Eli shut up no one tonight. He's a bad football player and if you think any differently based on tonight than you need to find a new sport to watch because you have no clue what you're watching.
Eli shut up no one tonight. He's a bad football player and if you think any differently based on tonight than you need to find a new sport to watch because you have no clue what you're watching.
He has a few bad throws, but he had some really nice ones too. The fact is that he drove his team downfield for a game-winning touchdown in the final minute.
Pathetic comments from the owner of this site and mook
Eli shut up no one tonight. He's a bad football player and if you think any differently based on tonight than you need to find a new sport to watch because you have no clue what you're watching.
Eli shut up no one tonight. He's a bad football player and if you think any differently based on tonight than you need to find a new sport to watch because you have no clue what you're watching.
Disappointed in you Mook.
Eli is among my favorite Giants players of all time, but it's coming
I'm happy for him personally that he got to drive the team to a win, but unfortunately I think the Giants just lost out on the #1 pick and their potential long-term QB answer.
Unless Oakland can somehow put together a couple of wins....which I don't see anytime soon.
I think he kinda proved both sides of this debate right tonight. At times showed he cant make all the plays he used to make, but also showed he can make enough big time plays to win.
We all know hes done soon, but its nice seeing him pull one out and smile after.
Yes, the penalty exchange ended up in our favor and helped the last drive. But Eli also showed he can still get it done when the blocking is there.
I swear Eli is the most scrutinized QB. Either you focus on all his great throws and ignore the bad ones or focus on his bad throws and ignore the great ones. Show me the perfect QB and Ill show you Jesus Cristi. We finally won a game and Eli did what he needed to do. Just savor the moment.
I'm happy for him personally that he got to drive the team to a win, but unfortunately I think the Giants just lost out on the #1 pick and their potential long-term QB answer.
Unless Oakland can somehow put together a couple of wins....which I don't see anytime soon.
Nah... there's no franchise qb in this draft so number 1 isn't a big deal this year
but his biggest issue was not the bad throws but his check-down throws when he's not under pressure, which happened multiple times on 3rd down. Those are killers.
but his biggest issue was not the bad throws but his check-down throws when he's not under pressure, which happened multiple times on 3rd down. Those are killers.
Didn't Eli convert like 7 of 9, or 8 of 10 3rd downs tonight?
Ill take 188 and 3 TDs (should have been a 4th if OBJ didnt slip) and no INTs over what has been his customary 285 yards/no TDs bc we cant score in the red zone game as of late
but his biggest issue was not the bad throws but his check-down throws when he's not under pressure, which happened multiple times on 3rd down. Those are killers.
Didn't Eli convert like 7 of 9, or 8 of 10 3rd downs tonight?
Was what I said wrong? Did he not repeatedly check down when he wasn't under pressure? And at least twice on 3rd down?
but his biggest issue was not the bad throws but his check-down throws when he's not under pressure, which happened multiple times on 3rd down. Those are killers.
Another genius on this board who has no idea what he's watching...
Eli shut up no one tonight. He's a bad football player and if you think any differently based on tonight than you need to find a new sport to watch because you have no clue what you're watching.
. Mook, Ive forgotten more football then you will ever know. Hes not a bad player. Is he great? No. But he is solid and when give. Time to throw he will win games. You may now continue to enjoy being a miserable hack.
but his biggest issue was not the bad throws but his check-down throws when he's not under pressure, which happened multiple times on 3rd down. Those are killers.
Didn't Eli convert like 7 of 9, or 8 of 10 3rd downs tonight?
And we were 5-12 on 3rd down...but when it comes to Eli you've never let reality or facts effect your analysis anyway.
but his biggest issue was not the bad throws but his check-down throws when he's not under pressure, which happened multiple times on 3rd down. Those are killers.
Didn't Eli convert like 7 of 9, or 8 of 10 3rd downs tonight?
And we were 5-12 on 3rd down...but when it comes to Eli you've never let reality or facts effect your analysis anyway.
I asked a question, asshole. I thought they said something like that on the last drive.
are serious ingrates. People should have more respect. It's absolutely sickening. Eli is the best QB we've ever had and just because the media is filled up with vultures doesn't mean our fanbase should follow suit. I believe that the more the line improves the more Eli makes sense. The more the play calling improves the more Eli makes sense. He is not the reason we have been losing.
Nice to see my all time favorite professional athlete bring my favorite team from behind to get a win. Love me some Eli fucking Manning! Been a professional every fucking day since he started with Big Blue. Gonna enjoy every last good play hes on the field. Thanks for another win 10.
Mook, Ive forgotten more football then you will ever know. Hes not a bad player. Is he great? No. But he is solid and when give. Time to throw he will win games. You may now continue to enjoy being a miserable hack.
but his biggest issue was not the bad throws but his check-down throws when he's not under pressure, which happened multiple times on 3rd down. Those are killers.
Didn't Eli convert like 7 of 9, or 8 of 10 3rd downs tonight?
Was what I said wrong? Did he not repeatedly check down when he wasn't under pressure? And at least twice on 3rd down?
So the criticism is that he checked down...into a first down? Weird.
Ill take 188 and 3 TDs (should have been a 4th if OBJ didnt slip) and no INTs over what has been his customary 285 yards/no TDs bc we cant score in the red zone game as of late
but he absolutely is still a bad football player. Thinking differently based on tonight is what makes most of this site totally delusional.
Bad football players can once in a while have a good game.
I love Eli and I'll forever appreciate the 2 super bowls, but he is a bad football player and part of the problem. One game doesnt change that. He's not any good. You can have a good game and still be a bad player, we've seen plenty enough of that over the last few years
Ill take 188 and 3 TDs (should have been a 4th if OBJ didnt slip) and no INTs over what has been his customary 285 yards/no TDs bc we cant score in the red zone game as of late
He's not any good. He plays well once every 6 or 7 weeks now and people use that as evidence that he's "not bad"
He is bad. The offensive line is bad. Eli makes the offensive line look worse than they actually are, and at the same time the offensive line makes Eli look worse than he actually is.
But the one undeniable fact is at this point both are bad.
The only reason the Giants have Eli is because they properly tanked in 2003.
Ill take 188 and 3 TDs (should have been a 4th if OBJ didnt slip) and no INTs over what has been his customary 285 yards/no TDs bc we cant score in the red zone game as of late
Except how many teams does this performance beat?
3 TDS and a decent defense? I would think, most..
Except this was a 2-7 team he did it against. With a practice squad QB. And it still wasnt good.
But he's not the future of this franchise, he will never win another playoff game with us ... so what's the point of this thread ?
. The point of this thread is Eli, the face of adversity led his team to a big win. Yes its a big win. I wont say he wont win a playoff game for us until he no longer plays for us. For one week, everyone can focus on the pour outs defense.
BTW your handle name says Metsareback - whats the point of that?
but he absolutely is still a bad football player. Thinking differently based on tonight is what makes most of this site totally delusional.
Bad football players can once in a while have a good game.
I love Eli and I'll forever appreciate the 2 super bowls, but he is a bad football player and part of the problem. One game doesnt change that. He's not any good. You can have a good game and still be a bad player, we've seen plenty enough of that over the last few years
Tonight was the same as the Houston game. When hes not under siege, hes still good enough. But, I guess I dont know what Im watching despite watching this game for 30 years.
Ill take 188 and 3 TDs (should have been a 4th if OBJ didnt slip) and no INTs over what has been his customary 285 yards/no TDs bc we cant score in the red zone game as of late
Except how many teams does this performance beat?
3 TDS and a decent defense? I would think, most..
Except this was a 2-7 team he did it against. With a practice squad QB. And it still wasnt good.
That wasnt even remotely close to being related to the question you asked.
but he absolutely is still a bad football player. Thinking differently based on tonight is what makes most of this site totally delusional.
Bad football players can once in a while have a good game.
I love Eli and I'll forever appreciate the 2 super bowls, but he is a bad football player and part of the problem. One game doesnt change that. He's not any good. You can have a good game and still be a bad player, we've seen plenty enough of that over the last few years
Tonight was the same as the Houston game. When hes not under siege, hes still good enough. But, I guess I dont know what Im watching despite watching this game for 30 years.
With Odell and Barkley if the line protects well just about any QB in the league will play well. This trash bag at QB for the 49ers was playing well at times tonight because you guessed it he had blocking in front of him. Even without much weapons at his disposal.
Basically you're saying Eli is ONLY capable of being a good player if everything is perfect in front of him. So its on everyone else. Maybe just maybe Eli being a complete statue back there at this point makes the offensive line look worse than it really is (and it's pretty horrible i agree)
If your argument is he's still good when everything is perfect, then I think you could say the same about 30 other QB's in the NFL.
He's bad because unless everything is perfect, he plays like shit, which is most of the time at this point.
He has 2 world class weapons on offense. That alone should be good for a couple touchdowns a game.
another bad player at this point. He goes off for 30 points in a game once in a while, does that prove that he's not actually bad? Of course not, still a bad player.
He missed a lot more than one. He under threw 3 on the last drive alone.
And he made some great throws, too.
The throw to Barkley down the sideline was a perfec throw. All Barkley had to do was look. It was placed perfectly. Leading him where he was basically on the sideline and well covered is not the ideal throw.
There was no chance the defender was defending the back shoulder throw.
He's not any good. He plays well once every 6 or 7 weeks now and people use that as evidence that he's "not bad"
He is bad. The offensive line is bad. Eli makes the offensive line look worse than they actually are, and at the same time the offensive line makes Eli look worse than he actually is.
But the one undeniable fact is at this point both are bad.
The only reason the Giants have Eli is because they properly tanked in 2003.
. You truly are a bitter person. Go root for the Eagles.
I believe that the more the line improves the more Eli makes sense. The more the play calling improves the more Eli makes sense. He is not the reason we have been losing.
another bad player at this point. He goes off for 30 points in a game once in a while, does that prove that he's not actually bad? Of course not, still a bad player.
your parents went off once in a while and now we all have to deal with you. Be quiet and go be miserable elsewhere.
but he absolutely is still a bad football player. Thinking differently based on tonight is what makes most of this site totally delusional.
Bad football players can once in a while have a good game.
I love Eli and I'll forever appreciate the 2 super bowls, but he is a bad football player and part of the problem. One game doesnt change that. He's not any good. You can have a good game and still be a bad player, we've seen plenty enough of that over the last few years
When half this place was yammering for quick slants, quick outs, etc. because we threw deep too much. Now we check down too much in a win. Jesus Christ
"Eli Manning is due for one of those games where his most loyal supporters can claim he still has it. But as discussed ad nauseam, those good games have become too infrequent."
It feels good to win, but we just played a horrible football team that bailed out the offense with two late defensive penalties. Game Preview - ( New Window )
RE: Pathetic comments from the owner of this site and mook
This is likely Elis last year, the team is 2-7 & its been a shit season. God forbid some fans are happy for Eli to get a win in his last year. Sheesh.
Fine, be happy that Eli got a win in his last year.
But you have people thinking this is evidence that he still has it and still is a good player.
How many more bad games from Eli do they have to see before they finally admit he is finished being a good football player over the course of an entire season?
I'm sick of having a shit roster and sick of not making the proper changes to get this team going in the right direction. DG went all in on Eli this off-season and while not entirely Eli's fault, that blew up on him big time.
I'm so sick and tired of having no shot to compete for a division title. Basically every year outside of the fluke 2016 season since 2013. That's what matters to me, competing for titles, not competing for 4-12, 5-11 seasons. I'd rather go 1-15 than 4-12, shoot me for it.
RE: RE: RE: Eli wasn't a bad football player tonight
but he absolutely is still a bad football player. Thinking differently based on tonight is what makes most of this site totally delusional.
Bad football players can once in a while have a good game.
I love Eli and I'll forever appreciate the 2 super bowls, but he is a bad football player and part of the problem. One game doesnt change that. He's not any good. You can have a good game and still be a bad player, we've seen plenty enough of that over the last few years
Tonight was the same as the Houston game. When hes not under siege, hes still good enough. But, I guess I dont know what Im watching despite watching this game for 30 years.
With Odell and Barkley if the line protects well just about any QB in the league will play well. This trash bag at QB for the 49ers was playing well at times tonight because you guessed it he had blocking in front of him. Even without much weapons at his disposal.
Basically you're saying Eli is ONLY capable of being a good player if everything is perfect in front of him. So its on everyone else. Maybe just maybe Eli being a complete statue back there at this point makes the offensive line look worse than it really is (and it's pretty horrible i agree)
If your argument is he's still good when everything is perfect, then I think you could say the same about 30 other QB's in the NFL.
He's bad because unless everything is perfect, he plays like shit, which is most of the time at this point.
He has 2 world class weapons on offense. That alone should be good for a couple touchdowns a game.
Im not saying everything has to be perfect. It just has to be decent and he can be successful. Is he what he was in 2011? No, but if they dont love Herbert/College QB, hes probably still the best option in 2019.
RE: RE: Pathetic comments from the owner of this site and mook
I know bad football when I see it. You sound like Dave Gettleman.
Don't worry Eric. Eli isn't part of the problem, he's just a victim of a bad offensive line. Get a couple more offensive lineman and surely Eli will return to his former great years.
There's nothing wrong with a 37 year old quarterback being cooked as far as being an even decent QB. Age catches up with someone earlier than others. Eli is a slam dunk HOF guy in my opinion, just right now is a poor QB.
is brought back next year, everyone involved with that decision needs to be removed from the organization, John Mara included.
I dont care if they dont like a QB enough next year, you still cant keep Eli around especially at his cap number. At that point give the team to Lauletta and if he sucks you pick a QB the next year.
Bringing back Eli next year would be a horrible decision but wouldnt surprise me with DG and JM running this show
We had 63 passing yards in the first half. We finished with 188. The three TD throws were excellent. Beckham was thrown at 11 times with only 4 completions. Engram was left wide open on a 31 yard gain. The 23-yarder to Saquon was an excellent play all around.
But the Giants got bailed out by the defensive holding penalty. If the 49ers don't do that, we lose to a 3rd string QB.
We had 63 passing yards in the first half. We finished with 188. The three TD throws were excellent. Beckham was thrown at 11 times with only 4 completions. Engram was left wide open on a 31 yard gain. The 23-yarder to Saquon was an excellent play all around.
But the Giants got bailed out by the defensive holding penalty. If the 49ers don't do that, we lose to a 3rd string QB.
Again, OBJ dropped an easy slant on the first play of the game. He also fell down when wide open on what would have been a TD. So let's not act like the 4/11 on attempts to him was terrible QB play.
What a 4th rd draft pick has and just come out and admit that you're both miserable because we won a game and have put at risk the #1 pick in a draft that has any really exciting QB prospects?
Stop trying to sugarcoat that miserable of a view that we need to tank with 7 games left.
RE: RE: Pathetic comments from the owner of this site and mook
I know bad football when I see it. You sound like Dave Gettleman.
This isn't even the first time he has called you out Eric. He is an insufferable poster that does nothing but throw jabs at those that dare criticize his hero Eli Manning.
RE: Can we stop with the weak argument that we need to see
What a 4th rd draft pick has and just come out and admit that you're both miserable because we won a game and have put at risk the #1 pick in a draft that has any really exciting QB prospects?
Stop trying to sugarcoat that miserable of a view that we need to tank with 7 games left.
"Hasn't any really exciting QB prospects"
RE: RE: RE: Pathetic comments from the owner of this site and mook
I know bad football when I see it. You sound like Dave Gettleman.
This isn't even the first time he has called you out Eric. He is an insufferable poster that does nothing but throw jabs at those that dare criticize his hero Eli Manning.
Again, I predicted this in my game preview, and I predicted the reaction.
Eli wasn't bad, and at times, he was downright good. But again, we were breath away from a bad 23-20 loss with about 150 passing yards (had the game ended on a 4th-and-long incompletion). Eli checked down a bunch tonight and he should of audibled when OBJ was left all alone in the red zone. There were a few "WTF" passes in the game, not just one.
The danger here is - like Gettleman - fans will point to 1-out-4 games and say, "See, we can still win with Eli!"
This is the same mindset John Mara has too.
It's time to move on.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Pathetic comments from the owner of this site and mook
I know bad football when I see it. You sound like Dave Gettleman.
This isn't even the first time he has called you out Eric. He is an insufferable poster that does nothing but throw jabs at those that dare criticize his hero Eli Manning.
Shut up Dupe
Wow. What a great contribution. Your mother must be proud.
We had 63 passing yards in the first half. We finished with 188. The three TD throws were excellent. Beckham was thrown at 11 times with only 4 completions. Engram was left wide open on a 31 yard gain. The 23-yarder to Saquon was an excellent play all around.
But the Giants got bailed out by the defensive holding penalty. If the 49ers don't do that, we lose to a 3rd string QB.
It's doesn't matter Eric...there's no reason to point out facts to the Eli fanboys. They are literally making up fake stats to prove how good Eli is. We were 5-12 on 3rd downs and Britt's going around bragging how great Eli was because he was either 7-9 or 8-10 on 3rd downs.
So maybe Eli wasn't really 18-31 for 188 yards, maybe he was really 25-28 for 375 yards.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Pathetic comments from the owner of this site and mook
I know bad football when I see it. You sound like Dave Gettleman.
This isn't even the first time he has called you out Eric. He is an insufferable poster that does nothing but throw jabs at those that dare criticize his hero Eli Manning.
Shut up Dupe
Wow. What a great contribution. Your mother must be proud.
Really good response especially because it nails it Dupe
We had 63 passing yards in the first half. We finished with 188. The three TD throws were excellent. Beckham was thrown at 11 times with only 4 completions. Engram was left wide open on a 31 yard gain. The 23-yarder to Saquon was an excellent play all around.
But the Giants got bailed out by the defensive holding penalty. If the 49ers don't do that, we lose to a 3rd string QB.
It's doesn't matter Eric...there's no reason to point out facts to the Eli fanboys. They are literally making up fake stats to prove how good Eli is. We were 5-12 on 3rd downs and Britt's going around bragging how great Eli was because he was either 7-9 or 8-10 on 3rd downs.
So maybe Eli wasn't really 18-31 for 188 yards, maybe he was really 25-28 for 375 yards.
We had 63 passing yards in the first half. We finished with 188. The three TD throws were excellent. Beckham was thrown at 11 times with only 4 completions. Engram was left wide open on a 31 yard gain. The 23-yarder to Saquon was an excellent play all around.
But the Giants got bailed out by the defensive holding penalty. If the 49ers don't do that, we lose to a 3rd string QB.
Again, OBJ dropped an easy slant on the first play of the game. He also fell down when wide open on what would have been a TD. So let's not act like the 4/11 on attempts to him was terrible QB play.
There were also a couple more where the defender just made a great play. Pass was only where OBJ could get it, tight coverage and the defender knocked it away.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Pathetic comments from the owner of this site and mook
I know bad football when I see it. You sound like Dave Gettleman.
This isn't even the first time he has called you out Eric. He is an insufferable poster that does nothing but throw jabs at those that dare criticize his hero Eli Manning.
Shut up Dupe
Wow. What a great contribution. Your mother must be proud.
Really good response especially because it nails it Dupe
Remember when I owned you in the Eli contract discussion? Shut the fuck up already. You pretend you are the equivalent of Britt but you are not.
