Listening to the postgame on WFAN, a caller said something about Eli’s pic and Bob Pappa, kind of agitated, said it wasn’t Eli’s fault, that Toomer broke it down earlier in the broadcast and referred the caller to go back and listen. I can’t find that stream archived anywhere. Can someone who heard it summarize or post a link?
Apparently timing routes always have to be thrown no matter how the CB plays the route from the snap.
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Was awful. The route wasn't run clean but Fuller had the inside covered right away. Eli never should have thrown it there. Tired of the Eli apologists.
My god the sheer lack of any kind of understanding how a timing route works from you is really telling
How does a timing route change whether or not you should throw a slant when the defender is lined up inside and shows no urgency in his backpedal. I'm curious what your reasoning is here?
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In comment 14202855 ajr2456 said:
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In comment 14202832 montanagiant said:
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In comment 14202797 hitdog42 said:
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and the route wasn't run crisply-- looked more like a dummy route--- regardless the throw is awful and the poster noting Fuller jumping the route twice is correct in the sense that fuller knew where it was going and the risk reward on the throw was bad
The throw was right where the receiver was supposed to be. It's that same timing route that OBJ has hit on a few times. When he runs correctly he takes off like he is going deep which drives that DB back and then as he comes to his cut the ball is thrown so that the min he turns around it's there and he usually has some space to play with.
Because he failed to run off the DB and stopped at his cut it got jumped
If DB doesn’t get driven back, it’s because he’s read that it’s going to be a slant. Fuller was playing the slant from very early in the route.
LOL...Just stop already. You're not getting the fact that due to the way he ran that route the other aspects that make a timing pass work fail. Everything is predicated on OBJ running the route correctly or it doesn't work.
I know you earnestly want to blame Eli but you looking silly at this point
Whatever you say. Eli has never thrown an interception that wasn’t the WRs fault I forgot.
Both things can be true that the route wasn’t run well and the ball shouldn’t have been thrown because Fuller had the inside cut of let early.
There you go, you know you don't have shit for any kind of an argument so you decide to play the strawman game of claiming I'm saying it's never Eli's fault. Meanwhile you don't even comprehend what proper route running is
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In comment 14202871 Marty866b said:
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Was awful. The route wasn't run clean but Fuller had the inside covered right away. Eli never should have thrown it there. Tired of the Eli apologists.
Again, it's a timing route. Eli is throwing to a spot, and he is expecting that OBJ will get there. It's a one-read throw.
If you want to bitch at Eli, you should bitch about the sack he took in the 4th quarter that led to the punt instead of the FG attempt. Eli is supposed to audible to the run and take the 3.
Pete, this poster spent the whole game thread with one purpose in mind, to dog Eli any chance he could.
Of course there are people here who would rather blame Eli for a loss than celebrate a win. That's been obvious since the day he was drafted.
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In comment 14202871 Marty866b said:
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Was awful. The route wasn't run clean but Fuller had the inside covered right away. Eli never should have thrown it there. Tired of the Eli apologists.
My god the sheer lack of any kind of understanding how a timing route works from you is really telling
How does a timing route change whether or not you should throw a slant when the defender is lined up inside and shows no urgency in his backpedal. I'm curious what your reasoning is here?
He wasn't lined up inside he was behind OBJ and then stepped up when OBJ stopped his route and didn't make the cut to undercut. He was never lined up parallel and inside of OBJ
Now, if OBJ gets to the spot then at worst it is incomplete.
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In comment 14202877 montanagiant said:
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In comment 14202871 Marty866b said:
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Was awful. The route wasn't run clean but Fuller had the inside covered right away. Eli never should have thrown it there. Tired of the Eli apologists.
My god the sheer lack of any kind of understanding how a timing route works from you is really telling
How does a timing route change whether or not you should throw a slant when the defender is lined up inside and shows no urgency in his backpedal. I'm curious what your reasoning is here?
He wasn't lined up inside he was behind OBJ and then stepped up when OBJ stopped his route and didn't make the cut to undercut. He was never lined up parallel and inside of OBJ
And it wasn't a slant OBJ ran it was a down and in
What don’t you get about it was a timing route,?
