I'd wager it knocks him down in the draft a bit. He's not yet a top 15 talent in my eyes.
He's more polished than Herbert is. He can read defenses and he goes through his progression very well. He keeps his eyes downfield and has a cannon as well as very very accurate and is mobile. How does this not scream top 15 to you? I don't understand...
Explain how he's overrated? From what I'm reading on random articles and tweets is that he's now the top QB prospect. He's had a phenomenal season while breaking alot of records in the process, as well as being a Heisman finalist. So go ahead and share your explanation
Tim Tebow broke a lot of records too and he won a Heisman.
RE: RE: Assuming all the elite edge rush prospects are gone Â
Greedy Williams is taken and no great OT available, I think 10 is a great spot for the FS from Alabama (Thompson).
If Greedy and all elite edge rushers are gone, that will leave Jonah Williams sitting there for us. Taking care of the RT spot is far more important than FS. Both need addressing, but the trenches will be prioritized.
Reading things on Jonah Williams, scouts are calling him an overachiever with very short arms and underweight. They're projecting him to guard, not tackle. He does have sound technique though
Explain how he's overrated? From what I'm reading on random articles and tweets is that he's now the top QB prospect. He's had a phenomenal season while breaking alot of records in the process, as well as being a Heisman finalist. So go ahead and share your explanation
Tim Tebow broke a lot of records too and he won a Heisman.
That statement still doesn't explain how he's overrated Smh. Everyone knew Tebow wasn't going to succeed as a QB at the next level. This comparison you made is hot garbage. Haskins clearly has very good arm talent. Try again.
Posters who have called Haskins overrated, mediocre etc, have given no reasoning as to why you label him as such. Sounds like you're just spouting random nonsense just for the sake of it. How bout and explanation as to why you label Haskins as such?
I'd wager it knocks him down in the draft a bit. He's not yet a top 15 talent in my eyes.
He's more polished than Herbert is. He can read defenses and he goes through his progression very well. He keeps his eyes downfield and has a cannon as well as very very accurate and is mobile. How does this not scream top 15 to you? I don't understand...
As bw correctly outlined, OSU was often playing in 7 on 7 type contests due to the talent disparity their opponents suffered. I don't see the accuracy or mobility being a given in the NFL, both will need to growth a great deal to translate to the NFL. He's also got to lose considerable lbs, he's tubby.
Top 15 includes non-QBs, I think it's quite possible he's not a top 15 talent in this crop.
Why do you say barf about Haskins? What don't you like about him?
Plays with so much more elite talent than the teams he faced. Even against Michigan they picked on their worst defender all game. He’s not as mobile as people think. Urbs QBs ALWAYS put up insane stats. And yet only one has had any success in the NFL and that’s Alex Smith.
His deep ball isn’t the most impressive and tends to lock on o e WR. He has by far the biggest bust ability out of any QB coming out. His yardage is inflated cause his WRs get in space and are just faster than all the other players on the field.
Picking on the worst defender is called game planning, every team does it to exploit a weakness that will help the team win. That part makes literally no sense at all. I respect what else you wrote even though I don't agree with it
accuracy and touch were issues when the windows were tight. Working quickly through multiple progressions, keeping mechanics in tact, and hitting moving targets through those windows in the NFL with live bullets flying is much, much harder. Also, Meyer hasn't put many effective QBs in the NFL, if any, the " college system QB" label can't be tossed away.
I'd make an analogy between the Haskins situation and Matt Leinart Â
different coasts but both played on talent-laden, overpowering offensive units. This led to a misevaluation of Leinart's ability.
I don't see how any scouting would reveal whether Haskins would be able to consistently fit passes into tight windows while under significant pressure, like he'd need to do in the NFL. I'm not saying he can't do it -- I'm saying there's no way for scouting to tell whether he can. So I agree with bw's comment about drafting him in the 1st round is remote thrower.
"Posters who have called Haskins overrated, mediocre etc,"
No one's saying he's not a very good college QB. The ever-present question is whether his skills translate to the NFL. I maintain that we don't know and, more than that, we can't know.
I'd wager it knocks him down in the draft a bit. He's not yet a top 15 talent in my eyes.
He's more polished than Herbert is. He can read defenses and he goes through his progression very well. He keeps his eyes downfield and has a cannon as well as very very accurate and is mobile. How does this not scream top 15 to you? I don't understand...
