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At what win/loss record does Shurmur lose his job?

giantfan2000 : 11/7/2018 6:53 am
Giants traditionally do not fire Head Coaches or General Managers
But it could be argued that the Giants are WORSE this year than last.

Looking at schedule for rest of year (which is easier than first half)

We have at least 2 winnable games remaining
San Fran and Tampa Bay

We play in one of the weakest divisions in football
I think we should be able to win one division game
( maybe last game Dallas at home if it is meaningless game)

So in my estimate the most realistic scenario Giants end up 4 -12
(If Giants win more than 4 games then Shurmur is definitely coming back)

But it is entirely possible Giants only win one more game (Tampa Bay)
and end up 2- 14

Or maybe the team quits and Giants lose out and we end up 1-15

What record will get Shurmur fired? or is this year a mulligan for the new coach and he is guaranteed back regardless of record?













The only way Shurmur gets fired this year  
SHO'NUFF : 11/7/2018 6:56 am : link
is if he calls Mara a dickhead through the media.
Mara is going to give PS a mulligan  
micky : 11/7/2018 6:58 am : link
Can lose out and hed be back. Unless, total chaos with team happens and he lost control of locker room..though not happening
Let DG do his job with the Draft and UDFAs.  
Big Blue '56 : 11/7/2018 7:08 am : link
Shurmur’s going nowhere
I think anything less than  
Les in TO : 11/7/2018 7:10 am : link
4-12 or worse will be the end of PS.
Many of you that are hoping for a purge  
Diver_Down : 11/7/2018 7:13 am : link
are going to be disappointed. The players are competing. There has been no blowouts with players quitting. PS will be here for another season at minimum. DG will be given longer to mold the roster to fit his philosophy in roster construction.
RE: I think anything less than  
TeamSchlitz1 : 11/7/2018 7:13 am : link
In comment 14167647 Les in TO said:
Quote:
4-12 or worse will be the end of PS.


I disagree, respectfully of course. I think 1-15 he would keep his job, UNLESS he 100% lost the locker room. Which doesn't look like the case thus far.
RE: RE: I think anything less than  
section125 : 11/7/2018 7:18 am : link
In comment 14167649 TeamSchlitz1 said:
Quote:
In comment 14167647 Les in TO said:


Quote:


4-12 or worse will be the end of PS.



I disagree, respectfully of course. I think 1-15 he would keep his job, UNLESS he 100% lost the locker room. Which doesn't look like the case thus far.


Ask again next year. I'm not sure even next year will be an option.
I don't think it's how much we lose  
Doomster : 11/7/2018 7:18 am : link
that determines this......I think it will be how we lose, that determines this........

we are 1-7, with 5 losses by 7 points or less.....

If we come back from the bye and lose to one of the 3 worst teams in the NFL, continue to lose, and get blown out of games, then maybe.....

The cherry on the top would be a lot of empty seats in the stands....
It is simply eye-opening to believe Giants  
Jimmy Googs : 11/7/2018 7:22 am : link
can add Barkley and get OBJ back and we can only win 1 game thus far. No better than last year.

Shurmur and his guys should be taken to the woodshed...
He will still be the Head Coach  
cjac : 11/7/2018 7:22 am : link
in September of 2020


I think that is the season that he's going to have to have a winning record in order to keep his job.

And, this team is not going to be good until then, we are in the middle of a 3 year rebuild here
RE: It is simply eye-opening to believe Giants  
cjac : 11/7/2018 7:23 am : link
In comment 14167652 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
can add Barkley and get OBJ back and we can only win 1 game thus far. No better than last year.

Shurmur and his guys should be taken to the woodshed...


The only thing that hasnt changed is.......

The Quarterback

just sayin
Wow,  
Doomster : 11/7/2018 7:24 am : link
he will be here in 2020?

This could be an even longer rebuild....
He keeps his job at 1-15 IMO  
Oscar : 11/7/2018 7:28 am : link
But I think they win a few times second half.
If JPP is playing that Tampa game,  
Simms11 : 11/7/2018 7:30 am : link
Eli could get sacked another 7 times!! I'm not so sure we'd win that game either?!
RE: RE: It is simply eye-opening to believe Giants  
BillT : 11/7/2018 7:33 am : link
In comment 14167654 cjac said:
Quote:
In comment 14167652 Jimmy Googs said:


Quote:


can add Barkley and get OBJ back and we can only win 1 game thus far. No better than last year.

Shurmur and his guys should be taken to the woodshed...



