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Real Talk: How much will it cost resign Jamon Brown?

BigBlueDownTheShore : 12/11/2018 8:59 am
Do we think there will be money left over to also get a FA RT?

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wow  
giantfan2000 : 12/11/2018 10:59 am : link
our castoffs are starting OL on other teams
there is a huge demand for OL and not a big supply
whoever signs Brown is going to pay a lot of $$$
I think $5-$6 million a year  
1st and 10 : 12/11/2018 11:16 am : link
And yes you resign him. We need to replace so many people, he is a serviceable player. He gives us the a bility to upgrade other roster positions. You cannot have an all pro at every position.
RE: RE: Wringing hands over resigning Brown  
BillT : 12/11/2018 11:29 am : link
In comment 14214396 Toth029 said:
Quote:
In comment 14214200 JonC said:


Quote:


shows how desperate we've become.

It won't cost much, and RT is a bigger need.


I think finding a quality C is more vital than RT.

Can't see that. Halapio might not have been great or maybe even good but I think he was better than Wheeler.
He gives us the possibility of coming out of the blocks fast in 2019  
Bob in Newburgh : 12/11/2018 11:35 am : link
If the o-line had had any kind of functionality at the start of the season, we would be in the playoff hunt right now.
If someone better is available  
fkap : 12/11/2018 11:47 am : link
sign him.

If you don't resign JB (or an equal/better replacement), the position joins C and RT as one of those bigger problems. Doesn't mean you go crazy with paying him, but you can't be too cavalier about letting him go.
Most estimates are correct - prob 5-6m range  
AcesUp : 12/11/2018 11:49 am : link
I'd sign him. As we know from experience, the known beats the unknown at that price point. Resigning him allows you to focus on upgrading C and RT. You need to go 7-8 deep on the OL, I'm much more comfortable with Halapio being penciled in as primary interior depth and Wheeler swing tackle than those two as starters.
The Giants will need to consider all FA RG options  
ij_reilly : 12/11/2018 11:49 am : link
If Brown is good value, then sign him if possible. I mean relative good value. Relative to other FA options. Sure, maybe they could seen a Norwell-type RG but that of course would be at Norwell-type dollars. Is it worth it? Nobody will know until the FA market kicks in.

A guess at a reasonable strategy - sign Brown and draft his potential replacement.

Center and RT are huge issues too.

They tried to sign Sullivan (Rams) at C but he stayed with the Rams. So it seems they didn't like going into 2018 with Halapio and Jones. Jones is gone and Halapio broke his leg after not impressing. The Giants are going to get a C this offseason. I cannot imagine they will go into next year with Pulley/Halapio as the only options at C.

RT, Wheeler works so hard, I love that, but he's a backup/swing kind of guy.
RE: RE: Brown is not the answer at RG  
1st and 10 : 12/11/2018 12:29 pm : link
In comment 14214273 giants#1 said:
Quote:
In comment 14214208 BillT said:


Quote:


His spot needs to be upgraded. Be glad to see him resigned. He’s serviceable and would be good depth but would like to see them spend their 2nd round pick again on a guard or guard/center.



Ideally they would upgrade him, but center and RT are both in much more urgent need of an upgrade. Not to mention pass rusher, safety, LB, QB etc.

I'd look to upgrade OC or RT via FA and the other in the draft while bringing Brown back. A starting OL of: Solder-Hernandez-Paradis (other FA)-Brown-Rd 2 Pick could actually get the unit to average or better. And an OL where Brown is the "weak link" could be solid and significantly better than this years with Pulley or Wheeler the weak link.


+1
RE: RE: Wringing hands over resigning Brown  
JonC : 12/11/2018 12:47 pm : link
In comment 14214396 Toth029 said:
Quote:
In comment 14214200 JonC said:


Quote:


shows how desperate we've become.

It won't cost much, and RT is a bigger need.


I think finding a quality C is more vital than RT.


