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5 Weeks in ó How Do You Feel about Drafting Saquon Barkley?

KyleY : 10/10/2018 2:50 pm
This is not meant to be a leading question. I'm genuinely curious.

With the benefit of a little hindsight, if we could draft again, who would you use that #2 pick on?
Barkley  
giants#1 : 10/10/2018 2:52 pm : link
He looks special, and the available QBs haven't impressed*.


*obviously a long way to go
There is no doubt in my mind that he is a special player.  
Keith : 10/10/2018 2:52 pm : link
Guys like him don't come around too often.

Knowing what we know now, I'd call Cle about trading up to #1 and taking Mayfield. I'd be fine taking Darnold at #2 and I'd be fine dropping back a few picks and taking Rosen/Allen.

In conclusion, I don't feel any better about our QB situation now.
The QB's haven't impressed?  
Keith : 10/10/2018 2:52 pm : link
I beg to differ.
FAN  
GmeninPSL : 10/10/2018 2:54 pm : link
TASTIC!!!!!!!!
He's fantastic and it was absolutely the right pick  
RobCarpenter : 10/10/2018 2:54 pm : link
He's everything I expected from watching him at Penn State. His agility, balance, and explosiveness are awesome.

Now if the OL could keep people off of him when he gets a handoff, who knows what he could accomplish.
the only one that has kind of impressed me is baker  
GMAN4LIFE : 10/10/2018 2:56 pm : link
other than that, anyone would be fucked behind this line. then we would be here saying its a bust pick.
Right now? LOVE IT.  
x meadowlander : 10/10/2018 2:59 pm : link
Time will tell if it was the correct move.

I still can't believe the Browns passed on him. One of the top QB's would've still been there in the 5 spot.
he'll look way better when they draft  
Giantsfan79 : 10/10/2018 2:59 pm : link
Jonah Williams with their 1st round pick.
I wanted Darnold  
Jay on the Island : 10/10/2018 3:01 pm : link
but Barkley has won me over. I am hoping the Giants get Justin Herbert in the draft next season and come away with Ja'Wuan James in free agency for RT. They could then draft a guard on day 2 to compete with Omameh for the starting job and Barkley will become the best back in football.
Love the player  
GiantNatty : 10/10/2018 3:02 pm : link
hate the pick.
Hope he has a long career here  
rocco8112 : 10/10/2018 3:02 pm : link
He looks very good. Hopefully before his prime is done the Giants will build an o line that is at least in the bottom third of the league instead of rock bottom.

Looks like a special player.
I feel fine.  
Britt in VA : 10/10/2018 3:03 pm : link
Happy even.
RE: Barkley  
widmerseyebrow : 10/10/2018 3:04 pm : link
In comment 14117821 giants#1 said:
Quote:
He looks special, and the available QBs haven't impressed*.


*obviously a long way to go


Agreed.

Allen looks like a guy destined for many sacks, low completion percentages, turnovers, and eventual injury.

The other two haven't jumped off the screen in any meaningful way. They have plenty of football ahead of them, but I don't see anything that distinguishes them from the next two crops of high first round quarterbacks.
To me its more clear..  
Simpleman in Tx : 10/10/2018 3:04 pm : link
now that it was the best choice. I wanted Barkley but also Mayfield. I would've hated the Giants if I saw SB lighting up the stat boards and highlight reels every week while we have a rookie qb sitting on the bench behind Eli. You dont pass on generational talent at a key postion.
He looks like a really talented player  
Go Terps : 10/10/2018 3:05 pm : link
Lots to like. But I think it was the wrong pick.

By the time we're ready to compete who the hell knows what kind of player he'll be after the wear and tear.

Drafting him, paying Beckham, and moving forward with Eli were signs of a front office incapable of making on honest and difficult assessment of where this team actually is.
We'll be just fine  
JonC : 10/10/2018 3:07 pm : link
with SB and Herbert.
Pick still looks good to me.  
TMS : 10/10/2018 3:11 pm : link
ELi and SB have both been held back by our awful OL plus confusion and play calling on offense. We will get it together soon I am hoping. Anyone expecting a quick start with this many new faces and rebuilding changes was kidding themselves. We could easily be 3/2 now with a few more plays by the offense. MO
I LOVE the player  
Scyber : 10/10/2018 3:12 pm : link
But I still think the value of a RB at #2 is questionable. IMO getting a QB, OL, or DL at that spot provides a much better value.


Given that no QB could do better  
VinegarPeppers : 10/10/2018 3:12 pm : link
...behind this OL and that Barkley has only been hampered by it, I am happy with what ONLY a player like Saquon could get running behind it.

This OL might have created another David Carr out of any of those QBs.
Good player,  
Dave in Hoboken : 10/10/2018 3:14 pm : link
but all of the QB's already have flashed at least something in their first 5 games of their career with less than stellar supporting casts, as well. Definitely don't feel any better than last season about our current QB/offensive situation, either.
He's been the best player to watch  
B in ALB : 10/10/2018 3:18 pm : link
on the team so far. And he's probably right there in terms of talent with Beckham already.
RE: We'll be just fine  
lax counsel : 10/10/2018 3:20 pm : link
In comment 14117864 JonC said:
Quote:
with SB and Herbert.


Giants won't be the only team in on Herbert, if they even like him.
Nice player  
HomerJones45 : 10/10/2018 3:23 pm : link
probably could have gone 1-4 without him.
Still don't like the pick  
jcn56 : 10/10/2018 3:24 pm : link
He's shown promise, but I think people are still extending their hope into reality. He's flashed, and obviously the potential is there, but so far the offensive ineptitude overall has impacted Barkley as well and the production doesn't match his cost so far.

Meanwhile, who knows how long Eli has left, or how long it will take to rebuild the OL. Could easily waste the last year or two of Eli's career, the first year or two of SB's career, and the first couple of years of OBJ's big contract on a luxury that didn't resolve the offensive issues.
RE: RE: We'll be just fine  
JonC : 10/10/2018 3:24 pm : link
In comment 14117893 lax counsel said:
Quote:
In comment 14117864 JonC said:


Quote:


with SB and Herbert.



Giants won't be the only team in on Herbert, if they even like him.


We're looking good for the #1 overall pick.
Really like it.  
Beezer : 10/10/2018 3:24 pm : link
.
...  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 10/10/2018 3:25 pm : link
HOFer talent if healthy.
Barkley  
Steve in Greenwich : 10/10/2018 3:26 pm : link
is everything he was advertised as, but still would rather have gone Rosen/Darnold and even Denzel Ward (extreme hindsight on that one as he wasn't on the radar, but he has drastically made a difference on that Browns team more than anyone else). Right now we're living proof that pro bowl running backs can easily be wasted on bad teams.
Very, very excited...  
Chris684 : 10/10/2018 3:33 pm : link
Best player available in the whole draft.

We got him at #2.
Thrilled,  
Big Blue '56 : 10/10/2018 3:36 pm : link
but only 5 games. Not even a small sample size
God wanted the Giants to be 1-4.  
Dave in Hoboken : 10/10/2018 3:39 pm : link
.
Love it...  
JCin332 : 10/10/2018 3:39 pm : link
Use next off season to upgrade OL and things are looking up...
Too soon  
Thegratefulhead : 10/10/2018 3:44 pm : link
I did not like Darnold, still do not. I liked Mayfield and Rosen. Mayfield was gone. If we were going to draft a QB at 2, it would have likely been Darnold, so if you force me to choose right this moment, I am happy. If you told me we could have traded down for extra picks, that would have been my choice. If we could have gotten Rosen, Michel and Hernandez, sign me up for that.
Wait till he  
Fish : 10/10/2018 3:45 pm : link
Starts really seeing the holes. If you look at previous games he has missed a few. Awesome pick for us!
The only QB  
mdthedream : 10/10/2018 3:48 pm : link
I liked was Mayfield and he was gone. I also was afraid of his off field issues so that said I was and still am very happy. Who know Kyle might be better than the rest of the Qbs taken in the first round.
Who knew  
Chris684 : 10/10/2018 3:49 pm : link
Gettleman ruffled so many feathers with his throw away "touched by the hand of God" comment.

Meanwhile, Dave in Hoboken has trouble keeping it in his pants when he watches Sam Darnold play.

The irony.
RE: Very, very excited...  
jcn56 : 10/10/2018 3:50 pm : link
In comment 14117911 Chris684 said:
Quote:
Best player available in the whole draft.

We got him at #2.


Based on what they've both done so far, do you believe Barkley's better than Mayfield?

And I realize we had no shot at Mayfield, but you did say best...
BPA with high picks all the time  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 10/10/2018 3:50 pm : link
Exceptional players are rare, can't limit your chance to acquire them narrowing your search to need. There's several "ordinary" QB prospects every year, and nowadays QB hell is less of a worry.
I didnít want him  
WillVAB : 10/10/2018 3:52 pm : link
But Iím happy with the pick. Exceptional player, very exciting to watch.
perfectly fine  
blueblood : 10/10/2018 3:53 pm : link
Barkley was the consensus best player in the draft on pretty much everyone's lips. He has talent at his position that hasnt been seen in while. He is a weapon that can take it to the house on any given play.

Fix the OL. Give him some running lanes.

no problem with the pick.
Same as I felt in April  
Anakim : 10/10/2018 3:54 pm : link
Wanted him then, happy with him now.


Saquon yesterday, Saquon today, and Saquon tomorrow
RE: Who knew  
blueblood : 10/10/2018 3:54 pm : link
In comment 14117936 Chris684 said:
Quote:
Gettleman ruffled so many feathers with his throw away "touched by the hand of God" comment.

Meanwhile, Dave in Hoboken has trouble keeping it in his pants when he watches Sam Darnold play.

The irony.


people make such a big deal about that comment..

all he said was that he has rare God given talent..

period..
He's a fantastic player  
BigBlueDownTheShore : 10/10/2018 3:55 pm : link
always was going to be one.