The only thing that hasnt changed is.......

The Quarterback

just sayin

Not true. The quality of the OL hasn’t changed it’s actually gotten worse given they’ve already given up as many sacks as last year in half the games.
1-7 next year he doesn't finish the year.  
Blue21 : 11/7/2018 7:34 am : link
.
The Tampa game......  
Doomster : 11/7/2018 7:38 am : link
I can't wait to see JPP vs Solder....that alone would make the game worth watching....
He’ll probably need to win 4 games NEXT YEAR  
Dave in PA : 11/7/2018 7:51 am : link
to keep his job for a third season. This is a tear down job guys, get realistic.
RE: The Tampa game......  
Jim in Tampa : 11/7/2018 7:52 am : link
In comment 14167664 Doomster said:
Quote:
I can't wait to see JPP vs Solder....that alone would make the game worth watching....

JPP is lining up on the other side. He'll go against Wheeler.
Unless we see  
Tony in Tampa : 11/7/2018 7:53 am : link
a player rebellion (unlikely) or gross incompetence/scandal he's staying after this season. Ownership will not blame him for the issues that started in the last regime.
The one way he is fired  
bigblue12 : 11/7/2018 7:54 am : link
Is if they find an eight ball and a dead hooker in his hotel room
RE: Let DG do his job with the Draft and UDFAs.  
Jim in Tampa : 11/7/2018 7:54 am : link
In comment 14167646 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
Shurmur’s going nowhere

The last part of your post actually has two meanings and I agree with both.

;>)
Cant even imagine  
lecky : 11/7/2018 7:54 am : link
what the Giants have shown that would make you believe they will beat Tampa? Or anyone for that matter.
Shurmur  
TyreeHelmet : 11/7/2018 7:57 am : link
If they don’t think he’s the right guy, then they need to move on. Don’t just him a 2nd year for optics. It’s about finding the right person for the long haul.

And can we please stop with the argument they were in “close 1 score games” ? The only close loss was Carolina. They were destroyed by Philly and Dallas and the NO/ ATL/ Skins games were never in doubt.
no chance he gets fired this year  
ron mexico : 11/7/2018 7:59 am : link
If DG repeats his mistakes with pro personnel next year and they end up with another top 5 pick they could both be out next year

No he isn't....  
Doomster : 11/7/2018 8:03 am : link
RE: The Tampa game......
Jim in Tampa : 7:52 am : link : reply
In comment 14167664 Doomster said:
Quote:
I can't wait to see JPP vs Solder....that alone would make the game worth watching....

JPP is lining up on the other side. He'll go against Wheeler.
I think he stays no matter what....  
sb from NYT Forum : 11/7/2018 8:13 am : link
But Shula and the OL coach will he fired. IMO they should have been fired already.
It's probably going to take an extreme circumstance  
JonC : 11/7/2018 8:13 am : link
to fire him after only one season. As bad as the losing is for fans, the team has to consider the rest of the league is watching how they treat their employees, especially under duress.
If they keep Shurmur after a 3-13 season or worse..  
Sean : 11/7/2018 8:16 am : link
they might as well have just kept McAdoo.
If he has a typical contract  
fkap : 11/7/2018 8:18 am : link
his salary is guaranteed.
They aren't eating his salary this early.

There has to be at least 3 dead hookers in his hotel room in order for him to go.
McAdoo had a few things do him in  
JonC : 11/7/2018 8:22 am : link
Benching Eli and the poor manner in which it was handled, he was a very poor communicator with his players, his players quit on him early last season, and the perception was he ruined a team that had won 11 games the prior season. Overmatched coach trending off a cliff and a defiant, tone-deaf personality that quickly wore out his welcome.

Not yet a similar situation with PS.
RE: RE: I think anything less than  
Les in TO : 11/7/2018 8:30 am : link
In comment 14167649 TeamSchlitz1 said:
Quote:
In comment 14167647 Les in TO said:


Quote:


4-12 or worse will be the end of PS.



I disagree, respectfully of course. I think 1-15 he would keep his job, UNLESS he 100% lost the locker room. Which doesn't look like the case thus far.
we”ll see. Mara may at a minimum force Shula to be the sacrificial lamb to demonstrate to fans that he does not tolerate dreadful seasons . Reactionary incrementalism has been the MO lately
I won't be watching the standings  
UberAlias : 11/7/2018 8:32 am : link
I'll be watching things like, are young players developing, is the team prepared, and are they fighting despite the poor record. I can't say he's done a horrible job in these areas. I do think the play calling leaves something to be desired, at times, but PS isn't playing with a full deck just yet.
If the OK doesn't improve  
JCin332 : 11/7/2018 8:49 am : link
I would guess Hal Hunter will be gone...
OL  
JCin332 : 11/7/2018 8:49 am : link
..
0-16  
arniefez : 11/7/2018 8:51 am : link
and they have one win already. Not going to happen but if there isn't a new OC and OL line coach for 2019 the latest Giants lost weekend will have no end in sight.