As bw correctly outlined, OSU was often playing in 7 on 7 type contests due to the talent disparity their opponents suffered. I don't see the accuracy or mobility being a given in the NFL, both will need to growth a great deal to translate to the NFL. He's also got to lose considerable lbs, he's tubby.
Top 15 includes non-QBs, I think it's quite possible he's not a top 15 talent in this crop.
There was no talent disparity in the Michigan game and he absolutely dominated them, so I have to disagree with that point. Big Ben is fat as shit yet that hasn't stopped him from being a great QB and Haskins is no where near his size. Plus he'll be working with NFL trainers, he'll be fine as far as his physical physique. Ok I respect the top 15 including non QB types, that I understand. He had a 70 percent completion rate, playing against very good defenses, including the no. 1 rated defense at the time in Michigan. He's mobile enough and showed that he can move around in the pocket well.
myself included, would have said Barf to trading up from 22 to 9 to take Mahomes two years ago??? If the Giants do draft a QB at 10, it means they think he's going be good.
That's not remotely fair to Haskins as a prospect, nor is bringing up Tim Tebow in any context. I guess it's possible that Haskins had the most time to throw in the history of the Big Ten conference as well as the best group of receivers, but they sound like stretches to me. His production was far superior to anything Darnold, Rosen, or Allen ever did. His numbers were superior to anything JT Barrett did in the same offense. Baker Mayfield's production was matched almost exactly by his successor.
He's certainly not a perfect prospect. Like I said before, he's definitely as good as any of the 4 quarterbacks drafted in the top 10 in 2018.
accuracy and touch were issues when the windows were tight. Working quickly through multiple progressions, keeping mechanics in tact, and hitting moving targets through those windows in the NFL with live bullets flying is much, much harder. Also, Meyer hasn't put many effective QBs in the NFL, if any, the " college system QB" label can't be tossed away.
I think he progressed a lot in these aspects as the year went on, understandable given this was his first year starting. Big 10 championship game really showed this where he had to hit tighter windows than he did against Michigan and also made plays improvising and moving out of the pocket. Urban's offense no doubt is advantageous to QB stats. But Haskins put some really good stuff on tape late in the season
He's unlike any QB Meyer has had, he's a pure pocket guy with some mobility when necessary but he's not a runner, like Urban usually has. Don't think any comparison to his past Qbs are really relevant.
There are question marks, no doubt. He is raw, but the arm talent I think is the best in this draft. That doesn't count for everything though
Re OSU vs Michigan, there absolutely was a talent disparity. The Mich DBs could not keep up with the quickness and speed of the OSU WRs. Haskins was throwing to receivers who were either wide open or had clean separation. And that's probably the stiffest test Haskins has faced. Hence my position: we simply don't know what level talent Haskins is.
who had the total package coming out of tiny Miami OH. I saw him play a number of times while in college, he had "it" in spades. Don't see it with Haskins.
Michigan was the exception, not the rule.
TBD.
RE: I'd make an analogy between the Haskins situation and Matt Leinart Â
different coasts but both played on talent-laden, overpowering offensive units. This led to a misevaluation of Leinart's ability.
I don't see how any scouting would reveal whether Haskins would be able to consistently fit passes into tight windows while under significant pressure, like he'd need to do in the NFL. I'm not saying he can't do it -- I'm saying there's no way for scouting to tell whether he can. So I agree with bw's comment about drafting him in the 1st round is remote thrower.
That goes for any college QB then. Since none of them play in the league, we don't know if any of them can fit their throws into tight windows against NFL DBs, so that explanation still doesn't make sense. With that logic drafting any college QB in the first round would be a remote thrower.
That's not remotely fair to Haskins as a prospect, nor is bringing up Tim Tebow in any context. I guess it's possible that Haskins had the most time to throw in the history of the Big Ten conference as well as the best group of receivers, but they sound like stretches to me. His production was far superior to anything Darnold, Rosen, or Allen ever did. His numbers were superior to anything JT Barrett did in the same offense. Baker Mayfield's production was matched almost exactly by his successor.
He's certainly not a perfect prospect. Like I said before, he's definitely as good as any of the 4 quarterbacks drafted in the top 10 in 2018.
