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Chad Wheeler expected to starting at RT

jlukes : 9/23/2018 7:20 am
Per twitter
What about the other four?  
Brown Recluse : 9/23/2018 7:23 am : link
haha
At this coach is trying  
micky : 9/23/2018 7:24 am : link
All they can do at this point
and the show has hit  
dep026 : 9/23/2018 7:24 am : link
A new low.
Reason?  
jeff57 : 9/23/2018 7:27 am : link
.
Per Rapoport  
BigBlueHens : 9/23/2018 7:28 am : link
We can't say the coach isn't trying...
Link - ( New Window )
RE: Reason?  
FStubbs : 9/23/2018 7:28 am : link
In comment 14089363 jeff57 said:
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You're kidding right?
RE: Reason?  
GiantsRage2007 : 9/23/2018 7:29 am : link
In comment 14089363 jeff57 said:
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Lol. Good one.
RE: RE: Reason?  
jeff57 : 9/23/2018 7:30 am : link
In comment 14089365 FStubbs said:
Quote:
In comment 14089363 jeff57 said:


Quote:


.



You're kidding right?


My point is that they just didnít suddenly wake up and realize that Flowers sucked.
Are we supposed to take from this  
Reb8thVA : 9/23/2018 7:30 am : link
That Flowers is the communication problem?
Now  
K-Gun? Pop-Gun : 9/23/2018 7:38 am : link
Iíll watch!
I like  
Josh in the City : 9/23/2018 7:39 am : link
How this was kept a secret all week to prevent the Texans big time pass rushers from preparing for Wheeler. Good job Shurm.
Jerry Reese's drafts are making me really angry and that's not healthy  
Britt in VA : 9/23/2018 7:41 am : link
.
RE: Jerry Reese's drafts are making me really angry and that's not healthy  
Reb8thVA : 9/23/2018 7:43 am : link
In comment 14089375 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
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The gift that keeps on giving. I wanted him gone after 2013. Still canít believe he hasnít been hired.sarcasm off
RE: Jerry Reese's drafts are making me really angry and that's not healthy  
jeff57 : 9/23/2018 7:44 am : link
In comment 14089375 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
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Just think. Had he taken Gurley or Gordon, the Giants would have taken a QB or traded down in this yearís draft.
RE: At this coach is trying  
mfsd : 9/23/2018 7:46 am : link
In comment 14089359 micky said:
Quote:
All they can do at this point


Agree. They cut Shane Smith. Essentially holding weekly tryouts for kick returner. Putting Ray Ray Armstrong on the field a lot more. The talent is pretty thin, but at least theyíre not afraid to make harsh decisions
Be careful  
Mark from Jersey : 9/23/2018 7:47 am : link
what you wish for Wheeler looked worse than Flowers in PS.

That being said worth a shot.
RE: RE: RE: Reason?  
GiantsRage2007 : 9/23/2018 7:48 am : link
In comment 14089368 jeff57 said:
Quote:
In comment 14089365 FStubbs said:


Quote:


In comment 14089363 jeff57 said:


Quote:


.



You're kidding right?



My point is that they just didnít suddenly wake up and realize that Flowers sucked.


I hear what youíre saying. Theyíve probably known Flowers has sucked itís just maybe now they think Wheeler has progressed? We can only hope.
worth a shot  
bigblue18 : 9/23/2018 7:52 am : link
nothing to lose here. Maybe omaheh will play better without flowers
Nothing to lose.  
Britt in VA : 9/23/2018 7:56 am : link
Just having a better attitude makes him an upgrade.
wheeler sucks  
XBRONX : 9/23/2018 8:02 am : link
at pass pro at RT. The staff said he is better playing the left side. Poor Eli.
RE: worth a shot  
nygiants16 : 9/23/2018 8:02 am : link
In comment 14089384 bigblue18 said:
Quote:
nothing to lose here. Maybe omaheh will play better without flowers


it COULD be he felt he had to help flowers to much and he was getting beat but either way he has tonplay a lot better
RE: RE: RE: Reason?  
BigBlueShock : 9/23/2018 8:04 am : link
In comment 14089368 jeff57 said:
Quote:
In comment 14089365 FStubbs said:


Quote:


In comment 14089363 jeff57 said:


Quote:


.



You're kidding right?



My point is that they just didnít suddenly wake up and realize that Flowers sucked.

Iím really not sure what your point is. Are you suggesting that they should keep Flowers starting all season because they already knew he sucked and he started week 1?

They were always going to give him the first opportunity. Between him being a 1st round pick and not having anything remotely average to replace him with, a new staff of course is going to see if thereís some, anything, they can bring out in the guy. They obviously have their answer
My point was, why now?  
jeff57 : 9/23/2018 8:08 am : link
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RE: My point was, why now?  
Britt in VA : 9/23/2018 8:10 am : link
In comment 14089394 jeff57 said:
Quote:
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Because they have to do something if they have any hope of saving the season. Now is the time.
Why now?  
bigblue18 : 9/23/2018 8:11 am : link
Come on if we win we still have a season. Might as well do everything possible until it's too late
RE: My point was, why now?  
nygiants16 : 9/23/2018 8:16 am : link
In comment 14089394 jeff57 said:
Quote:
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they could not release flowers so they gave him first shot...he failed.

Shurmur decided to make a change, maybe they see wheeler getting better
if someone sucks it's ok to bench them even if you  
markky : 9/23/2018 8:16 am : link
think the replacement might suck worse. everyone needs to earn their job by not sucking.
This is Gettleman  
shyster : 9/23/2018 8:17 am : link
not Shurmur.
RE: This is Gettleman  
nygiants16 : 9/23/2018 8:20 am : link
In comment 14089403 shyster said:
Quote:
not Shurmur.


based on what?
RE: This is Gettleman  
BigBlueShock : 9/23/2018 8:21 am : link
In comment 14089403 shyster said:
Quote:
not Shurmur.