The 1st one lasted 15 years from 1965-1980. The 2nd one which didn't last as long and actually had 1 playoff win was from 1991-1999. Lost weekend the 3rd is now 7 years year since the last playoff win anyone see an end in sight?
1% chance  
BillyM : 11/7/2018 9:10 am : link
and that 1% is only if Bill Belichek wants in. That is it.

Besides that scenario, if we lose out, he keeps his job.
RE: Many of you that are hoping for a purge  
Justlurking : 11/7/2018 9:18 am : link
In comment 14167648 Diver_Down said:
Quote:
are going to be disappointed. The players are competing. There has been no blowouts with players quitting. PS will be here for another season at minimum. DG will be given longer to mold the roster to fit his philosophy in roster construction.


Its not even December. If this team lays down rest of season he's gone. And DG will "retire".
Your thread suggests  
joeinpa : 11/7/2018 9:18 am : link
Shurmur s future as head coach is tied to this year s won loss record. It s a flawed premise
I think that 1-31 will cost him his job  
Bill L : 11/7/2018 9:56 am : link
and, just by watching the games, I think this year's team is clearly better, not worse, than last year's team. Also, the team psyche, morale, composure, and competitiveness is logarthimically better than what it was under BM. And, I think that last part, as much or more than the record, is what cost him his job.
So let's see  
TrueBlue56 : 11/7/2018 10:04 am : link
Front office changes, new coaching staff and over 2/3 of a roster turnover and already discussions about shurmurs job status.

Yes, let's fire shurmur at the end of the year and bring in another coach so he can bring in another defensive coordinator and coaching staff, start all over again and we can have this discussion same time next year.
They're not firing him  
Go Terps : 11/7/2018 10:29 am : link
Though in my opinion he's been so bad that he shouldn't be able to save his job.
If the Giants go 1-15 he’s gone..  
Sean : 11/7/2018 10:41 am : link
they aren’t that bad. No one deserves to come back off a 1-15 season when you stck with Eli, pay Beckham, trade for Ogletree, sign Solder & draft Barkley.

Go read Mara’s preseason quotes and tell me why that warrants another year.
Meh  
Sneakers O'toole : 11/7/2018 11:23 am : link
The book on this era hasnt been written yet. Nobody's getting fired this season. Too soon
I don't know..  
NoPeanutz : 11/7/2018 11:39 am : link
Coaches in this league have survived 1-31 to come back and coach another year.
RE: I think that 1-31 will cost him his job  
jcn56 : 11/7/2018 11:45 am : link
In comment 14167823 Bill L said:
Quote:
and, just by watching the games, I think this year's team is clearly better, not worse, than last year's team. Also, the team psyche, morale, composure, and competitiveness is logarthimically better than what it was under BM. And, I think that last part, as much or more than the record, is what cost him his job.


We're halfway through with a draft of high picks and a healthy dose of FA spending, with 1 win to show for it despite being relatively healthy and the division sucking. It's really every bit as shitty as last year's campaign.
RE: It is simply eye-opening to believe Giants  
bw in dc : 11/7/2018 11:53 am : link
In comment 14167652 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
can add Barkley and get OBJ back and we can only win 1 game thus far. No better than last year.

Shurmur and his guys should be taken to the woodshed...


That is a remarkable. Two of the best players in the league at their positions - positions that produce points - and we're currently at the top of the 2019 draft board.

Shurmur has been a monumental disappointment thus far a s strategist and developer. And his hiring of Hal Hunter looks to be an epic miss...
RE: RE: It is simply eye-opening to believe Giants  
Bill L : 11/7/2018 12:39 pm : link
In comment 14167977 bw in dc said:
Quote:
In comment 14167652 Jimmy Googs said:


Quote:


can add Barkley and get OBJ back and we can only win 1 game thus far. No better than last year.

Shurmur and his guys should be taken to the woodshed...



That is a remarkable. Two of the best players in the league at their positions - positions that produce points - and we're currently at the top of the 2019 draft board.

