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NFT: 10/9 Knicks Chat: The tank rolls on

LawrenceTaylor56 : 10/9/2018 7:36 am
I know there's not a lot faith around here this year for the Knicks. But for those who may have been excited at a 3-0 start, last night should temper your expectations. After turning off the Yankee game I watched almost all of the game. Couple notes:

-We missed Kanter, who right now is our best player on this team. Let that one sink in.

-We still don't have a true PG. I'm not really a fan of this positionless basketball that Fiz is trying to employ. I'll be patient though.

Frank Ntilikina: Got his first start last night. Looked good and attacked last night. Hit a couple open jumpers. Unneccessary fouls in the third though while almost fouling out. Finished with 10 points/4 rebounds/2 assists

Kevin Knox: Welcome to the NBA. Easily his worst game as a Knick. He looked lost and lacked confidence. He's only 19, but he needs to come off the bench to start the season. Let Mario get the start. Which leads me to my next point.

Mario Hezonja: Sucks. He's careless with the ball. Is atrocious on defense. His offense is neither glorious or deplorable. Unimpressed so far with his tenure as a Knick.

Allonzo Trier: Another night where he shined. 18 points/2 assists/4 rebounds. Seems to be a great find so far. The kid can score and create his own shot.

Luke Kornet: Has size. That's about it. Easily could be cut.

Moving forward we have one preseason game left. Who is our starting PG? As mentioned above, no one is standing out. Every PG we have on our roster has one thing but not another. You can pretty much pencil in Lance Thomas-Kanter as our starting front court. Yikes.



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I  
DanMetroMan : 10/9/2018 9:27 am : link
was told the Knicks checked in on Monk again this off-season. What is going on with that guy? Hornets seemed to sour on him almost instantly and he tried checking into a game without a jersey on? lol. With Trier looking solid I doubt the Knicks would bother with such a move but I'll never knock looking at recent lotto picks.
Supposedly Mills wanted Monk  
bceagle05 : 10/9/2018 9:34 am : link
but Phil wanted Frank. Maybe Mills wants the last laugh on that one? We certainly need shooting.
for a similar style player (on paper)  
Pep22 : 10/9/2018 9:36 am : link
Trier > Monk

and he looks far better than solid to me
Now if somehow we can clear enough CAP  
Carl in CT : 10/9/2018 9:41 am : link
For two max players and have a top 5 pick, we are in business.
Monk  
DanMetroMan : 10/9/2018 9:41 am : link
is the superior athlete which means the upside is likely "higher" but the Hornets likely aren't dumping him for nada so it was probably a kick the tires situation. No downside to check in "hey I hear you are down on Monk, future 2nd or 2 for him?". You don't know unless you ask.
I  
DanMetroMan : 10/9/2018 9:42 am : link
don't think it's a coincidence they brought in Vonleh and Mario. Players bust all the time but low-mid 20's former lotto pick players fates aren't sealed.
I truly think that  
GMEN46 : 10/9/2018 9:51 am : link
The Knicks signed all of these 1 year contracts with the hope that between Mudiay, Mario, Vonleh and Burke that one guy will be a hit and they can use them with Lee or hardaway or Noah to get rid of there contracts. Smart strategy now we just need one to play wel
Anyone else  
mattyblue : 10/9/2018 9:53 am : link
concerned about how KP will recover? I get 90% of my Knicks info from you guys, especially DanMetroMan. I really haven’t watched my basketball the last few years so I am asking not stating an opinion. KP has such an awkward looking build I worry how he will recover from the ACL. Am I just being paranoid?
RE: Anyone else  
DanMetroMan : 10/9/2018 10:00 am : link
In comment 14115373 mattyblue said:
Quote:
concerned about how KP will recover? I get 90% of my Knicks info from you guys, especially DanMetroMan. I really haven’t watched my basketball the last few years so I am asking not stating an opinion. KP has such an awkward looking build I worry how he will recover from the ACL. Am I just being paranoid?


You're not being paranoid in the sense both the Knicks and KP have acknowledged it's different for a 7'3 player. However, ACL surgery has really come a long way and for the most part you rarely hear players have their careers severely impacted nowadays. Shocking to say... but I actually trust the Knicks on this one. IF KP doesn't come back 100% then yeah the Knicks will not be good for a long, long time.
Yes - Matty Blue  
GiantsUA : 10/9/2018 10:04 am : link
I am afraid that KP's body will not hold up to the grind of the NBA.