There you go, you know you don't have shit for any kind of an argument so you decide to play the strawman game of claiming I'm saying it's never Eli's fault. Meanwhile you don't even comprehend what proper route running is
Did you not turn saying “you can’t throw that ball there” into a “you just want to hate on Eli”?
I don’t think you comprehend that you can’t throw a slant when the corner in lined up off the line, with inside leverage and doesn’t put effort into his back pedal.
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In comment 14202877 montanagiant said:
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In comment 14202871 Marty866b said:
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Was awful. The route wasn't run clean but Fuller had the inside covered right away. Eli never should have thrown it there. Tired of the Eli apologists.
My god the sheer lack of any kind of understanding how a timing route works from you is really telling
How does a timing route change whether or not you should throw a slant when the defender is lined up inside and shows no urgency in his backpedal. I'm curious what your reasoning is here?
He wasn't lined up inside he was behind OBJ and then stepped up when OBJ stopped his route and didn't make the cut to undercut. He was never lined up parallel and inside of OBJ
Fuller was lined up inside of Odell at the line of scrimmage.
Will have to tweet Bob Papa, Howard Cross, etc and tell them some fans are tired of them
Now, if OBJ gets to the spot then at worst it is incomplete.
By that analysis, OBJ is more at fault.
Why run half-3/4 speed? Isn't that the real question?
I thought superstars go hard all the time...........
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There you go, you know you don't have shit for any kind of an argument so you decide to play the strawman game of claiming I'm saying it's never Eli's fault. Meanwhile you don't even comprehend what proper route running is
Did you not turn saying “you can’t throw that ball there” into a “you just want to hate on Eli”?
I don’t think you comprehend that you can’t throw a slant when the corner in lined up off the line, with inside leverage and doesn’t put effort into his back pedal.
You sure as hell can throw a slant if your receiver runs the route hard, regardless of what the fucking DB does.
Michael Irvin made his living doing that shit in the early 90s. Do you not think that corners didn't line up with inside leverage and wait for the slant on Irvin? What was the difference? Irvin ran his routes hard and got his body between DB and ball. OBJ didn't do that, in this instance.
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In comment 14202893 Zeke's Alibi said:
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In comment 14202877 montanagiant said:
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In comment 14202871 Marty866b said:
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Was awful. The route wasn't run clean but Fuller had the inside covered right away. Eli never should have thrown it there. Tired of the Eli apologists.
My god the sheer lack of any kind of understanding how a timing route works from you is really telling
How does a timing route change whether or not you should throw a slant when the defender is lined up inside and shows no urgency in his backpedal. I'm curious what your reasoning is here?
He wasn't lined up inside he was behind OBJ and then stepped up when OBJ stopped his route and didn't make the cut to undercut. He was never lined up parallel and inside of OBJ
Fuller was lined up inside of Odell at the line of scrimmage.
No he wasn't..He was playing him heads up 4 yards off. Here's the replay, I mean come on you're just making things up now
link - ( New Window )
Yeah, but did you play QB with a receiver like OBJ?
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In comment 14202877 montanagiant said:
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In comment 14202871 Marty866b said:
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Was awful. The route wasn't run clean but Fuller had the inside covered right away. Eli never should have thrown it there. Tired of the Eli apologists.
My god the sheer lack of any kind of understanding how a timing route works from you is really telling
How does a timing route change whether or not you should throw a slant when the defender is lined up inside and shows no urgency in his backpedal. I'm curious what your reasoning is here?
He wasn't lined up inside he was behind OBJ and then stepped up when OBJ stopped his route and didn't make the cut to undercut. He was never lined up parallel and inside of OBJ
I just went back and looked at it. He wasn't as inside as I thought, but he's still on the inside shoulder. However in his back pedal he's moving much more inside. Fuller knows the route he's clearly seen something on film. Like I said before Odell's shit effort got that ball picked, but it should never have been thrown to begin with. The presnap wasnt as bad as I thought becausee well its Odell your not gonna not throw it to him just because hes shaded inside. But everything that went on during that play Eli should have daignosed especially because he was looking the whole time.