It depends on how you're looking at it ... positionally, and in terms of supply and demand, RT is more vital and harder to find.
Wow, some big offers teed up for Jamon  
JonC : 12/11/2018 12:48 pm : link
I'd go $3M for one year. If things go well and to plan, he's a depth player.
Nick Gates could be the next RG  
GeorgeAdams33 : 12/11/2018 12:49 pm : link
But I'd like to re-sign J.Brown. I don't want to have a repeat of the Fluker non-signing. You need guys who can create movement in the trenches. We have enough problems without creating more problems. Consistency is important too.
Fluker is remembered more fondly than accurately  
JonC : 12/11/2018 12:51 pm : link
because he's having a solid season elsewhere.
I'd offer him  
ryanmkeane : 12/11/2018 12:52 pm : link
very good backup money, whatever that may be. If he walks, he walks. Draft or other FA would be able to replace him
So low ball don't even bother contacting the agent  
Bob in Newburgh : 12/11/2018 12:57 pm : link
Spencer Long and Brian Winters are somewhat equivalent players, although on paper Brown seems somewhat more gifted.

Not only is the 6 mil the market, but in some fashion the player is going to be guaranteed 6 that initial year.
RE: I'd offer him  
BigBlueDownTheShore : 12/11/2018 1:07 pm : link
In comment 14214705 ryanmkeane said:
Quote:
very good backup money, whatever that may be. If he walks, he walks. Draft or other FA would be able to replace him


You guys are crazy. We actually have a line right now that is functional, and you want to make a change just to change.

Looking at our line right now, we are getting by with terrible center and RT play.

Jamon plays adequately in both run and pass blocking. Upgrade whats around him, and I am positive he will play better.

We know what we have right now if you extend a big contract to someone else there is no guarantee it will be better.

We also can't upgrade center, RT, and guard all at the same time again next year.

More of the roster will change this Spring  
JonC : 12/11/2018 1:11 pm : link
quite possibly including RG, unless he agrees to a fair deal, which I highly doubt will approach $6M per.
RE: Wow, some big offers teed up for Jamon  
section125 : 12/11/2018 1:12 pm : link
In comment 14214691 JonC said:
Quote:
I'd go $3M for one year. If things go well and to plan, he's a depth player.


That is what I said. $2.5 to $3 mill per year. I'm sure he'd like 3 years or better.
RE: RE: Halapio  
GiantGrit : 12/11/2018 1:25 pm : link
In comment 14214377 section125 said:
Quote:
In comment 14214369 BigBlueDownTheShore said:


Quote:


is not the answer, nor was he ever going to be.

He got a shot to start, and he wasn't very good. Solid depth player though that can play 2 positions.

We are more than likely going to move on from him after this season is my guess.



This was his 1st season at center, so who knows how they feel. He was improving before the injury and he is big.


Multiple beats have said the team is still high on Halapio even after the injury.
RE: Fluker is remembered more fondly than accurately  
giants#1 : 12/11/2018 1:36 pm : link
In comment 14214700 JonC said:
Quote:
because he's having a solid season elsewhere.


I agree. Fluker's also missed 4 games this year after missing time last year. Can't help the team if you aren't on the field.
RE: More of the roster will change this Spring  
giants#1 : 12/11/2018 1:37 pm : link
In comment 14214742 JonC said:
Quote:
quite possibly including RG, unless he agrees to a fair deal, which I highly doubt will approach $6M per.


Omameh signed for 3 yrs/$15M. I think Brown's deal will be around there.
The team  
darren in pdx : 12/11/2018 1:37 pm : link
was high on Halapio based on reports, he seemed to be doing okay and improving, but I think the team needs to sign or draft someone regardless. He broke his ankle and lower leg, it’s going to be awhile before he trusts his leg and who knows if he’ll get back to where he was.
RE: RE: More of the roster will change this Spring  
JonC : 12/11/2018 1:44 pm : link
In comment 14214782 giants#1 said:
Quote:
In comment 14214742 JonC said:


Quote:


quite possibly including RG, unless he agrees to a fair deal, which I highly doubt will approach $6M per.



Omameh signed for 3 yrs/$15M. I think Brown's deal will be around there.


Yuck.
Giants fixed 2 spots last offseason. Not optimistic that they can  
Ivan15 : 12/11/2018 1:55 pm : link
do it again this year.

Halapio May be a find. We dont kNow but they liked him enough to trade away Jones.

We don’t know if they think enough of Brown to outbid others.

Two or 3 spots will be asking a lot to fix.
RE: Giants fixed 2 spots last offseason. Not optimistic that they can  
giants#1 : 12/11/2018 2:02 pm : link
In comment 14214806 Ivan15 said:
Quote:
do it again this year.