First of all, who gives a shit whoís decision it is? Secondly, how the hell would you have any clue about whoís decision it is?

I swear, this place sucks.
Jerry's draft miscues  
Canton : 9/23/2018 8:24 am : link
Has the "offensive" line set back a few years. And now with DG strapping our cap with some questionable pick-ups in FA..

Its Safe to say we're going to be royally fucked for quite some time .
Does anyone else here think that maybe Flowers  
Rjanyg : 9/23/2018 8:25 am : link
Could be a decent RG? Is it even worth a shot?
This  
Rolyrock : 9/23/2018 8:28 am : link
Line is under a lot of pressure, all eyes are on them. Maybe they can spring 26 a few times.
RE: Does anyone else here think that maybe Flowers  
rdt288 : 9/23/2018 8:29 am : link
In comment 14089409 Rjanyg said:
Quote:
Could be a decent RG? Is it even worth a shot?


If you donít get it in the nfl from year 3 to year 4, you are finished in the nfl
Jerry's draft miscues  
Canton : 9/23/2018 8:30 am : link
Has the "offensive" line set back a few years. And now with DG strapping our cap with some questionable pick-ups in FA..

Its Safe to say we're going to be royally fucked for quite some time .
Not sure what to expect from Wheeler.  
johnnyb : 9/23/2018 8:31 am : link
Be careful what you wish for, though. This could get ugly.

Flowers is probably crying in his oatmeal right now.
RE: RE: This is Gettleman  
shyster : 9/23/2018 8:32 am : link
In comment 14089404 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
In comment 14089403 shyster said:


Quote:


not Shurmur.



based on what?


My impression of DG's style and my take on things PS has said and done.

PS said nice things about EF after Week 1. He never showed any interest in giving Wheeler first team reps.

When Francesa asked PS if he was considering personnel change, he dismissed it.

This decision was made by the same guy who insists on keeping Stewart on the roster, who PS pretty much refuses to play.
We need average at this point  
Giantimistic : 9/23/2018 8:34 am : link
Our best bet for this season is if the oline can go from awful to average and hopefully we can do that with better communication. Does this move do it? I am not sure but I think we clearly reached the the limits of flowers. maybe the light goes on for Wheeler, we will see. We just need to communicate and give a little more time for Eli at this point.

I am also hoping that Hernandez will benefit from being sandwiched between two veterans--not that Halapio wasn't doing ok. I think Greco might help Hernandez.

I like that we are at least trying something and not just hoping.
RE: RE: RE: This is Gettleman  
Giantimistic : 9/23/2018 8:36 am : link
In comment 14089416 shyster said:
Quote:
In comment 14089404 nygiants16 said:


Quote:


In comment 14089403 shyster said:


Quote:


not Shurmur.



based on what?



My impression of DG's style and my take on things PS has said and done.

PS said nice things about EF after Week 1. He never showed any interest in giving Wheeler first team reps.

When Francesa asked PS if he was considering personnel change, he dismissed it.

This decision was made by the same guy who insists on keeping Stewart on the roster, who PS pretty much refuses to play.


I think we learned that Shurmer is not going to call players out publicly but willing to address and make changes. He is a players coach in that regard. Do run your team through the press.
Not a surprising move. Clearly smells of a bit of panic  
Jimmy Googs : 9/23/2018 8:36 am : link
but you have to assume Shurmur/coaches plans for this year have are failing. Therefore they have to jockey around with moves to see if they can see some light can be seen at the end of the tunnel.

I am okay with the move with the sheer fact that Flowers is just simply awful and never going to get better.

Repeat after me...NEVER.

Wheeler may suck too but MAYBE he can get better.

RE: RE: RE: This is Gettleman  
nygiants16 : 9/23/2018 8:37 am : link
In comment 14089416 shyster said:
Quote:
In comment 14089404 nygiants16 said:


Quote:


In comment 14089403 shyster said:


Quote:


not Shurmur.



based on what?



My impression of DG's style and my take on things PS has said and done.

PS said nice things about EF after Week 1. He never showed any interest in giving Wheeler first team reps.

When Francesa asked PS if he was considering personnel change, he dismissed it.

This decision was made by the same guy who insists on keeping Stewart on the roster, who PS pretty much refuses to play.


umm did you think shurmur would really come out and say hey guys i am benching flowers?

no one knew it was kept a secret..

so your definitive statement was based on nothing..
Flowers @ G  
Mdgiantsfan : 9/23/2018 8:38 am : link
If Ommameh (sp?) continues to struggle, I wonder if Flowers would get a look at G. I vaguely remember discussion that he projected inside as well.

Nevertheless, I'm hoping for a good showing not just from Wheels but the entire unit. Go Big Blue!
...  
christian : 9/23/2018 8:38 am : link
Lol Wheeler's first start of the season and real meaningful time next to Omameh is going up against Watt?

This is spectacularly bad. Manning is going to get obliterated. Chad Wheeler spent more time on his ass at RT than his feet in the pre-season.

I'm starting to think Shurmur and Gettleman brought Manning back because they hate him.
RE: Not sure what to expect from Wheeler.  
BigBlueShock : 9/23/2018 8:39 am : link
In comment 14089415 johnnyb said:
Quote:
Be careful what you wish for, though. This could get ugly.

Flowers is probably crying in his oatmeal right now.

I doubt it. Heís probably thrilled he doesnít have to actually work for his paycheck.
RE: Jerry's draft miscues  
nygiants16 : 9/23/2018 8:39 am : link
In comment 14089414 Canton said:
Quote:
Has the "offensive" line set back a few years. And now with DG strapping our cap with some questionable pick-ups in FA..

