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Should the Jets sit Sam Darnold ? ...

Manny in CA : 11/4/2018 11:31 pm

ESPN's Graziano thinks so. (Me I don't care, but as Arte Johnson used to say - "verty inter-esting")

http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/25178405/let-overreact-nfl-week-9-new-orleans-saints-2018-super-bowl-picks

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At this point, no  
jcn56 : 11/5/2018 12:04 am : link
but he shouldn't have started right off the bat. They had McCown, should have just let him start the season and eventually inserted Darnold after he had some practice reps under his belt.

They skipped that, so might as well get him the experience and exposure than bench him at this point.
Your thoughts, Mr. Gettleman...  
bceagle05 : 11/5/2018 12:11 am : link
No, He Should Continue to Start  
Giants34 : 11/5/2018 12:18 am : link
Once you commit to a rookie QB, the worst thing you can possibly do is bench him or otherwise yank him around. Look, by all accounts, Darnold was horrid today. And he has had his ups and downs.

Because of the quick success that some QBs have experienced recently, people forget that rookie QBs struggle. It's what they do. Miami's D is actually good. Anyone judging Darnold by what he is doing right now or even this year is not giving him a fair shot. Eli was not good his first few starts, either, and he turned out fine, notwithstanding the last few years.

Fact is, Darnold has little talent surrounding him, and his system does him no favors. People should really think about how others wrote Goff off so quickly only three years ago, and he now leads one of the best offenses in the history of the sport.
look at Goff  
RAIN : 11/5/2018 12:41 am : link
... he was terrible. I wouldn't. You need him to get back out there. It's not like he's got a great supporting cast.
No. They can't.  
Leg of Theismann : 11/5/2018 1:20 am : link
You wanna talk about messing with a young QB's confidence. He can throw a bunch of picks in his first season and he should understand that's going to happen as a rookie, I mean look at Peyton's rookie year. But if you bench the kid I just feel like you're saying "our #3 overall pick is the reason we're losing and shouldn't be the starter". Then what happens next year? You put him back in there and let's say he has a bit of a rough start to the year... do you bench him again? What does that say about your confidence in him for the long term?

You have continue to have confidence in him to develop and let him take his lumps, and he has to understand that this just comes with being a rookie QB in the NFL. He's only going to learn with more experience so you might as well keep him out there.
RE: No, He Should Continue to Start  
Deejboy : 11/5/2018 2:01 am : link
In comment 14165060 Giants34 said:
Quote:
Once you commit to a rookie QB, the worst thing you can possibly do is bench him or otherwise yank him around. Look, by all accounts, Darnold was horrid today. And he has had his ups and downs.

Because of the quick success that some QBs have experienced recently, people forget that rookie QBs struggle. It's what they do. Miami's D is actually good. Anyone judging Darnold by what he is doing right now or even this year is not giving him a fair shot. Eli was not good his first few starts, either, and he turned out fine, notwithstanding the last few years.

Fact is, Darnold has little talent surrounding him, and his system does him no favors. People should really think about how others wrote Goff off so quickly only three years ago, and he now leads one of the best offenses in the history of the sport.

Or maybe Darnold isn't that good? He is regressing this year and that is what is scary. You can deal with a young QB as long as he shows some improvement. The narrative that the Jets writers were selling was "he doesn't make the same mistake twice." Well he does. A lot. He should have had 6 INTs in this game. Yeah, he doesn't have talent around him but he is part of that. A QB can elevate the talent around him and his poor decision making is making it much worse. He should get better but the thing is he didn't get better at USC. He is what he is. A turnover prone QB.

He isn't close to Peyton. He isn't nearly as talented as Eli coming out of college. He isn't even Sam Bradford or Blake Bortles. Is there any evidence he is as talented as Goff? No. Darnold was a guy that was always overhyped as a player until he actually played. The more you saw him at USC, the more you questioned him as a NFL QB. The Jets might find themselves in QB hell for a long time cause they are tied to him. A bad NFL QB pick can really set you back as a franchise cause you can't abandon him and just have to pray he gets better until you realize he is just not good.
No, you would mess him up doing that  
montanagiant : 11/5/2018 2:21 am : link
Plus you will know by the end of the year if you actually have something or not if you keep him starting.