Again, I predicted this in my game preview, and I predicted the reaction.
Eli wasn't bad, and at times, he was downright good. But again, we were breath away from a bad 23-20 loss with about 150 passing yards (had the game ended on a 4th-and-long incompletion). Eli checked down a bunch tonight and he should of audibled when OBJ was left all alone in the red zone. There were a few "WTF" passes in the game, not just one.
The danger here is - like Gettleman - fans will point to 1-out-4 games and say, "See, we can still win with Eli!"
This is the same mindset John Mara has too.
It's time to move on.
1 mil % end of thread
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Pathetic comments from the owner of this site and mook
I know bad football when I see it. You sound like Dave Gettleman.
This isn't even the first time he has called you out Eric. He is an insufferable poster that does nothing but throw jabs at those that dare criticize his hero Eli Manning.
Shut up Dupe
Wow. What a great contribution. Your mother must be proud.
Really good response especially because it nails it Dupe
Remember when I owned you in the Eli contract discussion? Shut the fuck up already. You pretend you are the equivalent of Britt but you are not.
LOL...You know what I do remember that and I just realized you own me in here...
Beating another bottom dweller with a backup rookie QB and thinking that proves something conclusively, is the height of recency bias. Where was that performance when the season still mattered against our division rivals like Dallas or philly or against battered/ugly defenses in New Orleans or Atlanta.
But, it does quiet them a little. First, just like last year, it needs to be more than one game to shut up the critics completely. Second, the 3 TDs were great, but the multiple deep balls that were terribly underthrown were ugly amd at least one was an easy TD to OBJ. I want to see him and the OL build on the good from this game.
RE: RE: Pathetic comments from the owner of this site and mook
If youre on one side you have to hate the other. Its sad.
Eli didnt play great but it was nice to see him do some good things and win a game for a change. Some people have already committed to the Eli sucks, get rid of him side of things that they cant even enjoy this game and are butthurt that they won.
I need some confidence in the QB, the coaching staff, and some of the players, not to mention the GM. Some good games and some wins are not evil. The bottom falling out helps NO ONE, draft be damned. They beat a shitty team tonight but maybe they get some confidence and they can build on this.
Eli is not the future. This game will not create delusion in the front office or with the coaches-Im pretty sure Shurmur knows exactly what hes watching and its mediocre QB play. But this was a decent game and a fun win with some great plays. Youre allowed to enjoy it and you dont have to get defensive and shit on people who do. The other extreme-Look Eli is awesome! is a delusional point of view. The answer of course is somewhere in the middle but were conditioned to jump all over the other side no matter what.
Ill take a few good wins (beat the Eagles in philly, would anyone be crying?) and some solid play so that I can feel good about next year. Draft your qb or trade up if need be. Personally I cant root for another 2-14 year. It could happen but with a new coach and GM... it isnt necessarily a great thing to be that horrible again despite the draft pick. We do need some positives.
I hate seeing Manning get pounded into the turf. Watching him play good football is a pleasure.
But playing well against a bottom 3 team, isn't an indication of things to come, nor a reason to invest in that future.
The difference between bad and good in the NFL is so thin. And we've seen 7 other times in full view the talent/age trajectories between QB and team don't line up well for the Giants.
And like Eric, I thought Eli was in his typical cycle where he was due for a productive game. We were off a bye, against another poor team, and playing against an opposing QB recently from the practice squad.
And Eric is right - we got bailed out by a very questionable defensive holding call on 2nd and 20 on the GW drive. That was two guys playing football, with much of the contact initiated by OBJ. But the NFL is so pro-offense that they continue to move the game down this path where they want to be the NBA with a prolate spheroid. Its just unbearable - even when it goes your way...
The Carter call, for example, was right in todays game but it was really just a guy playing football and tackling another player. The game is just pathetic to watch...
I hate seeing Manning get pounded into the turf. Watching him play good football is a pleasure.
But playing well against a bottom 3 team, isn't an indication of things to come, nor a reason to invest in that future.
The difference between bad and good in the NFL is so thin. And we've seen 7 other times in full view the talent/age trajectories between QB and team don't line up well for the Giants.
No predictions or projections, but if, perhaps a big if, the protection holds up as it did last night, lets see where Eli really is at this point in his career, when he finally has the time.
And like Eric, I thought Eli was in his typical cycle where he was due for a productive game. We were off a bye, against another poor team, and playing against an opposing QB recently from the practice squad.
And Eric is right - we got bailed out by a very questionable defensive holding call on 2nd and 20 on the GW drive. That was two guys playing football, with much of the contact initiated by OBJ. But the NFL is so pro-offense that they continue to move the game down this path where they want to be the NBA with a prolate spheroid. Its just unbearable - even when it goes your way...
The Carter call, for example, was right in todays game but it was really just a guy playing football and tackling another player. The game is just pathetic to watch...
Seriously, after 15 years, you really need to recuse yourself from any discussion of Eli or even TC for that matter. We know and have seen your consistently subjective stances by now as it pertains to those two. There is nothing to be learned from your takes on these guys. Perhaps, if you persist on weighing in on Eli, you should offer a disclaimer such as, Im not an Eli guy, but.... 😎😎
Neither of them are playing against each other. Many on this thread keep repeating that narrative that Eli barely squeezes out a win against a QB that was on the practice squad a few weeks ago.
If anything, fans should be pissed at our defense for giving up 23 points to a QB that was on the practice squad a few weeks ago.
Was Manning perfect? I don't think anyone is claiming he was. But his performance was enough. The OL for once weren't lolling around with their bellies in the mire while defenders have a free release on Eli. Eli isn't some decrepit, noodle-arm, frail, geriatric that some of his critics make him out to be.
I hate seeing Manning get pounded into the turf. Watching him play good football is a pleasure.
But playing well against a bottom 3 team, isn't an indication of things to come, nor a reason to invest in that future.
The difference between bad and good in the NFL is so thin. And we've seen 7 other times in full view the talent/age trajectories between QB and team don't line up well for the Giants.
No predictions or projections, but if, perhaps a big if, the protection holds up as it did last night, lets see where Eli really is at this point in his career, when he finally has the time.
He had time and averaged 6 yards per passing attempt, and barely beat a 2 win team that turned it over twice - once in their own zone.
I hate seeing Manning get pounded into the turf. Watching him play good football is a pleasure.
But playing well against a bottom 3 team, isn't an indication of things to come, nor a reason to invest in that future.
The difference between bad and good in the NFL is so thin. And we've seen 7 other times in full view the talent/age trajectories between QB and team don't line up well for the Giants.
No predictions or projections, but if, perhaps a big if, the protection holds up as it did last night, lets see where Eli really is at this point in his career, when he finally has the time.
He had time and averaged 6 yards per passing attempt, and barely beat a 2 win team that turned it over twice - once in their own zone.
We know where Eli is at in his career.
Take a look around the league. See how many times this year Brady and Rodgers FOR EXAMPLE, have averaged between 6-7 yards per attempt. Seriously, actually go look. No, Im not comparing Eli to these guys, but when I bring this point up, its met with, yeah, but he threw for 3-4 TDs, thats what matters. Got it
Still showing up and being pissed off that we won. Even more pissed off that Eli had a big hand in the win.
Just makes ya laugh anymore.
Eli plays a good game and leads a game winning TD drive, and his critics cite the fact he didnt put up enough fantasy stats as evidence he didnt play that well.
If 188 yards and 3 TDs and a game winning drive isnt good enough, imagine the way this place would have been in the Phil Simms era
So much talk about our two-time MVP Super Bowl QB...
Again, I predicted this in my game preview, and I predicted the reaction.
Eli wasn't bad, and at times, he was downright good. But again, we were breath away from a bad 23-20 loss with about 150 passing yards (had the game ended on a 4th-and-long incompletion). Eli checked down a bunch tonight and he should of audibled when OBJ was left all alone in the red zone. There were a few "WTF" passes in the game, not just one.
The danger here is - like Gettleman - fans will point to 1-out-4 games and say, "See, we can still win with Eli!"
This is the same mindset John Mara has too.
It's time to move on.
I never said it wasn't time to move on. Just saying there's no need to go out of your way looking for things to criticize.
Again, I predicted this in my game preview, and I predicted the reaction.
Eli wasn't bad, and at times, he was downright good. But again, we were breath away from a bad 23-20 loss with about 150 passing yards (had the game ended on a 4th-and-long incompletion). Eli checked down a bunch tonight and he should of audibled when OBJ was left all alone in the red zone. There were a few "WTF" passes in the game, not just one.
The danger here is - like Gettleman - fans will point to 1-out-4 games and say, "See, we can still win with Eli!"
This is the same mindset John Mara has too.
It's time to move on.
I never said it wasn't time to move on. Just saying there's no need to go out of your way looking for things to criticize.
it's time to move on from Eli after this year. Hopefully upper management has already arrived at that conclusion. Nice to get a win, but too many plays being left on the table for a guy making franchise money. Take the $17M and see if they can't sign a good Center, or a pass rusher.
where Eli tossed 3 TDs and a GW drive... the narrative is he didnt play that well and he is still done in comparison too...
Ogletree not being able to cover me
Collins with one of the worst performances of his career
Vernon playing like an absolute bum
STs had 3 costly penalties
We didnt sack a rookie QB once.
Not sure you understand the QB position well. People bring up Brees and Brady all the time. Brees has a great offensive line and a running game. I think both would have similar results with this Giants team along with its coaching and scheme.
Booger got on Eli pretty good last night. He was right that he can still play but needs more from his team now. Eli with the 2008 Giants line and running game could be at a high level this year. The problem is the Giants are far from creating that type of supporting team and it is best to move on as it is going to take some years to strengthen the LOS on both sides. In the interim, relax and pull for him to finish out the year with some dignity. I was pretty happy to see him smiling post game.
Eric, I apologize, I was over the top angry last night and said some stupid shit to other posters. I do disagree with the points about management though. This is exactly the meaningless performance that I think will have Gettleman saying they can still win with Eli. Until he provides me with evidence to the contrary, he is still the GM that highlights moments as confirmation bias.
I hate seeing Manning get pounded into the turf. Watching him play good football is a pleasure.
But playing well against a bottom 3 team, isn't an indication of things to come, nor a reason to invest in that future.
The difference between bad and good in the NFL is so thin. And we've seen 7 other times in full view the talent/age trajectories between QB and team don't line up well for the Giants.
No predictions or projections, but if, perhaps a big if, the protection holds up as it did last night, lets see where Eli really is at this point in his career, when he finally has the time.
He had time and averaged 6 yards per passing attempt, and barely beat a 2 win team that turned it over twice - once in their own zone.
We know where Eli is at in his career.
Take a look around the league. See how many times this year Brady and Rodgers FOR EXAMPLE, have averaged between 6-7 yards per attempt. Seriously, actually go look. No, Im not comparing Eli to these guys, but when I bring this point up, its met with, yeah, but he threw for 3-4 TDs, thats what matters. Got it
Both the Pats and Packers are having down years on offense and still:
Aaron Rodgers has done it 3 times this year and they are 0-2-1 in those games.
Tom Brady has done it 2 times this year, they are 0-2 in those games.
Eli has done it 6 times in 9 games and they are 1-5 in those games. In fact teams this year that average 6.5 ypa or less are 22-58-1. Its not a winnable formula in 2018.
where Eli tossed 3 TDs and a GW drive... the narrative is he didnt play that well and he is still done in comparison too...
Ogletree not being able to cover me
Collins with one of the worst performances of his career
Vernon playing like an absolute bum
STs had 3 costly penalties
We didnt sack a rookie QB once.
BBI never disappoints.
Youre not wrong, just in the wrong thread for those points.
I just had a good feeling after this game and was glad to see the team win. I am not a scout and fully realize Eli is near the end. Change is always hard, but I am happy for the team today..
What I mind is when people make ridiculous fucking statements:
Quote:
What you dont like the name calling when its to you?
If they werent playing a bottom three team in the league they lose by double digits with the performance tonight.
Teams thats score under 30 points and pass for under 200 yards are 88-130 (.404) the last two years.
If you tally up all of the QB's with 180+ yards, 3 TD's and no turnovers, I'm going to bet that 75% of those games are wins.
You really seem to think that isn't true. Shows both how biased you are against Eli as well as how big of a fucking moron you are.
Why does it matter who gets the TDs? Points are points. That situation has happened 5 times in 2 years, and two of the four wins the winning team scored 30+ points.
that posters are taking joy and calling others butthurt when we won a meaningless game against a practice squad quarterback. Hope it makes your day better.
I would rather this team make the necessary changes that result in this team actually being relevant moving forward. If this team was even remotely competent this season we would be fighting for a division title.
There is absolutely no reason to shit on Eli after last night's game.
Those of you who are doing it, are doing so with an agenda and it's pretty piss poor in my opinion.
He's on the way out, you're going to get your wish. Just like you did with Tom Coughlin. Let the Coughlin thing be a lesson. Yeah, maybe it was time for him to go, too, but what has followed has been absolutely terrible.
The fact that you sh-t on these guys when they're down says a lot more about you than anybody else.
This is a Giants fan site. Eli Manning is one of the greatest Giants of all time. You got nothing nice to say about seeing the guy get it done a lost couple of times? Then show some respect and shut up.
There's no need to downplay his accomplishments. It's coming to an end, anyway. This year or next.
Let people enjoy the end of his career if they want.
that posters are taking joy and calling others butthurt when we won a meaningless game against a practice squad quarterback. Hope it makes your day better.
I would rather this team make the necessary changes that result in this team actually being relevant moving forward. If this team was even remotely competent this season we would be fighting for a division title.
Heh.
RE: There is absolutely no reason to shit on Eli after last night's game.
Those of you who are doing it, are doing so with an agenda and it's pretty piss poor in my opinion.
He's on the way out, you're going to get your wish. Just like you did with Tom Coughlin. Let the Coughlin thing be a lesson. Yeah, maybe it was time for him to go, too, but what has followed has been absolutely terrible.
The fact that you sh-t on these guys when they're down says a lot more about you than anybody else.
I assume you are talking to me Britt, and I have never once been one of ignorant assholes that tried to make the argument that Eli was never good and has been carried by the team around him.
He used to be a good QB, now he is not. A meaningless game against a garbage team changes nothing. I dont agree. He absolutely should be on his way out, but I am not convinced, given the level of incompetence this organization has shown recently. I would not be shocked if Eli were the opening day starter next year.
This is a Giants fan site. Eli Manning is one of the greatest Giants of all time. You got nothing nice to say about seeing the guy get it done a lost couple of times? Then show some respect and shut up.
There's no need to downplay his accomplishments. It's coming to an end, anyway. This year or next.
Let people enjoy the end of his career if they want.
At this stage, Eli is neither the best nor the worst starting qb
in the league. The fact that he's held up this long behind the sieve we call an offensive line while putting up respectable numbers for a starting qb is amazing. There's no reason to put a small school 4th round qb with a weak arm in the starting lineup as a rookie. He'd get eaten up alive.
I agree. It was a win against a team that isn't very good. And it was a close game. But some of our losses were also close games - including that last minute field goal from the other side of town.
and HE IS on his way out. That's the point. The road is nearing the end.... So rather than sh-t on him why not just show some damn respect and root for the guy on his way out, rather than downplay everything?
I don't care how sh-tty San Fran is, our ENTIRE team is equally as sh-tty. They gave Eli some time last night, and some semblance of a run game so he could playaction, and he was able to muster it up and get it done.
If nothing else, maybe performances like last night can energize the rest of the roster and build some confidence in the rest of the team moving forward.
Greg, I dont mean to derail this thread, but I never got to see Simms play. Can you please share your thoughts as to why he is the best QB to ever play for the Giants? I know all about the amazing superbowl performance, etc. What was he like on a week to week basis?
Eli Manning, one of my favorite NY athletes ever but this consistent "I told you so" is tedious. It's time to move on. No need to pile on or diminish what he has done for the organization and as us the viewing fans but if he's the starting QB next season they really did the fans a disservice. If you watch any of the other good teams you see their QB's doing things Eli no longer can do. His arm strength is diminished and while never the quickest guy he is one of the slower QB's in the NFL at this point.
Greg, I dont mean to derail this thread, but I never got to see Simms play. Can you please share your thoughts as to why he is the best QB to ever play for the Giants? I know all about the amazing superbowl performance, etc. What was he like on a week to week basis?
Simms played in a much, much tougher environment for a QB, in an NFC that was absolutely brutal, and the best receivers he ever had were a TE (Bavaro) and half a season of Mike Sherrard in 1993.
Eli Manning, one of my favorite NY athletes ever but this consistent "I told you so" is tedious.
So is the "Eli is done" line that is used on the majority of BBI threads even though no one is disagreeing.
It's one of the odder things I've seen on BBI. It's as if this is a good team with a ton of talent being held back by a 2 time SB QB. I fully agree it's time to move on but why are so many obsessed with piling on or proclaiming how done he is? He's diminished, he's 37 years old with 237 NFL games under his belt. It happens to the best of em. If we are going to compare him to others.. Brady might be the GOAT and Drew Brees game is closer to what the NFL now is than the traditional QB. Quick release, move around the pocket etc and quite frankly Brees too is one of the GOAT. He's a no doubter HOFer.
Eli Manning, one of my favorite NY athletes ever but this consistent "I told you so" is tedious.
So is the "Eli is done" line that is used on the majority of BBI threads even though no one is disagreeing.
It's one of the odder things I've seen on BBI. It's as if this is a good team with a ton of talent being held back by a 2 time SB QB. I fully agree it's time to move on but why are so many obsessed with piling on or proclaiming how done he is? He's diminished, he's 37 years old with 237 NFL games under his belt. It happens to the best of em. If we are going to compare him to others.. Brady might be the GOAT and Drew Brees game is closer to what the NFL now is than the traditional QB. Quick release, move around the pocket etc and quite frankly Brees too is one of the GOAT. He's a no doubter HOFer.
After last week, the GOAT may be done too.
because people like dep and Britt would never, ever concede even
the slightest criticism of Eli Manning. He was never at fault for anything, ever. He was always amazing and incredible and the bestest of bestest QBs of all time.
"After we went and scored, I came back to the sideline and said to him, 'Man, you've been doing that since I was like 12!'... When you're young and you are watching him on TV you're like 'Oh, wow!'" - Saquon Barkley
Quote:
Im happy to be with him and Im embracing the time I do have with him. I dont know what the future holds, but Im embracing the time to play with greatness and Im taking in every moment. - Sterling Shepard on Eli Manning
RE: because people like dep and Britt would never, ever concede even
the slightest criticism of Eli Manning. He was never at fault for anything, ever. He was always amazing and incredible and the bestest of bestest QBs of all time.
Every action has an equal and opposite reaction.
lol. Just wow.
RE: because people like dep and Britt would never, ever concede even
the slightest criticism of Eli Manning. He was never at fault for anything, ever. He was always amazing and incredible and the bestest of bestest QBs of all time.
Every action has an equal and opposite reaction.
It's interesting because you act the same way you just described towards anything 80's or 1990's giants.
RE: because people like dep and Britt would never, ever concede even
the slightest criticism of Eli Manning. He was never at fault for anything, ever. He was always amazing and incredible and the bestest of bestest QBs of all time.