Its Safe to say we're going to be royally fucked for quite some time .


cap strapped? there are ways to maneuver the cap and the best teams know how to do it..

giants have one of the best cap guys in the business
.  
Danny Kanell : 9/23/2018 8:40 am : link
Canít believe people are arguing this move on this thread. Flowers has brought this franchise down for years. There nothing to lose here. I wouldnít be one bit upset if we cut Flowers this morning and put someone from the practice squad on the active roster.
This is not necessarily a good thing.  
bradshaw44 : 9/23/2018 8:41 am : link
He could easily be worse than Flowers.
RE: ...  
BigBlueShock : 9/23/2018 8:42 am : link
In comment 14089428 christian said:
Quote:
Lol Wheeler's first start of the season and real meaningful time next to Omameh is going up against Watt?

This is spectacularly bad. Manning is going to get obliterated. Chad Wheeler spent more time on his ass at RT than his feet in the pre-season.

I'm starting to think Shurmur and Gettleman brought Manning back because they hate him.

Haha! Youíre right, how will they ever compete now that the legendary Flowers has been benched? We are in trouble now!
Hoping not of course, but watch one of our Tackles get dinged up  
Jimmy Googs : 9/23/2018 8:42 am : link
in this game, and they have to bring Flowers back out to play.

it'll be like gum on your shoe...
I get it  
Capt. Don : 9/23/2018 8:45 am : link
But I am not expecting an improvement.
RE: This is Gettleman  
Mike from Ohio : 9/23/2018 8:45 am : link
In comment 14089403 shyster said:
Quote:
not Shurmur.


No, this is all Mara. Possibly at the direction of Trump. This may go all the way to the top rungs of the illuminati.

Posting is much more fun when you aren't constrained by logic or reality!
RE: RE: RE: RE: This is Gettleman  
shyster : 9/23/2018 8:46 am : link
In comment 14089425 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
In comment 14089416 shyster said:


Quote:


In comment 14089404 nygiants16 said:


Quote:


In comment 14089403 shyster said:


Quote:


not Shurmur.



based on what?



My impression of DG's style and my take on things PS has said and done.

PS said nice things about EF after Week 1. He never showed any interest in giving Wheeler first team reps.

When Francesa asked PS if he was considering personnel change, he dismissed it.

This decision was made by the same guy who insists on keeping Stewart on the roster, who PS pretty much refuses to play.



umm did you think shurmur would really come out and say hey guys i am benching flowers?

no one knew it was kept a secret..

so your definitive statement was based on nothing..


I think it's tedious to preface with an IMO.

The nuance of Shurmur's answer to MF was significant. "We're going with the guys we have."

DG has more ego and is more likely to react to being embarrassed. Don't see that in PS.
The Flowers selection has severely damaged this team  
ij_reilly : 9/23/2018 8:47 am : link
A disastrous high first round pick.

Also, the notion that Gettleman chooses who is starting for Shurmur is so far off base that I would call it moronic.
RE: RE: ...  
christian : 9/23/2018 8:47 am : link
In comment 14089433 BigBlueShock said:
Quote:
In comment 14089428 christian said:


Quote:


Lol Wheeler's first start of the season and real meaningful time next to Omameh is going up against Watt?

This is spectacularly bad. Manning is going to get obliterated. Chad Wheeler spent more time on his ass at RT than his feet in the pre-season.

I'm starting to think Shurmur and Gettleman brought Manning back because they hate him.


Haha! Youíre right, how will they ever compete now that the legendary Flowers has been benched? We are in trouble now!


Benching Flowers is inevitable because he's dreadful. Replacing him with a dude who is so dreadful he couldn't take his spot in pre-season? And thrown in against one of the best pass rushers in the NFL day one? LOL.
RE: .  
Giantimistic : 9/23/2018 8:49 am : link
In comment 14089431 Danny Kanell said:
Quote:
Canít believe people are arguing this move on this thread. Flowers has brought this franchise down for years. There nothing to lose here. I wouldnít be one bit upset if we cut Flowers this morning and put someone from the practice squad on the active roster.


I agree. This could be an addition by subtraction result. the online is about 5 guys coming together and working as a group. Although Flowers sounded like he was working with Solder I always got the feeling like he was not really part of the online camaraderie. Our great oline of 2007 had a camaraderie on and off the field, at least it seemed that way.
RE: .  
Big Blue '56 : 9/23/2018 8:49 am : link
In comment 14089431 Danny Kanell said:
Quote:
Canít believe people are arguing this move on this thread. Flowers has brought this franchise down for years. There nothing to lose here. I wouldnít be one bit upset if we cut Flowers this morning and put someone from the practice squad on the active roster.


Finally, something cogent on this thread. I tried to be patient with Flowers, I can no longer be. The inability to Ďget ití is confounding to this diehard
Why do fans who allegedly watch football  
Ten Ton Hammer : 9/23/2018 8:50 am : link
Insist on talking quotes from interviews as being indicative of anything?
And to my friend, christian,  
Big Blue '56 : 9/23/2018 8:50 am : link
Lol
And whoís starting for omameh?  
Tuckrule : 9/23/2018 8:50 am : link
.
Agreed Jimmy Googs  
mittenedman : 9/23/2018 8:51 am : link
It's crazy - Flowers has not improved 1 iota since he got here. Says it all. 4 years.

The light isn't suddenly going to go on.

I keep reading Wheeler was worse. That is absolute BS. Flowers is as bad as it gets. This will be an improvement, even if it's just attitude and mental toughness. I think anyone could see Flowers lost his confidence years ago and everyone in the league knows it, and really gets after him on the field. You see people mentally breaking him.
They  
greek13 : 9/23/2018 8:52 am : link
Have to try something!!! How many years do we watch Flowers suck? JR was an awful GM and was in my opinion an arrogant manipulator of Mara. I would guess his famous head of scouting was equally bad -they sentenced us to 10 years of stepped on dog crap. You donít use early picks on projects - like Flowers . Iím not a fan of missing a QB in first round of 2018 draft but I believe Mara overcompensated for ending Eliís streak and the backlash. We are still 2-3 years away from potentially being a competitive playoff team. No depth at DB - OL and need a QB - let Eli retire and go to the ring of fame where he belongs. Lose today and the stadium will be empty very early this year. Shame on Mara - karma needs to follow JR

Blame Reese all you want with this pick  
Jimmy Googs : 9/23/2018 8:53 am : link
but this is now the 3rd set of coaches that keep trotting this clown out there to play. I realize they have few, if any, options at Tackle, but its been YEARS now folks and strategy for this team basically has been pinned to "hope".

the excuses are gone...