Thanks guys.  
mattyblue : 10/9/2018 10:07 am : link
When he is on he is awesome, so hopefully he comes back better than ever. He is very easy to cheer for
RE: The Knicks rebuild could be years.  
gmenatlarge : 10/9/2018 10:08 am : link
In comment 14115291 LawrenceTaylor56 said:
Quote:
The only way to jumpstart that is to somehow land KD.


That's hilarious, here's a guy who left OKC so he could join a CHAMPIONSHIP team, and now he's going to come to the Knicks who are about as far from a champ as you can get! Not in our lifetimes.
RE: Yes - Matty Blue  
gmenatlarge : 10/9/2018 10:10 am : link
In comment 14115403 GiantsUA said:
Quote:
I am afraid that KP's body will not hold up to the grind of the NBA.



+1 he also has already suffered a foot injury which is the plague of all big men, besides the ACL.
RE: RE: Yes - Matty Blue  
nygiants16 : 10/9/2018 10:12 am : link
In comment 14115412 gmenatlarge said:
Quote:
In comment 14115403 GiantsUA said:


Quote:


I am afraid that KP's body will not hold up to the grind of the NBA.





+1 he also has already suffered a foot injury which is the plague of all big men, besides the ACL.


never had a foot injury
RE: RE: The Knicks rebuild could be years.  
nygiants16 : 10/9/2018 10:14 am : link
In comment 14115411 gmenatlarge said:
Quote:
In comment 14115291 LawrenceTaylor56 said:


Quote:


The only way to jumpstart that is to somehow land KD.



That's hilarious, here's a guy who left OKC so he could join a CHAMPIONSHIP team, and now he's going to come to the Knicks who are about as far from a champ as you can get! Not in our lifetimes.


this is not something made up by knicks fans
Definitely concerned about KP  
bceagle05 : 10/9/2018 10:15 am : link
but most star NBA players have long injury histories - it's a grueling sport. I don't think he's more vulnerable than anyone else - Wade and Rose were smaller guys who had severe knee injuries. Philly has to hold its breath with Embiid, too - just part of the game.
RE: Definitely concerned about KP  
mattyblue : 10/9/2018 10:46 am : link
In comment 14115419 bceagle05 said:
Quote:
but most star NBA players have long injury histories - it's a grueling sport. I don't think he's more vulnerable than anyone else - Wade and Rose were smaller guys who had severe knee injuries. Philly has to hold its breath with Embiid, too - just part of the game.


That’s a very good point
The Knicks are a very young team  
blueblood : 10/9/2018 10:54 am : link
without their best player. They wont have to tank. All they will have to do is play..
RE: RE: Knox  
djm : 10/9/2018 11:51 am : link
In comment 14115204 LawrenceTaylor56 said:
Quote:
In comment 14115200 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


is starting.



He shouldn't.


Why shouldn’t he start? There’s no valid answer...
The Knicks  
Jon in NYC : 10/9/2018 11:54 am : link
should be losing games.

The only priority is develop the youth. Play Knox until his legs fall off.
RE: The Knicks  
Anakim : 10/9/2018 11:55 am : link
In comment 14115687 Jon in NYC said:
Quote:
should be losing games.

The only priority is develop the youth. Play Knox until his legs fall off.


Given the Giants and the Rangers, I want the Knicks to win. They're my only hope.
Frank and Knox should both start.  
bceagle05 : 10/9/2018 11:57 am : link
None of the guys competing for playing time at their positions have distinguished themselves.
Play Knox with Trier so these very young men  
idiotsavant : 10/9/2018 12:15 pm : link
Teens basically, won't loose confidence (Knox) if the other appears better (trier) but, rather, both have fun dishing.

Trier 1
Knox 2
Nili 3
??
Kantor?

Win or loose get da yoots going.
RE: Definitely concerned about KP  
TyreeHelmet : 10/9/2018 12:16 pm : link
In comment 14115419 bceagle05 said:
Quote:
but most star NBA players have long injury histories - it's a grueling sport. I don't think he's more vulnerable than anyone else - Wade and Rose were smaller guys who had severe knee injuries. Philly has to hold its breath with Embiid, too - just part of the game.


This is spot on and a counter argument I wish I heard more when this gets brought up with KP. Davis, Curry, Westbrook, Durant, Embiid, Simmons, Butler, Leonard all have “injury histories”. NBA season is brutal and basketball is a rough sport.