The TD throws are at 0:12, 1:50, and 4:11 in particular I thought were some of the best things he put on tape all season. Each one a little bit different, the first and last required him to throw from different platforms and move in the pocket. Link - ( New Window )
to cite in favor of Haskins than the Michigan game. OSU completely out schemed Michigan. Guys were wide open.
Kyle - That's interesting. Would you claim the Northwestern playoff game as a better game to gauge Haskins' talent? If not, please suggest one so we can check it out ourselves.
to cite in favor of Haskins than the Michigan game. OSU completely out schemed Michigan. Guys were wide open.
Kyle - That's interesting. Would you claim the Northwestern playoff game as a better game to gauge Haskins' talent? If not, please suggest one so we can check it out ourselves.
I thought Northwestern was his best game. He couldn't miss that night. And that defense put up a much better fight than Michigan did. He actually had to hit some tight windows. Now Northwestern is a solid team, though it's obviously not an elite playoff caliber squad. Unfortunately he wasn't given the chance to face Bama which would have been really interesting. Washington in the Rose Bowl will be a decent test
was I saw two games where his OL didnt give him all the time in the world...
PSU
Purdue
His first three and a half quarters against PSU werent good. His stats look nice due to the fact PSU couldnt figure out OSU's screen name. But he struggled that night.
Purdue was his worst game were he consistently saw pressure.
And while he isnt a statue.... I dont see his mobility translate well in the NFL.
was I saw two games where his OL didnt give him all the time in the world...
PSU
Purdue
His first three and a half quarters against PSU werent good. His stats look nice due to the fact PSU couldnt figure out OSU's screen name. But he struggled that night.
Purdue was his worst game were he consistently saw pressure.
And while he isnt a statue.... I dont see his mobility translate well in the NFL.
Thank you, I respect your analysis of those two games and I agree with you on your assessment of those two games as well. We all talk about mobility but I guess we've forgotten we have the most immobile QB in the league in Eli lol, so anything that's remotely higher than him as far as mobility is a win
I am not as high on mobility as most. But I dont see him as a mobile QB. He can get out of the pocket and make throws. But he isnt a Trubinsky, Rodgers, Wilson, Mahomes.... I consider those guys as mobile QBs. Cause they can run for 15-20 yards consistently.
So when they say his mobility is a strength, I just dont see it at the NFL level.
I am not high on any of these QBs either. I probably wouldnt touch any of them in the first round. Herbert has a special arm but he has huge question marks too.
He made the Buckeye faithful quickly the Barrett and his 35TD passes the prior year.
I watch a ton of OSU games. They are loaded with pro prospects on both sides. I actually think they are as talented as Bama up and down their roster.
But for Haskins, I can't recall a QB having a more comfortable pocket and open receivers to throw to than Haskins this year. It was like 7 on 7 drills most games for OSU because the B1G was down this year.
While I certainly give him credit for making plays with his mobility, and showing decent accuracy, I think his production is highly skewed by his circumstances.
I wouldn't touch him in round one. I think there is definite upside, but still a real project. So if we draft him at #10, it would be a definite remote smasher.
If you wouldn't touch him in round 1, who would you draft instead? I'll give my response to what you wrote after I see your answer.
AT QB, either Grier or Lock. I'm just not sure where in the draft I'd grab them.
I love Grier, but not sure he's be worth a first rounder in the top half of the first round.
Metrics wise, I think I could be talked into Lock as a top 15 pick. There is a lot there to like...
RE: So to those who think he's not ready, mediocre Â
Or he'd be a remote thrower, what an would you choose if we were going QB assuming they all were still available
If this team is 'going QB' no matter what then they are not a well run team. Of course, I'm sure if the Giants take someone besides a QB in the first round then they'll get a poor draft grade from all the pundits like McShay and Kiper.
Take the BPA. In my opinion that's going to be an OL or an edge rusher - which could be a DE or a LB. Depending on where the pick is it could be a DB.
Haskins just screams 'system QB' to me. And the talent level of Ohio State's RBs and WRs makes a big difference in his numbers. Against Michigan they ran crossing routes all day long and picked on Watson (the third DB) for Michigan, both Michigan DEs were hurt and couldn't get pressure, and Don Brown didn't ever adjust. As a Michigan fan that game was brutal.