RE: Flowers @ G  
Jimmy Googs : 9/23/2018 8:55 am : link
In comment 14089426 Mdgiantsfan said:
Quote:
If Ommameh (sp?) continues to struggle, I wonder if Flowers would get a look at G. I vaguely remember discussion that he projected inside as well.



barring a new injury at tackle, its over for him as a NYG...
Funny thing is Flowers was probably the best OL  
Rflairr : 9/23/2018 8:55 am : link
against Dallas. lol
The truth is most of us don't have a clue how Wheeler will do,  
Ira : 9/23/2018 8:55 am : link
but it's worth a try.
What a shitshow.  
RottenApple : 9/23/2018 8:56 am : link
This organization has no clue.
RE: .  
RobCarpenter : 9/23/2018 8:57 am : link
In comment 14089431 Danny Kanell said:
Quote:
Canít believe people are arguing this move on this thread. Flowers has brought this franchise down for years. There nothing to lose here. I wouldnít be one bit upset if we cut Flowers this morning and put someone from the practice squad on the active roster.


Me either. The Giants starting RT for 2019 is either in college or playing for another team right now.

Itís gotten to the point that whatever personnel move the Giants make fans will argue against it, just because 1) the Giants have not been good and 2) any decision they make is therefore bad.
RE: Funny thing is Flowers was probably the best OL  
Sean : 9/23/2018 8:57 am : link
In comment 14089458 Rflairr said:
Quote:
against Dallas. lol


I was going to mention this. Wasnít Flowers graded best last week on the line? Regardless, I hope it works out.
RE: RE: RE: ...  
Jimmy Googs : 9/23/2018 8:58 am : link
In comment 14089440 christian said:
Quote:

Benching Flowers is inevitable because he's dreadful. Replacing him with a dude who is so dreadful he couldn't take his spot in pre-season? And thrown in against one of the best pass rushers in the NFL day one? LOL.


Not disagreeing. But this tells you a bit about where the coaching staff is with this Oline/Offense. They are now willing to almost try anything, even if it goes against everything they planned for over the past 7 months...
RE: And to my friend, christian,  
christian : 9/23/2018 8:59 am : link
In comment 14089446 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
Lol


I get the long term vision, and I get the roster needs a near complete overhaul. I just don't want Manning to get hurt frankly.

The talent isn't there on the line, so I assume the hope was build continuity. Now 3 weeks in 2/5 of the line are new.

Chad Wheeler against JJ Watt is actually slightly more scary than versus Flowers.
RE: RE: worth a shot  
PatersonPlank : 9/23/2018 9:00 am : link
In comment 14089390 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
In comment 14089384 bigblue18 said:


Quote:


nothing to lose here. Maybe omaheh will play better without flowers



it COULD be he felt he had to help flowers to much and he was getting beat but either way he has tonplay a lot better


I think this is correct. FB, TE's, etc. After a while its not worth it because it limits what you can do offensively.
RE: Funny thing is Flowers was probably the best OL  
Britt in VA : 9/23/2018 9:02 am : link
In comment 14089458 Rflairr said:
Quote:
against Dallas. lol


That's like pointing out the piece of shit in the toilet with the most corn in it.
RE: Flowers @ G  
Fred-in-Florida : 9/23/2018 9:05 am : link
In comment 14089426 Mdgiantsfan said:
Quote:
If Ommameh (sp?) continues to struggle, I wonder if Flowers would get a look at G. I vaguely remember discussion that he projected inside as well.

Nevertheless, I'm hoping for a good showing not just from Wheels but the entire unit. Go Big Blue!


That thought crossed my mind as well! 'Ohmygod' hasn't played any better than Flowers. Should have kept Fluker for the money
Great  
rocco8112 : 9/23/2018 9:05 am : link
A unit performance like last week and in Flowers case his whole bust of a Giant career calls for action. Let's the other line man know there will be accountability too.

Hope this kid plays well.
Good move, we have to try different things because what we  
PatersonPlank : 9/23/2018 9:05 am : link
have isn't working/good enough. Whats the alternative, not do anything?
Well.....there it is  
Anakim : 9/23/2018 9:07 am : link



Chad Wheeler vs. JJ Watt....oh boy
Itís not panic, itís not desperation  
mattlawson : 9/23/2018 9:08 am : link
If you canít do the job you need to be held accountable and if this is what it takes so be it.
.  
Diver_Down : 9/23/2018 9:10 am : link
RE: Itís not panic, itís not desperation  
Big Blue '56 : 9/23/2018 9:12 am : link
In comment 14089479 mattlawson said:
Quote:
If you canít do the job you need to be held accountable and if this is what it takes so be it.


Agreed
You can quiver over Watt vs. Wheeler  
mittenedman : 9/23/2018 9:13 am : link
It isn't pretty.

Imagine Flowers blocking Whitney Mercilus? No chance!
RE: RE: Funny thing is Flowers was probably the best OL  
PatersonPlank : 9/23/2018 9:19 am : link
In comment 14089463 Sean said:
Quote:
In comment 14089458 Rflairr said:


Quote:


against Dallas. lol



I was going to mention this. Wasnít Flowers graded best last week on the line? Regardless, I hope it works out.


I think this was according to PFF, which is kind of bull. Obviously the coaches have analyzed all the film and identified where the issues start.
I can see this unit shortly becoming  
SuperRonJohnson : 9/23/2018 9:21 am : link
LT-Solder, LG Hernandez, C Pulley, RG Greco RT Wheeler
Have to feel sorry for this kid...  
the mike : 9/23/2018 9:21 am : link
He was an undrafted free agent last year... now he is being thrown into the fire against arguably the best defensive lineman in the league. Wheeler will be in way over his head... I will be rooting hard for him but difficult to see him being successful today.

