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NFT: Cano deal almost final. Waiting on physical

ZGiants98 : 12/1/2018 8:54 pm
Hctor Gmez
@hgomez27
BREAKING NEWS: According to a Report by Dominican Sportscaster @TenchyRodEspn Robinson Cano has been notified and called to the USA by his agent, and is just awaiting a physical exam to make his trade to the @mets official.#ZDigital #ZDeportes@z101digital @ZDeportes
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Love it!  
ZGiants98 : 12/1/2018 8:57 pm : link
n Morosi

@jonmorosi
Robinson Cano trade to #Mets is agreed upon pending physical, according to this tweet by @TenchyRodEspn. Excellent work by @hgomez27 in his reporting as well. @MLBNetwork @MLB
Do Mets fans really like this deal  
robbieballs2003 : 12/1/2018 8:58 pm : link
?
RE: Do Mets fans really like this deal  
ZGiants98 : 12/1/2018 8:59 pm : link
In comment 14200081 robbieballs2003 said:
Quote:
?


Absolutely. There's about 20 pages to go through if you feel like understanding why.

We just added two all-stars and our payroll for 2019 actually went down.
No, not a fan  
pjcas18 : 12/1/2018 9:02 pm : link
not a great trade, but need to wait and see what other moves the Mets make before I am negative about the team for 2019.

Mets should have had leverage here and people will say prospects are prospects, but when you take the M's salary dump (Cano) and only get a closer out of it, you should not give up this much in terms of prospects - especially and this is the key point, there are many bullpen options available in free agency.

I hope Cano fails his physical.
I actually like it from an economic standpoint  
UConn4523 : 12/1/2018 9:03 pm : link
but it wont take long for everyone to hate Cano after 1 too many slow trots to first. They just need a few solid years out of him, but Id be concerned about the need for PEDs to stay healthy.
RE: No, not a fan  
robbieballs2003 : 12/1/2018 9:04 pm : link
In comment 14200087 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
not a great trade, but need to wait and see what other moves the Mets make before I am negative about the team for 2019.

Mets should have had leverage here and people will say prospects are prospects, but when you take the M's salary dump (Cano) and only get a closer out of it, you should not give up this much in terms of prospects - especially and this is the key point, there are many bullpen options available in free agency.

I hope Cano fails his physical.


That is my take as well especially when there are closers in FA that can be had.
The closer better be Rivera-like  
GiantGolfer : 12/1/2018 9:05 pm : link
taking on Cano minus PEDs will be brutal.
For those not following along  
ZGiants98 : 12/1/2018 9:06 pm : link
The deal basically boils down to

Cano for 20-ish million, Bruce, Swarzak (net 50 million or so back) leaving 60 million on the Cano deal over 60 years. Steamer has Cano worth over 20 million alone next year.

The next part is Edwin Diaz, the best closer in baseball last year who's 24 and under control for 4 more years, for Kelenic, Dunn, and Bautista. Kelenic and Dunn were rated the Mets 4th and 5th best prospects by BA a few days ago... Bautista is a lottery ticket reliever.

Because of the bad contracts going the other way, payroll actually gets lowered and Mets can still spend spend spend.
That's 5 years for Cano!  
ZGiants98 : 12/1/2018 9:07 pm : link
Not 60!
RE: RE: Do Mets fans really like this deal  
Big Blue Hokie : 12/1/2018 9:11 pm : link
In comment 14200083 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
In comment 14200081 robbieballs2003 said:


Quote:


?



Absolutely. There's about 20 pages to go through if you feel like understanding why.

We just added two all-stars and our payroll for 2019 actually went down.


Yeah I like it too. Prospects are such a gamble. It stings including him but he could be the next Lastings Millege or Fernando Martinez.

As longer as we take the money and get another impact player, it 100% makes sense.
RE: RE: RE: Do Mets fans really like this deal  
ZGiants98 : 12/1/2018 9:13 pm : link
In comment 14200102 Big Blue Hokie said:
Quote:
In comment 14200083 ZGiants98 said:


Quote:


In comment 14200081 robbieballs2003 said:


Quote:


?



