I think your position needs are accurate, but what we don't know is who'll be available and at what price in free agency and what players will be there when we pick at 5.
Unless Wheeler surprises and starts to look like a starting tackle, that should be one priority. If there's a qb at 5 who we think is the future, we grab him. But right now, everything is speculation.
As I see it, we need better players almost everywhere:
OC
RG
RT
WR (someone better than Lattimore, doesn’t need to be from a premium asset)
Edge rusher
LB
FS
CB
And maybe most importantly, QB.
That’s still a ton needed.
Probably need to come to grips that 2019 might not be a good year either.
Shepard is a FA the following season. I would say a top of the draft WR is a big need. Rookie year they can be the #3 and then hopefully move up to #2 after Shepard leaves.
Vernon isn't long for this team. Edge Rusher is a big need, these guys tend to come from the top of the draft.
If i was a GM i would draft a late round OL and DL player ever single draft no matter what. That's on top of taking one early if it warrants it.
Draft either Justin Herbert or Will Grier in the draft. Trade up for Herbert if needed.
- I would sign Donovan Smith or Ja'Wuan James in free agency for RT.
- Release Eli and Vernon.
- Franchise Landon Collins
- Sign Nick Easton or Ali Marpet to compete at center
- Sign Sam Bradford or Ryan Fitzpatrick as the veteran stopgap for Herbert/Grier
- Sign OLB Markus Golden in free agency.
Draft either Justin Herbert or Will Grier in the draft. Trade up for Herbert if needed.
- I would sign Donovan Smith or Ja'Wuan James in free agency for RT.
- Release Eli and Vernon.
- Franchise Landon Collins
- Sign Nick Easton or Ali Marpet to compete at center
- Sign Sam Bradford or Ryan Fitzpatrick as the veteran stopgap for Herbert/Grier
- Sign OLB Markus Golden in free agency.
Can you quit your job and volunteer to be DGs assistant.
This team has got to improve the OL. The have spent the past 6 years wasting talent because nothing has really worked along the OL. We have one of the best RB's and several really good WR's/TE's and the Giants can't take advantage of their abilities.
Far past the time to go from a below average group to a above average group. They need edge rushers too and probably need to find a replacement for Harrison as well.
What they really need to do is end the infatuation with guys they think can move the ball and focus on dominating the trenches.
If the Giants draft in the top 10 this year, I think that they will have to move on from Eli.
I would not make a splash in free agency. It will be premature. Set the team up in great cap position for 2020.
If there is the QB of the future in the draft I draft him.
I then pick the best available offensive lineman.
If there is no QB worth drafting I take a defensive lineman first. The strength of this draft is the defensive line.
The Giants must get away from short fixes. This has not worked and it will
Draft either Justin Herbert or Will Grier in the draft. Trade up for Herbert if needed.
- I would sign Donovan Smith or Ja'Wuan James in free agency for RT.
- Release Eli and Vernon.
- Franchise Landon Collins
- Sign Nick Easton or Ali Marpet to compete at center
- Sign Sam Bradford or Ryan Fitzpatrick as the veteran stopgap for Herbert/Grier
- Sign OLB Markus Golden in free agency.
Can you quit your job and volunteer to be DGs assistant.
This is a great and realistic way to looo at it.
Close, but I go Teddy Bridgewater over Fitz or Sam. There are plenty of WR 3's out there to be had as well in FA. Eli's contract (will free up 17m) is the big problem. We also should not release OV. We get him and Jenkins to agree to a paycut 1st. But worse case, yes, release OV.
find better offensive linemen some how, some way Â
Draft either Justin Herbert or Will Grier in the draft. Trade up for Herbert if needed.
- I would sign Donovan Smith or Ja'Wuan James in free agency for RT.
- Release Eli and Vernon.
- Franchise Landon Collins
- Sign Nick Easton or Ali Marpet to compete at center
- Sign Sam Bradford or Ryan Fitzpatrick as the veteran stopgap for Herbert/Grier
- Sign OLB Markus Golden in free agency.
Please no Sam Bradford. He’s going to want 15 mill+ and if Eli is Captain Checkdown, then Bradford is King Checkdown. no thanks.
Draft either Justin Herbert or Will Grier in the draft. Trade up for Herbert if needed.
- I would sign Donovan Smith or Ja'Wuan James in free agency for RT.
- Release Eli and Vernon.
- Franchise Landon Collins
- Sign Nick Easton or Ali Marpet to compete at center
- Sign Sam Bradford or Ryan Fitzpatrick as the veteran stopgap for Herbert/Grier
- Sign OLB Markus Golden in free agency.
Please no Sam Bradford. He’s going to want 15 mill+ and if Eli is Captain Checkdown, then Bradford is King Checkdown. no thanks.
Afer this season Bradford will have to settle for around 5 million on a 1 year deal. I am not a big fan of Bradford but he was playing very well under Shurmur in Minnesota. I am just looking for an inexpensive stogap. As for Bridgewater I doubt he comes to another situation where they are likely to draft a young QB plus he will not be cheap. I also don't think the Saints will allow him to walk after trading a 3rd round pick for him.
and it wouldnt work. But a guy you may get on the cheap who has been an utter failure is Devante Parker.
I doubt Miami will go to a 5th year with him and he has been banged up. But he is talented and has had some good games. Could give us the big wideout we have been seeking on a fraction of the price.
I would try to get rid of bad players and get good players instead. Â
and it wouldnt work. But a guy you may get on the cheap who has been an utter failure is Devante Parker.
I doubt Miami will go to a 5th year with him and he has been banged up. But he is talented and has had some good games. Could give us the big wideout we have been seeking on a fraction of the price.
My buddy is a huge Dolphins fan and he said there is no chance that they are picking up the option on Parker. I like the idea of kicking the tires on players like this. He could thrive in a new scheme where the focus will be on Beckham, Barkley, Engram, and Shepard.
RE: I would try to get rid of bad players and get good players instead. Â
And start drafting. This team is built all wrong due to poor drafting over the past ten years that they've been forced to hand out bad contracts for mediocre players. They need some solid drafts
Has been as productive as any NFL WR always hurt for some reason or the other, I’ve come to the conclusion he has talent just not NFL talent unfortunately.
Get whatever you can for him. Some team will pony up something for him. We can not make the playoffs with him so not making the playoffs without him is no big deal.
Restructure or dump OV. See how the rest of the season plays out for him but I dont see him being here beyond this season.
Continue to rebuild the OL. We only have Hernandez right now. Solder has maybe a year left but he has not been good and so far not worth the investment.
We have to look for a QB or let Tanney and Lauletta battle it out. As stated above, we can not make the playoffs and have Elis $22 million to play with. We should have drafted Darnold this season and bit the bullet or traded the pick for more picks. Now we have a great RB and it did not improve the team. But I guess he is fun to watch while we lose.
Do not resign Collins, he had his one great year but has been average at best. He is going to want top $$ and we cant affrd to pay average players top $$. Unless he improves I think we should let him walk. We should resign Sterling Shepard instead, we cant keep both.
Sign pass rushers Multiple pass rushers.
We have to draft BPA or stockpile picks. This team needs too much. We traded a pick for a punter which is silly for a bad team.
Out with old players. Signing Stewart now looks like a joke. Solder was over the hill and is playing like he is on the decline. Eli is not getting better with age. Its time for the rebuild and not sell the fanbase on how we can win now.
in the top 7 I go with the QB. First round talent is a strong grade and if you have a QB graded as high as any of those other positions you take the QB especially since ours is on the way out.
If there isn't a QB rated high enough for the top pick then I go OL next. Then DE.
I think Eli is a lock to return as well but this thread is about what we would do if we were the GM. I would love to grab Herbert and keep Eli. They will be able to sign an OL like Donovan Smith or Ja'Wuan James if they wanted. If they let go of Vernon then they could also afford another top FA like Markus Golden.
Is that we all seem to agree on one thing: Justin Herbert.
Everyone says the 2019 QB class is weak, but honestly I think Herbert looks better than every one of the 4 guys drafted in the top 10 in the 2018 draft, or at the very least he looks/seems like more of a sure thing than the new "Big 4" were coming out. I would absolutely pull the trigger on him and be willing to give up our 2020 first rounder to get him if need be.
RE: If their are 7 players rated nearly identical Â
in the top 7 I go with the QB. First round talent is a strong grade and if you have a QB graded as high as any of those other positions you take the QB especially since ours is on the way out.
If there isn't a QB rated high enough for the top pick then I go OL next. Then DE.
bradshaw44,
The DL/OL class is stronger than the QB class. However, if the *right* QB is there, I don't think you can pass on him, even if you have an otherworldly (i.e. higher rated) pass rusher like Bosa available. Some may disagree and prefer we take the BPA in the trenches, but I'm not sure we can afford to pass up anopportunity get our guy at QB.
If the once again don't like any of the QBs, sure go ahead and draft Bosa, try to ride with Eli or a cheaper more sensible option at QB for one more year, and then take one of the studs in the 2020 QB class. Gotta really like the QB if you're gonna take one, but if you do really like one then you HAVE TO take one.
JonC, In your opinion do you think the Giants will entertain taking a QB next year? I know it's early and things will certainly change but has any of the college QB's caught the FO eye's so far?
RE: RE: I would try to get rid of bad players and get good players instead. Â
JonC, In your opinion do you think the Giants will entertain taking a QB next year? I know it's early and things will certainly change but has any of the college QB's caught the FO eye's so far?
Jay, I think they will consider a QB if the grade and value are there at their pick. As others have said, early projections are strong on OL and DL, and an infusion is a wise investment if they're not sold on a QB.
Haven't heard anything yet, it's really early. I suspect Herbert will be well regarded.
Alas, this is what I fully expect. And further proof that Jints Central is more incompetent than ever.
