6 games into the season, we are now 1-5. We are in last place. We've already established that this football team has absolutely no chance at the playoffs and that they are bad.
We all know we need a QB. Whether you think Eli is done now or are hanging onto him playing another 2 years - we need a QB.
Obviously the more we lose, the better our pick will be.
So, the question is simple. Which of these things do you think are more important to the future of the Giants?
Is it more important to win a few games down the stretch, compromise draft position, but build a more positive foundation before next year with a new coach?
OR...
Is winning games from here on out nothing more than something that will make it harder to draft Justin Herbert (or the QB of our choice come April) and something that is only going to hurt the team long-term?
I'm not suggesting the team intentionally set out to lose games.
My question is just from a fan perspective.
What are you rooting for over the final 10 games? Are you actively hoping the team loses? Are you still hoping they'll turn it around somehow and will get back into the division mix? Do you just want to see wins for "pride" or culture?
It's very, very sad that I am posing this question on October 14th, but... the Giants are putrid. They're a truly awful team in disarray and we very clearly need to figure out who Eli's successor is going to be as soon as humanly possible and we need to figure out how to fix this football team. It is broken and it is broken badly. The only team in the NFL with fewer wins over the course of last year and this one are... the Browns.
And sadly, the Browns are now in better shape than the Giants are. I think that's actually inarguable. I would gladly take their roster and their future over what is here right now.
So - what are you rooting for? What do you want to see happen between now and the end of the year?
That's what people said about this year's QBs and they've already at least flashed in the first 6 games of their career. The QB we draft is NOT going to be perfect when we draft him.
People really have to get that through their thick skulls. Holy shit.
The only thing this thread is about is the "magical thinking" of fans hoping for a high draft pick actually causing the team to lose (which is even more dumb)
It’s easy for fans, especially cynical ones to say, “tank” and get a high draft pick, but that’s just gross. Anyone who played sports know that’s a terrible environment. People always look to be inspired, in sports, in life. Play to win every week. You never know what will happen and allow things to run it’s course. Don’t just give up.
I'm not asking the team to lose on purpose - I'm simply asking what fans would prefer to see happen.
There's an important difference.
Quote:
So I'm fine with winning.
Let's pretend that the Giants agree with you. If the Giants have the #1 pick and a team like Denver wants to trade up for a QB then the Giants could trade down a few spots while grabbing a 2020 1st round pick as part of the package. The Giants could then take a pass rusher or OT with the pick and the extra 2020 1st round pick could end up being in the top 10 along with the Giants. That would give them two premium picks to get one of the top QB's in the 2020 class. That's a good reason for them to lose.
I tend to think this might be the best long term strategy. We have a lot of needs. And Tua might be the real prize.
Good luck with this offense.
The losing culture is endemic to this team because of the dirth of talent at the most important positions.
The Giants cut all the mean, bad guys and they still suck. They gave a bunch of money to old really nice guys and they still suck.
This team is going to keep losing until there is far better QB play, far better offensive line play, and a far better pass rush.
There's no boogie man mystery to the losing of this team. It's the TEAM.
Look back at the draft. The Giants got a lot of good players because they picked near the top every round. That's how it should happen. That's the only way it happens.
The only thing this thread is about is the "magical thinking" of fans hoping for a high draft pick actually causing the team to lose (which is even more dumb)
You don't believe in the power of positive thinking?
I mean, it doesn't work on my stock portfolio, but it has to work somewhere, right?
The biggest disappointment is that the division is weak. They could have and should have had a reasonable shot at the playoffs.
The OL woes I get but what happened to the defense. They are no showing especially in the 2nd half.
You want them to lose in the SB?
Quote:
In comment 14127470 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
So I'm fine with winning.
Let's pretend that the Giants agree with you. If the Giants have the #1 pick and a team like Denver wants to trade up for a QB then the Giants could trade down a few spots while grabbing a 2020 1st round pick as part of the package. The Giants could then take a pass rusher or OT with the pick and the extra 2020 1st round pick could end up being in the top 10 along with the Giants. That would give them two premium picks to get one of the top QB's in the 2020 class. That's a good reason for them to lose.
I tend to think this might be the best long term strategy. We have a lot of needs. And Tua might be the real prize.
The one issue in this scenario is which team has the 2020 1st overall pick. If they need a QB they aren't going to trade the pick unless the Giants offer a franchise crippling package.