Absolutely. There's about 20 pages to go through if you feel like understanding why.

We just added two all-stars and our payroll for 2019 actually went down.



Yeah I like it too. Prospects are such a gamble. It stings including him but he could be the next Lastings Millege or Fernando Martinez.

As longer as we take the money and get another impact player, it 100% makes sense.


SO many people think we can just sign Kimbrel for 100 million and an IF upgrade without giving up prospects. The problem with that is you just added 30+ million to the payroll and your offseason is likely done or your trading Syndergaard for pieces. Fuck that. This is much better.
RE: For those not following along  
Eman11 : 12/1/2018 9:13 pm : link
In comment 14200093 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
The deal basically boils down to

Cano for 20-ish million, Bruce, Swarzak (net 50 million or so back) leaving 60 million on the Cano deal over 60 years. Steamer has Cano worth over 20 million alone next year.

The next part is Edwin Diaz, the best closer in baseball last year who's 24 and under control for 4 more years, for Kelenic, Dunn, and Bautista. Kelenic and Dunn were rated the Mets 4th and 5th best prospects by BA a few days ago... Bautista is a lottery ticket reliever.

Because of the bad contracts going the other way, payroll actually gets lowered and Mets can still spend spend spend.


Sure they could spend spend spend but the question like always is will they?
Not Cano related but hope it's true...  
ZGiants98 : 12/1/2018 9:14 pm : link
Jeremy Rinehart
@jeremymrinehart
Allegedly, Bryce Harper told a friend he doesn't want to live in Philadelphia. The real question is, why would anyone want to live in Philadelphia?
RE: RE: For those not following along  
ZGiants98 : 12/1/2018 9:14 pm : link
In comment 14200107 Eman11 said:
Quote:
In comment 14200093 ZGiants98 said:


Quote:


The deal basically boils down to

Cano for 20-ish million, Bruce, Swarzak (net 50 million or so back) leaving 60 million on the Cano deal over 60 years. Steamer has Cano worth over 20 million alone next year.

The next part is Edwin Diaz, the best closer in baseball last year who's 24 and under control for 4 more years, for Kelenic, Dunn, and Bautista. Kelenic and Dunn were rated the Mets 4th and 5th best prospects by BA a few days ago... Bautista is a lottery ticket reliever.

Because of the bad contracts going the other way, payroll actually gets lowered and Mets can still spend spend spend.



Sure they could spend spend spend but the question like always is will they?


Of course they will. You dont do this deal and then call it. Sit back and enjoy the ride.
its a fair deal  
CGiants07 : 12/1/2018 9:15 pm : link
would i have liked to keep klenic sure but he is a long way off from mjaor leagues and you have to give to get cost controlled good young players at mlb level
RE: RE: RE: For those not following along  
Eman11 : 12/1/2018 9:18 pm : link
In comment 14200109 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
In comment 14200107 Eman11 said:


Quote:


In comment 14200093 ZGiants98 said:


Quote:


The deal basically boils down to

Cano for 20-ish million, Bruce, Swarzak (net 50 million or so back) leaving 60 million on the Cano deal over 60 years. Steamer has Cano worth over 20 million alone next year.

The next part is Edwin Diaz, the best closer in baseball last year who's 24 and under control for 4 more years, for Kelenic, Dunn, and Bautista. Kelenic and Dunn were rated the Mets 4th and 5th best prospects by BA a few days ago... Bautista is a lottery ticket reliever.

Because of the bad contracts going the other way, payroll actually gets lowered and Mets can still spend spend spend.



Sure they could spend spend spend but the question like always is will they?



Of course they will. You dont do this deal and then call it. Sit back and enjoy the ride.


Well full disclosure I'm not a Mets fan but have close family and friends who are. Not a Mets hater either, just interested and hope for my family and friends sake, the Mets do spend.

