Who has been compared to Sanders ?, since he left - NOBODY.
Sanders is a generational running back (just like Mahomes was a generational QB, two years ago). The Mahomes ship passed, even though McAdoo begged Reese for him.
Is Eli done ?, maybe; but who can judge with the O-line he has ?
Bottom line - the Giants did the right thing picking Barkley. The intelligent thing to do now is "endure the pain" and keep rebuilding the line. Every thing else, will take care of itself.
He also has a great offensive line and a great offensive mind coaching his team. The giants have Barkley and he’s doing everything with zero help. It’s remarkable what he’s able to accomplish
Why do people insist on putting x player above established all-pros? It's not that hard to not have homer goggles on.
Because he’s better. I don’t see why it’s some unfathomable statement. He’s better now than Gurley was at any point during his first 2 years and is as good as him now despite the stark differences in the offenses they play in.
So you pass on a generational back, who will be with you for years and take questionable a franchise QB who may or may not be just that and who were deemed not franchise worthy by a QB guru (who may or may not know a thing or two about QBs)?
I’ll take my chances with an all-world type back and Lauletta or a QB next year in a class I believe are deemed better than this year’s.
But, we only have 1 win. Good eye towards the future. Got it. 😎
The view of a never happy fan. I'm guessing you're still bothered that the 2007 giants didn't win the division, and again disappointed the 2011 giants had only 9 regular season wins.
Of course you're also the guy who would have taken any qb, but manning (Rivers, roethlisberger) in the redo of the 04 draft even though hindsight gives you the benefit of knowing manning guarantees the giants 2 super bowl, while the others is unknown. Which means the possibility of zero titles.
Say “get your giant goggles off” should go take a look at scouts quotes and look at what bill Simmons said. It’s common sense. A back like Barkley is once in a generation. Sam Darnold isn’t the best qb I the damn class. I wonder what people will say 2 years from now when Barkley is a perennial all pro and we have Herbert under center scoring 30 plus every game. I would love to revisit all these discussions
Say “get your giant goggles off” should go take a look at scouts quotes and look at what bill Simmons said. It’s common sense. A back like Barkley is once in a generation. Sam Darnold isn’t the best qb I the damn class. I wonder what people will say 2 years from now when Barkley is a perennial all pro and we have Herbert under center scoring 30 plus every game. I would love to revisit all these discussions
Or maybe even Lauletta. I have little idea about that, but I certainly wouldn’t be surprised. There may be intangibles there that Shurmur sees
But backs can do more on their own than WRs can. I'm convinced we might also have a better record by maybe a game or two if Shurmur was willing to give Barkley the 25-28 touches per game he should be getting. He's also a leader and not an asshole that Beckham is.
at staying objective when it comes to NYG and the NFL...in discussions like this. NYG has always been my childhood team but I am a scout/NFL fan first. That said...right now I rank NFL running backs like this:
Used because there Were few..W.Payton, Eric Dickerson, before my time and the best..Jim Brown...but Barkley is labeled as one..lol..and he hasn't won a game on his own yet. Heck, even emmitt smith single handedly won a game own his own with bad shoulder..carried the team
Life span of a rb isnt as long as a qb for most part.
Barkley is good..call him special when he single handedly wins games
Used because there Were few..W.Payton, Eric Dickerson, before my time and the best..Jim Brown...but Barkley is labeled as one..lol..and he hasn't won a game on his own yet. Heck, even emmitt smith single handedly won a game own his own with bad shoulder..carried the team
Life span of a rb isnt as long as a qb for most part.
Barkley is good..call him special when he single handedly wins games
Perhaps your view that players single handedly win and lose games is too simplistic?
Used because there Were few..W.Payton, Eric Dickerson, before my time and the best..Jim Brown...but Barkley is labeled as one..lol..and he hasn't won a game on his own yet. Heck, even emmitt smith single handedly won a game own his own with bad shoulder..carried the team
Life span of a rb isnt as long as a qb for most part.
Barkley is good..call him special when he single handedly wins games
Perhaps your view that players single handedly win and lose games is too simplistic?
this by saying I was definitely in favor of drafting a QB. However, Barkley is absolutely incredible and so much fun to watch. I really look forward to a time when our team is playing well and contending because he will be even more exciting then. Outside of all the moves, speed, and everything else he has he also carries the ball tight and definitely keeps it secure which is also great. However, doesn’t he have to have a big career like a Sanders, Smith, Dickerson before he is generational? I just find the term a little weird and it seems to be thrown around a lot. Take a guy like Bo Jackson he was a stud and a nasty injury ended his football career. Barkley has all the talent in the world and I think any Giants fan has to love watching him, but I just think he needs to play a little more than six games before you can call him generational. Maybe I am thinking about it wrong, I don’t know.
at staying objective when it comes to NYG and the NFL...in discussions like this. NYG has always been my childhood team but I am a scout/NFL fan first. That said...right now I rank NFL running backs like this:
Barkley has never been just good at football a day in his life. In college he was easily the best player on the field every single game and at least twice this year he’s proven to be the best player on the field as a rookie in the NFL as well.
if we find a qb that is good in the next year or so and can make a run with Barkley, OBJ, and him while we build the rest of the team from the inside out, all will be good and we will have made the right pick. Sort of like Gurley to Goff. If we are in qb hell and don't find a to 10-15 qb, we will have wasted Barkley's career and made a bad pick. I would much prefer the former, but as I said this is really not all that complicated.