I probably saw Haskins play every game this year... Â
I agree with Kyle (and Tyrik), that Haskins is unlike any other QB Urban has brought up. he's not a mobile, playmaker, he's a pocket passer than can extend plays to a degree. He has an absolute rifle for an arm. So I don't think comparisons to any of the QB's in Urban's past makes sense.
A system QB, not sure I agree with that, Urban's system is set up for a JT Barrett or a Tebow, NOT a Haskins type player. So I don't think about him in terms of a system QB.
He did slump somewhat during mid-season, and those are the games you may want to evaluate (PSU, Ind, Minn, Purdue), but was still respectable in those games.
Its hard to determine his NFL prospects, he's in a different mold than what's been coming out lately. He is a big armed pocket passer with some ("some") mobility. As far as working through progressions and all that, I'm not an expert but assume if he threw 45 TD passes, and as a starter for one of the Top 3 college programs in the country, he has that ability.
Most PSU running backs in the last 2 decades have had an inordinate number of injuries. Larry Johnson is an exception. It is blatantly unfair to write that all Penn State running backs suck. PSU is among the leaders in all-time NFL rushing yards.
A buddy of mine is his first cousin. He said he's still undecided about coming out as of Thanksgiving weekend. We'll see but I don't want him at 10. I'd rather have White or Little
Where is Haskins from? I know he went to private school in Potomac, MD.
He lived in Highland Park, NJ until his early teens
RE: I probably saw Haskins play every game this year... Â
Its hard to determine his NFL prospects, he's in a different mold than what's been coming out lately. He is a big armed pocket passer with some ("some") mobility. As far as working through progressions and all that, I'm not an expert but assume if he threw 45 TD passes, and as a starter for one of the Top 3 college programs in the country, he has that ability.
Haskins certainly has ability. And you are right about his production being noteworthy.
Except for a game or two, however, that Oline gave Haskins a comfortable environment to throw and his receivers overwhelmed most B1G secondaries. So he had some fairly straightforward throws at this disposal. Look at that come back against PSU this year. Which throws were great? A lot of the work done was by his receivers. Hey, I get it, that's part of the game. But I think it makes it trickier to evaluate Haskins.
So for me, he's more of a project. A player who is hard to separate where the talent was the factor or the team's talent and concepts were...
I agree, I think he may be somewhat of a project. But he was only the starter for 1 year, although he's like a 5th year Soph (whatever that means - hopefully not a Soph for five years!), and Urban changed around a lot of the offense for him to succeed (Note the knock on OSU this year is that they had no run offense - which they did with Weber and Dobbins, but they didn't run much RPO as they have in the past).
Also, I agree, he did have a strong set of WR's and the OL did, for the most part, provide a lot of time for him.
Haskins looks to have natural throwing motion, steps up in pocket, puts touch on the long ball and has general awareness of pressure in the pocket.
Compared to other College QBs being floated as first round picks, it seems he has the talent to compete at high level and worth looking at. For example after watching some Will Grier highlights (again not scientific), you can clearly see him throwing off his back foot against much lower level of comp. Maybe he has the arm talent and more experience, but fixing bad footwork is harder to coach out of these guys at NFL level.
He totally stars down his receiver, doesn't go through a progression basically because he doesn't have to. However watch the Purdue game and see if this is your guy, The best QB at Ohio State is the sophmore from Bischop Gorman
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Explain how he's overrated? From what I'm reading on random articles and tweets is that he's now the top QB prospect. He's had a phenomenal season while breaking alot of records in the process, as well as being a Heisman finalist. So go ahead and share your explanation
They trade Beckham and pick both a pass rusher and QB. Don't need Beckham on this team. He will never go for second fiddle, go get the first and third that you can get and be thankful we got rid of him for that now that we can.
Has nothing to do with his team. Basically like saying you wouldn't draft Saquon, because all Penn State RBs suck.
Actually it would be more like saying you wouldn't draft an RB who goes to a school that always has excellent RB production from players who don't duplicate that success in the NFL.
He's more polished than Herbert is. He can read defenses and he goes through his progression very well. He keeps his eyes downfield and has a cannon as well as very very accurate and is mobile. How does this not scream top 15 to you? I don't understand...
