actually more talented than they were in 2016. The problem I have with that is 2016 is the only year in the last what, 5 years, that the team hasn't sucked shit. That entire season seemed very flukey. They won a shit load of close games. The defense played way above their heads. Eli did not have a great year.
It's more than fair to be worried about the direction of this franchise with John Mara and Gettleman running the show. Most of the decisions John Mara has made have blown up in his face. There is no way to know this for sure, but I'd guess that DG is the only GM that the Giants could have hired that would have taken Barkley. His comments in the press are the most frightening of all. Ripping analytics and talking as if we're still in the 1980's.
Right or wrong, I also think DG's age played a role in the decisions made in the off-season. He's 67 years old. He's unlikely to be thinking of where this franchise will be in a decade.
It's still hard to fathom that anyone could watch the Giants the last 4-5 years and thought that taking a running back #2 overall was a smart business decision.
A lot of people on BBI in the off-season also thought that Davis Webb was the legitimate future of the Giants. Yet another thing i'll never be able to wrap my head around. He couldn't get off the bench last year and play over Geno Smith for a regime that drafted him. That told me all I needed to know about him.
Eli Manning is not the main problem with this team. But the fact is he's 37 years old, has not played well in years, and with the current roster it's not going to get any better. He could have Barry Sanders in his prime back there and it wouldn't make much difference. The line is a total train wreck. Eli is clearly shot mentally playing behind this line for the last 5 years. Physically he still has something left but each year that passes he's going to have less and less left.
I actually feel bad for Barkley. It's not his fault that the roster sucks.
The Giants desperately need a QB of the future. 2019 doesn't look to be a good year to need a QB, the likely top QB has a lot of character concerns. Barkley could stand on his head every game and without a QB for the future and a new offensive line none of it will ever matter.
John Mara has really put this franchise in a terrible situation. There is a legitimate argument to be made that the New York Giants are in the worst shape for the future of any team in the sport.
Yes, it's only 2 games into the season. But we've seen this movie too many times in the last 5 years.
The owner can't be fired, but he hasn't given any Giants fan reason to be confident in any decision that he makes. He totally botched the Eli situation last year, made the wrong hire at HC in McAdoo, kept Jerry Reese as the GM for way too long, stayed within his comfort zone when he hired Gettleman. His batting average is close to .00 in the last 5 years when it comes to decision making.
I'm genuinely interested in hearing from people who still believe that Barkley was the correct pick for this franchise. Every season that goes by without being a contender is a season wasted of Barkley's prime.
This really was not that hard to see coming.
For argument's sake, let's put the Giants, Saints, Patriots, Chargers and Steelers all in the same category. That is to say, all have SB winning, or franchise (sorry Chargers) QBs who are most likely nearing the end.
The Pats traded away Jimmy G.
The Steelers are doing just about the same, if not less, planning for their future than NYG, and that's with Ben talking retirement every year.
New Orleans traded a 3rd for Teddy B with one year left on his deal, after already trading this coming year's 1st for a pass rusher.
The Chargers, even with all the winning Phil Rivers has been doing lately (no playoffs since 2013), what exactly is their plan when he hangs em up?
Now I understand the argument is, well, those teams weren't sitting near the top of the draft. I get it, and it's fair. But, every single one of those franchises passed on Lamar Jackson, and in the Patriots case, passed twice. Jackson had gotten a ton of praise by scouts and even here on BBI as maybe the forgotten QB of this class and absolutely on the level as the others.
The Chargers and even the Patriots with multiple firsts were very much in striking distance of Rosen after he dropped down to 10.
For all the bitching about NYG being careless, having no future, etc. You can argue that they've actually been doing more than the teams that are in the most similar situation as they are. Also, while not applicable to the DG/PS regime, NYG was reported to be very heavily interested in Mahomes in 2017 round 1 before settling for Webb in round 3, so it's not as if ownership is walking on eggshells around Manning.
And a couple of other things. If you're calling a positive 2016 "flukey" then you can also turn around and say a negative 2015 was also "flukey" as they lost a bunch of games they should have won, enough to make the playoffs even. Eli's 2016 season was also more than fine by any measure. He put this team in position to win a playoff game that year, others did not do the same for themselves.
