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NFT: Knicks Game Thread - Knicks @ Hawks

adamg : 11/7/2018 6:58 pm
Starting lineup: Hardaway, Ntilikina, Vonleh, Dotson and Robinson

Glad he's keeping Frank in there.
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16, I don't think thats what it is.  
Keith : 11/9/2018 9:33 am : link
First off, we can agree that it's in the Knicks best interest to hold KP out as long as possible. The other kids will get more PT and experience and the Knicks should lose more games thus giving them a better shot at a good pick.

We can also agree that the league and/or players union would not be ok with the Knicks holding KP out when he's healthy to play.

I also believe that KP is way further along in his recovery than Fizdale is letting on, way futher. If the Knicks were competitive, he'd probably be playing in Dec/Jan at the latest, but considering the situation, they are taking in extra slow. The guy was jumping off of a boat 3 months ago. If he's only jogging now, he would have blown his knee up doing that. Ive had 2 ACL reconstructions, I'm speaking from experience.

Therefore, the Knicks don't want people thinking that KP is anywhere close to playing. HOwever, KP doesn't want people thinking that he's soft or a slow healer. That's why I think KP showed that.
.  
Anakim : 11/9/2018 9:45 am : link
Wasn't KP jumping off boats and swimming within a couple of months of his surgery?
RE: 16, I don't think thats what it is.  
nygiants16 : 11/9/2018 9:50 am : link
In comment 14169696 Keith said:
Quote:
First off, we can agree that it's in the Knicks best interest to hold KP out as long as possible. The other kids will get more PT and experience and the Knicks should lose more games thus giving them a better shot at a good pick.

We can also agree that the league and/or players union would not be ok with the Knicks holding KP out when he's healthy to play.

I also believe that KP is way further along in his recovery than Fizdale is letting on, way futher. If the Knicks were competitive, he'd probably be playing in Dec/Jan at the latest, but considering the situation, they are taking in extra slow. The guy was jumping off of a boat 3 months ago. If he's only jogging now, he would have blown his knee up doing that. Ive had 2 ACL reconstructions, I'm speaking from experience.

Therefore, the Knicks don't want people thinking that KP is anywhere close to playing. HOwever, KP doesn't want people thinking that he's soft or a slow healer. That's why I think KP showed that.


i agree with that...

my point was that kp should of went to fiz first and say hey why did you say i am not running yet...

kp loves to make everything out in the open, i would rather that stuff be kept in house..

it makes it seem like they are all not on the same page qhen kp himself said he was going to take it slow
If KP is at a point where he can only jog,  
Keith : 11/9/2018 9:51 am : link
it's because his knee isn't stable enough to do more and the muscles around his knee aren't strong enough yet. If that's the case, I assure you that jumping off the boat like he did was a major risk to his knee. He's so much further along than the Knicks are saying.
16,  
Keith : 11/9/2018 9:54 am : link
I agree. I bet the KNicks don't want KP doing that, it's making them look like liars and sending up red flags. They need to delay his return as long as possible and they won't be able to do that if KP is showing the world that he's ready.

Hopefully he only plays in 20-30 games which would mean sometime towards the end of Feb, beginning of March.
RE: 16,  
nygiants16 : 11/9/2018 10:00 am : link
In comment 14169746 Keith said:
Quote:
I agree. I bet the KNicks don't want KP doing that, it's making them look like liars and sending up red flags. They need to delay his return as long as possible and they won't be able to do that if KP is showing the world that he's ready.

Hopefully he only plays in 20-30 games which would mean sometime towards the end of Feb, beginning of March.


it is just annoying at this point, the vibe around the team and the view from around the league has changed. and now the media has ammo to create a narrative of dysfunction and not everyone on the same page once again
It's not a great look,  
Keith : 11/9/2018 10:05 am : link
but I don't think it's that big of a deal...yet. It concerns me because I question whether KP is on the same page. I understand it, it's his legacy/career at stake. He has to worry about whats best for him and he probably wants to play when he's ready. He doesn't want to sit the whole year.
RE: It's not a great look,  
nygiants16 : 11/9/2018 10:09 am : link
In comment 14169778 Keith said:
Quote:
but I don't think it's that big of a deal...yet. It concerns me because I question whether KP is on the same page. I understand it, it's his legacy/career at stake. He has to worry about whats best for him and he probably wants to play when he's ready. He doesn't want to sit the whole year.


