Rookie maximums for at-bats (130), games pitched (30) or innings (50) in the major leagues"
If the 2 leaders are within 5% of each other, or the leader has less than 35% there will be a run-off between the top 2. If a run-off results in a tie the tiebreaker will be vote total in the previous poll, we will continue to "go back" in the polls until there is a clear leader.
*Jeff McNeil is ineligible
*Chris Flexen is ineligible
1) Andres Gimenez (SS) AA 19/37 votes- 51%
2) Peter Alonso (1B) AAA 24/36 votes- 67%
3) Jarred Kelenic (CF) Kingsport 31/36-86%
4) Ronny Mauricio (SS) Kingsport 12/33-36%
5) Justin Dunn (RHP) AA 10/37-27%, Run-off with Mark Vientos 17/30-57%
6) Mark Vientos (3b) Kingsport 16/31-52%
7) David Peterson (LHP) A+ 21/31- 68%
8) Franklyn Kilome (RHP) AA 20/33-61%
9) Thomas Szapucki (LHP) A 18/32-56%
10) Shervyen Newton (SS) Kingsport 12/30-40%, Run-off with Anthony Kay 17/33-52%
11) Anthony Kay (LHP) AA 18/26-69%
12) Simeon Woods-Richardson (RHP) Kingsport 12/30-40%
13) Luis Santana (2B) 15/26-58%
14) Will Toffey (3B) 10/29-34%, run-off with Cecchini 15/27-56%
15) Gavin Cecchini (2b) 14/26-46%
16) Francisco Alvarez (C) 9/26-35%
17) Dez Lindsay (OF) 7/18-39%
18) Tony Dibrell (RHP) 9/23-39%
19) Jordan Humphreys (RHP) 7/21-33%, Run-off with Nido 18/24-75%
20) Ross Adolph (OF) 6/25-24%, run-off with Nido 18/25-72%
21) Adam Hill (RHP) 4/26-15%, Run-off with Nido/Crismatt 11/26-58%
22) Junior Santos (RHP) 6/28-21%, Run-off with Nido 11/20-55%
23) Tomas Nido (C) 10/23-43%
24) Luis Guillorme (SS) 9/24-38%
25) Adrian Hernandez 6/26-23%, run-off with Wahl/Cortes 8/15-53%
26) Carlos Cortes (2b) 8/21-38%
on the type of offseason plan that might be in place now that the decision has been made on BVW?
I missed his presser and haven't read or seen much since.
Not particularly. No knock on BVW at all but he's simply parroted buzzwords. Back to winning, stronger up the middle. Thus far there has been absolutely zero hint of targets or play (not a criticism) rather there just hasn't been anything to go on.
I hadn't realized Machado's agent was also Piazza's
though he was also Beltran's agent after he left Boras, probably in the exact moment the petty bs went on in the press. Was also A-Rod's agent. I've probably been the least optimistic person that there's actually a chance but if the Yankees + Dodgers aren't heavy in the bidding the Mets do make a ton of sense.
Roessler didn't appear to be a great hire in the first place. Sandy didn't really put Callaway in the best position to succeed outside of Eiland. DiScarcina was an especially strange call #Mets
Those first 12 are not a bad crop of young ballplayers. I guess Kilome has to be devalued for a season, and at least 1 of those LHP should work out. There's a couple of promising shortstops.
Trouble is....half this list is at Kingsport, moving up to Columbia.
1) Andres Gimenez (SS) AA 19/37 votes- 51%
2) Peter Alonso (1B) AAA 24/36 votes- 67%
3) Jarred Kelenic (CF) Kingsport 31/36-86%
4) Ronny Mauricio (SS) Kingsport 12/33-36%
5) Justin Dunn (RHP) AA 10/37-27%, Run-off with Mark Vientos 17/30-57%
6) Mark Vientos (3b) Kingsport 16/31-52%
7) David Peterson (LHP) A+ 21/31- 68%
8) Franklyn Kilome (RHP) AA 20/33-61%
9) Thomas Szapucki (LHP) A 18/32-56%
10) Shervyen Newton (SS) Kingsport 12/30-40%, Run-off with Anthony Kay 17/33-52%
11) Anthony Kay (LHP) AA 18/26-69%
12) Simeon Woods-Richardson (RHP) Kingsport 12/30-40%
Those first 12 are not a bad crop of young ballplayers. I guess Kilome has to be devalued for a season, and at least 1 of those LHP should work out. There's a couple of promising shortstops.
Trouble is....half this list is at Kingsport, moving up to Columbia.
1) Andres Gimenez (SS) AA 19/37 votes- 51%
2) Peter Alonso (1B) AAA 24/36 votes- 67%
3) Jarred Kelenic (CF) Kingsport 31/36-86%
4) Ronny Mauricio (SS) Kingsport 12/33-36%
5) Justin Dunn (RHP) AA 10/37-27%, Run-off with Mark Vientos 17/30-57%
6) Mark Vientos (3b) Kingsport 16/31-52%
7) David Peterson (LHP) A+ 21/31- 68%
8) Franklyn Kilome (RHP) AA 20/33-61%
9) Thomas Szapucki (LHP) A 18/32-56%
10) Shervyen Newton (SS) Kingsport 12/30-40%, Run-off with Anthony Kay 17/33-52%
11) Anthony Kay (LHP) AA 18/26-69%
12) Simeon Woods-Richardson (RHP) Kingsport 12/30-40%
Kilome would have dropped down a bit had the TJ news come before the ranking. Not a ton but as far as 12 I would think
on a post that mentioned signing Machado, signing Ramos, and dumping Frazier and Bruce. Guessing that's already a bad look with somebody like Fraizer who he has represented and has a relationship with.
I expect an active Mets offseason. A bunch of teams are going to be "in on" many of the big players and I don't believe there is such a thing as a realistic target, really for any team, unless they are a lesser talent.
Colon was really, really bad last year. I can't even advocate signing him for depth. 5.47 FIP. Fun to watch but pass. https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/c/colonba01.shtml
But I have a feeling BVW is going to be a bit like Omar this offseason and make a splash early and in this particular case Im ok with it (three aces together and in their primes and half a lineup of young position player prospects to build around its now or never)
The Mets payroll has had the ability to go up higher than its been for years now IMO, and it simply wasn't Sandy's philosophy to max out the payroll or dole out a bunch of long term contracts. We can hate Sandy all we want but there's virtually zero contracts on the books after 2020 which is nice. Ill never understand why fans think think every single teams payroll is their absolute max in which they can spend. You do have to allow flexibility in case a guy goes down to injury or you intend to extend or pay some of your own players eventually.
Things might tilt back the other way now though (zero chance BVW takes this job without payroll spending assurances) but hell after so many years of losing, Im ready for it. Let's just hope in 5 years we aren't in payroll hell ala Omar all over again.
Colon was really, really bad last year. I can't even advocate signing him for depth. 5.47 FIP. Fun to watch but pass. https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/c/colonba01.shtml
Yeah no thanks on Colon. If you look at Vargas's numbers after his first 3-4 starts in which he had no ST (was pitching in front of a net?), he pitched pretty much exactly like the 5th starter you would want.
IOW, he didn't draft them, it's not even like a guy hired/promoted from within where he was part of the team making the selection and grooming the prospects.
He has no loyalty to any of them and could trade all of them.
And as much as it scares me because I feel better about the farm system than any time in my recent memory even when it was rated top 10, it may actually be for the best.
I'm sort of conservative wrt prospects and my ideal scenario is to see them all kept and developed and debut a home grown roster that wins a title (to an extent), but maybe a fresh approach with zero emotional investment can turn prospects into young players with potential or turn prospects into established young players.
I suspect BVW is going to have a lot of "coaching" when it comes to prospects being traded. He's coming into this somewhat late to somehow be able to really scout/value the prospects. I'm sure that's going to be where guys like Omar/Tanous come in and not really related to "ties" to a prospect. Also as an agent I'm sure he's seen more of the top guys more than you think (at least the non IFA kids).
RE: The one thing that scares me a little bit out BVW
IOW, he didn't draft them, it's not even like a guy hired/promoted from within where he was part of the team making the selection and grooming the prospects.
He has no loyalty to any of them and could trade all of them.
And as much as it scares me because I feel better about the farm system than any time in my recent memory even when it was rated top 10, it may actually be for the best.
I'm sort of conservative wrt prospects and my ideal scenario is to see them all kept and developed and debut a home grown roster that wins a title (to an extent), but maybe a fresh approach with zero emotional investment can turn prospects into young players with potential or turn prospects into established young players.
Should be an interesting off-season.
He was talking up Alonso almost the second he walked in the door so Im guessing he has some knowledge. I agree though.
From there it gets muddy. We likely have conversations with Machado, Harper, and just about every other premium player. If those guys go off the board quick will BVW strike on a Donaldson as a backup plan? Will he go hard after a catcher? Who knows.
I'd probably be ok with a Realmuto, Herrera, Donaldson offseason but that's probably close to the minimum.
Teddy was saying last year (and I think Shecky mentioned it too)
We could get Realmuto for "less than Gimenez". If that's possible, I think we have to pull the trigger. Realmuto's numbers away from the cavernous Marlins park over the last three years are close to elite for catching standards. He'd be the best catcher we've had since Piazza and its not close.
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nats and marlins haven't closed door on Realmuto, so there could still be talks until Tuesday. last we heard, nats would consider including Robles or possibly kieboom, and marlins sought both for baseball's best catcher.
Bowden claims the Nats budged and the Marlins still said no
"Thats what has been reported by Jim Bowden (though no other insiders have confirmed yet): Realmuto for outfielder Vctor Robles and catcher Spencer Kieboom. The offer was proposed by the Nationals last weekend and rejected by the Fish."
is a 0% chance that is accurate. Marlins turned down Robles and Kieboom from the Nats. Robles is a top 10 prospect in the game.
Yeah at that time Jeter was vocal about re-signing him so was likely only interested in a deal if he was bowled over. Now Realmuto is demanding a trade (as I predicted) so things are likely different.
Miami has reportedly declined two deals from the Washington Nationals, first a package built around teenage phenom Juan Soto last offseason and then a Vctor Robles/Spencer Kieboom package prior to the July trade deadline. With two more years under arbitration eligibility before becoming a free agent as the best player at his position, his value could be hard to decipher.
So no, the Mets would not be landing Realmuto for less than Gimenez. It's not even close to reality.
not looking to argue but they control him for 2 seasons and "most" teams in baseball would be bidding therefore his price would still be insanely high.
up Gimenez for Realmuto anyway. Dont see a place for him on an upcoming team anyway with Rosario at SS and Mauricio will be right behind him in a year or two.
Teddy's tie (Im not at liberty to say who) is as high up as it gets so I wouldnt discount that it was true, at least at some point. Obviously, things change daily.
Mets would do that trade in a millisecond. It's nowhere near enough. Realmuto is a top 3 player at his position, cheap, controlled and the best athlete at the C position in the game. He will bring back 2 premium prospects and likely a 3rd decent one.
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For the Mets, a coaching shakeup. Per source: Pat Roessler is out as hitting coach. Bullpen coach Ricky Bones is being reassigned within the organization. Bench coach Gary DiSarcina and first-base coach Ruben Amaro Jr. also may not return, though that's not yet certain.
to disagree. We can come back to this later. You believe he can be had for "less than" Gimenez a top 40-50 prospect in baseball. I am suggesting he costs at least 2 such players let alone "less than". If moved we will see who was closer to the truth.
to disagree. We can come back to this later. You believe he can be had for "less than" Gimenez a top 40-50 prospect in baseball. I am suggesting he costs at least 2 such players let alone "less than". If moved we will see who was closer to the truth.
Im not saying he wouldnt cost two good prospects. I was simply mentioning that it was mentioned to me by two people I trust he could be had for a package not including Gimenez at some point last season.
The Marlins are now looking to trade him ala Ozuna and Yelich last offseason. Maybe they get a great package. Maybe they dont. Everybody thought Yelich would bring back a ton and although they got one very good prospect in Brinson they didn't get much else. I could see two top 100 prospects one being a top 50, the other top 100 but two top 40-50 guys would be interesting.
Unless Mets are willing to spend for Harper (unlikely)
Id just as soon see them play it by ear and see how the team does first half.
Deadline trades are way less costly these days. So I would see how the team does before trading away prospects.
They finished 45-37. If they play like that, then pull the trigger in July. Big mistake the last couple of years has been signing too many mid level deals. Sign closer and let the young guys play
And I do know Diaz and Harrison were top 150 guys too
"Jason: The Braves surplus of pitching talent is starting to cause a logjam. Whom do you trade assuming its an outfield slugger or established #1 type starter ? Would you start a package w soroka or Wright ?
2:28
Kiley McDaniel: I think J.T. Realmuto would be the big fish if they made a big move. I wouldnt trade those guys, but a Realmuto trade would have to have 1-2 uncomfortable names included."
The Mets do not have 1-2 "uncomfortable names" to give up sans Gimenez/Alonso. It's those 2 and a drop-off.
and Dunn. Maybe they'd be interested in a third piece like Dom Smith as a bounce back. That's as high as I would go though.
Alonso to me is borderline untouchable at this point. 1B prospects are rarely going to be at the top of 100 lists because offense is "expected" and these guys usually aren't very athletic or have a lot of other intangibles to rate off of, but Alonso's bat is very exciting and its close.
We haven't had a true power prospect like his in some time and the position is open for him.
Large, bulky body with elite strength in both halves. Solid athlete for his size; body will require maintenance in future.
Swing Mechanics - Even, shoulder-width extended set-up, bent knees, hands low, bat across shoulder. Leg raise, average stride, quiet load up behind ear, legs engaged, natural loft in bat path, excellent extension. Bat speed, hands, timing to impact baseball.
Tool Present Future
Hit 45 50
Looks to damage and does; comes with swing-and-miss. Plus barrel-feel on anything hard; vulnerable to spin away. Solid approach; doesn't expand early-count, can take a walk. Two-strike approach needs work, doesn't shorten up. Will strikeout and walk.
Game Power 60 70
Murders fastballs middle-in and up out over plate; waits on and punishes hangers up in zone. Pull-heavy at present; some vulnerability soft away, but has feel for barrel. Half-grade projection with adjustments to tap opposite field power.
Raw Power 70 70
Elite strength, plus bat speed, elevated bat path, and leg engagement all work together for top-scale pull power and ability to go out to all fields.
Run 40 30
Not a clogger; down the line at 4.45; will lose a step with age. Station-to-station on bases.
Field 50 45
Compensates for below-average lateral mobility and stiff fielding actions with plus hands. Will cost outs on dirt, save outs with scooping ability at bag. With age, good enough to stick at fringe-average.
Throw 50 50
Accuracy and strength to make solid DP throw to 2nd; makes throw across diamond on line.
just had a game which was the epitome of what we can likely expect. Drilled a homer off Pearson (still bummed we took Peterson over him) on a 103 MPH FB, made a very nice diving stop, but also couldn't bend at 1b on a pretty routine throw from Gimenez and the winning run scored.
just had a game which was the epitome of what we can likely expect. Drilled a homer off Pearson (still bummed we took Peterson over him) on a 103 MPH FB, made a very nice diving stop, but also couldn't bend at 1b on a pretty routine throw from Gimenez and the winning run scored.
Yeah saw that. Actually, heard it was 104 mph and that no other player, majors or otherwise, has hit a HR off a pitch that was that fast in recorded Statcast history. Pretty cool.
Also 1 of the biggest things to keep in mind is that 1 of the major reasons Realmuto has so much $ value is his contract. Do we really want to give up talent value (prospects) for $ value? To me that is highly inefficient.
Sign Ramos or Lucroy to combo with Plawecki. Or see if KC is looking to sell Perez. His defensive metrics supposedly declined a little bit this past year, but for the right deal I'd roll the dice.
I wouldn't be interested in Realmuto if it cost mets top prospects, but if it was Alonso as the center piece I'd do it.
Alonso may have prodigious power, but that's not how today's MLB world series are won.
So, I doubt that gets it done for the Mets, but I wouldn't trade much more
Maybe the market dries up and the Mets benefit, but you also don't need the best catcher in the league. The Red Sox catchers all had lower fWAR than the Mets catchers.
I wouldn't be interested in Realmuto if it cost mets top prospects, but if it was Alonso as the center piece I'd do it.
Alonso may have prodigious power, but that's not how today's MLB world series are won.
So, I doubt that gets it done for the Mets, but I wouldn't trade much more
Maybe the market dries up and the Mets benefit, but you also don't need the best catcher in the league. The Red Sox catchers all had lower fWAR than the Mets catchers.
Leon did have a borderline GG season for the Sox though. Here's a pretty good write-up from Mark Simon on the trend of top defensive backup catchers, that's the type of guy I'd personally be looking to pair with Plawecki as opposed to dealing prospects. There's a pretty healthy number of FA who graded out better than Realmuto defensively.