I just don't know when we will have a real good team around him.
My overwhelming preference was QB at #2...  
M.S. : 10/10/2018 3:55 pm : link

...but Saquon Barkley is even better than advertised!

He's the greatest show on two wheels, and he's driving behind one fucked up offensive line.

He is also mature and full of wisdom beyond his years, and if we are very, very lucky, which I doubt, some of his character will some how, some way rub off on our resident, semi-nut job OBJ.
RE: BPA with high picks all the time  
Keith : 10/10/2018 3:57 pm : link
In comment 14117941 Coach Red Beaulieu said:
Quote:
Exceptional players are rare, can't limit your chance to acquire them narrowing your search to need. There's several "ordinary" QB prospects every year, and nowadays QB hell is less of a worry.


Hypothetical. We have the #1 pick next year. The clear cut best player is a WR and he's an elite talent. Do you take him? BPA
RE: RE: BPA with high picks all the time  
Big Blue '56 : 10/10/2018 4:08 pm : link
In comment 14117958 Keith said:
Quote:
In comment 14117941 Coach Red Beaulieu said:


Quote:


Exceptional players are rare, can't limit your chance to acquire them narrowing your search to need. There's several "ordinary" QB prospects every year, and nowadays QB hell is less of a worry.



Hypothetical. We have the #1 pick next year. The clear cut best player is a WR and he's an elite talent. Do you take him? BPA


Unless there is a franchise player there at another position, sure, I eould
would  
Big Blue '56 : 10/10/2018 4:08 pm : link
.
56  
Keith : 10/10/2018 4:09 pm : link
are you going off of hte assumption that OBJ will be our new QB?
like I did right before and after the draft...  
Dan in the Springs : 10/10/2018 4:10 pm : link
hoping he fell to us before, because I thought he was an outstanding talent, and thrilled that the Giants took him, because I knew it meant tons of exhilarating moments for me as a Giants fan.

Nothing has changed.
Really good player...  
bw in dc : 10/10/2018 4:11 pm : link
as expected.

But a total luxury pick that we didn't have the luxury of using.

So, I still stand firm - a wasted pick based on current and future ROI value.
RE: RE: BPA with high picks all the time  
Boatie Warrant : 10/10/2018 4:11 pm : link
In comment 14117958 Keith said:
Quote:
In comment 14117941 Coach Red Beaulieu said:


Quote:


Exceptional players are rare, can't limit your chance to acquire them narrowing your search to need. There's several "ordinary" QB prospects every year, and nowadays QB hell is less of a worry.



Hypothetical. We have the #1 pick next year. The clear cut best player is a WR and he's an elite talent. Do you take him? BPA


If he is Megaton good I would. Then draft OL and LBers the rest of the draft
I should have added...  
Dan in the Springs : 10/10/2018 4:13 pm : link
I would have been okay if the Giants felt good enough about a QB to pass on him. I wouldn't have been okay if they'd passed on him because they felt we needed a QB and you have to take one when you have a chance.

That's exactly how we ended up with the guy cut yesterday.
So far of this draft, including the touch of god  
micky : 10/10/2018 4:15 pm : link
Mayfield has been the most impressive of all
Great pick, Hall of Fame talent none  
Stan in LA : 10/10/2018 4:24 pm : link
Of which any the the QB's have.
Let's see...  
Mr. Bungle : 10/10/2018 4:32 pm : link
He's on a trajectory for 1,800+ yards from scrimmage and 16 TDs on a bad team in his rookie season.

Hmmmm...how do I feel about drafting him?...Hmmm...
RE: Great pick, Hall of Fame talent none  
bceagle05 : 10/10/2018 4:36 pm : link
In comment 14117994 Stan in LA said:
Quote:
Of which any the the QB's have.

That hardly settles the argument, even if true. Some positions on a team are more important than others. Love watching Barkley play, but still would've chosen Darnold. Finding a suitable successor to Eli over the next year or two would relieve a lot of angst.
Pointing to his stats isn't telling the story  
Go Terps : 10/10/2018 4:40 pm : link
Yeah he extrapolates out to 1800 yards and 16 TDs. The team extrapolates out to 4-12/3-13.

Criticizing the pick isn't about the player. It's about roster construction and timing. That's been the argument those against the pick have been making since April.
It's a shame the Giants were only allowed to engage  
Mr. Bungle : 10/10/2018 4:42 pm : link
in roster construction during the offseason between 2017 and 2018. The roster is (apparently) cast in stone going forward.

It's also a shame there will never be an opportunity to get a young QB ever again.

Oh well.
Love the player  
Jesse B : 10/10/2018 4:51 pm : link
Depends what they do this off-season
RE: Pointing to his stats isn't telling the story  
Dave in Hoboken : 10/10/2018 4:51 pm : link
In comment 14118011 Go Terps said:
Quote:
Yeah he extrapolates out to 1800 yards and 16 TDs. The team extrapolates out to 4-12/3-13.

Criticizing the pick isn't about the player. It's about roster construction and timing. That's been the argument those against the pick have been making since April.


But all of those yards on THIS team!
If the Giants  
jtfuoco : 10/10/2018 4:52 pm : link
go up and get Justin Herbert next year then I will absolutely love the Barkley pick. You will at that point with some FA OL help have one of the most dangerous offenses in NFL short only to maybe KC or LA.
GLAD WE PICKED HIM  
MarineMan : 10/10/2018 4:54 pm : link
He was the pick I hoped for, and I am happy he is a New York Giant. He can make nothing into something most of the time.
RE: It's a shame the Giants were only allowed to engage  
Go Terps : 10/10/2018 4:56 pm : link
In comment 14118014 Mr. Bungle said:
Quote:
in roster construction during the offseason between 2017 and 2018. The roster is (apparently) cast in stone going forward.

It's also a shame there will never be an opportunity to get a young QB ever again.

Oh well.


The shame is that Barkley plays a position where the average career lasts 2.7 years. Let's play out what, to me, seems like the most realistic scenario for his career here leading up to his contract negotiation...

- Year 1 looks like it's going to be a losing season.
- Year 2 may not be all that different from year one considering we expect Eli and Shurmur back, and we also have massive needs on OL, DL, LB, and secondary.
- Year 3 we may be starting with a new QB. At present there is no plan for this QB. Even if Gettleman puts together a strong roster by this point there is a possibility that it is undercut by QB problems (I also wouldn't rule out Eli still being the QB at this point).
- Year 4, assuming he is still in peak form at the most attritional position on the field, may be a sweet spot year for Barkley's career intersecting with a quality roster around him
- Year 5 may be impacted by a contract negotiation. If the Giants have been a losing team during the previous 4 years whomever the GM is may be asking the question, "If we can lose with him why can't we lose without him?"

That's a realistic scenario assuming no injuries and a successful effort by Gettleman to reinfuse the roster with talent. History tells us though that there will be injuries and situations that impede Barkley's ability to be maximized. Shit, we're seeing that already. The offense has been mostly poor with him on it.
A monumentally stupid pick  
Jerry in DC : 10/10/2018 5:06 pm : link
Made by a monumentally ignorant old man demonstrating an extraordinary level of organizational ineptitude and zero understanding of roster construction, modern football, and basic concepts like positional value. An incredible opportunity squandered by a team destined to be anchored to the bottom of the league by the incapable morons in leadership positions who will count their money while the fans suffer through an extended period of misery until they lose interest.
RE: RE: Great pick, Hall of Fame talent none  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 10/10/2018 5:08 pm : link
In comment 14118006 bceagle05 said:
Quote:
In comment 14117994 Stan in LA said:


Quote:


Of which any the the QB's have.


That hardly settles the argument, even if true. Some positions on a team are more important than others. Love watching Barkley play, but still would've chosen Darnold. Finding a suitable successor to Eli over the next year or two would relieve a lot of angst.

Rather would take the surefire HoFer than the 1/3 chance franchise QB Eli/Rivers/Roethlisburger level. Wouldn't be too thrilled with a franchise Matt Ryan or Alex Smith QB either.
Barkley is the goods for certain  
Jimmy Googs : 10/10/2018 5:15 pm : link
but I guess we all knew that was going to be the case.

Look forward to continue to build a team around him...
This is how I think this will work out  
Jay on the Island : 10/10/2018 5:15 pm : link
The Giants come out of the 2019 NFL draft with QB Justin Herbert. Eli comes back for one more season. The Giants are in the playoff hunt and finish 9-7.

Eli plays one more season elsewhere, probably Jax or Denver, and the keys are turned over to Herbert who had a full season to learn from a HOF'er. Herbert's 2nd season mirrors Eli's where he plays well as Barkley is a finalist for the MVP award as the Giants finish 10-6. Will Hernandez makes his first pro bowl and is 2nd team all-pro.

BBI is a far more pleasant place while we enjoy years of Herbert, Barkley, Beckham, Shepard, and Engram.
Very happy  
mrvax : 10/10/2018 5:16 pm : link
with Barkley as the pick. We have Lauletta and ? for our next QB.
RE: Still don't like the pick  
BleedBlue : 10/10/2018 5:27 pm : link
In comment 14117899 jcn56 said:
Quote:
He's shown promise, but I think people are still extending their hope into reality. He's flashed, and obviously the potential is there, but so far the offensive ineptitude overall has impacted Barkley as well and the production doesn't match his cost so far.

Meanwhile, who knows how long Eli has left, or how long it will take to rebuild the OL. Could easily waste the last year or two of Eli's career, the first year or two of SB's career, and the first couple of years of OBJ's big contract on a luxury that didn't resolve the offensive issues.



he is 7th in the NFL in yards from scrimmage....how much more production do you want? lol

we arent 1-4 because of him...this team has a bunch of holes and deficiencies
My thoughts.,,  
EricJ : 10/10/2018 5:30 pm : link
We are just scratching the surface with him since our OL is so bad. If we can fix that then he can lead the league in rushing

He still needs to learn when to go between the tackles and when to give up on that and bounce it outside.