Sink or swim is what any true competitor would want
Bceagles05  
Tuckrule : 11/5/2018 5:09 am : link
Awesome! Thread over
Has there been  
RobThailand : 11/5/2018 5:29 am : link
any rookie QB that played lights out his first season. Im really asking the question not being sarcastic. I cannot think of any

thanks
Has there been  
RobThailand : 11/5/2018 5:31 am : link
any rookie QB that played lights out his first season. Im really asking the question not being sarcastic. I cannot think of any. Was Foles a rookie that had a good first season

thanks
I have no idea how good Darnold is going to be  
mattnyg05 : 11/5/2018 6:05 am : link
but does anyone remember Elis first 3 games?
RE: Your thoughts, Mr. Gettleman...  
Les in TO : 11/5/2018 6:05 am : link
In comment 14165059 bceagle05 said:
Quote:
at 1-7 Dave does not get to laugh at anyone
Its not like  
BigBlueDownTheShore : 11/5/2018 6:11 am : link
Eli threw 4 picks against the Vikings in the 2007 Super Bowl run.
Or Eli  
BigBlueDownTheShore : 11/5/2018 6:12 am : link
Had a 0.0 QB rating against the Ravens his first season
No.  
Big Blue '56 : 11/5/2018 6:40 am : link
Its not like he wasnt reported to be a TO machine in college. He needs to work through it, continue to feel the pace of the NFL game and take in all the teaching he can. You dont get that on the bench as rookie Eli showed once he was installed the starter.
It's all the learning process  
micky : 11/5/2018 6:43 am : link
Take bumps in the beginning.
RE: No.  
section125 : 11/5/2018 6:48 am : link
In comment 14165100 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
Its not like he wasnt reported to be a TO machine in college. He needs to work through it, continue to feel the pace of the NFL game and take in all the teaching he can. You dont get that on the bench as rookie Eli showed once he was installed the starter.


How will he ever learn what defenses are doing to him, unless he lives it and then gets to see it on tape? I don't think he is a dummy.
He needs to play. He needs time watching game tape in order to recognize the disguises that Ds are throwing at him.

And yes, everyone knew he gave up lots of TOs.
That Gettleman gif has me rolling  
Optimus-NY : 11/5/2018 6:49 am : link
lol
So do people still think we made the wrong choice with  
Couchy : 11/5/2018 6:50 am : link
Saquon!?!?
RE: So do people still think we made the wrong choice with  
Big Blue '56 : 11/5/2018 6:52 am : link
In comment 14165107 Couchy said:
Quote:
Saquon!?!?


Of course not. But, it has nothing to do with Darnold. Way too early
RE: RE: So do people still think we made the wrong choice with  
crick n NC : 11/5/2018 6:54 am : link
In comment 14165108 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
In comment 14165107 Couchy said:


Quote:


Saquon!?!?



Of course not. But, it has nothing to do with Darnold. Way too early


👍
No value in sitting him now  
giants#1 : 11/5/2018 7:36 am : link
but if a QB is so mentally weak that benching him destroys his confidence, then he was likely doomed to failure anyway.
RE: No value in sitting him now  
UConn4523 : 11/5/2018 7:43 am : link
In comment 14165123 giants#1 said:
Quote:
but if a QB is so mentally weak that benching him destroys his confidence, then he was likely doomed to failure anyway.


I think it has more to do with his teammates than him. If the coaching staff loses confidence in the QB, so will the rest of the team. No choice but to ride it out.
RE: RE: No value in sitting him now  
jcn56 : 11/5/2018 7:45 am : link
In comment 14165127 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
In comment 14165123 giants#1 said:


Quote:


but if a QB is so mentally weak that benching him destroys his confidence, then he was likely doomed to failure anyway.



I think it has more to do with his teammates than him. If the coaching staff loses confidence in the QB, so will the rest of the team. No choice but to ride it out.


I think you might have that the other way around - right now, it sounds as if the Jets defensive players have lost confidence in their coaching staff.

If the Jets somehow manage to finish up this year and not can their coaches, they deserve what they get.
Darnold is very young  
Marty866b : 11/5/2018 7:52 am : link
With not even two full years of starting at the college level. He's is also playing with the worst set of skill position players in the league and behind a subpar offensive line. He is younger then the quarterbacks coming out this year. I don't see how anyone can come to any kind of conclusion on what kind of quarterback Darnold,or any of the rookies will be.
RE: RE: RE: No value in sitting him now  
UConn4523 : 11/5/2018 7:56 am : link
In comment 14165131 jcn56 said:
Quote:
In comment 14165127 UConn4523 said:


Quote:


In comment 14165123 giants#1 said:


Quote:


but if a QB is so mentally weak that benching him destroys his confidence, then he was likely doomed to failure anyway.



I think it has more to do with his teammates than him. If the coaching staff loses confidence in the QB, so will the rest of the team. No choice but to ride it out.



I think you might have that the other way around - right now, it sounds as if the Jets defensive players have lost confidence in their coaching staff.

If the Jets somehow manage to finish up this year and not can their coaches, they deserve what they get.


