Gil Brandt on Justin Herbert...

Tua and Fromm in it, it never made sense for him to come back.

in the draft he ever saw or am I misremembering?

Now let some other team take a flyer on him. I want Tua or Fromm. Both are worth trading up for in 2020.

In comment 14213445 bradshaw44 said:

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Now let some other team take a flyer on him. I want Tua or Fromm. Both are worth trading up for in 2020.

How likely will that even be a possibility? Chances are will be middle of the pack next year, be drafting in the 10-20 range. Which would make it extremely difficult if not impossible to trade up to the 1 or 2 spot to grab Tua or Fromm.

I realize I'm doing a lot of educated guesswork here but the reality is our newfound mediocrity is going to make it extremely difficult if not impossible for us to get a franchise QB anytime soon.

.

In comment 14213417 Big Blue '56 said:

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in the draft he ever saw or am I misremembering?

He said he was the best skill player he ever saw(been at it since 1960 or so).

Is either a delusional Ducks fan or extremely gullible. You don't need sources to know that he's coming out this year.

but I don't see it yet with the kid.

In comment 14213416 bigblue12 said:

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Tua and Fromm in it, it never made sense for him to come back.

What's the big deal about Fromm exactly? I like him but he isn't first round material. Good college player. Medium size, decent arm, decent athleticism.

In comment 14213482 bw in dc said:

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In comment 14213416 bigblue12 said: Quote: Tua and Fromm in it, it never made sense for him to come back. What's the big deal about Fromm exactly? I like him but he isn't first round material. Good college player. Medium size, decent arm, decent athleticism.

IMHO, can make all the throws, is a leader, big game tested, and comes to play in those big games.

He put on a clinic last week in Atlanta.

In comment 14213445 bradshaw44 said:

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Now let some other team take a flyer on him. I want Tua or Fromm. Both are worth trading up for in 2020.

Giants most likely won't be in on them as likely be in the mid to late teens picking..they'd haveto trade away a lot to move up that far, also having to compete with other teams looking to take those qbs.

They may have to go with journeymen after eli retires after next contract

they are likely going QB

Unless his draft stock falls dramatically

In comment 14213457 Tesla said:

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In comment 14213445 bradshaw44 said: Quote: Now let some other team take a flyer on him. I want Tua or Fromm. Both are worth trading up for in 2020. How likely will that even be a possibility? Chances are will be middle of the pack next year, be drafting in the 10-20 range. Which would make it extremely difficult if not impossible to trade up to the 1 or 2 spot to grab Tua or Fromm. I realize I'm doing a lot of educated guesswork here but the reality is our newfound mediocrity is going to make it extremely difficult if not impossible for us to get a franchise QB anytime soon.

We mortgaged the future for Eli. We would have to mortgage the future for the next guy if we truly feel they are cut from that cloth. It's the price to pay if you have to. Not too mention, we are going to be middle of the pack this year so how would we get Herbert?

but Jacksonville will be the main threat. They are desperate for a QB and they will likely be picking in front of the Giants. Hopefully they will sign Bridgewater or another QB and decide to pass on Herbert.

can pry Carr from the Raiders?

the oline is still mediocre and has to be upgraded. The Giants must upgrade the oline and their pass rush, drafting a qb does not make this team better.

ten teams off the top of my head who would/could/should draft a QB in Round 1 next spring - including two teams in the NFC East (and, if they're smart, a third) alone - either to start in 2019 or to develop into heirs apparent for the 2020 season.

(NE - maybe)
Miami
Pitt
Cincy
Jax
Oakland
Denver
NYG
Wash
(Dal - maybe)
(GB - maybe)
TB
SF

To be in position to get the top quarterback in a draft two years in a row l, is a bit of a reach. That ship sailed.

In comment 14213545 joeinpa said:

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To be in position to get the top quarterback in a draft two years in a row l, is a bit of a reach. That ship sailed.

You don’t need to tank to get your next QB. Giants may very well trade up if they like someone enough.

In comment 14213550 Sean said:

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In comment 14213545 joeinpa said: Quote: To be in position to get the top quarterback in a draft two years in a row l, is a bit of a reach. That ship sailed. You don’t need to tank to get your next QB. Giants may very well trade up if they like someone enough.

That's assuming that the team with the top pick is willing to trade it. Chances are they won't

big deal? The Giants have Kyle.

In comment 14213542 SterlingArcher said:

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the oline is still mediocre and has to be upgraded. The Giants must upgrade the oline and their pass rush, drafting a qb does not make this team better.

This is extremely shortsighted. The Giants need to add a C and RT but the line has played significantly better since the arrival of Jamon Brown. QB is the most important position so when you have the chance to get a potential franchise QB you go for it. Chances are they will sit to start their career anyway so if the line falls apart keep the vet in.