He should wind up being our best RB in team history if we don't fuck it up.

Let's not put him in the hall of fame yet please.
One would think that the Erek Flowers situation  
Bill L : 10/10/2018 5:38 pm : link
*this week* would be instructive of the dangers f passing on talent to force a position just because you simply have to have a guy at that position.

Roster construction takes a little time and you always get several bites of the apple. Best to pick talent when you can get it even if you have to wait for the next bite before you finish the Apple. Otherwise, all youíll eat is the worm.
Great stud RBs are rarer  
LauderdaleMatty : 10/10/2018 5:51 pm : link
Than franchise QBs. Yes. I said it. But that depends on what you consider a franchise QB.

Brady Brees and Rodgers are the best still.

Anyone who wants to claim there's a huge difference between those ranked 3-10 is spitting hairs. The rules in today's NFL make it so much easier to be a very good statistical QB. Nick Foles helped win the Super Bowl for God's sake.

I would have picked Mayfield if he was there but Barkley was hardly a. We choice. Great pick
RE: Great stud RBs are rarer  
Jimmy Googs : 10/10/2018 6:04 pm : link
In comment 14118089 LauderdaleMatty said:
Quote:
Than franchise QBs. Yes. I said it. But that depends on what you consider a franchise QB.



yeah, not so much since my view is they are the elite level.
Better...  
trueblueinpw : 10/10/2018 6:07 pm : link
Wanted Rosen and still think that was the right choice. But watching Barks, Iíve already said ďwowĒ more than a few times. Kid is worth the price of admission.
RE: A monumentally stupid pick  
Ed A. : 10/10/2018 6:08 pm : link
In comment 14118039 Jerry in DC said:
Quote:
Made by a monumentally ignorant old man demonstrating an extraordinary level of organizational ineptitude and zero understanding of roster construction, modern football, and basic concepts like positional value. An incredible opportunity squandered by a team destined to be anchored to the bottom of the league by the incapable morons in leadership positions who will count their money while the fans suffer through an extended period of misery until they lose interest.


Said by a true football expert who really should be a GM for a top notch team. You can rave on all you want. The true test will be in the next three years when we all will see who is right and who is nothing but a big blow hard. You really should apply for a position with a team that can use your superior expertise.
RE: RE: It's a shame the Giants were only allowed to engage  
USAF NYG Fan : 10/10/2018 6:10 pm : link
In comment 14118030 Go Terps said:
Quote:
The shame is that Barkley plays a position where the average career lasts 2.7 years.

Not trying to call out this poster as a lot of people keep pointing this out but that 2.7 years average for RBs is a terrible stat towards this situation. What really bothers me with that is it's an average which labels Barkley as average. Most of us are confident that Barkley will be well well above average. What's the average career length of AN ELITE RB? vs an average QB. As of now, Darnold, Rosen, Mayfield, etc have not shown anything more than average (which is normal as rookies). Hell, the average for a QB is 4.44 so are we really saying anything there?

There are 4 RBs in the HoF that started after 1990. Their career lengths average to 9.75 years. I'm not declaring Barkley a HoFer but this is far more likely to be his shelf life than 2.7 years. If any of the QBs turn out to be at least great (not just good) then you may have a mild argument.
The QBs llook good  
KWALL2 : 10/10/2018 6:18 pm : link
But heís an elite player already.

How many offensive players are better right now? Not many. He makes plays others canít. If he had help it would be record breaking already. Get him some blocking and keep developing the pass game with him and heís an MVP in 2 years.

He was billed as a no risk HR. And thatís what we have.
...  
christian : 10/10/2018 6:26 pm : link
Hopefully Gettleman dodged a bullet and he hasn't constructed a 7 or 8 win team.

The Giants look primed for a top 5 pick and will have another chance to choose one of the better QBs in a draft.

Bad teams should collect talent while they evolve. The Rams, Jags and Eagles are all contemporary examples of this working.

Barkley isn't going to turn into a pumpkin, he'll still be here if the Giants get a QB next April.

Extract the emotion -- the reality is Beckham, Engram and Barkley will all be under contract for years 1-3 of a QB selected next year. Barkley and Beckham will be under contract years 1-4.

This is a much better outlook than when Manning was selected and he won a ring in year 4.
He made my offseason by giving me hope  
WillieYoung : 10/10/2018 6:31 pm : link
Reality has now set in and the Jets have their quarterback for the next 15 years and we're back to Danny Kannell and Kent Graham.
RE: RE: Still don't like the pick  
jcn56 : 10/10/2018 6:32 pm : link
In comment 14118069 BleedBlue said:
Quote:
In comment 14117899 jcn56 said:


Quote:


He's shown promise, but I think people are still extending their hope into reality. He's flashed, and obviously the potential is there, but so far the offensive ineptitude overall has impacted Barkley as well and the production doesn't match his cost so far.

Meanwhile, who knows how long Eli has left, or how long it will take to rebuild the OL. Could easily waste the last year or two of Eli's career, the first year or two of SB's career, and the first couple of years of OBJ's big contract on a luxury that didn't resolve the offensive issues.




he is 7th in the NFL in yards from scrimmage....how much more production do you want? lol

we arent 1-4 because of him...this team has a bunch of holes and deficiencies


How many touches does he have compared to other RBs? Forget the yards from scrimmage, which would be higher given the number of times he sees the ball. Look at YAC for receptions and YPC for rushes.

He might be great one day - but right now, he's decidedly good. And that's not worth the investment right now.

I don't mind people saying he has the potential, he's flashed, etc. But this sure fire HR, the returns we've already seen - where are they? What games have you guys been watching, because I've seen a 1-4 team with a RB who looks like he's got some talent but hasn't been able to do much. And we're talking about *production* now, not what he might do down the road.
ďLooks like he has some talentĒ?  
KWALL2 : 10/10/2018 6:57 pm : link
Wow. 🤨
RE: ďLooks like he has some talentĒ?  
jcn56 : 10/10/2018 6:59 pm : link
In comment 14118191 KWALL2 said:
Quote:
Wow. 🤨


Wow yourself - did I miss some production in there? Feel free to chime in.
hes the only reason  
UESBLUE : 10/10/2018 6:59 pm : link
i continue to watch this season. For now...
that being said  
UESBLUE : 10/10/2018 7:00 pm : link
how many SBs did Barry Sanders win again?
RE: The QBs llook good  
bw in dc : 10/10/2018 7:07 pm : link
In comment 14118115 KWALL2 said:
Quote:
But heís an elite player already.

How many offensive players are better right now? Not many. He makes plays others canít. If he had help it would be record breaking already. Get him some blocking and keep developing the pass game with him and heís an MVP in 2 years.

He was billed as a no risk HR. And thatís what we have.


At least 20.
Reading this thread  
UConn4523 : 10/10/2018 7:09 pm : link
**wet fart noise**
There are only better offensive players if you count  
jcn56 : 10/10/2018 7:11 pm : link
the plays they made. If you count the plays they could have been making, or would have made if the rest of the team didn't stink, then SB leads the league.

Again - promising player, lots of potential - but his production to date doesn't match where some of you are putting him. It might someday, but not right now.
RE: that being said  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 10/10/2018 7:13 pm : link
In comment 14118196 UESBLUE said:
Quote:
how many SBs did Barry Sanders win again?

As many as Dan Marino.
My 20 for starters...  
bw in dc : 10/10/2018 7:14 pm : link
Rodgers, Brady, Wilson, Roeth, OBJ, LBell, Gurley, AB, Gronk, Wentz, Mahomes, Gordon, Rivers, Brees, Kamara, Jones, Newton, Elliott, Hunt, AJ Greene.

Want more?
Barkley was the safe pick.  
baadbill : 10/10/2018 7:14 pm : link
But this story wonít be written until Manning is gone and his successor is in place. If the Giants successfully draft a great QB in 2019 or 2020 then having Barkley + a great replacement for Manning will make DG look like a genius.
RE: A monumentally stupid pick  
BigK : 10/10/2018 7:17 pm : link
In comment 14118039 Jerry in DC said:
Quote:
Made by a monumentally ignorant old man demonstrating an extraordinary level of organizational ineptitude and zero understanding of roster construction, modern football, and basic concepts like positional value. An incredible opportunity squandered by a team destined to be anchored to the bottom of the league by the incapable morons in leadership positions who will count their money while the fans suffer through an extended period of misery until they lose interest.

Sarcasm or stupidity?
And a big reason why RBs last  
UConn4523 : 10/10/2018 7:19 pm : link
2.7 years is because a ton of them get drafted and a ton of them suck. Itís not all about injuries.

I bet the reverse is true with QBs if I even cared to look it up. Most of them have nice long careers being journeyman backups.

This shelf life thing is a tired and fruitless argument. Teams are investing in RB again, so I guess every team hat does that somehow doesnít know the average RB shelf life?
RE: Barkley was the safe pick.  
jcn56 : 10/10/2018 7:26 pm : link
In comment 14118217 baadbill said:
Quote:
But this story wonít be written until Manning is gone and his successor is in place. If the Giants successfully draft a great QB in 2019 or 2020 then having Barkley + a great replacement for Manning will make DG look like a genius.


This is true - but it requires us to do a whole lot of losing this year, and for a QB to end up worthy of that pick.

We had a much bigger field this year, and decided there wasn't one worthy of 2nd overall. The odds aren't in our favor.
For a draft pick they hit a home run  
mdc1 : 10/10/2018 7:30 pm : link
however, we will soon find out that the QB position is more important over the long term and sometimes it takes several auditions and QBs to arrive at a more permanent solution. This pick likely sent us into another 5 years of average middling football with Eli fading right in front of us. The next guy we see after Eli will likely shock us all with respect to the levels of incompetency of this ownership.

Yeah I don't get the people mentioning Herbert  
Go Terps : 10/10/2018 7:34 pm : link
He still has a bunch of football to play at Oregon, and it's not a sure thing he'll even leave school. And I'll essentially repeat what jcn just said...we had a QB-rich draft just occur and we took none with the second pick. Why should we assume that in a lesser QB draft we'll have a shot at an equal QB prospect with likely a lower pick than #2?