Every action has an equal and opposite reaction.
Don't forget to throw in Tom Coughlin.
RE: RE: because people like dep and Britt would never, ever concede even
the slightest criticism of Eli Manning. He was never at fault for anything, ever. He was always amazing and incredible and the bestest of bestest QBs of all time.
Every action has an equal and opposite reaction.
I actually think this is fair. I have been overly critical of Manning, but a lot of that is due to some of the absurd excuses and hero worshiping I hear on here.
It is no different than the morons that say Eli only has Superbowls because of the pass rush those teams had. Some of you guys go way over the top in defending him.
Greg, I dont mean to derail this thread, but I never got to see Simms play. Can you please share your thoughts as to why he is the best QB to ever play for the Giants? I know all about the amazing superbowl performance, etc. What was he like on a week to week basis?
Simms played in a much, much tougher environment for a QB, in an NFC that was absolutely brutal, and the best receivers he ever had were a TE (Bavaro) and half a season of Mike Sherrard in 1993.
Disagree on Sherrard. Lionel Manual was the best receiver he ever had...and he was pretty good and underrated IMO.
But Greg's point is 100% accurate....Simms played in a much tougher environment for QB's and he never had anything close to the receiving corps that Eli's had for his career.
Seriously, after 15 years, you really need to recuse yourself from any discussion of Eli or even TC for that matter. We know and have seen your consistently subjective stances by now as it pertains to those two. There is nothing to be learned from your takes on these guys. Perhaps, if you persist on weighing in on Eli, you should offer a disclaimer such as, Im not an Eli guy, but.... 😎😎
What did I write that was unreasonable? I wrote that Eli had a solid game and that we were the beneficiaries of a poor call at the end.
I dont deny at all that I was disgusted with what Archie, Condon, and Peyton did leading up to that 2004 draft. It was a cocksucker move. And it was outrageously hypocritical after Peyton was more than willing to join the hideous Colts, but baby brother Eli was too good for the Chargers. Are we to believe the Irsays were this football royalty over the Spanoses? Please...what a joke.
But I am more than capable of setting that side and offering measured, well reasoned opinions on Eli and all things Jints Central... ; )
Take a look around the league. See how many times this year Brady and Rodgers FOR EXAMPLE, have averaged between 6-7 yards per attempt. Seriously, actually go look. No, Im not comparing Eli to these guys, but when I bring this point up, its met with, yeah, but he threw for 3-4 TDs, thats what matters. Got it
Bruce, I actually think it's fair to compare both the players and the situations. I actually don't think Manning's decline is disproportionate to Brees's or Brady's. Granted, I think where they've declined from was higher, so there's that.
Two things are obvious: 1) the Giants have a massive talent deficit 2) Manning isn't the transcendent player from 7 years ago.
Things the Patriots and Saints have immediately; better coaching, arguably much better talent, and more than a decade of observation by the coach of the QB of who he is and once was.
So now how do the Giants get back into contention if those variables are true?
Can't turn back time and not fire Coughlin, can't turn back time and retrieve peak Manning. So what's left is address the talent disparity between Manning's team and his opponents.
Against an equally talented team last night he looked very good. He could move the ball methodically, take the 6 yards, and take the scores. Problem is the equally talented team is one of the worst.
My primary contention with Manning has never been his talent has eroded too far to compete, it's the trajectory of his erosion against the trajectory of upping the talent around him. As we've seen this year, grabbing 4-5 good players against turning over 35 bad hasn't moved the needle.
I think it's a good 2 more years -- and by then I think Manning is going to be a deficit.
Greg, I dont mean to derail this thread, but I never got to see Simms play. Can you please share your thoughts as to why he is the best QB to ever play for the Giants? I know all about the amazing superbowl performance, etc. What was he like on a week to week basis?
Simms played in a much, much tougher environment for a QB, in an NFC that was absolutely brutal, and the best receivers he ever had were a TE (Bavaro) and half a season of Mike Sherrard in 1993.
This is very true. Simms took a pounding when football was actually football. And he was damn good despite playing in a stadium that was very, very tricky and with a HC/OC who were very run centric...
Yes, after that, the Giants running game fell apart, but that's an eight year stretch where the running game was great for all but two years, and was still above average in one of those two. Now, let's look at Simms. I'll even leave off 1979-80 even though those years undercut your argument, and of course Brunner was the starter in 82-83 and Hostetler for all but 8 games in 1991-92 so those are out too.
Seriously, after 15 years, you really need to recuse yourself from any discussion of Eli or even TC for that matter. We know and have seen your consistently subjective stances by now as it pertains to those two. There is nothing to be learned from your takes on these guys. Perhaps, if you persist on weighing in on Eli, you should offer a disclaimer such as, Im not an Eli guy, but.... 😎😎
What did I write that was unreasonable? I wrote that Eli had a solid game and that we were the beneficiaries of a poor call at the end.
I dont deny at all that I was disgusted with what Archie, Condon, and Peyton did leading up to that 2004 draft. It was a cocksucker move. And it was outrageously hypocritical after Peyton was more than willing to join the hideous Colts, but baby brother Eli was too good for the Chargers. Are we to believe the Irsays were this football royalty over the Spanoses? Please...what a joke.
But I am more than capable of setting that side and offering measured, well reasoned opinions on Eli and all things Jints Central... ; )
I think you are a valuable poster and a worthy adversary. But don't pretend like we forget your embarrassing posts from this past summer proclaiming Eli would be the starter for another 2/3 years. Now you have conviction that his time is up and he is on the way out?
I think contrary to the popular opinion shared among you and your constituents, I think there is a very good chance Eli is not only on the roster next year, but is the starter week 1.
Won't be surprised either way. But I know you will be.
I know we are probably better off losing, but it was great to see Eli lead us down the field in the 4th quarter. I don't want him going out like he has.
I don't think Eli played great. He played good enough to beat a crappy team, but that's what it is at this point. With OBJ in man coverage and not getting help, he should ahve had 12 catches and 3 TD's.
Either way, Im happy we won the game and like seeing Eli happy on the sidelines. He deserves it.
Its incredibly weird. Hope they run the table and Eli is back for his final year. I want to see the best QB in franchise history go out on top and dont care how many fans that hope annoys. I have no issue, ever, of going overboard for our QB. Jamon was a good addition and Gettleman is serious about fixing the Oline. He also believes in Eli. Unlike that tool Marc Ross
Its incredibly weird. Hope they run the table and Eli is back for his final year. I want to see the best QB in franchise history go out on top and dont care how many fans that hope annoys. I have no issue, ever, of going overboard for our QB. Jamon was a good addition and Gettleman is serious about fixing the Oline. He also believes in Eli. Unlike that tool Marc Ross
Heres the problem that some people like yourself don't understand. A lot of people, myself included, feel really strongly about Eli's abilities at this point in his career. I think just about all of us would hope that they run the table and Eli goes out a champ, but we believe the likelihood of that happening is almost 0%. Should we just stick our heads in the sand and ignore what we've seen for the past 3 years because fans like yourself want to lie to yourselves and pretend like he can still win something?
RE: RE: Some people get so snarky when Eli plays well
Its incredibly weird. Hope they run the table and Eli is back for his final year. I want to see the best QB in franchise history go out on top and dont care how many fans that hope annoys. I have no issue, ever, of going overboard for our QB. Jamon was a good addition and Gettleman is serious about fixing the Oline. He also believes in Eli. Unlike that tool Marc Ross
Heres the problem that some people like yourself don't understand. A lot of people, myself included, feel really strongly about Eli's abilities at this point in his career. I think just about all of us would hope that they run the table and Eli goes out a champ, but we believe the likelihood of that happening is almost 0%. Should we just stick our heads in the sand and ignore what we've seen for the past 3 years because fans like yourself want to lie to yourselves and pretend like he can still win something?
Its incredibly weird. Hope they run the table and Eli is back for his final year. I want to see the best QB in franchise history go out on top and dont care how many fans that hope annoys. I have no issue, ever, of going overboard for our QB. Jamon was a good addition and Gettleman is serious about fixing the Oline. He also believes in Eli. Unlike that tool Marc Ross
Heres the problem that some people like yourself don't understand. A lot of people, myself included, feel really strongly about Eli's abilities at this point in his career. I think just about all of us would hope that they run the table and Eli goes out a champ, but we believe the likelihood of that happening is almost 0%. Should we just stick our heads in the sand and ignore what we've seen for the past 3 years because fans like yourself want to lie to yourselves and pretend like he can still win something?
Exactly Keith. We are fans of the NY Giants, not the NY Elis. I want this team to win superbowls, not cling to the past. Eli was a great player in his prime, and he was worth every cent. Now he is holding us back from becoming a better team. I would have loved to see him go out on top. But if the last three years isn't enough evidence that he needs to go than I dont know what to tell you people.
Yes, after that, the Giants running game fell apart, but that's an eight year stretch where the running game was great for all but two years, and was still above average in one of those two. Now, let's look at Simms. I'll even leave off 1979-80 even though those years undercut your argument, and of course Brunner was the starter in 82-83 and Hostetler for all but 8 games in 1991-92 so those are out too.
The one year that Simms won the Super Bowl he had a 2,245 yard rushing game.
Eli's Giants had 2,148 in the season of his first win. He won his second with the worst rushing attack in the league (1,427). When did Simms ever do that?
So Eli did better in the absence of a running game than Simms ever did. And he never had the all time great defense Simms had, captained by the greatest defensive player of all time.
after the NY Giants win a game, YOU started a thread mocking.
And you still call yourself a fan of the NY Giants?
Go fuck yourself.
Yes, a meaningless win in another lost season. But please go on with your schtick of doing nothing but bullying anyone who disagrees with you. I try real hard to ignore you, but you are an insufferable douche bag. How you have not been banned is beyond me. Everyone is a moron in your eyes. Get the fuck over yourself.
Yes, after that, the Giants running game fell apart, but that's an eight year stretch where the running game was great for all but two years, and was still above average in one of those two. Now, let's look at Simms. I'll even leave off 1979-80 even though those years undercut your argument, and of course Brunner was the starter in 82-83 and Hostetler for all but 8 games in 1991-92 so those are out too.
The one year that Simms won the Super Bowl he had a 2,245 yard rushing game.
Eli's Giants had 2,148 in the season of his first win. He won his second with the worst rushing attack in the league (1,427). When did Simms ever do that?
So Eli did better in the absence of a running game than Simms ever did. And he never had the all time great defense Simms had, captained by the greatest defensive player of all time.
after the NY Giants win a game, YOU started a thread mocking.
And you still call yourself a fan of the NY Giants?
Go fuck yourself.
Yes, a meaningless win in another lost season. But please go on with your schtick of doing nothing but bullying anyone who disagrees with you. I try real hard to ignore you, but you are an insufferable douche bag. How you have not been banned is beyond me. Everyone is a moron in your eyes. Get the fuck over yourself.
I find it very interesting that you are telling someone to get over themselves.
LOL! That is a weak way to justify actively rooting against the team and one of our most beloved legacy players. There are some fans who want our team to WIN no matter what the record is. And in a way, perhaps youre right to a certain extent. The NY Elis is a flippant way of acknowledging that Eli is the heart of the franchise. With everything Eli has given us over the years, some of us will not abandon him at the end. That is just tacky as fk.
comparing qbs 25 years apart is silly, but I don't think anyone can take a look at the guys around Simms and not shake their head. He had a shit run game(go look up the rankings) save for 3 years and arguably the worst era of receivers in giants history. I remember being so stoked for Chris Calloway because we didn't have a receiver of his caliber my whole life. That's how bad they were. Somehow the line is fondly remembered here despite a very poor rushing attack and giving up a ton of sacks.
Anyhow, Eli had an efficient game and the line at least protected well most of the game. I feel like we stole that game from them, but it's nice to have a win
RE: RE: The NFC of the 1980s >>>>>>> the NFC of the 2000s
Some things are better some things aren't as good.
c'mon ...Greg isn't going out on a limb here. The giants had to contend with the dynasties of the skins and niners not to mention a very good Bears team. Perennial powerhouses like them don't exist anymore
Eli played well. It was nice to see. I'm happy for him.
That's really all that needs to be said, even if you're ready to move on from the guy.
I agree with both statements. From a purely "Best interests of the franchise" a loss was probably better in that spot. I was happy for the win though. I don't care about the draft position. It was good to see Eli smile after a win. It felt better, I am glad I watched even though I intended not to. I hope Tampa turns it over as just as much.
RE: RE: RE: The NFC of the 1980s >>>>>>> the NFC of the 2000s
Some things are better some things aren't as good.
c'mon ...Greg isn't going out on a limb here. The giants had to contend with the dynasties of the skins and niners not to mention a very good Bears team. Perennial powerhouses like them don't exist anymore
I think contrary to the popular opinion shared among you and your constituents, I think there is a very good chance Eli is not only on the roster next year, but is the starter week 1.
Won't be surprised either way. But I know you will be.
That's one thing I can agree with you on. I think there is a pretty good chance Eli is the starter here week 1 next year. Much higher than people realize.
2005: Two NFC East teams in the playoffs
2006: Three NFC East teams in the playoffs
2007: Three NFC East teams in the playoffs
2008: Two NFC East teams in the playoffs
2009: Two NFC East teams in the playoffs
It kind of puts the reality of the situation under the microscope even more. Two of the three worst teams in the entire league (along with the Raiders) played last night. Eli played well, and the game still went down to the last seconds to win said game. The other team was also starting their 3rd string QB.
This is a bad, bad team.
RE: you wanna beat that drum, Britt, don't let me stop you
Now we are down to arguing over which Giants Super Bowl teams had the tougher road.
I normally don't agree with Britt's take, but I agree with him, why put down the 2007/2011 runs to say the Giants teams from the 80's was a harder trek?
It's like people just want to argue for arguments sake.
I bully anyone who disagrees with me?? More like I point out rampant stupidity:
Quote:
Yes, a meaningless win in another lost season. But please go on with your schtick of doing nothing but bullying anyone who disagrees with you. I try real hard to ignore you, but you are an insufferable douche bag. How you have not been banned is beyond me. Everyone is a moron in your eyes. Get the fuck over yourself.
Minutes after the Giants won last night, the team you supposedly root for, you started a thread mocking Eli. And then spent the next few hours defending the fact that Eli played just alright to squeak by.
My schtick of calling you a fucking moron isn't because I disagree with you. It is because you truly appear to b e a fucking moron in what you post.
Distinguish between the two, asswipe.
When we were kids, and would throw the football around....
playing backyard football or just throwing it and pretending to tap our feet inbounds at the curb and emulate our favorite players, if I was throwing it I was Phil Simms. If I was catching it, I was Stephen Baker, or Bavaro.
Now, my 7 year old pretends to be Eli when he throws. We watch the games together, he wears his Eli jersey.
He'll never know Simms, just like I never knew Tittle or Connerly.
You should learn to appreciate good players while they're playing.
I think contrary to the popular opinion shared among you and your constituents, I think there is a very good chance Eli is not only on the roster next year, but is the starter week 1.
Won't be surprised either way. But I know you will be.
That's one thing I can agree with you on. I think there is a pretty good chance Eli is the starter here week 1 next year. Much higher than people realize.
The Giants being loyal to an incumbent, deteriorating character from the Super Bowls era shouldn't surprise any Giants fan.
That decision ending in anything other than another last place finish and Manning get his teeth kicked in weekly would be the surprise.
I bully anyone who disagrees with me?? More like I point out rampant stupidity:
Quote:
Yes, a meaningless win in another lost season. But please go on with your schtick of doing nothing but bullying anyone who disagrees with you. I try real hard to ignore you, but you are an insufferable douche bag. How you have not been banned is beyond me. Everyone is a moron in your eyes. Get the fuck over yourself.
Minutes after the Giants won last night, the team you supposedly root for, you started a thread mocking Eli. And then spent the next few hours defending the fact that Eli played just alright to squeak by.
My schtick of calling you a fucking moron isn't because I disagree with you. It is because you truly appear to b e a fucking moron in what you post.
Distinguish between the two, asswipe.
You are right, my thread was out of line and that is why I deleted it shortly thereafter. That doesn't mean I am a moron or a bad fan. You dont know anything about my intelligence or fandom. I do apologize for calling you a douche bag, I dont want to be that guy. I just wish you would show some decency and stop constantly ridiculing people.
But they really accelerated in 2005 when Bill Polian cried his way to doing everything possible to prevent defense from being played. IOW, for basically all of Eli Manning's career.
I just wish you would show some decency and stop constantly ridiculing people.
The irony is I basically ridicule posters who actually don't show decency and crap all over the players they supposedly are rooting for. Ridiculing them.
I have no motivation to have decency to morons who have little respect for an organization they supposedly spend much of their time following.
And I don't constantly ridicule people. Just moronic ones.
Now if it comes down to whether or not I'm going to ridicule Eli or you - you're going to win every fucking time.
People keep diminishing the win because of their record. Have you watched or kept track of the 49ers this year? The 49er's have battled in every game this year and a lot of good teams barely beat them. It took Rogers a big come back to do it.
I also keep hearing the fact that it was against Mullins. Isn't that a reason to be pissed at the D and not Eli?
I just wish you would show some decency and stop constantly ridiculing people.
The irony is I basically ridicule posters who actually don't show decency and crap all over the players they supposedly are rooting for. Ridiculing them.
I have no motivation to have decency to morons who have little respect for an organization they supposedly spend much of their time following.
And I don't constantly ridicule people. Just moronic ones.
Now if it comes down to whether or not I'm going to ridicule Eli or you - you're going to win every fucking time.
Behind this idea is that you get to decide what the appropriate level of respect for the organization is. That's a ridiculous notion. When you factor that in with an extended period of incompetence and blinkered thinking on the part of the organization, the idea of needing to defend them against much poorly articulated but justified frustration becomes that much more silly.
I just wish you would show some decency and stop constantly ridiculing people.
The irony is I basically ridicule posters who actually don't show decency and crap all over the players they supposedly are rooting for. Ridiculing them.
I have no motivation to have decency to morons who have little respect for an organization they supposedly spend much of their time following.
And I don't constantly ridicule people. Just moronic ones.
Now if it comes down to whether or not I'm going to ridicule Eli or you - you're going to win every fucking time.
Haha ok Fats...good for you. I dont know why I expected a reasonable response. Please continue to suck in your gut and be the internet tough guy. I also take back my apology. You are a miserable douche bag. I should just heap praise at the players in this organization that have won 5 games in the last two years just to appease your ego.
RE: When we were kids, and would throw the football around....
playing backyard football or just throwing it and pretending to tap our feet inbounds at the curb and emulate our favorite players, if I was throwing it I was Phil Simms. If I was catching it, I was Stephen Baker, or Bavaro.
Now, my 7 year old pretends to be Eli when he throws. We watch the games together, he wears his Eli jersey.
He'll never know Simms, just like I never knew Tittle or Connerly.
You should learn to appreciate good players while they're playing.
This post made me think of my first year playing Pee-Wee football. I won the QB competition for first string. We didn't get our uniforms until nearly the first week so we didn't know our numbers. It was 1989 and I loved Phil Simms and I wanted #11 so bad. The coach came to me and told me there was only one option for me and it was #16. I nearly broke down in tears having to wear Montana's number while I was QB. It was sacrilegious to me. Ha ha. I almost forgot that memory but for some reason your post brought it back to me.