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Explain how he's overrated? From what I'm reading on random articles and tweets is that he's now the top QB prospect. He's had a phenomenal season while breaking alot of records in the process, as well as being a Heisman finalist. So go ahead and share your explanation
Tim Tebow broke a lot of records too and he won a Heisman.
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Greedy Williams is taken and no great OT available, I think 10 is a great spot for the FS from Alabama (Thompson).
If Greedy and all elite edge rushers are gone, that will leave Jonah Williams sitting there for us. Taking care of the RT spot is far more important than FS. Both need addressing, but the trenches will be prioritized.
Reading things on Jonah Williams, scouts are calling him an overachiever with very short arms and underweight. They're projecting him to guard, not tackle. He does have sound technique though
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would love to bolster our OLB/Edge rush guys.
Would love to see this move, local kid from Montclair High who wasn't a big time recruit but he's turned into a heck of a player
He's from my high school!!! He'd be a hell of a pick for us though, really like this kid
So who, in your opinion, is a franchise qb?
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In comment 14215577 gtt350 said:
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Explain how he's overrated? From what I'm reading on random articles and tweets is that he's now the top QB prospect. He's had a phenomenal season while breaking alot of records in the process, as well as being a Heisman finalist. So go ahead and share your explanation
Tim Tebow broke a lot of records too and he won a Heisman.
That statement still doesn't explain how he's overrated Smh. Everyone knew Tebow wasn't going to succeed as a QB at the next level. This comparison you made is hot garbage. Haskins clearly has very good arm talent. Try again.
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I'd wager it knocks him down in the draft a bit. He's not yet a top 15 talent in my eyes.
He's more polished than Herbert is. He can read defenses and he goes through his progression very well. He keeps his eyes downfield and has a cannon as well as very very accurate and is mobile. How does this not scream top 15 to you? I don't understand...
As bw correctly outlined, OSU was often playing in 7 on 7 type contests due to the talent disparity their opponents suffered. I don't see the accuracy or mobility being a given in the NFL, both will need to growth a great deal to translate to the NFL. He's also got to lose considerable lbs, he's tubby.
Top 15 includes non-QBs, I think it's quite possible he's not a top 15 talent in this crop.
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Why do you say barf about Haskins? What don't you like about him?
Plays with so much more elite talent than the teams he faced. Even against Michigan they picked on their worst defender all game. He’s not as mobile as people think. Urbs QBs ALWAYS put up insane stats. And yet only one has had any success in the NFL and that’s Alex Smith.
His deep ball isn’t the most impressive and tends to lock on o e WR. He has by far the biggest bust ability out of any QB coming out. His yardage is inflated cause his WRs get in space and are just faster than all the other players on the field.
Picking on the worst defender is called game planning, every team does it to exploit a weakness that will help the team win. That part makes literally no sense at all. I respect what else you wrote even though I don't agree with it
I don't see how any scouting would reveal whether Haskins would be able to consistently fit passes into tight windows while under significant pressure, like he'd need to do in the NFL. I'm not saying he can't do it -- I'm saying there's no way for scouting to tell whether he can. So I agree with bw's comment about drafting him in the 1st round is remote thrower.
No one's saying he's not a very good college QB. The ever-present question is whether his skills translate to the NFL. I maintain that we don't know and, more than that, we can't know.
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In comment 14215681 JonC said:
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I'd wager it knocks him down in the draft a bit. He's not yet a top 15 talent in my eyes.
He's more polished than Herbert is. He can read defenses and he goes through his progression very well. He keeps his eyes downfield and has a cannon as well as very very accurate and is mobile. How does this not scream top 15 to you? I don't understand...
As bw correctly outlined, OSU was often playing in 7 on 7 type contests due to the talent disparity their opponents suffered. I don't see the accuracy or mobility being a given in the NFL, both will need to growth a great deal to translate to the NFL. He's also got to lose considerable lbs, he's tubby.
Top 15 includes non-QBs, I think it's quite possible he's not a top 15 talent in this crop.
There was no talent disparity in the Michigan game and he absolutely dominated them, so I have to disagree with that point. Big Ben is fat as shit yet that hasn't stopped him from being a great QB and Haskins is no where near his size. Plus he'll be working with NFL trainers, he'll be fine as far as his physical physique. Ok I respect the top 15 including non QB types, that I understand. He had a 70 percent completion rate, playing against very good defenses, including the no. 1 rated defense at the time in Michigan. He's mobile enough and showed that he can move around in the pocket well.