The strong odds are that the top 2 QBs on our depth chart in 2019 are Eli Manning and Kyle Lauletta. That's the route we chose when we picked Barkley.
I love..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 10/10/2018 7:35 pm : link
the way people dig in.

Barkley has "some talent" and Darnold is the Jets QB for 15 years.

Fucking madness.
And for the people saying simply that Barkley was the best prospect  
Go Terps : 10/10/2018 7:45 pm : link
That wasn't the consensus (at least on this board and many draft sites) before the draft. He was absolutely in the top group, but the discussion revolved around him being one of several (6-7) blue chips at the top of the draft.

And I don't believe his being "the most talented prospect" was the only consideration. I've asked this question in the past and I'll ask it again:

If Eli Manning had retired after the 2017 season who would the Giants have drafted?

I'd bet my mortgage they'd have drafted Darnold.
RE: I love..  
Go Terps : 10/10/2018 7:47 pm : link
In comment 14118245 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
the way people dig in.

Barkley has "some talent" and Darnold is the Jets QB for 15 years.

Fucking madness.


And there are people calling Barkley a Hall of Famer.
RE: I love..  
jcn56 : 10/10/2018 7:47 pm : link
In comment 14118245 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
the way people dig in.

Barkley has "some talent" and Darnold is the Jets QB for 15 years.

Fucking madness.


I'm the one who said it's obvious he's got some talent. Now, when you can find the other half of what you're claiming I said, I'll own it. I didn't, so we might be here awhile.

In the meanwhile, stop making up shit to make a point.
I love having great players on the giants  
djm : 10/10/2018 7:52 pm : link
So I love the pick. Donít over think it.
I..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 10/10/2018 7:52 pm : link
said "people" so cool it there, Chief:

Quote:
In the meanwhile, stop making up shit to make a point.


This was the other post I was talking about:
Quote:
He made my offseason by giving me hope
WillieYoung : 6:31 pm : link : reply
Reality has now set in and the Jets have their quarterback for the next 15 years and we're back to Danny Kannell and Kent Graham.


Maybe if you stopped bitching about everything the team does, you'd have understood what the fuck I was referring to.

Jesus, you are on another thread acting like we are just now hearing that flowers is a bad apple.

Lets play Barkley (projected) or Faulk rookie season  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 10/10/2018 7:53 pm : link
314 RA, 1282 yds, 4.1 ypc, 11 TD, 52 Rec, 522 yds, 10 ypc, 1 TD

285 RA, 1173 yds, 4.1 ypc, 10.2 td, 60 rec, 415 yds, 6.9 ypc, 7.2 td
It is what it is and I see no good reason to frett about it.  
wgenesis123 : 10/10/2018 7:56 pm : link
I like him, what's not to like about him?
Love the pick  
montanagiant : 10/10/2018 7:58 pm : link
He's a stud
A this..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 10/10/2018 7:59 pm : link
is a moronic take too:

Quote:
And there are people calling Barkley a Hall of Famer.


He is what he is right now - a dynamic player that certainly appears to be a playmaker and worthy of a high draft pick.
Hunt?  
KWALL2 : 10/10/2018 8:00 pm : link
Not in the same league. Not close.

You fail.

Gordon isnít better either.
Right now, SB is a good player on a bad team  
jcn56 : 10/10/2018 8:10 pm : link
He's not a great player. Not yet, and maybe not ever.

Not what anyone wants to hear - but the production that would have to accompany calling him great just isn't there. And while I'm willing to cut him slack because of the overall offensive woes, that doesn't mean we can just pretend he's guaranteed greatness.
LBell?  
KWALL2 : 10/10/2018 8:12 pm : link
No again. Barkley is better now than Bell last year. And Bell isnít playing now. When he comes back heís on the cliff.

Iíd take him over Kamara (who is one of the best players the league). Everything you see Kamara do? Barkley can do with much more power, quickness, and speed. Everything. Put Barkley on the Saints for Kamara and thatís a better team.

No production? Who said that? Heís had a 100 yards every game and they still arenít using him enough in the pass game and he has an awful OL. Heís on pace for 100 catches , close to 2000 yards from scrimmage, and 15 TDS.

They start using isolating him more like the Saints do with Kamara and he,ll hit 2000 yards in year 1. And thatís a bottom of the heap OL and a fading QB.
.??..?..Barkley projected?  
KWALL2 : 10/10/2018 8:19 pm : link
Quote:
314 RA, 1282 yds, 4.1 ypc, 11 TD, 52 Rec, 522 yds, 10 ypc, 1 TD

285 RA, 1173 yds, 4.1 ypc, 10.2 td, 60 rec, 415 yds, 6.9 ypc, 7.2 td


You got the wrong Barkley.

Our guy is on pace for almost 100/catches. Close to 2000 from scrimmage. And 16 TDs.
RE: Hunt?  
bw in dc : 10/10/2018 8:21 pm : link
In comment 14118297 KWALL2 said:
Quote:
Not in the same league. Not close.

You fail.

Gordon isnít better either.


Hunt had 1,300+ yards as a rookie and nearly 5 ypc. 53 catches and 11 TDs. And he's off and running again this year.

I see your point - that's "not close"...




Not About numbers  
KWALL2 : 10/10/2018 8:25 pm : link
Nobody considers Hunt in the same league. Heís a good player. But limited.

Heís not close.

Kamara is close in many ways. Hunt isnít close in any way. Barkley is in another league.
RE: And for the people saying simply that Barkley was the best prospect  
Sean : 10/10/2018 8:30 pm : link
In comment 14118264 Go Terps said:
Quote:
That wasn't the consensus (at least on this board and many draft sites) before the draft. He was absolutely in the top group, but the discussion revolved around him being one of several (6-7) blue chips at the top of the draft.

And I don't believe his being "the most talented prospect" was the only consideration. I've asked this question in the past and I'll ask it again:

If Eli Manning had retired after the 2017 season who would the Giants have drafted?

I'd bet my mortgage they'd have drafted Darnold.


But, Eli didnít retire. Everyone in the room liked Saquon enough, coupled with the fan outcry over the Eli benching. If Eli retired, the pick would have easily been QB.

Michael Lombardi during todayís Ringer podcast talks about the toughest thing to do is manage a declining great player. The destination may end up being correct if NYG is in a position to draft Herbert. You may not like how they arrived to it, but it would be hard to argue.
KWALL and bw  
Joey in VA : 10/10/2018 8:36 pm : link
You guys are arguing different things IMO. Talent and ability wise, Barkley has no peer athletically, none, not even Odell. With all that ability he's still not elevating the team the way a great QB can. His effectiveness is stunted by middling QB play, terrible OL play and sub par receiving so far. He can affect a game and he will more as we go along and we keep feeding him.

bw believes RBs are fungible and should be sought later, he's not letting that go. KWALL believes that Barkley is the best gifted athlete of all those mentioned and I happen to agree but that's not what wins all the time. Just my take, it's two different arguments but the arguers are on opposite sides of the debate and always will be no matter what happens. Welcome to Giants discussions, where no ones mind ever changes but we beat others over the head in hopes to do so.
RE: Hunt?  
Jerry in DC : 10/10/2018 8:41 pm : link
In comment 14118297 KWALL2 said:
Quote:
Not in the same league. Not close.

You fail.

Gordon isnít better either.


That's the whole point though. Hunt isnt that good an RB? I buy it. Hes a good, solid RB. I wouldn't pay him more than a few million a year if he were an FA. But he puts up big numbers in a productive offense. And before him, Spencer ware put up big numbers in a productive offense.

Gordon? Same deal for me. Good player, wouldn't pay him more than a few million. Puts up big numbers in a productive offense. And when he's not on the field? Austin Ekeler puts up big numbers in a productive offense.

The RB position is low value, highly dependent, and massively fungible. Far more so than any other position. Investing major resources in a RB is a low ROI move for those reasons. We all know this - it's been the case for a long time. Unfortunately our extremely dumb GM thinks football is the same as it was in 1935 and we have to suffer the consequences of his ignorance.
My point is simple  
KWALL2 : 10/10/2018 8:41 pm : link
Heís already an elite player.

About the position and long term draft value? Weíll see. The position does decline faster than any other and gets impacted by dings and hits more than others (See Bell)

So he may be finished sooner and the long term draft value may be better for some other players (Rosen), Who knows at this point.

But the guy playing right now? Not many better than that guy certainly not Hunt or Gordon. Or AJ Green.

He makes any team much better including that shit show we have going on right now.
They came away  
LakeGeorgeGiant : 10/10/2018 8:43 pm : link
with a dynamic playmaker, I don't see how that can be considered a failure in any respect.

At this (very early)point I'm still more convinced of Barkley's worth than I am any of the QBs that were available.
RE: I love..  
Mr. Bungle : 10/10/2018 8:49 pm : link
In comment 14118245 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
the way people dig in.

Barkley has "some talent" and Darnold is the Jets QB for 15 years.

Fucking madness.

Darnold has shown next to nothing so far in the "franchise QB" department.

But the Jets clearly found their guy.
RE: Not About numbers  
bw in dc : 10/10/2018 8:49 pm : link
In comment 14118325 KWALL2 said:
Quote:
Nobody considers Hunt in the same league. Heís a good player. But limited.

Heís not close.

Kamara is close in many ways. Hunt isnít close in any way. Barkley is in another league.


I served up Hunt's production. That's who he is right now. If the style points are important to you, then I guess you are a big fan of figure skating.

Really, here's my problem - saying it's "not close." That is such a poor choice of words. At this level, the differences are not as great as you think.





RE: .??..?..Barkley projected?  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 10/10/2018 8:50 pm : link
In comment 14118321 KWALL2 said:
Quote:


Quote:


314 RA, 1282 yds, 4.1 ypc, 11 TD, 52 Rec, 522 yds, 10 ypc, 1 TD

285 RA, 1173 yds, 4.1 ypc, 10.2 td, 60 rec, 415 yds, 6.9 ypc, 7.2 td



You got the wrong Barkley.