The Giants will upgrade this line this offseason. It also helps that Herbert isn't a statue in the pocket. He can buy time with his legs.

In comment 14213555 XBRONX said:

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big deal? The Giants have Kyle.

Reminds me of the great George Carlin bit on Soft Boy's Names..."Kyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyle."


Link - ( New Window )

We’re not getting any of these guys drafting middle of the pack every year, which is were we’re likely to be..

And there’s also Lock and Grier.

Retires? In his last year where he possibly sharply declines? We've strung some wins together but we're hardly a lock for bottom half of the draft order from here on out.

Our draft position will be just about perfect to draft Daniel Jones. Might have to trade up a few spots to get him. Full year behind Eli to develop. Waiting for 2020 will likely mean starting a rookie QB because we haven’t seen anything from KL and there is no other QB talent on the roster.

Had Mahomes as the guy to pick.

You mean the giants could have their very own Ryan Tannehill?! Watch him slip to the second round. He is nothing special at all.

since we're dropping in the draft with these wins.

In comment 14213520 Jay on the Island said:

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but Jacksonville will be the main threat. They are desperate for a QB and they will likely be picking in front of the Giants. Hopefully they will sign Bridgewater or another QB and decide to pass on Herbert.

It just so happens the Jags and Skins play this weekend. I hope the Skins win out.

In comment 14213603 Jay in Toronto said:

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Had Mahomes as the guy to pick.

Lots of experts favored Mahomes, but let's not forget that Mahomes inherited an explosive offense in KC that was clicking pretty well without him the year before. I like the guy, but he wouldn't be lighting up the world if he were playing for say the Raiders instead of the Chiefs.

p.s.--My current favorite QB prospect is Drew Lock, but it's subject to change because it's still real early in the process.

From Walter Football...

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Drew Lock, QB, Missouri Height: 6-3. Weight: 226. Projected 40 Time: 4.85. Projected Round (2019): 1. 12/6/18: Lock has completed 63 percent of his passes in 2018 for 3,125 yards with 25 touchdowns and eight interceptions. He has six rushing touchdowns as well. Lock played well and fought hard against Georgia, but he was plagued by dropped passes. Lock then had a disappointing performance against Alabama, committing three turnovers. He bounced back with a good game against Florida. In surveying sources from seven different teams, five of them thought that Lock would be a first-round pick in the 2019 NFL Draft. Scouts who were through Missouri's fall camp label Lock's arm as legit. He has a rifle and is a good athlete. They say that he can really spin it and is able to make every throw required in the NFL. Some sources have taken a liking to Lock while others are somewhat skeptical. Sources believe his skill set and athleticism are similar to Jay Cutler but offset with a nerdy/quiet personality that is similar to Eli Manning. Lock is a quiet guy and not a vocal rah-rah leader who takes over the room. He does not like to be the center of attention and is a little nerdy. Some general managers and coaches want their quarterback to be a commanding personality to lead the team, and Lock does not fit that type of player. 8/28/18: According to NFL teams' preseason data provided by team sources, Lock checks in at 6-foot-3, 226 pounds. He has 33.63-inch arms, and a wingspan of 77.5 inches. He is said to run the 40 in 4.85 seconds. Sources say Lock is known to be a quiet player who is not a vocal leader. His lack of leadership skills could hurt him with some team evaluators who want their quarterback to have a presence as a team leader. Lock set the SEC single regular-season record for touchdown passes in 2017 with 43. He went on a tear in the last half of the year to lead Missouri to six straight wins after a 1-5 start. Lock completed 58 percent of his passes in 2017 for 3,964 yards with 44 touchdowns and 13 interceptions. Lock is a gunslinger-style quarterback who has a big arm with the ability to throw any pass. However, he needs to improve his accuracy, field vision, and the speed at which he works through progressions. Lock can be prone to overthrows, plus can put too much heat on some passes. Lock has good size and can fit the pass into tight windows. He throws the ball well downfield and shows some timing and anticipation. Lock does have the propensity to force throws to covered wideouts, occasionally trusting his arm too much to beat tight coverage. He also has some mobility. Lock could stand to make improvements before going to the NFL, thus he was wise to return to Missouri before turning pro.

Walter Football--the QBs... - ( New Window )

In comment 14213445 bradshaw44 said:

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Now let some other team take a flyer on him. I want Tua or Fromm. Both are worth trading up for in 2020.

15 other teams will also be trading up for Tua or Fromm. It's highly unlikely the Giants will be able to trade up to draft those players.

I’m down to either Lock or Grier.

Lock’s overall production slipped from last year, but has accuracy got better and he finished really well down the stretch. I see some Jim Kelly in him. Tough, sneaky athletic, with a big, playmaking style...

In comment 14213585 jeff57 said:

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And there’s also Lock and Grier.

^
This

In comment 14213735 bw in dc said:

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I’m down to either Lock or Grier.