Quote:
The thing about baseballs best defensive catchers in 2018 was that they didnt play a lot. Of the five who had the most Defensive Runs Saved, only one (Mike Zunino, who wasnt a finalist) was an everyday catcher. Teams are going to much more of a platoon system. Ten years ago, 23 catchers made 90 starts. This year, only 15 did.
If youre going just by skill and factoring out playing time, Jeff Mathis of the Diamondbacks (17 Defensive Runs Saved, best pitch-blocker in MLB) and Sandy Leon of the Red Sox (12 DRS), probably should have won. If were picking among the finalists, Buster Posey (10 DRS) and Martin Maldonado (3 DRS), both previous winners, were arguably better choices.
I wouldn't be interested in Realmuto if it cost mets top prospects, but if it was Alonso as the center piece I'd do it.
Alonso may have prodigious power, but that's not how today's MLB world series are won.
So, I doubt that gets it done for the Mets, but I wouldn't trade much more
Maybe the market dries up and the Mets benefit, but you also don't need the best catcher in the league. The Red Sox catchers all had lower fWAR than the Mets catchers.
Leon did have a borderline GG season for the Sox though. Here's a pretty good write-up from Mark Simon on the trend of top defensive backup catchers, that's the type of guy I'd personally be looking to pair with Plawecki as opposed to dealing prospects. There's a pretty healthy number of FA who graded out better than Realmuto defensively.
Quote:
The thing about baseballs best defensive catchers in 2018 was that they didnt play a lot. Of the five who had the most Defensive Runs Saved, only one (Mike Zunino, who wasnt a finalist) was an everyday catcher. Teams are going to much more of a platoon system. Ten years ago, 23 catchers made 90 starts. This year, only 15 did.
If youre going just by skill and factoring out playing time, Jeff Mathis of the Diamondbacks (17 Defensive Runs Saved, best pitch-blocker in MLB) and Sandy Leon of the Red Sox (12 DRS), probably should have won. If were picking among the finalists, Buster Posey (10 DRS) and Martin Maldonado (3 DRS), both previous winners, were arguably better choices.
Gold Glove selections are getting better, but not every winner was the most deserving ($) - ( New Window )
Yes, exactly what I'd do, stop the parade around the base paths with a solid defensive catcher. I'd prefer one who isn't a black hole offensively, but nonetheless, if I could get Realmmuto for Alonso + lesser pieces (not Gimenez) I'd do it in a heartbeat, but otherwise I'd be fine with a lesser catcher, but one who is solid defensively, particularly pitch framing and throwing out runners.
We need a RH power bat in the middle of our lineup more than just about anything else.
Yes defense is nice, speed is nice, attitude... ect. ect. but at the end of the day we didn't hit in 2018, AGAIN, Cespedes is likely missing the majority of the year and we are very LH hitting heavy.
I can't think of a single good reason to trade Alonso. He likely hits 20 HR by accident in his rookie year. He's going to mash.
Yes, exactly what I'd do, stop the parade around the base paths with a solid defensive catcher. I'd prefer one who isn't a black hole offensively, but nonetheless, if I could get Realmmuto for Alonso + lesser pieces (not Gimenez) I'd do it in a heartbeat, but otherwise I'd be fine with a lesser catcher, but one who is solid defensively, particularly pitch framing and throwing out runners.
Yea to me this + adding 2 of the top relievers are the no-brainers of the offseason. Plenty of options available for both that only cost middle of the road $. It's likely you could get both taken care of without needing to give out more than a 3 year deal. Fixes 2 of the ways we made life for our starters harder than it needed to be this year (and many others the past decades).
We need a RH power bat in the middle of our lineup more than just about anything else.
Yes defense is nice, speed is nice, attitude... ect. ect. but at the end of the day we didn't hit in 2018, AGAIN, Cespedes is likely missing the majority of the year and we are very LH hitting heavy.
I can't think of a single good reason to trade Alonso. He likely hits 20 HR by accident in his rookie year. He's going to mash.
I tend to agree and think it's really unlikely I'd trade Alonso, but it all depends on which way they go. In the very unlikely event they add Machado for example and use most of their budget for that, it's a lot easier to trade Alonso to fill another need. But I'd say it's 90% or more than Alonso leads the team in games at 1st next year.
look into C.C at the right price. I think he's going to be a steal for someone and the Mets are a young team overall. Fangraphs likes him for 1.7 fWAR over only 24 starts DESTROYED lefties last year so if you're looking at a playoff or late in the year situation you can move him into that role
We need a RH power bat in the middle of our lineup more than just about anything else.
Yes defense is nice, speed is nice, attitude... ect. ect. but at the end of the day we didn't hit in 2018, AGAIN, Cespedes is likely missing the majority of the year and we are very LH hitting heavy.
I can't think of a single good reason to trade Alonso. He likely hits 20 HR by accident in his rookie year. He's going to mash.
I tend to agree and think it's really unlikely I'd trade Alonso, but it all depends on which way they go. In the very unlikely event they add Machado for example and use most of their budget for that, it's a lot easier to trade Alonso to fill another need. But I'd say it's 90% or more than Alonso leads the team in games at 1st next year.
I hope so. I mean we desperately need a RH power bat, he seems very close, and 1B is just there and open for him. Even with Machado, I think Alsono fits in just beautifully at 1B. I think we know Smith isnt the answer at this point. Alonso is just too close at a position of need to deal at this point unless its part of a huge no brainer deal, ect.
I actually think the organization is middle infield rich in prospects but legitimate power guys rarely come through. I would deal from a position of strength.
Warthen and Eilland are well regarded. I think because so many of these guys were uber prospects coming up through the system/their systems they may have been rushed through and fundamentals were more of an afterthought to their pitching. Best guess I got.
Rosenthal now confirming Phillies will go "all in"
just had a game which was the epitome of what we can likely expect. Drilled a homer off Pearson (still bummed we took Peterson over him) on a 103 MPH FB, made a very nice diving stop, but also couldn't bend at 1b on a pretty routine throw from Gimenez and the winning run scored.
Someone who lives and breathes baseball, knows the rulebook inside and out, his been to the promised land a bunch of times, and now is content to put on a uniform, sit in a dugout, and impart wisdom.
Someone who lives and breathes baseball, knows the rulebook inside and out, his been to the promised land a bunch of times, and now is content to put on a uniform, sit in a dugout, and impart wisdom.
I want Dusty Baker. Flaws and all the guy was ALWAYS winning games and has managed in the NL for 22 seasons.
But I think he might be boosting him up for a trade.
It's possible but I think it's sincere. Alonso has potential 30 homer pop and the Mets are pretty limited in minor league talent that is anywhere near ready in terms of position players. I think the Mets have done a piss poor job displaying confidence in their younger players and that includes guys like Nimmo and Conforto who have proven them "wrong".
Someone who lives and breathes baseball, knows the rulebook inside and out, his been to the promised land a bunch of times, and now is content to put on a uniform, sit in a dugout, and impart wisdom.
I want Dusty Baker. Flaws and all the guy was ALWAYS winning games and has managed in the NL for 22 seasons.
Yeah, he'd be great in that role. Just keep him away from the bullpen.
Someone who lives and breathes baseball, knows the rulebook inside and out, his been to the promised land a bunch of times, and now is content to put on a uniform, sit in a dugout, and impart wisdom.
I want Dusty Baker. Flaws and all the guy was ALWAYS winning games and has managed in the NL for 22 seasons.
Yeah, he'd be great in that role. Just keep him away from the bullpen.
I'd like to believe Mickey/Eiland have enough experience in dealing with pitchers that it wouldn't be an issue. Dusty seems to keep his players loose and he obviously knows the game. He's also likely less of a threat to Mickey than a younger guy but also competent enough where if you do have to make an in-season move you can trust Dusty to be able to handle it.
This guy seems to be well-versed in the National League
Disclaimer: I am not advocating bringing Wally Backman back and I believe these videos are now 12 years old.
In all seriousness, someone like Riggleman isn't a terrible idea. These moves aren't franchise altering but I am certainly pleased they are exploring improvement in all areas. Obviously we have an entire off-season ahead of us but I am happy to see some activity.
BVW and Collins fly out to sit with Dom. Pump him up, save his life, and let him win the starting 1B job out if spring. If he is failing miserably, understanding hes a slow starter, you call up Alonso in a couple weeks. Energize the team and fans it also allows Alonso to face more outside junk and work on it
Best case scenario. Dom actually holds his own. And Alonso is ripping the cover off the ball in Syr. You can actually wait till super 2 to call him up. A really win win for everyone but Alonso, who got to perfect his deficiencies even further.
Thats all logic and super basic stuff. But those things are almost always looked over for much more complicated solutions.
Dusty would be a huge hire if he's willing to bench coach
Its not, but lets say it is
And Alonso comes out of the gate as an All Star 6 War player. He misses the first month of the season. It cost the Mets 1/6, or one win. To the team, its 1-2 wins on the field, to the FO it cost them $8mm. But gained them not only an extra year of control before FA. If hes a six win player (unlikely), how important is that year vs month? Even if he is a 2-3 win player, how Important is that year of control?
I thought it was a month, no? That's 15% of the season.
BVW and Collins fly out to sit with Dom. Pump him up, save his life, and let him win the starting 1B job out if spring. If he is failing miserably, understanding hes a slow starter, you call up Alonso in a couple weeks. Energize the team and fans it also allows Alonso to face more outside junk and work on it
Best case scenario. Dom actually holds his own. And Alonso is ripping the cover off the ball in Syr. You can actually wait till super 2 to call him up. A really win win for everyone but Alonso, who got to perfect his deficiencies even further.
Thats all logic and super basic stuff. But those things are almost always looked over for much more complicated solutions.
I agree with this. As someone who wanted Alonso up last year, I actually am less urgent in wanting him to him breaking ST with the team in April because I'd rather see him get off to a hot start before coming up to the big leagues.
Can figure out the super two estimated cutoff and the Actual FA cutoff for 2019?
FA cutoff is a fixed number, its like a 172 or 174 days on the roster, forget the number off the top of my head. Super two is a fluid cutoff based on service time and to
22% so that will have to be estimated
How often is a kids career effed u
Because they waited a month or two too long before he debuted? In a perfect world, your Ml squad is so stacked anyone in the minors has to FORCE their way up, instead of it being handed to them. Thats how it SHOULD be.
It may take some time, but every indication is we are going back to Sandys early years when he was actually able to implement. A refocus on ORGANIZATION, and pride of being a Met. A shit ton of INSTRUCTIONALS on the farm. Growth, development an ignorance of what your stats say, it what your new age stats are saying. Taking care of the kids nutritionally, exercise, mentally, a winning attitude. Unfortunately A LOT has to be changed on every single level.
The good news, a lot of the talent on the farm will reap the benefits lot since for the most part they are all on the lower levels.
Can figure out the super two estimated cutoff and the Actual FA cutoff for 2019?
FA cutoff is a fixed number, its like a 172 or 174 days on the roster, forget the number off the top of my head. Super two is a fluid cutoff based on service time and to
22% so that will have to be estimated
FA date is roughly mid-April (2 - 3 weeks), Super 2 is roughly 60 days into the season.
How often is a kids career effed u
Because they waited a month or two too long before he debuted? In a perfect world, your Ml squad is so stacked anyone in the minors has to FORCE their way up, instead of it being handed to them. Thats how it SHOULD be.
It may take some time, but every indication is we are going back to Sandys early years when he was actually able to implement. A refocus on ORGANIZATION, and pride of being a Met. A shit ton of INSTRUCTIONALS on the farm. Growth, development an ignorance of what your stats say, it what your new age stats are saying. Taking care of the kids nutritionally, exercise, mentally, a winning attitude. Unfortunately A LOT has to be changed on every single level.
The good news, a lot of the talent on the farm will reap the benefits lot since for the most part they are all on the lower levels.
I generally agree, but I also think it should be a case by case basis.
Alonso is 24 years old, this is not rushing a 19 year old through the system.
FA cutoff makes sense to me, that's just good business.
Super 2 depends IMO how the Mets start (and how Alonso starts), but if the Mets wait on Super 2 ignoring a need at the major league level I think that goes beyond good business and falls into the being cheap category.
I'd be fine with that now, or even at the time, but if the Mets miss the wild card by a game is it still worth it?
if you think the Mets are not wild card contenders sure protect the $8M.
If they miss it by one game, sure impasses. But I can guarantee Id also be able to go back on the 162 and find at least 2-3 plays each game they coulda, shoulda, woulda done something differently to win the game. So knowing they can spend an extra 15 mins a day in spring training hammering home instructs and win several more games - Id say the risk of adding Alonso for an extra year is absolutely worth it.
Especially if he is a six win rookie - then I would give u
The WC for an extra year of a star 101 out of 100 times. But I get Im in the minority in that one.
here's the thing though- we don't know if Alonso is the best 1B option
because we've never seen him at the MLB level and ST is mostly meaningless. Conforto tore the cover off the ball in ST last year and was a proven MLB'er but he still had a terrible April and weak overall first half. I know he was coming back from injury, but obviously in ST that didn't matter.
That's why Alonso should have been called up last year - 2 months of real regular season playing time would have been a big help answering that question. They blew that so now they need to figure out what's best for Alonso's development. For my money that would be getting him off to a hot start in the minors, even if it's just 2 weeks, and then calling him up when it's clear he's a better option than whoever they are playing at the MLB level - whether it's Smith, Bruce, Frazier, whoever.
I think were on the same page super 2 vs FA cutoff now. Yeah, I think BVW is more than aware that if he same old cheap Mets and holds him an extra size weeks for $$ while hurting he team, he will lose his credibility in 1/4 a season, breaking a new Mets GM record lol
Shecky, but my point with that was "it only costs the team 1 to 2 wins on the field" argument is great until you miss the playoffs by 1 or 2 games.
Obviously there will be games the bullpen blows, a player makes an error to allow the winning run to score, or other events that you can pinpoint as the reason for a loss.
so sure it won't likely be because Alonso was kept down for too long as the reason the Mets miss the playoffs.
I think of this too when people say "at most an MLB manager is estimated to impact 5 wins/losses.
many times those 5 games are the difference between missing and making the playoffs, but that's another tangent I won't go down.
If the Mets are a 70 win team who cares. Keep Alonso down all year. But if they have a good off-season, have a healthy team in April, and get off to a good start, and have a need for power/1B, I'd hate to have Alonso sitting in Syracuse waiting for a day the Mets can save money on a contract in 4 - 6 years.
BVW's early comments (and background as an agent) make me think
he will call Alonso up when it's the right move, even if it's a little bit early. At his advanced age for a high level prospect I don't even think he's going to view it as that controversial. Determining when it's the right move is tough to peg and we just need to see how the offseason shakes out. If they don't add someone like Machado or even Pollock, then it probably increases the chances we see Alonso sooner since there will be a bigger need for a RH bat in the middle of the order.
And I hope this sets realistic expectations for everyone. My two personal opinions:
Hes proven time and time again, there no fastballs on this planet that he will have trouble with. And that exclamation point was clearly put on that this week. Unfortunately, with scouting as it is today, it will literally take two weeks MAX before pitchers pick up on this. And he has some serious bat to ball trouble on outside junk. Hes a smart kid and works hard, he will learn. He will adjust. But do you want him doing this in Sept 18 and hitting 138 proving nothing one way or the other about him? Or even April 19? Aaa is the perfect place to learn to hit junk... and continue to work on his D.
Which is the second part. Spring training 18 I thought helped him a lot being around the big guys. But I think an offseason of focus on the kid could really leapfrog his career right now. Send Wright to hang with him a couple days. Let him learn the importance of NUTRITION, his body, flexibility, hard work. Then send Thor down to learn about media, your body, etc. then DeGrom, to learn how to chill, be flexible. Then Frazier, what its like to be a pro, and just a good guy, how to extend your career when you arent an athletic freak. Sounds childish, but thats what being a Met should be all about. The more the big leaguers hang with the minor leaguers, the better for everyone. Its an organization with one goal, period.
As you can tell, Ive got too much free time this morning lol
Who here, today, would sign up for an 88 win season. McNeil is a 3 win 2b. Rosario is a 3 win SS. Alonso is a 6 win 1B. DG and Thor are 5 win aces. Conforto and Nimmo are 3 win corner OFs. They havent traded away one prospect in the minors all season long.
But they miss the one game wild car by one win. If I could 110% guarantee the above scenario. But you have to sign up for it right this second. Who signs up for the above, or start Alonso on day one, crossing your fingers for the best and see how the team finishes. Who signs up for A, who signs up for B?
Who here, today, would sign up for an 88 win season. McNeil is a 3 win 2b. Rosario is a 3 win SS. Alonso is a 6 win 1B. DG and Thor are 5 win aces. Conforto and Nimmo are 3 win corner OFs. They havent traded away one prospect in the minors all season long.
But they miss the one game wild car by one win. If I could 110% guarantee the above scenario. But you have to sign up for it right this second. Who signs up for the above, or start Alonso on day one, crossing your fingers for the best and see how the team finishes. Who signs up for A, who signs up for B?