Getting the nauseous feeling that Shurmur may be in over his head as well with this move. Offensive lines take time to gel and a panic move like this will only breed mistrust... Not sure I get the point of believing in Flowers for the last four months and suddenly realizing now that it has been a mistake. Seems like it is more of a "shame on Shurmur" than a "shame on Flowers" move... which is locker room poison.

Seems like some of you  
joeinpa : 9/23/2018 9:24 am : link
Guys have been so beaten down by the losing that you ve become jaded.

MacAdoo was right about Flowers, too stiff in hips to play tackle. Wheeler is more athletic It s a move that needed to be made
Here is some Pie-in-the-Sky conspiracy theory,  
Diver_Down : 9/23/2018 9:24 am : link
but is there any chance that DG is negotiating a trade of Flowers? I know Flowers isn't worth anything. But another team might be inclined to take on his salary and give him a look over the remaining games. If he remains on another team's active 53, then we get cap relief. If he actually plays, then we get a 7th round. If he is signed to an extension, then we get 5th or 6th pick.

Any chance? Or should I move straight on to the glue?
RE: Have to feel sorry for this kid...  
Danny Kanell : 9/23/2018 9:26 am : link
In comment 14089493 the mike said:
Quote:
He was an undrafted free agent last year... now he is being thrown into the fire against arguably the best defensive lineman in the league. Wheeler will be in way over his head... I will be rooting hard for him but difficult to see him being successful today.

Getting the nauseous feeling that Shurmur may be in over his head as well with this move. Offensive lines take time to gel and a panic move like this will only breed mistrust... Not sure I get the point of believing in Flowers for the last four months and suddenly realizing now that it has been a mistake. Seems like it is more of a "shame on Shurmur" than a "shame on Flowers" move... which is locker room poison.


Oh my God.
RE: Here is some Pie-in-the-Sky conspiracy theory,  
bLiTz 2k : 9/23/2018 9:26 am : link
In comment 14089496 Diver_Down said:
Quote:
but is there any chance that DG is negotiating a trade of Flowers? I know Flowers isn't worth anything. But another team might be inclined to take on his salary and give him a look over the remaining games. If he remains on another team's active 53, then we get cap relief. If he actually plays, then we get a 7th round. If he is signed to an extension, then we get 5th or 6th pick.

Any chance? Or should I move straight on to the glue?


Who is the 3rd tackle?
RE: RE: RE: Funny thing is Flowers was probably the best OL  
bigbluescot : 9/23/2018 9:28 am : link
In comment 14089488 PatersonPlank said:
Quote:
In comment 14089463 Sean said:


Quote:


In comment 14089458 Rflairr said:


Quote:


against Dallas. lol



I was going to mention this. Wasnít Flowers graded best last week on the line? Regardless, I hope it works out.



I think this was according to PFF, which is kind of bull. Obviously the coaches have analyzed all the film and identified where the issues start.


Unless it was assignment based (could very be), the all 22 stuff showed Flowers at least getting a hand on his guy most of the time last week, which isn't actually something you could say about most of the rest of the line.
RE: RE: Here is some Pie-in-the-Sky conspiracy theory,  
Diver_Down : 9/23/2018 9:28 am : link
In comment 14089498 bLiTz 2k said:
Quote:
In comment 14089496 Diver_Down said:


Quote:


but is there any chance that DG is negotiating a trade of Flowers? I know Flowers isn't worth anything. But another team might be inclined to take on his salary and give him a look over the remaining games. If he remains on another team's active 53, then we get cap relief. If he actually plays, then we get a 7th round. If he is signed to an extension, then we get 5th or 6th pick.

Any chance? Or should I move straight on to the glue?



Who is the 3rd tackle?




It can't be any worse.
Wheeler will stone and embarrass Watt!  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 9/23/2018 9:29 am : link
And make him quit at halftime.

Seriously, is Watt and Clowney anything more than a name this year?
...  
Milton : 9/23/2018 9:33 am : link
Funny  
nygiants16 : 9/23/2018 9:33 am : link
all you hear is how the giants need to bench flowers, they bench flowers and you get the same people saying the giants do not know what they are doing...

I'm still holding out for the  
idiotsavant : 9/23/2018 9:34 am : link
280lb blocking TE signed off a practice squad or the street.

Or an OT for that matter.

And..regardless of that we don't have the types; more zone blocking.
RE: Funny  
BigBlueShock : 9/23/2018 9:36 am : link
In comment 14089510 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
all you hear is how the giants need to bench flowers, they bench flowers and you get the same people saying the giants do not know what they are doing...

Welcome to BBI!
surprised  
Peter from NH (formerly CT) : 9/23/2018 9:39 am : link
but the big issue isn't physical, its communication. My first thought on this news was that might move Flowers inside but I suppose we would hear that.
Whoís to say something didnít happen at practice this week  
mikeinbloomfield : 9/23/2018 9:39 am : link
Flowers isnít the most mature guy. I can see him mouthing off, or more likely, not putting the work in to get better.
RE: Whoís to say something didnít happen at practice this week  
UConn4523 : 9/23/2018 9:42 am : link
In comment 14089521 mikeinbloomfield said:
Quote:
Flowers isnít the most mature guy. I can see him mouthing off, or more likely, not putting the work in to get better.


Correct.

The comments about the Giants just waking up and realizing Flowers sucks are hilarious. Thereís a lot more to this whole thing than just what happens on Sundayís.
RE: Whoís to say something didnít happen at practice this week  
WillVAB : 9/23/2018 9:51 am : link
In comment 14089521 mikeinbloomfield said:
Quote:
Flowers isnít the most mature guy. I can see him mouthing off, or more likely, not putting the work in to get better.


