I'm extremely hopeful the season turns around starting Thursday. Let's beat the Eagles - please.
That said while it is to early to seriously talk draft there is one point I wanted to mention. If the Giants come away, and only if they come away with the #1 pick I would run to the podium for Nick Bosa.
Bosa is arguably better then his brother - even though Joey is bigger and has more pure power. Dominant pass rushers change franchises and our pass rush has not been dominant for a long time. Strahan, Tuck and Osi are long gone. If you are like me you still glowingly talk about LT.
The '20 Qb class is set to be VERY good with Tua in that group as well as a few other qbs.
This team would be a lot better with a pass rush and a continued investment in OL. Any fan of those 80's Giants simply loves pass rush. It is so much more fun to watch the game when you have one. Vernon's absence and the impact on the pass rush has been pronounced and Bosa would hopefully immediately be contending for the best pass rusher in the division.
Let's not suck. But if we do... Suck for Bosa.
He's not big enough to be a DE.
Check out Montez Sweat of Miss State (transferred a few years ago from Mich State). Guy is the real deal as a push rushing DE. And absolute terror. He is the guy to watch for any team's pass rushing needs.
I like Herbert if we are picking top 5, not sold on any of the other QB's. I like Grier, but he is a late first/early day 2 guy to me.
Ed Oliver is a great talent- but the Giants have Hill/Tomlinson/Snacks/McIntosh already on the interior.
Devin White from LSU is a great LB to keep an eye on, and as the previous poster mentioend, Montez Sweat. Also, David Edwards, a true RT from Wisconsin, LB Anfernee Jennings from Bama, and Rashaan Gary from Michigan stand out to me.
Tbh- I think the Giants will be picking somewhere from 6-12.
Lol that works just fine for me! Wouldn’t we still pick where the 5-6 win teams pick? Around 10 or so? I don’t think the giants would be penalized for making the playoffs they would still pick ahead of the team with more wins. Even better! Pick high AND make the playoffs.
I like Herbert if we are picking top 5, not sold on any of the other QB's. I like Grier, but he is a late first/early day 2 guy to me.
Ed Oliver is a great talent- but the Giants have Hill/Tomlinson/Snacks/McIntosh already on the interior.
Devin White from LSU is a great LB to keep an eye on, and as the previous poster mentioend, Montez Sweat. Also, David Edwards, a true RT from Wisconsin, LB Anfernee Jennings from Bama, and Rashaan Gary from Michigan stand out to me.
Tbh- I think the Giants will be picking somewhere from 6-12.
I heard Grier had three end zone picks this past weekend. And a red zone fumble. Is that true?
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We’re winning the division with 5, maybe 6 wins. That means we’re picking in the 20s
Lol that works just fine for me! Wouldn’t we still pick where the 5-6 win teams pick? Around 10 or so? I don’t think the giants would be penalized for making the playoffs they would still pick ahead of the team with more wins. Even better! Pick high AND make the playoffs.
No. Playoff teams pick 21-32.
I heard Grier had three end zone picks this past weekend. And a red zone fumble. Is that true?
He did. Bad some bad decisions. But still threw 4 TDs. Just one of those days - more the exception than the rule for him, IMV...
I like Herbert if we are picking top 5, not sold on any of the other QB's. I like Grier, but he is a late first/early day 2 guy to me.
Ed Oliver is a great talent- but the Giants have Hill/Tomlinson/Snacks/McIntosh already on the interior.
Devin White from LSU is a great LB to keep an eye on, and as the previous poster mentioend, Montez Sweat. Also, David Edwards, a true RT from Wisconsin, LB Anfernee Jennings from Bama, and Rashaan Gary from Michigan stand out to me.
Have you seen Josh Allen, the OLB/DE, from Kentucky? Another upcoming stud wreaking havoc in a very deep SEC 2020 class.
The same logic holds true for a franchise left tackle and Jonah Williams is the best tackle to come out in years. He's way closer to Smith of Dallas or Joe Thomas or others in that caliber.
We sure could use some high round talent up front on D but, if we draft that high in 2019 (and the talent is there) - it might be time to look for the "Heir apparent" - which I think the Giants will do.