Lastly, if this does happen, it will be more evidence, in my mind, that Mara is totally committed to finding any way possible to have Eli ride out on a white horse.
Because I can't imagine Shurmur, assuming Eli continues to trend in this fashion - unable to create points anymore on a week in week out basis, would come close to agreeing that Eli has anything left in the tank.
And Gettleman doesn't count - he's a fool. A real GM would resign if Eli is in the plans for 2019.
We will not draft a QB in 2019
Eli will be the starter
When things go back, Lauletta gets his chance.
Drafting a QB early means Lauletta becomes a wasted pick. DG wont have that. That effect of not taking Darnold will be felt into 2020.
This is a good point. I'd be surprised if they blew up the Lauletta pick by taking another QB. It's happened a few times recently elsewhere (Buffalo taking Allen after Peterman, Cleveland taking Mayfield after Kizer are two that quickly come to mind), but with Eli still in the mix it would surprise me.
We will not draft a QB in 2019
Eli will be the starter
When things go back, Lauletta gets his chance.
Drafting a QB early means Lauletta becomes a wasted pick. DG wont have that. That effect of not taking Darnold will be felt into 2020.
This is a good point. I'd be surprised if they blew up the Lauletta pick by taking another QB. It's happened a few times recently elsewhere (Buffalo taking Allen after Peterman, Cleveland taking Mayfield after Kizer are two that quickly come to mind), but with Eli still in the mix it would surprise me.
KL could become the backup and the pick would be justified.
even a project is an acceptable sunk cost. Of course as I write this, I'm saying to myself "If they rest on their laurels with that pick it would be really frustrating."
Lauletta was a fourth round pick, that's not a sunk cost that will prevent the Giants from investing a first round pick in a QB.
I'm fine if Eli's here next year even if this season continues to go poorly. But I'll be upset if there's not a plan in place.
This GM and coach just cut a 3rd round QB who never played a snap.
I would hope that was out of conviction and not spite, and a 4th round pick would suffer the same.
I would agree with this but Dg didnt draft Webb. GMs tend to hold onto their draft picks as long as possible. Think of the years we held onto guys like Adrian robinson, Beckum, Hosley, Jerrigan for absolutely no reason.
Lauletta was a fourth round pick, that's not a sunk cost that will prevent the Giants from investing a first round pick in a QB.
I'm fine if Eli's here next year even if this season continues to go poorly. But I'll be upset if there's not a plan in place.
This GM and coach just cut a 3rd round QB who never played a snap.
I would hope that was out of conviction and not spite, and a 4th round pick would suffer the same.
I would agree with this but Dg didnt draft Webb. GMs tend to hold onto their draft picks as long as possible. Think of the years we held onto guys like Adrian robinson, Beckum, Hosley, Jerrigan for absolutely no reason.
Thats a data point on 1 GM. You have other examples like Pete Carrol / seattle GM who are quick to cut draft picks
Lauletta was a fourth round pick, that's not a sunk cost that will prevent the Giants from investing a first round pick in a QB.
I'm fine if Eli's here next year even if this season continues to go poorly. But I'll be upset if there's not a plan in place.
We learned this last season when some were convinced the Giants would pass on a QB just because of Webb's presence. They passed on a QB because they felt Barkley was the BPA not because of Webb. I expect these same people to suggest that the Giants will once again pass on a QB because of Lauletta. The truth is that Lauletta is a project and more than likely will be a backup in the NFL. I really like Lauletta but his presence on the roster would have no bearing on whether or not I would take Herbert or another QB in the draft.
As mentioned this is a very talented draft for OT's plus there are a couple of young outstanding OT's in free agency. If the Giants do not address RT in free agency they still could get a solid one on day 2.
RE: RE: RE: My opinion of what will happen and what should happen are different Â
JonC, In your opinion do you think the Giants will entertain taking a QB next year? I know it's early and things will certainly change but has any of the college QB's caught the FO eye's so far?
Jay, I think they will consider a QB if the grade and value are there at their pick. As others have said, early projections are strong on OL and DL, and an infusion is a wise investment if they're not sold on a QB.
Haven't heard anything yet, it's really early. I suspect Herbert will be well regarded.
Thanks JonC, I think Herbert would be the most likely target of the Giants. It would be fun to watch Shurmur develop a QB with his talent.
Lauletta was a fourth round pick, that's not a sunk cost that will prevent the Giants from investing a first round pick in a QB.
I'm fine if Eli's here next year even if this season continues to go poorly. But I'll be upset if there's not a plan in place.
We learned this last season when some were convinced the Giants would pass on a QB just because of Webb's presence. They passed on a QB because they felt Barkley was the BPA not because of Webb. I expect these same people to suggest that the Giants will once again pass on a QB because of Lauletta. The truth is that Lauletta is a project and more than likely will be a backup in the NFL. I really like Lauletta but his presence on the roster would have no bearing on whether or not I would take Herbert or another QB in the draft.
As mentioned this is a very talented draft for OT's plus there are a couple of young outstanding OT's in free agency. If the Giants do not address RT in free agency they still could get a solid one on day 2.
Yeah, I certainly never bought that argument. I won't buy it this off-season, either.
Unless a SB contender loses their starting QB to an injury in the coming weeks, what team is trading for Eli? I just don't see any teams that would be interested...
I see it differently
ron mexico : 1:24 pm : link : reply
Eli was a sunk cost for 2018. There was no benefit in parting ways so might as well give him another shot.
maybe I'm giving them too much of the benefit of the doubt
Exactly: Eli's contract for 2018 has the Giants locked in. 2019 is not quite so bad, but Jon C isn't often wrong, so we should expect Eli back in 2019, perhaps even if we draft QB in round 1. If so, Eli will end up 2019 on the bench, in my opinion, unless he finds the fountain of youth before then (which likely will require a better O-lne).
Unless a SB contender loses their starting QB to an injury in the coming weeks, what team is trading for Eli? I just don't see any teams that would be interested...
The year still has to play out, but if Eli continues his current rate of play we couldn't get a 20th round pick if the draft had 20 rounds.
To think that DG would keep Eli for 2019 and not draft a QB Â
in the top 7 I go with the QB. First round talent is a strong grade and if you have a QB graded as high as any of those other positions you take the QB especially since ours is on the way out.
If there isn't a QB rated high enough for the top pick then I go OL next. Then DE.
bradshaw44,
The DL/OL class is stronger than the QB class. However, if the *right* QB is there, I don't think you can pass on him, even if you have an otherworldly (i.e. higher rated) pass rusher like Bosa available. Some may disagree and prefer we take the BPA in the trenches, but I'm not sure we can afford to pass up anopportunity get our guy at QB.
If the once again don't like any of the QBs, sure go ahead and draft Bosa, try to ride with Eli or a cheaper more sensible option at QB for one more year, and then take one of the studs in the 2020 QB class. Gotta really like the QB if you're gonna take one, but if you do really like one then you HAVE TO take one.
LOT, I'm saying if all the positions are graded even or close, you take the QB. We definitely need the next guy under center. If we have the first shot at a QB and any of them are graded in the top 5 of ALL players this season, you take him. Unless LT or someone of that caliber is in the draft.
They have to take it. If not, OLine or pass rusher. Say they go QB or pass rusher at 1, you still have major needs on OLine.
If they miss out on that keystone OT, you can still upgrade OC or OG in a big way in round 2. They need guys who can give Barkley some chances to do his thing. Barkley’s talents are nearly wasted. Teams still playing 2 deep on us and limiting impact of Odell and no answers thus far. They should have kept Fluker. Despite his flaws, he was the best run blocker this team has had in years. Unleash Barkley and a running game, and he doesn’t need a lot, and the equations change dramatically.
You can’t be sentimental. Eli has been great, but enough is enough. His recent history is the same as the organization’s, and that’s not good enough. Recent history is nothing to play for when the leaves remsin on the trees and far embarrassing losses in prime time games. That’s obviously not all on him, I get it. But a 37 year old QB with 4 wins in the last 20 games is all that needs to be said. You have to rebuild the core, and you don’t build around a 37 year old losing QB. It is just time.
Now if that guy is not there, you don’t force it. Improve the talent around Eli and he will play better. If they are picking in the top 10, they need to come away with an elite talent. You would love for it to be at QB, OLine, or pass rusher, but you can’t pass up on elite talent if it’s there.
I think some have gone too far in proclaiming the Giants an inept & laughable franchise. The goal is to win & Mara/DG are not going to blindfully commit to Eli in 2019 after what likely will be a losing season.
Let’s not make the same mistake with Lauletta like so many did with Webb. A 4th round pick is a developmental pick, as of now, Lauletta hasn’t won the backup job in a time where a ton of rookies came into the league hitting the ground running. It’s very possible Lauletta is a career backup who is an expert on the system and can come in at a moments notice, that’s what developmental QB’s tend to be.
Lastly, while we are all frustrated, let’s not forget what this is all the result of - winning 2 Super Bowls with the QB reaching the end. One of the most beloved, significant players in franchise history. It’s not unusual for sentimentality to get in the way, in fact I’d say it’s pretty common among franchises facing this issue, just look at the Lakers with Kobe Bryant for example. There is a reason Belichick is an all time great, he’s cold, unloyal. The Giants decided to stick with Eli after the majority of fans acted ridiculous last year. The mob got its way. So the can got kicked down the road. It happens.
If the Giants have a shitty year, Eli isn’t coming back. As DG said when pressed on Eli’s play during the Saquon draft presser, “we are going to find out.”
after the 2nd, that’s hard. Real hard & it has showed over the last few years.
Do yourself a favor and read NoGainDayne's long post on analytics, the Giants front office, the Eagles, and other thoughts. Excellent read. Link - ( New Window )
because that is entirely possible based upon how this team is playing...
If I am GM, I am...