Nice work
that was to determine whether he showed enough to be the QB of the future. Its called preparing for the future and self-evaluating.
For argument's sake, let's put the Giants, Saints, Patriots, Chargers and Steelers all in the same category. That is to say, all have SB winning, or franchise (sorry Chargers) QBs who are most likely nearing the end.
The Pats traded away Jimmy G.
The Steelers are doing just about the same, if not less, planning for their future than NYG, and that's with Ben talking retirement every year.
New Orleans traded a 3rd for Teddy B with one year left on his deal, after already trading this coming year's 1st for a pass rusher.
The Chargers, even with all the winning Phil Rivers has been doing lately (no playoffs since 2013), what exactly is their plan when he hangs em up?
Now I understand the argument is, well, those teams weren't sitting near the top of the draft. I get it, and it's fair. But, every single one of those franchises passed on Lamar Jackson, and in the Patriots case, passed twice. Jackson had gotten a ton of praise by scouts and even here on BBI as maybe the forgotten QB of this class and absolutely on the level as the others.
The Chargers and even the Patriots with multiple firsts were very much in striking distance of Rosen after he dropped down to 10.
For all the bitching about NYG being careless, having no future, etc. You can argue that they've actually been doing more than the teams that are in the most similar situation as they are. Also, while not applicable to the DG/PS regime, NYG was reported to be very heavily interested in Mahomes in 2017 round 1 before settling for Webb in round 3, so it's not as if ownership is walking on eggshells around Manning.
And a couple of other things. If you're calling a positive 2016 "flukey" then you can also turn around and say a negative 2015 was also "flukey" as they lost a bunch of games they should have won, enough to make the playoffs even. Eli's 2016 season was also more than fine by any measure. He put this team in position to win a playoff game that year, others did not do the same for themselves.
Very good post. The belief that the next franchise QB is as easy as selecting him at #2 is a faulty decision point that many are making.
Simply put, taking the best player available may not always be the best pick, but it is really difficult to say it is the wrong pick.
Imo, I think Mara would have been fine with letting Eli leave and hook up with Jax, for example. Shurmur comes in, is asked to evaluate Eli objectively (Mara’s love for Eli would be far too biased) and he felt Eli still had the physical tools.
Shurmur then obviously watched extensive film on the projected QBs in the draft and concluded that they were not SPECIAL enough to project as franchise-caliber. Given his ability to have developed QBs in the past, his expertise (along with scouting reports and consultations with the scouts themselves) was valued and, imo, appropriately followed.
Again, time will tell (and certainly not after just 2 games or even a year or two) if he and DG were right
I personally think you're giving Mara too much credit. I think those questions were asked to DG and Shurmur BEFORE they were hired and they were hired because of the answers they gave him (That Eli could still play and they can still win with him). And let's not forget Accorsi was involved in Gettleman's hiring. What's Accorsi's legacy again?
Just my opinion.
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try to say this for the last time:
Imo, I think Mara would have been fine with letting Eli leave and hook up with Jax, for example. Shurmur comes in, is asked to evaluate Eli objectively (Mara’s love for Eli would be far too biased) and he felt Eli still had the physical tools.
Shurmur then obviously watched extensive film on the projected QBs in the draft and concluded that they were not SPECIAL enough to project as franchise-caliber. Given his ability to have developed QBs in the past, his expertise (along with scouting reports and consultations with the scouts themselves) was valued and, imo, appropriately followed.
Again, time will tell (and certainly not after just 2 games or even a year or two) if he and DG were right
I personally think you're giving Mara too much credit. I think those questions were asked to DG and Shurmur BEFORE they were hired and they were hired because of the answers they gave him (That Eli could still play and they can still win with him). And let's not forget Accorsi was involved in Gettleman's hiring. What's Accorsi's legacy again?
Just my opinion.
I may be. Simply my take
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despite every indication he wasn't ready. And that was before we knew he sucked.
that was to determine whether he showed enough to be the QB of the future. Its called preparing for the future and self-evaluating.
At what expense? What if he was the QB of the future? You're going to throw him out there in that situation to prove it? You'd get the guy killed.
He was drafted as a two to three year project. Jerry Reese's words.