Our guy is on pace for almost 100/catches. Close to 2000 from scrimmage. And 16 TDs.

Even better. Makes Faulk look like a chicken legged scrub. I was using some crap fantasy site "projection".
I am glad they took him ..!  
Bluesbreaker : 10/10/2018 8:53 pm : link
He is already doing things I have never seen a back do before . The leaping ability is crazy although he needs to pick his spots with that he is so competitive and wants to prove his worth . He will be no good to us damaging those wheels really my only concern . He has great hands but the thing that jumps out is the acceleration it's off the charts I don't know which team has the best O-line but imagine the yards he would rack up .
His first TD the 68 yard run pretty much said it all .
I think were in for many memorable games for him to come .
Bw  
KWALL2 : 10/10/2018 9:06 pm : link
Itís a very accurate choice of words

Put it this way. Open draft of all NFL players. Barkley goes in the elite tier . At the very top. Hunt does not.

Itís not close.

Barklwy makes an offense much tougher to defend. In the same situations, heíll do much more for you. And he makes the offense a much tough matchup.

You know whoís a good comp for Hunt? Connor in PIT. Thatís where he is. Connor cut weight this year and heís more explosive. Heís better as a receiving threat. But those guys are closer than Hunt and Barklwy.

RE: My point is simple  
Joey in VA : 10/10/2018 9:16 pm : link
In comment 14118341 KWALL2 said:
Quote:
Heís already an elite player.

About the position and long term draft value? Weíll see. The position does decline faster than any other and gets impacted by dings and hits more than others (See Bell)

So he may be finished sooner and the long term draft value may be better for some other players (Rosen), Who knows at this point.

But the guy playing right now? Not many better than that guy certainly not Hunt or Gordon. Or AJ Green.

He makes any team much better including that shit show we have going on right now.
I agree. I think outside of Brady, Brees and Rodgers there are no other players I'd want over him. None of the others listed are even as close as impactful or dangerous.
RE: Bw  
bw in dc : 10/10/2018 9:20 pm : link
In comment 14118365 KWALL2 said:
Quote:
Itís a very accurate choice of words

Put it this way. Open draft of all NFL players. Barkley goes in the elite tier . At the very top. Hunt does not.

Itís not close.

Barklwy makes an offense much tougher to defend. In the same situations, heíll do much more for you. And he makes the offense a much tough matchup.

You know whoís a good comp for Hunt? Connor in PIT. Thatís where he is. Connor cut weight this year and heís more explosive. Heís better as a receiving threat. But those guys are closer than Hunt and Barklwy.


You made an outlandish statement that "not many" current players are in SB's league. I listed 20 off the top of my head. (I could probably find another ten. Players who have an actual resume with results.)

And now you are trying to make a case against a guy, Hunt, who actually killed it his rookie year in the NFL. And is likely going to do the same thing this year.

Okay, fine. In your world of glitz and glamour, SB would go higher in this open draft concept. And I'll get Kareem Hunt, again, as a bargain selection and get at least 90-95+% of SB's "projected" value.





RE: And for the people saying simply that Barkley was the best prospect  
mrvax : 10/10/2018 9:20 pm : link
In comment 14118264 Go Terps said:
Quote:


If Eli Manning had retired after the 2017 season who would the Giants have drafted?

I'd bet my mortgage they'd have drafted Darnold.


They would have been forced to do so. All the years you've been on BBI, you've claimed the Giants should pick BPA. Now you have suddenly changed to becoming a butt loving Darnold fan. Just stop your BS. It's evidenced in all your posts.

Rub your hiney and move on.
Will this board ever stfu  
TMS : 10/10/2018 9:25 pm : link
about the last draft. Get lives.
RE: He made my offseason by giving me hope  
Matt M. : 10/10/2018 9:26 pm : link
In comment 14118149 WillieYoung said:
Quote:
Reality has now set in and the Jets have their quarterback for the next 15 years and we're back to Danny Kannell and Kent Graham.
It's still very early, but how exactly has Darnold shown he is the guy for the next 15 years? He has shown flashes, but is still prone to turnovers as he was in college. He averages more than 1 turnover a game for nearly 2 seasons worth of games.
I've pointed this out before but I think this is a huge point  
Leg of Theismann : 10/10/2018 9:27 pm : link
I've never seen BBI so unanimously agree on a prospect as much as Herbert. And I personally love Herbert too. I like him more than any of the other QB prospects that came out this year, in fact. Considering everyone is saying 2019 is a weak QB class, I think that's astounding that we have all actually agreed we want this guy as our future QB, and we aren't even halfway through the college season yet. I just think he's going to be an absolute stud, and while I think Bosa may be a better overall prospect as far as a rating would go, I would still go with Herbert #1 overall if we had the pick because I think he's going to be a real winner.
RE: RE: And for the people saying simply that Barkley was the best prospect  
Go Terps : 10/10/2018 9:32 pm : link
In comment 14118375 mrvax said:
Quote:
In comment 14118264 Go Terps said:


Quote:




If Eli Manning had retired after the 2017 season who would the Giants have drafted?

I'd bet my mortgage they'd have drafted Darnold.



They would have been forced to do so. All the years you've been on BBI, you've claimed the Giants should pick BPA. Now you have suddenly changed to becoming a butt loving Darnold fan. Just stop your BS. It's evidenced in all your posts.

Rub your hiney and move on.


If the Giants start running the team the way I would, then yeah BPA always makes sense. But that's not how they operate.

I'm less troubled by missing out on Darnold than I am by what I believe to be a complete lack of a plan. But hey if you want to ignore it and say "trust them" for the sixth year in a row, that's your prerogative.

We should all be rubbing our asses because the incompetence at the top has been fucking all of us. Some of us are done kidding ourselves about it.
RE: I've pointed this out before but I think this is a huge point  
bw in dc : 10/10/2018 9:32 pm : link
In comment 14118380 Leg of Theismann said:
Quote:
I've never seen BBI so unanimously agree on a prospect as much as Herbert. And I personally love Herbert too. I like him more than any of the other QB prospects that came out this year, in fact. Considering everyone is saying 2019 is a weak QB class, I think that's astounding that we have all actually agreed we want this guy as our future QB, and we aren't even halfway through the college season yet. I just think he's going to be an absolute stud, and while I think Bosa may be a better overall prospect as far as a rating would go, I would still go with Herbert #1 overall if we had the pick because I think he's going to be a real winner.


Really? Unanimous?

There are a few of us - considering we are in your BBI world - who feel the same exact way about Will Grier.
I still don't believe any of the 4 QBs are special  
Matt M. : 10/10/2018 9:33 pm : link
players. Mayfield is the best right now and he is good, but I don't see a special player. Darnold is next and he is even less special. Rosen and Allen are in another class right now.

I truly believe Barkley is already a special player and should be even better and more dynamic with more improvements on the OL.
Hunt  
KWALL2 : 10/10/2018 9:33 pm : link
Wasnít very good in the 2nd half of last year. He was ok.

This year?

He hasnít been very good. He made one play vs PIT on a 10 yard pass. He got past the rookie DB on PIT for a nice TD. Big game vs DEN. The rest of the time. An ok NFL starter.

And the ďleagueĒ stuff was only said about Hunt. No one else.

I said heís better than some of the others like Gordon. But Hunt? Heís much better.

The Resume stuff means nothing. Iím talking about the players right now. Not their stats over a few years. Lot of things go into rush stats and all of those things are working against Barkley.
Hunt this year?  
KWALL2 : 10/10/2018 9:38 pm : link
On pace for 85 fewer catches than Barkley.

But itís not even that. You split Hunt wide and you can put an average LB on him and your fine. You swing him out of the backfield? The D isnít worried about it or doing anything to stop it.

With Barkley itís another story.
In  
Jerry in DC : 10/10/2018 9:46 pm : link
And open draft of all nfl players, the first 10-15 picks would all be QBs. No running back would go in the top 30 unless gettleman was involved. Probably not in the top 100.
RE: Hunt this year?  
bw in dc : 10/10/2018 9:52 pm : link
In comment 14118392 KWALL2 said:
Quote:
On pace for 85 fewer catches than Barkley.

But itís not even that. You split Hunt wide and you can put an average LB on him and your fine. You swing him out of the backfield? The D isnít worried about it or doing anything to stop it.

With Barkley itís another story.


Well, that (catches) is true, but it's misleading. Mahomes is going downfield a helluva lot more than Smith did. The days of Chiefs WRs struggling to get TDs in over. But when Smith was there we clearly saw what Hunt an do as a receiver.

Meanwhile, Eli has checked down considerably more. So it makes sense from a # of catches lens that SB will have more.
Barkley is better than hutt  
dep026 : 10/10/2018 9:53 pm : link
But KWALL, hunt was very very good at the end of the year last year. His last 4 games were impressive.


The thing with Hunt is when heís bad, heís very bad. Non contributor. Barkley bad game is still close to 100 yards combined.
RE: Barkley is better than hutt  
bw in dc : 10/10/2018 9:59 pm : link
In comment 14118401 dep026 said:
Quote:
But KWALL, hunt was very very good at the end of the year last year. His last 4 games were impressive.


The thing with Hunt is when heís bad, heís very bad. Non contributor. Barkley bad game is still close to 100 yards combined.


3 of 4. He had only 1 carry against Denver in the finale. Granted, it was 35 yards and a TD... ;)
A run on QBs for sure  
KWALL2 : 10/10/2018 10:00 pm : link
Weíll say top 15 are QBs? Barkley is in the next 10.

Hunt goes 200+.

Heís a good nfl starter. Limited. Heíll fall off the cliff fast too.

Just not the same player or close to it.

Connor or Hunt? Who would you take? I like Connor more.
1 of the 3  
KWALL2 : 10/10/2018 10:06 pm : link
30 carries. 90 yards vs Mia. Not impressive.