1. Going to plug holes in the OL via free agency. (I have no idea who is available)
2. Drafting a QB with our first pick if there is one that I like. I dont care if Lauletta is there Dep. It would not have been a wasted pick if he ends up being a solid backup.
3. Finding another pass rusher because we cannot continue to pay Vernon to sit in the ice tub every year.
4. Finding a free safety.
I think some have gone too far in proclaiming the Giants an inept & laughable franchise. The goal is to win & Mara/DG are not going to blindfully commit to Eli in 2019 after what likely will be a losing season.
Really? According to JonC, above, it's almost a certainty Eli will be back in 2019. So if that, plus the last 5-6 years, doesn't lead you to conclude ineptitude is in the air, then you have your head in the sand.
Out of curiosity, how is it not ineptitude to bring back a 76 year old former GM, Accorsi, to lead a fake widespread GM search, who then hires his old friend, 67 year old Dave Gettleman? And if Gettleman was such a hot commodity how many other GM offers did he receive?
Mara was humiliated last year with the Eli fiasco. As embarrassed as he's ever been. He's all in on Eli and finding a way to make him go out on a high note.
RE: RE: It’s one thing to win 1 SB and move on.. Â
after the 2nd, that’s hard. Real hard & it has showed over the last few years.
Do yourself a favor and read NoGainDayne's long post on analytics, the Giants front office, the Eagles, and other thoughts. Excellent read. Link - ( New Window )
Thanks for pointing that out. Very troubling, but not shocking. The fact that ownership still swears by the George Young structure is just stupid. It’s 2018.
I made a thread just before the SB asking why the Eagles are so successful in terms of sustained success since 2000.
I don’t think the Giants are inept as some say, but I do think they are stuck in the 80’s. The GM interviews headed by Accorsi say it all:
Marc Ross- Reese right hand man
Abrams- worked under Reese
Gettleman- worked under Reese
Riddick- outside candidate
Any poster who questions the direction at the top is 1000% reasonable. It’s fair to have higher expectations than a catch lightning in a bottle SB run.
Maybe it’ll take another bottom out season, but I would like to see a young HC coupled with a young GM to work in a cohesive manner together similar to a Shanahan-Lynch dynamic. I don’t want to pass the torch from Gettleman to Abrams when the job isn’t earned (see hiring an OC off a losing staff to be HC).
Lastly though, I do think Mara wants to win. Badly. But, he needs to leave his bubble. Fresh ideas are needed.
coupled with the next young QB. A lot of the reason it’s been shit the last 5 years is because everyone’s been on separate schedules.
DG/Shurmur represent hanging onto Eli in my opinion. The hires were geared towards winning with Eli. So, if Eli does prove to be shot here & the season is a disaster, the best thing for this franchise is to start over.
New GM/HC tandem & draft the next QB. That’s the foundation, then build from there. As far as I’m concerned, it’s completely reasonable for this to occur in 2019 if this season continues as is.
I then give him a wedgie and refer to him as Skippy in meetings. Next, I go to church to find who is touched by God to determine who I draft in the first round.
I’d suggest they got 4 very good players with their 1st 4 picks. That’s not the issue. The issue here is lack of vision. The biggest mistake a GM can make is not being honest about where you are. At this point you measure the GM on the big directional decisions -don’t sweat the little shit. It’s about how they are rebuilding the team to prominence —-what they did with the #2 pick, who they hired to coach the team, the Odell contract, the Eli transition plan. Also roster reconstruction.
I’m of the belief the fans acted absolutely pathetic last year with regards to the Eli benching.
I agree. It was ridiculous. So concerned about a streak in a season where we only won 3 games. It scared Mara who even said "we did not expect the fans to get this emotional over the decision". That in itself was a backhanded way to say the fans are stupid. In this instance, he was right but now he is making decisions to keep his customers happy because apparently it is more important for a huge portion of the fan base to see Eli behind center than to actually win games.
Wasthe epitome of stupid and the backlash was well deserved. Geno Smith has always and will always suck. Sitting a team legend for a journeyman backup or a guy not on any active roster in his 2nd year is the definition of ineptitude.
Wasthe epitome of stupid and the backlash was well deserved. Geno Smith has always and will always suck. Sitting a team legend for a journeyman backup or a guy not on any active roster in his 2nd year is the definition of ineptitude.
None of us saw Geno in practice. He probably busted his ass off & was a good soldier. In a lost season why doesn’t he deserve a start? Still a relatively young 2nd round QB - completely harmless to give him a start.
Wasthe epitome of stupid and the backlash was well deserved. Geno Smith has always and will always suck. Sitting a team legend for a journeyman backup or a guy not on any active roster in his 2nd year is the definition of ineptitude.
None of us saw Geno in practice. He probably busted his ass off & was a good soldier. In a lost season why doesn’t he deserve a start? Still a relatively young 2nd round QB - completely harmless to give him a start.
Ok then why not bench anyone else? If people don’t realize that Ben and Reese tried to make Eli the scapegoat for their ineptness, then they never will.
If we were starting someone to succeed Eli or was being groomed too, the backlash would be a lot less. But instead we started a f’n scrub who played exactly like one. To be honest with you, there was NO justification for Geno even being on the roster. Webb should have been the backup a long time ago and got a lot more reps in and then if mcadoo wanted to see what he had, fine.
And I saw what Geno did in the preseason. He was lucky he made the team.
But Geno Smith? Let’s knock it off with that nonsense. He was is and always will be a terrible player.
- Redo Vernon's contract
- Sign Landon Collins
- Get Earl Thomas or another free agent for the secondary
- Draft pretty much nothing but O and D lineman in the next draft.
Sitting Eli was not the issue. Sitting him for Geno was. Sitting Eli to give yourself a chance to evaluate your young QB in a lost season is an easy sell. Sitting Eli and breaking the streak in favor of Geno Smith, a player with enough game tape to knows is not an long term answer, was an embarrassing decision. Thinking you could rally the team and fan base behind Geno Smith was a desperate move by an over-his-head headcoach trying to preserve his job.
Problem is, the team hasn't become clear minded in the wake of that decision. They've miscalculated how close they are to being able to compete, what they have in their QB, and what the fans want to see. The pendulum is swinging from one terrible decision to another on the opposite spectrum.
Regarding Eli in 2019, a lot could change over the next 12 games. But, even though it feels like the sand is running out on Eli's time here, I don't think they cut him loose unless they somehow get really fortunate at the position next offseason.
I agree. It was ridiculous. So concerned about a streak in a season where we only won 3 games. It scared Mara who even said "we did not expect the fans to get this emotional over the decision". That in itself was a backhanded way to say the fans are stupid. In this instance, he was right but now he is making decisions to keep his customers happy because apparently it is more important for a huge portion of the fan base to see Eli behind center than to actually win games.
I have no issue with the backlash some fans created when Eli got benched. Fans get emotionally invested and get attached to players. It’s part of the territory.
The real problem - the major problem - is that Mara kowtowed to it and it’s impacted team strategy. While Mara is ultra sensitive to the fan base - saw the mutiny of fans in ‘78 - don’t think for a second he’s not genuinely all in on Eli.
I think he’s desperate to have Eli walk off into the sunset like Elway did with Denver. And he’s driving and making decisions wth that as the goal. It’s a horrendous and irresponsible way to run a team. And if JonC is right, that Eli will be back in 2019, then that just cements it for me that we have the wrong owner for this team.
I agree. It was ridiculous. So concerned about a streak in a season where we only won 3 games. It scared Mara who even said "we did not expect the fans to get this emotional over the decision". That in itself was a backhanded way to say the fans are stupid. In this instance, he was right but now he is making decisions to keep his customers happy because apparently it is more important for a huge portion of the fan base to see Eli behind center than to actually win games.
I have no issue with the backlash some fans created when Eli got benched. Fans get emotionally invested and get attached to players. It’s part of the territory.
The real problem - the major problem - is that Mara kowtowed to it and it’s impacted team strategy. While Mara is ultra sensitive to the fan base - saw the mutiny of fans in ‘78 - don’t think for a second he’s not genuinely all in on Eli.
I think he’s desperate to have Eli walk off into the sunset like Elway did with Denver. And he’s driving and making decisions wth that as the goal. It’s a horrendous and irresponsible way to run a team. And if JonC is right, that Eli will be back in 2019, then that just cements it for me that we have the wrong owner for this team.
There was absolutely no strategy when the Eli benching occurred. There was no strategy on what to do going forward into 2018. You had 2 imbeciles pissing in the wind trying to make miracles happen.
There are still some who believe that the benching was an FU to the organization by two guys knowing they were getting fired at the end of the year.
Regarding Eli in 2019, a lot could change over the next 12 games. But, even though it feels like the sand is running out on Eli's time here, I don't think they cut him loose unless they somehow get really fortunate at the position next offseason.
so you think it its more than likely that Eli gets his 5mm roster bonus even if this level of play / o production continues the rest of the season?
If they don't find a QB they feel is ready to take the reins Â
yes, I expect Eli to return. There's 12 games left for Eli and the team to improve and gain favor for next season or shit the bed. And then we wait and see if they like a QB in the draft next April.
There's a lot that has to take place in order for them to finally move on from Eli, imv.
Regarding Eli in 2019, a lot could change over the next 12 games. But, even though it feels like the sand is running out on Eli's time here, I don't think they cut him loose unless they somehow get really fortunate at the position next offseason.
so you think it its more than likely that Eli gets his 5mm roster bonus even if this level of play / o production continues the rest of the season?
Unless he really shows his age, I think they keep Eli one more year and hopefully they have a 1st rd QB in the draft to sit behind Eli and learn. With a good line, Eli can win. I expect the line to be greatly improved by next season.