Really hope they make a push for Andrew Miller. He gutted through knee issues all season because the Indians were contenders. His knee is apparently 100% now... yeah #MetsDoctors but at the right price he'd be a great add
Ike Davis has retired, Reyes plans to play in 2019,... hopefully not for the Mets
Who here, today, would sign up for an 88 win season. McNeil is a 3 win 2b. Rosario is a 3 win SS. Alonso is a 6 win 1B. DG and Thor are 5 win aces. Conforto and Nimmo are 3 win corner OFs. They havent traded away one prospect in the minors all season long.
But they miss the one game wild car by one win. If I could 110% guarantee the above scenario. But you have to sign up for it right this second. Who signs up for the above, or start Alonso on day one, crossing your fingers for the best and see how the team finishes. Who signs up for A, who signs up for B?
I'd sign. Obviously the binary of missing the playoffs would suck, but in many years 88 wins gets you a WC and it would put them in a very good position moving forward to have the young nucleus you described plus the starting rotation.
That said if the performances above didn't win 90+ games the defense must suck, they likely didn't have enough depth behind Plawecki when he got hurt, and probably screwed the pooch in the BP. So even though I'd sign for that scenario I'd probably be bitching on here that BVW made the same mistakes sandy made for 8 years.
Really hope they make a push for Andrew Miller. He gutted through knee issues all season because the Indians were contenders. His knee is apparently 100% now... yeah #MetsDoctors but at the right price he'd be a great add
Ike Davis has retired, Reyes plans to play in 2019,... hopefully not for the Mets
Agreed. Miller is probably the #1 guy I want. A dominant lefty who doesn't care about his role is a huge and unique piece to find. Miller + Familia would have me very enthused about the direction of this offseason.
Really hope they make a push for Andrew Miller. He gutted through knee issues all season because the Indians were contenders. His knee is apparently 100% now... yeah #MetsDoctors but at the right price he'd be a great add
Ike Davis has retired, Reyes plans to play in 2019,... hopefully not for the Mets
You gotta think Mickey loves Miller right?
Buy-low candidate with really bigtime upside. I mean.. the upside is a top 3 reliever in MLB. Even if he's "only" a top 30 reliever or so you don't hate the deal. I'd love it if we added Miller.
a 6 win 1b? lol So rookie year Alonso is the best 1b in baseball? I'll take 1 full year off from BBI if Alonso is worth 6 fWAR this season. There have been 4 total 6+ fWAR 1b seasons since 2015. 2 by Votto, 1 by Freeman, 1 by Goldschmidt.
won't be as cheap as some want to believe. I'm sure he'll still get 2 or 3 years at 12-13 per but the k rate was still there. He battled through some knee stuff. Gimmer Miller.
a 6 win 1b? lol So rookie year Alonso is the best 1b in baseball? I'll take 1 full year off from BBI if Alonso is worth 6 fWAR this season. There have been 4 total 6+ fWAR 1b seasons since 2015. 2 by Votto, 1 by Freeman, 1 by Goldschmidt.
won't be as cheap as some want to believe. I'm sure he'll still get 2 or 3 years at 12-13 per but the k rate was still there. He battled through some knee stuff. Gimmer Miller.
I'd hope for 2 / 28m with some kind of 3rd year option.
Then hope to get Familia on a longer term but lower aav deal - like 4/40.
Sabathia over his last 86 starts has a 117 ERA+. The guy can still pitch and has pitched at a high level in the NY market.
solidify the bullpen/lineup and gimme JDG, Thor, Wheeler, Sabathia, Matz as the rotation. Vargas can soak up innings out of the pen if they can't move him.
a 6 win 1b? lol So rookie year Alonso is the best 1b in baseball? I'll take 1 full year off from BBI if Alonso is worth 6 fWAR this season. There have been 4 total 6+ fWAR 1b seasons since 2015. 2 by Votto, 1 by Freeman, 1 by Goldschmidt.
No! If Alonso has a 6 WAR season don't think you're off the hook for the prospect updates!
a 6 win 1b? lol So rookie year Alonso is the best 1b in baseball? I'll take 1 full year off from BBI if Alonso is worth 6 fWAR this season. There have been 4 total 6+ fWAR 1b seasons since 2015. 2 by Votto, 1 by Freeman, 1 by Goldschmidt.
No! If Alonso has a 6 WAR season don't think you're off the hook for the prospect updates!
There is no realistic scenario Alonso as a rookie is that good. I like him but Wright had 3 such seasons, Reyes had 0, Bryce Harper has 1, Machado 3. Not one posted such a season as a rookie.
Dan just posted that Alonso will be better than Wright, Harper, Machado, Ruth, Bonds.
And is committed to his 7:30 minors report regardless. Its in his BBI contract
I'd give up Gimenez and one of the P as headliners pretty easily for him without thinking twice. Team controlled through 2022.
Someone setup the bat signal for Capone and get it done!!!!
I'd like to hang onto Alonso because we don't have another 1b option and he's MLB ready but I'd be willing to deal any of the other prospects in the system. He's exactly the line of bat you add with Alonso to Nimmo, Conforto, McNeil etc that changes the lineup + ideally you pay for one of the 2 catchers.
plan if it's the only option to add a solid bat (aka no Machado), but I prefer to not trade Gimenez for a 27 year old coming off a career year as my plan A.
plan if it's the only option to add a solid bat (aka no Machado), but I prefer to not trade Gimenez for a 27 year old coming off a career year as my plan A.
Wouldnt a trade like that simply increase the odds of the Mets making a huge splash like a Machado?
plan if it's the only option to add a solid bat (aka no Machado), but I prefer to not trade Gimenez for a 27 year old coming off a career year as my plan A.
Wouldnt a trade like that simply increase the odds of the Mets making a huge splash like a Machado?
Would it? I kind of viewed it as either or, but if it increases the chance of a Machado pursuit I'm all for it.
plan if it's the only option to add a solid bat (aka no Machado), but I prefer to not trade Gimenez for a 27 year old coming off a career year as my plan A.
You are really underrating Hanigar. Guy is the goods. Hanigar 135 OPS+ since 2017. Hits both righties and lefties well. .914 OPS away from Seattle
Well, just think it through.
You trade future for today?
Who happens to be cost controlled for a looooong time, saving future payroll.
Wouldnt that not only make sense then to increase payroll elsewhere, but if youre going for it today - sign a big free agent
The problem with a big free agent is after 3/4 years you are at risk, the trade off is you are going for it the next 3-4 years.
All Im saying is youre going half ass if you foolishly make a big trade and dont take the next step too.
plan if it's the only option to add a solid bat (aka no Machado), but I prefer to not trade Gimenez for a 27 year old coming off a career year as my plan A.
You are really underrating Hanigar. Guy is the goods. Hanigar 135 OPS+ since 2017. Hits both righties and lefties well. .914 OPS away from Seattle
He's played one full season.
I see the results, I know he's performed well, but it's one full season.
For the next 6-12 months.
Their value will not only greater than, by far, but there will be more to trade.
Are we a contender? Or still an underperforming tease. We wont know till mid season, no matter what we do this offseason.
We could as easily be sellers once again as buyers.
Id prefer if we are going balls to the wall to sign Machado/Harper and just say fuck it. Dont half ass it. If we are adding, then ADD. Incremental adds only lead fur5er to my above uncertainty. Do we really want to add another Bruce to this equation?
Well, just think it through.
You trade future for today?
Who happens to be cost controlled for a looooong time, saving future payroll.
Wouldnt that not only make sense then to increase payroll elsewhere, but if youre going for it today - sign a big free agent
The problem with a big free agent is after 3/4 years you are at risk, the trade off is you are going for it the next 3-4 years.
All Im saying is youre going half ass if you foolishly make a big trade and dont take the next step too.
Makes sense, but Gimenez is also cost controlled for a long time. My point was not about Haniger, but more about not wanting Haniger to be the only move or a move instead of Machado.
Sullivan has Hanigar as a top 25 offensive player in baseball. His 2017 rate stats were nearly identical to his 2018 full-season
"Another item is to prorate each players previous season to 600 plate appearances to see if anyone pops up if given more playing time. With Hanigers nearly identical pro-rated 2017 and 2018 seasons, his 2017 season would have stood out"
Sullivan has Hanigar as a top 25 offensive player in baseball. His 2017 rate stats were nearly identical to his 2018 full-season
"Another item is to prorate each players previous season to 600 plate appearances to see if anyone pops up if given more playing time. With Hanigers nearly identical pro-rated 2017 and 2018 seasons, his 2017 season would have stood out"
I'm sure he'll have a great career. I'm just a little leery of players who at 27 have career years when they couldn't crack lineups consistently before then and though I don't place a ton of stock in them, having never appeared on any prospect rankings.
That has to be rare, no? to go from not even on a top 100 prospect list to top 25 offensive player in MLB in two years?
I'm sure I'm just being cynical.
And why would Seattle do this and not just keep him?
top 25 offensive player in baseball cost controlled for 5 years for Gimenez and a pitcher (Kay or Dunn?)
Sullivan has Hanigar as a top 25 offensive player in baseball. His 2017 rate stats were nearly identical to his 2018 full-season
"Another item is to prorate each players previous season to 600 plate appearances to see if anyone pops up if given more playing time. With Hanigers nearly identical pro-rated 2017 and 2018 seasons, his 2017 season would have stood out"
I'm sure he'll have a great career. I'm just a little leery of players who at 27 have career years when they couldn't crack lineups consistently before then and though I don't place a ton of stock in them, having never appeared on any prospect rankings.
That has to be rare, no? to go from not even on a top 100 prospect list to top 25 offensive player in MLB in two years?
I'm sure I'm just being cynical.
And why would Seattle do this and not just keep him?
top 25 offensive player in baseball cost controlled for 5 years for Gimenez and a pitcher (Kay or Dunn?)
Passan claims the Mariners are considering trading off all of their assets and setting up for a multi-year rebuild. If that's the case a 28 year old is probably not part of the plans if they can cash in. Same with Seager (though he's coming off a down year and makes decent coin so less value) as well as Paxton who is quietly already 30 (but very good). If they are going to do this (and be bad for 2-3-4 seasons) ala the White Sox then yeah Hanigar's age and cheap years have less value given his age vs. a guy like Gimenez + say Peterson and another piece.
Ottavino is terrifying to me. 33 next season. Awful in 2017. I know he had a great season but the walk rate, age, resume... seems like the kind of signing the Mets always end up on the wrong end of.
Ottavino is terrifying to me. 33 next season. Awful in 2017. I know he had a great season but the walk rate, age, resume... seems like the kind of signing the Mets always end up on the wrong end of.
yup he reminds me of Swarzak. I'd much rather spend the money on a multi-year proven commodities like Familia/Miller.
So not the Mets style but I'd love to see them give Garrett Richards a 2 year deal (will miss 2019), both a lottery ticket and insurance should Wheeler leave via FA Link - ( New Window )
I'm kind of indifferent to him but I do think he'd be an upgrade. Can't imagine he has any aspirations to be a manager and he has a lot of experience in the NL.
honestly, i don't think the previous regime is rose-colored in their appraisal of how they did (from Sandy's "im not sure I deserve to come back" down). They were very good in trades, middle of the road with draft/player development, and poor at FA signings.
I also think Fisher's statement about being good at trades is kind of a coded nod to being more in control of their trade outcomes vs. FA outcomes (presumably since there were budget restrictions).
@Joelsherman1
27s28 seconds ago
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I hear #Yankees and CC Sabathia are working thru final details of what, when finalized, would be a 1-yr, $8M deal. Hear Sabathia, in planned last season, didn't want to look around, wanted to quickly work out something with NYY.
But Im not getting a warm and fuzzy feeling that its hapoening. Tons of experience surrounding BVW,and a ton of advice. But Ricco is really the one that was most important to retain. At least in my opinion.
RE: In an hour Ricco could announce hes returning andpromoted
But Im not getting a warm and fuzzy feeling that its hapoening. Tons of experience surrounding BVW,and a ton of advice. But Ricco is really the one that was most important to retain. At least in my opinion.
Why do you say that? The guy has been here forever and seems like a wet blanket. What does he do well behind the scenes that no one talks about?
taking a shot at ZGiants at all here but I just spoke to someone with ties to a team that has already called the Marlins and he said the price on Realmuto remains "extremely high" so "less than Gimenez" simply isn't accurate.
You can sign a big name just money. Oh, and a pick and intl money. Machado is free, Harper and Grandal etc are more expensive
Trade the farm for a Realmuto. Will have to sign him, so costs money are your farm
Take on another teams salary dump aka Stanton type. Cost you money only. Keep your prospects.
Each has its pros and cons - keep this in mind before you say trade for player X or sign player Y. Is Realmuto better than X? Is he prospect A and B better? Etc etc.
to go all in on Machado. Then i'd go hard after Edwin Diaz from the Mariners if they truly are in firesale mode or Felipe Vazquez from Pirates. Machado contracf you can structure in a way that makes in tenable to absorb and hopefully Brodie can sell the benefits of playing in NYC, especially if Yanks aren't going to pursue him (which I wouldn't if I were them since they already have a ton of RH power)
Theres lots of pros to having lots of help around. But some cons too, lots of opinions lol
None of us are BVW. But what I would do immediately if I were him. Go out and make a couple transactions literally for the sake of making moves. Sign a bunch of ML FA. Ask the Rays what it would take for an Andrew Velazquez and make the trade. Go through the process. Let everyone know youre ready let your advisors know you got this. Youre in charge.
especially with the young pitching they have coming up. I think the Nats are in decline, I don't think the Phillies are that great, they have some pieces but missing some elite players which is why the Mets need to beat them to Machado
Marlins think they can get astros to budge on Whitley in a Realmuto trade, which if happens, thats an insane trade. I doubt it does, but crazy that they even think its possible.
how good a prospect was Preston Wilson when we traded him for Piazza.
He was considered a potential star if it all came together tools wise but plate discipline was a major concern. Was kind of disappointing for a while, then put up a huge half season in St. Lucie which boosted his stock. All in all he ended up roughly what the best realistic case scenario was. Goetz went 6th overall in 1997. On paper the Marlins did well in the Piazza trade. Obviously it didn't work out.
30/30 guy one year, averaged 25 HR's 20 SB's with them. OPS'd probably averaged .825.
Mookie Wilson's nephew, right?
Preston Wilson, Jay Payton, Jason Tyner...the Mets had some good OF prospects back in that era (unless I'm confusing the timing on some of them).
Preston was both Mookie's nephew and step son lol
Preston James Richard Wilson (born July 19, 1974) is a former professional baseball center fielder. He played all or part of ten seasons in Major League Baseball from 19982007. He is both the nephew and stepson of former New York Mets outfielder Mookie Wilson. (Mookie married Preston's mother after his brother fathered Preston.)[1]
Like it very much. Don't love giving up the 2nd round pick and a huge contract, but certainly wouldn't complain. It's certainly still a good value compared to the expected price on Realmuto, and Grandal grades out better defensively with a very similar power/OBP profile.
Like it very much. Don't love giving up the 2nd round pick and a huge contract, but certainly wouldn't complain. It's certainly still a good value compared to the expected price on Realmuto, and Grandal grades out better defensively with a very similar power/OBP profile.
Is Grandal good defensivey? Ive heard conflicting stuff on him. Hed certainly be a nice bat to add.
he was terrible in the postseason but by most metrics he's been good
+26 DRS combined the past 2 seasons (3rd best over that period of time).
Only had 9 passed balls and 7 errors last year.
Pretty decent CS%.
His pitch framing has graded out among the best in baseball.
Certainly better than Realmuto who doesn't seem to be particularly well rated defensively.
his overall fangraphs D metrics were good but slightly regressed this year and like I said he had a bad postseason that got him benched, but his numbers were still ahead of Realmuto. Yasmani Grandal Is Doing It Again - ( New Window )
be really upset moving Conforto or Nimmo for Realmuto when both Grandal and Ramos are available.
agreed. completely counterproductive. I'd even be annoyed by moving Gimenez. Alonso is as far as I'd go but only if they're really afraid of his D.
I wouldn't even consider moving Nimmo/Conforto if Ramos/Grandal are off the board. Nimmo and Conforto are part of the core. They need them. I would move Gimenez but if we did I'd want to know they were willing to spend enough to lock up Realmuto, DeGrom and Wheeler when the time came (and improve the roster) or why bother?
RE: here's an article on his pitch framing from 2017
his overall fangraphs D metrics were good but slightly regressed this year and like I said he had a bad postseason that got him benched, but his numbers were still ahead of Realmuto. Yasmani Grandal Is Doing It Again - ( New Window )
Thanks for posting that.
He seems perfect for a 2 year deal but I imagine itll take at least 3 years.
be really upset moving Conforto or Nimmo for Realmuto when both Grandal and Ramos are available.
agreed. completely counterproductive. I'd even be annoyed by moving Gimenez. Alonso is as far as I'd go but only if they're really afraid of his D.