I just wish you would show some decency and stop constantly ridiculing people.
The irony is I basically ridicule posters who actually don't show decency and crap all over the players they supposedly are rooting for. Ridiculing them.
I have no motivation to have decency to morons who have little respect for an organization they supposedly spend much of their time following.
And I don't constantly ridicule people. Just moronic ones.
Now if it comes down to whether or not I'm going to ridicule Eli or you - you're going to win every fucking time.
Behind this idea is that you get to decide what the appropriate level of respect for the organization is. That's a ridiculous notion. When you factor that in with an extended period of incompetence and blinkered thinking on the part of the organization, the idea of needing to defend them against much poorly articulated but justified frustration becomes that much more silly.
I don't think he rails against criticism or frustration. HE rails against what has become pretty much a fanatical, near religious, prejudice.
I just wish you would show some decency and stop constantly ridiculing people.
The irony is I basically ridicule posters who actually don't show decency and crap all over the players they supposedly are rooting for. Ridiculing them.
I have no motivation to have decency to morons who have little respect for an organization they supposedly spend much of their time following.
And I don't constantly ridicule people. Just moronic ones.
Now if it comes down to whether or not I'm going to ridicule Eli or you - you're going to win every fucking time.
Behind this idea is that you get to decide what the appropriate level of respect for the organization is. That's a ridiculous notion. When you factor that in with an extended period of incompetence and blinkered thinking on the part of the organization, the idea of needing to defend them against much poorly articulated but justified frustration becomes that much more silly.
I don't think he rails against criticism or frustration. HE rails against what has become pretty much a fanatical, near religious, prejudice.
That's an opinion that issues from a different baseline assessment of how badly the organization has fucked up and what your tolerance for incompetence is/what you think incompetence is.
I don't think it's necessary to have that discussion because it's tired and we both have better things to do. I'm just noting that the "reasonable police" on the board, which is the role FMiC largely casts himself in whether he says so or not, are just as narrow-minded as the people they criticize.
I think contrary to the popular opinion shared among you and your constituents, I think there is a very good chance Eli is not only on the roster next year, but is the starter week 1.
Won't be surprised either way. But I know you will be.
That's one thing I can agree with you on. I think there is a pretty good chance Eli is the starter here week 1 next year. Much higher than people realize.
the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result
I think contrary to the popular opinion shared among you and your constituents, I think there is a very good chance Eli is not only on the roster next year, but is the starter week 1.
Won't be surprised either way. But I know you will be.
That's one thing I can agree with you on. I think there is a pretty good chance Eli is the starter here week 1 next year. Much higher than people realize.
the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result
You know it.
We keep reading your posts.
RE: RE: RE: The NFC of the 1980s >>>>>>> the NFC of the 2000s
Some things are better some things aren't as good.
c'mon ...Greg isn't going out on a limb here. The giants had to contend with the dynasties of the skins and niners not to mention a very good Bears team. Perennial powerhouses like them don't exist anymore
No, those pre-salary cap teams were awesome. But, there wasn't a lot of balance in the NFL back then. Teams were either great or they sucked. It's hard to say which era is tougher to win in. There's more balance now, but the best teams today are not as good as the best teams back in the 80s.
Tough to compare eras for many reasons.
I liked the brand of football from that era a lot more than the football from this era, but I understand the rule changes were made for the long term health of the players and of the game.
I think contrary to the popular opinion shared among you and your constituents, I think there is a very good chance Eli is not only on the roster next year, but is the starter week 1.
Won't be surprised either way. But I know you will be.
That's one thing I can agree with you on. I think there is a pretty good chance Eli is the starter here week 1 next year. Much higher than people realize.
the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result
You know it.
We keep reading your posts.
This is exactly what I am talking about. If you disagree with Les, fine but the constant name calling and shitting on other posters is destroying the integrity of this site. I have been saying this since last year when myself, googs, hassan etc. were getting crushed on here for wanting to move on from Manning. It is absolutely ridiculous.
This is exactly what I am talking about. If you disagree with Les, fine but the constant name calling and shitting on other posters is destroying the integrity of this site. I have been saying this since last year when myself, googs, hassan etc. were getting crushed on here for wanting to move on from Manning. It is absolutely ridiculous.
Oh boo friggity hoo. I dont hear you sticking up for the people who get continually attacked for sticking up for Eli..... I guess you approve when Les calls people fanboys, Cult of Eli, or Eli-lovers.
I think Britt and I have been called more names than anyone else on this site combined.... funny you dont say anything then, right?
This is exactly what I am talking about. If you disagree with Les, fine but the constant name calling and shitting on other posters is destroying the integrity of this site. I have been saying this since last year when myself, googs, hassan etc. were getting crushed on here for wanting to move on from Manning. It is absolutely ridiculous.
Oh boo friggity hoo. I dont hear you sticking up for the people who get continually attacked for sticking up for Eli..... I guess you approve when Les calls people fanboys, Cult of Eli, or Eli-lovers.
I think Britt and I have been called more names than anyone else on this site combined.... funny you dont say anything then, right?
That's such horseshit. I completely disagree with your views on Eli, but I have never once attacked your character. I even said to Britt in this thread that I think he is a valuable poster. But I sure as shit have seen you personally attack Les and other posters that dont praise Eli.
That's such horseshit. I completely disagree with your views on Eli, but I have never once attacked your character. I even said to Britt in this thread that I think he is a valuable poster. But I sure as shit have seen you personally attack Les and other posters that dont praise Eli.
1. Relax. I wasnt accusing you. I was stating BBI as a whole.
2. You never saw Les attack people by calling them fanboys or use the phrase cult of Eli? That tells me you never read a Les post before in your life.
You cant play the pity card because people here are attacking you when you dont say anything about others attacking people with the opposite viewpoint.
And you're right... people have NEVER attacked me for my views on Eli. You sure you want to go down that road?
This is exactly what I am talking about. If you disagree with Les, fine but the constant name calling and shitting on other posters is destroying the integrity of this site. I have been saying this since last year when myself, googs, hassan etc. were getting crushed on here for wanting to move on from Manning. It is absolutely ridiculous.
Oh boo friggity hoo. I dont hear you sticking up for the people who get continually attacked for sticking up for Eli..... I guess you approve when Les calls people fanboys, Cult of Eli, or Eli-lovers.
I think Britt and I have been called more names than anyone else on this site combined.... funny you don't say anything then, right?
The name calling is equal on both sides. The Giants suck and we are pissed. END OF STORY.
I think contrary to the popular opinion shared among you and your constituents, I think there is a very good chance Eli is not only on the roster next year, but is the starter week 1.
Won't be surprised either way. But I know you will be.
That's one thing I can agree with you on. I think there is a pretty good chance Eli is the starter here week 1 next year. Much higher than people realize.
the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result
Les - JonC mentioned this a few months ago as something sort of swirling in the halls of Jints Central. The more of these decent games that Eli plays the more this will have substance. The spell that Eli has on this organization is now in the preposterous zone..
Both are now tarring and feathering each other. Not very healthy or good behavior.
there is no need to bitch about him after a win. there is no need also to gloat excessively about any small acheivement of his.
Just petty and small minded at this point both ways.
NYG07, get over it, its not always about being right. Don't get me wrong, Im no big fan of several of the folks that defend Eli excessively but you are going down a bad rabbit hole.
FMIC, I really think you have been a very strong poster since the inception of the site (and while I havent met you from my inferrence you are 'good people') but you need to really just cut out some of the tone too, I really dont see why people venting has become so problematic for you or the zest with which you are attacking others and defending NYG.
I was blasted last night and for the second week in a row, I mistakenly called him a Dupe. The man has owned me 2 weeks straight now and my humbled ass apologizes
RE: Pathetic comments from the owner of this site and mook
nostalgia in the giants universe. I guess I am happy today bc I remember the team where 50 years ago Saturday I spent my last time in the locker room and it was also a Giants victory (7-6 btw). There is much sacrificed by players (I cleaned up my fair share of bloody socks, towels etc.) and usually a great deal of pride. While I am well aware the game has changed greatly, I still remember the feeling of victory and the great physical punishment the players endured..
If we lost, you'd probably shit on Eli for leaving too much time on the clock.
We won, so Eli still has to get shit on.
It is unbelievable.
We convert the majority of our 3rd downs, but Eli still was making terrible decisions. OK.
LOL
The best is the guy claiming we check downed too much
I think the best is crafting a narrative out of an incorrect statement and treating it as fact. That's your favorite, isn't it MG? Now you get to do it yourself!
has sort of evolved into this ombudsman for BBI and Jints Central. It's fascinating, and he seems to really embrace the role...
These Eli topics are great and a classic example. The Eli Army gets insulted so they send their "bat signal" to FMiC. He then swoops in and verbally pulverizes the the violator(s).
I was blasted last night and for the second week in a row, I mistakenly called him a Dupe. The man has owned me 2 weeks straight now and my humbled ass apologizes
Lol that is cute Montana. I dont even hate you as a poster. I hope that sarcastic post made you feel better about yourself.
What a 4th rd draft pick has and just come out and admit that you're both miserable because we won a game and have put at risk the #1 pick in a draft that has any really exciting QB prospects?
Stop trying to sugarcoat that miserable of a view that we need to tank with 7 games left.
Or... OR... people realize that with an aging QB who is clearly in decline and just seven weeks away from his 38th birthday, it's prudent to look to the future. I know that concept might be lost on you if you think that's a "weak argument." It's actually the only certainty in the whole debate - Eli is old and getting older. Unless you prefer a protracted tank period over several years, or favor giving up a ton of draft capital in a future year, you should absolutely be hoping to find Eli's successor in a year when we suck out loud anyway.
That's not meant to hurt your feelings or offend your mancrush.
NYG07, get over it, its not always about being right. Don't get me wrong, Im no big fan of several of the folks that defend Eli excessively but you are going down a bad rabbit hole.
You are right. Thanks for being the voice of reason. I am just tired of the personal attacks. We all have a right to our own opinions. Yet I constantly see posters getting ganged up on. I have even seen Eric get attacked recently. Just completely out of line.
there is obviously some small irony that people so off in their assessment last year are doubling down and are constantly nasty about it. Any shred of evidence in their position becomes a proof point.
But the name calling is going both ways. This is beyond ridiculous at this point.
I think everybody could stand a little self awareness.....
of how they post, and how it comes across to others.
Like the thread you started after the Eagles game last season?
Well I did say "everyone" didn't I?
It's funny you mention that thread, as that thread in particular was the one where I said it proved he could still play at a high level about a month before Gettleman cited that exact game as one where it appeared Manning could still play.
saying what you believe will happen based on the evidence, and then there's saying what you think should happen.
And they are two very different things.
I read the tea leaves and told you what I thought the organization would do based on what I saw. Truthfully, there was little emotion to it other than hoping that if they went that way it was successful.
Then there is saying what you think should happen, regardless of what all the signs are telling you.
Davis Webb WILL start the rest of the season.
The Giants WILL take a QB at 2.
The Giants WILL cut Eli/trade/take paycut this offseason.
It's just not exactly logical. It's happening again this year.
"Eli WILL be cut this offseason". This WILL be Eli's last game as a Giant." "Lauletta WILL start after the bye."
You sure?
RE: RE: RE: I think everybody could stand a little self awareness.....
It's funny you mention that thread, as that thread in particular was the one where I said it proved he could still play at a high level about a month before Gettleman cited that exact game as one where it appeared Manning could still play.
You do realize that sentence is a target rich environmental for a lot of jokes...right?
and Diehl and O' Hara will never dismiss Eli as loyal teammates. Banks and Papa have absolutely pinned some blame on him after games. They actually as announcers of the Giants cannot publicly take any stance on him otherwise bigger than that. So not sure why you would consider any of these opinions impartial.
Its not worth getting into. I sincerely hope Eli goes on a tear and wins out this season. I have no harbored agenda against him, and I hope he has more left than what it seems, but with protection he continued to struggle to move the ball last night and was ok but hardly stellar. Not a confidence inspiring game.
saying what you believe will happen based on the evidence, and then there's saying what you think should happen.
And they are two very different things.
I read the tea leaves and told you what I thought the organization would do based on what I saw. Truthfully, there was little emotion to it other than hoping that if they went that way it was successful.
Then there is saying what you think should happen, regardless of what all the signs are telling you.
Davis Webb WILL start the rest of the season.
The Giants WILL take a QB at 2.
The Giants WILL cut Eli/trade/take paycut this offseason.
It's just not exactly logical. It's happening again this year.
"Eli WILL be cut this offseason". This WILL be Eli's last game as a Giant." "Lauletta WILL start after the bye."
You sure?
Are you done Britt? We've seen the pattern before. Eli played pretty well this week (and that's fine--Eli's my favorite Giant of all time) and this might license a certain level of self satisfaction on your part.
He has, for the most part, been below average for a long time now. If sample size has any significance, then over the next few weeks he will very likely return to being below average. Should that happen you'll take the opposite tack and claim those critiquing Eli are gloating. Either way, you get to have the high ground.
Cutting Eli has much less of a cap impact than the previous one to the tune of 11million in dead money. So as we trend to a 4 win season the economics are much more favourable to cut him and use that money to shore up other areas.
The comment about self-awareness that is made above is very appropriate:
Quote:
FMiC...
bw in dc : 2:06 pm : link : reply
has sort of evolved into this ombudsman for BBI and Jints Central. It's fascinating, and he seems to really embrace the role...
These Eli topics are great and a classic example. The Eli Army gets insulted so they send their "bat signal" to FMiC. He then swoops in and verbally pulverizes the the violator(s).
I must say I find it great theater... ;)
I don't really embrace anything nor feel like an obudsman. If I find something particularly moronic or insulting I call it out. No need for a bat signal.
Here's the thing I look at - we have a QB who helped deliver 2 SB's to us. He shouldn't be immune from criticism, but he certainly should be immune from personal attacks.
Just like the organization that has delivered a SB in every decade since 1980 began should be immune from the ridiculous characterization that it is a bumbling one with a derisive moniker like "Jints Central".
to me, it is telling what type of fan will say these types of things.
I'm pretty self aware on this board. I call out what I perceive to be moronic statements, and try to keep the ones I utter to a minimum. Generally I'm not an asshole off the board and I'm not an asshole to the vast majority of posters who aren't ignorant, but my take has stayed pretty consistent throughout my time here.
I have little respect for people who shit on the very people they are supposedly wishing well of. I would not call myself an Eli apologist, but I will not denigrate any player who delivers entertainment. That's why I have conflicts here - because there are a lot of schmucks who don't really care what they say about people playing for or running the organization. They feel entitled to spew nonsense.
They are neither entitled to do so nor is it acceptable.
The comment about self-awareness that is made above is very appropriate:
Quote:
FMiC...
bw in dc : 2:06 pm : link : reply
has sort of evolved into this ombudsman for BBI and Jints Central. It's fascinating, and he seems to really embrace the role...
These Eli topics are great and a classic example. The Eli Army gets insulted so they send their "bat signal" to FMiC. He then swoops in and verbally pulverizes the the violator(s).
I must say I find it great theater... ;)
I don't really embrace anything nor feel like an obudsman. If I find something particularly moronic or insulting I call it out. No need for a bat signal.
Here's the thing I look at - we have a QB who helped deliver 2 SB's to us. He shouldn't be immune from criticism, but he certainly should be immune from personal attacks.
Just like the organization that has delivered a SB in every decade since 1980 began should be immune from the ridiculous characterization that it is a bumbling one with a derisive moniker like "Jints Central".
to me, it is telling what type of fan will say these types of things.
I'm pretty self aware on this board. I call out what I perceive to be moronic statements, and try to keep the ones I utter to a minimum. Generally I'm not an asshole off the board and I'm not an asshole to the vast majority of posters who aren't ignorant, but my take has stayed pretty consistent throughout my time here.
I have little respect for people who shit on the very people they are supposedly wishing well of. I would not call myself an Eli apologist, but I will not denigrate any player who delivers entertainment. That's why I have conflicts here - because there are a lot of schmucks who don't really care what they say about people playing for or running the organization. They feel entitled to spew nonsense.
They are neither entitled to do so nor is it acceptable.
None of this addresses the underlying critique: i.e. your feeling that you have some special access to what is appropriate or not about the sort of criticism an organization deserves.
When fan opinion is this polarized, it suggests that you're not arguing from a consensus on norms.
And then there's *none* of the QBs in the draft *WILL* be
of how they post, and how it comes across to others.
Like the thread you started after the Eagles game last season?
Well I did say "everyone" didn't I?
It's funny you mention that thread, as that thread in particular was the one where I said it proved he could still play at a high level about a month before Gettleman cited that exact game as one where it appeared Manning could still play.
At least you were wrong for free. Gettleman got paid to be completely off the mark. It's looking more and more like the supposed film junkie only watched film of one game before his grand QB declaration.
None of this addresses the underlying critique: i.e. your feeling that you have some special access to what is appropriate or not about the sort of criticism an organization deserves.
When fan opinion is this polarized, it suggests that you're not arguing from a consensus on norms.
The underlying critique isn't based on what level of critique an organization deserves, it is based on how it is presented.
I'll give an example - JonC has been critical many times of the team. But he states it in terms that are reasonable and measured. Do I rip into him? If Sy points out a negative, am I ripping him?
When people come on after a win and act like Eli Manning somehow shat in their non-chocolate up until then Wheaties, do I rip into them - of course.
There's a way to criticize the players and organization for a team that you supposedly root for reasonably and there's a way to do it not reasonably. If you find me ripping the former, by all means - I'm open for criticism.
RE: And then there's *none* of the QBs in the draft *WILL* be
If you can find a post where I definitively said that none of the quarterbacks in the draft would be good and go ahead and post it. otherwise shut up and stop attributing things to me that I never said. You do this often. You also are never able to find quotes back it up.
Ruh-roh,
Dave in Hoboken : 4:59 pm : link : reply
Mr. forever angry is coming at me now.
Scary stuff. I'm petrified.
So because I think you are a moron, I'm "Mr. forever angry", but you can spend most of your posts tearing apart Eli and the organization and you aren't??
It is much more logical to think you are a fuckstick than to think Eli is.
A lot of the venom on this site comes from people being made sick
of really bad takes. You can take a valid idea, but then wrap it in dogcrap language. People are going to come down on you for that. The truly unreasonable people aren't very numerous. There are some that just genuinely aren't great at conveying messages. "Eli's really not playing well" becomes "Eli's playing like shit, fuck this guy", and then here come the angry bees.
Ruh-roh,
Dave in Hoboken : 4:59 pm : link : reply
Mr. forever angry is coming at me now.
Scary stuff. I'm petrified.
So because I think you are a moron, I'm "Mr. forever angry", but you can spend most of your posts tearing apart Eli and the organization and you aren't??
It is much more logical to think you are a fuckstick than to think Eli is.
Not at all. You're forever angry because 99% of your posts are you coming off like a completely unhinged, certifiable, mental patient.