HE WASN'T READY! It's more than crystal clear at this point. They had seen what they needed to see in practice to determine that. He was never even elevated to 2nd team.
For argument's sake, let's put the Giants, Saints, Patriots, Chargers and Steelers all in the same category. That is to say, all have SB winning, or franchise (sorry Chargers) QBs who are most likely nearing the end.
The Pats traded away Jimmy G.
The Steelers are doing just about the same, if not less, planning for their future than NYG, and that's with Ben talking retirement every year.
New Orleans traded a 3rd for Teddy B with one year left on his deal, after already trading this coming year's 1st for a pass rusher.
The Chargers, even with all the winning Phil Rivers has been doing lately (no playoffs since 2013), what exactly is their plan when he hangs em up?
Belichick has taken a ton of shit for trading JG - and he's fucking BELICHICK.
The Chargers? Is that the sterling example we want to compare ourselves with?
That leaves the Saints and Steelers. The Saints traded for Bridgewater - who will be a FA at season's end, but could just as easily end up extending him. The Steelers nabbed MR, who looked good in preseason action. Further, both of these teams currently have functional offenses. We don't.
It would have made the hurricane surrounding Eli's benching look like a sneeze by comparison. There's no way that Mara, Shurmur, or Gettleman wanted anything to do with this, especially since they felt Eli was the right guy to deal with the entirely reconstructed OL.
It would have made the hurricane surrounding Eli's benching look like a sneeze by comparison. There's no way that Mara, Shurmur, or Gettleman wanted anything to do with this, especially since they felt Eli was the right guy to deal with the entirely reconstructed OL.
If they're making picks based on what the media will say then we're in more trouble than I thought.
In doing so, they allowed Shurmur to fully evaluate Webb. Ok, they let Webb go, but that was very smart to do your due diligence there.
They still have Kyle Lauletta who showed us some things in the preseason.
They still have all of their draft picks.
Look, if it was up to me, I probably would have gone with Wilks when this process started. I didn't trust that Shurmur's first HC experience could totally be blamed on "Cleveland". If it had been Wilks, I would have placed more emphasis on drafting the QB as we would have hired a defensive mind.
Once Shurmur was brought in, I really came around to the idea, and I think most of it was seeing what he had done for Case Keenum. That kind of takes you away from the idea that you need the highly touted QBs with the high bust potential, when the best player to come out of the draft in the last 25 years is staring you in the face.
The short term "bonus" if you will would be if Shurmur could get Eli back on track. That of course goes hand in hand with this offensive line that so far has not held up its end of the bargain.
Longer term, the plan at QB is Kyle Lauletta and/or any other future draft pick or FA pickup and Shurmur's ability to develop them. To me, even more than usual with other head coaches, Shurmur's success here will be directly measured by his ability to find/develop the next guy.
1. Finding a running back in the draft is easier than perhaps any other position
2. Finding a franchise QB in the draft is exceptionally difficult and can take years or even decades
3. There were 6 or 7 blue chip prospects in this draft: Mayfield, Darnold, Allen, Rosen, Barkley, Chubb, and Nelson
After the draft, those previously accepted truths were frequently challenged by BBIers that wanted to talk themselves into Barkley being the right pick.
Now, another piece of history: since we drafted Odell Beckham we have averaged 21 PPG (less now after these first two games). I know Beckham is the most popular Giant player, but he has been a gloss of paint on a blasted out shell of an offense. That isn't me disliking his personality, and it isn't me going on about the salary cap. It is a fact.
The front office didn't seem to appreciate that fact when they used the most important pick in 14 years on another gloss of paint. I know Gettleman just got here, and Barkley absolutely looks like a wonderful player and a great kid, but drafting him over the next franchise QB was a disastrous error. We will continue to be the same poor offense we've been for many years because we haven't addressed the true nature of our problems.
I'd say it is a fireable mistake, but I'm convinced ownership either mandated keeping Eli when they hired Gettleman, or they hired Gettleman because he said he'd keep Eli.
The Giants have no idea what they're doing and anyone defending what they've done the past 6 years is just a loyal homer. Nothing wrong with that but facts make you look foolish.