I wouldn't even consider moving Nimmo/Conforto if Ramos/Grandal are off the board. Nimmo and Conforto are part of the core. They need them. I would move Gimenez but if we did I'd want to know they were willing to spend enough to lock up Realmuto, DeGrom and Wheeler when the time came (and improve the roster) or why bother?
Honestly, I think a good argument can be made the best move at C is a more budget efficient pickup like Maldonado or Lucroy in combo with Plawecki since we know the payroll isn't limitless even if it goes up.
for example I'd personally prefer Lucory/Maldonado + the extra money go after someone like Andrew Miller over an expensive catcher and then potentially settling for a 1 year flier RP which we know is likely to be a Blevins type.
RE: RE: here's an article on his pitch framing from 2017
his overall fangraphs D metrics were good but slightly regressed this year and like I said he had a bad postseason that got him benched, but his numbers were still ahead of Realmuto. Yasmani Grandal Is Doing It Again - ( New Window )
Thanks for posting that.
He seems perfect for a 2 year deal but I imagine itll take at least 3 years.
Yea some even say 4.
I read, on another board, that Chilli Davis is a name on the Mets list
Mike Puma
@NYPost_Mets
2m2 minutes ago
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Brodie Van Wagenen on the bullpen: "I cant imagine we would be looking for a one-and-done situation. I think our goal would be to add multiple pieces that can help us.
taking a shot at ZGiants at all here but I just spoke to someone with ties to a team that has already called the Marlins and he said the price on Realmuto remains "extremely high" so "less than Gimenez" simply isn't accurate.
This is a false accusation. I said at some point last year, a persons's source said it could take less than Gimenez. I didn't suggest that was said today or in the last week and specifically said asks change daily.
e Puma
✔
@NYPost_Mets
Brodie Van Wagenen on the bullpen: "I cant imagine we would be looking for a one-and-done situation. I think our goal would be to add multiple pieces that can help us.
Bring in a legitimate catcher that can also hit... and bring in just one more bat after that that's not somebody shitty like DJLM... but a real hitter, and Im pretty much there.
taking a shot at ZGiants at all here but I just spoke to someone with ties to a team that has already called the Marlins and he said the price on Realmuto remains "extremely high" so "less than Gimenez" simply isn't accurate.
This is a false accusation. I said at some point last year, a persons's source said it could take less than Gimenez. I didn't suggest that was said today or in the last week and specifically said asks change daily.
Last year makes even less sense as the Marlins turned down Robles at the deadline who obviously has more value than Gimenez.
Are Phillies the favorite for Harper?
Nov. 7: Are the Phillies the most logical landing spot for free-agent superstar Bryce Harper? USA Today's Bob Nightengale thinks it's a virtual lock. The reasons he gives boil down to the process of elimination, as well as what he says executives around the game think.
If Realmuto went to the Braves, his addition would go a long way toward strengthening the budding roster for the reigning NL East champs, who employed a platoon of Tyler Flowers and Kurt Suzuki (now a free agent) behind the plate last season. Acquiring Realmuto via trade would likely cost Atlanta several top prospects, and perhaps a current Major Leaguer as well, but the Braves possess one of the game's top farm systems per MLB Pipeline.
Because i vividly remember him actually saying "less" when we were talking about it mid-summer, this was around the time Shecky was telling us to watch "Bour" also. If I have time Ill actually go through the threads I guess.
I have to say this shit really needs to end though. I bring up a vague conversation from last year and offer my opinion that IF IT WERE TRUE Id be all over it. Nobody knows what the return is and its just a general throw away hot stove comment. I even said I personally WOULD trade Gimenez+. Not every comment needs to be turned into a federal case. Especially, with something that is so incredibly impossible to pin down or know for sure anyway (How the hell are we supposed to prove what players might have been discussed between the Marlins and Mets??) If every single time you brought up Nimmo and I grilled you for being wrong about him being nothing more than a 4th OF, or Wheeler and him never improving his control and being anything more than a backend starter, or TDA and 100000% not being in the Syndergaard deal, etc., etc, and over and over again... Dont you think it would get annoying? Enough with trying to attack me every time I speak. Its freaking old.
Lets's just be cool and coexist. I have no issues with you. No desire to fight with you anymore.
Every offseason is different and this offseason seems to be shaping up to be much "hotter" than the recent couple of seasons. We saw true star players get dealt for underwhelming packages and MVP candidates like JD Martinez signed to underwhelming deals... At best, every team seemed to want to "wait out" everybody else. I dont see that happening this year.
So maybe the Marlins and Realmuto picked a great offseason to make him available and they get a ton back. Who knows until it happens? We'll just wait and see.
truly was not looking to fight with you. You made a statement that flew against what everyone, I mean every single writer has stated, that the price on Realmuto is and has been sky high. I wasn't attacking or rude. I said I didn't agree and we would soon find out the price.
I 100% respect Shecky, but he doesn't work for the Marlins. If "less than Gimenez" landed Realmuto it would mean the entire baseball writing community is wrong and you would have to believe Realmuto would be a Met by now. "Less than Gimenez" is so far below Realmuto's value that it just doesn't pass the sniff test. I'm truly, truly not interesting in fighting all season. If you think I find it interesting or fun you are mistaken. If Realmuto is moved for a price we can compare to "less than Gimenez" I will admit my folly. It would also mean Brodie is off to an awful start.
@CraigMish
13h13 hours ago
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Sources also indicate Marlins are asking price on Realmuto is a high end young pitching prospect and a position player. A potential two for one.
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Joe Frisaro
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@JoeFrisaro
11h11 hours ago
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Am hearing 8-10 teams have touched base with #Marlins regarding J.T. Realmuto.
Was Gimenez even considered the Mets best prospect? Or if he was, was he considered top 30-ish where he might be now or more fringe top 100?. Is it conceivable a package was discussed "not with Gimenez" because they simply didn't like him? Maybe more pitcher friendly that included guys like Peterson, etc? I dont know. Just guessing.. Our prospect pool in the least likely didn't have the value it has now (players finished strong, etc)
I agree with you that he likely gets a big return. I also think sometimes trades happen where teams dont necessarily "love" a specific prospect or even more... get back underwhelming returns... so I guess thats more where I was coming from.
Glad to see we are cool though. Looking forward to an interesting offseason!
don't have an Athletic subscription but Bowden lays out 5 potential Realmuto packages (none are Mets) Link - ( New Window )
It's pretty uninteresting. First he uses CS% to prop up Realmuto's defense compared to other top catchers then the actual deals are basically recycled from the deadline. Straight up for Robles, 2 of Atlanta's young arms, etc.
the median ask is probably.. Top 30 guy, +Top 70 guy, +upside interesting guy OR Young cost controlled established player (Nimmo or Conforto) and that still might not be enough..
Seems like his market is going to be huge so at this point just give me Grandal or Ramos. Just dont sign Grandal to a "mega deal" please. Something in the the 3-4 year range and Im golden.
Mets interested in a reunion with Asdrubel per Puma
I can't let myself think Brodie is this stupid this quickly. It's like every bad Sandy FA move rolled into 1.
displace a promising young player defensively? check.
reunite with an unathletic crusty veteran? check.
make the defense worse? check.
minimal upside? check.
Cabrera is a good hitter and as an extra piece if they have a spot open in January, fine. But to start the offseason using one of their handful of open 40 man spots to potentially displace 1 of last year's promising breakout players would be as 'same old mets' as it gets.
Means what exactly? Are his clients not options for Mets, are negotiations done via intermediarys?
He said he would speak to Omar, Fred and Jeff.
"Boras adds: "I've never talked to Brodie Van Wagenen in my life." He says when he meets with the Mets to negotiate this winter, he can talk to the Wilpons or other staffers."
Mets interested in a reunion with Asdrubel per Puma
I can't let myself think Brodie is this stupid this quickly. It's like every bad Sandy FA move rolled into 1.
displace a promising young player defensively? check.
reunite with an unathletic crusty veteran? check.
make the defense worse? check.
minimal upside? check.
Cabrera is a good hitter and as an extra piece if they have a spot open in January, fine. But to start the offseason using one of their handful of open 40 man spots to potentially displace 1 of last year's promising breakout players would be as 'same old mets' as it gets.
Many of the writers are saying as much. They are saying if they sign him now it means he's been promised major PT aka 2b. He's too good to be settling for 5th
iF in November. Totally against the move unless there are prior moves.
as the final piece of the infield of the future (Alonso, Rosario, Gimenez and McNeil) and want Cabrera as a place holder for Gimenez who isn't quite ready.
RE: If the Mets sign Asdrubal, it means they view Gimenez
as the final piece of the infield of the future (Alonso, Rosario, Gimenez and McNeil) and want Cabrera as a place holder for Gimenez who isn't quite ready.
Cabrera blocks McNeil in 2019. Frazier is the starting 3b.
RE: If the Mets sign Asdrubal, it means they view Gimenez
as the final piece of the infield of the future (Alonso, Rosario, Gimenez and McNeil) and want Cabrera as a place holder for Gimenez who isn't quite ready.
They have Frazier on a 1 year deal, who is much better defensively and similar offensively. And Flores if they bring him back. No reason to add another mediocre 2b with Mcneil. In just 248 plate appearances he was the 11th best 2b in baseball last year. Ahead of Cabrera who had 592 PA.
despite the bvw relationship, but I actually think he's a really good stop gap piece. High energy, plays good D, can play 3rd or be the placeholder for Alonso at 1b (if they do get an every day 3B elsewhere and dump bruce).
RE: I could see a Frazier trade if something crazy (machado) happens
despite the bvw relationship, but I actually think he's a really good stop gap piece. High energy, plays good D, can play 3rd or be the placeholder for Alonso at 1b (if they do get an every day 3B elsewhere and dump bruce).
Traded, sure it's possible. Benched while Cabrera becomes the 2b? 0% chance. 0.
but as a super sub/utility guy - especially if they non-tender Flores.
I don't want him starting.
Just seems redundant with a handful of other players.
Which is fine but a player of his caliber isn't signing on in November/December for that kind of role. He's too close to being an MLB starter to settle for that.
behind the paywall but Britton did a good article on top relievers
1 interesting stat was that Familia has the least innings on him of the top tier guys. Still think he makes the most sense as 1 of the additions to the BP. Other than Kimbrel he's the least risky investment by far, and would make it far easier to gamble on someone like Miller as the 2nd piece. In a sea of options to rebuild their bullpen, the Mets search for the best fit - ( New Window )
on Britton. The Mets aren't going to be a great defensive team and Britton pitches to contact. Kimbrel obviously is the best option but even going with 2 of tier 2 like Robertson is fine, just pass on Britton for me.
I'd take Familia over Kimbrel, especially if the money were less for Familia.
but to me the key is the Mes HAVE to add Familia/Kimbrel AND AT LEAST one other solid bullpen piece. Not a Swarzak or Ramos, but a Miller or Robertson or Britton - I don't even know the names as well as some of you, but the bullpen needs to be turned from a weakness to a strength. Shorten games, take some pressure off starters, fix the D, and roll through 2019.
is still the superior pitcher to Familia. People were saying similar things about him post 2016, that he was in decline etc then he put up a monster 2017. The mere fact the NL has seen a lot less of him in recent years makes him very appealing (he won't be a Met) but Steamer is projecting a 2.71 FIP, 13.61 K/9, Familia 3.49. On paper it's still not particularly close.
is still the superior pitcher to Familia. People were saying similar things about him post 2016, that he was in decline etc then he put up a monster 2017. The mere fact the NL has seen a lot less of him in recent years makes him very appealing (he won't be a Met) but Steamer is projecting a 2.71 FIP, 13.61 K/9, Familia 3.49. On paper it's still not particularly close.
is still the superior pitcher to Familia. People were saying similar things about him post 2016, that he was in decline etc then he put up a monster 2017. The mere fact the NL has seen a lot less of him in recent years makes him very appealing (he won't be a Met) but Steamer is projecting a 2.71 FIP, 13.61 K/9, Familia 3.49. On paper it's still not particularly close.
what were the 2018 projections?
Familia FIP in 2018 was better than Kimbrel.
I don't have access to their 2018 projections as they wipe them for the new season. I've yet to see a single "expert" rank Familia above Kimbrel for 2019. Kiley McDaniel has Kimbrel the #1 RP (#12 overall), Familia #4 (25th best FA) behind Kimbrel, Ottavino and Robertson.
issue. Kimbrel projects to get a bigger contract than Familia.
If signing Familia means the Mets can get Familia and Miller (for example) or one of the other top bullpen guys then I support that more than one bullpen piece.
If it's irrelevant then get the better player.
but I don't care too much about what the "experts" think or how they're ranked. I watched the playoffs, Kimbrel looked beyond shaky. Very few clean outings, especially early in the playoffs. Hate to buy high on a reliever on the cusp of a meltdown.
issue. Kimbrel projects to get a bigger contract than Familia.
If signing Familia means the Mets can get Familia and Miller (for example) or one of the other top bullpen guys then I support that more than one bullpen piece.
If it's irrelevant then get the better player.
but I don't care too much about what the "experts" think or how they're ranked. I watched the playoffs, Kimbrel looked beyond shaky. Very few clean outings, especially early in the playoffs. Hate to buy high on a reliever on the cusp of a meltdown.
I'd certainly take Familia and Miller over Kimbrel. I don't expect 2 "big" RP so if it's Kimbrel head to head with Familia I'm taking the better P and that's Kimbrel. I expect 1 "name" RP which is why I suggested Dom+ for someone like Fry
But see Z accusing me of some shit lol
Ill be brief. Jeffy had major hard on for Realmuto. Not everyone did, but he sure did
Marlins could ask for the world, but they werent getting it then. Not even close. Today, very different story. Theyre asking for the stars and the moon - and May wind up with stars. Personally, think thats a massive mistake - but 5ats personal.
Gimenez a year ago was virtually an afterthought, not a potential future star. Just potential. His value has grown tremendously, and will continue to do so.
My points for being adamant the cost of Realmuto was less than Gimenez was Gimenez was better than people thought, Realmuto is NOT. a GameChanger, if Marlins were moving him the cost shouldnt be as high as Jeffy is willing to go. And dont think articles dont get written within hours when you have your conversations on here. Lazy, lazy writers...
more I look at Donaldson the more I wish they would find a way to add him (even if it meant Alonso being blocked for a bit). Frazier either performs or he doesn't and if he doesn't he's a great clubhouse guy who can play 3b/1B. Non-tender Wilmer, sign Donaldson, make Frazier the OD 1b.
Not particularly buying the Mets trading one of their C's but even TDA represents an upgrade for the Mariners and DiPoto likes to make deals...TDA for Nick Vincent might make some sense #Mets
and if they cost $25m in AAV so be it. That might mean we need to settle for a cheaper catcher like Lucroy or Maldonado and that's ok with me. Plawecki has potential and as long as we are protected with a good defensive and reliably competent partner (NOT TDA) I think more than 1 glaring weakness is solved well.
Nicasio is quietly very effective (for his role). 2015 2.83 FIP, 2016 3.78, 2017 2.98, 2018 2.99. I think he'd be a solid add for a team that could use multiple solid arms. Throws hard. I'd swap TDA for Nicasio. I think he's easily worth the 5.5 million for 1 year in added payroll. That's chump change in todays game.
agrees with me Ramos should be the #1 C target. I hope Shecky is clutching his pearls lol
Limited upside but what does Luke Maile cost the Mets? Toronto is deep in catching options. Maile #24 in pitch framing in 2017, moved up to #5 in 2018 #Mets
Cervelli is a guy I'd call about, framing #'s don't love him however.
For my money the most underrated RP option is Robertson. 2011-2018 he's posted sub-3.00 FIP's all but 1 season (2016), closing experience, SU experience. #Mets
I like Robertson - he's done well with the yankees
I'd still prefer Familia from the right side, but if they go with 2 righties I'd be fine with those 2. Probably the 2 safest/best value pickups. Miller's versatility and upside are intriguing though.
You have to take a long, hard look at Miller's medicals.
mentioned Joe Kelly the other day as a guy who might have just emerged in Boston. I thought he did well to finish the year, velocity was up and had a couple saves
Could be a nice cheap 3rd piece to add next to closer/setup.
But I agree with the $160m total number.
They're currently at $92m (incl. Wright/Cespedes).
They're projected to have ~45m in arbitration awards.
So current projected total payroll = $137m.
If they non-tender or trade Flores + TDA they can save almost $9m.
So that gets the ~$30m to spend.
I think it would be ridiculous even by Wilpon standards to count Wright ($15m) in the payroll fully since he has admittedly played his last game and they will get significant insurance $. It's almost as silly with Cespedes ($29m) for this upcoming year, who likely won't play and will also bring them back major insurance $. So that's where I'm more aggressive thinking they should reinvest at least $20-30m of that insurance money into the actual team on the field opening day. Even if they only spend that money as short term deals since both are only on the books for 2 more seasons.