I get he wants to play, i have no doubt he is anxious to play. i would be worried if he was not anxious to play..

The Knicks are in a tough spot  
Keith : 11/9/2018 10:12 am : link
because they really don't want him to play, but they have to make it appear as though he's not ready. KP has to understand that. Maybe he does and doesn't care, I don't know.
So will KP get the max extension if he doesn't play this year?  
Anakim : 11/9/2018 10:16 am : link
.
..  
Keith : 11/9/2018 10:16 am : link
absolutely.
Unless there is a setback(which would be disasterous),  
Keith : 11/9/2018 10:18 am : link
I cannot imagine any scenario in which KP sits out for the year. THis is a 6-7 month recovery these days, not 13-14 months.
I get  
Jon in NYC : 11/9/2018 10:26 am : link
the sense that this is Phil Jackson PTSD.

KP needs to unlearn what he has been shown, and not everything said in the press is a veiled attack.
i am also wondering  
nygiants16 : 11/9/2018 10:28 am : link
If Fizdale really doesnt know everything going on with kp and his rehab and letting the trainers handle it..

so maybe as far as fizdale knew kp was not doing a lot more..fizdale did say he is trying not to thi k about kp back and trying to concnentrate on the guys hr has currently..
I would be shocked if Fizdale  
Keith : 11/9/2018 10:31 am : link
wasn't aware of where KP was in the process. Jogging usually happens 3-4 months after surgery. KP had his surgery in Feb. There is no way Fizdale thought KP was only jogging.
NYPOST  
DanMetroMan : 11/9/2018 10:36 am : link
According to a report by The Athletic, seven teams are “monitoring’’ Rozier’s situation because of a perceived view he’s unhappy going back to the bench with Kyrie Irving healthy. Rozier was a standout in leading the Celtics to the Eastern Conference Finals last season after Irving went down with a left knee injury. Rozier is averaging 7.5 points in 22 minutes per game, his playing time down from the 33 minutes per game he logged after Irving was injured last season.

The report stated Celtics general manager Danny Ainge isn’t interested in trading Rozier now and still wants to re-sign him as a free agent. It also stated the Suns as the team most interested.

According to an NBA source, at last season’s trade deadline, the Knicks “were shopping for what they called their own young Terry Rozier.’’

Modal TriggerTerry Rozier
Terry RozierNBAE/Getty Images
Knicks GM Scott Perry went after Elfrid Payton, but wouldn’t give up Frank Ntilikina, and had to settle for Emmanuel Mudiay.
This article is from September  
arniefez : 11/9/2018 11:10 am : link
it explains how the Knicks will handle Porzingis' contract
Knicks will not offer Kristaps Porzingis max contract extension to preserve cap space - ( New Window )
I hope these KP stories are just blown out of proportion by the media.  
JustaDiscussion : 11/9/2018 11:42 am : link
It is however why I would have signed KP to a max deal this off season if I was running the team. I would have rather locked him up to ensure he doesn't pull anything unexpected. I would have just signed him to a similar deal the 76ers did with Embiid with some injury insurances built in. I think keeping KP on board is more important than entering free agency a year earlier. Hopefully I'm just worrying too much and they're able to do both.
RE: lol  
Mike in NJ : 11/9/2018 11:46 am : link
In comment 14169592 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
Ian Begley
ESPN Staff Writer

David Fizdale said Thursday that injured All-Star Kristaps Porzingis was at the stage of light running -- but not sprinting -- in his rehab from an ACL tear. After those comments were published in media reports, Porzingis posted pictures of himself sprinting on Instagram.