There's absolutely no downside to picking at the top. And as an added bonus you get to pick at the top of the other rounds too. Crazy, right?
If they had another couple of wins, they'd have missed out on him. The Colts and Texans would both be ahead, and we'd be tied with the Broncos (and not sure if that tiebreaker would have resulted in us being ahead or them).
Would you rather have had another couple of wins last season, as opposed to Barkley?
If they had another couple of wins, they'd have missed out on him. The Colts and Texans would both be ahead, and we'd be tied with the Broncos (and not sure if that tiebreaker would have resulted in us being ahead or them).
Would you rather have had another couple of wins last season, as opposed to Barkley?
That's exactly it.
Quote:
Do you really think any Giants fan is signing onto management asking the players to sign onto losing intentionally? Nobody I know of is suggesting that and that would never happen.
The only thing this thread is about is the "magical thinking" of fans hoping for a high draft pick actually causing the team to lose (which is even more dumb)
You don't believe in the power of positive thinking?
I mean, it doesn't work on my stock portfolio, but it has to work somewhere, right?
ummm... the power of positive thinking certainly can influence my thoughts... but I'm not ready to sign onto the "magical thinking" that BBI group thoughts can influence third persons... lol
You have to spend money to make money .... money right now is losses. Money in the future hopefully will be wins.
OL ... and what happened to the Giants defense that the Giants have been known for since the 50's? Even when all else was failing they always had a respectable to Good defense.
I guess the caveat there is that we also went from Fassel to Coughlin after the 2003 season and 2003 wasn't Fassel's first year here. He had been here since 97.
I really don't think we are going to fire Shurmur after 1 year even if we go like 3-13. 3 coaches in 3 seasons just screams panic, instability, and chaos.
For better or worse, I think they've got to give Pat time with a new QB and another offseason where Gettleman can continue to hopefully rebuild this OL.
This team is horrible. Need to rip the bandaid off with the QB situation
This team is horrible. Need to rip the bandaid off with the QB situation
I just hope there is a "Franchise QB" out there when we are in a position to take one.
OL ... and what happened to the Giants defense that the Giants have been known for since the 50's? Even when all else was failing they always had a respectable to Good defense.
Oh, of course - this team is awful. We need a ton of help.
The reason I zeroed in on QB in the OP is because that's 100% what we're doing in the draft barring some crazy, unforeseen circumstances - and because it's the most important thing to address.
We need TONS of help elsewhere. We need better WR depth, we need more OL help, we need DB help (particularly @ FS)
But for the Giants, it has to be all about who the next QB is now. It doesn't matter if Eli is here again next year or not - we have to prepare for life after Eli ASAP. It has to start there.
It is like Clemenza said to Michael (while he was making the tomato sauce?) ... "We have to go to war - usually every 10 years to clean out the bullshit" - (or something like that).
Quote:
We need more (much more) than just a new QB.
OL ... and what happened to the Giants defense that the Giants have been known for since the 50's? Even when all else was failing they always had a respectable to Good defense.
Oh, of course - this team is awful. We need a ton of help.
The reason I zeroed in on QB in the OP is because that's 100% what we're doing in the draft barring some crazy, unforeseen circumstances - and because it's the most important thing to address.
We need TONS of help elsewhere. We need better WR depth, we need more OL help, we need DB help (particularly @ FS)
But for the Giants, it has to be all about who the next QB is now. It doesn't matter if Eli is here again next year or not - we have to prepare for life after Eli ASAP. It has to start there.
I wish there was a like icon so I would not have to type -
+1
1. Draft the QB
2. Waive Eli
3. Sign a veteran backup QB who can start a few games if we need him to. Someone like Fitzpatrick.
I'm sort of torn on the new GM/HC angle because I feel like 3 new coaches in 3 years is what panicky, chaotic franchises with no plan and no direction do... but I guess that describes us at this point.
I'd like to give the coach a chance with a rookie QB and I'd like to give Gettleman another offseason to work on the OL. I think Reese left this roster in such bad shape that it was nearly impossible to fix in one year.
That said - there's a serious culture issue here. The foundation of this org is rotten and there's no easy answer here.
But I really don't think it'll do us any good to win 5-6 games - I'd rather just be awful. Take the high draft pick, take the QB.. go from there.
#1 pick plus upgrading from this buffoon....that would be amazing
End of story.