Also on Cano, I'm pretty sure he still has 120 mil left on his deal, not 110. Not a big deal but it's another two mil a year over the five.
If they continue to build for next season  
Chris684 : 12/1/2018 9:19 pm : link
And (God forbid) spend money on additional relievers, a catcher, or dare I say Bryce Harper, I will like this move.

If they trade Thor I will be pissed and if they trade Thor for a less than no brained, slam dunk package I will be livid.

So TBD for me. I can see the pros and cons to the move.
The key is to see what the Mets  
Chris L. : 12/1/2018 9:20 pm : link
do next. So far its more of the same from dear ol Fred. Giving up future assets for aging veterans and cost controlled players so that payroll can be kept in line. I will change my mind and be on board if they add additional quality over quantity. Unfortunately, I expect them to spend $25 million on 5 players rather than on one or two players who could really elevate this team. At least small market teams like the Marlins would go all in once and a while. The Mets are in the biggest market in the world, have three great cost controlled starting pitchers and I have been conditioned to fully expect them to add a number of players NONE of whom will be difference makers. That makes us worse than the Marlins because we don't even go for it when we have the opportunity to and we are in the biggest market in the world. Now go out and give Bryce Harper a contract and I will gladly say I was wrong. Ball is in your court Fred Wilpon!
RE: RE: RE: RE: For those not following along  
ZGiants98 : 12/1/2018 9:21 pm : link
In comment 14200113 Eman11 said:
Quote:
In comment 14200109 ZGiants98 said:


Quote:


In comment 14200107 Eman11 said:


Quote:


In comment 14200093 ZGiants98 said:


Quote:


The deal basically boils down to

Cano for 20-ish million, Bruce, Swarzak (net 50 million or so back) leaving 60 million on the Cano deal over 60 years. Steamer has Cano worth over 20 million alone next year.

The next part is Edwin Diaz, the best closer in baseball last year who's 24 and under control for 4 more years, for Kelenic, Dunn, and Bautista. Kelenic and Dunn were rated the Mets 4th and 5th best prospects by BA a few days ago... Bautista is a lottery ticket reliever.

Because of the bad contracts going the other way, payroll actually gets lowered and Mets can still spend spend spend.



Sure they could spend spend spend but the question like always is will they?



Of course they will. You dont do this deal and then call it. Sit back and enjoy the ride.



Well full disclosure I'm not a Mets fan but have close family and friends who are. Not a Mets hater either, just interested and hope for my family and friends sake, the Mets do spend.

Also on Cano, I'm pretty sure he still has 120 mil left on his deal, not 110. Not a big deal but it's another two mil a year over the five.


Final numbers haven't been released but most reports are saying there will be about a 60 million net when it's done. It really doesnt matter. The Mets dont have a single contract on the books passed 2020. They can absorb it easily.
Subway Series  
shyster : 12/1/2018 9:21 pm : link
Cano fan, glad he's back.
The trade is made worse  
pjcas18 : 12/1/2018 9:24 pm : link
because OF is such a positional black hole for the Mets in terms of depth. Conforto and Nimmo are good, but that's it. at almost any level for the Mets.

middle infielders and starting pitching are the strengths.

Trading a different prospect from Kelenic would have made a better trade for the Mets.
RE: The trade is made worse  
ZGiants98 : 12/1/2018 9:27 pm : link
In comment 14200121 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
because OF is such a positional black hole for the Mets in terms of depth. Conforto and Nimmo are good, but that's it. at almost any level for the Mets.

middle infielders and starting pitching are the strengths.

Trading a different prospect from Kelenic would have made a better trade for the Mets.


I jut said this in the other thread but I seem to remember you saying you would be devastated if it was Gimenez over Kelenic. Apparently the Mets were given the option to protect two prospects and they chose Alonso and Gimenez. You're right that there is no depth but with Bruce gone you can expect another addition and Conforto and Nimmo are young and under control for the foreseeable future. Sign Harper and nobody is going to care about our OF depth.
.  
ZGiants98 : 12/1/2018 9:28 pm : link
Fail it  
Rflairr : 12/1/2018 9:28 pm : link
Save the Mets from themselves
I wouldn't have been devastated if it was Gimenez  
pjcas18 : 12/1/2018 9:31 pm : link
in fact I would have preferred any prospect in the system over Kelenic.