If the decision was to bring back Eli, then every possible resource should have been liquidated and redirected towards the goal of making the offensive line not only competent but in the top tier of the entire league. Signing Beckham, signing Ogletree, drafting Barkley...that all should have gone to the OL if the conviction from the top was "Eli stays". We also probably should have hired a different head coach.
there wasn't really a deep pool for the OL this year. Getting solder or Norwell were the key pieces in play. We have essentially an entirely new OL. And it isn't too late to think they might gel.
But basically liquidating assets to upgrade the OL wasn't going to yield much better returns.
Wasthe epitome of stupid and the backlash was well deserved. Geno Smith has always and will always suck. Sitting a team legend for a journeyman backup or a guy not on any active roster in his 2nd year is the definition of ineptitude.
None of us saw Geno in practice. He probably busted his ass off & was a good soldier. In a lost season why doesn’t he deserve a start? Still a relatively young 2nd round QB - completely harmless to give him a start.
Ok then why not bench anyone else? If people don’t realize that Ben and Reese tried to make Eli the scapegoat for their ineptness, then they never will.
If we were starting someone to succeed Eli or was being groomed too, the backlash would be a lot less. But instead we started a f’n scrub who played exactly like one. To be honest with you, there was NO justification for Geno even being on the roster. Webb should have been the backup a long time ago and got a lot more reps in and then if mcadoo wanted to see what he had, fine.
And I saw what Geno did in the preseason. He was lucky he made the team.
But Geno Smith? Let’s knock it off with that nonsense. He was is and always will be a terrible player.
This is stupid, and why the team is as directionless as it is.
When the decision was made to put someone else in at QB - a decision which started with having Eli start the games and then get pulled - Manning balked, and a huge drama ensued.
At that point in the season, losses were more valuable than wins. The decision to bench Manning wasn't some career saving effort by McAdoo and Reese, it was an attempt to see what else they had on the roster. And whatever complaints you could have about those two - the decision made perfect sense.
But because Giants fans have to be as embarrassing as possible, huge fan backlash ensued. Manning was not innocent in that either, he could have helped the team out there, but opted not to.
Coughlin deserved to go, as did Reese and McAdoo. And now it's pretty clear it's Eli's time as well.
That was narrowed to ONE position for a journeyman backup
Yeah, not buying it.
Yeah - because defensively they were already going through the suspension craze and guys were seeing the bench, and the OL was already awful enough that putting other players in would only make matters worse.
Plus - there was enough evidence to support that the QB was part of the problem - so why the hell not try something else? The season was a goner.
They even went so far as to ask him, and let him continue his streak. Eli decided to take the martyr route.
So if you think it was McAdoo/Reese just trying to save their jobs, it's every bit as reasonable to believe Eli's only objection was out of fear that he would be proven responsible for the problems on offense.
By allowing the guy mcadoo wanted to play the entire game and let him try to succeed as much as possible? By being a good teammate?
Agenda noted. Carry on.
Yeah, that's what Eli was trying to do - he wasn't trying to buy sympathy, he was deliberately trying to get Geno Smith onto the field for the whole game. You know, because he felt for ole Geno.
By allowing the guy mcadoo wanted to play the entire game and let him try to succeed as much as possible? By being a good teammate?
Agenda noted. Carry on.
Yeah, that's what Eli was trying to do - he wasn't trying to buy sympathy, he was deliberately trying to get Geno Smith onto the field for the whole game. You know, because he felt for ole Geno.
So by telling McAdoo to start Geno the whole game, he was trying in essence to have Geno not play and for Eli himself to start the whole game - even though he McAdoo that Geno should play the whole game and wound up playing the whole game?
Am I getting this mystery right now?
The fact is in NO TIME in NFL History has a QB came out on planned to start the 2nd half, irregardless of how he was playing. Why? Because thats not how things work. Eli told McAdoo that if he wanted to see Geno that Geno deserved the whole game because thats whats fair to him. Thats being a good teammate.
Its downright comical how Giants "fans" will take any situation and turn it against Eli. Eli sticking up for a teammate is now Eli being selfish. I have heard it all now.
There was absolutely no strategy when the Eli benching occurred. There was no strategy on what to do going forward into 2018. You had 2 imbeciles pissing in the wind trying to make miracles happen.
There are still some who believe that the benching was an FU to the organization by two guys knowing they were getting fired at the end of the year.
I don't buy the mutiny theory by McAdoo and Reese at all. I actually think McAdoo was ahead of the curve at Jints Central and saw Eli had reached this point of diminishing returns.
The 2018 season wasn't a disaster because of McAdoo. It was a disaster driven by two reasons - (1) an inordinate amount of injuries and (2) Reese's inability to supply the team with talent short or long term.
I do think there was a strategy to taking Eli away from the huddle - let's see if we can win with either of the other two QBs and/or what we have in the stable under live fire.
Mine is to one day see the Giants have a winning season again.
Yours is to make sure nobody ever assigns any blame, whatsoever, to Eli Manning. No interception has ever been his fault, no fumble, no loss. He's the football equivalent of Jesus Christ, just more clean cut than the ole Savior.
One thing is for sure - we blame everyone around here, but the one constant through it all has been Eli. And plenty of teams have offenses playing more capably than ours with a lot less talent. At some point, the QB is accountable for the mess as well.
you can see that from the get go. Its one thing to believe Eli is done. Thats not the point of this conversation. McAdoo did NOTHING to help the progression from Eli to Webb. Webb was inactive, took few practice reps, and when Eli was benched - he was nowhere near ready to be a starter.
If the Ginats had cut ties with Geno in week 5 when we were 0-5. Made Webb the backup, and then tried him the last 3-4 games - the backlash would be MUCH MUCH less. There would have been criticism of course, but at lesat you can see a plan.
There was NOT a single plan that meant Geno for the future. None, nil, nada.
Mine is to one day see the Giants have a winning season again.
Yours is to make sure nobody ever assigns any blame, whatsoever, to Eli Manning. No interception has ever been his fault, no fumble, no loss. He's the football equivalent of Jesus Christ, just more clean cut than the ole Savior.
Just a stupid post being that I wanted to draft darnold this whole offseason and said this should be Eli's last season.
I am sorry I made your example and opinion of last years situation look dumb, so I'll refrain from doing so again.
But you need to start getting personal and making attacks on me that have NOTHING to do with the topic at hand.
isn't a personal attack. Your campaign to ensure that Eli Manning is never blamed for anything related to the Giants offensive woes has generated plenty of those posts, unfortunately.
"Eli is blameless.... blah blah blah.... Eli is the greatest ever.... blah blah blah..."
Its like being in elementary school when someone says somethign to a kid they dont understand and they respond - I know you are but what am I....
Nowhere in this thread did I say a word about Eli's game playing ability. None. But you bring it up as if it is a constant. I was talking about Ben McAdoo and his plan for the future and you are bringing up Eli as a martyr for christ sakes.
Grow up buddy. Since you have selective reading tendencies. I have been stating all year this should be Eli's last year aand its time to move on.
So when you say something that is wrong or stupid - you should come back with something different than... "Its never Eli's fault."
Aging, high priced safety who is coming off major injury is not the process to believe in.
.
No, they have to sign Collins first, how much do want
to pay two safeties. I wouldn't be surprised if Thomas
winds up with the Cowpokes, he has hinted to them in somewhat of a jest. He is also a Texas native...
Don't see them spending $10M per at both safety positions Â
Why shouldn't have it been 2016 or 2017...solely the cap hit?
2014-2015 - whether people want to agree or not - Eli was pretty damn good.
Now 2016 he took a step back but the team did better. I mean we were 11-5 and he did play well against GB in the playoffs = did you think it was time for a new QB then?
So he becomes the starter last year and the team had a year to forget. He would have been a big hit on the cap if cut. So again, I think he deserved this year to start, draft Darnold - and once this year went to shit, you could have groomed Darnold as early this year.
Why shouldn't have it been 2016 or 2017...solely the cap hit?
He had a good year in 2015. There was no reason to believe that would stop in 2016.
'16-17 should have been enough for someone to figure one of two things - that either Eli was done, or that he needed significantly different personnel around him to be productive. Regardless of that decision, by 17 someone should have been planning an exit strategy.
16 was a successful year even if there wasn't a ton of Â
But the signs were showing in 2016 so there was clear risk gong into 2017. Just saying this doesn’t match the “better a year early versus a year late”.
RE: Didn’t say I would have cut him loose after 2015 Â
But the signs were showing in 2016 so there was clear risk gong into 2017. Just saying this doesn’t match the “better a year early versus a year late”.
In 2016 he had two skilled players that played football in 2017. And while 26 and 16 aren’t great numbers, they weren’t disastrous.
Changing QBs after a playoff season is not always the smartest thing.
RE: RE: Didn’t say I would have cut him loose after 2015 Â
But the signs were showing in 2016 so there was clear risk gong into 2017. Just saying this doesn’t match the “better a year early versus a year late”.
In 2016 he had two skilled players that played football in 2017. And while 26 and 16 aren’t great numbers, they weren’t disastrous.
Changing QBs after a playoff season is not always the smartest thing.
Don’t follow the first statement?
Regarding the second statement, Eli wasn’t the key contributor to the playoffs in 2016. It was overwhelmingly the defense, OBJ and winning close games. Eli was a neutral factor at best. So don’t put emphasis where it is not warranted...
you can see that from the get go. Its one thing to believe Eli is done. Thats not the point of this conversation. McAdoo did NOTHING to help the progression from Eli to Webb. Webb was inactive, took few practice reps, and when Eli was benched - he was nowhere near ready to be a starter.
If the Ginats had cut ties with Geno in week 5 when we were 0-5. Made Webb the backup, and then tried him the last 3-4 games - the backlash would be MUCH MUCH less. There would have been criticism of course, but at lesat you can see a plan.
There was NOT a single plan that meant Geno for the future. None, nil, nada.