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Just a simple prove it.
Prove that the pick doesn’t happen if Odell runs the right route.
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In comment 14202896 montanagiant said:
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There you go, you know you don't have shit for any kind of an argument so you decide to play the strawman game of claiming I'm saying it's never Eli's fault. Meanwhile you don't even comprehend what proper route running is
Did you not turn saying “you can’t throw that ball there” into a “you just want to hate on Eli”?
I don’t think you comprehend that you can’t throw a slant when the corner in lined up off the line, with inside leverage and doesn’t put effort into his back pedal.
You sure as hell can throw a slant if your receiver runs the route hard, regardless of what the fucking DB does.
Michael Irvin made his living doing that shit in the early 90s. Do you not think that corners didn't line up with inside leverage and wait for the slant on Irvin? What was the difference? Irvin ran his routes hard and got his body between DB and ball. OBJ didn't do that, in this instance.
Are you saying a corner never won on a slant route vs Irvin?
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Odell's effort was dogshit there and that ball probably hits the deck on a 50/50 ball. Eli should have never thrown that ball though. Fuller is lined up way inside and doesnt even get into his back pedal. Hes sitting slant the whole time. How people don't see this blows my mind. Maybe its because I played some QB in high school but it seems fairly obvious no?
Yeah, but did you play QB with a receiver like OBJ?
Lol no but see my above post.
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In comment 14202896 montanagiant said:
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There you go, you know you don't have shit for any kind of an argument so you decide to play the strawman game of claiming I'm saying it's never Eli's fault. Meanwhile you don't even comprehend what proper route running is
Did you not turn saying “you can’t throw that ball there” into a “you just want to hate on Eli”?
I don’t think you comprehend that you can’t throw a slant when the corner in lined up off the line, with inside leverage and doesn’t put effort into his back pedal.
You sure as hell can throw a slant if your receiver runs the route hard, regardless of what the fucking DB does.
Michael Irvin made his living doing that shit in the early 90s. Do you not think that corners didn't line up with inside leverage and wait for the slant on Irvin? What was the difference? Irvin ran his routes hard and got his body between DB and ball. OBJ didn't do that, in this instance.
He just refuses to understand that with a threat like OBJ if he takes off at full speed a DB on an island has no option but to play him back because he will burn him deep. The way OBJ ran that Fuller probably thought it was a run play and thus had no worry about being beaten over the top
The mechanics of the WR position don't change just because they're different types of players. You can put a practice squad guy out there, and he knows that on that route, you have to go hard up to sell the deep route, and then hard cut in and beat the DB to the spot.
Neither the "hard up" nor the "hard cut in" happened. It made the INT easy as pie for Fuller.
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In comment 14202899 montanagiant said:
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In comment 14202893 Zeke's Alibi said:
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In comment 14202877 montanagiant said:
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In comment 14202871 Marty866b said:
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Was awful. The route wasn't run clean but Fuller had the inside covered right away. Eli never should have thrown it there. Tired of the Eli apologists.
My god the sheer lack of any kind of understanding how a timing route works from you is really telling
How does a timing route change whether or not you should throw a slant when the defender is lined up inside and shows no urgency in his backpedal. I'm curious what your reasoning is here?
He wasn't lined up inside he was behind OBJ and then stepped up when OBJ stopped his route and didn't make the cut to undercut. He was never lined up parallel and inside of OBJ
Fuller was lined up inside of Odell at the line of scrimmage.
No he wasn't..He was playing him heads up 4 yards off. Here's the replay, I mean come on you're just making things up now link - ( New Window )
Fullers outside foot is lined up with Odell’s inside foot... that’s inside leverage. He then shades more inside when the ball is snapped.
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In comment 14202893 Zeke's Alibi said:
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In comment 14202877 montanagiant said:
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In comment 14202871 Marty866b said:
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Was awful. The route wasn't run clean but Fuller had the inside covered right away. Eli never should have thrown it there. Tired of the Eli apologists.