With that said, I want KP to essentially take the year off. Maybe bring him back at the end of the season for a few games but might not even do that.
I  
DanMetroMan : 10/9/2018 12:29 pm : link
don't see any scenario where the Knicks are significantly better than what we think. Kanter is the only above average starter they have and the rookies and even "key" pieces are mostly below average or likely to be so in 2019.
The idea that Knox should come off the bench  
NoGainDayne : 10/9/2018 12:46 pm : link
is insane. We aren't trying to win games we are trying to develop talent.

This isn't baseball where you don't want to send your stars out too fast because it is such a mental game. There are very few examples if any of players with amazing talent flaming out by playing too early.

By all accounts the best thing to do is throw young players in the fire, especially ones like Knox who seem to have no problem with confidence.

I can't think of a worse case scenario than playing a lineup without starting Knox and winning a few more games than we otherwise would while also giving Knox less burn against the best players. Fiz has even said he wants him playing defense against the best players in the league. Harder to do that from the bench.
RE: RE: RE: Knox  
LawrenceTaylor56 : 10/9/2018 12:46 pm : link
In comment 14115678 djm said:
Quote:


Why shouldn’t he start? There’s no valid answer...


I think the first month he should be brought off the bench. I know I'm probably in the minority, but he's 19 and he looked completely lost out there. I know we were all impressed with his display at the Summer League games.

Again, it's just my opinion. But I think he should be introduced into the starting lineup a little bit after the season starts. Don't wanna ruin this kids confidence.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Knox  
LawrenceTaylor56 : 10/9/2018 12:51 pm : link
In comment 14115796 LawrenceTaylor56 said:
Quote:
In comment 14115678 djm said:


Quote:




Why shouldn’t he start? There’s no valid answer...



I think the first month he should be brought off the bench. I know I'm probably in the minority, but he's 19 and he looked completely lost out there. I know we were all impressed with his display at the Summer League games.

Again, it's just my opinion. But I think he should be introduced into the starting lineup a little bit after the season starts. Don't wanna ruin this kids confidence.


I shouldn't say lost. But after he missed his first few shots he became invisible. He seemed to have lost confidence. He refuses to go to his left, and his body language after he missed the open layup a few minutes. I just don't think he's ready to be thrown to the wolves.
This  
DanMetroMan : 10/9/2018 12:51 pm : link
was the first game where he he looked "lost" and he admitted he had some garden jitters. Is he suddenly going to be ruined by struggling initially? Like most rookies do? I really think fans overrate "starters" anyway. Minutes played is all that matters in terms of development.
Mudiay didn't get any burn until the 4th quarter  
LawrenceTaylor56 : 10/9/2018 12:53 pm : link
might be an indication that Fizdale has him falling down the pecking order of playing time.
I'm more concerned with him playing a bulk of his minutes  
bceagle05 : 10/9/2018 12:57 pm : link
with Frank, as opposed to Burke. If Knox is out there with Burke and Timmy, he's a spectator like the rest of us.
DMM - minutes played, I agree.  
GiantsUA : 10/9/2018 12:57 pm : link
Many of the players on the Knicks seem interchangeable in regards to talent.

Knox should get some serious minutes this year whether he starts or not.
RE: RE: The Knicks  
Jon in NYC : 10/9/2018 12:58 pm : link
In comment 14115695 Anakim said:
Quote:
In comment 14115687 Jon in NYC said:


Quote:


should be losing games.

The only priority is develop the youth. Play Knox until his legs fall off.



Given the Giants and the Rangers, I want the Knicks to win. They're my only hope.


It sucks, but all three teams stink and should be losing games right now. Hopefully success is on the horizon for all 3. I think the Knicks actually have the clearest path.
The Knicks literally have the greatest fans in the world  
arniefez : 10/9/2018 12:59 pm : link
Well maybe tied with Cleveland Browns fans. I don't know how you guys do it. Maybe it's the ignorance and exuberance of youth. The Knicks have one good player and he's hurt, he gets hurt a lot and he will require a huge contract before he can prove he's not always hurt. The owner is on the short list for worst owner in sports history and no matter who he changes around him the historic losing just keeps on coming. If you think that somehow changes history tells us you're wrong.
Chris Bosh says he'd be open to signing with us.  
bceagle05 : 10/9/2018 1:03 pm : link
Hey, we could use a little depth in the front court!
MASSIVE  
DanMetroMan : 10/9/2018 1:05 pm : link
pass on Bosh. 35 soon, absolutely zero upside. Take minutes from Knox and Mitch? no thanks.
RE: MASSIVE  
nygiants16 : 10/9/2018 1:09 pm : link
In comment 14115841 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
pass on Bosh. 35 soon, absolutely zero upside. Take minutes from Knox and Mitch? no thanks.