Nothing he does is impressive. He makes an occasional play. But you should with 300 touches on a team with explosive players around you.
RE: RE: RE: And for the people saying simply that Barkley was the best prospect  
WillVAB : 10/10/2018 10:17 pm : link
In comment 14118386 Go Terps said:
Quote:
In comment 14118375 mrvax said:


Quote:


In comment 14118264 Go Terps said:


Quote:




If Eli Manning had retired after the 2017 season who would the Giants have drafted?

I'd bet my mortgage they'd have drafted Darnold.



They would have been forced to do so. All the years you've been on BBI, you've claimed the Giants should pick BPA. Now you have suddenly changed to becoming a butt loving Darnold fan. Just stop your BS. It's evidenced in all your posts.

Rub your hiney and move on.



If the Giants start running the team the way I would, then yeah BPA always makes sense. But that's not how they operate.

I'm less troubled by missing out on Darnold than I am by what I believe to be a complete lack of a plan. But hey if you want to ignore it and say "trust them" for the sixth year in a row, that's your prerogative.

We should all be rubbing our asses because the incompetence at the top has been fucking all of us. Some of us are done kidding ourselves about it.


If you care about the cap like your other posts suggest, then youíd know that the timing simply wasnít right to force a QB pick this year.

If the Giants took a QB, they wouldíve had a ton of money tied up in Darnold/Rosen plus Eli this year and at least the dead money hit from an Eli cut next year. 1 maybe 2 years wasted of a cheap rookie QB deal. Then factor in the terrible situation the new QB would be walking into ó terrible OL and the media frenzy taking over for Eli. Definitely not optimal imv.

RE: 1 of the 3  
bw in dc : 10/10/2018 10:18 pm : link
In comment 14118414 KWALL2 said:
Quote:
30 carries. 90 yards vs Mia. Not impressive.

Nothing he does is impressive. He makes an occasional play. But you should with 300 touches on a team with explosive players around you.


"Nothing he does is impressive."

Welcome to the abyss.


Yeah.  
Jerry in DC : 10/10/2018 10:20 pm : link
Hunt might not even go in the top 500. That's about the 16th round. I certainly wouldn't pick him earlier than that. But you might be right - it just depends on who's doing the drafting. The Jags did just pick fournette at 4, which is probably even dumber than taking Barkley at 2.

I wouldn't even consider an rb in the top 300 of that draft. I would easily pick the tenth best OG in the league over the #1 rated rb.
RE: RE: I've pointed this out before but I think this is a huge point  
Leg of Theismann : 10/10/2018 10:38 pm : link
In comment 14118387 bw in dc said:
Quote:
In comment 14118380 Leg of Theismann said:


Quote:


I've never seen BBI so unanimously agree on a prospect as much as Herbert. And I personally love Herbert too. I like him more than any of the other QB prospects that came out this year, in fact. Considering everyone is saying 2019 is a weak QB class, I think that's astounding that we have all actually agreed we want this guy as our future QB, and we aren't even halfway through the college season yet. I just think he's going to be an absolute stud, and while I think Bosa may be a better overall prospect as far as a rating would go, I would still go with Herbert #1 overall if we had the pick because I think he's going to be a real winner.



Really? Unanimous?

There are a few of us - considering we are in your BBI world - who feel the same exact way about Will Grier.


Sorry dude, my bad, didn't mean to speak for everyone. I was just going by the fact that so often I see Herbert's name randomly pop up in BBI discussions when we aren't even talking about the 2019 draft yet. But then again I may be biased because I love me some Herbert and that's probably why I notice it so often. I'm sure there are plenty of people who like Grier as well and I don't claim to be the end-all-be-all expert on which current 19 yr old kid is going to be the next HOF QB. Let's just hope DG and PS know what the hell they're doing and pick the right guy whether its 2019, 2020, hell even 2021, I don't care as long as they get the *right* guy.
Still feel  
Jay in Toronto : 10/10/2018 10:39 pm : link
we should have traded down
RE: I love..  
Jimmy Googs : 10/10/2018 11:29 pm : link
In comment 14118245 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
the way people dig in.

Barkley has "some talent" and Darnold is the Jets QB for 15 years.

Fucking madness.


almost ponderous...
RE: Right now, SB is a good player on a bad team  
fireitup77 : 10/10/2018 11:36 pm : link
In comment 14118309 jcn56 said:
Quote:
He's not a great player. Not yet, and maybe not ever.

Not what anyone wants to hear - but the production that would have to accompany calling him great just isn't there. And while I'm willing to cut him slack because of the overall offensive woes, that doesn't mean we can just pretend he's guaranteed greatness.



The first 5 games of his career he has gained over100 yards from scrimmage. Only 2 other players in the history off the game has done that. One had seven and one 5. Yea no production.....
Jerry!  
KWALL2 : 10/10/2018 11:59 pm : link
You win.

You would take the 10th best guard over Barkley and also 300 NFL players over him (10 players on every team?)

No you wouldnít.

RE: RE: RE: I've pointed this out before but I think this is a huge point  
bw in dc : 10/11/2018 12:27 am : link
In comment 14118432 Leg of Theismann said:
Quote:


Sorry dude, my bad, didn't mean to speak for everyone. I was just going by the fact that so often I see Herbert's name randomly pop up in BBI discussions when we aren't even talking about the 2019 draft yet. But then again I may be biased because I love me some Herbert and that's probably why I notice it so often. I'm sure there are plenty of people who like Grier as well and I don't claim to be the end-all-be-all expert on which current 19 yr old kid is going to be the next HOF QB. Let's just hope DG and PS know what the hell they're doing and pick the right guy whether its 2019, 2020, hell even 2021, I don't care as long as they get the *right* guy.


Just needling you a bit. There is a strong camp for Herbert. He certainly looks the part physically. I've seen two full games this year and was impressed with his ability to change arm angles to make plays.
The irony in this thread is hilarious  
montanagiant : 10/11/2018 12:39 am : link
A bunch of posters in this thread has pointed out and bitched that the reason the Giants suck right now is that they drafted for need instead of BPA in the past (IE: Flowers). Yet here they drafted the BPA in the whole draft and because they didn't reach (in the Giants mind) for a QB that posters like it's now wrong to draft BPA, it's absurd to see.


He's an exciting player  
.McL. : 10/11/2018 4:51 am : link
And I am sure he will give us many highlight real plays.

I am rooting for him and the team.

I stick by what I said at the time, I don't think RB at 2 is good value especially behind our o-line...

You can have all the skill position players in the world. If you don't have a decent o-line, your offense is going nowhere.

I don't know what offers there really were, but I was a proponent of trading down. I had dreams of picking up Nelson. and one of the tackles, possibly one of the centers...

I will say Hernandez looks solid.
Even if we couldn't get Nelson  
.McL. : 10/11/2018 5:00 am : link
Imagine if we were able to pick McGlinchey and Ragnow, who both seem to be getting going along with Hernandez.

I know starting 3 rookies would cause some serious growing pains, but imagine how much better we would feel about the o-line, now and in the future, and the team in general right now. Now, I feel we are forever mired down by a completely ineffective o-line. With no end in sight.
RE: RE: I love..  
micky : 10/11/2018 6:14 am : link
In comment 14118462 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
In comment 14118245 FatMan in Charlotte said:


Quote:


the way people dig in.

Barkley has "some talent" and Darnold is the Jets QB for 15 years.

Fucking madness.



almost ponderous...


Lol!!!!
Barkley has been better than expected so far  
ZogZerg : 10/11/2018 6:35 am : link
However, I would still rather they picked a QB - Josh Rosen (or even Darnold).

The 2 studds - Beckham and Barkley - have the Giants at 1-4.

I'd rather the Giants be in position do dump Eli next year, free up 19 million, sign a few quality players in FA, and roll out a young, future, QB that had year to learn and grow under Eli. Instead, we have no future QB moving forward and a disaster year on hand. Future looks like the present, a big mess.
For me it was a tough call  
English Alaister : 10/11/2018 6:52 am : link
but I think Barkley just edges it. He really looks like a generational talent at the position so far and that is on a terrible offense.

If I had to wager on a player from this draft class being a hall of famer then it is Barkley. However, it is a very fair critique that Darnold or Allen may be better value in the W column long term.

I do feel there won't be a chance to draft another Barkley whereas QBs like Darnold or Allen will come around again and hence I'd take Barkley.

I'd also say leaving wins and value out of the equation just the joy he brings me watching him is frankly brilliant. I haven't had this much fun watching a losing team ever.
Over the last 7 years  
UConn4523 : 10/11/2018 7:41 am : link
only 3 RBs taken in the first round are no longer playing in the NFL - Bishop Stanley, Trent Richardson and David Wilson. Sankey and Trent are playing, just not in the NFL. Wilson is the only one that isnít playing due to health.

AP is still playing, Bush only recently retired, McFadden retired last year.

The short shelf life doesnít apply to top picks at the position. It doesnít even apply to 2nd round RBs either.
I donít even watch college ball and the decision  
Big Blue '56 : 10/11/2018 7:50 am : link
was a no-brainer if our QB guru didnít feel any of the QBs were franchise-worthy. Only question is how he viewed Mayfield. Itís almost that simple. The discussion is so silly, especially at this point in time. But itís what weíre here for albeit the same RIGID points are beaten ad nauseum
Love the pick. He's a joy to watch.  
Watson : 10/11/2018 7:57 am : link
If we passed on a Luck or Peyton, I could understand the continual griping but there wasn't. In the next two drafts there will be available QBs equal to those in this year's draft.

Meanwhile, we get to watch a fantastic football player. That really sucks. Sometimes I wonder why people watch sports.
Correct, Watson  
JonC : 10/11/2018 8:16 am : link
That is the evaluation and decision NYG made, they're moving their bets on the next QB into the next two drafts.
Great pick  
section125 : 10/11/2018 8:17 am : link
and he looks great.
...  
christian : 10/11/2018 8:28 am : link
The only top 10 QB picks to win a Super Bowl this century are the Mannings and Trent Dilfer.