My god the sheer lack of any kind of understanding how a timing route works from you is really telling
How does a timing route change whether or not you should throw a slant when the defender is lined up inside and shows no urgency in his backpedal. I'm curious what your reasoning is here?
He wasn't lined up inside he was behind OBJ and then stepped up when OBJ stopped his route and didn't make the cut to undercut. He was never lined up parallel and inside of OBJ
I just went back and looked at it. He wasn't as inside as I thought, but he's still on the inside shoulder. However in his back pedal he's moving much more inside. Fuller knows the route he's clearly seen something on film. Like I said before Odell's shit effort got that ball picked, but it should never have been thrown to begin with. The presnap wasnt as bad as I thought becausee well its Odell your not gonna not throw it to him just because hes shaded inside. But everything that went on during that play Eli should have daignosed especially because he was looking the whole time.
Timing routes are bang-bang plays and with a talent like OBJ he wins that 99% of the time if he runs them correctly. Once again, I think it was an audible out of a run call because OBJ was one on one with Fuller and he just missed the call. To me that replay looks as if OBJ is going out to block Fuller more then anything else
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In comment 14202907 ajr2456 said:
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In comment 14202896 montanagiant said:
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There you go, you know you don't have shit for any kind of an argument so you decide to play the strawman game of claiming I'm saying it's never Eli's fault. Meanwhile you don't even comprehend what proper route running is
Did you not turn saying “you can’t throw that ball there” into a “you just want to hate on Eli”?
I don’t think you comprehend that you can’t throw a slant when the corner in lined up off the line, with inside leverage and doesn’t put effort into his back pedal.
You sure as hell can throw a slant if your receiver runs the route hard, regardless of what the fucking DB does.
Michael Irvin made his living doing that shit in the early 90s. Do you not think that corners didn't line up with inside leverage and wait for the slant on Irvin? What was the difference? Irvin ran his routes hard and got his body between DB and ball. OBJ didn't do that, in this instance.
He just refuses to understand that with a threat like OBJ if he takes off at full speed a DB on an island has no option but to play him back because he will burn him deep. The way OBJ ran that Fuller probably thought it was a run play and thus had no worry about being beaten over the top
Fuller recognizes the play from something he saw on film or previously in the game. He clearly had it read the whole time.
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In comment 14202912 ajr2456 said:
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In comment 14202899 montanagiant said:
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In comment 14202893 Zeke's Alibi said:
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In comment 14202877 montanagiant said:
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In comment 14202871 Marty866b said:
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Was awful. The route wasn't run clean but Fuller had the inside covered right away. Eli never should have thrown it there. Tired of the Eli apologists.
My god the sheer lack of any kind of understanding how a timing route works from you is really telling
How does a timing route change whether or not you should throw a slant when the defender is lined up inside and shows no urgency in his backpedal. I'm curious what your reasoning is here?
He wasn't lined up inside he was behind OBJ and then stepped up when OBJ stopped his route and didn't make the cut to undercut. He was never lined up parallel and inside of OBJ
Fuller was lined up inside of Odell at the line of scrimmage.
No he wasn't..He was playing him heads up 4 yards off. Here's the replay, I mean come on you're just making things up now link - ( New Window )
Fullers outside foot is lined up with Odell’s inside foot... that’s inside leverage. He then shades more inside when the ball is snapped.
LOL..You are hilariously bad
He. Wasn't. Running. Hard.
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In comment 14202907 ajr2456 said:
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In comment 14202896 montanagiant said:
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There you go, you know you don't have shit for any kind of an argument so you decide to play the strawman game of claiming I'm saying it's never Eli's fault. Meanwhile you don't even comprehend what proper route running is
Did you not turn saying “you can’t throw that ball there” into a “you just want to hate on Eli”?
I don’t think you comprehend that you can’t throw a slant when the corner in lined up off the line, with inside leverage and doesn’t put effort into his back pedal.
You sure as hell can throw a slant if your receiver runs the route hard, regardless of what the fucking DB does.
Michael Irvin made his living doing that shit in the early 90s. Do you not think that corners didn't line up with inside leverage and wait for the slant on Irvin? What was the difference? Irvin ran his routes hard and got his body between DB and ball. OBJ didn't do that, in this instance.