The Giants will have an opportunity to pick a good QB this year, and Barkley won't disappear in 10 months.
But look at Gurley, he's not the player he was year one, all things considered. The team, line, coach etc. all are much improved. But from a physical perspective a RB is like a car coming off the lot.
somebody just deleted a thread about conserving Barkley Â
and it was deleted (not sure why but probably because he was getting killed). But I don't think that is a bad idea necessarily. I don't think you do it to tank a season, but I do think with rbs and their short life spans as premier players, teams should look to conserve carries in meaningless football games, akin to what baseball teams do with Pitchers. As long as we are still not eliminated, I have no issue playing Barkley however Shurmur thinks he should be played, but I also think its worth analyzing whether we could elongate his career or any running backs career for that matter when the games are not meaningful or there is little rational purpose in playing them. Could we get another year or two at near peak performance if we did it. I know football teams as a general rule, play you normally if your healthy unless resting for the playoffs, but I would hope the analytic guys in the NFL are asking these types of questions, especially as it pertains to running backs.
The Giants will have an opportunity to pick a good QB this year, and Barkley won't disappear in 10 months.
But look at Gurley, he's not the player he was year one, all things considered. The team, line, coach etc. all are much improved. But from a physical perspective a RB is like a car coming off the lot.
All things considered - like he's having the best season of his career?
Averaging 4.8 ypc...tied for his best mark
11 total TDs...on pace for his best mark
11.8 yards/rec...2nd best mark and well above his rookie season
The Giants will have an opportunity to pick a good QB this year, and Barkley won't disappear in 10 months.
But look at Gurley, he's not the player he was year one, all things considered. The team, line, coach etc. all are much improved. But from a physical perspective a RB is like a car coming off the lot.
All things considered - like he's having the best season of his career?
Averaging 4.8 ypc...tied for his best mark
11 total TDs...on pace for his best mark
11.8 yards/rec...2nd best mark and well above his rookie season
Yes all things considered. The offensive line, overall talent, quarterback and coaching is orders of magnitude better now.
Gurley's rookie season quite literally changed how the league viewed darfting running backs.
Zero doubt in my mind the rookie version of Gurley would eclipse today's version statistically.
The Giants will have an opportunity to pick a good QB this year, and Barkley won't disappear in 10 months.
But look at Gurley, he's not the player he was year one, all things considered. The team, line, coach etc. all are much improved. But from a physical perspective a RB is like a car coming off the lot.
In what way is Gurley not the same player than he was after his rookie year?
then lets always tell the truth. Although we like the fact that Max is saying nice things about Barkley... he does not know shit about football. He should stick to boxing.
Just remember this next week when he says something about the Giants that we dont like.
You can practically telegraph some of the responses on here. Â
The same people who spent all offseason bitching and moaning because the Giants didn't draft a QB are now entirely incapable of just being able to appreciate Barkley's talent. They have to come into every discussion and moan about how meaningless his talent is because the team is going nowhere, as if its going to turn back time to April and replace Barkley with Darnold or Rosen.
Yes, we know the team is going nowhere. Watching Barkley is about the only thing worth tuning in for at this point.
while at the same time wanting to declare Barkley the best in the NFL and the next Sanders.
They're both short-sighted. Right now, Barkley is very impressive - he's had some great runs. It's clear he could be one of the best, if not the best in the NFL, if he had the surrounding cast.
But the same way people preach patience, that the QB position will be resolved, posters need to understand Barkley's not there yet. OBJ opened up his career in an even more impressive manner, and now we are where we are.
Until the offensive performance gets settled out - it's all good, not great. The notion that 'he's the only thing entertaining on the Giants right now' - well, duh. They stink. Again, OBJ redux.
We need to get out of 'good/great individual performances' and back to actually winning football games.
Won't commit to the run game. Go old school style football. Play ball control. Boring football, but own the clock and the rock. Instead we go out of Shot gun all the time.
and the Vikings had some of the worst QBs in the league while AP was there:
Tavaris Jackson
Gus Frerotte
40 year old Favre - AP carried them to NFC Championship
41 year old Favre
Christian Ponder x3
Bridgewater x2 - AP hurt his rookie season, playoffs year 2
When a 40 year old Favre is the best QB you play with, you're not going to go very far. I hope the Giants can find someone at least that good to pair with Barkley.