I think thats 2 separate scenarios. They never had a strong coaching staff there to begin with so they will be the first to go. Benching Darnold on top of it would be a catastrophe.
He should definitely not be seated  
Chris684 : 11/5/2018 7:59 am : link
It is really, really hard to become a Super Bowl caliber franchise QB with any longevity in the NFL.
I hope everyone remembers this when our new QB be it Lauletta  
Blue21 : 11/5/2018 8:11 am : link
or whoever starts his first few games.
Think about the receivers and WR Injuries the Jets have had...  
Rafflee : 11/5/2018 8:15 am : link
He's playing with a Rotating cast...and that cast is not yet established.

This is the look you get when you splash a young qb on to a losing squad.... it's Ugly. They need to give him things he can do well and they need to get something steady around him....and He needs to continue to play.
he should only be benched  
fkap : 11/5/2018 8:19 am : link
if the game is getting faster instead of slower.

That can be a type of shell shock, too.

Then it's time to stop, sit back, and take a breather.

IMO, that can only be assessed in person.

rookies can hit the wall mentally, too.
RE: Darnold is very young  
AcidTest : 11/5/2018 8:31 am : link
In comment 14165139 Marty866b said:
Quote:
With not even two full years of starting at the college level. He's is also playing with the worst set of skill position players in the league and behind a subpar offensive line. He is younger then the quarterbacks coming out this year. I don't see how anyone can come to any kind of conclusion on what kind of quarterback Darnold,or any of the rookies will be.


Agreed. i was fine taking Barkley or Darnold, but judging Darnold as a failure now under these circumstances is ridiculous.
Give him time to develop.  
FStubbs : 11/5/2018 8:43 am : link
It almost doesn't matter how badly he sucks right now as long as he's getting reps in games and learning.

Tune back in in a couple of years.
Everybody is different.  
Pepe LePugh : 11/5/2018 8:46 am : link
I have had good results personally stepping away from something for a bit before I get frustrated with my lack of progress. It's not a bad thing to be able to recharge and let brain and body absorb the experience before bad habits become too entrenched.
RE: Has there been  
jeffusedtobeonwebtv : 11/5/2018 8:48 am : link
In comment 14165085 RobThailand said:
Quote:
any rookie QB that played lights out his first season. Im really asking the question not being sarcastic. I cannot think of any

thanks


Dan Marino.
Also Darnold literally  
BigBlueDownTheShore : 11/5/2018 8:59 am : link
Has 2 starting seasons in the NCAA level and 2 High School seasons as a starter.

So his 5th year playing QB in total, he's playing in the NFL, which is impressive, but he surely has some learning to do.
I'd sit him  
UberAlias : 11/5/2018 9:00 am : link
Until they get a competent coach.
RE: Has there been  
DonQuixote : 11/5/2018 9:13 am : link
In comment 14165086 RobThailand said:
Quote:
any rookie QB that played lights out his first season. Im really asking the question not being sarcastic. I cannot think of any. Was Foles a rookie that had a good first season

thanks


Dak Prescott
RE: I hope everyone remembers this when our new QB be it Lauletta  
DonQuixote : 11/5/2018 9:14 am : link
In comment 14165154 Blue21 said:
Quote:
or whoever starts his first few games.


Excellent post
Absolutely not.  
Keith : 11/5/2018 9:19 am : link
This experience is vital to his success. The guy has a brutally bad supporting cast. They should let him take his lumps, get another top player in next years draft and hope he grows.
RE: RE: Has there been  
BigBlueDownTheShore : 11/5/2018 9:20 am : link
In comment 14165241 DonQuixote said:
Quote:
In comment 14165086 RobThailand said:


Quote:


any rookie QB that played lights out his first season. Im really asking the question not being sarcastic. I cannot think of any. Was Foles a rookie that had a good first season

thanks



Dak Prescott


He joined a win now team with the best line in football, along with the best RB. He wasn't lighting it up in the passing game, more of a game manager, but he played well.

Jets have a terrible line, and no playmakers on offense. It's night and day.
He has a lot of similarities to Eli  
bigblue12 : 11/5/2018 9:21 am : link
and has performed better than Eli in his rookie season. It would be moronic to sit him. He is going to be a good one.
Eli was pretty terrible his rookie year, wasn't he?  
Greg from LI : 11/5/2018 9:24 am : link
It's a bit too soon to make any definitive statements about what Darnold is or isn't.
RE: Eli was pretty terrible his rookie year, wasn't he?  
Britt in VA : 11/5/2018 9:39 am : link
In comment 14165261 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
It's a bit too soon to make any definitive statements about what Darnold is or isn't.


It absolutely is too early. Been saying that since the weekly Sam Darnold threads started in preseason.
No. When they decided SD was the starter  
NoPeanutz : 11/5/2018 9:44 am : link
he's got to be the starter. It's not like the Jets are competing for anything this year. 2018 exists only to give Darnold reps and let him make mistakes.
I dont get this kind of stuff  
gmen9892 : 11/5/2018 9:46 am : link
Rookies have been coming into the NFL for YEARS and very few do well right off the bat. Even fewer do well when they are surrounded by horrible talent from the OL to the weapons they have to throw to.