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Down the road with QB. Franchise QBs don't grow on trees, and they are the most important position. Shurmur and Gettleman can't wait another 3 years after this one for a QB from 2020 to start winning, and that's if they are lucky.
The same logic holds true for a franchise left tackle and Jonah Williams is the best tackle to come out in years. He's way closer to Smith of Dallas or Joe Thomas or others in that caliber.
Just ask Miami how they feel about picking Jake Long over Matt Ryan.
The feedback I received is that he has a cannon arm, but has trouble throwing the intermediate routes.
I know he can throw the long balls on a dime. I have witnessed that myself.
What has changed from last season to this season?
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Down the road with QB. Franchise QBs don't grow on trees, and they are the most important position. Shurmur and Gettleman can't wait another 3 years after this one for a QB from 2020 to start winning, and that's if they are lucky.
The same logic holds true for a franchise left tackle and Jonah Williams is the best tackle to come out in years. He's way closer to Smith of Dallas or Joe Thomas or others in that caliber.
No, the same logic doesn't hold true for a franchise LT vs franchise QB. Not sure if you heard, but Nate Solder is our LT and will continue to be for a long time, but even if we did not have Solder, this regime would need to draft Eli's replacement. Eli is under contract for 2019 and that's it. A good plan would be to draft a franchise QB when ostensibly, you are going to have a top 5 pick again, and let that pick have an understudy year as Eli has his swan song. A bad plan is to wait until 2020 and hope you are back in position to draft one of those quarterbacks and then have a rookie start right away or kick the can another year with Lauletta or Tanney at QB.
I'm pretty sure that Shurmur and Gettleman want to win before 2021 or 2022. In order to do that, they are going to have to get their guy in this next draft and they have to not miss. Then that guy has to start winning games in 2020. Ownership is not going to let this team become the Browns.
Obviously, you can't force the pick. But there will probably be very little competition for the top QB in this class, and I expect the Giants will be well-positioned to get him. If you don't take him in 2019 in favor of an OT or pass rusher, when you have a guy at QB entering his age 38 season and last under contract, then you have completely mismanaged the future of this franchise. I don't think this regime would even entertain that idea if they had the option.
Yes they will. The 49ers, Cardinals, and Bills might have a worse record by the end of the season, but I highly doubt that the Giants will have any worse than the 4th pick in the draft. Realistically this is a 3-5 win team. We have exciting players but until we can score points consistently we are going to lose a lot more games than win them.
The feedback I received is that he has a cannon arm, but has trouble throwing the intermediate routes.
I know he can throw the long balls on a dime. I have witnessed that myself.
What has changed from last season to this season?
Don't forget Will Grier left UF after being suspended for a year for a banned substance, and then said it was "an over the counter substance." Now, think about everything you know about John Mara. Do you think that Mara is going to sign off on a top 5 QB in the draft with that history?
No. That guy has to be a clean prospect and model citizen, especially at the QB position, who is going to be the face of the franchise. Although there is a lot about Grier to like, I don't see how he would be a consideration for the Giants at all, they are definitely going to downgrade him.
I don't see a 3-4 team spending a high pick on Oliver, unless they project him as Snacks' successor at NT. Even then, that's a potentially awfully high pick at a non-premium position.
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Last season I mentioned him as a possible first round selection in 2019.
The feedback I received is that he has a cannon arm, but has trouble throwing the intermediate routes.
I know he can throw the long balls on a dime. I have witnessed that myself.
What has changed from last season to this season?
Don't forget Will Grier left UF after being suspended for a year for a banned substance, and then said it was "an over the counter substance." Now, think about everything you know about John Mara. Do you think that Mara is going to sign off on a top 5 QB in the draft with that history?
No. That guy has to be a clean prospect and model citizen, especially at the QB position, who is going to be the face of the franchise. Although there is a lot about Grier to like, I don't see how he would be a consideration for the Giants at all, they are definitely going to downgrade him.
For sure. I knew that. I'm just talking about his throws from prospect angle.