So that would bring the total up closer to $50m-60m in new acquisitions of which I'd break down $25-30m in AAV to BP, $10-15m AAV to C, and then some other shorter term pickups. If Machado becomes a possibility, obviously you scale back everything else accordingly.
here's the part of the equation that I think accurately shows why trading for him is a bad idea - the bulk of the value you are trading for is in monetary savings relative to performance, not performance on the field.
Quote:
If we use round numbers and say Realmuto is worth $90 million and is getting paid $15 million, thats a $75 million asset value, maybe a hair lower, as both numbers are on the aggressive side. If I asked you which prospects in baseball are definitely worth more than $70-75 million and you said only Vladimir Guerrero Jr., then you would be correct. Thats the only one.
Every other prospect in baseball should be on the table, but you can realistically eliminate a few more simply because the clubs dont seem inclined to push all their chips in right now (the Twins with Alex Kirilloff and Royce Lewis, the Reds with Nick Senzel and Taylor Trammell), or they have multiple prospects just below this level, so they can still give a market value offer while holding back their top prospect (the Padres with Fernando Tatis Jr., the White Sox with Eloy Jimenez, the Rays with Wander Franco, the Braves with Cristian Pache, and the Astros with Kyle Tucker).
This is also a preview of a new tool they are creating to evaluate trades which should means we are about to have a new toy to waste hundreds of hours on. So You Want to Trade for J.T. Realmuto - ( New Window )
But see Z accusing me of some shit lol
Ill be brief. Jeffy had major hard on for Realmuto. Not everyone did, but he sure did
Marlins could ask for the world, but they werent getting it then. Not even close. Today, very different story. Theyre asking for the stars and the moon - and May wind up with stars. Personally, think thats a massive mistake - but 5ats personal.
Gimenez a year ago was virtually an afterthought, not a potential future star. Just potential. His value has grown tremendously, and will continue to do so.
My points for being adamant the cost of Realmuto was less than Gimenez was Gimenez was better than people thought, Realmuto is NOT. a GameChanger, if Marlins were moving him the cost shouldnt be as high as Jeffy is willing to go. And dont think articles dont get written within hours when you have your conversations on here. Lazy, lazy writers...
Lol. Definitely wasn't accusing you of anything, although I think your joking, but more just remembering a conversation we had this past season. Thanks for confirming that conversation happened and backing me up. I was beginning to think I might have been going crazy. ;) Your explanation also makes sense.
@jaseidler
Following Following @jaseidler
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Martin Maldonado cant hit, is 32, and his defense tanked last year, so hes a perfect Met
he was +DRS and his overall fangraphs rating was similar to 2017. His DRS fell from a ridiculous +22 the year before so maybe that's what he means? Mark Simon mentioned him as a possible GG snub a couple days ago so comparatively he's still 1 of the better defensive catchers in baseball.
he was +DRS and his overall fangraphs rating was similar to 2017. His DRS fell from a ridiculous +22 the year before so maybe that's what he means? Mark Simon mentioned him as a possible GG snub a couple days ago so comparatively he's still 1 of the better defensive catchers in baseball.
Eric all due respect he backs it up-
arrett Seidler
@jaseidler
3h3 hours ago
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Replying to @WexlerRules
yep, from about 27 framing runs above average to about 6; framing also tends to not age so well which came up in Maldonados trade TA by @euqubud
he was +DRS and his overall fangraphs rating was similar to 2017. His DRS fell from a ridiculous +22 the year before so maybe that's what he means? Mark Simon mentioned him as a possible GG snub a couple days ago so comparatively he's still 1 of the better defensive catchers in baseball.
Eric all due respect he backs it up-
arrett Seidler
@jaseidler
3h3 hours ago
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Replying to @WexlerRules
yep, from about 27 framing runs above average to about 6; framing also tends to not age so well which came up in Maldonados trade TA by @euqubud
Right but is the 27 the outlier or the 6 compared to the rest of his career? I don't know the answer just saying it strikes me as hyperbole.
he may not be as good as he was at his peak but he's still elite throwing (which would be a big help given our weakness slowing down runners) and grades out positively, at least across all fangraphs metrics. You just have to sign him to be a role player and others to be impact players.
Sounds like the Mets are literally checking in on everyone
@MBrownstein89
5m5 minutes ago
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Great point here. Nido posted a better pop time to 2B (1.94 to Maldonado's 1.97), & posted 3.5 framing runs in 1,473 framing chances compared to Maldonado's 5.9 framing runs in 7,057 framing chances in '18.
Not to mention who you have Nido under control for 5 more seasons. #Mets
reportedly available. He had such a disaster of a year (by his standards, would have been great extrapolated over a full season by Mets standards) I wonder if change of scenery would be good and if a bounce back is likely or if he's damaged goods with the shoulder injury.
Definitely more expensive than I'd want to pay if he's healthy, but he's "just" 27 all of next year, so only a year older than Machado, under team control for 3 seasons, and a 3B fit is better on the Mets than SS like Machado wants to play.
reportedly available. He had such a disaster of a year (by his standards, would have been great extrapolated over a full season by Mets standards) I wonder if change of scenery would be good and if a bounce back is likely or if he's damaged goods with the shoulder injury.
Definitely more expensive than I'd want to pay if he's healthy, but he's "just" 27 all of next year, so only a year older than Machado, under team control for 3 seasons, and a 3B fit is better on the Mets than SS like Machado wants to play.
I wonder where the bidding starts for him.
Eno Sarris says its just due diligence and that Theo would need a Godfather offer so this will be a story people yap about but likely nothing comes of it.
1 of conforto/nimmo + wheeler + top prospect? Cubs can move Heyward to CF. Highly suspect they wont move him, but he'd qualify as an mvp caliber building block worthy of a massive return. Talk about solving the 3b/RH power issue.
1 of conforto/nimmo + wheeler + top prospect? Cubs can move Heyward to CF. Highly suspect they wont move him, but he'd qualify as an mvp caliber building block worthy of a massive return. Talk about solving the 3b/RH power issue.
Cubs would pass. Wheeler only has .5 of dominance and is a FA after the year so they are getting a "top" prospect and one of Conforto or Nimmo + 1 year of Wheeler. Not nearly enough for a recent NL MVP. Cubs aren't tearing it down. They are simply speaking to teams about players. Think Syndergaard level prices.
1 of conforto/nimmo + wheeler + top prospect? Cubs can move Heyward to CF. Highly suspect they wont move him, but he'd qualify as an mvp caliber building block worthy of a massive return. Talk about solving the 3b/RH power issue.
Cubs would pass. Wheeler only has .5 of dominance and is a FA after the year so they are getting a "top" prospect and one of Conforto or Nimmo + 1 year of Wheeler. Not nearly enough for a recent NL MVP. Cubs aren't tearing it down. They are simply speaking to teams about players. Think Syndergaard level prices.
syndergaard for bryant is interesting. I'd do that i think.
Weve never operated with untouchables, he said. It sends the wrong message. Given what were trying to accomplish, it would be virtually impossible to envision the deal that would make sense to move them. I just dont believe in untouchables. Why limit yourself?
Not sure what it is, I want to love the guy, but it doesn't seem like he's improving from what we saw as a rookie at 22 years old. And that's fine, he's a great pitcher.
After that rookie season, I thought he'd be a perennial CY Young candidate, but he seems to have plateaued. Granted, it's a nice place to plateau, but IMO for a player like Bryant, he's a guy I'd consider moving.
but I wouldn't want to add much more than Syndergaard. Maybe Dom Smith or Kay/Dunn, but not any of higher ceiling guys.
Cost control lines up, but Syndergaard gets paid less.
I agree PJ - even if Thor may be harder to find, pitchers break
i'd take comparable value in the more durable player.
JDG - Wheeler - Lugo - Matz is still pretty good, then you go out and sign a starter. Even the top starters on the market are expected to get 1/3 of what Machado/Harper project to get
But I agree with DMM this is probably a lot of nothing.
"Van Wagenen does not view Wilmer Flores as particularly versatile, saying 'hed be a predominantly first-base option or power bat off the bench.' He does think Jeff McNeil can move around the diamond a little bit, should the roster take a different form."
I know it's not my money, but just the reality that 10 year deals in all sports are a long as time and it seems harder to get value from veterans post-30 (non pitchers). A 2 or 3 war stop gap like Frazier + $30m invested in a lights out BP seems like a better play to me if there's a finite budget (which we know there is).
If he's hanging out there in December and there's a limited market and you can get down to 7 or 8 years, that would change things though since he's so young. Then at least half of the contract is under 30 seasons.
Link - ( New Window )
Link - ( New Window )
If the 2 leaders are within 5% of each other, or the leader has less than 35% there will be a run-off between the top 2. If a run-off results in a tie the tiebreaker will be vote total in the previous poll, we will continue to "go back" in the polls until there is a clear leader.
*Jeff McNeil is ineligible
*Chris Flexen is ineligible
1) Andres Gimenez (SS) AA 19/37 votes- 51%
2) Peter Alonso (1B) AAA 24/36 votes- 67%
3) Jarred Kelenic (CF) Kingsport 31/36-86%
4) Ronny Mauricio (SS) Kingsport 12/33-36%
5) Justin Dunn (RHP) AA 10/37-27%, Run-off with Mark Vientos 17/30-57%
6) Mark Vientos (3b) Kingsport 16/31-52%
7) David Peterson (LHP) A+ 21/31- 68%
8) Franklyn Kilome (RHP) AA 20/33-61%
9) Thomas Szapucki (LHP) A 18/32-56%
10) Shervyen Newton (SS) Kingsport 12/30-40%, Run-off with Anthony Kay 17/33-52%
11) Anthony Kay (LHP) AA 18/26-69%
12) Simeon Woods-Richardson (RHP) Kingsport 12/30-40%
13) Luis Santana (2B) 15/26-58%
14) Will Toffey (3B) 10/29-34%, run-off with Cecchini 15/27-56%
15) Gavin Cecchini (2b) 14/26-46%
16) Francisco Alvarez (C) 9/26-35%
17) Dez Lindsay (OF) 7/18-39%
18) Tony Dibrell (RHP) 9/23-39%
19) Jordan Humphreys (RHP) 7/21-33%, Run-off with Nido 18/24-75%
20) Ross Adolph (OF) 6/25-24%, run-off with Nido 18/25-72%
21) Adam Hill (RHP) 4/26-15%, Run-off with Nido/Crismatt 11/26-58%
22) Junior Santos (RHP) 6/28-21%, Run-off with Nido 11/20-55%
23) Tomas Nido (C) 10/23-43%
24) Luis Guillorme (SS) 9/24-38%
25) Adrian Hernandez 6/26-23%, run-off with Wahl/Cortes 8/15-53%
26) Carlos Cortes (2b) 8/21-38%
I missed his presser and haven't read or seen much since.
I missed his presser and haven't read or seen much since.
Not particularly. No knock on BVW at all but he's simply parroted buzzwords. Back to winning, stronger up the middle. Thus far there has been absolutely zero hint of targets or play (not a criticism) rather there just hasn't been anything to go on.
Trouble is....half this list is at Kingsport, moving up to Columbia.
1) Andres Gimenez (SS) AA 19/37 votes- 51%
2) Peter Alonso (1B) AAA 24/36 votes- 67%
3) Jarred Kelenic (CF) Kingsport 31/36-86%
4) Ronny Mauricio (SS) Kingsport 12/33-36%
5) Justin Dunn (RHP) AA 10/37-27%, Run-off with Mark Vientos 17/30-57%
6) Mark Vientos (3b) Kingsport 16/31-52%
7) David Peterson (LHP) A+ 21/31- 68%
8) Franklyn Kilome (RHP) AA 20/33-61%
9) Thomas Szapucki (LHP) A 18/32-56%
10) Shervyen Newton (SS) Kingsport 12/30-40%, Run-off with Anthony Kay 17/33-52%
11) Anthony Kay (LHP) AA 18/26-69%
12) Simeon Woods-Richardson (RHP) Kingsport 12/30-40%
Trouble is....half this list is at Kingsport, moving up to Columbia.
1) Andres Gimenez (SS) AA 19/37 votes- 51%
2) Peter Alonso (1B) AAA 24/36 votes- 67%
3) Jarred Kelenic (CF) Kingsport 31/36-86%
4) Ronny Mauricio (SS) Kingsport 12/33-36%
5) Justin Dunn (RHP) AA 10/37-27%, Run-off with Mark Vientos 17/30-57%
6) Mark Vientos (3b) Kingsport 16/31-52%
7) David Peterson (LHP) A+ 21/31- 68%
8) Franklyn Kilome (RHP) AA 20/33-61%
9) Thomas Szapucki (LHP) A 18/32-56%
10) Shervyen Newton (SS) Kingsport 12/30-40%, Run-off with Anthony Kay 17/33-52%
11) Anthony Kay (LHP) AA 18/26-69%
12) Simeon Woods-Richardson (RHP) Kingsport 12/30-40%
Kilome would have dropped down a bit had the TJ news come before the ranking. Not a ton but as far as 12 I would think
I expect an active Mets offseason. A bunch of teams are going to be "in on" many of the big players and I don't believe there is such a thing as a realistic target, really for any team, unless they are a lesser talent.
Just need to sit back and watch it unfold.
The Mets payroll has had the ability to go up higher than its been for years now IMO, and it simply wasn't Sandy's philosophy to max out the payroll or dole out a bunch of long term contracts. We can hate Sandy all we want but there's virtually zero contracts on the books after 2020 which is nice. Ill never understand why fans think think every single teams payroll is their absolute max in which they can spend. You do have to allow flexibility in case a guy goes down to injury or you intend to extend or pay some of your own players eventually.
Things might tilt back the other way now though (zero chance BVW takes this job without payroll spending assurances) but hell after so many years of losing, Im ready for it. Let's just hope in 5 years we aren't in payroll hell ala Omar all over again.
Yeah no thanks on Colon. If you look at Vargas's numbers after his first 3-4 starts in which he had no ST (was pitching in front of a net?), he pitched pretty much exactly like the 5th starter you would want.
IOW, he didn't draft them, it's not even like a guy hired/promoted from within where he was part of the team making the selection and grooming the prospects.
He has no loyalty to any of them and could trade all of them.
And as much as it scares me because I feel better about the farm system than any time in my recent memory even when it was rated top 10, it may actually be for the best.
I'm sort of conservative wrt prospects and my ideal scenario is to see them all kept and developed and debut a home grown roster that wins a title (to an extent), but maybe a fresh approach with zero emotional investment can turn prospects into young players with potential or turn prospects into established young players.
Should be an interesting off-season.
IOW, he didn't draft them, it's not even like a guy hired/promoted from within where he was part of the team making the selection and grooming the prospects.
He has no loyalty to any of them and could trade all of them.
And as much as it scares me because I feel better about the farm system than any time in my recent memory even when it was rated top 10, it may actually be for the best.
I'm sort of conservative wrt prospects and my ideal scenario is to see them all kept and developed and debut a home grown roster that wins a title (to an extent), but maybe a fresh approach with zero emotional investment can turn prospects into young players with potential or turn prospects into established young players.
Should be an interesting off-season.
He was talking up Alonso almost the second he walked in the door so Im guessing he has some knowledge. I agree though.
I'd probably be ok with a Realmuto, Herrera, Donaldson offseason but that's probably close to the minimum.
2017 wRC+ 136
2018 wRC+ 134
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@JonHeyman
nats and marlins haven't closed door on Realmuto, so there could still be talks until Tuesday. last we heard, nats would consider including Robles or possibly kieboom, and marlins sought both for baseball's best catcher.
Bowden claims the Nats budged and the Marlins still said no
"Thats what has been reported by Jim Bowden (though no other insiders have confirmed yet): Realmuto for outfielder Vctor Robles and catcher Spencer Kieboom. The offer was proposed by the Nationals last weekend and rejected by the Fish."
Yeah at that time Jeter was vocal about re-signing him so was likely only interested in a deal if he was bowled over. Now Realmuto is demanding a trade (as I predicted) so things are likely different.
So no, the Mets would not be landing Realmuto for less than Gimenez. It's not even close to reality.
Teddy's tie (Im not at liberty to say who) is as high up as it gets so I wouldnt discount that it was true, at least at some point. Obviously, things change daily.
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For the Mets, a coaching shakeup. Per source: Pat Roessler is out as hitting coach. Bullpen coach Ricky Bones is being reassigned within the organization. Bench coach Gary DiSarcina and first-base coach Ruben Amaro Jr. also may not return, though that's not yet certain.
Gimminez
Alonso
???
I know people are not going to want to give up both Gim and Alonso but that is the only way I see it getting done
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Im not saying he wouldnt cost two good prospects. I was simply mentioning that it was mentioned to me by two people I trust he could be had for a package not including Gimenez at some point last season.
The Marlins are now looking to trade him ala Ozuna and Yelich last offseason. Maybe they get a great package. Maybe they dont. Everybody thought Yelich would bring back a ton and although they got one very good prospect in Brinson they didn't get much else. I could see two top 100 prospects one being a top 50, the other top 100 but two top 40-50 guys would be interesting.
Deadline trades are way less costly these days. So I would see how the team does before trading away prospects.