Halapio May be a find. We dont kNow but they liked him enough to trade away Jones.

We don’t know if they think enough of Brown to outbid others.

Two or 3 spots will be asking a lot to fix.


Halapio was a marginal upgrade over Jones who was (at best) a replacement level player. They went with the slightly better player, saved a couple million, and got an extra draft pick at the same time.

That said, hopefully they at least bring in competition for Pulley/Halapio, even if it's a day 3 pick.
The top 12 highest paid RG  
kdog77 : 12/11/2018 2:35 pm : link
make more than $8M/year according to Overthecap. Zach Martin is the highest RG at $14M/year. I was surpised to see most RT and C are paid quite bit less, but 2019 FA class at both positions does not seem that promising. Brown will likely have options to get big contract elsewhere if Giants do not make decent offer.
Giants  
PaulN : 12/11/2018 2:41 pm : link
Will and should overpay him, he is a great fallback option and great depth, this offensive line is clicking, they will only get better now, there is no need to break anything up now. They are playing great football, the Giants with Gettleman will add a center/guard and also add a tackle in this draft or free agency. But I do not see the Giants letting him go, that would be insane with the way this line is now playing.

I love it, people see garbage for so many years, then they see great play from the OLine and the first thing they want is to change things, fucking unreal.
RE: Giants  
BigBlueDownTheShore : 12/11/2018 2:55 pm : link
In comment 14214879 PaulN said:
Quote:
Will and should overpay him, he is a great fallback option and great depth, this offensive line is clicking, they will only get better now, there is no need to break anything up now. They are playing great football, the Giants with Gettleman will add a center/guard and also add a tackle in this draft or free agency. But I do not see the Giants letting him go, that would be insane with the way this line is now playing.

I love it, people see garbage for so many years, then they see great play from the OLine and the first thing they want is to change things, fucking unreal.


AMEN BROTHER!
Let's not confuse great with  
JonC : 12/11/2018 2:57 pm : link
serviceable. Some of you guys are like starving hobos ...
RE: Let's not confuse great with  
BigBlueDownTheShore : 12/11/2018 2:59 pm : link
In comment 14214907 JonC said:
Quote:
serviceable. Some of you guys are like starving hobos ...


No one is.

You just feel the need to shit on the one player that actually helped straighten out this offensive line. God forbid we overpay a little bit to keep our jelling Oline in tact.
If you think he's starting to figure it out  
JonC : 12/11/2018 3:02 pm : link
and is ascending into a solid starter, by all means try to keep him on a fair deal. Fluker was basically a known entity and they chose to pass. I think Brown is somewhere between decent starter and solid depth at the moment.

The key is not to rest on your laurels and lock yourself into a bad contract.

It's also harder to find a good RT, they need to factor in the available parts there as well under a finite salary cap.
BBDS  
JonC : 12/11/2018 3:03 pm : link
Get a hold of yourself.
and read up a few posts  
JonC : 12/11/2018 3:03 pm : link
.
BigBlue  
ryanmkeane : 12/11/2018 3:07 pm : link
by this notion, we would never want to upgrade any player if he was doing OK. Brown was the #72 overall pick in 2015 draft, has been injured and suspended with Rams, but played alright.

You're gonna tell me we can't upgrade this position?
ryan  
JonC : 12/11/2018 3:08 pm : link
ding ding
RE: If you think he's starting to figure it out  
BigBlueDownTheShore : 12/11/2018 3:10 pm : link
In comment 14214919 JonC said:
Quote:
and is ascending into a solid starter, by all means try to keep him on a fair deal. Fluker was basically a known entity and they chose to pass. I think Brown is somewhere between decent starter and solid depth at the moment.

The key is not to rest on your laurels and lock yourself into a bad contract.

It's also harder to find a good RT, they need to factor in the available parts there as well under a finite salary cap.


Fluker couldn't pass block to save his life.

John Jerry couldn't run block to save his life.

Both players I would consider backups.

Jamon is adequate in both areas, and at this point probably still learning the offense and knocking off the rust. Plus he is working with dog shit next to him at tackle and Center which brings down the rest of line.

He's good enough to give Eli a pocket to step into, Solder doesn't look as bad as everyone was making him out to be.