And what you call 'tearing apart' is what most people call honesty. I said Eli played well last night. Didn't bash him, or any of the other players, either for last night's performance. Not sure what else one can expect after beating a 2-7 team with a 3rd string QB playing for them. A win is a win, and we won. No bashing from me today.
RE: RE: I really need to apologize once again to NYG07
I was blasted last night and for the second week in a row, I mistakenly called him a Dupe. The man has owned me 2 weeks straight now and my humbled ass apologizes
Lol that is cute Montana. I dont even hate you as a poster. I hope that sarcastic post made you feel better about yourself.
Dude, I was being 100% serious. I was an idiot for calling you that once again and was apologizing for it
Being on tne avant garde to defend a man you don't know on a message board he doesn't read, invites a little ribbing.
It's not disrespect, it's not degration -- it's criticism of his play and his mistakes among fans.
If the critique is poorly formed or inaccurate, go for it. But creating a value proposition of someone's "fandom" and "respect" for Eli -- that's funny.
I miss Randy. He'd kicked that stuff right in the butt.
RE: A lot of the venom on this site comes from people being made sick
of really bad takes. You can take a valid idea, but then wrap it in dogcrap language. People are going to come down on you for that. The truly unreasonable people aren't very numerous. There are some that just genuinely aren't great at conveying messages. "Eli's really not playing well" becomes "Eli's playing like shit, fuck this guy", and then here come the angry bees.
That's what I see, the hyperbole drives a lot of the other responses.
This is exactly what I am talking about. If you disagree with Les, fine but the constant name calling and shitting on other posters is destroying the integrity of this site. I have been saying this since last year when myself, googs, hassan etc. were getting crushed on here for wanting to move on from Manning. It is absolutely ridiculous.
I am not sure I recall getting "crushed" NYG07 or anything close to that quite frankly. Some of us gave some tough love opinions and should realize those will often beget strong reactions as fair game. The Eli-debates have actually seemed fairly straightforward to me as I think too many on the site struggle to separate their fandom from their objectivity. The berating of posters with anything more than a sarcastic jab really just lets you know how entrenched some take their agendas.
But putting aside some of the hitler-youth posters that reside on BBI to attack in their own ways, I typically find the majority of debates and even heated-arguments topical if not fully entertaining.
Next May I will absolutely think back as to how valueless it was to win last night. But then again, it was sure nice to win again last night...
i remember having debates but i think in general i did not really get crushed. As Jimmy said. Some here do because of the tone but Im not one to post like that.
There are some snide old grumps who cant be civil with anyone at all but those are hardly very bothersome.
Eli shut up no one tonight. He's a bad football player and if you think any differently based on tonight than you need to find a new sport to watch because you have no clue what you're watching.
seriously. I get it. Its nice to see a win.
But lord we barely beat a bad team with there 3rd string QB and if it wasn't for a bogus PI call on the 49ers on 2nd and 20 we probably lose....
but yes, lets throw a party
Eli shut up no one tonight. He's a bad football player and if you think any differently based on tonight than you need to find a new sport to watch because you have no clue what you're watching.
He has a few bad throws, but he had some really nice ones too. The fact is that he drove his team downfield for a game-winning touchdown in the final minute.
Eli shut up no one tonight. He's a bad football player and if you think any differently based on tonight than you need to find a new sport to watch because you have no clue what you're watching.
You are insufferable.
Eli shut up no one tonight. He's a bad football player and if you think any differently based on tonight than you need to find a new sport to watch because you have no clue what you're watching.
Disappointed in you Mook.
I'm happy for him personally that he got to drive the team to a win, but unfortunately I think the Giants just lost out on the #1 pick and their potential long-term QB answer.
Unless Oakland can somehow put together a couple of wins....which I don't see anytime soon.
Get on the bus. Theres room.
He missed one throw, he sucked!!!
And OBJ dropped an easy slant that he might have taken to the house. And fell down on an easy TD. As usual, it goes both ways.
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not go overboard. He had some horrible throws in this game, including a horrific throw on what should have been a TD.
seriously. I get it. Its nice to see a win.
But lord we barely beat a bad team with there 3rd string QB and if it wasn't for a bogus PI call on the 49ers on 2nd and 20 we probably lose....
but yes, lets throw a party
We were going to get the ball into the end zone no matter what on that drive.
With the extra week of rest and a poor opponent, Eli did what he had to, led the team to a win, and bought himself a week of good will.
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RUN THE TABLE BABY!!!!!!!!
Get on the bus. Theres room.
My man.
I think he kinda proved both sides of this debate right tonight. At times showed he cant make all the plays he used to make, but also showed he can make enough big time plays to win.
We all know hes done soon, but its nice seeing him pull one out and smile after.
Yes, the penalty exchange ended up in our favor and helped the last drive. But Eli also showed he can still get it done when the blocking is there.
He missed one throw, he sucked!!!
188 yards is a good performance in 1962
Sounds like someone here needs to find something else to watch.
I'm happy for him personally that he got to drive the team to a win, but unfortunately I think the Giants just lost out on the #1 pick and their potential long-term QB answer.
Unless Oakland can somehow put together a couple of wins....which I don't see anytime soon.
Nah... there's no franchise qb in this draft so number 1 isn't a big deal this year
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its sad this place even when we win.
He missed one throw, he sucked!!!
188 yards is a good performance in 1962
lol.
I assume you mean the underthrown ball to OBJ. Watched it again. Nose tackle collapsed the pocket. That throw was all arm. Couldnt step into it.
Eli was good tonight. He would be good with decent blocking. But, that doesnt fit the narrative of the media or many on this website.
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In comment 14174996 colin said:
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RUN THE TABLE BABY!!!!!!!!
Get on the bus. Theres room.
My man.
Thats one. Lets get it. 7 to go.
Didn't Eli convert like 7 of 9, or 8 of 10 3rd downs tonight?
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its sad this place even when we win.
He missed one throw, he sucked!!!
188 yards is a good performance in 1962
Ill take 188 and 3 TDs (should have been a 4th if OBJ didnt slip) and no INTs over what has been his customary 285 yards/no TDs bc we cant score in the red zone game as of late
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but his biggest issue was not the bad throws but his check-down throws when he's not under pressure, which happened multiple times on 3rd down. Those are killers.
Didn't Eli convert like 7 of 9, or 8 of 10 3rd downs tonight?
Was what I said wrong? Did he not repeatedly check down when he wasn't under pressure? And at least twice on 3rd down?
Watch it again his plant foot slipped on that shitty turf
Another genius on this board who has no idea what he's watching...
Loving the C-man
Eli shut up no one tonight. He's a bad football player and if you think any differently based on tonight than you need to find a new sport to watch because you have no clue what you're watching.
That pass interference was the type of call that's been going against the Giants. It does not detract from the win or Eli's winning drive.
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but his biggest issue was not the bad throws but his check-down throws when he's not under pressure, which happened multiple times on 3rd down. Those are killers.
Didn't Eli convert like 7 of 9, or 8 of 10 3rd downs tonight?
And we were 5-12 on 3rd down...but when it comes to Eli you've never let reality or facts effect your analysis anyway.
If we lost, you'd probably shit on Eli for leaving too much time on the clock.
We won, so Eli still has to get shit on.
It is unbelievable.
We convert the majority of our 3rd downs, but Eli still was making terrible decisions. OK.
LOL
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In comment 14175153 Tesla said:
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but his biggest issue was not the bad throws but his check-down throws when he's not under pressure, which happened multiple times on 3rd down. Those are killers.
Didn't Eli convert like 7 of 9, or 8 of 10 3rd downs tonight?
And we were 5-12 on 3rd down...but when it comes to Eli you've never let reality or facts effect your analysis anyway.
I asked a question, asshole. I thought they said something like that on the last drive.
That pass interference was the type of call that's been going against the Giants. It does not detract from the win or Eli's winning drive.
Agreed. That call has gone against us many times the past couple years. I'll take it
If we lost, you'd probably shit on Eli for leaving too much time on the clock.
We won, so Eli still has to get shit on.
It is unbelievable.
We convert the majority of our 3rd downs, but Eli still was making terrible decisions. OK.
LOL
5-12 is a majority? OK.
But keep calling other posters idiots.
If we lost, you'd probably shit on Eli for leaving too much time on the clock.
We won, so Eli still has to get shit on.
It is unbelievable.
We convert the majority of our 3rd downs, but Eli still was making terrible decisions. OK.
LOL
The best is the guy claiming we check downed too much
If we lost, you'd probably shit on Eli for leaving too much time on the clock.
We won, so Eli still has to get shit on.
It is unbelievable.
We convert the majority of our 3rd downs, but Eli still was making terrible decisions. OK.
LOL
If we lost, that Beckham miss deep would have been talked about ad nauseam all week.
Mook's really en fuego.
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In comment 14175153 Tesla said:
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but his biggest issue was not the bad throws but his check-down throws when he's not under pressure, which happened multiple times on 3rd down. Those are killers.
Didn't Eli convert like 7 of 9, or 8 of 10 3rd downs tonight?
Was what I said wrong? Did he not repeatedly check down when he wasn't under pressure? And at least twice on 3rd down?
So the criticism is that he checked down...into a first down? Weird.
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you guys are great.
If we lost, you'd probably shit on Eli for leaving too much time on the clock.
We won, so Eli still has to get shit on.
It is unbelievable.
We convert the majority of our 3rd downs, but Eli still was making terrible decisions. OK.
LOL
If we lost, that Beckham miss deep would have been talked about ad nauseam all week.
Yea well anyone watching could counter with Odell falling down on the sure TD early in the third.
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In comment 14175048 dep026 said:
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its sad this place even when we win.
He missed one throw, he sucked!!!
188 yards is a good performance in 1962
Ill take 188 and 3 TDs (should have been a 4th if OBJ didnt slip) and no INTs over what has been his customary 285 yards/no TDs bc we cant score in the red zone game as of late
Except how many teams does this performance beat?
Bad football players can once in a while have a good game.
I love Eli and I'll forever appreciate the 2 super bowls, but he is a bad football player and part of the problem. One game doesnt change that. He's not any good. You can have a good game and still be a bad player, we've seen plenty enough of that over the last few years
Nobody is pumping their chests. Its nice to watch a win and not be pussies whining about where we draft.
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In comment 14175077 ajr2456 said:
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In comment 14175048 dep026 said:
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its sad this place even when we win.
He missed one throw, he sucked!!!
188 yards is a good performance in 1962
Ill take 188 and 3 TDs (should have been a 4th if OBJ didnt slip) and no INTs over what has been his customary 285 yards/no TDs bc we cant score in the red zone game as of late
Except how many teams does this performance beat?
3 TDS and a decent defense? I would think, most..
eli played well, eric. mook suck my dick if u cant enjoy this...
ban me I don't care
A 3TD 188 yard game with no picks doesn't often win?
What fucking sport are you following, or are you just going to cement that your sole reason for posting on BBI is to crap on Eli?
He is bad. The offensive line is bad. Eli makes the offensive line look worse than they actually are, and at the same time the offensive line makes Eli look worse than he actually is.
But the one undeniable fact is at this point both are bad.
The only reason the Giants have Eli is because they properly tanked in 2003.
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In comment 14175166 mfsd said:
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In comment 14175077 ajr2456 said:
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In comment 14175048 dep026 said:
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its sad this place even when we win.
He missed one throw, he sucked!!!
188 yards is a good performance in 1962
Ill take 188 and 3 TDs (should have been a 4th if OBJ didnt slip) and no INTs over what has been his customary 285 yards/no TDs bc we cant score in the red zone game as of late
Except how many teams does this performance beat?
3 TDS and a decent defense? I would think, most..
Except this was a 2-7 team he did it against. With a practice squad QB. And it still wasnt good.
BTW your handle name says Metsareback - whats the point of that?
Bad football players can once in a while have a good game.
I love Eli and I'll forever appreciate the 2 super bowls, but he is a bad football player and part of the problem. One game doesnt change that. He's not any good. You can have a good game and still be a bad player, we've seen plenty enough of that over the last few years
Tonight was the same as the Houston game. When hes not under siege, hes still good enough. But, I guess I dont know what Im watching despite watching this game for 30 years.
The mere fact that so many still jump on Eli, even after wins and very good games, shows just what frustration will do.
At least we should hope it is that - because otherwise it is just rampant stupidity.
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In comment 14175236 ajr2456 said:
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In comment 14175166 mfsd said:
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In comment 14175077 ajr2456 said:
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In comment 14175048 dep026 said:
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its sad this place even when we win.
He missed one throw, he sucked!!!
188 yards is a good performance in 1962
Ill take 188 and 3 TDs (should have been a 4th if OBJ didnt slip) and no INTs over what has been his customary 285 yards/no TDs bc we cant score in the red zone game as of late
Except how many teams does this performance beat?
3 TDS and a decent defense? I would think, most..
Except this was a 2-7 team he did it against. With a practice squad QB. And it still wasnt good.
That wasnt even remotely close to being related to the question you asked.
Giant fans really suck in this day and age
Yeah, lets not go overboard. But maybe too, lets not shit on the QB that brought us two Lombardis.
He missed one throw, he sucked!!!
He missed a lot more than one. He under threw 3 on the last drive alone.
And he made some great throws, too.
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but he absolutely is still a bad football player. Thinking differently based on tonight is what makes most of this site totally delusional.
Bad football players can once in a while have a good game.
I love Eli and I'll forever appreciate the 2 super bowls, but he is a bad football player and part of the problem. One game doesnt change that. He's not any good. You can have a good game and still be a bad player, we've seen plenty enough of that over the last few years
Tonight was the same as the Houston game. When hes not under siege, hes still good enough. But, I guess I dont know what Im watching despite watching this game for 30 years.
With Odell and Barkley if the line protects well just about any QB in the league will play well. This trash bag at QB for the 49ers was playing well at times tonight because you guessed it he had blocking in front of him. Even without much weapons at his disposal.
Basically you're saying Eli is ONLY capable of being a good player if everything is perfect in front of him. So its on everyone else. Maybe just maybe Eli being a complete statue back there at this point makes the offensive line look worse than it really is (and it's pretty horrible i agree)
If your argument is he's still good when everything is perfect, then I think you could say the same about 30 other QB's in the NFL.
He's bad because unless everything is perfect, he plays like shit, which is most of the time at this point.
He has 2 world class weapons on offense. That alone should be good for a couple touchdowns a game.
The mere fact that so many still jump on Eli, even after wins and very good games, shows just what frustration will do.
At least we should hope it is that - because otherwise it is just rampant stupidity.
Youre the brain dead one if you think this was very good. Good enough to beat a very bad team, sure.
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its sad this place even when we win.
He missed one throw, he sucked!!!
He missed a lot more than one. He under threw 3 on the last drive alone.
And he made some great throws, too.
The throw to Barkley down the sideline was a perfec throw. All Barkley had to do was look. It was placed perfectly. Leading him where he was basically on the sideline and well covered is not the ideal throw.
There was no chance the defender was defending the back shoulder throw.
He is bad. The offensive line is bad. Eli makes the offensive line look worse than they actually are, and at the same time the offensive line makes Eli look worse than he actually is.
But the one undeniable fact is at this point both are bad.
The only reason the Giants have Eli is because they properly tanked in 2003.
This.
Fuck off.
Show me how many QB's with a 3TD, 0 INT stat line lose.
You are seriously going to stick with the story that it wasn't a very good performance.
Seriously?
Bad football players can once in a while have a good game.
I love Eli and I'll forever appreciate the 2 super bowls, but he is a bad football player and part of the problem. One game doesnt change that. He's not any good. You can have a good game and still be a bad player, we've seen plenty enough of that over the last few years
Ah the old double down.
"Eli Manning is due for one of those games where his most loyal supporters can claim he still has it. But as discussed ad nauseam, those good games have become too infrequent."
It feels good to win, but we just played a horrible football team that bailed out the offense with two late defensive penalties.
Game Preview - ( New Window )
I know bad football when I see it. You sound like Dave Gettleman.
Fine, be happy that Eli got a win in his last year.
But you have people thinking this is evidence that he still has it and still is a good player.
How many more bad games from Eli do they have to see before they finally admit he is finished being a good football player over the course of an entire season?
I'm sick of having a shit roster and sick of not making the proper changes to get this team going in the right direction. DG went all in on Eli this off-season and while not entirely Eli's fault, that blew up on him big time.
I'm so sick and tired of having no shot to compete for a division title. Basically every year outside of the fluke 2016 season since 2013. That's what matters to me, competing for titles, not competing for 4-12, 5-11 seasons. I'd rather go 1-15 than 4-12, shoot me for it.
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In comment 14175240 MookGiants said:
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but he absolutely is still a bad football player. Thinking differently based on tonight is what makes most of this site totally delusional.
Bad football players can once in a while have a good game.
I love Eli and I'll forever appreciate the 2 super bowls, but he is a bad football player and part of the problem. One game doesnt change that. He's not any good. You can have a good game and still be a bad player, we've seen plenty enough of that over the last few years
Tonight was the same as the Houston game. When hes not under siege, hes still good enough. But, I guess I dont know what Im watching despite watching this game for 30 years.
With Odell and Barkley if the line protects well just about any QB in the league will play well. This trash bag at QB for the 49ers was playing well at times tonight because you guessed it he had blocking in front of him. Even without much weapons at his disposal.
Basically you're saying Eli is ONLY capable of being a good player if everything is perfect in front of him. So its on everyone else. Maybe just maybe Eli being a complete statue back there at this point makes the offensive line look worse than it really is (and it's pretty horrible i agree)
If your argument is he's still good when everything is perfect, then I think you could say the same about 30 other QB's in the NFL.
He's bad because unless everything is perfect, he plays like shit, which is most of the time at this point.
He has 2 world class weapons on offense. That alone should be good for a couple touchdowns a game.
Im not saying everything has to be perfect. It just has to be decent and he can be successful. Is he what he was in 2011? No, but if they dont love Herbert/College QB, hes probably still the best option in 2019.
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...just becoming awful posters...
I know bad football when I see it. You sound like Dave Gettleman.
Don't worry Eric. Eli isn't part of the problem, he's just a victim of a bad offensive line. Get a couple more offensive lineman and surely Eli will return to his former great years.
There's nothing wrong with a 37 year old quarterback being cooked as far as being an even decent QB. Age catches up with someone earlier than others. Eli is a slam dunk HOF guy in my opinion, just right now is a poor QB.
I dont care if they dont like a QB enough next year, you still cant keep Eli around especially at his cap number. At that point give the team to Lauletta and if he sucks you pick a QB the next year.
Bringing back Eli next year would be a horrible decision but wouldnt surprise me with DG and JM running this show
But the Giants got bailed out by the defensive holding penalty. If the 49ers don't do that, we lose to a 3rd string QB.
But the Giants got bailed out by the defensive holding penalty. If the 49ers don't do that, we lose to a 3rd string QB.
Again, OBJ dropped an easy slant on the first play of the game. He also fell down when wide open on what would have been a TD. So let's not act like the 4/11 on attempts to him was terrible QB play.
Giants are still moving on next year.
Stop trying to sugarcoat that miserable of a view that we need to tank with 7 games left.
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...just becoming awful posters...
I know bad football when I see it. You sound like Dave Gettleman.
This isn't even the first time he has called you out Eric. He is an insufferable poster that does nothing but throw jabs at those that dare criticize his hero Eli Manning.