Where is Begley getting this from? The most recent post on KPs Instagram is from October 27. Also, how can you tell from a picture whether a guy is lightly running or sprinting?
I heard around the office that Lance Thomas will be out a month  
Anakim : 11/9/2018 11:54 am : link
After undergoing knee surgery
...  
Keith : 11/9/2018 12:23 pm : link
Lance Thomas underwent arthroscopic surgery on his left knee for removal of loose bodies and will be re-evaluated in four weeks.

Thomas started the first five games of the season but had then seen his minutes reduced dramatically as the Knicks committed to playing their youngsters. Over his last five appearances, Thomas averaged just 4.4 points and 1.4 rebounds in 11.1 minutes. He belongs on waivers in all fantasy formats. Kevin Knox is working his way back from an ankle injury, and will soak up the minutes Thomas leaves behind.
Really liking my fanduel  
dep026 : 11/9/2018 12:34 pm : link
lineup tonight. Lot of injuries so theres a lot of value with players.

Point Guard
Tyler Johnson - 4,700. No Wade, Dragic. Should get a lot of burn.
Derrick Rose - 6,000 - Playing a bad defense with Teague out. Riding the hot hand.
Buddy Hield - 7,400. Expecting a high scoring game.
Jimmy Butler - 9,500. All in on this game.
Jeff Green - 3,600 - Boom/Bust player. Low value, most likely will be low score dropped.
Justice Winslow - 5,600. Filling up the box score.
Aaron Gordon - 7,900. My big risk. Not in love with this one. Actually may change to Saric and get an extra 2700. Just have a feeling with him tonight.
Omari Spellman - 4,200 - great value here.
Joel Embiid - 11,000. My big play. 30-15 and a few blocks and assists against Charlotte who has no center.
Fizdale said talked to kp this morning  
nygiants16 : 11/9/2018 12:40 pm : link
he said frustration with perception he is not working hard to come back
RE: Fizdale said talked to kp this morning  
adamg : 11/9/2018 1:30 pm : link
In comment 14170022 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
he said frustration with perception he is not working hard to come back
This is my expectation and hope for the situation. Fiz's job is to talk to KP about it and fix things. If he does that there's no story. Actually, the story then is that Fiz has control of his guys and they're able to communicate. I think this story is overblown due to how effective Fiz has been.
RE: ...  
Tesla : 11/9/2018 1:35 pm : link
In comment 14170003 Keith said:
Quote:
Lance Thomas underwent arthroscopic surgery on his left knee for removal of loose bodies and will be re-evaluated in four weeks.

Thomas started the first five games of the season but had then seen his minutes reduced dramatically as the Knicks committed to playing their youngsters. Over his last five appearances, Thomas averaged just 4.4 points and 1.4 rebounds in 11.1 minutes. He belongs on waivers in all fantasy formats. Kevin Knox is working his way back from an ankle injury, and will soak up the minutes Thomas leaves behind.


That's really..................such..............a............shame.
Jesus, these guys are thin-skinned  
wigs in nyc : 11/9/2018 1:41 pm : link
the whole world can see it's better for the Knicks if KP milks the return. Noone in their right mind is juding his effort. Sounds like communication between coach and KP could really be improved - how are they not on the same page on this?
I would think  
Keith : 11/9/2018 1:42 pm : link
the KNicks would have to be really careful with how they present this to KP. It would probably be an issue if they told KP that they planned on keeping him on he injured list if he was healthy. They probably can't just come out and say it.
RE: Jesus, these guys are thin-skinned  
Ten Ton Hammer : 11/9/2018 2:09 pm : link
In comment 14170094 wigs in nyc said:
Quote:
the whole world can see it's better for the Knicks if KP milks the return. Noone in their right mind is juding his effort. Sounds like communication between coach and KP could really be improved - how are they not on the same page on this?