Alonso is the one I'd have been pushing, but it sounds like from capone the league feels the same way about Alonso as I do.

and to be clear for some perspective, I'm not devastated at all.

this is just not a trade I would have made.

from the sounds of it the M's were desperate to get rid of Cano's contract, losing 2 of your top 5 prospects, to take that contract and get a closer doesn't seem like desperate to me.
RE: Not Cano related but hope it's true...  
CGiants07 : 12/1/2018 9:35 pm : link
In comment 14200108 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
Jeremy Rinehart
@jeremymrinehart
Allegedly, Bryce Harper told a friend he doesn't want to live in Philadelphia. The real question is, why would anyone want to live in Philadelphia?


its always sunny in philadelphia unless your santa?
As much as Im saying I love it I think its fair actually  
ZGiants98 : 12/1/2018 9:35 pm : link
Helps the Mets win now which is important while our rotation is still together

Helps the Mariners, who are blowing it up, win later. Kelenic is a legit prospect. No denying that.

I dont think any Mets fan truly cares about the money, Dunn, or Bautista though. Not if they are honest.

What stings is basically losing Kelenic for an elite closer and Cano but what do people really expect Diaz was going to cost?

its definitely fair.
I hate the deal  
Archer : 12/1/2018 9:35 pm : link
The Mets are mortgaging their future to obtain Diaz

Lets see how this plays out. I fear that the Mets will be mediocre and that they will be hamstrung by Cano and his contract

And to make matters worse Kelenic and Dunn will be plus players

The Mets are not the Yankees they do not throw money after their mistakes, quite the contrary they use bad economics as an excuse to spend money

If this fails you can expect at least 5 years of bad baseball

Why cant the Mets build a team around young players and supplement with quality free agents?

This trade is about how to make it appear that the Mets are actually spending money to improve the team

Trade Grade  
Steve in South Jersey : 12/1/2018 9:38 pm : link
from the Athletic is a C for the Mets


Link - ( New Window )
RE: I hate the deal  
ZGiants98 : 12/1/2018 9:38 pm : link
In comment 14200135 Archer said:
Quote:
The Mets are mortgaging their future to obtain Diaz

Lets see how this plays out. I fear that the Mets will be mediocre and that they will be hamstrung by Cano and his contract

And to make matters worse Kelenic and Dunn will be plus players

The Mets are not the Yankees they do not throw money after their mistakes, quite the contrary they use bad economics as an excuse to spend money

If this fails you can expect at least 5 years of bad baseball

Why cant the Mets build a team around young players and supplement with quality free agents?

This trade is about how to make it appear that the Mets are actually spending money to improve the team


Who says they arent?? The Mets payroll was 160 million last year and the Wilpons publicly said it was Sandy who chose not to spend more. They hire BVW and flat out tell him he can spend and go for it, or else he's never giving up his cushy job to come here. Last I checked, the Yankees are now trying to keep it under the luxury tax threshold. So assuming the Mets are truly going to spend more what's the difference between that and around 200 million? Not a whole lot. The time is now. Im sick of waiting.
if the Mets offseason is done  
ZGiants98 : 12/1/2018 9:40 pm : link
and they dont add more payroll I will eat my hat.
this puts a lot of pressure on BVW  
pjcas18 : 12/1/2018 9:40 pm : link
and maybe that's fine, all GM's have pressure.

If the Mets win, and win soon, the guy is a hero.

If they don't and it gets bad like the past few seasons, it will get really ugly, really quickly for Brodie.
RE: Trade Grade  
Big Blue Hokie : 12/1/2018 9:41 pm : link
In comment 14200136 Steve in South Jersey said:
Quote:
from the Athletic is a C for the Mets
Link - ( New Window )


Bowden is a hack
Not really...  
ZGiants98 : 12/1/2018 9:42 pm : link
With Diaz under control for 4 more years, the worst thing that could happen is he trades him to another contender for a haul back and we are right back where we started. A lot of time to capitalize on Diaz.