Whether it's for 1 year or longterm - Barkley is my first pick. I don't see other backs doing what he is doing with no help whatsoever. Kamara and Gurley are in the equation and you can make an argument for either, but I'm taking Barkley if you're asking me to pick my RB. That makes him the best back in football in my view.
while at the same time wanting to declare Barkley the best in the NFL and the next Sanders.
They're both short-sighted. Right now, Barkley is very impressive - he's had some great runs. It's clear he could be one of the best, if not the best in the NFL, if he had the surrounding cast.
But the same way people preach patience, that the QB position will be resolved, posters need to understand Barkley's not there yet. OBJ opened up his career in an even more impressive manner, and now we are where we are.
Until the offensive performance gets settled out - it's all good, not great. The notion that 'he's the only thing entertaining on the Giants right now' - well, duh. They stink. Again, OBJ redux.
We need to get out of 'good/great individual performances' and back to actually winning football games.
I'll take what I can get. The giants suck, but I have no control over that, so again I'll take what I can get. I've started to realize for me the best way I can approach giants football is to be entertained. That is the reason why I watch sports in the first place. To each their own, I certainly do not have any right to suggest how people should handle their sports. For me it's much healthier and more enjoyable to treat it as entertainment, which it really is in respect to the real issues that we deal with in life.
Btw, I'm a patience preacher, which of course I've been mocked for, but again to each their own.
Link - ( New Window )
"When I see Barkley, I see Barry Sanders"
Who has been compared to Sanders ?, since he left - NOBODY.
Sanders is a generational running back (just like Mahomes was a generational QB, two years ago). The Mahomes ship passed, even though McAdoo begged Reese for him.
Is Eli done ?, maybe; but who can judge with the O-line he has ?
Bottom line - the Giants did the right thing picking Barkley. The intelligent thing to do now is "endure the pain" and keep rebuilding the line. Every thing else, will take care of itself.
Why do people insist on putting x player above established all-pros? It's not that hard to not have homer goggles on.
+1
If Barkley plays behind that line he is running for 200 yards on the regular.
Quote:
Gurley.
Why do people insist on putting x player above established all-pros? It's not that hard to not have homer goggles on.
Because he’s better. I don’t see why it’s some unfathomable statement. He’s better now than Gurley was at any point during his first 2 years and is as good as him now despite the stark differences in the offenses they play in.
Do you watch what he does?
Quote:
Gurley.
Why do people insist on putting x player above established all-pros? It's not that hard to not have homer goggles on.
Oh jeez, what bothers you about one's opinion? This is a weird post considering its at least arguable.
BFD.
BFD.
So you pass on a generational back, who will be with you for years and take questionable a franchise QB who may or may not be just that and who were deemed not franchise worthy by a QB guru (who may or may not know a thing or two about QBs)?
I’ll take my chances with an all-world type back and Lauletta or a QB next year in a class I believe are deemed better than this year’s.
But, we only have 1 win. Good eye towards the future. Got it. 😎
BFD.
That’s about as short sighted as it gets. We’d be 0-6 with Darnold but we’d “have the future”, right?
BFD.
The view of a never happy fan. I'm guessing you're still bothered that the 2007 giants didn't win the division, and again disappointed the 2011 giants had only 9 regular season wins.
Of course you're also the guy who would have taken any qb, but manning (Rivers, roethlisberger) in the redo of the 04 draft even though hindsight gives you the benefit of knowing manning guarantees the giants 2 super bowl, while the others is unknown. Which means the possibility of zero titles.
Self appointed genius
Or maybe even Lauletta. I have little idea about that, but I certainly wouldn’t be surprised. There may be intangibles there that Shurmur sees
1 - Alvin Kamara
2 - Saquon Barkley
3 - Todd Gurley
4 - Kareem Hunt
5 - Ezekiel Elliot
Life span of a rb isnt as long as a qb for most part.
Barkley is good..call him special when he single handedly wins games
Life span of a rb isnt as long as a qb for most part.
Barkley is good..call him special when he single handedly wins games
Perhaps your view that players single handedly win and lose games is too simplistic?
Quote:
Used because there Were few..W.Payton, Eric Dickerson, before my time and the best..Jim Brown...but Barkley is labeled as one..lol..and he hasn't won a game on his own yet. Heck, even emmitt smith single handedly won a game own his own with bad shoulder..carried the team
Life span of a rb isnt as long as a qb for most part.
Barkley is good..call him special when he single handedly wins games
Perhaps your view that players single handedly win and lose games is too simplistic?
Nope..it isnt..thank you
Barry Sanders played on as many 9+ loss teams as playoff teams, and participated in exactly one postseason victory.