Negative. According to Rappaport, Wheeler has been practicing w the 1ís all week.

This looks like DGís clean slate for Flowers is no longer clean. They gave him a shot at RT and heís been terrible. Looks like the Flowers era is over.
You know,  
bLiTz 2k : 9/23/2018 9:52 am : link
I thought immediately it may not have been an entirely football decision too, as soon as I read it. We will probably never really know unless EF airs out the decision in the media, which a i doubt will happen. Just a strange set of circumstances...but the positive maybe that Wheeler has really improved since camp and the coaches loved what they saw these past few weeks. I thought he was actually very good at LT last year in his start...
RE: RE: Flowers @ G  
SJGiant : 9/23/2018 9:58 am : link
In comment 14089456 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
In comment 14089426 Mdgiantsfan said:


Quote:


If Ommameh (sp?) continues to struggle, I wonder if Flowers would get a look at G. I vaguely remember discussion that he projected inside as well.





barring a new injury at tackle, its over for him as a NYG...


I actually think that they are going to give Flowers a chance at guard. Itís worked with other offensive lineman. The change also shows the team that no one is on scholarship anymore. The players need to play for their jobs.
RE: RE: Whoís to say something didnít happen at practice this week  
BigBlueShock : 9/23/2018 9:58 am : link
In comment 14089539 WillVAB said:
Quote:
In comment 14089521 mikeinbloomfield said:


Quote:


Flowers isnít the most mature guy. I can see him mouthing off, or more likely, not putting the work in to get better.



Negative. According to Rappaport, Wheeler has been practicing w the 1ís all week.

This looks like DGís clean slate for Flowers is no longer clean. They gave him a shot at RT and heís been terrible. Looks like the Flowers era is over.

Iím sure this is true, but I find it hard to believe that none of the reporters mentioned anything about this throughout the week?

Unless youíre saying Rappaport did mention it earlier in the week. But Iím taking your post to mean heís said it this morning
THis may not be an improvement in talent but may be in communication.  
Ivan15 : 9/23/2018 10:02 am : link
I wonder if Omameh can play RT better.

Maybe move him to RT and Greco/Pulley at RG/C.
How can they put Flowers at Guard?  
Simms11 : 9/23/2018 10:04 am : link
Itís a position heís never played and heís not going to start learning it mid-season. Quite frankly, I think heís got a learning disability. He never seems to improve his technique.
An experiment at Guard would be just another desperate move  
Jimmy Googs : 9/23/2018 10:04 am : link
Imo, Flowers should stay on the bench for rest of the season barring injury.

Bad pick, bad situation that he had to play LT so quickly, bad decision to not find real competition each offseason, bad idea to keep hoping he would improve.

just kind of bad...

I watched Wheeler during the preseason  
Hammer : 9/23/2018 10:11 am : link
and he looked dreadful. 2nd teamers were routinely crossing his face and taking direct routes to the passer.

Wheeler looked much better during his rookie preseason snaps on the left side. Moreover, I recall reading a couple weeks ago a coach, I do not recall who, it might have been an anonymous quote, saying that Wheeler was much better on the left side.

I'm hopeful, but not expecting too much out of Wheeler. I'll be looking for a tight end or running back lined up on his side.

Ugh.
RE: RE: RE: Whoís to say something didnít happen at practice this week  
WillVAB : 9/23/2018 10:23 am : link
In comment 14089555 BigBlueShock said:
Quote:
In comment 14089539 WillVAB said:


Quote:


In comment 14089521 mikeinbloomfield said:


Quote:


Flowers isnít the most mature guy. I can see him mouthing off, or more likely, not putting the work in to get better.



Negative. According to Rappaport, Wheeler has been practicing w the 1ís all week.

This looks like DGís clean slate for Flowers is no longer clean. They gave him a shot at RT and heís been terrible. Looks like the Flowers era is over.


Iím sure this is true, but I find it hard to believe that none of the reporters mentioned anything about this throughout the week?

Unless youíre saying Rappaport did mention it earlier in the week. But Iím taking your post to mean heís said it this morning


My understanding is that the Giants kept it a secret so Houston wouldnít be able to prepare.
....  
riceneggs : 9/23/2018 10:24 am : link
So basically, no more excuses for Eli
IMO  
mrvax : 9/23/2018 10:25 am : link
Either Flowers screwed up early in the week or Wheeler has really improved in practice. Let's hope it's the latter.
Finally  
twostepgiants : 9/23/2018 10:25 am : link
Now the message of having to earn your place in the lineup and on the team can start to happen again.
Missed it  
XBRONX : 9/23/2018 10:27 am : link
when did Wheeler earn the spot to start?
Wheeler kinda stunk last year though  
KerrysFlask : 9/23/2018 10:30 am : link
And flowers played better than the rest of the OL against Dallas.

So careful what you wish for here....
I always hate betting against the Giants.  
Jerz44 : 9/23/2018 10:35 am : link
But, I'm feeling pretty strong about picking Houston in my survival league.
I sure hope this produces at least some improvement. I think everyone  
Ivan15 : 9/23/2018 10:36 am : link
pretty much agrees it canít be worse.

Finally, this is recognition by Shurmur that Flowers is not improving enough to continue to give him playing time, and he wonít be here next year anyway.

Let someone else try to get Flowers to try LG.
RE: Wheeler kinda stunk last year though  
eclipz928 : 9/23/2018 10:37 am : link
In comment 14089600 KerrysFlask said:
Quote:
And flowers played better than the rest of the OL against Dallas.

So careful what you wish for here....

Yea, I don't understand why Flowers was singled-out after last week's game. Unless it's just a matter of they're not being comfortable with anyone on the roster being able to move in for Omameh. Solder has been terrible too, but with how much money they committed to him he's likely untouchable.
RE: Wheeler kinda stunk last year though  
eclipz928 : 9/23/2018 10:37 am : link
In comment 14089600 KerrysFlask said:
Quote:
And flowers played better than the rest of the OL against Dallas.