I particularly do not like the offenses that either Grier or Herbert have come out of. Grier Air Raid spread, and Herbert, Willie Taggert lethal simplicity.
Stop it!
Jonah Williams at RT and I will hear nothing else of the sort!
Have you heard anything about NYG’s scouting presence for the early QB prospects?
I know people dont want to hear this.... but I see the Giants winning some games. If the team progresses like I think you and I both know... I can see us getting to 6 wins. Taking us out of the top 5.
The feedback I received is that he has a cannon arm, but has trouble throwing the intermediate routes.
I know he can throw the long balls on a dime. I have witnessed that myself.
What has changed from last season to this season?
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that's a shitty sign for the talent level of the draft pool. Solder's locked in a for a bit at LT.
I know people dont want to hear this.... but I see the Giants winning some games. If the team progresses like I think you and I both know... I can see us getting to 6 wins. Taking us out of the top 5.
We'll likely be 1-5 tonight, I don't see this team winning half their games down the stretch, and don't really want them to. 6 wins this season doesn't help them get more talented.
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and I suspect one will "fit" and be "BPA" no matter what.
Have you heard anything about NYG’s scouting presence for the early QB prospects?
No, way too early. Didn't hear a peep about QBs last year until March.
We'll likely be 1-5 tonight, I don't see this team winning half their games down the stretch, and don't really want them to. 6 wins this season doesn't help them get more talented.
Eagles are beatable. A mess weather wise tonight makes it anyones game. Atlanta is not very good. Washington isnt anything special. It wouldnt shock me if we got 2 wins in the next 3.
Plus with Tennseee, Indy, TB, Dallas at home, SF - there are wins on the schedule IMO.
True Sophomore. Have to be 3 years removed from HS.
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We'll likely be 1-5 tonight, I don't see this team winning half their games down the stretch, and don't really want them to. 6 wins this season doesn't help them get more talented.
Eagles are beatable. A mess weather wise tonight makes it anyones game. Atlanta is not very good. Washington isnt anything special. It wouldnt shock me if we got 2 wins in the next 3.
Plus with Tennseee, Indy, TB, Dallas at home, SF - there are wins on the schedule IMO.
Tennessee, Indy, Tampa, Dallas...are looking at the Giants on their schedule as a W. Also, all of those teams are better teams than the Giants.
Tennessee, Indy, Tampa, Dallas...are looking at the Giants on their schedule as a W. Also, all of those teams are better teams than the Giants.
Well sure they can lose them as well. But those teams being "better" than the Giants is speculative. None of them are that good and have major problems as well. Shit, TB looked like a high school team against Chicago. Indy has looked awful in areas. And Tennessee has ZERO offense.
There is no way Edwards falls to round 2. He will go top 20 at worst possibly top 10.
As for QB, that depends on how Eli and the offense finish the year. And what kind of ceiling they put on Lauletta's upside (obviously they like him, but do they love him?).
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In comment 14118455 allstarjim said:
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Down the road with QB. Franchise QBs don't grow on trees, and they are the most important position. Shurmur and Gettleman can't wait another 3 years after this one for a QB from 2020 to start winning, and that's if they are lucky.
The same logic holds true for a franchise left tackle and Jonah Williams is the best tackle to come out in years. He's way closer to Smith of Dallas or Joe Thomas or others in that caliber.
Just ask Miami how they feel about picking Jake Long over Matt Ryan.
Seeing that Matty ice has delivered nothing to Atlanta I'd say it's a wash. But the flipside to your example, how many times have we seen teams draft the franchise QB throw him behind a substandard line and watch him get killed? We drafted a great running back who oftentimes can't take more than two steps before a defender is on him.
We can agree to disagree but I say fix the oline before you get the QB.
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In comment 14118455 allstarjim said:
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Not sure if you heard, but Nate Solder is our LT and will continue to be for a long time, but even if we did not have Solder, this regime would need to draft Eli's replacement.
Nate Solder is signed for two more years after this and while he's been an upgrade over what he had :( I'd argue he's in his decline years. Go look at highlights of Williams, almost every play he's pushing the defender backwards not the other way around. And his hip and hand placement is elite.