That's not remotely fair to Haskins as a prospect, nor is bringing up Tim Tebow in any context. I guess it's possible that Haskins had the most time to throw in the history of the Big Ten conference as well as the best group of receivers, but they sound like stretches to me. His production was far superior to anything Darnold, Rosen, or Allen ever did. His numbers were superior to anything JT Barrett did in the same offense. Baker Mayfield's production was matched almost exactly by his successor.
He's certainly not a perfect prospect. Like I said before, he's definitely as good as any of the 4 quarterbacks drafted in the top 10 in 2018.
I think he progressed a lot in these aspects as the year went on, understandable given this was his first year starting. Big 10 championship game really showed this where he had to hit tighter windows than he did against Michigan and also made plays improvising and moving out of the pocket. Urban's offense no doubt is advantageous to QB stats. But Haskins put some really good stuff on tape late in the season
He's unlike any QB Meyer has had, he's a pure pocket guy with some mobility when necessary but he's not a runner, like Urban usually has. Don't think any comparison to his past Qbs are really relevant.
There are question marks, no doubt. He is raw, but the arm talent I think is the best in this draft. That doesn't count for everything though
Michigan was the exception, not the rule.
TBD.
I don't see how any scouting would reveal whether Haskins would be able to consistently fit passes into tight windows while under significant pressure, like he'd need to do in the NFL. I'm not saying he can't do it -- I'm saying there's no way for scouting to tell whether he can. So I agree with bw's comment about drafting him in the 1st round is remote thrower.
That goes for any college QB then. Since none of them play in the league, we don't know if any of them can fit their throws into tight windows against NFL DBs, so that explanation still doesn't make sense. With that logic drafting any college QB in the first round would be a remote thrower.
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DO NOT draft a QB just to draft a QB. EVER.
That's not remotely fair to Haskins as a prospect, nor is bringing up Tim Tebow in any context. I guess it's possible that Haskins had the most time to throw in the history of the Big Ten conference as well as the best group of receivers, but they sound like stretches to me. His production was far superior to anything Darnold, Rosen, or Allen ever did. His numbers were superior to anything JT Barrett did in the same offense. Baker Mayfield's production was matched almost exactly by his successor.
He's certainly not a perfect prospect. Like I said before, he's definitely as good as any of the 4 quarterbacks drafted in the top 10 in 2018.
This, right here, is a very good explanation sir
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to cite in favor of Haskins than the Michigan game. OSU completely out schemed Michigan. Guys were wide open.
Kyle - That's interesting. Would you claim the Northwestern playoff game as a better game to gauge Haskins' talent? If not, please suggest one so we can check it out ourselves.
I thought Northwestern was his best game. He couldn't miss that night. And that defense put up a much better fight than Michigan did. He actually had to hit some tight windows. Now Northwestern is a solid team, though it's obviously not an elite playoff caliber squad. Unfortunately he wasn't given the chance to face Bama which would have been really interesting. Washington in the Rose Bowl will be a decent test
PSU
Purdue
His first three and a half quarters against PSU werent good. His stats look nice due to the fact PSU couldnt figure out OSU's screen name. But he struggled that night.
Purdue was his worst game were he consistently saw pressure.
And while he isnt a statue.... I dont see his mobility translate well in the NFL.
PSU
Purdue
His first three and a half quarters against PSU werent good. His stats look nice due to the fact PSU couldnt figure out OSU's screen name. But he struggled that night.
Purdue was his worst game were he consistently saw pressure.
And while he isnt a statue.... I dont see his mobility translate well in the NFL.
Thank you, I respect your analysis of those two games and I agree with you on your assessment of those two games as well. We all talk about mobility but I guess we've forgotten we have the most immobile QB in the league in Eli lol, so anything that's remotely higher than him as far as mobility is a win
So when they say his mobility is a strength, I just dont see it at the NFL level.
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He made the Buckeye faithful quickly the Barrett and his 35TD passes the prior year.
I watch a ton of OSU games. They are loaded with pro prospects on both sides. I actually think they are as talented as Bama up and down their roster.
But for Haskins, I can't recall a QB having a more comfortable pocket and open receivers to throw to than Haskins this year. It was like 7 on 7 drills most games for OSU because the B1G was down this year.