Franchise QBs are way more about where they land and not necessarily when they were drafted.

If you trust Shurmur and Shula, they will be able to build up a guy they pick this year, even if it's not the 2nd pick overall.

That said, it's not going to hurt pairing a good system with the most talented QB. Thankfully some of the middling moves Gettleman made have backfired and the Giants aren't an 8-8 team. Getting one of the best players on each round is a benifit.
RE: Barkley has been better than expected so far  
Bill L : 10/11/2018 9:02 am : link
In comment 14118516 ZogZerg said:
Quote:
However, I would still rather they picked a QB - Josh Rosen (or even Darnold).

The 2 studds - Beckham and Barkley - have the Giants at 1-4.

I'd rather the Giants be in position do dump Eli next year, free up 19 million, sign a few quality players in FA, and roll out a young, future, QB that had year to learn and grow under Eli. Instead, we have no future QB moving forward and a disaster year on hand. Future looks like the present, a big mess.

Ereck Flowers.
He was the right pick  
MotownGIANTS : 10/11/2018 9:52 am : link
the OL needed to be fixed no matter what. A rookie QB behind this OL with a sub-par run game and a couple of weapons would have been crap ... a vet SB MVP QB with a talented runner and slightly improved OL (still kinda bad) with some weapons at least give us a shot.

Next yr stage 2 of the OL rebuild will be complete. The QB whoever it turns out to be (Eli/FA/Rookie/Kyle) should have better protection the RB should have better lanes ... and we already have the weapons (a true #2 WR would be nice though). Get 2ndary and LB depth and it is on an popping ...
He was the best player in the draft.  
Mike in Long Beach : 10/11/2018 11:09 am : link
I think ultimately we'll be happy with the pick, but if one of those QBs becomes part of a generation that performs similar to the Brees/Brady/Rodgers guard, then we'll probably regret it.

But I think we're too quick to assume that's happening. If Darnold/Mayfield/Rosen end up more like the Matt Ryans or Matt Stafford's of today's NFL, I think we'll be very happy with our pick. And that's not a knock on those guys. They're great QBs. But you can pluck a QB late in the first round or off FA and they can have the same success as those guys (maybe not the same numbers).

I don't think you can just get a game-changing RB like that.

So in short, if those QBs become sure-fire Hall of Famers, then yeah, we'll regret it. But I think we all have to appreciate how big an "if" that is.
RE: Barkley has been better than expected so far  
giants#1 : 10/11/2018 11:17 am : link
In comment 14118516 ZogZerg said:
Quote:
However, I would still rather they picked a QB - Josh Rosen (or even Darnold).

The 2 studds - Beckham and Barkley - have the Giants at 1-4.

I'd rather the Giants be in position do dump Eli next year, free up 19 million, sign a few quality players in FA, and roll out a young, future, QB that had year to learn and grow under Eli. Instead, we have no future QB moving forward and a disaster year on hand. Future looks like the present, a big mess.


That's faulty logic. With Darnold/Rosen we're probably sitting at 0-5 and would've had to watch Jonathan Stewart starting for 3 games!

Why is Barkley expected to immediately turn around a 3 win team, but a rookie QB is allowed several years?
RE: RE: Barkley has been better than expected so far  
jcn56 : 10/11/2018 11:24 am : link
In comment 14118955 giants#1 said:
Quote:
In comment 14118516 ZogZerg said:


Quote:


However, I would still rather they picked a QB - Josh Rosen (or even Darnold).

The 2 studds - Beckham and Barkley - have the Giants at 1-4.

I'd rather the Giants be in position do dump Eli next year, free up 19 million, sign a few quality players in FA, and roll out a young, future, QB that had year to learn and grow under Eli. Instead, we have no future QB moving forward and a disaster year on hand. Future looks like the present, a big mess.



That's faulty logic. With Darnold/Rosen we're probably sitting at 0-5 and would've had to watch Jonathan Stewart starting for 3 games!

Why is Barkley expected to immediately turn around a 3 win team, but a rookie QB is allowed several years?


Why is it you assume that a change at QB has us losing more games instead of winning more? Especially with a mobile QB, who might offset some of the rush allowed by that porous line?
several reasons  
giants#1 : 10/11/2018 11:29 am : link
1. Drafting a QB doesn't guarantee he starts and with Eli still here, I doubt he would've. After a poor start to the season, sure, but not out of the gate.

2. Barkley's averaging >100 yds from scrimmage and 1 TD/game and this team is still struggling to score. You think the combo of Stewart and Gallman would even come close to that?

3. The one win was with Eli going 25-29 297 yds and 2 TDs. Nothing I've seen from Darnold/Rosen/Allen make me believe they would've done that.
RE: several reasons  
jcn56 : 10/11/2018 11:54 am : link
In comment 14118989 giants#1 said:
Quote:
1. Drafting a QB doesn't guarantee he starts and with Eli still here, I doubt he would've. After a poor start to the season, sure, but not out of the gate.

2. Barkley's averaging >100 yds from scrimmage and 1 TD/game and this team is still struggling to score. You think the combo of Stewart and Gallman would even come close to that?

3. The one win was with Eli going 25-29 297 yds and 2 TDs. Nothing I've seen from Darnold/Rosen/Allen make me believe they would've done that.


1. Drafting a QB doesn't mean he starts right away, but it also doesn't guarantee they retain Eli.

2. Maybe not - but given the number of times they have to target Barkley, Gallman's production might not have been far off.

3. Fair enough - but that's one game out of 5. And that implies you couldn't beat the Texans with a weaker performance by the QB. The Texans haven't exactly been a powerhouse this season.
fan/media reaction  
giants#1 : 10/11/2018 12:04 pm : link
last season pretty much guaranteed Eli was returning and starting this season.

That one was the only game the Giants won. I'm not some blind fan that thinks Eli can still produce like his prime with better OL (hi dep!), but he's completed >70% of his passes and thrown only 2 INTs. I believe Darnold has been the best of the 3 and he's completing 55% of his passes with 6 INTs. And it's not like he's scrambling for big first downs. He has 13 yds on 13 rushes.

Allen's made some plays with his feet, but he's looked as advertised throwing the ball.

I really don't see anyway the Giants would be better with one of the rookie QBs this season. Long term? I can see this argument, but this year would be dreadful.
RE: RE: Barkley has been better than expected so far  
ZogZerg : 10/11/2018 12:20 pm : link
In comment 14118955 giants#1 said:
Quote:
In comment 14118516 ZogZerg said:


Quote:


However, I would still rather they picked a QB - Josh Rosen (or even Darnold).

The 2 studds - Beckham and Barkley - have the Giants at 1-4.

I'd rather the Giants be in position do dump Eli next year, free up 19 million, sign a few quality players in FA, and roll out a young, future, QB that had year to learn and grow under Eli. Instead, we have no future QB moving forward and a disaster year on hand. Future looks like the present, a big mess.



That's faulty logic. With Darnold/Rosen we're probably sitting at 0-5 and would've had to watch Jonathan Stewart starting for 3 games!

Why is Barkley expected to immediately turn around a 3 win team, but a rookie QB is allowed several years?



Dude - Do you watch football? Rookie RB is the biggest impact position around. Have you heard of Kamara and Hunt?

Is 0-5 really that much worse than 1-4? Stewart is out for the year injured, so we would be watching Wayne Gallman (BTW, he plays for the Giants), who is actually pretty good.

Finally, Rookie QBs don't take "several years", but continue on with your babbling.
Ereck Flowers  
Bill L : 10/11/2018 12:22 pm : link
.
RE: RE: RE: Barkley has been better than expected so far  
giants#1 : 10/11/2018 12:28 pm : link
In comment 14119107 ZogZerg said:
Quote:




Dude - Do you watch football? Rookie RB is the biggest impact position around. Have you heard of Kamara and Hunt?

Is 0-5 really that much worse than 1-4? Stewart is out for the year injured, so we would be watching Wayne Gallman (BTW, he plays for the Giants), who is actually pretty good.

Finally, Rookie QBs don't take "several years", but continue on with your babbling.


Stewart was healthy games 1-3, hence why he'd start 3 games (or at least see considerable action).

Gallman's a decent backup, but he's not in Barkley's league.

Chiefs lost 2 more games last year than 2016, so by your logic Hunt was a shitty pick.
RE: RE: RE: Barkley has been better than expected so far  
giants#1 : 10/11/2018 12:39 pm : link
In comment 14119107 ZogZerg said:
Quote:
In comment 14118955 giants#1 said:


Quote:


In comment 14118516 ZogZerg said:


Quote:


However, I would still rather they picked a QB - Josh Rosen (or even Darnold).

The 2 studds - Beckham and Barkley - have the Giants at 1-4.

I'd rather the Giants be in position do dump Eli next year, free up 19 million, sign a few quality players in FA, and roll out a young, future, QB that had year to learn and grow under Eli. Instead, we have no future QB moving forward and a disaster year on hand. Future looks like the present, a big mess.



That's faulty logic. With Darnold/Rosen we're probably sitting at 0-5 and would've had to watch Jonathan Stewart starting for 3 games!

Why is Barkley expected to immediately turn around a 3 win team, but a rookie QB is allowed several years?




Dude - Do you watch football? Rookie RB is the biggest impact position around. Have you heard of Kamara and Hunt?

Is 0-5 really that much worse than 1-4? Stewart is out for the year injured, so we would be watching Wayne Gallman (BTW, he plays for the Giants), who is actually pretty good.

Finally, Rookie QBs don't take "several years", but continue on with your babbling.


So you're ready to declare Darnold/Rosen/Allen finished projects? If that's the case, I'm thrilled we avoided them!

Bortles looked like an ascending QB after year 2 (4400+ yds, ~35 TDs).

Winston was the next great QB after starting his career with back-to-back >4000 yd seasons.