What's good for the Knicks isn't good for the player. It doesn't benefit him at all to milk the return. If he's perceived to be damaged goods, it affects his future earnings. Pretty simple.
RE: I would think  
nygiants16 : 11/9/2018 2:14 pm : link
In comment 14170096 Keith said:
Quote:
the KNicks would have to be really careful with how they present this to KP. It would probably be an issue if they told KP that they planned on keeping him on he injured list if he was healthy. They probably can't just come out and say it.


kp was the one who said he was not returning until he was 110 percent...
RE: Fizdale said talked to kp this morning  
PhiPsi125 : 11/9/2018 2:14 pm : link
In comment 14170022 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
he said frustration with perception he is not working hard to come back


Is this even a thing? I haven’t seen/heard/read anything negative about KPs rehab process. Where is this “perception” coming from? Thin air?
RE: RE: Fizdale said talked to kp this morning  
adamg : 11/9/2018 2:15 pm : link
In comment 14170127 PhiPsi125 said:
Quote:
In comment 14170022 nygiants16 said:


Quote:


he said frustration with perception he is not working hard to come back



Is this even a thing? I haven’t seen/heard/read anything negative about KPs rehab process. Where is this “perception” coming from? Thin air?


I agree. This whole thing sounds like a mountain out of a molehill.
RE: I would be shocked if Fizdale  
DanMetroMan : 11/9/2018 2:43 pm : link
In comment 14169826 Keith said:
Quote:
wasn't aware of where KP was in the process. Jogging usually happens 3-4 months after surgery. KP had his surgery in Feb. There is no way Fizdale thought KP was only jogging.


Fizdale acknowledged he did NOT know KP was sprinting and also acknowledged the comments made KP respond.
My first reaction is that it's amazing that Fizdale isn't aware  
Keith : 11/9/2018 2:53 pm : link
of where KP is at. Then as I think about it, I guess that's not really important. The HC should be worrying about the guys in the lockerroom, the front office should know where KP is at in his recovery. That being said, common sense should tell you that KP is running and cutting vs jogging. He's 9 months into his 6-7 month recovery!
ALso,  
Keith : 11/9/2018 2:54 pm : link
it's also reasonable to expect Fizdale to play dumb. To my earlier point...the NBA/union would not be happy with the Knicks sitting KP out when healthy so they need to play dumb and pretend like KP isn't ready.
RE: ALso,  
DanMetroMan : 11/9/2018 2:57 pm : link
In comment 14170165 Keith said:
Quote:
it's also reasonable to expect Fizdale to play dumb. To my earlier point...the NBA/union would not be happy with the Knicks sitting KP out when healthy so they need to play dumb and pretend like KP isn't ready.


You would think the Knicks would have communicated this "plan" aka playing dumb to KP.
Sounds like a lack of trust  
ghost718 : 11/9/2018 3:02 pm : link
Anything Fizdale says is not gonna change my mind on that
I think KP would benefit  
bceagle05 : 11/9/2018 3:45 pm : link
from expanding his inner circle beyond his brothers. Janis is his brother's keeper at this point, which is nice, but he's not a typical NBA agent who represents players all over the league and has to maintain relationships with all those coaches, GMs and owners. Someone who has that responsibility, and a little more objectivity, might be of assistance when these "troll" moves are being debated over video games at 3 a.m.
i know this year ia about tanking  
nygiants16 : 11/9/2018 8:01 pm : link
but if you could get beal and keep max space next year qould you do it? probably cost you a first and frank at minimum
RE: i know this year ia about tanking  
JustaDiscussion : 11/9/2018 8:47 pm : link
In comment 14170403 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
but if you could get beal and keep max space next year qould you do it? probably cost you a first and frank at minimum


I wouldn't, though I admittedly don't know enough about Beal to speak intelligently. He seems to be redundant with what the Knicks already have, but the Knick's players are younger. Also, if I'm not mistaken, Mills and Perry have said that they're not trading young talent or picks, so it seems like they wouldn't either. I hope they stick to their guns.
I love Beal's game and he's young and under contract  
bceagle05 : 11/9/2018 9:15 pm : link
BUT there are enough good shooting guards in this year's draft to sway me toward passing on that trade. That's a tough one though - Beal is one of my favorite players.
RE: i know this year ia about tanking  
adamg : 11/9/2018 9:33 pm : link
In comment 14170403 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
but if you could get beal and keep max space next year qould you do it? probably cost you a first and frank at minimum
Beal has to cost more than Frank and a first, no?
RE: RE: i know this year ia about tanking  
nygiants16 : 11/9/2018 10:27 pm : link
In comment 14170448 adamg said:
Quote:
In comment 14170403 nygiants16 said:


Quote:


but if you could get beal and keep max space next year qould you do it? probably cost you a first and frank at minimum

Beal has to cost more than Frank and a first, no?


hence the part where i said at minimum
RE: i know this year ia about tanking  
Ten Ton Hammer : 11/9/2018 10:32 pm : link
In comment 14170403 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
but if you could get beal and keep max space next year qould you do it? probably cost you a first and frank at minimum


And do what with Hardaway's contract? The math doesn't work out to have two shooting guards being paid that much. Beal is making 25, 27, 27m the next three seasons. Hardaway another 17, 17, 18.
RE: RE: lol  
steve in ky : 11/9/2018 10:34 pm : link
In comment 14169955 Mike in NJ said:
Quote:
In comment 14169592 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


Ian Begley
ESPN Staff Writer

David Fizdale said Thursday that injured All-Star Kristaps Porzingis was at the stage of light running -- but not sprinting -- in his rehab from an ACL tear. After those comments were published in media reports, Porzingis posted pictures of himself sprinting on Instagram.




Where is Begley getting this from? The most recent post on KPs Instagram is from October 27. Also, how can you tell from a picture whether a guy is lightly running or sprinting?


Pfft Speed lines
RE: RE: i know this year ia about tanking  
nygiants16 : 11/9/2018 10:44 pm : link
In comment 14170472 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
In comment 14170403 nygiants16 said:


Quote:


but if you could get beal and keep max space next year qould you do it? probably cost you a first and frank at minimum



And do what with Hardaway's contract? The math doesn't work out to have two shooting guards being paid that much. Beal is making 25, 27, 27m the next three seasons. Hardaway another 17, 17, 18.


hardaway would have to be involved most likely...

it was just a thought sin e wizards are most likely going to blow it up...

Nets taking care of nuggets  
hitdog42 : 11/9/2018 11:40 pm : link
In Denver
Levert with a game winning bucket essentially at the buzzer.
Back to .500 and 2-0 on the road trip
RE: Nets taking care of nuggets  
nygiants16 : 11/10/2018 7:49 am : link
In comment 14170498 hitdog42 said:
Quote:
In Denver
Levert with a game winning bucket essentially at the buzzer.
Back to .500 and 2-0 on the road trip


why do you want them to win? i cant root for losses either but i can see what is best for the knicks and that is adding another high draft pick while kp is out...

Nrts should want the same thing, there is no franchise talent on the nets, levert is a good player and allen is a good player but they are not leading you to a championship...

if the nets are the 8th seed or barely miss the playoffs that is horrible for them..
They are not going to get a top 5 pick  
hitdog42 : 11/10/2018 8:04 am : link
So there is no reason to root for losses
In a perfect world yes they would get that but it’s not happening— play too hard and in a good system with good depth- doesn’t add up to top 5

Defining what those 2 have for upside is a bit silly- given the leap each is taking this year- in particular Allen who is a bit of a freak
Brooks has to be fired within the the next  
dep026 : 11/10/2018 8:05 am : link
few days...

But will Thibs be the next one to go?
RE: They are not going to get a top 5 pick  
nygiants16 : 11/10/2018 8:06 am : link
In comment 14170538 hitdog42 said:
Quote:
So there is no reason to root for losses
In a perfect world yes they would get that but it’s not happening— play too hard and in a good system with good depth- doesn’t add up to top 5

Defining what those 2 have for upside is a bit silly- given the leap each is taking this year- in particular Allen who is a bit of a freak


i am not saying root for losses, but i am just saying in the end the best course of action is to lose...
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