While I certainly give him credit for making plays with his mobility, and showing decent accuracy, I think his production is highly skewed by his circumstances.
I wouldn't touch him in round one. I think there is definite upside, but still a real project. So if we draft him at #10, it would be a definite remote smasher.
If you wouldn't touch him in round 1, who would you draft instead? I'll give my response to what you wrote after I see your answer.
AT QB, either Grier or Lock. I'm just not sure where in the draft I'd grab them.
I love Grier, but not sure he's be worth a first rounder in the top half of the first round.
Metrics wise, I think I could be talked into Lock as a top 15 pick. There is a lot there to like...
If this team is 'going QB' no matter what then they are not a well run team. Of course, I'm sure if the Giants take someone besides a QB in the first round then they'll get a poor draft grade from all the pundits like McShay and Kiper.
Take the BPA. In my opinion that's going to be an OL or an edge rusher - which could be a DE or a LB. Depending on where the pick is it could be a DB.
Haskins just screams 'system QB' to me. And the talent level of Ohio State's RBs and WRs makes a big difference in his numbers. Against Michigan they ran crossing routes all day long and picked on Watson (the third DB) for Michigan, both Michigan DEs were hurt and couldn't get pressure, and Don Brown didn't ever adjust. As a Michigan fan that game was brutal.
I agree with Kyle (and Tyrik), that Haskins is unlike any other QB Urban has brought up. he's not a mobile, playmaker, he's a pocket passer than can extend plays to a degree. He has an absolute rifle for an arm. So I don't think comparisons to any of the QB's in Urban's past makes sense.
A system QB, not sure I agree with that, Urban's system is set up for a JT Barrett or a Tebow, NOT a Haskins type player. So I don't think about him in terms of a system QB.
He did slump somewhat during mid-season, and those are the games you may want to evaluate (PSU, Ind, Minn, Purdue), but was still respectable in those games.
Its hard to determine his NFL prospects, he's in a different mold than what's been coming out lately. He is a big armed pocket passer with some ("some") mobility. As far as working through progressions and all that, I'm not an expert but assume if he threw 45 TD passes, and as a starter for one of the Top 3 college programs in the country, he has that ability.
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A buddy of mine is his first cousin. He said he's still undecided about coming out as of Thanksgiving weekend. We'll see but I don't want him at 10. I'd rather have White or Little
Where is Haskins from? I know he went to private school in Potomac, MD.
He lived in Highland Park, NJ until his early teens
Its hard to determine his NFL prospects, he's in a different mold than what's been coming out lately. He is a big armed pocket passer with some ("some") mobility. As far as working through progressions and all that, I'm not an expert but assume if he threw 45 TD passes, and as a starter for one of the Top 3 college programs in the country, he has that ability.
Haskins certainly has ability. And you are right about his production being noteworthy.
Except for a game or two, however, that Oline gave Haskins a comfortable environment to throw and his receivers overwhelmed most B1G secondaries. So he had some fairly straightforward throws at this disposal. Look at that come back against PSU this year. Which throws were great? A lot of the work done was by his receivers. Hey, I get it, that's part of the game. But I think it makes it trickier to evaluate Haskins.
So for me, he's more of a project. A player who is hard to separate where the talent was the factor or the team's talent and concepts were...
Also, I agree, he did have a strong set of WR's and the OL did, for the most part, provide a lot of time for him.
Tough call...
Compared to other College QBs being floated as first round picks, it seems he has the talent to compete at high level and worth looking at. For example after watching some Will Grier highlights (again not scientific), you can clearly see him throwing off his back foot against much lower level of comp. Maybe he has the arm talent and more experience, but fixing bad footwork is harder to coach out of these guys at NFL level.
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He totally stars down his receiver, doesn't go through a progression basically because he doesn't have to. However watch the Purdue game and see if this is your guy, The best QB at Ohio State is the sophmore from Bischop Gorman
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Explain how he's overrated? From what I'm reading on random articles and tweets is that he's now the top QB prospect. He's had a phenomenal season while breaking alot of records in the process, as well as being a Heisman finalist. So go ahead and share your explanation
Actually it would be more like saying you wouldn't draft an RB who goes to a school that always has excellent RB production from players who don't duplicate that success in the NFL.