On the open market, O-linemen are making bank because it is very hard to develop them and find them in the draft. You don't let a young guy that more then likely could play even better if you gave him some help on either side walk away.
BigBlue  
ryanmkeane : 12/11/2018 3:11 pm : link
"god forbid we overpay to keep our OL in tact" you realize this is the exact thing we did with Omameh and it completely backfired right?

I'm not saying Brown won't be our RG in 2019. But to say we can't try to upgrade him, whether in the draft or FA with a significantly better player (and there will be available) is completely and utterly absurd.

Oh yippee our OL is showing signs of life...Should we not look to upgrade Wheeler either? He gets pushed back into the backfield nearly every down.
BB  
ryanmkeane : 12/11/2018 3:12 pm : link
let's not pretend you are all of a sudden some scout that has been watching Brown his whole career. You, like the rest of us, had probably never heard of him before the Rams cut him. But because he is not absolutely horrendous, you want to keep him and claim that he's better than Fluker or this guy or this guy. Sure, he might be better than Fluker. But shouldn't our standards be a bit higher than "he's slightly better or the same as DJ Fluker"...jesus
RE: BigBlue  
BigBlueDownTheShore : 12/11/2018 3:13 pm : link
In comment 14214926 ryanmkeane said:
Quote:
by this notion, we would never want to upgrade any player if he was doing OK. Brown was the #72 overall pick in 2015 draft, has been injured and suspended with Rams, but played alright.

You're gonna tell me we can't upgrade this position?


He is good enough to keep around, and I'm sure he will look better with a blue chip center or RT next to him.

Wheeler and Pulley absolutely suck ass. You look to replace those two before you replace the only thing that works on the right side of the line.

Halapio is another flaming pile of dogshit that we were trying to make a starter, because there was no options in FA.

Can we upgrade from Brown, I wouldn't do it this season or even next year. Maybe in the near future. He is the only thing that works over there, and has been for maybe 5 years.

If it ain't broke don't fix it.
RE: RE: BigBlue  
ryanmkeane : 12/11/2018 3:15 pm : link
In comment 14214940 BigBlueDownTheShore said:
Quote:
In comment 14214926 ryanmkeane said:


Quote:


by this notion, we would never want to upgrade any player if he was doing OK. Brown was the #72 overall pick in 2015 draft, has been injured and suspended with Rams, but played alright.

You're gonna tell me we can't upgrade this position?



He is good enough to keep around, and I'm sure he will look better with a blue chip center or RT next to him.


OK, but a better player than Brown, would look even better than this with a blue chip center or RT next to him. Why must we just plant Brown in there at RG?

If there is a great RG prospect in round 2 or 3...and the Center or RT prospects are just "eh"...you're gonna tell me the Giants would pass on the RG because the need is better at RT or C? That's ridiculous.
RE: If you think he's starting to figure it out  
giants#1 : 12/11/2018 3:15 pm : link
In comment 14214919 JonC said:
Quote:
and is ascending into a solid starter, by all means try to keep him on a fair deal. Fluker was basically a known entity and they chose to pass. I think Brown is somewhere between decent starter and solid depth at the moment.

The key is not to rest on your laurels and lock yourself into a bad contract.

It's also harder to find a good RT, they need to factor in the available parts there as well under a finite salary cap.


Omameh's contract wasn't a "bad contract". It sucks because they completely missed on the player, but it's not going to stop them from doing anything they want moving forward. So if they can ink him to a similar deal (3 yrs/$15M with $5M gtd), I think it's reasonable. $5M per would make him the 30th highest paid OG (18th highest paid RG), which is basically average. Maybe a little bit of an overpay, but he's also still only 25 with the potential for improvement (he was also a 3rd round pick which is fairly high for interior OL so there's talent).

Definitely harder to find a RT and there'd be more guesswork predicting how a 2nd tier RT might do in their scheme since there'd be some projection involved. Whereas with Brown they see him everyday at practice and should have a firm grasp of what he can/can't do.

Personally, I'd look to add a top C in FA, re-sign Brown, and draft a RT on day 2. Would probably look to add some OL depth on day 3 as well.
RE: BigBlue  
BigBlueDownTheShore : 12/11/2018 3:18 pm : link
In comment 14214934 ryanmkeane said:
Quote:
"god forbid we overpay to keep our OL in tact" you realize this is the exact thing we did with Omameh and it completely backfired right?