Mcadoo felt he needed to know one way or another if his design was hampered by Manning. He wasn't looking for a succession plan, he was looking to take stock of the state of the team.
Webb was not ready. If his practices resembled this pre-season that was probably very clear.
Smith was the 2nd QB and when the whole thing blew up, was the only guy 1) willing to start and 2) actually even part of installation of the game plan.
Thanks Anak. Hopefully with richburg, Pugh, kennard, fuller leaving we may get a comp pick.
They're even now in that category, but could gain a 4th according to this excerpt:
"New York Giants: They are currently even with five CFAs each lost and gained. Of the five they gained, Michael Thomas and Cody Latimer could be the most vulnerable to being cut for comp pick reasons. It will not be cheap to cut either: Thomas was guaranteed $1.5 million, and almost all of Latimer’s $2.5 million was guaranteed. But if they cut one of the two before Week 10, it would open up a 4th rounder for one of Weston Richburg or Justin Pugh, and if they cut both it would open up an additional 5th or 6th for Devon Kennard. (Cutting Latimer would also end any scant hope the Broncos have to continue their comp pick streak.)"
Unless Wheeler surprises and starts to look like a starting tackle, that should be one priority. If there's a qb at 5 who we think is the future, we grab him. But right now, everything is speculation.
2. Draft QB in top 5, if we are there.
3. Sam Beal comes back so I'm fine with corners
4. Use Vernon's cap space to help sign Collins, and get Center help.
5. Free up Eli money for top tier RT and Guard.
6. Draft DE in second round of draft.
7. Fortify depth with picks 4 on, since Beal is our 3 rounder
No. This is the reason why we have been terrible.
Aging, high priced safety who is coming off major injury is not the process to believe in.
OC
RG
RT
WR (someone better than Lattimore, doesn’t need to be from a premium asset)
Edge rusher
LB
FS
CB
And maybe most importantly, QB.
That’s still a ton needed.
Probably need to come to grips that 2019 might not be a good year either.
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immediately
No. This is the reason why we have been terrible.
Aging, high priced safety who is coming off major injury is not the process to believe in.
Dep, Rocky is poking fun at the poster who said we should trade for Earl Thomas immediately - broken leg and all.
Shepard is a FA the following season. I would say a top of the draft WR is a big need. Rookie year they can be the #3 and then hopefully move up to #2 after Shepard leaves.
Vernon isn't long for this team. Edge Rusher is a big need, these guys tend to come from the top of the draft.
If i was a GM i would draft a late round OL and DL player ever single draft no matter what. That's on top of taking one early if it warrants it.
Draft a Center, A Right Guard, a blocking TE and a FB.
Get Vernon to agree to a pay cut or dump him.
Get Jenkins to agree to a pay cut or dump him.
Look at this photograph!! 🎶🎶🎶
- I would sign Donovan Smith or Ja'Wuan James in free agency for RT.
- Release Eli and Vernon.
- Franchise Landon Collins
- Sign Nick Easton or Ali Marpet to compete at center
- Sign Sam Bradford or Ryan Fitzpatrick as the veteran stopgap for Herbert/Grier
- Sign OLB Markus Golden in free agency.
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In comment 14104535 Rocky369 said:
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immediately
No. This is the reason why we have been terrible.
Aging, high priced safety who is coming off major injury is not the process to believe in.
Dep, Rocky is poking fun at the poster who said we should trade for Earl Thomas immediately - broken leg and all.
Damnit!!!!
Sad thing was that was my original thought as well.
Well played rocky!
C - IDK IOL
RT - 2nd round like David Edwards of Wisconsin?
ILB - see what's out there
FS - see what's out there
That was easy!
Round 4 - Most explosive WR left.
Round 5/6 - secondary depth.
He's not getting 40M in the open market. Taking a pay cut and staying with the Giants would be his best financial decision in that scenario.
-Draft QB at 5
-Draft Best Available prospect in Round 2 within those needs
-Draft Best Available prospect in Round 4 within those needs
Look to sign a starting player via Free Agency. Not a high end guy, just a dependable player that fills any of those needs.
- Sign Sam Bradford or Ryan Fitzpatrick as the veteran stopgap for Herbert/Grier
Shoot me now. A year of Bradford or Fitzpatrick will kill me off anyway so just make it quick and painless. Thank you.
- I would sign Donovan Smith or Ja'Wuan James in free agency for RT.
- Release Eli and Vernon.
- Franchise Landon Collins
- Sign Nick Easton or Ali Marpet to compete at center
- Sign Sam Bradford or Ryan Fitzpatrick as the veteran stopgap for Herbert/Grier
- Sign OLB Markus Golden in free agency.
Can you quit your job and volunteer to be DGs assistant.
This is a great and realistic way to looo at it.
Far past the time to go from a below average group to a above average group. They need edge rushers too and probably need to find a replacement for Harrison as well.
What they really need to do is end the infatuation with guys they think can move the ball and focus on dominating the trenches.
I would not make a splash in free agency. It will be premature. Set the team up in great cap position for 2020.
If there is the QB of the future in the draft I draft him.
I then pick the best available offensive lineman.
If there is no QB worth drafting I take a defensive lineman first. The strength of this draft is the defensive line.
The Giants must get away from short fixes. This has not worked and it will
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Draft either Justin Herbert or Will Grier in the draft. Trade up for Herbert if needed.
- I would sign Donovan Smith or Ja'Wuan James in free agency for RT.
- Release Eli and Vernon.
- Franchise Landon Collins
- Sign Nick Easton or Ali Marpet to compete at center
- Sign Sam Bradford or Ryan Fitzpatrick as the veteran stopgap for Herbert/Grier
- Sign OLB Markus Golden in free agency.
Can you quit your job and volunteer to be DGs assistant.
This is a great and realistic way to looo at it.
Close, but I go Teddy Bridgewater over Fitz or Sam. There are plenty of WR 3's out there to be had as well in FA. Eli's contract (will free up 17m) is the big problem. We also should not release OV. We get him and Jenkins to agree to a paycut 1st. But worse case, yes, release OV.
- I would sign Donovan Smith or Ja'Wuan James in free agency for RT.
- Release Eli and Vernon.
- Franchise Landon Collins
- Sign Nick Easton or Ali Marpet to compete at center
- Sign Sam Bradford or Ryan Fitzpatrick as the veteran stopgap for Herbert/Grier
- Sign OLB Markus Golden in free agency.
Please no Sam Bradford. He’s going to want 15 mill+ and if Eli is Captain Checkdown, then Bradford is King Checkdown. no thanks.
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Draft either Justin Herbert or Will Grier in the draft. Trade up for Herbert if needed.
- I would sign Donovan Smith or Ja'Wuan James in free agency for RT.
- Release Eli and Vernon.
- Franchise Landon Collins
- Sign Nick Easton or Ali Marpet to compete at center
- Sign Sam Bradford or Ryan Fitzpatrick as the veteran stopgap for Herbert/Grier
- Sign OLB Markus Golden in free agency.
Please no Sam Bradford. He’s going to want 15 mill+ and if Eli is Captain Checkdown, then Bradford is King Checkdown. no thanks.
Afer this season Bradford will have to settle for around 5 million on a 1 year deal. I am not a big fan of Bradford but he was playing very well under Shurmur in Minnesota. I am just looking for an inexpensive stogap. As for Bridgewater I doubt he comes to another situation where they are likely to draft a young QB plus he will not be cheap. I also don't think the Saints will allow him to walk after trading a 3rd round pick for him.
I doubt Miami will go to a 5th year with him and he has been banged up. But he is talented and has had some good games. Could give us the big wideout we have been seeking on a fraction of the price.
I doubt Miami will go to a 5th year with him and he has been banged up. But he is talented and has had some good games. Could give us the big wideout we have been seeking on a fraction of the price.
My buddy is a huge Dolphins fan and he said there is no chance that they are picking up the option on Parker. I like the idea of kicking the tires on players like this. He could thrive in a new scheme where the focus will be on Beckham, Barkley, Engram, and Shepard.
Your intelligence always goes unnoticed because of your beauty.
C - IDK IOL
RT - 2nd round like David Edwards of Wisconsin?
ILB - see what's out there
FS - see what's out there
That was easy!
I can't imagine Edwards makes it out of the top 20.
Restructure or dump OV. See how the rest of the season plays out for him but I dont see him being here beyond this season.
Continue to rebuild the OL. We only have Hernandez right now. Solder has maybe a year left but he has not been good and so far not worth the investment.
We have to look for a QB or let Tanney and Lauletta battle it out. As stated above, we can not make the playoffs and have Elis $22 million to play with. We should have drafted Darnold this season and bit the bullet or traded the pick for more picks. Now we have a great RB and it did not improve the team. But I guess he is fun to watch while we lose.
Do not resign Collins, he had his one great year but has been average at best. He is going to want top $$ and we cant affrd to pay average players top $$. Unless he improves I think we should let him walk. We should resign Sterling Shepard instead, we cant keep both.
Sign pass rushers Multiple pass rushers.
We have to draft BPA or stockpile picks. This team needs too much. We traded a pick for a punter which is silly for a bad team.
Out with old players. Signing Stewart now looks like a joke. Solder was over the hill and is playing like he is on the decline. Eli is not getting better with age. Its time for the rebuild and not sell the fanbase on how we can win now.
Yup.
This got a laugh out of me.
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but he'll be here in 2019.
Yup.
Of course he will be -- that's clearly been the plan all along. And that should be alarming.
If there isn't a QB rated high enough for the top pick then I go OL next. Then DE.
I think Eli is a lock to return as well but this thread is about what we would do if we were the GM. I would love to grab Herbert and keep Eli. They will be able to sign an OL like Donovan Smith or Ja'Wuan James if they wanted. If they let go of Vernon then they could also afford another top FA like Markus Golden.