Gayle Sayers lead the NFL in rushing in 1966 and 1969 and those teams were 5-7-2 and 1-13, respectively.
Barkley is great. No denying it. That alone is not enough.
1 - Alvin Kamara
2 - Saquon Barkley
3 - Todd Gurley
4 - Kareem Hunt
5 - Ezekiel Elliot
Time will tell of course. Something tells me Kamara doesn’t hold up long term, however. Ditto for hunt.
But look at Gurley, he's not the player he was year one, all things considered. The team, line, coach etc. all are much improved. But from a physical perspective a RB is like a car coming off the lot.
But look at Gurley, he's not the player he was year one, all things considered. The team, line, coach etc. all are much improved. But from a physical perspective a RB is like a car coming off the lot.
All things considered - like he's having the best season of his career?
Averaging 4.8 ypc...tied for his best mark
11 total TDs...on pace for his best mark
11.8 yards/rec...2nd best mark and well above his rookie season
Quote:
The Giants will have an opportunity to pick a good QB this year, and Barkley won't disappear in 10 months.
But look at Gurley, he's not the player he was year one, all things considered. The team, line, coach etc. all are much improved. But from a physical perspective a RB is like a car coming off the lot.
All things considered - like he's having the best season of his career?
Averaging 4.8 ypc...tied for his best mark
11 total TDs...on pace for his best mark
11.8 yards/rec...2nd best mark and well above his rookie season
Yes all things considered. The offensive line, overall talent, quarterback and coaching is orders of magnitude better now.
Gurley's rookie season quite literally changed how the league viewed darfting running backs.
Zero doubt in my mind the rookie version of Gurley would eclipse today's version statistically.
But look at Gurley, he's not the player he was year one, all things considered. The team, line, coach etc. all are much improved. But from a physical perspective a RB is like a car coming off the lot.
In what way is Gurley not the same player than he was after his rookie year?
I'm not saying it's not great to have him, but if we can't get the rest of the house in order, it will be a wasted asset.
Just remember this next week when he says something about the Giants that we dont like.
Yes, we know the team is going nowhere. Watching Barkley is about the only thing worth tuning in for at this point.
And I've been around a long time.
If they can keep him in one piece, fast lane HOF.
I'm not saying it's not great to have him, but if we can't get the rest of the house in order, it will be a wasted asset.
Jim Brown won a championship with crap at QB.
Emmitt Smith anchored several championship offenses.
Marshawn Lynch carried a Seahawks offense to a SB title.
Terrell Davis carried Elway and the Broncos to 2 titles.
Faulk was the heart & soul of the greatest show on turf.
Dan Marino has 0 rings.
Philip Rivers has 0 rings.
Elway has no rings without TD.
Rodgers/Brees - arguably 2 of the top 10 QBs all time have 2 rings combined.
Warren Moon has no rings.
They're both short-sighted. Right now, Barkley is very impressive - he's had some great runs. It's clear he could be one of the best, if not the best in the NFL, if he had the surrounding cast.
But the same way people preach patience, that the QB position will be resolved, posters need to understand Barkley's not there yet. OBJ opened up his career in an even more impressive manner, and now we are where we are.
Until the offensive performance gets settled out - it's all good, not great. The notion that 'he's the only thing entertaining on the Giants right now' - well, duh. They stink. Again, OBJ redux.
We need to get out of 'good/great individual performances' and back to actually winning football games.
Tavaris Jackson
Gus Frerotte
40 year old Favre - AP carried them to NFC Championship
41 year old Favre
Christian Ponder x3
Bridgewater x2 - AP hurt his rookie season, playoffs year 2
When a 40 year old Favre is the best QB you play with, you're not going to go very far. I hope the Giants can find someone at least that good to pair with Barkley.
They're both short-sighted. Right now, Barkley is very impressive - he's had some great runs. It's clear he could be one of the best, if not the best in the NFL, if he had the surrounding cast.
But the same way people preach patience, that the QB position will be resolved, posters need to understand Barkley's not there yet. OBJ opened up his career in an even more impressive manner, and now we are where we are.
Until the offensive performance gets settled out - it's all good, not great. The notion that 'he's the only thing entertaining on the Giants right now' - well, duh. They stink. Again, OBJ redux.
We need to get out of 'good/great individual performances' and back to actually winning football games.
I'll take what I can get. The giants suck, but I have no control over that, so again I'll take what I can get. I've started to realize for me the best way I can approach giants football is to be entertained. That is the reason why I watch sports in the first place. To each their own, I certainly do not have any right to suggest how people should handle their sports. For me it's much healthier and more enjoyable to treat it as entertainment, which it really is in respect to the real issues that we deal with in life.
Btw, I'm a patience preacher, which of course I've been mocked for, but again to each their own.