if it was just as a mentor role in the locker room where he plays 10 to 15 minutes a night i am good with it...

i wouldnt mind kp learning a few things from bosh
RE: Chris Bosh says he'd be open to signing with us.  
nygiants16 : 10/9/2018 1:09 pm : link
In comment 14115838 bceagle05 said:
Quote:
Hey, we could use a little depth in the front court!


he also said he expects 1 or 2 max guys to sign with knicks
Miles Bridges  
DanMetroMan : 10/9/2018 1:20 pm : link
apparently has looked awesome. Fingers crossed this isn't Mitchell/Frank 2.0 lol
I was being facetious about Bosh, but I'm glad he's feeling better.  
bceagle05 : 10/9/2018 1:24 pm : link
As for Bridges, he looked great in the little I've watched of him in preseason. Gilgeous-Alexander is gonna be really good, too. Draft classes have been loaded lately.
I  
DanMetroMan : 10/9/2018 1:55 pm : link
want Zion Williamson!!!
RE: I  
LawrenceTaylor56 : 10/9/2018 1:59 pm : link
In comment 14115930 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
want Zion Williamson!!!


Second that
..  
DanMetroMan : 10/9/2018 2:02 pm : link
Unless a trade opportunity suddenly emerges for the center, the Knicks will waive Noah before the regular-season roster needs to be set on Oct. 15, sources told the Daily News.

The Knicks have been shopping Noah but are declining to attach valuable assets to shed the two years and $38 million remaining on his contract. By waiting until the roster deadline, the Knicks are hoping against odds that an injury or something else creates a stronger trade market.
Link - ( New Window )
.  
DanMetroMan : 10/9/2018 2:10 pm : link
Justise Winslow said he believes he is “getting close” to an agreement on a contract extension by Monday’s NBA deadline…

“There’s been talks. We’re getting close,” Winslow said… “I think it should get done.”

One guy not near a deal is the Wizards’ Kelly Oubre, reports Chase Hughes at NBC Sports Washington.

However, it does not appear likely a deal between the two sides will get done, according to multiple people familiar with the situation…

When it comes to the Wizards and Oubre, whom they picked 15th overall in 2015, both sides have reason to wait. The Wizards have substantial money committed long-term to other players, so they can use the flexibility, and Oubre knows he can raise his stock significantly with a big year.
Is  
DanMetroMan : 10/9/2018 2:20 pm : link
Larry Nance Jr. underrated or do the metrics overrate him thanks to his minutes?
RE: Is  
nygiants16 : 10/9/2018 2:30 pm : link
In comment 14115981 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
Larry Nance Jr. underrated or do the metrics overrate him thanks to his minutes?


I dont think he is very good, he is a hustle, rebounder and can jump out of the gym...

henis a good bench big
RE: ..  
Pep22 : 10/9/2018 3:41 pm : link
In comment 14115951 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
Unless a trade opportunity suddenly emerges for the center, the Knicks will waive Noah before the regular-season roster needs to be set on Oct. 15, sources told the Daily News.

The Knicks have been shopping Noah but are declining to attach valuable assets to shed the two years and $38 million remaining on his contract. By waiting until the roster deadline, the Knicks are hoping against odds that an injury or something else creates a stronger trade market. Link - ( New Window )


Unclear what he will give back. Deng gave back $7mm. I wouldn't let him go for a penny less.
RE: ..  
TyreeHelmet : 10/9/2018 3:51 pm : link
In comment 14115951 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
Unless a trade opportunity suddenly emerges for the center, the Knicks will waive Noah before the regular-season roster needs to be set on Oct. 15, sources told the Daily News.

The Knicks have been shopping Noah but are declining to attach valuable assets to shed the two years and $38 million remaining on his contract. By waiting until the roster deadline, the Knicks are hoping against odds that an injury or something else creates a stronger trade market. Link - ( New Window )


I’d love to hear those “trade talks”. Unless the Knicks are taking back a worse contract ( which they aren’t many if any), they’ll have to attach some serious sweeteners for anyone to touch him.

I’d hold out and make him give back more than Deng. Does that 15th spot really matter for the Knicks? I want every useful dollar for cap space next year.
Lotta dumbasses on this team  
ghost718 : 10/9/2018 3:58 pm : link
It's worth saying twice
I'd  
DanMetroMan : 10/9/2018 4:01 pm : link
argue professional sports are littered with dummies but in the NBA they are more up close and personal. Less players, closer to the action, interviews during the game etc etc.
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