Everyone says the 2019 QB class is weak, but honestly I think Herbert looks better than every one of the 4 guys drafted in the top 10 in the 2018 draft, or at the very least he looks/seems like more of a sure thing than the new "Big 4" were coming out. I would absolutely pull the trigger on him and be willing to give up our 2020 first rounder to get him if need be.
If there isn't a QB rated high enough for the top pick then I go OL next. Then DE.
bradshaw44,
The DL/OL class is stronger than the QB class. However, if the *right* QB is there, I don't think you can pass on him, even if you have an otherworldly (i.e. higher rated) pass rusher like Bosa available. Some may disagree and prefer we take the BPA in the trenches, but I'm not sure we can afford to pass up anopportunity get our guy at QB.
If the once again don't like any of the QBs, sure go ahead and draft Bosa, try to ride with Eli or a cheaper more sensible option at QB for one more year, and then take one of the studs in the 2020 QB class. Gotta really like the QB if you're gonna take one, but if you do really like one then you HAVE TO take one.
JonC, In your opinion do you think the Giants will entertain taking a QB next year? I know it's early and things will certainly change but has any of the college QB's caught the FO eye's so far?
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Your intelligence always goes unnoticed because of your beauty.
:)
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JonC, In your opinion do you think the Giants will entertain taking a QB next year? I know it's early and things will certainly change but has any of the college QB's caught the FO eye's so far?
Jay, I think they will consider a QB if the grade and value are there at their pick. As others have said, early projections are strong on OL and DL, and an infusion is a wise investment if they're not sold on a QB.
Haven't heard anything yet, it's really early. I suspect Herbert will be well regarded.
Alas, this is what I fully expect. And further proof that Jints Central is more incompetent than ever.
Lastly, if this does happen, it will be more evidence, in my mind, that Mara is totally committed to finding any way possible to have Eli ride out on a white horse.
Because I can't imagine Shurmur, assuming Eli continues to trend in this fashion - unable to create points anymore on a week in week out basis, would come close to agreeing that Eli has anything left in the tank.
And Gettleman doesn't count - he's a fool. A real GM would resign if Eli is in the plans for 2019.
What a f-ckin catastrophe...
maybe I'm giving them too much of the benefit of the doubt
We will not draft a QB in 2019
Eli will be the starter
When things go back, Lauletta gets his chance.
Drafting a QB early means Lauletta becomes a wasted pick. DG wont have that. That effect of not taking Darnold will be felt into 2020.
If this team wins 3 or 4 games and the offense continues to sputter, how could they justify keeping him?
We will not draft a QB in 2019
Eli will be the starter
When things go back, Lauletta gets his chance.
Drafting a QB early means Lauletta becomes a wasted pick. DG wont have that. That effect of not taking Darnold will be felt into 2020.
This is a good point. I'd be surprised if they blew up the Lauletta pick by taking another QB. It's happened a few times recently elsewhere (Buffalo taking Allen after Peterman, Cleveland taking Mayfield after Kizer are two that quickly come to mind), but with Eli still in the mix it would surprise me.
I'm fine if Eli's here next year even if this season continues to go poorly. But I'll be upset if there's not a plan in place.
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Barring injury or complete embarrassment.
We will not draft a QB in 2019
Eli will be the starter
When things go back, Lauletta gets his chance.
Drafting a QB early means Lauletta becomes a wasted pick. DG wont have that. That effect of not taking Darnold will be felt into 2020.
This is a good point. I'd be surprised if they blew up the Lauletta pick by taking another QB. It's happened a few times recently elsewhere (Buffalo taking Allen after Peterman, Cleveland taking Mayfield after Kizer are two that quickly come to mind), but with Eli still in the mix it would surprise me.
KL could become the backup and the pick would be justified.
I'm fine if Eli's here next year even if this season continues to go poorly. But I'll be upset if there's not a plan in place.
This GM and coach just cut a 3rd round QB who never played a snap.
I would hope that was out of conviction and not spite, and a 4th round pick would suffer the same.
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Lauletta was a fourth round pick, that's not a sunk cost that will prevent the Giants from investing a first round pick in a QB.
I'm fine if Eli's here next year even if this season continues to go poorly. But I'll be upset if there's not a plan in place.
This GM and coach just cut a 3rd round QB who never played a snap.
I would hope that was out of conviction and not spite, and a 4th round pick would suffer the same.
I would agree with this but Dg didnt draft Webb. GMs tend to hold onto their draft picks as long as possible. Think of the years we held onto guys like Adrian robinson, Beckum, Hosley, Jerrigan for absolutely no reason.
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In comment 14104969 BrettNYG10 said:
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Lauletta was a fourth round pick, that's not a sunk cost that will prevent the Giants from investing a first round pick in a QB.
I'm fine if Eli's here next year even if this season continues to go poorly. But I'll be upset if there's not a plan in place.
This GM and coach just cut a 3rd round QB who never played a snap.
I would hope that was out of conviction and not spite, and a 4th round pick would suffer the same.
I would agree with this but Dg didnt draft Webb. GMs tend to hold onto their draft picks as long as possible. Think of the years we held onto guys like Adrian robinson, Beckum, Hosley, Jerrigan for absolutely no reason.
Thats a data point on 1 GM. You have other examples like Pete Carrol / seattle GM who are quick to cut draft picks
I'm fine if Eli's here next year even if this season continues to go poorly. But I'll be upset if there's not a plan in place.
We learned this last season when some were convinced the Giants would pass on a QB just because of Webb's presence. They passed on a QB because they felt Barkley was the BPA not because of Webb. I expect these same people to suggest that the Giants will once again pass on a QB because of Lauletta. The truth is that Lauletta is a project and more than likely will be a backup in the NFL. I really like Lauletta but his presence on the roster would have no bearing on whether or not I would take Herbert or another QB in the draft.
As mentioned this is a very talented draft for OT's plus there are a couple of young outstanding OT's in free agency. If the Giants do not address RT in free agency they still could get a solid one on day 2.
KL could become the backup and the pick would be justified.
Agreed, some will disagree with that but if you get a cheap backup QB for four years that is well worth a 4th round pick.
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In comment 14104862 JonC said:
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.
JonC, In your opinion do you think the Giants will entertain taking a QB next year? I know it's early and things will certainly change but has any of the college QB's caught the FO eye's so far?
Jay, I think they will consider a QB if the grade and value are there at their pick. As others have said, early projections are strong on OL and DL, and an infusion is a wise investment if they're not sold on a QB.
Haven't heard anything yet, it's really early. I suspect Herbert will be well regarded.
Thanks JonC, I think Herbert would be the most likely target of the Giants. It would be fun to watch Shurmur develop a QB with his talent.
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Lauletta was a fourth round pick, that's not a sunk cost that will prevent the Giants from investing a first round pick in a QB.
I'm fine if Eli's here next year even if this season continues to go poorly. But I'll be upset if there's not a plan in place.
We learned this last season when some were convinced the Giants would pass on a QB just because of Webb's presence. They passed on a QB because they felt Barkley was the BPA not because of Webb. I expect these same people to suggest that the Giants will once again pass on a QB because of Lauletta. The truth is that Lauletta is a project and more than likely will be a backup in the NFL. I really like Lauletta but his presence on the roster would have no bearing on whether or not I would take Herbert or another QB in the draft.
As mentioned this is a very talented draft for OT's plus there are a couple of young outstanding OT's in free agency. If the Giants do not address RT in free agency they still could get a solid one on day 2.
Yeah, I certainly never bought that argument. I won't buy it this off-season, either.
ron mexico : 1:24 pm : link : reply
Eli was a sunk cost for 2018. There was no benefit in parting ways so might as well give him another shot.
maybe I'm giving them too much of the benefit of the doubt
Exactly: Eli's contract for 2018 has the Giants locked in. 2019 is not quite so bad, but Jon C isn't often wrong, so we should expect Eli back in 2019, perhaps even if we draft QB in round 1. If so, Eli will end up 2019 on the bench, in my opinion, unless he finds the fountain of youth before then (which likely will require a better O-lne).
The year still has to play out, but if Eli continues his current rate of play we couldn't get a 20th round pick if the draft had 20 rounds.
To think it would happen because of DG's (and Mara's) view that Eli still has enough to offer is simply gross negligence.
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in the top 7 I go with the QB. First round talent is a strong grade and if you have a QB graded as high as any of those other positions you take the QB especially since ours is on the way out.
If there isn't a QB rated high enough for the top pick then I go OL next. Then DE.
bradshaw44,
The DL/OL class is stronger than the QB class. However, if the *right* QB is there, I don't think you can pass on him, even if you have an otherworldly (i.e. higher rated) pass rusher like Bosa available. Some may disagree and prefer we take the BPA in the trenches, but I'm not sure we can afford to pass up anopportunity get our guy at QB.
If the once again don't like any of the QBs, sure go ahead and draft Bosa, try to ride with Eli or a cheaper more sensible option at QB for one more year, and then take one of the studs in the 2020 QB class. Gotta really like the QB if you're gonna take one, but if you do really like one then you HAVE TO take one.
LOT, I'm saying if all the positions are graded even or close, you take the QB. We definitely need the next guy under center. If we have the first shot at a QB and any of them are graded in the top 5 of ALL players this season, you take him. Unless LT or someone of that caliber is in the draft.
If they miss out on that keystone OT, you can still upgrade OC or OG in a big way in round 2. They need guys who can give Barkley some chances to do his thing. Barkley’s talents are nearly wasted. Teams still playing 2 deep on us and limiting impact of Odell and no answers thus far. They should have kept Fluker. Despite his flaws, he was the best run blocker this team has had in years. Unleash Barkley and a running game, and he doesn’t need a lot, and the equations change dramatically.