Carr was made one of the highest paid QBs after his 3rd season and it's been downhill (fast) since then.

Prescott looked great year 1, I wouldn't be giving him anything close to franchise money now.
In Hindsight....  
FanMan : 10/11/2018 12:55 pm : link
I would have taken Chubb ... Non-existent pass rush problem solved. I think that would have made a bigger impact on THIS season than Barkley. He is awesome, but lack of pass rush is crippling this defense.
FMIC  
KWALL2 : 10/11/2018 3:35 pm : link
The defense has played better than I expected especially without Vernon.

Picture the offense without Barkley.

Just double Beckham all game. This team would never score.
giants#1  
ZogZerg : 10/11/2018 5:19 pm : link
Quote:

So you're ready to declare Darnold/Rosen/Allen finished projects? If that's the case, I'm thrilled we avoided them!

Bortles looked like an ascending QB after year 2 (4400+ yds, ~35 TDs).

Winston was the next great QB after starting his career with back-to-back >4000 yd seasons.

Carr was made one of the highest paid QBs after his 3rd season and it's been downhill (fast) since then.

Prescott looked great year 1, I wouldn't be giving him anything close to franchise money now.


I guess you like to ramble on and on and don't comprehend what folks actually type? Not sure how sitting behind Eli for a year declares a rookie QB as a "finished product"?
Yes, I think both Darnold and Rosen will be Franchise QBs in the league. So far they look the part.


Dak was a 4th round pick that no one really believed in. They should have put Romo back in, they would have won the Superbowl. Car was a second round pick. Neither fit in this conversation.

I was never a Bortles or Winston fan.
How do Goff and Wentz look?


Off the available players at # 2  
Dave in PA : 10/11/2018 6:24 pm : link
Heís very clearly the best performer RIGHT NOW. That said, this team is mired in the basement with or without him and no matter how good he is if Iím 3 years the Giants are pathetic at QB and Josh Rosen is awesome then it will have been a blown pick. Barkley is lights out though. Maybe the most impressive rookie Iíve ever seen
RE: Off the available players at # 2  
baadbill : 10/11/2018 6:55 pm : link
In comment 14119575 Dave in PA said:
Quote:
Heís very clearly the best performer RIGHT NOW. That said, this team is mired in the basement with or without him and no matter how good he is if Iím 3 years the Giants are pathetic at QB and Josh Rosen is awesome then it will have been a blown pick. Barkley is lights out though. Maybe the most impressive rookie Iíve ever seen


You obviously never saw LT.
RE: RE: Off the available players at # 2  
bw in dc : 10/11/2018 7:06 pm : link
In comment 14119594 baadbill said:
Quote:
In comment 14119575 Dave in PA said:


Quote:


Heís very clearly the best performer RIGHT NOW. That said, this team is mired in the basement with or without him and no matter how good he is if Iím 3 years the Giants are pathetic at QB and Josh Rosen is awesome then it will have been a blown pick. Barkley is lights out though. Maybe the most impressive rookie Iíve ever seen



You obviously never saw LT.


Or Barry Sanders. Or Randy Moss.
Updates after 5.5 games anybody?  
KWALL2 : 10/11/2018 9:32 pm : link
Now with 6 games over 100. And making plays NOBODY makes in the NFL right now.
I fucking love him  
Giantology : 10/11/2018 9:32 pm : link
He is Barry Sanders 2.0!
Barkley  
darren in pdx : 10/11/2018 9:33 pm : link
is well worth the pick, and the Giants are bad enough they'll have their pick of QBs next draft. Worked out well enough, I guess.
RE: Updates after 5.5 games anybody?  
Keith : 10/11/2018 9:34 pm : link
In comment 14120640 KWALL2 said:
Quote:
Now with 6 games over 100. And making plays NOBODY makes in the NFL right now.


Yet here we are losing to a poor eagles team at home and staring at 1-5 with arguably the worst qb situation in the league. No doubt heís fantastic, but unless he can throw, heís not gonna be able to do enough.
.  
arcarsenal : 10/11/2018 9:35 pm : link
He was the best player in the draft. That alone completely justifies the pick in my eyes.
RE: RE: Off the available players at # 2  
Dave in PA : 10/11/2018 9:44 pm : link
In comment 14119594 baadbill said:
Quote:
In comment 14119575 Dave in PA said:


Quote:


Heís very clearly the best performer RIGHT NOW. That said, this team is mired in the basement with or without him and no matter how good he is if Iím 3 years the Giants are pathetic at QB and Josh Rosen is awesome then it will have been a blown pick. Barkley is lights out though. Maybe the most impressive rookie Iíve ever seen



You obviously never saw LT.
you're correct. I started watching the Giants in 1995 as a 10 year old.
Love the pick...  
Vinny from Danbury : 10/11/2018 9:45 pm : link
and love the player. He is freakishly talented. I'll enjoy watching his career for years, regardless of how this season plays out.
If we're building for the long term  
widmerseyebrow : 10/11/2018 9:53 pm : link
We take someone besides Barkley and the QBs. The quarterbacks after Mayfield were not great prospects. Saddling yourself with the wrong developmental QB is more damaging than some of you guys are willing to admit and drafting high is not going to a problem for this team for another year or two.

Eli was still pretty damn good 5 years ago and we've all seen what we've accomplished as a team since then without an offensive line and a pass rush.
The Giants have the worst OL in football. So long as that remains true  
baadbill : 10/11/2018 10:09 pm : link
you can put all the talent in the world at QB, WR, RB, and TE and itís not going to make a difference.
RE: RE: that being said  
Nomad Crow on the Madison : 10/13/2018 9:28 am : link
In comment 14118215 Coach Red Beaulieu said:
Quote:
In comment 14118196 UESBLUE said:


Quote:


how many SBs did Barry Sanders win again?


As many as Dan Marino.


Ah, but Dan Marino played in one and was a significant part of a very competitive team for many years. Barry's teams were competitive in
really only one year.
RE: And for the people saying simply that Barkley was the best prospect  
Nomad Crow on the Madison : 10/13/2018 9:33 am : link
In comment 14118264 Go Terps said:
Quote:
That wasn't the consensus (at least on this board and many draft sites) before the draft. He was absolutely in the top group, but the discussion revolved around him being one of several (6-7) blue chips at the top of the draft.

And I don't believe his being "the most talented prospect" was the only consideration. I've asked this question in the past and I'll ask it again:

If Eli Manning had retired after the 2017 season who would the Giants have drafted?

I'd bet my mortgage they'd have drafted Darnold.


Actually, DG was quoted somewhere saying he would have drafted Josh Allen.
Nomad - please document DGís comment about Allen.  
cosmicj : 10/13/2018 9:59 am : link
Very curious about the source.
Perfectly happy  
Bramton1 : 10/13/2018 10:06 am : link
There were no Peyton in that draft. No Brees. No Luck. There were talented qbs in that draft, just like any year. It's just that there were more than the average number of them.

As for Barkley, he is not your average high-level running back. This is a guy who get once a decade, at best. To quote Ernie Accorsi in his scouting report of Eli, "These guys are rare, you know."
I love Barkley, looks very promising  
Jim in Forest Hills : 10/13/2018 10:08 am : link
but you don't win shit without a QB.

So we have to see what DG's plan is, cause I'm 100% sure it wasn't to go 1-5.

If DG drafts a winner at QB this year or somehow Lauletta turns into Superman, it was perhaps an alltime great pick.
I understand the ď draft a QBĒ crowd  
Shecky : 10/13/2018 10:17 am : link
But

How many players five games into their careers can you legit say ďthis guy has a good chance to be a hall of fameĒ. Barkley is THAT good, and that rare. I donít care what position he plays. As a fan of the franchise, Iím happy. Would I prefer a hall of fame QB, come on, what kind of question is that.

Who was available at #2 at this point you look at and say ďthis guy is a legit all proĒ? We drafted the best PLAYER who was available when we picked.

You donít rebuild a team overnight. Drafting superstars is not a bad start...
terrific player  
MookGiants : 10/13/2018 1:11 pm : link
still the wrong pick.

He is a special, once a decade type running back.

The problem is having the top or a top RB in the league in this era doesn't mean much when it comes to winning and losing, especially in the playoffs.

Adrian Peterson and LDT were once a decade type RBs, yet the only year he even sniffed the playoffs was when Brett Favre came and turned the clock back that one year. Outside of that, Peterson's teams were never super bowl contenders. Tomlinson never played in a super bowl, either.

Look at the teams that have won Super Bowls in the last decade. Which one had a top running back? No matter how many times DG says that analytics about RB value are a crock, he's wrong.

Peter King said that DG is a dinosaur when it comes to scouting and drafting in today's NFL. It certainly seems like that is the case
RE: I understand the ď draft a QBĒ crowd  
MookGiants : 10/13/2018 1:18 pm : link
In comment 14126056 Shecky said:
Quote:
But

How many players five games into their careers can you legit say ďthis guy has a good chance to be a hall of fameĒ. Barkley is THAT good, and that rare. I donít care what position he plays. As a fan of the franchise, Iím happy. Would I prefer a hall of fame QB, come on, what kind of question is that.

Who was available at #2 at this point you look at and say ďthis guy is a legit all proĒ? We drafted the best PLAYER who was available when we picked.

You donít rebuild a team overnight. Drafting superstars is not a bad start...


Tomlinson and AP were that type of player. Neither one had much team success, especially in the playoffs. For the most part, a running backs best days are behind them by age 27-28. That scares the hell out of me when the Giants are years away from contending. Until they actually get a franchise QB, it doesn't matter what else they do, they will not be a contender.

Barkley's prime started game 1. Every year that the Giants suck, and make no mistake this team is at least 2 more years away from even thinking about being a contender, is a wasted year of Barkley's prime.

A franchise QB in today's NFL is worth significantly more than a hall of fame running back is. You don't have to be a hall of fame quarterback to be worth much more than a hall of fame running back
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