On the contrary, you are saying we should do exactly the same thing as we did last year. Let a current player walk, and try to refill that position with a supposed upgrade.

Omameh was supposed to be better then Jerry or Fluker. He was worse.

Why fix something that is working?
I think the disconnect is  
giants#1 : 12/11/2018 3:21 pm : link
that if you try and upgrade Brown, then what are you doing at C and RT? Or are you hoping/trying to upgrade all 3 positions in one offseason?

Those advocating re-signing Brown don't see him as a pro-bowler (at least most of us), but see him as an adequate starter who would look even better if he was the weakest link on the line.

Wheeler and Pulley are also backup level players at this point. So even if you feel Brown is a bottom 1/3 of the NFL starting RG, its still much easier to find significant improvements at C/RT and the gap from Wheeler/Pulley to those players will be much larger than Brown to some theoretical player.
RE: RE: RE: BigBlue  
BigBlueDownTheShore : 12/11/2018 3:30 pm : link
In comment 14214944 ryanmkeane said:
Quote:
In comment 14214940 BigBlueDownTheShore said:


Quote:


In comment 14214926 ryanmkeane said:


Quote:


by this notion, we would never want to upgrade any player if he was doing OK. Brown was the #72 overall pick in 2015 draft, has been injured and suspended with Rams, but played alright.

You're gonna tell me we can't upgrade this position?



He is good enough to keep around, and I'm sure he will look better with a blue chip center or RT next to him.




OK, but a better player than Brown, would look even better than this with a blue chip center or RT next to him. Why must we just plant Brown in there at RG?

If there is a great RG prospect in round 2 or 3...and the Center or RT prospects are just "eh"...you're gonna tell me the Giants would pass on the RG because the need is better at RT or C? That's ridiculous.


Sure draft someone in a later round.

I just don't see the team drafting RT, C, Guard in a draft at this point. I know that is a ton of BBI's wet dreams.

We need a ton of defensive help to go along with some Oline talent.
Agree with Jon  
Dave on the UWS : 12/11/2018 4:10 pm : link
3-5 for Brown some decent quaranteed money. The biggest positive is continuity. Important on the OL. They like Halapio. But if they can upgrade C,RG and RT in the draft or FA they will. There are holes in the secondary and LB that are just as important if not more so to fill first.
Jamon Brown  
Bluesbreaker : 12/11/2018 5:43 pm : link
We have a few more games to see how he does he has the size
and he is only 25 . Were gonna have a top 5-7 pick
if Herbert doesn't declare then its LT or Edge rusher
If he does I think he is the pick .
Soldier is getting near the end and we need help with pass rusher . My guy would be Josh Allen .best LT available would
be fine as well plug him into the RT spot and add a Center.
RE: The team  
Boy Cord : 12/11/2018 8:11 pm : link
In comment 14214783 darren in pdx said:
Quote:
was high on Halapio based on reports, he seemed to be doing okay and improving, but I think the team needs to sign or draft someone regardless. He broke his ankle and lower leg, it’s going to be awhile before he trusts his leg and who knows if he’ll get back to where he was.


I got high on Halapio once and let me tell you, that was some fucked up shit.
RE: Jamon Brown  
Diver_Down : 12/11/2018 8:35 pm : link
In comment 14215144 Bluesbreaker said:
Quote:
We have a few more games to see how he does he has the size
and he is only 25 . Were gonna have a top 5-7 pick
if Herbert doesn't declare then its LT or Edge rusher
If he does I think he is the pick .
Soldier is getting near the end and we need help with pass rusher . My guy would be Josh Allen .best LT available would
be fine as well plug him into the RT spot and add a Center.


Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but we are already picking outside of the top 10. The only way we are picking between 5-7 is that we lose out those teams that are ahead of us win out. It's not happening.
I want Kareem McKenzie back  
djm : 12/11/2018 8:52 pm : link
.
My eyes ....  
short lease : 12/11/2018 10:47 pm : link
The first time I read that I read

"enough money to get a FART?"

dam .... I am getting old.
Jamon Brown  
Big_Pete : 12/12/2018 1:40 am : link
I would expect his next contract will be in a similar ballpark to the 3 year, $15m deal we gave Omameh.

I can't ser us paying too much more. I expect wr will target a RT in free agency. Plus there are defensive needs.
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