At this point, they need him to take his lumps and try to fight through this. You need to find out how the kid deals with adversity.

In the end, the Jets were never going to contend this year. You might as well stack up the L's and get a better draft pick next year so that you can put together a good OL and give Darnold some pieces to work with.
No  
Jay on the Island : 11/5/2018 10:01 am : link
Unless the line starts to fall apart and he takes a beating. This is all part of the maturation process. Let him work his way through it. He has a similar personality to Eli in that he doesnt let his poor performances affect his confidence. He will be better off in the long run by playing.
Another false statement being promoted....  
sxdxca : 11/5/2018 10:02 am : link
The fallacy that Darnold was a turnover machine, and Eli Manning wasn't in college is simply an untruth.

Here are Sam Darnold's numbers in college, when he was 19 years old

Year 2016 67% cmp 3086 yards 31 TD 9 Int 161 QB Rating,
Year 2017 63% cmp 4143 yards 26 TD 13 Int 148 QB Rating

Eli Mannings's college stats from his 2002 year, he threw 15 interceptions in 13 games. So people calling Darnold a turnover machine, are the same people that justify Manning's turnover ratio in college, which was worse than Darnold's.

Furthermore, Manning was 23 years old when he entered the NFL, Darnold is only 21 years old. In other words, Eli wasn't good enough at 21 to be in the league, he had to wait two more years. And after waiting till he was 23 his rookie year was still horrific. Here are his stats, and I'm an Eli fan...

2004 48% 1048 yards 6 TD 9 Int 55 QB Rating.

Eli lost his first 6 games, and didn't win one until the very last game in the season. So no, in my opinion Darnold was rated very high, and even with the bad game he had, I'll still take him right now.

Give him Beckham, Engram and Shepard, compared to his bottom five receiving core, and its a different story. He's light years ahead of Eli when Eli was a rookie, and I was an Eli fan, even though it took him years to finally develop.
It's way too soon to definitively discount Darnold...  
Chris684 : 11/5/2018 10:03 am : link
The comparisons to Eli are fun though.

Eli put up a 0.0 rating, that everyone loves to toss out there, against a Baltimore Ravens defense that featured 3 Hall of Famers in Ed Reed, Ray Lewis and Terrell Suggs plus guys like Chris McAlister and Bart Scott. This was before the league fully neutered defenses like it has today. You think Darnold has faced a defense on the same planet as that one at any point this year? Go look at this Miami defense that the Jets just scored 6 points on.

There is pretty much no comparison to be made as far as defense in the league from then and now.

Also funny, I don't remember NYG fans being as patient with Eli as they are with Sam Darnold.
RE: Your thoughts, Mr. Gettleman...  
gmenatlarge : 11/5/2018 10:06 am : link
In comment 14165059 bceagle05 said:
Quote:


What does he have to laugh about?????
RE: Another false statement being promoted....  
Diver_Down : 11/5/2018 10:06 am : link
In comment 14165328 sxdxca said:
Quote:
The fallacy that Darnold was a turnover machine, and Eli Manning wasn't in college is simply an untruth.

Here are Sam Darnold's numbers in college, when he was 19 years old

Year 2016 67% cmp 3086 yards 31 TD 9 Int 161 QB Rating,
Year 2017 63% cmp 4143 yards 26 TD 13 Int 148 QB Rating

Eli Mannings's college stats from his 2002 year, he threw 15 interceptions in 13 games. So people calling Darnold a turnover machine, are the same people that justify Manning's turnover ratio in college, which was worse than Darnold's.

Furthermore, Manning was 23 years old when he entered the NFL, Darnold is only 21 years old. In other words, Eli wasn't good enough at 21 to be in the league, he had to wait two more years. And after waiting till he was 23 his rookie year was still horrific. Here are his stats, and I'm an Eli fan...

2004 48% 1048 yards 6 TD 9 Int 55 QB Rating.

Eli lost his first 6 games, and didn't win one until the very last game in the season. So no, in my opinion Darnold was rated very high, and even with the bad game he had, I'll still take him right now.

Give him Beckham, Engram and Shepard, compared to his bottom five receiving core, and its a different story. He's light years ahead of Eli when Eli was a rookie, and I was an Eli fan, even though it took him years to finally develop.


You are so intellectually dishonest. You start off by stating the "fallacy" that Darnold was a turnover machine, then you try to disprove the point by only quoting INTs. Besides his INTs, he was also prone to treating the football like it was bocce. There is a reason he is called Doll-Hands Darnold.
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