No team has started 0-2 five of the past six years except the Giants even the Browns. The Giants have won 3 of their last 19 games. They haven't scored 30 points since 2015. There's no defense for this. We're talking 3 head coaches and 2 GM's and almost all new players and it keeps getting worse not better.
1. Finding a running back in the draft is easier than perhaps any other position
2. Finding a franchise QB in the draft is exceptionally difficult and can take years or even decades
3. There were 6 or 7 blue chip prospects in this draft: Mayfield, Darnold, Allen, Rosen, Barkley, Chubb, and Nelson
After the draft, those previously accepted truths were frequently challenged by BBIers that wanted to talk themselves into Barkley being the right pick.
Now, another piece of history: since we drafted Odell Beckham we have averaged 21 PPG (less now after these first two games). I know Beckham is the most popular Giant player, but he has been a gloss of paint on a blasted out shell of an offense. That isn't me disliking his personality, and it isn't me going on about the salary cap. It is a fact.
The front office didn't seem to appreciate that fact when they used the most important pick in 14 years on another gloss of paint. I know Gettleman just got here, and Barkley absolutely looks like a wonderful player and a great kid, but drafting him over the next franchise QB was a disastrous error. We will continue to be the same poor offense we've been for many years because we haven't addressed the true nature of our problems.
I'd say it is a fireable mistake, but I'm convinced ownership either mandated keeping Eli when they hired Gettleman, or they hired Gettleman because he said he'd keep Eli.
+1
Going one step further to the last sentence of Terps' post. There have been numerous posts two games in that the Giants knew this was going to be a multi-year effort and that the roster needed to be completely overhauled.
If that's the case, then it just makes the decision to pass on a QB or DE that much worse. I don't believe that to be true; I think the Giants thought they'd be competitive this year and right back in it next, which is why they decided they had enough runway left in Eli's career to bypass a QB. That bit of self-evaluation is the most concerning to me, TBH.
Two games into a season with a roster still badly in need of talent everywhere is way too soon to hit the panic button.
Hang in there, this is going to take time. I have concerns about DG and his outdated thinking, and if we're right about it, this is going to take longer than that to fix. Hiring DG will have been the root mistake ...
This was my opinion, but I like Barkley as well since it is obvious to me that we are picking pretty high up this year as well.
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was the best player in the draft. It's never wrong to go BPA.
I've never seen so much handwringing over drafting the consensus best player in the entire draft, before.
Great - he was the best college player in the draft and the best prospect (I don't agree, but let's use that as the baseline).
But that doesn't change the dynamic that this best player/prospect is a RB. So that changes this best players value immensely. By nature of his position, he has the biggest, quickest downside.
Okay, maybe I get 4-5 great years - tops. Meanwhile, with a QB I potentially get 10+. The most critical in the game; and while I have a 37 year old QB who looks like he just saw ghost.
I could do the same thought on a DE, OL, maybe a corner.
It's really a math problem. And taking a RB doesn't solve that problem...
If the Giants drafted Darnold, he would be out of the league or injured by 2023. It doesn't matter who you are lining up back there if there is no protection.
The Giants knew they could not turn this horrible roster into one that could compete for a championship the following year. Too many holes to fill and not enough money or available talent to do it.
Their only move here was to do what they did this off season.
1. Addressed (whether effective or not) the OL with Solder and Hernandez.
2. Drafted an exciting RB. We know fans like shiny objects.
3. Signed OBJ who is also an untouchable fan favorite.
4. Showed a commitment to Eli both in their actions and verbally. Very important to the fans.
These decisions also made the most sense to help the team THIS year. Up until Sunday night, fans still had hope.
Barkley was the safe pick.
I do believe Barkley will be great, but I don't think it will translate into much difference as far as wins and losses go.
The possibility is also there that Barkley won't live up the hype. We all (myself included) act like it would be impossible for him to be a bust, but it's still a possibility. Trent Richardson was not as highly thought of but no one thought he would bust and he did.
I thought he would bust and said so at the time. Alabama that year had the best OL in the country and was opening up highways for Richardson to run through. Richardson showed me nothing in terms of his game translating. In fact, I openly mocked a draft publication on twitter for calling him the next Adrian Peterson.
The truth is that Reese left this franchise with total crap on the OL. Even had the Giants picked Darnold, you are looking at a multi-year rebuild of the OL.