Now if that guy is not there, you don’t force it. Improve the talent around Eli and he will play better. If they are picking in the top 10, they need to come away with an elite talent. You would love for it to be at QB, OLine, or pass rusher, but you can’t pass up on elite talent if it’s there.
Let’s not make the same mistake with Lauletta like so many did with Webb. A 4th round pick is a developmental pick, as of now, Lauletta hasn’t won the backup job in a time where a ton of rookies came into the league hitting the ground running. It’s very possible Lauletta is a career backup who is an expert on the system and can come in at a moments notice, that’s what developmental QB’s tend to be.
Lastly, while we are all frustrated, let’s not forget what this is all the result of - winning 2 Super Bowls with the QB reaching the end. One of the most beloved, significant players in franchise history. It’s not unusual for sentimentality to get in the way, in fact I’d say it’s pretty common among franchises facing this issue, just look at the Lakers with Kobe Bryant for example. There is a reason Belichick is an all time great, he’s cold, unloyal. The Giants decided to stick with Eli after the majority of fans acted ridiculous last year. The mob got its way. So the can got kicked down the road. It happens.
If the Giants have a shitty year, Eli isn’t coming back. As DG said when pressed on Eli’s play during the Saquon draft presser, “we are going to find out.”
Do yourself a favor and read NoGainDayne's long post on analytics, the Giants front office, the Eagles, and other thoughts. Excellent read.
Link - ( New Window )
If I am GM, I am...
1. Going to plug holes in the OL via free agency. (I have no idea who is available)
2. Drafting a QB with our first pick if there is one that I like. I dont care if Lauletta is there Dep. It would not have been a wasted pick if he ends up being a solid backup.
3. Finding another pass rusher because we cannot continue to pay Vernon to sit in the ice tub every year.
4. Finding a free safety.
Really? According to JonC, above, it's almost a certainty Eli will be back in 2019. So if that, plus the last 5-6 years, doesn't lead you to conclude ineptitude is in the air, then you have your head in the sand.
Out of curiosity, how is it not ineptitude to bring back a 76 year old former GM, Accorsi, to lead a fake widespread GM search, who then hires his old friend, 67 year old Dave Gettleman? And if Gettleman was such a hot commodity how many other GM offers did he receive?
Mara was humiliated last year with the Eli fiasco. As embarrassed as he's ever been. He's all in on Eli and finding a way to make him go out on a high note.
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after the 2nd, that’s hard. Real hard & it has showed over the last few years.
Do yourself a favor and read NoGainDayne's long post on analytics, the Giants front office, the Eagles, and other thoughts. Excellent read. Link - ( New Window )
Thanks for pointing that out. Very troubling, but not shocking. The fact that ownership still swears by the George Young structure is just stupid. It’s 2018.
I made a thread just before the SB asking why the Eagles are so successful in terms of sustained success since 2000.
I don’t think the Giants are inept as some say, but I do think they are stuck in the 80’s. The GM interviews headed by Accorsi say it all:
Marc Ross- Reese right hand man
Abrams- worked under Reese
Gettleman- worked under Reese
Riddick- outside candidate
Any poster who questions the direction at the top is 1000% reasonable. It’s fair to have higher expectations than a catch lightning in a bottle SB run.
Maybe it’ll take another bottom out season, but I would like to see a young HC coupled with a young GM to work in a cohesive manner together similar to a Shanahan-Lynch dynamic. I don’t want to pass the torch from Gettleman to Abrams when the job isn’t earned (see hiring an OC off a losing staff to be HC).
Lastly though, I do think Mara wants to win. Badly. But, he needs to leave his bubble. Fresh ideas are needed.
DG/Shurmur represent hanging onto Eli in my opinion. The hires were geared towards winning with Eli. So, if Eli does prove to be shot here & the season is a disaster, the best thing for this franchise is to start over.
New GM/HC tandem & draft the next QB. That’s the foundation, then build from there. As far as I’m concerned, it’s completely reasonable for this to occur in 2019 if this season continues as is.
I agree. It was ridiculous. So concerned about a streak in a season where we only won 3 games. It scared Mara who even said "we did not expect the fans to get this emotional over the decision". That in itself was a backhanded way to say the fans are stupid. In this instance, he was right but now he is making decisions to keep his customers happy because apparently it is more important for a huge portion of the fan base to see Eli behind center than to actually win games.
None of us saw Geno in practice. He probably busted his ass off & was a good soldier. In a lost season why doesn’t he deserve a start? Still a relatively young 2nd round QB - completely harmless to give him a start.
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Wasthe epitome of stupid and the backlash was well deserved. Geno Smith has always and will always suck. Sitting a team legend for a journeyman backup or a guy not on any active roster in his 2nd year is the definition of ineptitude.
None of us saw Geno in practice. He probably busted his ass off & was a good soldier. In a lost season why doesn’t he deserve a start? Still a relatively young 2nd round QB - completely harmless to give him a start.
Ok then why not bench anyone else? If people don’t realize that Ben and Reese tried to make Eli the scapegoat for their ineptness, then they never will.
If we were starting someone to succeed Eli or was being groomed too, the backlash would be a lot less. But instead we started a f’n scrub who played exactly like one. To be honest with you, there was NO justification for Geno even being on the roster. Webb should have been the backup a long time ago and got a lot more reps in and then if mcadoo wanted to see what he had, fine.
And I saw what Geno did in the preseason. He was lucky he made the team.
But Geno Smith? Let’s knock it off with that nonsense. He was is and always will be a terrible player.
- Redo Vernon's contract
- Sign Landon Collins
- Get Earl Thomas or another free agent for the secondary
- Draft pretty much nothing but O and D lineman in the next draft.
Problem is, the team hasn't become clear minded in the wake of that decision. They've miscalculated how close they are to being able to compete, what they have in their QB, and what the fans want to see. The pendulum is swinging from one terrible decision to another on the opposite spectrum.
Regarding Eli in 2019, a lot could change over the next 12 games. But, even though it feels like the sand is running out on Eli's time here, I don't think they cut him loose unless they somehow get really fortunate at the position next offseason.
I agree. It was ridiculous. So concerned about a streak in a season where we only won 3 games. It scared Mara who even said "we did not expect the fans to get this emotional over the decision". That in itself was a backhanded way to say the fans are stupid. In this instance, he was right but now he is making decisions to keep his customers happy because apparently it is more important for a huge portion of the fan base to see Eli behind center than to actually win games.
I have no issue with the backlash some fans created when Eli got benched. Fans get emotionally invested and get attached to players. It’s part of the territory.
The real problem - the major problem - is that Mara kowtowed to it and it’s impacted team strategy. While Mara is ultra sensitive to the fan base - saw the mutiny of fans in ‘78 - don’t think for a second he’s not genuinely all in on Eli.
I think he’s desperate to have Eli walk off into the sunset like Elway did with Denver. And he’s driving and making decisions wth that as the goal. It’s a horrendous and irresponsible way to run a team. And if JonC is right, that Eli will be back in 2019, then that just cements it for me that we have the wrong owner for this team.
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I agree. It was ridiculous. So concerned about a streak in a season where we only won 3 games. It scared Mara who even said "we did not expect the fans to get this emotional over the decision". That in itself was a backhanded way to say the fans are stupid. In this instance, he was right but now he is making decisions to keep his customers happy because apparently it is more important for a huge portion of the fan base to see Eli behind center than to actually win games.
I have no issue with the backlash some fans created when Eli got benched. Fans get emotionally invested and get attached to players. It’s part of the territory.
The real problem - the major problem - is that Mara kowtowed to it and it’s impacted team strategy. While Mara is ultra sensitive to the fan base - saw the mutiny of fans in ‘78 - don’t think for a second he’s not genuinely all in on Eli.
I think he’s desperate to have Eli walk off into the sunset like Elway did with Denver. And he’s driving and making decisions wth that as the goal. It’s a horrendous and irresponsible way to run a team. And if JonC is right, that Eli will be back in 2019, then that just cements it for me that we have the wrong owner for this team.
There was absolutely no strategy when the Eli benching occurred. There was no strategy on what to do going forward into 2018. You had 2 imbeciles pissing in the wind trying to make miracles happen.
There are still some who believe that the benching was an FU to the organization by two guys knowing they were getting fired at the end of the year.
Regarding Eli in 2019, a lot could change over the next 12 games. But, even though it feels like the sand is running out on Eli's time here, I don't think they cut him loose unless they somehow get really fortunate at the position next offseason.
so you think it its more than likely that Eli gets his 5mm roster bonus even if this level of play / o production continues the rest of the season?
There's a lot that has to take place in order for them to finally move on from Eli, imv.
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Correct across the board.
Regarding Eli in 2019, a lot could change over the next 12 games. But, even though it feels like the sand is running out on Eli's time here, I don't think they cut him loose unless they somehow get really fortunate at the position next offseason.
so you think it its more than likely that Eli gets his 5mm roster bonus even if this level of play / o production continues the rest of the season?
Unless he really shows his age, I think they keep Eli one more year and hopefully they have a 1st rd QB in the draft to sit behind Eli and learn. With a good line, Eli can win. I expect the line to be greatly improved by next season.
2. FS
3. Edge Rusher
4. OLINE!!!
5. LB
6. OLINE
7. OOOOOOOLINE
2. FS
3. Edge Rusher
4. OLINE!!!
5. LB
6. OLINE
7. OOOOOOOLINE
We don’t have a 3rd or 7th.
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1. OLine
2. FS
3. Edge Rusher
4. OLINE!!!
5. LB
6. OLINE
7. OOOOOOOLINE
We don’t have a 3rd or 7th.
We don't have a third, but we do have a seventh from the Brett Jones trade, I believe
But basically liquidating assets to upgrade the OL wasn't going to yield much better returns.
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In comment 14105918 dep026 said:
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Wasthe epitome of stupid and the backlash was well deserved. Geno Smith has always and will always suck. Sitting a team legend for a journeyman backup or a guy not on any active roster in his 2nd year is the definition of ineptitude.