Stop trying to sugarcoat that miserable of a view that we need to tank with 7 games left.
"Hasn't any really exciting QB prospects"
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In comment 14175036 JCin332 said:
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...just becoming awful posters...
I know bad football when I see it. You sound like Dave Gettleman.
This isn't even the first time he has called you out Eric. He is an insufferable poster that does nothing but throw jabs at those that dare criticize his hero Eli Manning.
Shut up Dupe
Eli wasn't bad, and at times, he was downright good. But again, we were breath away from a bad 23-20 loss with about 150 passing yards (had the game ended on a 4th-and-long incompletion). Eli checked down a bunch tonight and he should of audibled when OBJ was left all alone in the red zone. There were a few "WTF" passes in the game, not just one.
The danger here is - like Gettleman - fans will point to 1-out-4 games and say, "See, we can still win with Eli!"
This is the same mindset John Mara has too.
It's time to move on.
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In comment 14175386 Eric from BBI said:
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In comment 14175036 JCin332 said:
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...just becoming awful posters...
I know bad football when I see it. You sound like Dave Gettleman.
This isn't even the first time he has called you out Eric. He is an insufferable poster that does nothing but throw jabs at those that dare criticize his hero Eli Manning.
Shut up Dupe
Wow. What a great contribution. Your mother must be proud.
But the Giants got bailed out by the defensive holding penalty. If the 49ers don't do that, we lose to a 3rd string QB.
It's doesn't matter Eric...there's no reason to point out facts to the Eli fanboys. They are literally making up fake stats to prove how good Eli is. We were 5-12 on 3rd downs and Britt's going around bragging how great Eli was because he was either 7-9 or 8-10 on 3rd downs.
So maybe Eli wasn't really 18-31 for 188 yards, maybe he was really 25-28 for 375 yards.
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In comment 14175408 NYG07 said:
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In comment 14175386 Eric from BBI said:
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In comment 14175036 JCin332 said:
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...just becoming awful posters...
I know bad football when I see it. You sound like Dave Gettleman.
This isn't even the first time he has called you out Eric. He is an insufferable poster that does nothing but throw jabs at those that dare criticize his hero Eli Manning.
Shut up Dupe
Wow. What a great contribution. Your mother must be proud.
Really good response especially because it nails it Dupe
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We had 63 passing yards in the first half. We finished with 188. The three TD throws were excellent. Beckham was thrown at 11 times with only 4 completions. Engram was left wide open on a 31 yard gain. The 23-yarder to Saquon was an excellent play all around.
But the Giants got bailed out by the defensive holding penalty. If the 49ers don't do that, we lose to a 3rd string QB.
It's doesn't matter Eric...there's no reason to point out facts to the Eli fanboys. They are literally making up fake stats to prove how good Eli is. We were 5-12 on 3rd downs and Britt's going around bragging how great Eli was because he was either 7-9 or 8-10 on 3rd downs.
So maybe Eli wasn't really 18-31 for 188 yards, maybe he was really 25-28 for 375 yards.
Yeah, those 3rd downs don't matter..LOL
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We had 63 passing yards in the first half. We finished with 188. The three TD throws were excellent. Beckham was thrown at 11 times with only 4 completions. Engram was left wide open on a 31 yard gain. The 23-yarder to Saquon was an excellent play all around.
But the Giants got bailed out by the defensive holding penalty. If the 49ers don't do that, we lose to a 3rd string QB.
Again, OBJ dropped an easy slant on the first play of the game. He also fell down when wide open on what would have been a TD. So let's not act like the 4/11 on attempts to him was terrible QB play.
There were also a couple more where the defender just made a great play. Pass was only where OBJ could get it, tight coverage and the defender knocked it away.
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In comment 14175413 montanagiant said:
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In comment 14175408 NYG07 said:
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In comment 14175386 Eric from BBI said:
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In comment 14175036 JCin332 said:
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...just becoming awful posters...
I know bad football when I see it. You sound like Dave Gettleman.
This isn't even the first time he has called you out Eric. He is an insufferable poster that does nothing but throw jabs at those that dare criticize his hero Eli Manning.
Shut up Dupe
Wow. What a great contribution. Your mother must be proud.
Really good response especially because it nails it Dupe
Remember when I owned you in the Eli contract discussion? Shut the fuck up already. You pretend you are the equivalent of Britt but you are not.
Eli wasn't bad, and at times, he was downright good. But again, we were breath away from a bad 23-20 loss with about 150 passing yards (had the game ended on a 4th-and-long incompletion). Eli checked down a bunch tonight and he should of audibled when OBJ was left all alone in the red zone. There were a few "WTF" passes in the game, not just one.
The danger here is - like Gettleman - fans will point to 1-out-4 games and say, "See, we can still win with Eli!"
This is the same mindset John Mara has too.
It's time to move on.
1 mil % end of thread
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In comment 14175423 NYG07 said:
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In comment 14175413 montanagiant said:
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In comment 14175408 NYG07 said:
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In comment 14175386 Eric from BBI said:
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In comment 14175036 JCin332 said:
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...just becoming awful posters...
I know bad football when I see it. You sound like Dave Gettleman.
This isn't even the first time he has called you out Eric. He is an insufferable poster that does nothing but throw jabs at those that dare criticize his hero Eli Manning.
Shut up Dupe
Wow. What a great contribution. Your mother must be proud.
Really good response especially because it nails it Dupe
Remember when I owned you in the Eli contract discussion? Shut the fuck up already. You pretend you are the equivalent of Britt but you are not.
LOL...You know what I do remember that and I just realized you own me in here...
You're not a dupe..
Lets agree everyone just overreacts to every game with Eli. People have their sides- why is this crap so personal and negative for some of you?
Giants are 2-7. Critics of the critics can STFU
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...just becoming awful posters...
I know bad football when I see it. You sound like Dave Gettleman.
Eric I don't know if this is your new shtick to generate clicks for the site but its a bad look for you...
I liked it better when you were one of the voices of reason on here...
A good example is the above Gettleman comment...guy inherited a shitshow of an OL and now he is a caricature...
Football is a team game Eric...c'mon you're better than this...!!
Just makes ya laugh anymore.
He missed one throw, he sucked!!!
No need to go to the other extreme.
Eli had good pass protection and he played well. Did he play "great?" Not close to that.
In any event, bad, good or great... doesn't really matter anymore. Eli is the past. He's not our future, beginning in 2019.
Eli didnt play great but it was nice to see him do some good things and win a game for a change. Some people have already committed to the Eli sucks, get rid of him side of things that they cant even enjoy this game and are butthurt that they won.
I need some confidence in the QB, the coaching staff, and some of the players, not to mention the GM. Some good games and some wins are not evil. The bottom falling out helps NO ONE, draft be damned. They beat a shitty team tonight but maybe they get some confidence and they can build on this.
Eli is not the future. This game will not create delusion in the front office or with the coaches-Im pretty sure Shurmur knows exactly what hes watching and its mediocre QB play. But this was a decent game and a fun win with some great plays. Youre allowed to enjoy it and you dont have to get defensive and shit on people who do. The other extreme-Look Eli is awesome! is a delusional point of view. The answer of course is somewhere in the middle but were conditioned to jump all over the other side no matter what.
Ill take a few good wins (beat the Eagles in philly, would anyone be crying?) and some solid play so that I can feel good about next year. Draft your qb or trade up if need be. Personally I cant root for another 2-14 year. It could happen but with a new coach and GM... it isnt necessarily a great thing to be that horrible again despite the draft pick. We do need some positives.
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Youre the brain dead one if you think this was very good. Good enough to beat a very bad team, sure.
Fuck off.
Show me how many QB's with a 3TD, 0 INT stat line lose.
You are seriously going to stick with the story that it wasn't a very good performance.
Seriously?
What you dont like the name calling when its to you?
If they werent playing a bottom three team in the league they lose by double digits with the performance tonight.
Teams thats score under 30 points and pass for under 200 yards are 88-130 (.404) the last two years.
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Were pumping our chest?
Nobody is pumping their chests. Its nice to watch a win and not be pussies whining about where we draft.
But playing well against a bottom 3 team, isn't an indication of things to come, nor a reason to invest in that future.
The difference between bad and good in the NFL is so thin. And we've seen 7 other times in full view the talent/age trajectories between QB and team don't line up well for the Giants.
And Eric is right - we got bailed out by a very questionable defensive holding call on 2nd and 20 on the GW drive. That was two guys playing football, with much of the contact initiated by OBJ. But the NFL is so pro-offense that they continue to move the game down this path where they want to be the NBA with a prolate spheroid. Its just unbearable - even when it goes your way...
The Carter call, for example, was right in todays game but it was really just a guy playing football and tackling another player. The game is just pathetic to watch...
But playing well against a bottom 3 team, isn't an indication of things to come, nor a reason to invest in that future.
The difference between bad and good in the NFL is so thin. And we've seen 7 other times in full view the talent/age trajectories between QB and team don't line up well for the Giants.
No predictions or projections, but if, perhaps a big if, the protection holds up as it did last night, lets see where Eli really is at this point in his career, when he finally has the time.
And Eric is right - we got bailed out by a very questionable defensive holding call on 2nd and 20 on the GW drive. That was two guys playing football, with much of the contact initiated by OBJ. But the NFL is so pro-offense that they continue to move the game down this path where they want to be the NBA with a prolate spheroid. Its just unbearable - even when it goes your way...
The Carter call, for example, was right in todays game but it was really just a guy playing football and tackling another player. The game is just pathetic to watch...
Seriously, after 15 years, you really need to recuse yourself from any discussion of Eli or even TC for that matter. We know and have seen your consistently subjective stances by now as it pertains to those two. There is nothing to be learned from your takes on these guys. Perhaps, if you persist on weighing in on Eli, you should offer a disclaimer such as, Im not an Eli guy, but.... 😎😎
If anything, fans should be pissed at our defense for giving up 23 points to a QB that was on the practice squad a few weeks ago.
Was Manning perfect? I don't think anyone is claiming he was. But his performance was enough. The OL for once weren't lolling around with their bellies in the mire while defenders have a free release on Eli. Eli isn't some decrepit, noodle-arm, frail, geriatric that some of his critics make him out to be.
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I hate seeing Manning get pounded into the turf. Watching him play good football is a pleasure.
But playing well against a bottom 3 team, isn't an indication of things to come, nor a reason to invest in that future.
The difference between bad and good in the NFL is so thin. And we've seen 7 other times in full view the talent/age trajectories between QB and team don't line up well for the Giants.
No predictions or projections, but if, perhaps a big if, the protection holds up as it did last night, lets see where Eli really is at this point in his career, when he finally has the time.
He had time and averaged 6 yards per passing attempt, and barely beat a 2 win team that turned it over twice - once in their own zone.
We know where Eli is at in his career.
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In comment 14175571 christian said:
Quote:
I hate seeing Manning get pounded into the turf. Watching him play good football is a pleasure.
But playing well against a bottom 3 team, isn't an indication of things to come, nor a reason to invest in that future.
The difference between bad and good in the NFL is so thin. And we've seen 7 other times in full view the talent/age trajectories between QB and team don't line up well for the Giants.
No predictions or projections, but if, perhaps a big if, the protection holds up as it did last night, lets see where Eli really is at this point in his career, when he finally has the time.
He had time and averaged 6 yards per passing attempt, and barely beat a 2 win team that turned it over twice - once in their own zone.
We know where Eli is at in his career.
Take a look around the league. See how many times this year Brady and Rodgers FOR EXAMPLE, have averaged between 6-7 yards per attempt. Seriously, actually go look. No, Im not comparing Eli to these guys, but when I bring this point up, its met with, yeah, but he threw for 3-4 TDs, thats what matters. Got it
Just makes ya laugh anymore.
Eli plays a good game and leads a game winning TD drive, and his critics cite the fact he didnt put up enough fantasy stats as evidence he didnt play that well.
If 188 yards and 3 TDs and a game winning drive isnt good enough, imagine the way this place would have been in the Phil Simms era
...who is receding further and further in the Giants rear view mirror.
A lot of pixels for a guy who will be out of the game at the end of this season.
Eli wasn't bad, and at times, he was downright good. But again, we were breath away from a bad 23-20 loss with about 150 passing yards (had the game ended on a 4th-and-long incompletion). Eli checked down a bunch tonight and he should of audibled when OBJ was left all alone in the red zone. There were a few "WTF" passes in the game, not just one.
The danger here is - like Gettleman - fans will point to 1-out-4 games and say, "See, we can still win with Eli!"
This is the same mindset John Mara has too.
It's time to move on.
I never said it wasn't time to move on. Just saying there's no need to go out of your way looking for things to criticize.
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Again, I predicted this in my game preview, and I predicted the reaction.
Eli wasn't bad, and at times, he was downright good. But again, we were breath away from a bad 23-20 loss with about 150 passing yards (had the game ended on a 4th-and-long incompletion). Eli checked down a bunch tonight and he should of audibled when OBJ was left all alone in the red zone. There were a few "WTF" passes in the game, not just one.
The danger here is - like Gettleman - fans will point to 1-out-4 games and say, "See, we can still win with Eli!"
This is the same mindset John Mara has too.
It's time to move on.
I never said it wasn't time to move on. Just saying there's no need to go out of your way looking for things to criticize.
Yep
Ogletree not being able to cover me
Collins with one of the worst performances of his career
Vernon playing like an absolute bum
STs had 3 costly penalties
We didnt sack a rookie QB once.
BBI never disappoints.
What I mind is when people make ridiculous fucking statements:
If they werent playing a bottom three team in the league they lose by double digits with the performance tonight.
Teams thats score under 30 points and pass for under 200 yards are 88-130 (.404) the last two years.
If you tally up all of the QB's with 180+ yards, 3 TD's and no turnovers, I'm going to bet that 75% of those games are wins.
You really seem to think that isn't true. Shows both how biased you are against Eli as well as how big of a fucking moron you are.
Booger got on Eli pretty good last night. He was right that he can still play but needs more from his team now. Eli with the 2008 Giants line and running game could be at a high level this year. The problem is the Giants are far from creating that type of supporting team and it is best to move on as it is going to take some years to strengthen the LOS on both sides. In the interim, relax and pull for him to finish out the year with some dignity. I was pretty happy to see him smiling post game.
Admittingly I'm like a moth to a bright light when I see a dorgan post
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In comment 14175604 Big Blue '56 said:
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In comment 14175571 christian said:
Quote:
I hate seeing Manning get pounded into the turf. Watching him play good football is a pleasure.
But playing well against a bottom 3 team, isn't an indication of things to come, nor a reason to invest in that future.
The difference between bad and good in the NFL is so thin. And we've seen 7 other times in full view the talent/age trajectories between QB and team don't line up well for the Giants.
No predictions or projections, but if, perhaps a big if, the protection holds up as it did last night, lets see where Eli really is at this point in his career, when he finally has the time.
He had time and averaged 6 yards per passing attempt, and barely beat a 2 win team that turned it over twice - once in their own zone.
We know where Eli is at in his career.
Take a look around the league. See how many times this year Brady and Rodgers FOR EXAMPLE, have averaged between 6-7 yards per attempt. Seriously, actually go look. No, Im not comparing Eli to these guys, but when I bring this point up, its met with, yeah, but he threw for 3-4 TDs, thats what matters. Got it
Both the Pats and Packers are having down years on offense and still:
Aaron Rodgers has done it 3 times this year and they are 0-2-1 in those games.
Tom Brady has done it 2 times this year, they are 0-2 in those games.
Eli has done it 6 times in 9 games and they are 1-5 in those games. In fact teams this year that average 6.5 ypa or less are 22-58-1. Its not a winnable formula in 2018.
Ogletree not being able to cover me
Collins with one of the worst performances of his career
Vernon playing like an absolute bum
STs had 3 costly penalties
We didnt sack a rookie QB once.
BBI never disappoints.
Youre not wrong, just in the wrong thread for those points.
What I mind is when people make ridiculous fucking statements:
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What you dont like the name calling when its to you?
If they werent playing a bottom three team in the league they lose by double digits with the performance tonight.
Teams thats score under 30 points and pass for under 200 yards are 88-130 (.404) the last two years.
If you tally up all of the QB's with 180+ yards, 3 TD's and no turnovers, I'm going to bet that 75% of those games are wins.
You really seem to think that isn't true. Shows both how biased you are against Eli as well as how big of a fucking moron you are.
Why does it matter who gets the TDs? Points are points. That situation has happened 5 times in 2 years, and two of the four wins the winning team scored 30+ points.
I would rather this team make the necessary changes that result in this team actually being relevant moving forward. If this team was even remotely competent this season we would be fighting for a division title.
He's on the way out, you're going to get your wish. Just like you did with Tom Coughlin. Let the Coughlin thing be a lesson. Yeah, maybe it was time for him to go, too, but what has followed has been absolutely terrible.
The fact that you sh-t on these guys when they're down says a lot more about you than anybody else.
This is a Giants fan site. Eli Manning is one of the greatest Giants of all time. You got nothing nice to say about seeing the guy get it done a lost couple of times? Then show some respect and shut up.
There's no need to downplay his accomplishments. It's coming to an end, anyway. This year or next.
Let people enjoy the end of his career if they want.
That's really all that needs to be said, even if you're ready to move on from the guy.
Not true
I would rather this team make the necessary changes that result in this team actually being relevant moving forward. If this team was even remotely competent this season we would be fighting for a division title.
Heh.
He's on the way out, you're going to get your wish. Just like you did with Tom Coughlin. Let the Coughlin thing be a lesson. Yeah, maybe it was time for him to go, too, but what has followed has been absolutely terrible.
The fact that you sh-t on these guys when they're down says a lot more about you than anybody else.
I assume you are talking to me Britt, and I have never once been one of ignorant assholes that tried to make the argument that Eli was never good and has been carried by the team around him.
He used to be a good QB, now he is not. A meaningless game against a garbage team changes nothing. I dont agree. He absolutely should be on his way out, but I am not convinced, given the level of incompetence this organization has shown recently. I would not be shocked if Eli were the opening day starter next year.
This is a Giants fan site. Eli Manning is one of the greatest Giants of all time. You got nothing nice to say about seeing the guy get it done a lost couple of times? Then show some respect and shut up.
There's no need to downplay his accomplishments. It's coming to an end, anyway. This year or next.
Let people enjoy the end of his career if they want.
I agree. It was a win against a team that isn't very good. And it was a close game. But some of our losses were also close games - including that last minute field goal from the other side of town.
I don't care how sh-tty San Fran is, our ENTIRE team is equally as sh-tty. They gave Eli some time last night, and some semblance of a run game so he could playaction, and he was able to muster it up and get it done.
If nothing else, maybe performances like last night can energize the rest of the roster and build some confidence in the rest of the team moving forward.
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Eli is the best QB we've ever had
Not true
Greg, I dont mean to derail this thread, but I never got to see Simms play. Can you please share your thoughts as to why he is the best QB to ever play for the Giants? I know all about the amazing superbowl performance, etc. What was he like on a week to week basis?
So is the "Eli is done" line that is used on the majority of BBI threads even though no one is disagreeing.
We played the Raiders last night?