Shurmur has been a monumental disappointment thus far a s strategist and developer. And his hiring of Hal Hunter looks to be an epic miss...


Not much has changed...

(a book excerpt)
Quote:
They tell a story at Notre Dame University about the so-called “four horsemen.” They began to believe they were the entire football team. Coach Knute Rockne sent the team on the field one day with the instructions that every time the ball was snapped, the offensive line was to lie down and not block the defense. The highly regarded backfield suddenly started getting clobbered. In play after play, the four horsemen were losing ground.

Calling a time out, Coach Rockne brought them to the sidelines and pointed out to the four people whose job it was to carry the ball that they were absolutely useless on a football field unless everyone else was blocking.
5-27.  
santacruzom : 11/7/2018 1:08 pm : link
It'll take two years, IMO.
Let's Pray  
PaulN : 11/7/2018 1:31 pm : link
We go 1-15, that we get the top pick, get our future QB, and fire this clueless coach, he is horrendous. Not an excuse for this team either, and Gettleman has been bad also, this entire organization stinks right now. They better do some serious soul searching and start doing the right thing for the fans and organization instead of what is best for my nephew and buddies. The Gettleman hire for example, all comfortable hires.
RE: RE: RE: It is simply eye-opening to believe Giants  
gmenatlarge : 11/7/2018 1:35 pm : link
In comment 14168018 Bill L said:
Quote:
In comment 14167977 bw in dc said:


Quote:


In comment 14167652 Jimmy Googs said:


Quote:


can add Barkley and get OBJ back and we can only win 1 game thus far. No better than last year.

Shurmur and his guys should be taken to the woodshed...



That is a remarkable. Two of the best players in the league at their positions - positions that produce points - and we're currently at the top of the 2019 draft board.

Shurmur has been a monumental disappointment thus far a s strategist and developer. And his hiring of Hal Hunter looks to be an epic miss...



Not much has changed...

(a book excerpt)


Quote:


They tell a story at Notre Dame University about the so-called “four horsemen.” They began to believe they were the entire football team. Coach Knute Rockne sent the team on the field one day with the instructions that every time the ball was snapped, the offensive line was to lie down and not block the defense. The highly regarded backfield suddenly started getting clobbered. In play after play, the four horsemen were losing ground.

Calling a time out, Coach Rockne brought them to the sidelines and pointed out to the four people whose job it was to carry the ball that they were absolutely useless on a football field unless everyone else was blocking.


So you're saying Shurmur is Rockne reincarnated?
RE: RE: RE: It is simply eye-opening to believe Giants  
bw in dc : 11/7/2018 1:59 pm : link
In comment 14168018 Bill L said:
Quote:


Quote:
They tell a story at Notre Dame University about the so-called “four horsemen.” They began to believe they were the entire football team. Coach Knute Rockne sent the team on the field one day with the instructions that every time the ball was snapped, the offensive line was to lie down and not block the defense. The highly regarded backfield suddenly started getting clobbered. In play after play, the four horsemen were losing ground.

Calling a time out, Coach Rockne brought them to the sidelines and pointed out to the four people whose job it was to carry the ball that they were absolutely useless on a football field unless everyone else was blocking.




Can you say with 100% confidence the problem with the oline is talent or coaching?

It's easy to say talent - and that may be true - but with this staff, I don't think you can rule out coaching either...
RE: RE: RE: RE: It is simply eye-opening to believe Giants  
Bill L : 11/7/2018 2:50 pm : link
In comment 14168097 bw in dc said:
Quote:
In comment 14168018 Bill L said:


Quote:




Quote:
They tell a story at Notre Dame University about the so-called “four horsemen.” They began to believe they were the entire football team. Coach Knute Rockne sent the team on the field one day with the instructions that every time the ball was snapped, the offensive line was to lie down and not block the defense. The highly regarded backfield suddenly started getting clobbered. In play after play, the four horsemen were losing ground.

Calling a time out, Coach Rockne brought them to the sidelines and pointed out to the four people whose job it was to carry the ball that they were absolutely useless on a football field unless everyone else was blocking.






Can you say with 100% confidence the problem with the oline is talent or coaching?

It's easy to say talent - and that may be true - but with this staff, I don't think you can rule out coaching either...