None of us saw Geno in practice. He probably busted his ass off & was a good soldier. In a lost season why doesn’t he deserve a start? Still a relatively young 2nd round QB - completely harmless to give him a start.
Ok then why not bench anyone else? If people don’t realize that Ben and Reese tried to make Eli the scapegoat for their ineptness, then they never will.
If we were starting someone to succeed Eli or was being groomed too, the backlash would be a lot less. But instead we started a f’n scrub who played exactly like one. To be honest with you, there was NO justification for Geno even being on the roster. Webb should have been the backup a long time ago and got a lot more reps in and then if mcadoo wanted to see what he had, fine.
And I saw what Geno did in the preseason. He was lucky he made the team.
But Geno Smith? Let’s knock it off with that nonsense. He was is and always will be a terrible player.
This is stupid, and why the team is as directionless as it is.
When the decision was made to put someone else in at QB - a decision which started with having Eli start the games and then get pulled - Manning balked, and a huge drama ensued.
At that point in the season, losses were more valuable than wins. The decision to bench Manning wasn't some career saving effort by McAdoo and Reese, it was an attempt to see what else they had on the roster. And whatever complaints you could have about those two - the decision made perfect sense.
But because Giants fans have to be as embarrassing as possible, huge fan backlash ensued. Manning was not innocent in that either, he could have helped the team out there, but opted not to.
Coughlin deserved to go, as did Reese and McAdoo. And now it's pretty clear it's Eli's time as well.
Yeah, not buying it.
Yeah, not buying it.
Yeah - because defensively they were already going through the suspension craze and guys were seeing the bench, and the OL was already awful enough that putting other players in would only make matters worse.
Plus - there was enough evidence to support that the QB was part of the problem - so why the hell not try something else? The season was a goner.
They even went so far as to ask him, and let him continue his streak. Eli decided to take the martyr route.
So if you think it was McAdoo/Reese just trying to save their jobs, it's every bit as reasonable to believe Eli's only objection was out of fear that he would be proven responsible for the problems on offense.
Agenda noted. Carry on.
Agenda noted. Carry on.
Yeah, that's what Eli was trying to do - he wasn't trying to buy sympathy, he was deliberately trying to get Geno Smith onto the field for the whole game. You know, because he felt for ole Geno.
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By allowing the guy mcadoo wanted to play the entire game and let him try to succeed as much as possible? By being a good teammate?
Agenda noted. Carry on.
Yeah, that's what Eli was trying to do - he wasn't trying to buy sympathy, he was deliberately trying to get Geno Smith onto the field for the whole game. You know, because he felt for ole Geno.
So by telling McAdoo to start Geno the whole game, he was trying in essence to have Geno not play and for Eli himself to start the whole game - even though he McAdoo that Geno should play the whole game and wound up playing the whole game?
Am I getting this mystery right now?
The fact is in NO TIME in NFL History has a QB came out on planned to start the 2nd half, irregardless of how he was playing. Why? Because thats not how things work. Eli told McAdoo that if he wanted to see Geno that Geno deserved the whole game because thats whats fair to him. Thats being a good teammate.
Its downright comical how Giants "fans" will take any situation and turn it against Eli. Eli sticking up for a teammate is now Eli being selfish. I have heard it all now.
There was absolutely no strategy when the Eli benching occurred. There was no strategy on what to do going forward into 2018. You had 2 imbeciles pissing in the wind trying to make miracles happen.
There are still some who believe that the benching was an FU to the organization by two guys knowing they were getting fired at the end of the year.
I don't buy the mutiny theory by McAdoo and Reese at all. I actually think McAdoo was ahead of the curve at Jints Central and saw Eli had reached this point of diminishing returns.
The 2018 season wasn't a disaster because of McAdoo. It was a disaster driven by two reasons - (1) an inordinate amount of injuries and (2) Reese's inability to supply the team with talent short or long term.
I do think there was a strategy to taking Eli away from the huddle - let's see if we can win with either of the other two QBs and/or what we have in the stable under live fire.
Yours is to make sure nobody ever assigns any blame, whatsoever, to Eli Manning. No interception has ever been his fault, no fumble, no loss. He's the football equivalent of Jesus Christ, just more clean cut than the ole Savior.
One thing is for sure - we blame everyone around here, but the one constant through it all has been Eli. And plenty of teams have offenses playing more capably than ours with a lot less talent. At some point, the QB is accountable for the mess as well.
If the Ginats had cut ties with Geno in week 5 when we were 0-5. Made Webb the backup, and then tried him the last 3-4 games - the backlash would be MUCH MUCH less. There would have been criticism of course, but at lesat you can see a plan.
There was NOT a single plan that meant Geno for the future. None, nil, nada.
Yours is to make sure nobody ever assigns any blame, whatsoever, to Eli Manning. No interception has ever been his fault, no fumble, no loss. He's the football equivalent of Jesus Christ, just more clean cut than the ole Savior.
Just a stupid post being that I wanted to draft darnold this whole offseason and said this should be Eli's last season.
I am sorry I made your example and opinion of last years situation look dumb, so I'll refrain from doing so again.
But you need to start getting personal and making attacks on me that have NOTHING to do with the topic at hand.
BBH deserves posters like you.
Its like being in elementary school when someone says somethign to a kid they dont understand and they respond - I know you are but what am I....
Nowhere in this thread did I say a word about Eli's game playing ability. None. But you bring it up as if it is a constant. I was talking about Ben McAdoo and his plan for the future and you are bringing up Eli as a martyr for christ sakes.
Grow up buddy. Since you have selective reading tendencies. I have been stating all year this should be Eli's last year aand its time to move on.
So when you say something that is wrong or stupid - you should come back with something different than... "Its never Eli's fault."
Its old, its boring, and its wrong.
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immediately
No. This is the reason why we have been terrible.
Aging, high priced safety who is coming off major injury is not the process to believe in.
No, they have to sign Collins first, how much do want
to pay two safeties. I wouldn't be surprised if Thomas
winds up with the Cowpokes, he has hinted to them in somewhat of a jest. He is also a Texas native...
Why shouldn't have it been 2016 or 2017...solely the cap hit?
Why shouldn't have it been 2016 or 2017...solely the cap hit?
2014-2015 - whether people want to agree or not - Eli was pretty damn good.
Now 2016 he took a step back but the team did better. I mean we were 11-5 and he did play well against GB in the playoffs = did you think it was time for a new QB then?
So he becomes the starter last year and the team had a year to forget. He would have been a big hit on the cap if cut. So again, I think he deserved this year to start, draft Darnold - and once this year went to shit, you could have groomed Darnold as early this year.
Unfortunately, it didnt go that way.
Why shouldn't have it been 2016 or 2017...solely the cap hit?
He had a good year in 2015. There was no reason to believe that would stop in 2016.
'16-17 should have been enough for someone to figure one of two things - that either Eli was done, or that he needed significantly different personnel around him to be productive. Regardless of that decision, by 17 someone should have been planning an exit strategy.
In 17 nothing went right, offense, defense, kicking punting, nothing. Even the fucking equipment guys shit the bed.
I can see how we got to where we are now.
In 2016 he had two skilled players that played football in 2017. And while 26 and 16 aren’t great numbers, they weren’t disastrous.
Changing QBs after a playoff season is not always the smartest thing.
Changing QBs after a playoff season is not always the smartest thing.
This jarred my memory back to 2000 when the Ravens won the SB and then cut Dilfer. Made the playoffs the following year.
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But the signs were showing in 2016 so there was clear risk gong into 2017. Just saying this doesn’t match the “better a year early versus a year late”.
In 2016 he had two skilled players that played football in 2017. And while 26 and 16 aren’t great numbers, they weren’t disastrous.
Changing QBs after a playoff season is not always the smartest thing.
Don’t follow the first statement?
Regarding the second statement, Eli wasn’t the key contributor to the playoffs in 2016. It was overwhelmingly the defense, OBJ and winning close games. Eli was a neutral factor at best. So don’t put emphasis where it is not warranted...
If the Ginats had cut ties with Geno in week 5 when we were 0-5. Made Webb the backup, and then tried him the last 3-4 games - the backlash would be MUCH MUCH less. There would have been criticism of course, but at lesat you can see a plan.
There was NOT a single plan that meant Geno for the future. None, nil, nada.
Mcadoo felt he needed to know one way or another if his design was hampered by Manning. He wasn't looking for a succession plan, he was looking to take stock of the state of the team.
Webb was not ready. If his practices resembled this pre-season that was probably very clear.
Smith was the 2nd QB and when the whole thing blew up, was the only guy 1) willing to start and 2) actually even part of installation of the game plan.
They're even now in that category, but could gain a 4th according to this excerpt:
"New York Giants: They are currently even with five CFAs each lost and gained. Of the five they gained, Michael Thomas and Cody Latimer could be the most vulnerable to being cut for comp pick reasons. It will not be cheap to cut either: Thomas was guaranteed $1.5 million, and almost all of Latimer’s $2.5 million was guaranteed. But if they cut one of the two before Week 10, it would open up a 4th rounder for one of Weston Richburg or Justin Pugh, and if they cut both it would open up an additional 5th or 6th for Devon Kennard. (Cutting Latimer would also end any scant hope the Broncos have to continue their comp pick streak.)"
2019 Compensatory Draft Picks Update (5/8/2018) Posted on May 8, 2018 by Nick - ( New Window )
-Draft QB at 5
-Draft Best Available prospect in Round 2 within those needs
-Draft Best Available prospect in Round 4 within those needs
Look to sign a starting player via Free Agency. Not a high end guy, just a dependable player that fills any of those needs.
I agree with you about Eli, his play is not even close to what his contract takes from the team, time to clean house and send Eli to ESPN...