They finished 45-37. If they play like that, then pull the trigger in July. Big mistake the last couple of years has been signing too many mid level deals. Sign closer and let the young guys play
"Jason: The Braves surplus of pitching talent is starting to cause a logjam. Whom do you trade assuming its an outfield slugger or established #1 type starter ? Would you start a package w soroka or Wright ?
2:28
Kiley McDaniel: I think J.T. Realmuto would be the big fish if they made a big move. I wouldnt trade those guys, but a Realmuto trade would have to have 1-2 uncomfortable names included."
The Mets do not have 1-2 "uncomfortable names" to give up sans Gimenez/Alonso. It's those 2 and a drop-off.
Alonso to me is borderline untouchable at this point. 1B prospects are rarely going to be at the top of 100 lists because offense is "expected" and these guys usually aren't very athletic or have a lot of other intangibles to rate off of, but Alonso's bat is very exciting and its close.
We haven't had a true power prospect like his in some time and the position is open for him.
Swing Mechanics - Even, shoulder-width extended set-up, bent knees, hands low, bat across shoulder. Leg raise, average stride, quiet load up behind ear, legs engaged, natural loft in bat path, excellent extension. Bat speed, hands, timing to impact baseball.
Tool Present Future
Hit 45 50
Looks to damage and does; comes with swing-and-miss. Plus barrel-feel on anything hard; vulnerable to spin away. Solid approach; doesn't expand early-count, can take a walk. Two-strike approach needs work, doesn't shorten up. Will strikeout and walk.
Game Power 60 70
Murders fastballs middle-in and up out over plate; waits on and punishes hangers up in zone. Pull-heavy at present; some vulnerability soft away, but has feel for barrel. Half-grade projection with adjustments to tap opposite field power.
Raw Power 70 70
Elite strength, plus bat speed, elevated bat path, and leg engagement all work together for top-scale pull power and ability to go out to all fields.
Run 40 30
Not a clogger; down the line at 4.45; will lose a step with age. Station-to-station on bases.
Field 50 45
Compensates for below-average lateral mobility and stiff fielding actions with plus hands. Will cost outs on dirt, save outs with scooping ability at bag. With age, good enough to stick at fringe-average.
Throw 50 50
Accuracy and strength to make solid DP throw to 2nd; makes throw across diamond on line.
Yeah saw that. Actually, heard it was 104 mph and that no other player, majors or otherwise, has hit a HR off a pitch that was that fast in recorded Statcast history. Pretty cool.
Also 1 of the biggest things to keep in mind is that 1 of the major reasons Realmuto has so much $ value is his contract. Do we really want to give up talent value (prospects) for $ value? To me that is highly inefficient.
Sign Ramos or Lucroy to combo with Plawecki. Or see if KC is looking to sell Perez. His defensive metrics supposedly declined a little bit this past year, but for the right deal I'd roll the dice.
Alonso may have prodigious power, but that's not how today's MLB world series are won.
So, I doubt that gets it done for the Mets, but I wouldn't trade much more
Maybe the market dries up and the Mets benefit, but you also don't need the best catcher in the league. The Red Sox catchers all had lower fWAR than the Mets catchers.
My backup plan for catcher is Ramos. He can definitely still hit but at his age I only would want him on a two year deal if that's possible.
I think Grandal is going to cost way too much and his offense isnt "amazing" anyway and I think Lucroy is over the hill.
After Realmuto and Ramos, I probably just bring back TDA, as unexciting as that may be.
Alonso may have prodigious power, but that's not how today's MLB world series are won.
So, I doubt that gets it done for the Mets, but I wouldn't trade much more
Maybe the market dries up and the Mets benefit, but you also don't need the best catcher in the league. The Red Sox catchers all had lower fWAR than the Mets catchers.
Leon did have a borderline GG season for the Sox though. Here's a pretty good write-up from Mark Simon on the trend of top defensive backup catchers, that's the type of guy I'd personally be looking to pair with Plawecki as opposed to dealing prospects. There's a pretty healthy number of FA who graded out better than Realmuto defensively.
If youre going just by skill and factoring out playing time, Jeff Mathis of the Diamondbacks (17 Defensive Runs Saved, best pitch-blocker in MLB) and Sandy Leon of the Red Sox (12 DRS), probably should have won. If were picking among the finalists, Buster Posey (10 DRS) and Martin Maldonado (3 DRS), both previous winners, were arguably better choices.
Gold Glove selections are getting better, but not every winner was the most deserving ($) - ( New Window )
3 for 45 for Grandal
Not sure what Heyman was smoking when he put those together
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I wouldn't be interested in Realmuto if it cost mets top prospects, but if it was Alonso as the center piece I'd do it.
Alonso may have prodigious power, but that's not how today's MLB world series are won.
So, I doubt that gets it done for the Mets, but I wouldn't trade much more
Maybe the market dries up and the Mets benefit, but you also don't need the best catcher in the league. The Red Sox catchers all had lower fWAR than the Mets catchers.
Leon did have a borderline GG season for the Sox though. Here's a pretty good write-up from Mark Simon on the trend of top defensive backup catchers, that's the type of guy I'd personally be looking to pair with Plawecki as opposed to dealing prospects. There's a pretty healthy number of FA who graded out better than Realmuto defensively.
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The thing about baseballs best defensive catchers in 2018 was that they didnt play a lot. Of the five who had the most Defensive Runs Saved, only one (Mike Zunino, who wasnt a finalist) was an everyday catcher. Teams are going to much more of a platoon system. Ten years ago, 23 catchers made 90 starts. This year, only 15 did.
If youre going just by skill and factoring out playing time, Jeff Mathis of the Diamondbacks (17 Defensive Runs Saved, best pitch-blocker in MLB) and Sandy Leon of the Red Sox (12 DRS), probably should have won. If were picking among the finalists, Buster Posey (10 DRS) and Martin Maldonado (3 DRS), both previous winners, were arguably better choices.
Gold Glove selections are getting better, but not every winner was the most deserving ($) - ( New Window )
Yes, exactly what I'd do, stop the parade around the base paths with a solid defensive catcher. I'd prefer one who isn't a black hole offensively, but nonetheless, if I could get Realmmuto for Alonso + lesser pieces (not Gimenez) I'd do it in a heartbeat, but otherwise I'd be fine with a lesser catcher, but one who is solid defensively, particularly pitch framing and throwing out runners.
3 for 45 for Grandal
Not sure what Heyman was smoking when he put those together
That seems pretty low for Grandal too doesn't it? Im expecting he get s a lot more than that. Id be ok with that deal actually.
Yes defense is nice, speed is nice, attitude... ect. ect. but at the end of the day we didn't hit in 2018, AGAIN, Cespedes is likely missing the majority of the year and we are very LH hitting heavy.
I can't think of a single good reason to trade Alonso. He likely hits 20 HR by accident in his rookie year. He's going to mash.
Yes, exactly what I'd do, stop the parade around the base paths with a solid defensive catcher. I'd prefer one who isn't a black hole offensively, but nonetheless, if I could get Realmmuto for Alonso + lesser pieces (not Gimenez) I'd do it in a heartbeat, but otherwise I'd be fine with a lesser catcher, but one who is solid defensively, particularly pitch framing and throwing out runners.
Yea to me this + adding 2 of the top relievers are the no-brainers of the offseason. Plenty of options available for both that only cost middle of the road $. It's likely you could get both taken care of without needing to give out more than a 3 year deal. Fixes 2 of the ways we made life for our starters harder than it needed to be this year (and many others the past decades).
Yes defense is nice, speed is nice, attitude... ect. ect. but at the end of the day we didn't hit in 2018, AGAIN, Cespedes is likely missing the majority of the year and we are very LH hitting heavy.
I can't think of a single good reason to trade Alonso. He likely hits 20 HR by accident in his rookie year. He's going to mash.
I tend to agree and think it's really unlikely I'd trade Alonso, but it all depends on which way they go. In the very unlikely event they add Machado for example and use most of their budget for that, it's a lot easier to trade Alonso to fill another need. But I'd say it's 90% or more than Alonso leads the team in games at 1st next year.
agree, fix that too.
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We need a RH power bat in the middle of our lineup more than just about anything else.
Yes defense is nice, speed is nice, attitude... ect. ect. but at the end of the day we didn't hit in 2018, AGAIN, Cespedes is likely missing the majority of the year and we are very LH hitting heavy.
I can't think of a single good reason to trade Alonso. He likely hits 20 HR by accident in his rookie year. He's going to mash.
I tend to agree and think it's really unlikely I'd trade Alonso, but it all depends on which way they go. In the very unlikely event they add Machado for example and use most of their budget for that, it's a lot easier to trade Alonso to fill another need. But I'd say it's 90% or more than Alonso leads the team in games at 1st next year.
I hope so. I mean we desperately need a RH power bat, he seems very close, and 1B is just there and open for him. Even with Machado, I think Alsono fits in just beautifully at 1B. I think we know Smith isnt the answer at this point. Alonso is just too close at a position of need to deal at this point unless its part of a huge no brainer deal, ect.
I actually think the organization is middle infield rich in prospects but legitimate power guys rarely come through. I would deal from a position of strength.
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But the parade around the bases is just as much on the starting pitchers. We are simply awful, awful, awful at holding runners on. Laughable.
agree, fix that too.
How? Trade guys like Syndergaard? Matz? They are all pretty bad. Hopefully, they do improve, if even somewhat.
Thats what has been reported by Jim Bowden (though no other insiders have confirmed yet)
-Sign Machado 10/300
-Sign Familia 3/42
-Sign Miller 3/38
Dump Frazier and Flores. Come to terms with Wright. (payout his remaining two years over 5-6 years)
1.) Nimmo CF
2.) McNeil 2B
3.) Machado 3B
4.) Conforto LF
5.) Realmuto C
6.) Bruce RF
7.) Alonso 1B
8.) Rosario SS
:)
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In comment 14166001 ZGiants98 said:
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But the parade around the bases is just as much on the starting pitchers. We are simply awful, awful, awful at holding runners on. Laughable.
agree, fix that too.
How? Trade guys like Syndergaard? Matz? They are all pretty bad. Hopefully, they do improve, if even somewhat.
Coaching. It has to be coachable, right? or the Mets just magically have all pitchers who can't hold runners?
Yikes.
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Heard Howie call him a complete butcher at 1B
Yikes.
Mets need to be in it, even if its to drive the price way up for the Phils
I wish the nl would institute the designated hitter already. It's supposed to be coming.
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on Machado and Harper.
Yikes.
Mets need to be in it, even if its to drive the price way up for the Phils
The Dodgers, Yankees and Red Sox will probably do that.
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None thanks the stupid contract rules. I thought I read this year it would be May 20th but that's just from memory.
Cmicks pal Adam Fisher argued against Riggleman essentially calling him a "loser" (not as a human being).
Someone who lives and breathes baseball, knows the rulebook inside and out, his been to the promised land a bunch of times, and now is content to put on a uniform, sit in a dugout, and impart wisdom.
Someone who lives and breathes baseball, knows the rulebook inside and out, his been to the promised land a bunch of times, and now is content to put on a uniform, sit in a dugout, and impart wisdom.
I want Dusty Baker. Flaws and all the guy was ALWAYS winning games and has managed in the NL for 22 seasons.
It's possible but I think it's sincere. Alonso has potential 30 homer pop and the Mets are pretty limited in minor league talent that is anywhere near ready in terms of position players. I think the Mets have done a piss poor job displaying confidence in their younger players and that includes guys like Nimmo and Conforto who have proven them "wrong".
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needs a guy like Zimmer to be bench coach.
Someone who lives and breathes baseball, knows the rulebook inside and out, his been to the promised land a bunch of times, and now is content to put on a uniform, sit in a dugout, and impart wisdom.
I want Dusty Baker. Flaws and all the guy was ALWAYS winning games and has managed in the NL for 22 seasons.
Yeah, he'd be great in that role. Just keep him away from the bullpen.
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In comment 14166659 pjcas18 said:
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needs a guy like Zimmer to be bench coach.
Someone who lives and breathes baseball, knows the rulebook inside and out, his been to the promised land a bunch of times, and now is content to put on a uniform, sit in a dugout, and impart wisdom.
I want Dusty Baker. Flaws and all the guy was ALWAYS winning games and has managed in the NL for 22 seasons.
Yeah, he'd be great in that role. Just keep him away from the bullpen.
I'd like to believe Mickey/Eiland have enough experience in dealing with pitchers that it wouldn't be an issue. Dusty seems to keep his players loose and he obviously knows the game. He's also likely less of a threat to Mickey than a younger guy but also competent enough where if you do have to make an in-season move you can trust Dusty to be able to handle it.
"They begged me not to throw him out"
Disclaimer: I am not advocating bringing Wally Backman back and I believe these videos are now 12 years old.
In all seriousness, someone like Riggleman isn't a terrible idea. These moves aren't franchise altering but I am certainly pleased they are exploring improvement in all areas. Obviously we have an entire off-season ahead of us but I am happy to see some activity.
I love your Dusty suggestion.
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in the spring and is in opening day lineup?
None thanks the stupid contract rules. I thought I read this year it would be May 20th but that's just from memory.
Keep in mind the two cutoffs, you have super two and you have the free agency cutoff mid April.
He should be up as soon as possible since he's already going to be 30 when he hits free agency assuming he makes the roster opening day.
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In comment 14166625 Chris684 said:
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in the spring and is in opening day lineup?
None thanks the stupid contract rules. I thought I read this year it would be May 20th but that's just from memory.
Keep in mind the two cutoffs, you have super two and you have the free agency cutoff mid April.
I've heard since September they would keep him down until May if they didn't call him up in Sept. Sounds about right.
I thought it was a month, no? That's 15% of the season.
Best case scenario. Dom actually holds his own. And Alonso is ripping the cover off the ball in Syr. You can actually wait till super 2 to call him up. A really win win for everyone but Alonso, who got to perfect his deficiencies even further.
Thats all logic and super basic stuff. But those things are almost always looked over for much more complicated solutions.
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Its just a couple weeks, its really no big deal
Its not, but lets say it is
And Alonso comes out of the gate as an All Star 6 War player. He misses the first month of the season. It cost the Mets 1/6, or one win. To the team, its 1-2 wins on the field, to the FO it cost them $8mm. But gained them not only an extra year of control before FA. If hes a six win player (unlikely), how important is that year vs month? Even if he is a 2-3 win player, how Important is that year of control?
I thought it was a month, no? That's 15% of the season.
Best case scenario. Dom actually holds his own. And Alonso is ripping the cover off the ball in Syr. You can actually wait till super 2 to call him up. A really win win for everyone but Alonso, who got to perfect his deficiencies even further.
Thats all logic and super basic stuff. But those things are almost always looked over for much more complicated solutions.
I agree with this. As someone who wanted Alonso up last year, I actually am less urgent in wanting him to him breaking ST with the team in April because I'd rather see him get off to a hot start before coming up to the big leagues.
FA cutoff is a fixed number, its like a 172 or 174 days on the roster, forget the number off the top of my head. Super two is a fluid cutoff based on service time and to
22% so that will have to be estimated
if you think the Mets are not wild card contenders sure protect the $8M.
Because they waited a month or two too long before he debuted? In a perfect world, your Ml squad is so stacked anyone in the minors has to FORCE their way up, instead of it being handed to them. Thats how it SHOULD be.
It may take some time, but every indication is we are going back to Sandys early years when he was actually able to implement. A refocus on ORGANIZATION, and pride of being a Met. A shit ton of INSTRUCTIONALS on the farm. Growth, development an ignorance of what your stats say, it what your new age stats are saying. Taking care of the kids nutritionally, exercise, mentally, a winning attitude. Unfortunately A LOT has to be changed on every single level.
The good news, a lot of the talent on the farm will reap the benefits lot since for the most part they are all on the lower levels.
FA cutoff is a fixed number, its like a 172 or 174 days on the roster, forget the number off the top of my head. Super two is a fluid cutoff based on service time and to
22% so that will have to be estimated
FA date is roughly mid-April (2 - 3 weeks), Super 2 is roughly 60 days into the season.
Because they waited a month or two too long before he debuted? In a perfect world, your Ml squad is so stacked anyone in the minors has to FORCE their way up, instead of it being handed to them. Thats how it SHOULD be.
It may take some time, but every indication is we are going back to Sandys early years when he was actually able to implement. A refocus on ORGANIZATION, and pride of being a Met. A shit ton of INSTRUCTIONALS on the farm. Growth, development an ignorance of what your stats say, it what your new age stats are saying. Taking care of the kids nutritionally, exercise, mentally, a winning attitude. Unfortunately A LOT has to be changed on every single level.
The good news, a lot of the talent on the farm will reap the benefits lot since for the most part they are all on the lower levels.
I generally agree, but I also think it should be a case by case basis.
Alonso is 24 years old, this is not rushing a 19 year old through the system.
FA cutoff makes sense to me, that's just good business.