Simms played in a much, much tougher environment for a QB, in an NFC that was absolutely brutal, and the best receivers he ever had were a TE (Bavaro) and half a season of Mike Sherrard in 1993.
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Eli Manning, one of my favorite NY athletes ever but this consistent "I told you so" is tedious.
So is the "Eli is done" line that is used on the majority of BBI threads even though no one is disagreeing.
It's one of the odder things I've seen on BBI. It's as if this is a good team with a ton of talent being held back by a 2 time SB QB. I fully agree it's time to move on but why are so many obsessed with piling on or proclaiming how done he is? He's diminished, he's 37 years old with 237 NFL games under his belt. It happens to the best of em. If we are going to compare him to others.. Brady might be the GOAT and Drew Brees game is closer to what the NFL now is than the traditional QB. Quick release, move around the pocket etc and quite frankly Brees too is one of the GOAT. He's a no doubter HOFer.
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In comment 14175797 DanMetroMan said:
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Eli Manning, one of my favorite NY athletes ever but this consistent "I told you so" is tedious.
So is the "Eli is done" line that is used on the majority of BBI threads even though no one is disagreeing.
It's one of the odder things I've seen on BBI. It's as if this is a good team with a ton of talent being held back by a 2 time SB QB. I fully agree it's time to move on but why are so many obsessed with piling on or proclaiming how done he is? He's diminished, he's 37 years old with 237 NFL games under his belt. It happens to the best of em. If we are going to compare him to others.. Brady might be the GOAT and Drew Brees game is closer to what the NFL now is than the traditional QB. Quick release, move around the pocket etc and quite frankly Brees too is one of the GOAT. He's a no doubter HOFer.
After last week, the GOAT may be done too.
Every action has an equal and opposite reaction.
Every action has an equal and opposite reaction.
lol. Just wow.
Every action has an equal and opposite reaction.
It's interesting because you act the same way you just described towards anything 80's or 1990's giants.
Every action has an equal and opposite reaction.
Don't forget to throw in Tom Coughlin.
Don't forget to throw in Tom Coughlin.
Hey! That wasnt me!
Every action has an equal and opposite reaction.
I actually think this is fair. I have been overly critical of Manning, but a lot of that is due to some of the absurd excuses and hero worshiping I hear on here.
It is no different than the morons that say Eli only has Superbowls because of the pass rush those teams had. Some of you guys go way over the top in defending him.
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Greg, I dont mean to derail this thread, but I never got to see Simms play. Can you please share your thoughts as to why he is the best QB to ever play for the Giants? I know all about the amazing superbowl performance, etc. What was he like on a week to week basis?
Simms played in a much, much tougher environment for a QB, in an NFC that was absolutely brutal, and the best receivers he ever had were a TE (Bavaro) and half a season of Mike Sherrard in 1993.
Disagree on Sherrard. Lionel Manual was the best receiver he ever had...and he was pretty good and underrated IMO.
But Greg's point is 100% accurate....Simms played in a much tougher environment for QB's and he never had anything close to the receiving corps that Eli's had for his career.
Theres that equal and opposite reaction.
Seriously, after 15 years, you really need to recuse yourself from any discussion of Eli or even TC for that matter. We know and have seen your consistently subjective stances by now as it pertains to those two. There is nothing to be learned from your takes on these guys. Perhaps, if you persist on weighing in on Eli, you should offer a disclaimer such as, Im not an Eli guy, but.... 😎😎
What did I write that was unreasonable? I wrote that Eli had a solid game and that we were the beneficiaries of a poor call at the end.
I dont deny at all that I was disgusted with what Archie, Condon, and Peyton did leading up to that 2004 draft. It was a cocksucker move. And it was outrageously hypocritical after Peyton was more than willing to join the hideous Colts, but baby brother Eli was too good for the Chargers. Are we to believe the Irsays were this football royalty over the Spanoses? Please...what a joke.
But I am more than capable of setting that side and offering measured, well reasoned opinions on Eli and all things Jints Central... ; )
Bruce, I actually think it's fair to compare both the players and the situations. I actually don't think Manning's decline is disproportionate to Brees's or Brady's. Granted, I think where they've declined from was higher, so there's that.
Two things are obvious: 1) the Giants have a massive talent deficit 2) Manning isn't the transcendent player from 7 years ago.
Things the Patriots and Saints have immediately; better coaching, arguably much better talent, and more than a decade of observation by the coach of the QB of who he is and once was.
So now how do the Giants get back into contention if those variables are true?
Can't turn back time and not fire Coughlin, can't turn back time and retrieve peak Manning. So what's left is address the talent disparity between Manning's team and his opponents.
Against an equally talented team last night he looked very good. He could move the ball methodically, take the 6 yards, and take the scores. Problem is the equally talented team is one of the worst.
My primary contention with Manning has never been his talent has eroded too far to compete, it's the trajectory of his erosion against the trajectory of upping the talent around him. As we've seen this year, grabbing 4-5 good players against turning over 35 bad hasn't moved the needle.
I think it's a good 2 more years -- and by then I think Manning is going to be a deficit.
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Greg, I dont mean to derail this thread, but I never got to see Simms play. Can you please share your thoughts as to why he is the best QB to ever play for the Giants? I know all about the amazing superbowl performance, etc. What was he like on a week to week basis?
Simms played in a much, much tougher environment for a QB, in an NFC that was absolutely brutal, and the best receivers he ever had were a TE (Bavaro) and half a season of Mike Sherrard in 1993.
This is very true. Simms took a pounding when football was actually football. And he was damn good despite playing in a stadium that was very, very tricky and with a HC/OC who were very run centric...
2006: 2156, 4.7
2007: 2148, 4.6
2008: 2518, 5.0
2009: 1837, 4.1
2010: 2200, 4.6
2011: 1427, 3.5
2012: 1862, 4.6
Yes, after that, the Giants running game fell apart, but that's an eight year stretch where the running game was great for all but two years, and was still above average in one of those two. Now, let's look at Simms. I'll even leave off 1979-80 even though those years undercut your argument, and of course Brunner was the starter in 82-83 and Hostetler for all but 8 games in 1991-92 so those are out too.
1981: 1685, 3.5
1984: 1660, 3.4
1985: 2451, 4.2
1986: 2245, 4.0
1987*: 1457, 3.3
1988: 1689, 3.4
1989: 1889, 3.4
1990: 2049, 3.8
1993: 2210, 3.9
So who had the amazing run game?
Quote:
Seriously, after 15 years, you really need to recuse yourself from any discussion of Eli or even TC for that matter. We know and have seen your consistently subjective stances by now as it pertains to those two. There is nothing to be learned from your takes on these guys. Perhaps, if you persist on weighing in on Eli, you should offer a disclaimer such as, Im not an Eli guy, but.... 😎😎
What did I write that was unreasonable? I wrote that Eli had a solid game and that we were the beneficiaries of a poor call at the end.
I dont deny at all that I was disgusted with what Archie, Condon, and Peyton did leading up to that 2004 draft. It was a cocksucker move. And it was outrageously hypocritical after Peyton was more than willing to join the hideous Colts, but baby brother Eli was too good for the Chargers. Are we to believe the Irsays were this football royalty over the Spanoses? Please...what a joke.
But I am more than capable of setting that side and offering measured, well reasoned opinions on Eli and all things Jints Central... ; )
😎
Won't be surprised either way. But I know you will be.
I don't think Eli played great. He played good enough to beat a crappy team, but that's what it is at this point. With OBJ in man coverage and not getting help, he should ahve had 12 catches and 3 TD's.
Either way, Im happy we won the game and like seeing Eli happy on the sidelines. He deserves it.
Heres the problem that some people like yourself don't understand. A lot of people, myself included, feel really strongly about Eli's abilities at this point in his career. I think just about all of us would hope that they run the table and Eli goes out a champ, but we believe the likelihood of that happening is almost 0%. Should we just stick our heads in the sand and ignore what we've seen for the past 3 years because fans like yourself want to lie to yourselves and pretend like he can still win something?
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Its incredibly weird. Hope they run the table and Eli is back for his final year. I want to see the best QB in franchise history go out on top and dont care how many fans that hope annoys. I have no issue, ever, of going overboard for our QB. Jamon was a good addition and Gettleman is serious about fixing the Oline. He also believes in Eli. Unlike that tool Marc Ross
Heres the problem that some people like yourself don't understand. A lot of people, myself included, feel really strongly about Eli's abilities at this point in his career. I think just about all of us would hope that they run the table and Eli goes out a champ, but we believe the likelihood of that happening is almost 0%. Should we just stick our heads in the sand and ignore what we've seen for the past 3 years because fans like yourself want to lie to yourselves and pretend like he can still win something?
Im sorry, did I hit a nerve? Sure did.
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Its incredibly weird. Hope they run the table and Eli is back for his final year. I want to see the best QB in franchise history go out on top and dont care how many fans that hope annoys. I have no issue, ever, of going overboard for our QB. Jamon was a good addition and Gettleman is serious about fixing the Oline. He also believes in Eli. Unlike that tool Marc Ross
Heres the problem that some people like yourself don't understand. A lot of people, myself included, feel really strongly about Eli's abilities at this point in his career. I think just about all of us would hope that they run the table and Eli goes out a champ, but we believe the likelihood of that happening is almost 0%. Should we just stick our heads in the sand and ignore what we've seen for the past 3 years because fans like yourself want to lie to yourselves and pretend like he can still win something?
Exactly Keith. We are fans of the NY Giants, not the NY Elis. I want this team to win superbowls, not cling to the past. Eli was a great player in his prime, and he was worth every cent. Now he is holding us back from becoming a better team. I would have loved to see him go out on top. But if the last three years isn't enough evidence that he needs to go than I dont know what to tell you people.
And you still call yourself a fan of the NY Giants?
Go fuck yourself.
And then standing by it for several hours.
2006: 2156, 4.7
2007: 2148, 4.6
2008: 2518, 5.0
2009: 1837, 4.1
2010: 2200, 4.6
2011: 1427, 3.5
2012: 1862, 4.6
Yes, after that, the Giants running game fell apart, but that's an eight year stretch where the running game was great for all but two years, and was still above average in one of those two. Now, let's look at Simms. I'll even leave off 1979-80 even though those years undercut your argument, and of course Brunner was the starter in 82-83 and Hostetler for all but 8 games in 1991-92 so those are out too.
1981: 1685, 3.5
1984: 1660, 3.4
1985: 2451, 4.2
1986: 2245, 4.0
1987*: 1457, 3.3
1988: 1689, 3.4
1989: 1889, 3.4
1990: 2049, 3.8
1993: 2210, 3.9
So who had the amazing run game?
The one year that Simms won the Super Bowl he had a 2,245 yard rushing game.
Eli's Giants had 2,148 in the season of his first win. He won his second with the worst rushing attack in the league (1,427). When did Simms ever do that?
So Eli did better in the absence of a running game than Simms ever did. And he never had the all time great defense Simms had, captained by the greatest defensive player of all time.
And you still call yourself a fan of the NY Giants?
Go fuck yourself.
Yes, a meaningless win in another lost season. But please go on with your schtick of doing nothing but bullying anyone who disagrees with you. I try real hard to ignore you, but you are an insufferable douche bag. How you have not been banned is beyond me. Everyone is a moron in your eyes. Get the fuck over yourself.
Quote:
2005: 2209 yards, 4.7 YPC
2006: 2156, 4.7
2007: 2148, 4.6
2008: 2518, 5.0
2009: 1837, 4.1
2010: 2200, 4.6
2011: 1427, 3.5
2012: 1862, 4.6
Yes, after that, the Giants running game fell apart, but that's an eight year stretch where the running game was great for all but two years, and was still above average in one of those two. Now, let's look at Simms. I'll even leave off 1979-80 even though those years undercut your argument, and of course Brunner was the starter in 82-83 and Hostetler for all but 8 games in 1991-92 so those are out too.
1981: 1685, 3.5
1984: 1660, 3.4
1985: 2451, 4.2
1986: 2245, 4.0
1987*: 1457, 3.3
1988: 1689, 3.4
1989: 1889, 3.4
1990: 2049, 3.8
1993: 2210, 3.9
So who had the amazing run game?
The one year that Simms won the Super Bowl he had a 2,245 yard rushing game.
Eli's Giants had 2,148 in the season of his first win. He won his second with the worst rushing attack in the league (1,427). When did Simms ever do that?
So Eli did better in the absence of a running game than Simms ever did. And he never had the all time great defense Simms had, captained by the greatest defensive player of all time.
Important context
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after the NY Giants win a game, YOU started a thread mocking.
And you still call yourself a fan of the NY Giants?
Go fuck yourself.
Yes, a meaningless win in another lost season. But please go on with your schtick of doing nothing but bullying anyone who disagrees with you. I try real hard to ignore you, but you are an insufferable douche bag. How you have not been banned is beyond me. Everyone is a moron in your eyes. Get the fuck over yourself.
I find it very interesting that you are telling someone to get over themselves.
Some things are better some things aren't as good.
Anyhow, Eli had an efficient game and the line at least protected well most of the game. I feel like we stole that game from them, but it's nice to have a win
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Important context
Some things are better some things aren't as good.
c'mon ...Greg isn't going out on a limb here. The giants had to contend with the dynasties of the skins and niners not to mention a very good Bears team. Perennial powerhouses like them don't exist anymore
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Eli played well. It was nice to see. I'm happy for him.
That's really all that needs to be said, even if you're ready to move on from the guy.
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In comment 14176059 Greg from LI said:
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Important context
Some things are better some things aren't as good.
c'mon ...Greg isn't going out on a limb here. The giants had to contend with the dynasties of the skins and niners not to mention a very good Bears team. Perennial powerhouses like them don't exist anymore
They don't? What are the Patriots?
Won't be surprised either way. But I know you will be.
That's one thing I can agree with you on. I think there is a pretty good chance Eli is the starter here week 1 next year. Much higher than people realize.
They don't? What are the Patriots?
The exception and not in the NFC
2005: Two NFC East teams in the playoffs
2006: Three NFC East teams in the playoffs
2007: Three NFC East teams in the playoffs
2008: Two NFC East teams in the playoffs
2009: Two NFC East teams in the playoffs
But it was at least two, if not three, of those teams. And that's our division alone.
Maybe some of you don't remember what a dogfight the division was during those years.
The Giants played a pretty high level of competition those years.
Are we going to diminish that too? All in the name of what?
This is a bad, bad team.
I don't see the point in it, actually. But I don't see the point in diminishing team/player accomplishments the way you do, either.
👍
I normally don't agree with Britt's take, but I agree with him, why put down the 2007/2011 runs to say the Giants teams from the 80's was a harder trek?
It's like people just want to argue for arguments sake.
Minutes after the Giants won last night, the team you supposedly root for, you started a thread mocking Eli. And then spent the next few hours defending the fact that Eli played just alright to squeak by.
My schtick of calling you a fucking moron isn't because I disagree with you. It is because you truly appear to b e a fucking moron in what you post.
Distinguish between the two, asswipe.
Now, my 7 year old pretends to be Eli when he throws. We watch the games together, he wears his Eli jersey.
He'll never know Simms, just like I never knew Tittle or Connerly.
You should learn to appreciate good players while they're playing.
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I think contrary to the popular opinion shared among you and your constituents, I think there is a very good chance Eli is not only on the roster next year, but is the starter week 1.
Won't be surprised either way. But I know you will be.
That's one thing I can agree with you on. I think there is a pretty good chance Eli is the starter here week 1 next year. Much higher than people realize.
The Giants being loyal to an incumbent, deteriorating character from the Super Bowls era shouldn't surprise any Giants fan.
That decision ending in anything other than another last place finish and Manning get his teeth kicked in weekly would be the surprise.
Team building changed, and being able to keep rosters together for long periods changed, but the game itself didn't change that much.
Things really didn't start to change until the latter part of the 2000 decade, and to where we are now.
The late 90's and early to middle 2000's were every bit as physical as the 80's.
Quote:
Yes, a meaningless win in another lost season. But please go on with your schtick of doing nothing but bullying anyone who disagrees with you. I try real hard to ignore you, but you are an insufferable douche bag. How you have not been banned is beyond me. Everyone is a moron in your eyes. Get the fuck over yourself.
Minutes after the Giants won last night, the team you supposedly root for, you started a thread mocking Eli. And then spent the next few hours defending the fact that Eli played just alright to squeak by.
My schtick of calling you a fucking moron isn't because I disagree with you. It is because you truly appear to b e a fucking moron in what you post.
Distinguish between the two, asswipe.
You are right, my thread was out of line and that is why I deleted it shortly thereafter. That doesn't mean I am a moron or a bad fan. You dont know anything about my intelligence or fandom. I do apologize for calling you a douche bag, I dont want to be that guy. I just wish you would show some decency and stop constantly ridiculing people.
The irony is I basically ridicule posters who actually don't show decency and crap all over the players they supposedly are rooting for. Ridiculing them.
I have no motivation to have decency to morons who have little respect for an organization they supposedly spend much of their time following.
And I don't constantly ridicule people. Just moronic ones.
Now if it comes down to whether or not I'm going to ridicule Eli or you - you're going to win every fucking time.
I also keep hearing the fact that it was against Mullins. Isn't that a reason to be pissed at the D and not Eli?
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I just wish you would show some decency and stop constantly ridiculing people.
The irony is I basically ridicule posters who actually don't show decency and crap all over the players they supposedly are rooting for. Ridiculing them.
I have no motivation to have decency to morons who have little respect for an organization they supposedly spend much of their time following.
And I don't constantly ridicule people. Just moronic ones.
Now if it comes down to whether or not I'm going to ridicule Eli or you - you're going to win every fucking time.
Behind this idea is that you get to decide what the appropriate level of respect for the organization is. That's a ridiculous notion. When you factor that in with an extended period of incompetence and blinkered thinking on the part of the organization, the idea of needing to defend them against much poorly articulated but justified frustration becomes that much more silly.
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I just wish you would show some decency and stop constantly ridiculing people.
The irony is I basically ridicule posters who actually don't show decency and crap all over the players they supposedly are rooting for. Ridiculing them.
I have no motivation to have decency to morons who have little respect for an organization they supposedly spend much of their time following.
And I don't constantly ridicule people. Just moronic ones.
Now if it comes down to whether or not I'm going to ridicule Eli or you - you're going to win every fucking time.
Haha ok Fats...good for you. I dont know why I expected a reasonable response. Please continue to suck in your gut and be the internet tough guy. I also take back my apology. You are a miserable douche bag. I should just heap praise at the players in this organization that have won 5 games in the last two years just to appease your ego.
Now, my 7 year old pretends to be Eli when he throws. We watch the games together, he wears his Eli jersey.
He'll never know Simms, just like I never knew Tittle or Connerly.
You should learn to appreciate good players while they're playing.
This post made me think of my first year playing Pee-Wee football. I won the QB competition for first string. We didn't get our uniforms until nearly the first week so we didn't know our numbers. It was 1989 and I loved Phil Simms and I wanted #11 so bad. The coach came to me and told me there was only one option for me and it was #16. I nearly broke down in tears having to wear Montana's number while I was QB. It was sacrilegious to me. Ha ha. I almost forgot that memory but for some reason your post brought it back to me.
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don't seem to get:
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I just wish you would show some decency and stop constantly ridiculing people.