So careful what you wish for here....

Yea, I don't understand why Flowers was singled-out after last week's game. Unless it's just a matter of they're not being comfortable with anyone on the roster being able to move in for Omameh. Solder has been terrible too, but with how much money they committed to him he's likely untouchable.
I think  
Carson53 : 9/23/2018 10:39 am : link
the new RG will probably be next to be replaced, if he doesn't get his act together soon! John Jerry folks?
112 posts, and nobody has used the term  
fivehead : 9/23/2018 10:40 am : link
Flowers planted on the bench?
RE: 112 posts, and nobody has used the term  
Carson53 : 9/23/2018 10:44 am : link
In comment 14089624 fivehead said:
Quote:
Flowers planted on the bench?
.

That's a good one, we need humor with this team.
The Houston coaching staff must be freaking out ...  
Boy Cord : 9/23/2018 10:44 am : link
... right now. The Giants caught them completely ill prepared. So much for Houston counting on six sacks today. Shurmur 1, Bill OíBrien 0.
LOL Giants  
HomerJones45 : 9/23/2018 10:47 am : link
benching Reese's first round draft pick in favor or a UDFA signed by Reese who hadn't found a decent UDFA since Victor Cruz.

Got to be done because Flowers has run out of excuses.

Oh and please, no more snickering at the Browns. We are the Browns with a more stable qb situation and ODB. Familiar situation for Shurmer who has to be wondering why he left Minneapolis.
RE: Whoís to say something didnít happen at practice this week  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 9/23/2018 10:51 am : link
In comment 14089521 mikeinbloomfield said:
Quote:
Flowers isnít the most mature guy. I can see him mouthing off, or more likely, not putting the work in to get better.

In the meeting room Flowers asked coach "Hows do's I block teh speed rusher JJ Wut?"
Hey Eli! I hear you have a new tackle startingthis Sunday.  
Giant John : 9/23/2018 10:54 am : link
Yes I heard that too. Think I have to stay home Sunday and baby sit. Wife is visiting her Mom.
RE: Funny thing is Flowers was probably the best OL  
giantstock : 9/23/2018 11:01 am : link
In comment 14089458 Rflairr said:
Quote:
against Dallas. lol


I doubt it. Others said Willie actually played well. Once I saw some analysis saying from PFF that the giants OLINE was about 23 -- at that point for this point in time we have to recognize the ones who analyze are clueless. Thus I can't believe Flowers was the best if any supposed "expert" claimed so.
RE: LOL Giants  
FStubbs : 9/23/2018 11:04 am : link
In comment 14089631 HomerJones45 said:
Quote:
benching Reese's first round draft pick in favor or a UDFA signed by Reese who hadn't found a decent UDFA since Victor Cruz.

Got to be done because Flowers has run out of excuses.

Oh and please, no more snickering at the Browns. We are the Browns with a more stable qb situation and ODB. Familiar situation for Shurmer who has to be wondering why he left Minneapolis.


I say this as someone who still thinks Eli might have something left in the tank, but the Browns right now have a more stable QB situation than we do.
Its not about the Dallas game  
Jimmy Googs : 9/23/2018 11:04 am : link
It is simply about that he can't play Tackle in the NFL, and this new coaching staff doesn't want to continue letting him like the other ones did...
RE: RE: Whoís to say something didnít happen at practice this week  
therealmf : 9/23/2018 11:20 am : link
In comment 14089635 Coach Red Beaulieu said:
Quote:
In comment 14089521 mikeinbloomfield said:


Quote:


Flowers isnít the most mature guy. I can see him mouthing off, or more likely, not putting the work in to get better.


In the meeting room Flowers asked coach "Hows do's I block teh speed rusher JJ Wut?"


Wow. Where did that come from?
Can we play max protect with 2 TE's ????  
Rick in Dallas : 9/23/2018 11:34 am : link
just asking as Wheeler is not much better than Flowers.
Hopefully Wheeler outplayed Flowers during practice this week..
I think something happened in practice or meetings this week  
Jay on the Island : 9/23/2018 11:44 am : link
It seems like odd timing to announce the change now.
Glad Shurmur kept this quiet until  
BBelle21 : 9/23/2018 11:55 am : link
The morning of the game. Any little advantage may help Wheeler. Texans probably couldnít wait to go against Flowers.
RE: Have to feel sorry for this kid...  
bluepepper : 9/23/2018 11:56 am : link
In comment 14089493 the mike said:
Quote:
He was an undrafted free agent last year... now he is being thrown into the fire against arguably the best defensive lineman in the league. Wheeler will be in way over his head... I will be rooting hard for him but difficult to see him being successful today.

You feel sorry for him? He's in his second year in the NFL. He's getting a chance to start. This is part of the job - you know actually playing. No one is expecting him to shut down anybody, just do a halfway decent job and don't let his man single handedly beat us. If he can't do that then maybe he doesn't belong in the league.
:  
Big Al : 9/23/2018 11:59 am : link
Geoff Schwartz
Geoff Schwartz
@geoffschwartz
He doesnít care.
Quote Tweet
Jonathan Morales
@JonMorales1980
Replying to @geoffschwartz
I get that, just hate to see all that potential be a waste. You were in that locker room does the kid just not work on it, or is it just reverting to bad habit during play?
10:25 AM ∑ Sep 23, 2018
8
Retweets
39
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Geoff Schwartz
Geoff Schwartz
@geoffschwartz

1h
Replying to
@geoffschwartz
I think Ereck Flowers cares about the game. I donít think he cares much about getting better. Iím not knocking his work ethic. He worked hard in the weight room and at practice. But taking the time to work details and want to get better, I didnít see it.
what's the advantage  
Pork Chop : 9/23/2018 12:01 pm : link
of announcing this before the game? It's not like an injury that they are required to disclose. Why not just run the offense out there with Wheeler at RT? Surely that would be some advantage.
Don't be overly concerned...  
Tark10 : 9/23/2018 12:02 pm : link
Wheeler will do better then you think because JJ Watt isn't the same guy he was a few years ago. Too many injuries have taken their toll on him. He doesn't even have a sack yet. Flowers got benched for a reason. Lets see what happens.
put FLowers at guard  
spike : 9/23/2018 12:11 pm : link
to Maul someone and not be a turnstile
Wheeler's ceiling is higher than a UDFA  
bc4life : 9/23/2018 12:11 pm : link
There was a reason why he was not drafted (injuries, character).