If the Giants had taken Darnold then this board would be hot and bothered any time that Barkley had a great game for whatever team drafted him.
And the people screaming for Barkley do not understand that Barkley could be Reggie Bush, Trent Richardson or Cadillac Williams.
That works both ways, there's risk to drafting any position.
Most say Barkley was a great pick given all of the info on the table at the time of the selection. Maybe he won't be as good as advertised, you're right.
On the contrary, the Darnold people have placed this franchise in some nightmare QB hell they've made up in their heads.
So you’re that sure? You know he won’t be the answer. I don’t know. Even Shurmur doesn’t fully know, but He certainly knows more about KL than you or I
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Those of us that were screaming draft a QB in April wanted this team to do the right thing and completely rebuild the roster from the ground up instead of continuing with the half measure/band aid approach.
we turned over the majority of the roster. switched to a 3-4 D and brought in LB's. Have an entirely new OL (position wise). Have a different RB. New coach and new GM
But since we have the same QB it was a half-measure and a band aid?
Do you people really believe the horseshit you type?
You will never learn how to disagree with someone without being a dbag will you? Yes, everything they did this off-season was yet another attempt to band-aid a contender with Eli again.
New GM? All they did was hire the guy that lost out to Reese in 2007. The team desperately needed an outside perspective on the roster, instead we got Gettleman. But hey, at least the team is working their fannies off.
Way too early to make a call either way.
And you know what? As fans of a franchise, it's okay to debate this. It's okay to look back at watershed moments in the franchise's history and say "they goofed" or "they nailed that one."
A lot of people thought paying a king's ransom for Eli was the wrong move at the time. It was a reasonable position to take, just like thinking they should have taken a QB this year is a reasonable position to take. We had a viable QB in Collins who (like Eli), desperately needed protection. Robert Gallery was the guy a lot of people wanted to help solidify the line. Well, looking back, making the trade and drafting Eli was likely the right call (I suppose you could argue that keeping the draft picks and drafting Roethlisberger instead may have resulted in another championship or two - but come on, who knows).
Seems like there's a good chance we can get our franchise QB next year - in which case we'd have Beckham, Barkley, and a guy who can actually get them the ball. If that happens, we may look back on this year and say drafting Barkley was the right move and that another long season was worth it.
But of course, there looms the possibility that we may regret not drafting Darnold for a long, long time.
Time will tell...
And you know what? As fans of a franchise, it's okay to debate this. It's okay to look back at watershed moments in the franchise's history and say "they goofed" or "they nailed that one."
A lot of people thought paying a king's ransom for Eli was the wrong move at the time. It was a reasonable position to take, just like thinking they should have taken a QB this year is a reasonable position to take. We had a viable QB in Collins who (like Eli), desperately needed protection. Robert Gallery was the guy a lot of people wanted to help solidify the line. Well, looking back, making the trade and drafting Eli was likely the right call (I suppose you could argue that keeping the draft picks and drafting Roethlisberger instead may have resulted in another championship or two - but come on, who knows).
Seems like there's a good chance we can get our franchise QB next year - in which case we'd have Beckham, Barkley, and a guy who can actually get them the ball. If that happens, we may look back on this year and say drafting Barkley was the right move and that another long season was worth it.
But of course, there looms the possibility that we may regret not drafting Darnold for a long, long time.
Time will tell...
Debate is fine, that’s why we’re here, but consider:
1-We all push the SAME narrative ad infinitum, ad nauseum. So, a ludicrous debate
2-We’re all DUG IN with the same narrative. So, a ludicrous debate
3-Is this going to go on every flucking day, every flucking game, all season long? So, still a ludicrous debate. And torturous
4-Will ONE mind, relative to the draft change? So, a ludicrous debate
Saquon Barkley is a HOF talent. He is a once-in-a-generation RB. This is not about one year. And as far as concerns about RB health and career spans, one of the things I love about Barkley is he doesn't take big hits. He knows how to protect himself. Defenders can't square him up because he's so elusive. I fully expect he'll be a force in the NFL for at least 8 years and probably more.
He is 21 years old. I hope he's a Giant for the next 12 years. I hope he breaks Emmitt Smith's rushing record of 18,355 yards. He has the talent and the game to do that.
