6 games into the season, we are now 1-5. We are in last place. We've already established that this football team has absolutely no chance at the playoffs and that they are bad.
We all know we need a QB. Whether you think Eli is done now or are hanging onto him playing another 2 years - we need a QB.
Obviously the more we lose, the better our pick will be.
So, the question is simple. Which of these things do you think are more important to the future of the Giants?
Is it more important to win a few games down the stretch, compromise draft position, but build a more positive foundation before next year with a new coach?
OR...
Is winning games from here on out nothing more than something that will make it harder to draft Justin Herbert (or the QB of our choice come April) and something that is only going to hurt the team long-term?
I'm not suggesting the team intentionally set out to lose games.
My question is just from a fan perspective.
What are you rooting for over the final 10 games? Are you actively hoping the team loses? Are you still hoping they'll turn it around somehow and will get back into the division mix? Do you just want to see wins for "pride" or culture?
It's very, very sad that I am posing this question on October 14th, but... the Giants are putrid. They're a truly awful team in disarray and we very clearly need to figure out who Eli's successor is going to be as soon as humanly possible and we need to figure out how to fix this football team. It is broken and it is broken badly. The only team in the NFL with fewer wins over the course of last year and this one are... the Browns.
And sadly, the Browns are now in better shape than the Giants are. I think that's actually inarguable. I would gladly take their roster and their future over what is here right now.
So - what are you rooting for? What do you want to see happen between now and the end of the year?
This team is horrible. Need to rip the bandaid off with the QB situation
I just hope there is a "Franchise QB" out there when we are in a position to take one.
OL ... and what happened to the Giants defense that the Giants have been known for since the 50's? Even when all else was failing they always had a respectable to Good defense.
Oh, of course - this team is awful. We need a ton of help.
The reason I zeroed in on QB in the OP is because that's 100% what we're doing in the draft barring some crazy, unforeseen circumstances - and because it's the most important thing to address.
We need TONS of help elsewhere. We need better WR depth, we need more OL help, we need DB help (particularly @ FS)
But for the Giants, it has to be all about who the next QB is now. It doesn't matter if Eli is here again next year or not - we have to prepare for life after Eli ASAP. It has to start there.
It is like Clemenza said to Michael (while he was making the tomato sauce?) ... "We have to go to war - usually every 10 years to clean out the bullshit" - (or something like that).
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We need more (much more) than just a new QB.
OL ... and what happened to the Giants defense that the Giants have been known for since the 50's? Even when all else was failing they always had a respectable to Good defense.
Oh, of course - this team is awful. We need a ton of help.
The reason I zeroed in on QB in the OP is because that's 100% what we're doing in the draft barring some crazy, unforeseen circumstances - and because it's the most important thing to address.
We need TONS of help elsewhere. We need better WR depth, we need more OL help, we need DB help (particularly @ FS)
But for the Giants, it has to be all about who the next QB is now. It doesn't matter if Eli is here again next year or not - we have to prepare for life after Eli ASAP. It has to start there.
I wish there was a like icon so I would not have to type -
+1
1. Draft the QB
2. Waive Eli
3. Sign a veteran backup QB who can start a few games if we need him to. Someone like Fitzpatrick.
I'm sort of torn on the new GM/HC angle because I feel like 3 new coaches in 3 years is what panicky, chaotic franchises with no plan and no direction do... but I guess that describes us at this point.
I'd like to give the coach a chance with a rookie QB and I'd like to give Gettleman another offseason to work on the OL. I think Reese left this roster in such bad shape that it was nearly impossible to fix in one year.
That said - there's a serious culture issue here. The foundation of this org is rotten and there's no easy answer here.
But I really don't think it'll do us any good to win 5-6 games - I'd rather just be awful. Take the high draft pick, take the QB.. go from there.
#1 pick plus upgrading from this buffoon....that would be amazing
End of story.
No wins are meaningless to all fans..
Wins please,,,always I am watching my boys for a win, and hang in when they lose.... and I have been watching for years..
The 86 season isn't as moving without the shitshow beforehand..
The same could be said for SB42 after the 90's.
If you want to win every year then be a PATS fan...
watch the losses, it make the wins better, stop bitching, they are doing everything from top to bottom to improve the fucking team!
just watch!
To all those looking at the draft next spring...I will be watching that as well
but for the short term, no, it totally sucks!
Ownership needs to be shocked into action.
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Even though we didn't come away with a QB, picking 2nd got you Barkley.
If they had another couple of wins, they'd have missed out on him. The Colts and Texans would both be ahead, and we'd be tied with the Broncos (and not sure if that tiebreaker would have resulted in us being ahead or them).
Would you rather have had another couple of wins last season, as opposed to Barkley?
Yup, going nowhere, I want high draft picks and more roster turnover created.
That's exactly it.
The majority of the roster for the 2019 is already on the team
Your record is a best indication of the quality of your team
With these things in mind I want them to win to show that the have a better team (6 wins) vs a shittier team (3 wins) and have more to build on going forward.
Also add in the fact that what I want dons't impact reality I might as well root for them to win.
I do not want a stupid situation where they win enough to make everyone “feel good” and then either can’t draft the guy they want or have to give up picks/players to move up.
6-10 is just as bad as 1-15, worse because you don’t even get the top pick for your struggles. Just fucking lose and draft well and maybe this team will be on the right track next year.
Just lose baby!
Yup. #suckfortheduck!