The irony is I basically ridicule posters who actually don't show decency and crap all over the players they supposedly are rooting for. Ridiculing them.
I have no motivation to have decency to morons who have little respect for an organization they supposedly spend much of their time following.
And I don't constantly ridicule people. Just moronic ones.
Now if it comes down to whether or not I'm going to ridicule Eli or you - you're going to win every fucking time.
Behind this idea is that you get to decide what the appropriate level of respect for the organization is. That's a ridiculous notion. When you factor that in with an extended period of incompetence and blinkered thinking on the part of the organization, the idea of needing to defend them against much poorly articulated but justified frustration becomes that much more silly.
I don't think he rails against criticism or frustration. HE rails against what has become pretty much a fanatical, near religious, prejudice.
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In comment 14176278 FatMan in Charlotte said:
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don't seem to get:
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I just wish you would show some decency and stop constantly ridiculing people.
The irony is I basically ridicule posters who actually don't show decency and crap all over the players they supposedly are rooting for. Ridiculing them.
I have no motivation to have decency to morons who have little respect for an organization they supposedly spend much of their time following.
And I don't constantly ridicule people. Just moronic ones.
Now if it comes down to whether or not I'm going to ridicule Eli or you - you're going to win every fucking time.
Behind this idea is that you get to decide what the appropriate level of respect for the organization is. That's a ridiculous notion. When you factor that in with an extended period of incompetence and blinkered thinking on the part of the organization, the idea of needing to defend them against much poorly articulated but justified frustration becomes that much more silly.
I don't think he rails against criticism or frustration. HE rails against what has become pretty much a fanatical, near religious, prejudice.
That's an opinion that issues from a different baseline assessment of how badly the organization has fucked up and what your tolerance for incompetence is/what you think incompetence is.
I don't think it's necessary to have that discussion because it's tired and we both have better things to do. I'm just noting that the "reasonable police" on the board, which is the role FMiC largely casts himself in whether he says so or not, are just as narrow-minded as the people they criticize.
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I think contrary to the popular opinion shared among you and your constituents, I think there is a very good chance Eli is not only on the roster next year, but is the starter week 1.
Won't be surprised either way. But I know you will be.
That's one thing I can agree with you on. I think there is a pretty good chance Eli is the starter here week 1 next year. Much higher than people realize.
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In comment 14175926 Britt in VA said:
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I think contrary to the popular opinion shared among you and your constituents, I think there is a very good chance Eli is not only on the roster next year, but is the starter week 1.
Won't be surprised either way. But I know you will be.
That's one thing I can agree with you on. I think there is a pretty good chance Eli is the starter here week 1 next year. Much higher than people realize.
the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result
We keep reading your posts.
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In comment 14176059 Greg from LI said:
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Important context
Some things are better some things aren't as good.
c'mon ...Greg isn't going out on a limb here. The giants had to contend with the dynasties of the skins and niners not to mention a very good Bears team. Perennial powerhouses like them don't exist anymore
No, those pre-salary cap teams were awesome. But, there wasn't a lot of balance in the NFL back then. Teams were either great or they sucked. It's hard to say which era is tougher to win in. There's more balance now, but the best teams today are not as good as the best teams back in the 80s.
Tough to compare eras for many reasons.
I liked the brand of football from that era a lot more than the football from this era, but I understand the rule changes were made for the long term health of the players and of the game.
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In comment 14176149 Tesla said:
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In comment 14175926 Britt in VA said:
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I think contrary to the popular opinion shared among you and your constituents, I think there is a very good chance Eli is not only on the roster next year, but is the starter week 1.
Won't be surprised either way. But I know you will be.
That's one thing I can agree with you on. I think there is a pretty good chance Eli is the starter here week 1 next year. Much higher than people realize.
the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result
You know it.
We keep reading your posts.
This is exactly what I am talking about. If you disagree with Les, fine but the constant name calling and shitting on other posters is destroying the integrity of this site. I have been saying this since last year when myself, googs, hassan etc. were getting crushed on here for wanting to move on from Manning. It is absolutely ridiculous.
This is exactly what I am talking about. If you disagree with Les, fine but the constant name calling and shitting on other posters is destroying the integrity of this site. I have been saying this since last year when myself, googs, hassan etc. were getting crushed on here for wanting to move on from Manning. It is absolutely ridiculous.
Oh boo friggity hoo. I dont hear you sticking up for the people who get continually attacked for sticking up for Eli..... I guess you approve when Les calls people fanboys, Cult of Eli, or Eli-lovers.
I think Britt and I have been called more names than anyone else on this site combined.... funny you dont say anything then, right?
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This is exactly what I am talking about. If you disagree with Les, fine but the constant name calling and shitting on other posters is destroying the integrity of this site. I have been saying this since last year when myself, googs, hassan etc. were getting crushed on here for wanting to move on from Manning. It is absolutely ridiculous.
Oh boo friggity hoo. I dont hear you sticking up for the people who get continually attacked for sticking up for Eli..... I guess you approve when Les calls people fanboys, Cult of Eli, or Eli-lovers.
I think Britt and I have been called more names than anyone else on this site combined.... funny you dont say anything then, right?
That's such horseshit. I completely disagree with your views on Eli, but I have never once attacked your character. I even said to Britt in this thread that I think he is a valuable poster. But I sure as shit have seen you personally attack Les and other posters that dont praise Eli.
That's such horseshit. I completely disagree with your views on Eli, but I have never once attacked your character. I even said to Britt in this thread that I think he is a valuable poster. But I sure as shit have seen you personally attack Les and other posters that dont praise Eli.
1. Relax. I wasnt accusing you. I was stating BBI as a whole.
2. You never saw Les attack people by calling them fanboys or use the phrase cult of Eli? That tells me you never read a Les post before in your life.
You cant play the pity card because people here are attacking you when you dont say anything about others attacking people with the opposite viewpoint.
And you're right... people have NEVER attacked me for my views on Eli. You sure you want to go down that road?
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This is exactly what I am talking about. If you disagree with Les, fine but the constant name calling and shitting on other posters is destroying the integrity of this site. I have been saying this since last year when myself, googs, hassan etc. were getting crushed on here for wanting to move on from Manning. It is absolutely ridiculous.
Oh boo friggity hoo. I dont hear you sticking up for the people who get continually attacked for sticking up for Eli..... I guess you approve when Les calls people fanboys, Cult of Eli, or Eli-lovers.
I think Britt and I have been called more names than anyone else on this site combined.... funny you don't say anything then, right?
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In comment 14175926 Britt in VA said:
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I think contrary to the popular opinion shared among you and your constituents, I think there is a very good chance Eli is not only on the roster next year, but is the starter week 1.
Won't be surprised either way. But I know you will be.
That's one thing I can agree with you on. I think there is a pretty good chance Eli is the starter here week 1 next year. Much higher than people realize.
the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result
Les - JonC mentioned this a few months ago as something sort of swirling in the halls of Jints Central. The more of these decent games that Eli plays the more this will have substance. The spell that Eli has on this organization is now in the preposterous zone..
Both are now tarring and feathering each other. Not very healthy or good behavior.
there is no need to bitch about him after a win. there is no need also to gloat excessively about any small acheivement of his.
Just petty and small minded at this point both ways.
NYG07, get over it, its not always about being right. Don't get me wrong, Im no big fan of several of the folks that defend Eli excessively but you are going down a bad rabbit hole.
FMIC, I really think you have been a very strong poster since the inception of the site (and while I havent met you from my inferrence you are 'good people') but you need to really just cut out some of the tone too, I really dont see why people venting has become so problematic for you or the zest with which you are attacking others and defending NYG.
As opposed to you having always been an awful poster?
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you guys are great.
If we lost, you'd probably shit on Eli for leaving too much time on the clock.
We won, so Eli still has to get shit on.
It is unbelievable.
We convert the majority of our 3rd downs, but Eli still was making terrible decisions. OK.
LOL
The best is the guy claiming we check downed too much
I think the best is crafting a narrative out of an incorrect statement and treating it as fact. That's your favorite, isn't it MG? Now you get to do it yourself!
These Eli topics are great and a classic example. The Eli Army gets insulted so they send their "bat signal" to FMiC. He then swoops in and verbally pulverizes the the violator(s).
I must say I find it great theater... ;)
Look at Stain in LA coming to give Eli the kiss of death. Sorry, Eliphiles - Stain's record here is incontrovertible.
Lol that is cute Montana. I dont even hate you as a poster. I hope that sarcastic post made you feel better about yourself.
Oh, please. It's a term of endearment...
Stop trying to sugarcoat that miserable of a view that we need to tank with 7 games left.
Or... OR... people realize that with an aging QB who is clearly in decline and just seven weeks away from his 38th birthday, it's prudent to look to the future. I know that concept might be lost on you if you think that's a "weak argument." It's actually the only certainty in the whole debate - Eli is old and getting older. Unless you prefer a protracted tank period over several years, or favor giving up a ton of draft capital in a future year, you should absolutely be hoping to find Eli's successor in a year when we suck out loud anyway.
That's not meant to hurt your feelings or offend your mancrush.
Absolutely. That's a great one. I love Jints Central.
NYG07, get over it, its not always about being right. Don't get me wrong, Im no big fan of several of the folks that defend Eli excessively but you are going down a bad rabbit hole.
You are right. Thanks for being the voice of reason. I am just tired of the personal attacks. We all have a right to our own opinions. Yet I constantly see posters getting ganged up on. I have even seen Eric get attacked recently. Just completely out of line.
But the name calling is going both ways. This is beyond ridiculous at this point.
I wont get into the many claims made by some around his market and his trade value and other items discussed last year.
I think he means Sy...
Like the thread you started after the Eagles game last season?
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of how they post, and how it comes across to others.
Like the thread you started after the Eagles game last season?
Well I did say "everyone" didn't I?
It's funny you mention that thread, as that thread in particular was the one where I said it proved he could still play at a high level about a month before Gettleman cited that exact game as one where it appeared Manning could still play.
And they are two very different things.
I read the tea leaves and told you what I thought the organization would do based on what I saw. Truthfully, there was little emotion to it other than hoping that if they went that way it was successful.
Then there is saying what you think should happen, regardless of what all the signs are telling you.
Davis Webb WILL start the rest of the season.
The Giants WILL take a QB at 2.
The Giants WILL cut Eli/trade/take paycut this offseason.
It's just not exactly logical. It's happening again this year.
"Eli WILL be cut this offseason". This WILL be Eli's last game as a Giant." "Lauletta WILL start after the bye."
You sure?
It's funny you mention that thread, as that thread in particular was the one where I said it proved he could still play at a high level about a month before Gettleman cited that exact game as one where it appeared Manning could still play.
You do realize that sentence is a target rich environmental for a lot of jokes...right?
; )
Its not worth getting into. I sincerely hope Eli goes on a tear and wins out this season. I have no harbored agenda against him, and I hope he has more left than what it seems, but with protection he continued to struggle to move the ball last night and was ok but hardly stellar. Not a confidence inspiring game.
This looks like a 4-5 win team.
And they are two very different things.
I read the tea leaves and told you what I thought the organization would do based on what I saw. Truthfully, there was little emotion to it other than hoping that if they went that way it was successful.
Then there is saying what you think should happen, regardless of what all the signs are telling you.
Davis Webb WILL start the rest of the season.
The Giants WILL take a QB at 2.
The Giants WILL cut Eli/trade/take paycut this offseason.
It's just not exactly logical. It's happening again this year.
"Eli WILL be cut this offseason". This WILL be Eli's last game as a Giant." "Lauletta WILL start after the bye."
You sure?
Are you done Britt? We've seen the pattern before. Eli played pretty well this week (and that's fine--Eli's my favorite Giant of all time) and this might license a certain level of self satisfaction on your part.
He has, for the most part, been below average for a long time now. If sample size has any significance, then over the next few weeks he will very likely return to being below average. Should that happen you'll take the opposite tack and claim those critiquing Eli are gloating. Either way, you get to have the high ground.
It's tired.
bw in dc : 2:06 pm : link : reply
has sort of evolved into this ombudsman for BBI and Jints Central. It's fascinating, and he seems to really embrace the role...
These Eli topics are great and a classic example. The Eli Army gets insulted so they send their "bat signal" to FMiC. He then swoops in and verbally pulverizes the the violator(s).
I must say I find it great theater... ;)
I don't really embrace anything nor feel like an obudsman. If I find something particularly moronic or insulting I call it out. No need for a bat signal.
Here's the thing I look at - we have a QB who helped deliver 2 SB's to us. He shouldn't be immune from criticism, but he certainly should be immune from personal attacks.
Just like the organization that has delivered a SB in every decade since 1980 began should be immune from the ridiculous characterization that it is a bumbling one with a derisive moniker like "Jints Central".
to me, it is telling what type of fan will say these types of things.
I'm pretty self aware on this board. I call out what I perceive to be moronic statements, and try to keep the ones I utter to a minimum. Generally I'm not an asshole off the board and I'm not an asshole to the vast majority of posters who aren't ignorant, but my take has stayed pretty consistent throughout my time here.
I have little respect for people who shit on the very people they are supposedly wishing well of. I would not call myself an Eli apologist, but I will not denigrate any player who delivers entertainment. That's why I have conflicts here - because there are a lot of schmucks who don't really care what they say about people playing for or running the organization. They feel entitled to spew nonsense.
They are neither entitled to do so nor is it acceptable.
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FMiC...
bw in dc : 2:06 pm : link : reply
has sort of evolved into this ombudsman for BBI and Jints Central. It's fascinating, and he seems to really embrace the role...
These Eli topics are great and a classic example. The Eli Army gets insulted so they send their "bat signal" to FMiC. He then swoops in and verbally pulverizes the the violator(s).
I must say I find it great theater... ;)
I don't really embrace anything nor feel like an obudsman. If I find something particularly moronic or insulting I call it out. No need for a bat signal.
Here's the thing I look at - we have a QB who helped deliver 2 SB's to us. He shouldn't be immune from criticism, but he certainly should be immune from personal attacks.
Just like the organization that has delivered a SB in every decade since 1980 began should be immune from the ridiculous characterization that it is a bumbling one with a derisive moniker like "Jints Central".
to me, it is telling what type of fan will say these types of things.
I'm pretty self aware on this board. I call out what I perceive to be moronic statements, and try to keep the ones I utter to a minimum. Generally I'm not an asshole off the board and I'm not an asshole to the vast majority of posters who aren't ignorant, but my take has stayed pretty consistent throughout my time here.
I have little respect for people who shit on the very people they are supposedly wishing well of. I would not call myself an Eli apologist, but I will not denigrate any player who delivers entertainment. That's why I have conflicts here - because there are a lot of schmucks who don't really care what they say about people playing for or running the organization. They feel entitled to spew nonsense.
They are neither entitled to do so nor is it acceptable.
None of this addresses the underlying critique: i.e. your feeling that you have some special access to what is appropriate or not about the sort of criticism an organization deserves.
When fan opinion is this polarized, it suggests that you're not arguing from a consensus on norms.
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In comment 14176601 Britt in VA said:
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of how they post, and how it comes across to others.
Like the thread you started after the Eagles game last season?
Well I did say "everyone" didn't I?
It's funny you mention that thread, as that thread in particular was the one where I said it proved he could still play at a high level about a month before Gettleman cited that exact game as one where it appeared Manning could still play.
At least you were wrong for free. Gettleman got paid to be completely off the mark. It's looking more and more like the supposed film junkie only watched film of one game before his grand QB declaration.
When fan opinion is this polarized, it suggests that you're not arguing from a consensus on norms.
The underlying critique isn't based on what level of critique an organization deserves, it is based on how it is presented.
I'll give an example - JonC has been critical many times of the team. But he states it in terms that are reasonable and measured. Do I rip into him? If Sy points out a negative, am I ripping him?
When people come on after a win and act like Eli Manning somehow shat in their non-chocolate up until then Wheaties, do I rip into them - of course.
There's a way to criticize the players and organization for a team that you supposedly root for reasonably and there's a way to do it not reasonably. If you find me ripping the former, by all means - I'm open for criticism.
Did I say that? Please quote me, if so.
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good in the NFL. The high-horse act is amusing as hell.
Did I say that? Please quote me, if so.
Are you serious?
Clearly, I'm not going back to look in threads with hundreds of posts in them.
You forget the whole "these guys didn't play in a pro-style offense in college!" stuff?
Okay.
Scary stuff. I'm petrified.
'They're all flawed prospects.' 'They didn't play in a pro-style offense.' Blah, blah, blah.
Dave in Hoboken : 4:59 pm : link : reply
Mr. forever angry is coming at me now.
Scary stuff. I'm petrified.
So because I think you are a moron, I'm "Mr. forever angry", but you can spend most of your posts tearing apart Eli and the organization and you aren't??
It is much more logical to think you are a fuckstick than to think Eli is.
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Ruh-roh,
Dave in Hoboken : 4:59 pm : link : reply
Mr. forever angry is coming at me now.
Scary stuff. I'm petrified.
So because I think you are a moron, I'm "Mr. forever angry", but you can spend most of your posts tearing apart Eli and the organization and you aren't??
It is much more logical to think you are a fuckstick than to think Eli is.
Not at all. You're forever angry because 99% of your posts are you coming off like a completely unhinged, certifiable, mental patient.
And what you call 'tearing apart' is what most people call honesty. I said Eli played well last night. Didn't bash him, or any of the other players, either for last night's performance. Not sure what else one can expect after beating a 2-7 team with a 3rd string QB playing for them. A win is a win, and we won. No bashing from me today.
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I was blasted last night and for the second week in a row, I mistakenly called him a Dupe. The man has owned me 2 weeks straight now and my humbled ass apologizes
Lol that is cute Montana. I dont even hate you as a poster. I hope that sarcastic post made you feel better about yourself.
Dude, I was being 100% serious. I was an idiot for calling you that once again and was apologizing for it
It's not disrespect, it's not degration -- it's criticism of his play and his mistakes among fans.
If the critique is poorly formed or inaccurate, go for it. But creating a value proposition of someone's "fandom" and "respect" for Eli -- that's funny.
I miss Randy. He'd kicked that stuff right in the butt.
That's what I see, the hyperbole drives a lot of the other responses.
Quite entertaining though. (Especially the ape fight at the end ;>)
This is exactly what I am talking about. If you disagree with Les, fine but the constant name calling and shitting on other posters is destroying the integrity of this site. I have been saying this since last year when myself, googs, hassan etc. were getting crushed on here for wanting to move on from Manning. It is absolutely ridiculous.
I am not sure I recall getting "crushed" NYG07 or anything close to that quite frankly. Some of us gave some tough love opinions and should realize those will often beget strong reactions as fair game. The Eli-debates have actually seemed fairly straightforward to me as I think too many on the site struggle to separate their fandom from their objectivity. The berating of posters with anything more than a sarcastic jab really just lets you know how entrenched some take their agendas.
But putting aside some of the hitler-youth posters that reside on BBI to attack in their own ways, I typically find the majority of debates and even heated-arguments topical if not fully entertaining.
Next May I will absolutely think back as to how valueless it was to win last night. But then again, it was sure nice to win again last night...
There are some snide old grumps who cant be civil with anyone at all but those are hardly very bothersome.