Super 2 depends IMO how the Mets start (and how Alonso starts), but if the Mets wait on Super 2 ignoring a need at the major league level I think that goes beyond good business and falls into the being cheap category.
if you think the Mets are not wild card contenders sure protect the $8M.
If they miss it by one game, sure impasses. But I can guarantee Id also be able to go back on the 162 and find at least 2-3 plays each game they coulda, shoulda, woulda done something differently to win the game. So knowing they can spend an extra 15 mins a day in spring training hammering home instructs and win several more games - Id say the risk of adding Alonso for an extra year is absolutely worth it.
Especially if he is a six win rookie - then I would give u
The WC for an extra year of a star 101 out of 100 times. But I get Im in the minority in that one.
That's why Alonso should have been called up last year - 2 months of real regular season playing time would have been a big help answering that question. They blew that so now they need to figure out what's best for Alonso's development. For my money that would be getting him off to a hot start in the minors, even if it's just 2 weeks, and then calling him up when it's clear he's a better option than whoever they are playing at the MLB level - whether it's Smith, Bruce, Frazier, whoever.
Obviously there will be games the bullpen blows, a player makes an error to allow the winning run to score, or other events that you can pinpoint as the reason for a loss.
so sure it won't likely be because Alonso was kept down for too long as the reason the Mets miss the playoffs.
I think of this too when people say "at most an MLB manager is estimated to impact 5 wins/losses.
many times those 5 games are the difference between missing and making the playoffs, but that's another tangent I won't go down.
If the Mets are a 70 win team who cares. Keep Alonso down all year. But if they have a good off-season, have a healthy team in April, and get off to a good start, and have a need for power/1B, I'd hate to have Alonso sitting in Syracuse waiting for a day the Mets can save money on a contract in 4 - 6 years.
Hes proven time and time again, there no fastballs on this planet that he will have trouble with. And that exclamation point was clearly put on that this week. Unfortunately, with scouting as it is today, it will literally take two weeks MAX before pitchers pick up on this. And he has some serious bat to ball trouble on outside junk. Hes a smart kid and works hard, he will learn. He will adjust. But do you want him doing this in Sept 18 and hitting 138 proving nothing one way or the other about him? Or even April 19? Aaa is the perfect place to learn to hit junk... and continue to work on his D.
Which is the second part. Spring training 18 I thought helped him a lot being around the big guys. But I think an offseason of focus on the kid could really leapfrog his career right now. Send Wright to hang with him a couple days. Let him learn the importance of NUTRITION, his body, flexibility, hard work. Then send Thor down to learn about media, your body, etc. then DeGrom, to learn how to chill, be flexible. Then Frazier, what its like to be a pro, and just a good guy, how to extend your career when you arent an athletic freak. Sounds childish, but thats what being a Met should be all about. The more the big leaguers hang with the minor leaguers, the better for everyone. Its an organization with one goal, period.
As you can tell, Ive got too much free time this morning lol
But they miss the one game wild car by one win. If I could 110% guarantee the above scenario. But you have to sign up for it right this second. Who signs up for the above, or start Alonso on day one, crossing your fingers for the best and see how the team finishes. Who signs up for A, who signs up for B?
But they miss the one game wild car by one win. If I could 110% guarantee the above scenario. But you have to sign up for it right this second. Who signs up for the above, or start Alonso on day one, crossing your fingers for the best and see how the team finishes. Who signs up for A, who signs up for B?
I decline.
Let's roll the dice Shecky! Playoffs or bust.
Ike Davis has retired, Reyes plans to play in 2019,... hopefully not for the Mets
But they miss the one game wild car by one win. If I could 110% guarantee the above scenario. But you have to sign up for it right this second. Who signs up for the above, or start Alonso on day one, crossing your fingers for the best and see how the team finishes. Who signs up for A, who signs up for B?
I'd sign. Obviously the binary of missing the playoffs would suck, but in many years 88 wins gets you a WC and it would put them in a very good position moving forward to have the young nucleus you described plus the starting rotation.
That said if the performances above didn't win 90+ games the defense must suck, they likely didn't have enough depth behind Plawecki when he got hurt, and probably screwed the pooch in the BP. So even though I'd sign for that scenario I'd probably be bitching on here that BVW made the same mistakes sandy made for 8 years.
Grandal
Would be 3 "hopes" for me. I'd love Manny but I'd be beyond stunned.
Ike Davis has retired, Reyes plans to play in 2019,... hopefully not for the Mets
Agreed. Miller is probably the #1 guy I want. A dominant lefty who doesn't care about his role is a huge and unique piece to find. Miller + Familia would have me very enthused about the direction of this offseason.
Ike Davis has retired, Reyes plans to play in 2019,... hopefully not for the Mets
You gotta think Mickey loves Miller right?
Buy-low candidate with really bigtime upside. I mean.. the upside is a top 3 reliever in MLB. Even if he's "only" a top 30 reliever or so you don't hate the deal. I'd love it if we added Miller.
HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
Finally, someone caught that...
Grandal
Would be 3 "hopes" for me. I'd love Manny but I'd be beyond stunned.
I like that list. My 3 would be Miller, Familia, then Maldonado or Lucroy or Ramos (assuming they don't have enough $ for Grandal).
I'd hope for 2 / 28m with some kind of 3rd year option.
Then hope to get Familia on a longer term but lower aav deal - like 4/40.
solidify the bullpen/lineup and gimme JDG, Thor, Wheeler, Sabathia, Matz as the rotation. Vargas can soak up innings out of the pen if they can't move him.
No! If Alonso has a 6 WAR season don't think you're off the hook for the prospect updates!
I wouldn't hate it, but I'd prefer a guy less likely to break down.
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a 6 win 1b? lol So rookie year Alonso is the best 1b in baseball? I'll take 1 full year off from BBI if Alonso is worth 6 fWAR this season. There have been 4 total 6+ fWAR 1b seasons since 2015. 2 by Votto, 1 by Freeman, 1 by Goldschmidt.
No! If Alonso has a 6 WAR season don't think you're off the hook for the prospect updates!
There is no realistic scenario Alonso as a rookie is that good. I like him but Wright had 3 such seasons, Reyes had 0, Bryce Harper has 1, Machado 3. Not one posted such a season as a rookie.
And is committed to his 7:30 minors report regardless. Its in his BBI contract
Someone setup the bat signal for Capone and get it done!!!!
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I'd give up Gimenez and one of the P as headliners pretty easily for him without thinking twice. Team controlled through 2022.
Someone setup the bat signal for Capone and get it done!!!!
I'd like to hang onto Alonso because we don't have another 1b option and he's MLB ready but I'd be willing to deal any of the other prospects in the system. He's exactly the line of bat you add with Alonso to Nimmo, Conforto, McNeil etc that changes the lineup + ideally you pay for one of the 2 catchers.
And its known before Ricco confirmed?
Wouldnt a trade like that simply increase the odds of the Mets making a huge splash like a Machado?
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plan if it's the only option to add a solid bat (aka no Machado), but I prefer to not trade Gimenez for a 27 year old coming off a career year as my plan A.
Wouldnt a trade like that simply increase the odds of the Mets making a huge splash like a Machado?
Would it? I kind of viewed it as either or, but if it increases the chance of a Machado pursuit I'm all for it.
You are really underrating Hanigar. Guy is the goods. Hanigar 135 OPS+ since 2017. Hits both righties and lefties well. .914 OPS away from Seattle
You trade future for today?
Who happens to be cost controlled for a looooong time, saving future payroll.
Wouldnt that not only make sense then to increase payroll elsewhere, but if youre going for it today - sign a big free agent
The problem with a big free agent is after 3/4 years you are at risk, the trade off is you are going for it the next 3-4 years.
All Im saying is youre going half ass if you foolishly make a big trade and dont take the next step too.
Hanigar, Ramos or Grandal + Alonso and suddenly the Mets lineup looks strong 1-8 (assuming Rosario 2nd have is legit and McNeil is at least solid)
In terms of wRC+ since 2017 he ranks 18th in all of baseball, wOBA 23rd.
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plan if it's the only option to add a solid bat (aka no Machado), but I prefer to not trade Gimenez for a 27 year old coming off a career year as my plan A.
You are really underrating Hanigar. Guy is the goods. Hanigar 135 OPS+ since 2017. Hits both righties and lefties well. .914 OPS away from Seattle
He's played one full season.
I see the results, I know he's performed well, but it's one full season.
Their value will not only greater than, by far, but there will be more to trade.
Are we a contender? Or still an underperforming tease. We wont know till mid season, no matter what we do this offseason.
We could as easily be sellers once again as buyers.
Id prefer if we are going balls to the wall to sign Machado/Harper and just say fuck it. Dont half ass it. If we are adding, then ADD. Incremental adds only lead fur5er to my above uncertainty. Do we really want to add another Bruce to this equation?
You trade future for today?
Who happens to be cost controlled for a looooong time, saving future payroll.
Wouldnt that not only make sense then to increase payroll elsewhere, but if youre going for it today - sign a big free agent
The problem with a big free agent is after 3/4 years you are at risk, the trade off is you are going for it the next 3-4 years.
All Im saying is youre going half ass if you foolishly make a big trade and dont take the next step too.
Makes sense, but Gimenez is also cost controlled for a long time. My point was not about Haniger, but more about not wanting Haniger to be the only move or a move instead of Machado.
Well I'd have Alonso start opening day, giving us back that one game.
"Another item is to prorate each players previous season to 600 plate appearances to see if anyone pops up if given more playing time. With Hanigers nearly identical pro-rated 2017 and 2018 seasons, his 2017 season would have stood out"
"Another item is to prorate each players previous season to 600 plate appearances to see if anyone pops up if given more playing time. With Hanigers nearly identical pro-rated 2017 and 2018 seasons, his 2017 season would have stood out"
I'm sure he'll have a great career. I'm just a little leery of players who at 27 have career years when they couldn't crack lineups consistently before then and though I don't place a ton of stock in them, having never appeared on any prospect rankings.
That has to be rare, no? to go from not even on a top 100 prospect list to top 25 offensive player in MLB in two years?
I'm sure I'm just being cynical.
And why would Seattle do this and not just keep him?
top 25 offensive player in baseball cost controlled for 5 years for Gimenez and a pitcher (Kay or Dunn?)
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Sullivan has Hanigar as a top 25 offensive player in baseball. His 2017 rate stats were nearly identical to his 2018 full-season
"Another item is to prorate each players previous season to 600 plate appearances to see if anyone pops up if given more playing time. With Hanigers nearly identical pro-rated 2017 and 2018 seasons, his 2017 season would have stood out"
I'm sure he'll have a great career. I'm just a little leery of players who at 27 have career years when they couldn't crack lineups consistently before then and though I don't place a ton of stock in them, having never appeared on any prospect rankings.
That has to be rare, no? to go from not even on a top 100 prospect list to top 25 offensive player in MLB in two years?
I'm sure I'm just being cynical.
And why would Seattle do this and not just keep him?
top 25 offensive player in baseball cost controlled for 5 years for Gimenez and a pitcher (Kay or Dunn?)
Passan claims the Mariners are considering trading off all of their assets and setting up for a multi-year rebuild. If that's the case a 28 year old is probably not part of the plans if they can cash in. Same with Seager (though he's coming off a down year and makes decent coin so less value) as well as Paxton who is quietly already 30 (but very good). If they are going to do this (and be bad for 2-3-4 seasons) ala the White Sox then yeah Hanigar's age and cheap years have less value given his age vs. a guy like Gimenez + say Peterson and another piece.
yup he reminds me of Swarzak. I'd much rather spend the money on a multi-year proven commodities like Familia/Miller.
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I also think Fisher's statement about being good at trades is kind of a coded nod to being more in control of their trade outcomes vs. FA outcomes (presumably since there were budget restrictions).
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I hear #Yankees and CC Sabathia are working thru final details of what, when finalized, would be a 1-yr, $8M deal. Hear Sabathia, in planned last season, didn't want to look around, wanted to quickly work out something with NYY.
Why do you say that? The guy has been here forever and seems like a wet blanket. What does he do well behind the scenes that no one talks about?
Trade the farm for a Realmuto. Will have to sign him, so costs money are your farm
Take on another teams salary dump aka Stanton type. Cost you money only. Keep your prospects.
Each has its pros and cons - keep this in mind before you say trade for player X or sign player Y. Is Realmuto better than X? Is he prospect A and B better? Etc etc.
None of us are BVW. But what I would do immediately if I were him. Go out and make a couple transactions literally for the sake of making moves. Sign a bunch of ML FA. Ask the Rays what it would take for an Andrew Velazquez and make the trade. Go through the process. Let everyone know youre ready let your advisors know you got this. Youre in charge.
Yup. Today's NYPOST suggested that would be the cost. One of Nimmo and Conforto as part of the deal.
Braves have the pitching, makes sense. Assuming its Touki +,hes a local kid.
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Pete,
That must be his old account
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He was considered a potential star if it all came together tools wise but plate discipline was a major concern. Was kind of disappointing for a while, then put up a huge half season in St. Lucie which boosted his stock. All in all he ended up roughly what the best realistic case scenario was. Goetz went 6th overall in 1997. On paper the Marlins did well in the Piazza trade. Obviously it didn't work out.
30/30 guy one year, averaged 25 HR's 20 SB's with them. OPS'd probably averaged .825.
Mookie Wilson's nephew, right?
Preston Wilson, Jay Payton, Jason Tyner...the Mets had some good OF prospects back in that era (unless I'm confusing the timing on some of them).
Yanell was the big piece to that trade, lefty starter.
Wilson at the time was the type of prospect Mets fans always ski for, toolsy as could be
30/30 guy one year, averaged 25 HR's 20 SB's with them. OPS'd probably averaged .825.
Mookie Wilson's nephew, right?
Preston Wilson, Jay Payton, Jason Tyner...the Mets had some good OF prospects back in that era (unless I'm confusing the timing on some of them).
Preston was both Mookie's nephew and step son lol
Preston James Richard Wilson (born July 19, 1974) is a former professional baseball center fielder. He played all or part of ten seasons in Major League Baseball from 19982007. He is both the nephew and stepson of former New York Mets outfielder Mookie Wilson. (Mookie married Preston's mother after his brother fathered Preston.)[1]
Like it very much. Don't love giving up the 2nd round pick and a huge contract, but certainly wouldn't complain. It's certainly still a good value compared to the expected price on Realmuto, and Grandal grades out better defensively with a very similar power/OBP profile.
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have expressed interest in Miller and Grandal
Like it very much. Don't love giving up the 2nd round pick and a huge contract, but certainly wouldn't complain. It's certainly still a good value compared to the expected price on Realmuto, and Grandal grades out better defensively with a very similar power/OBP profile.
Is Grandal good defensivey? Ive heard conflicting stuff on him. Hed certainly be a nice bat to add.
Only had 9 passed balls and 7 errors last year.
Pretty decent CS%.
His pitch framing has graded out among the best in baseball.
Certainly better than Realmuto who doesn't seem to be particularly well rated defensively.
Yasmani Grandal Is Doing It Again - ( New Window )
agreed. completely counterproductive. I'd even be annoyed by moving Gimenez. Alonso is as far as I'd go but only if they're really afraid of his D.
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be really upset moving Conforto or Nimmo for Realmuto when both Grandal and Ramos are available.
agreed. completely counterproductive. I'd even be annoyed by moving Gimenez. Alonso is as far as I'd go but only if they're really afraid of his D.
I wouldn't even consider moving Nimmo/Conforto if Ramos/Grandal are off the board. Nimmo and Conforto are part of the core. They need them. I would move Gimenez but if we did I'd want to know they were willing to spend enough to lock up Realmuto, DeGrom and Wheeler when the time came (and improve the roster) or why bother?
Thanks for posting that.
He seems perfect for a 2 year deal but I imagine itll take at least 3 years.
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In comment 14168283 DanMetroMan said:
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be really upset moving Conforto or Nimmo for Realmuto when both Grandal and Ramos are available.
agreed. completely counterproductive. I'd even be annoyed by moving Gimenez. Alonso is as far as I'd go but only if they're really afraid of his D.
I wouldn't even consider moving Nimmo/Conforto if Ramos/Grandal are off the board. Nimmo and Conforto are part of the core. They need them. I would move Gimenez but if we did I'd want to know they were willing to spend enough to lock up Realmuto, DeGrom and Wheeler when the time came (and improve the roster) or why bother?
Honestly, I think a good argument can be made the best move at C is a more budget efficient pickup like Maldonado or Lucroy in combo with Plawecki since we know the payroll isn't limitless even if it goes up.
for example I'd personally prefer Lucory/Maldonado + the extra money go after someone like Andrew Miller over an expensive catcher and then potentially settling for a 1 year flier RP which we know is likely to be a Blevins type.
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his overall fangraphs D metrics were good but slightly regressed this year and like I said he had a bad postseason that got him benched, but his numbers were still ahead of Realmuto. Yasmani Grandal Is Doing It Again - ( New Window )
Thanks for posting that.
He seems perfect for a 2 year deal but I imagine itll take at least 3 years.