That's really more what I was getting at. As a fan, it's a weird spot to be in. It's hard for me to not root for the Giants to win in the midst of a game - but I absolutely would prefer to lose at this point.
More losing might also help flesh out more of the quitters on the roster.
These past couple of years have had to be the most unlikeable Giants teams I can remember in my life, so that makes it easier to hope for losses. I really can't stand this iteration of the team.
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Yes, we are better off losing. Now, if the question was....will you root for the GIants to lose, that's a more reasonable question, IMO.
That's really more what I was getting at. As a fan, it's a weird spot to be in. It's hard for me to not root for the Giants to win in the midst of a game - but I absolutely would prefer to lose at this point.
More losing might also help flesh out more of the quitters on the roster.
These past couple of years have had to be the most unlikeable Giants teams I can remember in my life, so that makes it easier to hope for losses. I really can't stand this iteration of the team.
I know how you feel. For me, I can't root for them to lose(especially in week 6!), but I certainly don't get upset when it happens.
If you feel that is already established, then you'd have to feel losing is better. Now I certainly don't feel this way, but you could argue that in an inconsistent division, there's still a microscopic shred of hope that the Giants can string together a few wins with an easy schedule and get back in this thing.
Again, not my opinion, but that opinion is the only opinion that would lead one to think it isn't better to lose. If you don't feel that way, then you have to think losses help this team's aspirations in the long wrong. And to be clear, I've always been of the opinion that it's fair to say it's best for the team to lose, but also say you aren't rooting for it. For me personally, unless it's literally the last week or two of the season and a top 3 pick is on the line, I've never been able to stomach it.
Others won't root for it, but accept it.
Some, the irrational, don't even accept it.
But from a factual standpoint I agree with others who have said it, this is not even debatable. Every single team that doesn't win it all is probably better off losing every game.
otherwise, how are you better off to improve your team? With pick #1 in every round or pick #31 in every round?
I can tell you, and statistics support it, the closer you draft to #1 the better chance you have of getting a good player.
Others won't root for it, but accept it.
Some, the irrational, don't even accept it.
But from a factual standpoint I agree with others who have said it, this is not even debatable. Every single team that doesn't win it all is probably better off losing every game.
otherwise, how are you better off to improve your team? With pick #1 in every round or pick #31 in every round?
I can tell you, and statistics support it, the closer you draft to #1 the better chance you have of getting a good player.
So, should every NBA team but GSW actively tank beginning tomorrow night?
We can't tolerate another 1-3 years of expansive patches under the guise of putting a winning team on the field.
Unfortunately, much like the way this franchise wasted Manning's golden years the past 6 years, I fear they will do the exact same thing to OBJ and Barkley.
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many fans just can't stomach rooting for their team to lose for a better draft pick.
Others won't root for it, but accept it.
Some, the irrational, don't even accept it.
But from a factual standpoint I agree with others who have said it, this is not even debatable. Every single team that doesn't win it all is probably better off losing every game.
otherwise, how are you better off to improve your team? With pick #1 in every round or pick #31 in every round?
I can tell you, and statistics support it, the closer you draft to #1 the better chance you have of getting a good player.
So, should every NBA team but GSW actively tank beginning tomorrow night?
No. Like I said, after the fact the decision is easy. Nothing worse in the NFL with winding up 7 - 9 or 8 - 8 and even maybe being worse than your record and picking 15th. All said and done, if you miss the playoffs (or don't win it all) you would have been better off losing every game. Do you disagree? It's not really an opinion question.
If you're a contender no one throws in the towel. I guarantee you there are 10 NBA teams who think they could beat GS, maybe more today. Plus, what about injuries? No one knows who will or won't be healthy.
Yep - I agree.
Would be great if they could find ways to win and still get younger/better at all positions of need next year.
Having a 1-15 record may give us cheaper access to the pick of our choice, but it also would mean trying to overcome internal expectations of our players.
So, we build a losing franchise and have to start building a winning culture from scratch next year. Sorry, I wouldn't prefer that. I'd much prefer this team learn to fight through adversity, believe in what the coaches are selling, and learn what it takes to win consistently.
Playoffs or not, it's always better to win imo. 6-10 is double the wins of last year and would mean we went 5-5 the rest of the way. Sounds good to me, even if it drops us to 13-14 in the draft.
If there is a QB we want to target we can make it happen next year. The cost of a few extra picks is less than the cost associated with a losing mindset.
We were 3-13 last year, how's that working out for us?
This thought that we can go from a top five pick to a double digit win and SB contender season the next year is crazy. You need to take steps. Those steps are likely to include middling seasons.
And limit Saquon Barkley’s touches! No more than 200 this year. Screw it - as much as I enjoy watching him play, I’d rather he not incur additional wear and tear in a wasted season.
We were 3-13 last year, how's that working out for us?
This thought that we can go from a top five pick to a double digit win and SB contender season the next year is crazy. You need to take steps. Those steps are likely to include middling seasons.
I guess it depends. If you have a solid core and you're 3 - 13 then making a jump to 8 - 8 or somewhere around there is fine, you're on the upturn.
but if you are 3 - 13 with a rotten core, having a smoke and mirrors season putting yourself in perpetual 8 - 8 land is not a good thing.
It's not about wanting my team to lose. I don't. It's about wanting my team to improve. So while I'm one of those people who won't root for losses, I find the facts simple.
And the whole "culture of winning" is a fan myth IMO. Was there a culture of winning under McAdoo when the Giants went 11 - 5?