And he can be part of Super Bowl winning teams. Yes, the Giants still have holes on the roster. That would be true no matter who they picked. Even if they picked Nelson, that wasn't going to fix the line. Solder has struggled, Omameh has been bad, Flowers has been bad, and Hernandez has struggled. The team needs work. They need improvement from the guys that are here and they need new players to fill some holes. A new QB is necessary. Eli is not going to magically turn back into 2011 Eli again. That time is gone. They need another OL, and they need pass rushers.
There will be more good QBs in the draft next year.
But Saquon Barkley was/is a once in a generation talent. When you have a RB breaking the Penn State power clean record, hoisting 405 lbs, and that man squats 495 lbs, and that man puts up OL reps on the bench (29) at the combine of 225 lbs, and that man runs a 4.4 40, and that man verts 41 inches, and that man was a one man scoring machine at PSU...you are dealing with a freak of nature, an otherwordly human being that is a one in a multi-billion (with a B, and not hyperbole) athlete.
If you pass on that individual, when you have your franchise icon entrenched for 2 more years at QB anyway, you are making a mistake. Saquon is going to make believers out of every single one of you.
And yes, they need to fix a lot more on this team. That will come down the road. Until then, enjoy Saquon, because this is the dawn of a player that is going to go down as one of the greatest Giants ever. It's not every year you can draft a guy like that. And keep repeating this statement..."the draft is not about 1 year."
They will get their QB. They will improve the OL. And they will do so with two of the most dynamic offensive weapons in NFL history already in place.
All that said, if they don't get a QB early in the draft next year, I will throw a conniption fit.
Drew Lock, Ryan Finley, perhaps Will Grier...one or more of these guys are going to be franchise QBs, the Giants just need to be in a position to get the right one. And it's a good year for them to be terrible and need a QB. The Broncos are going to win too much and are already 2-0. The Chargers are likely going to win too much as well. The Dolphins have already won 2 games. The Patriots will win too much. The Jets, Bills, Browns, and Texans have already grabbed their franchise QBs and are unlikely to use a high pick on another. The Saints and the Raiders will be potential QB suitors, and the Saints are going to win too much, and the Raiders will probably still have faith in Derek Carr.
There is unlikely to be much competition for the Giants to grab their top guy at QB in the 2019 draft. That should be exciting for us.
And you know what? As fans of a franchise, it's okay to debate this. It's okay to look back at watershed moments in the franchise's history and say "they goofed" or "they nailed that one."
A lot of people thought paying a king's ransom for Eli was the wrong move at the time. It was a reasonable position to take, just like thinking they should have taken a QB this year is a reasonable position to take. We had a viable QB in Collins who (like Eli), desperately needed protection. Robert Gallery was the guy a lot of people wanted to help solidify the line. Well, looking back, making the trade and drafting Eli was likely the right call (I suppose you could argue that keeping the draft picks and drafting Roethlisberger instead may have resulted in another championship or two - but come on, who knows).
Seems like there's a good chance we can get our franchise QB next year - in which case we'd have Beckham, Barkley, and a guy who can actually get them the ball. If that happens, we may look back on this year and say drafting Barkley was the right move and that another long season was worth it.
But of course, there looms the possibility that we may regret not drafting Darnold for a long, long time.
Time will tell...
I just don't understand this line of thinking and I've seen it several times. You are only drafting one guy. It doesn't matter one bit how the draft class stacks up relative to other classes. It's a one to one comparison. Is Barkley a far and away better prospect than your highest rated QB available at that pick. The Giants thought yes and I agreed with them, and I really, really liked Darnold and I do believe he will be a successful franchise QB. I'm happy for the Jets and their fans. However, there will be another guy as good as Darnold in the draft, likely next year. Darnold wasn't a generational QB like Luck or Peyton. He was a very good QB prospect and I would've supported the pick and understood it if they went that way. But I'm over the moon at having Barkley in the fold.
And when we get the heir apparent in a Drew Lock or Ryan Finley or Will Grier, 10 years from now you might be saying, "Wow, remember when we were arguing about Darnold over Barkley? We are so lucky we were a little more patient and landed _____ QB.