Jackie Slater swears that this kid can be good. Yeah, USC homer-vision, definitely a possibility. But, his opinion was very strong and he could have been supportive without going all in.

The move makes sense - you get better by playing, that is, if you are going to get better. Flowers has had more than his share of opportunities to get better.

I expect the rest of the OLine to settle down.

Couple of non-expert observations about Flowers. For a guy as strong as he is - I would expect a pretty good punch. I watched a few plays in which he didn't deliver a powerful jolt. Rather. his arms seemed to slowly roll out, unfurling if you will. In addition to his lack of bend - he seemed uncoordinated, never got hands/feet thing working smoothly.

Sometimes a player's deficiencies require unorthodox compensatory adjustments. Wonder if a lot of heavy bag work might have helped him? And, along those lines adjusting the punch so it may have favored one hand or the other.

Finally, given the fact that he does not seem to move well backwards, laterally, and in reaction to others - I will always wonder if he was miscast. Could he have been any worse as a DT or 3-4 DE? Doubtful.

Opposing defensive players....  
thrunthrublue : 9/23/2018 12:13 pm : link
Must all be looking forward to their ďsack incentive SundayĒ if the giants, and the statuesque E.M. Is on their schedule!
I  
AcidTest : 9/23/2018 12:16 pm : link
don't think this will work. Wheeler couldn't even beat out Flowers during training camp and the preseason, but now all of a sudden he's better after two weeks? But the Giants have to try something. Flowers is awful. Wheeler is not a RT, but at least he has better feet than Flowers.

We aren't trading Flowers, and he isn't a guard.

Reese's inability to find OL in the draft or via FA damaged Eli's career, but I'm beginning to think DG has just continued that problem by overpaying for Solder and Omameh. Maybe he should have signed Fleming or Hubbard.
I am rapidly becoming convinced  
Mike in Boston : 9/23/2018 12:17 pm : link
that, as bad as the previous regime was, the new regime is significantly worse. Look, we all saw Monday night. The problem was not guys on the OL unable to make their blocks. It was that on most plays there was some defender no one even tried to block. That is some combination of communication problems and not getting protections called right. I.e probably a coaching problem; plus Halapio demonstrated in preseason that he didn't know how to call protections, yet we still handed him the starting job and traded Jones. This was supposedly to free up cap room, but we still have the cap room, so we apparently didn't really need it.

And we still have Kaelin Clay on the team for some reason.
The defense seem porous and the special teams aren't special. And Solder doesn't look like he is worth anything like what we're paying for him.



Wheeler  
AcidTest : 9/23/2018 12:18 pm : link
is better at LT, but they obviously aren't moving Solder.
based on many reports  
bc4life : 9/23/2018 12:19 pm : link
Ol guys blew assignments - guys not used to working together, a stuggling OL playing a new position, a rookie, and adefense that moves a lot.
Geesh  
Bluesbreaker : 9/23/2018 12:23 pm : link
this is gonna be a long season this line has yet to have
enough game time reps to have any kind of continuity .
This reeks of desperation . I mean is Flowers just
shitting the bed in practice as well .
Wheeler Watt match-up talk about a 2nd baptism ..
It just shows really of JR and company's failures in the draft I mean basically none of the later round players
panned out either . While were forced to use other teams
late round picks .
Gonna have to grin and bear it and hope Eli doesn't get killed or get himself killed
That big hit he took last week was dangerous ..
straight from the horses' mouth  
bc4life : 9/23/2018 12:23 pm : link
Giants com
Shurmur re: Flowers benching - ( New Window )
Forget about Flowers at guard  
BillT : 9/23/2018 12:25 pm : link
There isn't enough time this year to make that transition and he's gone from the team at the end of the year no matter what. Like Richberg he's done here and no matter his potential he can't be resigned under any circumstances.
What I don't understand is  
prdave73 : 9/23/2018 12:28 pm : link
why the Giants don't try to find another option in free agency?? At this point anyone in FA would probably be an upgrade. They can also try to trade for one. It's a huge need right now..
prdave  
bc4life : 9/23/2018 12:31 pm : link
No doubt they are window shopping, at the least
True.  
prdave73 : 9/23/2018 12:33 pm : link
They have to be at this point. If not now, at least for the future.
Flowers  
AcidTest : 9/23/2018 12:36 pm : link
is just an emergency body at this point.

Even if Wheeler plays well, inserting him won't make any difference if we can't pick up basic stunts and blitzes.
But wait! PFF said that the G men line is like 23rd  
map7711 : 9/23/2018 12:40 pm : link
Thereís 9 other OLs worse. Why would they do this? Lol.
There were a lot of idiots in the game thread week 1..  
EricJ : 9/23/2018 12:46 pm : link
saying that we needed to cut Flowers at half time. He is being replaced by an undrafted free agent. We will see whether the Giants have options to replace him as a starter... forget about cutting him.
RE: based on many reports  
EricJ : 9/23/2018 12:47 pm : link
In comment 14089749 bc4life said:
Quote:
Ol guys blew assignments - guys not used to working together, a stuggling OL playing a new position, a rookie, and adefense that moves a lot.


Solder said nobody on the line picked up any blitz last week. Total breakdown by the entire line. He had no problem speaking for the rest of his line mates
Please send thoughts and prayers  
SomeFan : 9/23/2018 12:58 pm : link
to Chad
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