Yea some even say 4.
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Brodie Van Wagenen on the bullpen: "I cant imagine we would be looking for a one-and-done situation. I think our goal would be to add multiple pieces that can help us.
This is a false accusation. I said at some point last year, a persons's source said it could take less than Gimenez. I didn't suggest that was said today or in the last week and specifically said asks change daily.
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Brodie Van Wagenen on the bullpen: "I cant imagine we would be looking for a one-and-done situation. I think our goal would be to add multiple pieces that can help us.
Quote:
taking a shot at ZGiants at all here but I just spoke to someone with ties to a team that has already called the Marlins and he said the price on Realmuto remains "extremely high" so "less than Gimenez" simply isn't accurate.
This is a false accusation. I said at some point last year, a persons's source said it could take less than Gimenez. I didn't suggest that was said today or in the last week and specifically said asks change daily.
Last year makes even less sense as the Marlins turned down Robles at the deadline who obviously has more value than Gimenez.
Are Phillies the favorite for Harper?
Nov. 7: Are the Phillies the most logical landing spot for free-agent superstar Bryce Harper? USA Today's Bob Nightengale thinks it's a virtual lock. The reasons he gives boil down to the process of elimination, as well as what he says executives around the game think.
I have to say this shit really needs to end though. I bring up a vague conversation from last year and offer my opinion that IF IT WERE TRUE Id be all over it. Nobody knows what the return is and its just a general throw away hot stove comment. I even said I personally WOULD trade Gimenez+. Not every comment needs to be turned into a federal case. Especially, with something that is so incredibly impossible to pin down or know for sure anyway (How the hell are we supposed to prove what players might have been discussed between the Marlins and Mets??) If every single time you brought up Nimmo and I grilled you for being wrong about him being nothing more than a 4th OF, or Wheeler and him never improving his control and being anything more than a backend starter, or TDA and 100000% not being in the Syndergaard deal, etc., etc, and over and over again... Dont you think it would get annoying? Enough with trying to attack me every time I speak. Its freaking old.
Lets's just be cool and coexist. I have no issues with you. No desire to fight with you anymore.
So maybe the Marlins and Realmuto picked a great offseason to make him available and they get a ton back. Who knows until it happens? We'll just wait and see.
I 100% respect Shecky, but he doesn't work for the Marlins. If "less than Gimenez" landed Realmuto it would mean the entire baseball writing community is wrong and you would have to believe Realmuto would be a Met by now. "Less than Gimenez" is so far below Realmuto's value that it just doesn't pass the sniff test. I'm truly, truly not interesting in fighting all season. If you think I find it interesting or fun you are mistaken. If Realmuto is moved for a price we can compare to "less than Gimenez" I will admit my folly. It would also mean Brodie is off to an awful start.
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13h13 hours ago
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Sources also indicate Marlins are asking price on Realmuto is a high end young pitching prospect and a position player. A potential two for one.
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Joe Frisaro
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11h11 hours ago
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Am hearing 8-10 teams have touched base with #Marlins regarding J.T. Realmuto.
I agree with you that he likely gets a big return. I also think sometimes trades happen where teams dont necessarily "love" a specific prospect or even more... get back underwhelming returns... so I guess thats more where I was coming from.
Glad to see we are cool though. Looking forward to an interesting offseason!
It's pretty uninteresting. First he uses CS% to prop up Realmuto's defense compared to other top catchers then the actual deals are basically recycled from the deadline. Straight up for Robles, 2 of Atlanta's young arms, etc.
Seems like his market is going to be huge so at this point just give me Grandal or Ramos. Just dont sign Grandal to a "mega deal" please. Something in the the 3-4 year range and Im golden.
No. First round picks are safe now. 2nd pick and about 500 IFA money now.
2nd
I can't let myself think Brodie is this stupid this quickly. It's like every bad Sandy FA move rolled into 1.
displace a promising young player defensively? check.
reunite with an unathletic crusty veteran? check.
make the defense worse? check.
minimal upside? check.
Cabrera is a good hitter and as an extra piece if they have a spot open in January, fine. But to start the offseason using one of their handful of open 40 man spots to potentially displace 1 of last year's promising breakout players would be as 'same old mets' as it gets.
He said he would speak to Omar, Fred and Jeff.
"Boras adds: "I've never talked to Brodie Van Wagenen in my life." He says when he meets with the Mets to negotiate this winter, he can talk to the Wilpons or other staffers."
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Mets interested in a reunion with Asdrubel per Puma
I can't let myself think Brodie is this stupid this quickly. It's like every bad Sandy FA move rolled into 1.
displace a promising young player defensively? check.
reunite with an unathletic crusty veteran? check.
make the defense worse? check.
minimal upside? check.
Cabrera is a good hitter and as an extra piece if they have a spot open in January, fine. But to start the offseason using one of their handful of open 40 man spots to potentially displace 1 of last year's promising breakout players would be as 'same old mets' as it gets.
Many of the writers are saying as much. They are saying if they sign him now it means he's been promised major PT aka 2b. He's too good to be settling for 5th
iF in November. Totally against the move unless there are prior moves.
Braves or Nats. I think hes really good. And probably will get better.
Cabrera blocks McNeil in 2019. Frazier is the starting 3b.
They have Frazier on a 1 year deal, who is much better defensively and similar offensively. And Flores if they bring him back. No reason to add another mediocre 2b with Mcneil. In just 248 plate appearances he was the 11th best 2b in baseball last year. Ahead of Cabrera who had 592 PA.
Traded, sure it's possible. Benched while Cabrera becomes the 2b? 0% chance. 0.
I don't want him starting.
Just seems redundant with a handful of other players.
I don't want him starting.
Just seems redundant with a handful of other players.
Which is fine but a player of his caliber isn't signing on in November/December for that kind of role. He's too close to being an MLB starter to settle for that.
In a sea of options to rebuild their bullpen, the Mets search for the best fit - ( New Window )
As they say in Boston "hot-attack closah"
I'd take Familia over Kimbrel, especially if the money were less for Familia.
but to me the key is the Mes HAVE to add Familia/Kimbrel AND AT LEAST one other solid bullpen piece. Not a Swarzak or Ramos, but a Miller or Robertson or Britton - I don't even know the names as well as some of you, but the bullpen needs to be turned from a weakness to a strength. Shorten games, take some pressure off starters, fix the D, and roll through 2019.
what were the 2018 projections?
Familia FIP in 2018 was better than Kimbrel.
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is still the superior pitcher to Familia. People were saying similar things about him post 2016, that he was in decline etc then he put up a monster 2017. The mere fact the NL has seen a lot less of him in recent years makes him very appealing (he won't be a Met) but Steamer is projecting a 2.71 FIP, 13.61 K/9, Familia 3.49. On paper it's still not particularly close.
what were the 2018 projections?
Familia FIP in 2018 was better than Kimbrel.
I don't have access to their 2018 projections as they wipe them for the new season. I've yet to see a single "expert" rank Familia above Kimbrel for 2019. Kiley McDaniel has Kimbrel the #1 RP (#12 overall), Familia #4 (25th best FA) behind Kimbrel, Ottavino and Robertson.
If signing Familia means the Mets can get Familia and Miller (for example) or one of the other top bullpen guys then I support that more than one bullpen piece.
If it's irrelevant then get the better player.
but I don't care too much about what the "experts" think or how they're ranked. I watched the playoffs, Kimbrel looked beyond shaky. Very few clean outings, especially early in the playoffs. Hate to buy high on a reliever on the cusp of a meltdown.
If signing Familia means the Mets can get Familia and Miller (for example) or one of the other top bullpen guys then I support that more than one bullpen piece.
If it's irrelevant then get the better player.
but I don't care too much about what the "experts" think or how they're ranked. I watched the playoffs, Kimbrel looked beyond shaky. Very few clean outings, especially early in the playoffs. Hate to buy high on a reliever on the cusp of a meltdown.
I'd certainly take Familia and Miller over Kimbrel. I don't expect 2 "big" RP so if it's Kimbrel head to head with Familia I'm taking the better P and that's Kimbrel. I expect 1 "name" RP which is why I suggested Dom+ for someone like Fry
Ill be brief. Jeffy had major hard on for Realmuto. Not everyone did, but he sure did
Marlins could ask for the world, but they werent getting it then. Not even close. Today, very different story. Theyre asking for the stars and the moon - and May wind up with stars. Personally, think thats a massive mistake - but 5ats personal.
Gimenez a year ago was virtually an afterthought, not a potential future star. Just potential. His value has grown tremendously, and will continue to do so.
My points for being adamant the cost of Realmuto was less than Gimenez was Gimenez was better than people thought, Realmuto is NOT. a GameChanger, if Marlins were moving him the cost shouldnt be as high as Jeffy is willing to go. And dont think articles dont get written within hours when you have your conversations on here. Lazy, lazy writers...
I'm not saying they will, I'm saying they should. It's been my off-season plan all along.
I'd even consider Kimbrel and Familia.
To recap:
1. Sign the best two bullpen arms available/reasonable. not Swarzak/Ramos, but legit end of the game bullpen arms.
2. Add a legit starting pitcher. Names like Corbin, Gonzalez, even Keuchel, Ryu or Morton
3. Fix the D where it can be fixed (1B), trade Bruce, etc. in the name of fixing the D.
TDA to Seattle for one of their RP makes a lot of sense.
Too bad we couldn't have packed him with something for Mallex Smith.
Rays just traded for Zunino
Limited upside but what does Luke Maile cost the Mets? Toronto is deep in catching options. Maile #24 in pitch framing in 2017, moved up to #5 in 2018 #Mets
Cervelli is a guy I'd call about, framing #'s don't love him however.
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Id say the Rays are the favorites
Rays just traded for Zunino
WHAT?!?!?
Fuuuuuuucccccckkkkkkkkkk
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In comment 14168848 Shecky said:
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Id say the Rays are the favorites
Rays just traded for Zunino
WHAT?!?!?
Fuuuuuuucccccckkkkkkkkkk
for Mallex Smith - who would have been a perfect type of acquisition for what we need.
I like Miller and I'd be all over that but I also think they can find a lefty via trade.
Could be a nice cheap 3rd piece to add next to closer/setup.
It was 150 last year. I'm going to go with roughly 162 with 30 million spent on new players
They're currently at $92m (incl. Wright/Cespedes).
They're projected to have ~45m in arbitration awards.
So current projected total payroll = $137m.
If they non-tender or trade Flores + TDA they can save almost $9m.
So that gets the ~$30m to spend.
I think it would be ridiculous even by Wilpon standards to count Wright ($15m) in the payroll fully since he has admittedly played his last game and they will get significant insurance $. It's almost as silly with Cespedes ($29m) for this upcoming year, who likely won't play and will also bring them back major insurance $. So that's where I'm more aggressive thinking they should reinvest at least $20-30m of that insurance money into the actual team on the field opening day. Even if they only spend that money as short term deals since both are only on the books for 2 more seasons.
So that would bring the total up closer to $50m-60m in new acquisitions of which I'd break down $25-30m in AAV to BP, $10-15m AAV to C, and then some other shorter term pickups. If Machado becomes a possibility, obviously you scale back everything else accordingly.
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The Mets have reportedly expressed interest in Yasmani Grandal https://on.sny.tv/2DtKGI6
Every other prospect in baseball should be on the table, but you can realistically eliminate a few more simply because the clubs dont seem inclined to push all their chips in right now (the Twins with Alex Kirilloff and Royce Lewis, the Reds with Nick Senzel and Taylor Trammell), or they have multiple prospects just below this level, so they can still give a market value offer while holding back their top prospect (the Padres with Fernando Tatis Jr., the White Sox with Eloy Jimenez, the Rays with Wander Franco, the Braves with Cristian Pache, and the Astros with Kyle Tucker).
This is also a preview of a new tool they are creating to evaluate trades which should means we are about to have a new toy to waste hundreds of hours on.
So You Want to Trade for J.T. Realmuto - ( New Window )
Where will Manny Machado sign this offseason? - ( New Window )
Ill be brief. Jeffy had major hard on for Realmuto. Not everyone did, but he sure did
Marlins could ask for the world, but they werent getting it then. Not even close. Today, very different story. Theyre asking for the stars and the moon - and May wind up with stars. Personally, think thats a massive mistake - but 5ats personal.
Gimenez a year ago was virtually an afterthought, not a potential future star. Just potential. His value has grown tremendously, and will continue to do so.
My points for being adamant the cost of Realmuto was less than Gimenez was Gimenez was better than people thought, Realmuto is NOT. a GameChanger, if Marlins were moving him the cost shouldnt be as high as Jeffy is willing to go. And dont think articles dont get written within hours when you have your conversations on here. Lazy, lazy writers...
Lol. Definitely wasn't accusing you of anything, although I think your joking, but more just remembering a conversation we had this past season. Thanks for confirming that conversation happened and backing me up. I was beginning to think I might have been going crazy. ;) Your explanation also makes sense.
Ramos, Grandal, Call the Pirates about Cervelli
Seidler doesn;t like that move. Said his framing fell off and that doesn't improve with age
@jaseidler
Following Following @jaseidler
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Martin Maldonado cant hit, is 32, and his defense tanked last year, so hes a perfect Met
Eric all due respect he backs it up-
arrett Seidler
@jaseidler
3h3 hours ago
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Replying to @WexlerRules
yep, from about 27 framing runs above average to about 6; framing also tends to not age so well which came up in Maldonados trade TA by @euqubud
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he was +DRS and his overall fangraphs rating was similar to 2017. His DRS fell from a ridiculous +22 the year before so maybe that's what he means? Mark Simon mentioned him as a possible GG snub a couple days ago so comparatively he's still 1 of the better defensive catchers in baseball.
Eric all due respect he backs it up-
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Replying to @WexlerRules
yep, from about 27 framing runs above average to about 6; framing also tends to not age so well which came up in Maldonados trade TA by @euqubud
Right but is the 27 the outlier or the 6 compared to the rest of his career? I don't know the answer just saying it strikes me as hyperbole.
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@MBrownstein89
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Great point here. Nido posted a better pop time to 2B (1.94 to Maldonado's 1.97), & posted 3.5 framing runs in 1,473 framing chances compared to Maldonado's 5.9 framing runs in 7,057 framing chances in '18.
Not to mention who you have Nido under control for 5 more seasons. #Mets
Definitely more expensive than I'd want to pay if he's healthy, but he's "just" 27 all of next year, so only a year older than Machado, under team control for 3 seasons, and a 3B fit is better on the Mets than SS like Machado wants to play.
I wonder where the bidding starts for him.
Definitely more expensive than I'd want to pay if he's healthy, but he's "just" 27 all of next year, so only a year older than Machado, under team control for 3 seasons, and a 3B fit is better on the Mets than SS like Machado wants to play.
I wonder where the bidding starts for him.
Eno Sarris says its just due diligence and that Theo would need a Godfather offer so this will be a story people yap about but likely nothing comes of it.
Cubs would pass. Wheeler only has .5 of dominance and is a FA after the year so they are getting a "top" prospect and one of Conforto or Nimmo + 1 year of Wheeler. Not nearly enough for a recent NL MVP. Cubs aren't tearing it down. They are simply speaking to teams about players. Think Syndergaard level prices.
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1 of conforto/nimmo + wheeler + top prospect? Cubs can move Heyward to CF. Highly suspect they wont move him, but he'd qualify as an mvp caliber building block worthy of a massive return. Talk about solving the 3b/RH power issue.
Cubs would pass. Wheeler only has .5 of dominance and is a FA after the year so they are getting a "top" prospect and one of Conforto or Nimmo + 1 year of Wheeler. Not nearly enough for a recent NL MVP. Cubs aren't tearing it down. They are simply speaking to teams about players. Think Syndergaard level prices.
syndergaard for bryant is interesting. I'd do that i think.
Weve never operated with untouchables, he said. It sends the wrong message. Given what were trying to accomplish, it would be virtually impossible to envision the deal that would make sense to move them. I just dont believe in untouchables. Why limit yourself?
Not sure what it is, I want to love the guy, but it doesn't seem like he's improving from what we saw as a rookie at 22 years old. And that's fine, he's a great pitcher.
After that rookie season, I thought he'd be a perennial CY Young candidate, but he seems to have plateaued. Granted, it's a nice place to plateau, but IMO for a player like Bryant, he's a guy I'd consider moving.
but I wouldn't want to add much more than Syndergaard. Maybe Dom Smith or Kay/Dunn, but not any of higher ceiling guys.
Cost control lines up, but Syndergaard gets paid less.
JDG - Wheeler - Lugo - Matz is still pretty good, then you go out and sign a starter. Even the top starters on the market are expected to get 1/3 of what Machado/Harper project to get
But I agree with DMM this is probably a lot of nothing.
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J.P. Ricciardi is leaving the Mets, the team announced.
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-Price on Realmuto "huge"
If he's hanging out there in December and there's a limited market and you can get down to 7 or 8 years, that would change things though since he's so young. Then at least half of the contract is under 30 seasons.