It's not about 1 year. It's not about 1 year. It's not about 1 year.
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obviously do not understand that Barkley could be Marshall Faulk and Darnold could be Mark Sanchez or else they would not be screaming at this point.
And the people screaming for Barkley do not understand that Barkley could be Reggie Bush, Trent Richardson or Cadillac Williams.
That works both ways, there's risk to drafting any position.
And for you to make those comparisons is laughable. I'm trying hard not to insult you for saying something so idiotic. He's already shown more than Richardson, anyway.
Unless the unforeseen happens (tragic accident, meteor strike, or surprise medical situation), Barkley is and will be a homerun. Period end of story. There is literally zero chance he's a bust based on ability to play football. Zero.
Jim, I thought the team would be a 6-8 win team (with room for upside if things broke right). Planning on being as awful as they were last year was not factored into my predictions.
Keeping Eli and turning over more than half the roster was all they could do last offseason, we knew (if you were willing to acknowledge it) we're looking at 2-3 seasons to rebuild and perhaps more as it takes time to tear down the past (in terms of the contracts/salary cap).
Keeping Eli and turning over more than half the roster was all they could do last offseason, we knew (if you were willing to acknowledge it) we're looking at 2-3 seasons to rebuild and perhaps more as it takes time to tear down the past (in terms of the contracts/salary cap).
Thank you...this was not a 1 year make over. Minimum 2 years.
I've also learned to change the channel...
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And when we get the heir apparent in a Drew Lock or Ryan Finley or Will Grier, 10 years from now you might be saying, "Wow, remember when we were arguing about Darnold over Barkley? We are so lucky we were a little more patient and landed _____ QB.
Jim, I thought the team would be a 6-8 win team (with room for upside if things broke right). Planning on being as awful as they were last year was not factored into my predictions.
That's understandable and they could still get there. And even still, at 6-10 maybe they would still get their guy because so many bad teams got their franchise signal caller this year or in recent years. And teams that clearly need a franchise QB, like Denver and New Orleans, they are going to win 8 games or more almost assuredly.
I never thought the Giants would be a playoff team. I thought, if everything broke right, the moon and the stars aligned, and fate intervened, they could go 10-6, but that was on the verge of dreaming. I thought maybe 5-11 or 6-10, to your point, would be about right.
We'll see. I think just enjoy watching OBJ and Barkley this year. Even enjoy watching Eli (although it's pretty tough right now to enjoy it), because this may be his last full year starting for the NY Giants. This could be his swan song.
Don't watch for playoff hopes or a winning season, because this is just year 1 of a rebuild.
I still think it's an exciting time both for the foundation that was brought in and for the possibilities of the new QB that is coming.
As others have said, Barkley is a once in a decade type player on the level of guys like Adrian Peterson, Ladanian Tomlison, Marshall Faulk, Barry Sanders, etc. Unlike the QBs previously named, you don't find a guy like that every year.
Not drafting a QB isn't the issue with this team. The offensive line clearly is the number 1 problem, and I don't think anyone thinks taking Nelson over Barkley was the right pick. It's going to take time. Grab the QB next year, make more moves along the line in the second round and through free agency and continue to improve. This is just year 1 for Barkley, let's see where we are with him, and the team around him, in years 3, 4, 5 before we say taking the once in a generation prospect was the wrong move.
I still like the pick because I see Eli Manning still having gas in the tank, and I see no real reason to think Lauletta was a wasted pick. Who knows?
I support the pick. Barkley is going to be fun to watch.
The Giants need a better offensive line. If they had two more very good pieces there, I don't think this would be a conversation.
fwiw
I would've drafted Darnold, but I recognized that he was a flawed prospect that we would've hoped the best for. I'm perfectly fine with the Giants instead drafting THE BEST OVERALL PROSPECT in the class. I haven't really given it a second thought. The only way I would've joined the chorus of incessant complaints and criticisms is if they passed on a Tony Boselli/Jonathan Ogden-type OL prospect.
The idea that the Giants can't get QBs in another draft or trade up to get a QB prospect they love is ridiculous. Once again, none of these 4 players were Andrew Luck. What isn't ridiculous is the fact they didn't love any of these QB prospects regardless of how they felt about Eli. It's quite understandable.