I really cant see any way this deal could blow up in their face unless Diaz gets Tommy John in ST and never pitches again (knock on wood).
Sign Pollock and they have a few years to add OF depth in system  
Eric on Li : 12/1/2018 9:43 pm : link
but I agree, dealing Kelenic sucks. I'm on record as not being a fan of the deal because I think the asset usage was poor. I'd have just signed Familia and Pollock and kept Kelenic. Swapped Bruce for someone else's bad contract, kept Mcneil at 2nd.

Now all that said and economics aside, I do like both of the players they brought back a lot. Cano is the all around hitter they haven't had since pre-injury Wright. At least until they catch his new peds. Diaz' strikeout numbers are other wordly. So cross our fingers and hope for the best. This team is built around 2 elite SP and pitchers break so may as well take our best shot while they are healthy. Just don't half ass it. Go out and sign 3-4 more good free agents. A lot of them can help and won't break the bank - like Pollock, Miller, Grandal, Familia, Ramos, Gio, Robertson, Soria, etc.
RE: this puts a lot of pressure on BVW  
Big Blue Hokie : 12/1/2018 9:43 pm : link
In comment 14200140 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
and maybe that's fine, all GM's have pressure.

If the Mets win, and win soon, the guy is a hero.

If they don't and it gets bad like the past few seasons, it will get really ugly, really quickly for Brodie.


Why because we traded away one player who COULD be an impact 4 years from now?
Its a good trade..  
Sean : 12/1/2018 9:45 pm : link
We are unloading Bruce & Swarzak, that shouldnt be dismissed. Cano is an upgrade a 2B, hopefully McNeil slides over to 3B. Call up Alonso & we have a very solid INF. Diaz speaks for itself.

I hate losing Kelenic, but its not like the Mets have a long history of prospects panning out. At 19, hes a long way off & the Mets are a win now team. Good start to the offseason.
RE: Its a good trade..  
ZGiants98 : 12/1/2018 9:46 pm : link
In comment 14200150 Sean said:
Quote:
We are unloading Bruce & Swarzak, that shouldnt be dismissed. Cano is an upgrade a 2B, hopefully McNeil slides over to 3B. Call up Alonso & we have a very solid INF. Diaz speaks for itself.

I hate losing Kelenic, but its not like the Mets have a long history of prospects panning out. At 19, hes a long way off & the Mets are a win now team. Good start to the offseason.


+1000
.  
KevinBBWC : 12/1/2018 9:47 pm : link

Jon Heyman
‏Verified account @JonHeyman
22s22 seconds ago

Mariners send $20M to mets to complete deal
What Happened with Flores?  
Samiam : 12/1/2018 9:47 pm : link
Why did they outright him? Did he have no value to the team?
RE: .  
ZGiants98 : 12/1/2018 9:47 pm : link
In comment 14200153 KevinBBWC said:
Quote:

Jon Heyman
‏Verified account @JonHeyman
22s22 seconds ago

Mariners send $20M to mets to complete deal


Ok. So what we thought...
RE: Its a good trade..  
Big Blue Hokie : 12/1/2018 9:48 pm : link
In comment 14200150 Sean said:
Quote:
We are unloading Bruce & Swarzak, that shouldnt be dismissed. Cano is an upgrade a 2B, hopefully McNeil slides over to 3B. Call up Alonso & we have a very solid INF. Diaz speaks for itself.

I hate losing Kelenic, but its not like the Mets have a long history of prospects panning out. At 19, hes a long way off & the Mets are a win now team. Good start to the offseason.


Agree . I dont understand the idea of trading Thor so I hope that isnt the next move. Hope for Harper but more realistic is Ramos and Pollack
RE: What Happened with Flores?  
ZGiants98 : 12/1/2018 9:48 pm : link
In comment 14200155 Samiam said:
Quote:
Why did they outright him? Did he have no value to the team?


too expensive and one dimensional. He would have been backup 1B and we can do that with TJ Rivera/Dom Smith for much cheaper.
It could blow up like this  
pjcas18 : 12/1/2018 9:48 pm : link
Cano plays like a 36 year old coming off a PED assisted career, Diaz shows why relievers are so fungible and is ok, but Familia-like (which is good, and at times great, but not great enough).