Our best player is a guy on the downside of his career who is probably on the border of being a Pats reject. Everyone else, except the rookie, are people who's best days were on a practice squad or who was jettisoned by some other team with no regrets or attempt to even think about keeping. And we were happy to scarf them up and see them as upgrades.
But the overall point was that you can talk about  
Bill L : 11/7/2018 2:53 pm : link
how they should be be better simply because they have Barkley and OBJ all you want, but if there is a fatal flaw then that kills you no matter how healthy everything else is.
Shurmur is not losing his job because...  
EricJ : 11/7/2018 2:53 pm : link
he has not lost the locker room and the effort is still there. Anyone watching this team can see that the record is basically tied to the play of 5 guys on the OL.
Even if they finish with 1 win  
short lease : 11/7/2018 3:43 pm : link
He gets next year.
Agree with diver down  
mpinmaine : 11/7/2018 3:49 pm : link
and others....team hasn't quit.
OL has been awful with 3 different coordinators  
joe48 : 11/7/2018 5:02 pm : link
I know the personnel is different this year but this is not on Shurmur. Who is evaluating the talent or lack of we draft? Shurmur is also stuck with Eli who exasperates the OL problems.
Well,  
Doomster : 11/7/2018 6:04 pm : link
Agree with diver down
mpinmaine : 3:49 pm : link : reply
and others....team hasn't quit.

maybe not yet....
McAdoo  
Dragon : 11/7/2018 7:50 pm : link
Did the same thing Shurmur is doing loosing every week that’s what got him fired. You can come up with thousands of reports or rumors but in the end wins gets you contract extensions losses get you fired. This new leadership seems very unprepared for anything that has happened to this point with numerous very questionable decisions.
The offense had a lot of issues  
eclipz928 : 11/8/2018 6:56 am : link
in 2015 and 2016 that weren't ever fully rectified - which was a significantfactor that lead to McAdoo's dismissal.

At the very least, Shurmur won't be fired until he's given the opportunity to work with an offense with either a new QB, a vastly improved Oline, or both.
He's got a least 2 years, this one and 2019  
PatersonPlank : 11/8/2018 9:26 am : link
Mara is not making his 2nd change in 3 years. The guy barely has had a chance, plus we all knew the team still stunk.

GM and Shurmur will get 2-3 years to turn it around, as they should. If you took over a job like this you wouldn't want to be judged on the first half of the first season either.
Why  
Dragon : 11/8/2018 12:20 pm : link
Is everyone giving them the pass on the Eli decision McAdoo got killed for try to replace him. Shurmur said from the start Eli has years left in the NFL now the universe knows that’s BS don’t sugar coat it they made a real bad decision boastfully.
A record of 6-26 or worse (less than 0.200)  
D_Giants : 11/8/2018 5:10 pm : link
Five more wins over the next 24 games may be difficult given Dave's eternally spinning Gettle-Go-Round of players and Shurmur's offensive coaching. The first prevents--apparently by design--the building of needless team chemistry as it motivates high performance through overpayment, fear, and confusion: "I get paid whether we win or not"; and, "If I am still here next week, who will be my locker-neighbor?" The second prevents any scoring.

DG will go only after he has rid the team of the top players on its only pro-unit, the defense. Maron and Ticks may get rid of one or both when MetLife no longer evidences any fans wearing blue and when even the most-diehard, masochistic Giants fans have ceased wasting their time watching these pitiful events.
it's more about the players effort  
xtian : 11/8/2018 5:52 pm : link
and locker room, than the record. I thought the giants made a lot of bad personnel decisions [waiving davis webb, the 2 safeties, etc], that were not based on talent, but rather because they were associated with the previous regime. i was very worried that we could crash and burn, and we have. now, it's about cleaning house and building from the bottom. we will select our future QB in the first round, hopefully, a good one is there--every mentions justin herbert but he might not declare. we will do another purge this off season and be a very young team with energy. pay attention to how we rebuild the lines, because DG certainly will draft them.
It’s amazing how fickle we have become as a society.  
BlueHurricane : 11/8/2018 6:39 pm : link
Nobody wants to do the work or get their hands dirty. Just give me instant gratification or move along.

I hope these guys get a chance to prove they are not good coaches. With the shit they were left that means well past this season
RE: It’s amazing how fickle we have become as a society.  
D_Giants : 11/8/2018 6:48 pm : link
In comment 14169368 BlueHurricane said:
Quote:
Nobody wants to do the work or get their hands dirty. Just give me instant gratification or move along.

I hope these guys get a chance to prove they are not good coaches. With the shit they were left that means well past this season


Gettleman just changed the color of what he was given. We have another 5 years of losing, to mirror the oast (except 2016). Be patient.
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