He just refuses to understand that with a threat like OBJ if he takes off at full speed a DB on an island has no option but to play him back because he will burn him deep. The way OBJ ran that Fuller probably thought it was a run play and thus had no worry about being beaten over the top
I only count 10 players in the frame, so Fuller possibly didn’t even have to worry about him going deep because he had safety help.
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In comment 14202920 PetesHereNow said:
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In comment 14202907 ajr2456 said:
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In comment 14202896 montanagiant said:
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There you go, you know you don't have shit for any kind of an argument so you decide to play the strawman game of claiming I'm saying it's never Eli's fault. Meanwhile you don't even comprehend what proper route running is
Did you not turn saying “you can’t throw that ball there” into a “you just want to hate on Eli”?
I don’t think you comprehend that you can’t throw a slant when the corner in lined up off the line, with inside leverage and doesn’t put effort into his back pedal.
You sure as hell can throw a slant if your receiver runs the route hard, regardless of what the fucking DB does.
Michael Irvin made his living doing that shit in the early 90s. Do you not think that corners didn't line up with inside leverage and wait for the slant on Irvin? What was the difference? Irvin ran his routes hard and got his body between DB and ball. OBJ didn't do that, in this instance.
He just refuses to understand that with a threat like OBJ if he takes off at full speed a DB on an island has no option but to play him back because he will burn him deep. The way OBJ ran that Fuller probably thought it was a run play and thus had no worry about being beaten over the top
Fuller recognizes the play from something he saw on film or previously in the game. He clearly had it read the whole time.
Could be, but the only reason why I don't agree with this is that we would have gone back to that again and instead run a hitch to beat him over the top. I still think that because of how OBJ ran that route Fuller stepped up thinking it was a run his way and grabbed the inside angle so he couldn't get blocked out of bounds and the ball fell into his lap.
Beckham didn’t half ass it. He planted and cut butthe guy jumped in front of him. Is he supposed to run him over? The guy beat him there. No chance for Beckham to do much.
He. Wasn't. Running. Hard.
Theres no way he gets to the spot before Odell does if he knows the play. If Odell runs hard though it probably doesnt get picked.
Beckham didn’t half ass it. He planted and cut butthe guy jumped in front of him. Is he supposed to run him over? The guy beat him there. No chance for Beckham to do much.
No he didn't look at the replay, he didn't make a cut at all he just stopped
Beckham didn’t half ass it. He planted and cut butthe guy jumped in front of him. Is he supposed to run him over? The guy beat him there. No chance for Beckham to do much.
He didn't half ass it from the snap? That's his 100% hard break? If that's his break at top speed, he would get open about as much as Howard Cross in 1995.
Fuller was lined up inside of Odell at the line of scrimmage.
No he wasn't..He was playing him heads up 4 yards off. Here's the replay, I mean come on you're just making things up now link - ( New Window )
Fullers outside foot is lined up with Odell’s inside foot... that’s inside leverage. He then shades more inside when the ball is snapped.
LOL..You are hilariously bad
Watch the all 22 when it comes out tommorow. He was not heads up. He wasn’t a yard inside, but he was shaded inside of Odell.
But let’s be real - Eli should not have thrown that.
He jumped. Backed off. Jumped again.
Beckham was the problem? No. The CB( who currently leads the NFL I INTS) beat him there and made the play.
Beckham saw him jump. He was trying to adjust. Ball was already on the way.
He jumped. Backed off. Jumped again.
Beckham was the problem? No. The CB( who currently leads the NFL I INTS) beat him there and made the play.
Beckham saw him jump. He was trying to adjust. Ball was already on the way.
Can someone make a GIF of the last 7 seconds of this video?
Beckham's release off the snap is dogshit. He is jogging.
He either thought it was a run play or he thought the ball was going to the flat and trying to block.
Link - ( New Window )
It’s a reach to rip Beckham here. Db made the play. He was all over it early in the play.
Is Toomer,s point, Eli could have impacted the DBs read by looking him off? That’s a legit point.