Combined with those two simply under-performing, the Mets as a team just don't play well and are not a playoff team, once again being out of the contention by the trade deadline (just for example).

Meanwhile, in two years Kelenic is Mookie Betts 2.0, and the Mets can't make the moves they want because they're paying an albatross Robbie Cano to not contribute this trade will look awful. And I agree I don't care about Dunn or Bautista so I won't be disingenuous and claim any success they have will bother me.

Of course though, like I said, win and all is forgotten, Brodie is a genius with a set of brass balls making a trade like this as his first major league transaction.

but if you don't think this can blow up, you are kidding yourself.
RE: .  
Rflairr : 12/1/2018 9:48 pm : link
In comment 14200153 KevinBBWC said:
Quote:

Jon Heyman
‏Verified account @JonHeyman
22s22 seconds ago

Mariners send $20M to mets to complete deal


Thats all? Jeesh
Deal  
TyreeHelmet : 12/1/2018 9:49 pm : link
Ive fully come around on this deal. I really like it.

Now go do more. Sign Andrew Miller. Get a legit catcher. Go big game hunting.
RE: It could blow up like this  
ZGiants98 : 12/1/2018 9:52 pm : link
In comment 14200161 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
Cano plays like a 36 year old coming off a PED assisted career, Diaz shows why relievers are so fungible and is ok, but Familia-like (which is good, and at times great, but not great enough).

Combined with those two simply under-performing, the Mets as a team just don't play well and are not a playoff team, once again being out of the contention by the trade deadline (just for example).

Meanwhile, in two years Kelenic is Mookie Betts 2.0, and the Mets can't make the moves they want because they're paying an albatross Robbie Cano to not contribute this trade will look awful. And I agree I don't care about Dunn or Bautista so I won't be disingenuous and claim any success they have will bother me.

Of course though, like I said, win and all is forgotten, Brodie is a genius with a set of brass balls making a trade like this as his first major league transaction.

but if you don't think this can blow up, you are kidding yourself.


Ok ill take my chances Diaz will be good over the next few years over Kelenic being good in 3-4. And who cares if he turns into Trout? That's the risk. All teams trade prospects knowing they can become great. Doesnt matter one bit. His value is his value and thats a 50-100 overall prospect years away. Aka. Not a ton as of today.
RE: RE: .  
CGiants07 : 12/1/2018 9:53 pm : link
In comment 14200162 Rflairr said:
Quote:
In comment 14200153 KevinBBWC said:


Quote:



Jon Heyman
‏Verified account @JonHeyman
22s22 seconds ago

Mariners send $20M to mets to complete deal



Thats all? Jeesh


they unofficially absorbed 36 mil of bad deals that helps us for '19 in bruce and swarzak so its really 56 mil
Yes, all prospects  
pjcas18 : 12/1/2018 9:56 pm : link
are risky, and there is a litany of failed prospects in Mets lore.

but that next one can be "the" one.

You take the risk when the upside is so good it outweighs the risk.

I don't think Diaz is worth the risk when there were many free agent options out there.

that is my point.

And let's not lose sight of the fact we're all Mets fans (those of us who are Mets fans) and I think we all want this trade to work out and either turn the Mets into contenders or be a catalyst to some other moves that do.

I hope in September we're revisiting these discussions and laughing at me.

but as a Mets fan the way everything has blown up on us the past 30 years I have the right to be cynical.
Its just so typically Mets-ian  
gmenatlarge : 12/1/2018 9:58 pm : link
Signing an aging player coming off a Ped suspension, how soon before Cano gets hurt and starts with a bad attitude with zero hustle? As. For the rest cant you just see Kellenic and Dunn go in to be productive while Diaz has an off year as relievers often do.
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