That's kind of where I'm at, too, but I'm still open-minded about the rest of the class. I like to see how they handle the interview process and what the measurables reveal, not to mention all the detailed film room stuff that will be coming out.

Have you seen Tyree Jackson? I’ve seen about a few quarters of two Buffalo games this year. I got lured in by his size and some of the hype. But just too much of a project for my tastes. Just misses too much...

I’ve come around late on Lock. His last month has been tremendous. Playing well in the SEC carries a lot of weight for me when it’s with a second tier school like Mizzu.

What are your thoughts on Jones?

you have to find a trading partner. If a QB-starved team is sitting in the drivers seat with Tua or Fromm waiting for them with a top 3 pick, they're not picking up the phone. Even with multiple first rounders, you're not prying them loose so they can continue languishing in QB purgatory. I'm pretty sure Indy wasn't going to move off Luck when they tanked the previous season. You do not relinquish your position of power.

In comment 14213482 bw in dc said:

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In comment 14213416 bigblue12 said: Quote: Tua and Fromm in it, it never made sense for him to come back. What's the big deal about Fromm exactly? I like him but he isn't first round material. Good college player. Medium size, decent arm, decent athleticism.

You haven't seen him play then. He is better than a good college player. He can make all the throws, has poise and has a much better arm than you think. He will be the next great quarterback IMHO

In comment 14213807 bw in dc said:

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Have you seen Tyree Jackson? I’ve seen about a few quarters of two Buffalo games this year. I got lured in by his size and some of the hype. But just too much of a project for my tastes. Just misses too much... I’ve come around late on Lock. His last month has been tremendous. Playing well in the SEC carries a lot of weight for me when it’s with a second tier school like Mizzu. What are your thoughts on Jones?

More intrigued by Jones than Tyree Jackson at this point, but I think the current thinking is that he is returning for another year.

In comment 14213482 bw in dc said:

Quote:

In comment 14213416 bigblue12 said: Quote: Tua and Fromm in it, it never made sense for him to come back. What's the big deal about Fromm exactly? I like him but he isn't first round material. Good college player. Medium size, decent arm, decent athleticism.

I only watched about 5 minutes of this kid and was sold. He’s definitely a natural leader and seemed to play with a sense of urgency even though they had the game well in hand. I would love to have this kid be the next NYG QB

In comment 14213482 bw in dc said:

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What's the big deal about Fromm exactly? I like him but he isn't first round material. Good college player. Medium size, decent arm, decent athleticism.

Seriously? He'd be the first pick in this draft and he will be the 1st pick in next year's draft (yes, ahead of Tua). He has an excellent arm with terrific accuracy. Not the most athletic guy, but he can move a bit. He's a lot like Andrew Luck.

In comment 14213918 uconngiant said:

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You haven't seen him play then. He is better than a good college player. He can make all the throws, has poise and has a much better arm than you think. He will be the next great quarterback IMHO

Good one.

But, yes, I have seen him play. Plenty. I think he's a very good QB. He works for Georgia - run a ton, and throw it about 20X/game. I'm not sure, however, he's even the best QB on that roster. Fields may be in the long run...but that's a different topic.

Regardless, I see a solid player who does nothing special. Not this upper-echelon, top-pick talent. He doesn't jump off the screen to me. I'm certainly willing to give it time. But what exactly are the great attributes? His "better arm" than I give him credit for...

Give me a comparison and we can discuss further. I sort of see Kirk Cousins.

In comment 14214214 Section331 said:

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Seriously? He'd be the first pick in this draft and he will be the 1st pick in next year's draft (yes, ahead of Tua). He has an excellent arm with terrific accuracy. Not the most athletic guy, but he can move a bit. He's a lot like Andrew Luck.

Yes, seriously. With all due respect, Andrew Luck? The one from Stanford?

Uh, he's a helluva lot more like Kirk Cousins than Andrew Luck. Making that comparison is the stretch of stretches...

In comment 14214043 ZoneXDOA said:

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I only watched about 5 minutes of this kid and was sold. He’s definitely a natural leader and seemed to play with a sense of urgency even though they had the game well in hand. I would love to have this kid be the next NYG QB

I agree on the intangibles. That makes sense.

Physically? Uh, I just don't see anything extraordinary.

I certainly want to see more, but I just ain't buying this hype...

The Giants will have to have a top 2 pick in 2020 to get them because the teams that have those picks will not trade them unless they already are set at QB which is unlikely. I doubt the Giants will be that bad next year. I expect them to be in the 15-20 range in 2020. Even if the team that has a top 2 pick is willing to trade it the cost to move up that far would be insane.

I am not suggesting taking a QB this year just to take one because that is absurd. I am high on Herbert and i think he could be similar to Goff in time.

Is not an NFL QB. Won’t last too small.