They Love Him in Tampa Bay

he just did not fit here.

In comment 14216648 SterlingArcher said:

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he just did not fit here.

Lots of people here disputed that he was a good player the last few years and on top of that many questioned his effort.

He's long gone, playing well in TB on a loser defense and the Giants got out of the money. Their team is terrible - the Giants aren't much better - what's there to discuss?

It's a good dump by the Giants.

payday and something to prove.

his last year, which was pretty stupid since he was in his contract year and not likely to want to look bad.

People didn't know that Vernon's injured hand affected his play in his first season here until after the season was over.

"If you can't say anything nice, then don't say anything at all."

In comment 14216676 B in ALB said:

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He's long gone, playing well in TB on a loser defense and the Giants got out of the money. Their team is terrible - the Giants aren't much better - what's there to discuss? It's a good dump by the Giants.

And whom did the Giants get for the 3rd-round pick? BJ Hill or Carter? Giants made out great in that deal.

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The only time he plays well is when it's time for a SHO'NUFF : 12/12/2018 11:36 pm : link : reply payday and something to prove.

Really just stupid.

JPP this week? Very strong game, again. Active, hustling, and a beast vs the run. He’s got the sack numbers but he’s playing the run too. He’s at pro bowl level this year.

And gave up a 4th to pay ogletree 10-11 million/year.

We could have kept him and still had the 4th rounder without Ogletree, Barwin (useless) and Omameh (less than useless).

Was disappointed when they traded him but fully understood why. At least the comp was decent unlike the snacks trade. Never been a fan of the Vernon signing but hope he does well. Good player just never thought he was worth that contract.

This coming year. No way the cowboys let him hit the market but Lawrence is worth that type of contract.

might be having a good year, but he wasn’t worth keeping. He had an excellent first 2 years and then did very little.

In comment 14216691 KWALL2 said:

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Quote: The only time he plays well is when it's time for a SHO'NUFF : 12/12/2018 11:36 pm : link : reply payday and something to prove. Really just stupid. JPP this week? Very strong game, again. Active, hustling, and a beast vs the run. He’s got the sack numbers but he’s playing the run too. He’s at pro bowl level this year.

And you're the one getting conned once again by JPP... he will be shit again next year since he "proved" his point and really stuck it to us this year, yawn... this is coming from someone who wanted him resigned after the fireworks incident.

In comment 14216693 KWALL2 said:

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And gave up a 4th to pay ogletree 10-11 million/year. We could have kept him and still had the 4th rounder without Ogletree, Barwin (useless) and Omameh (less than useless).

They got a 3rd for JPP. They swapped 4th round picks with the Bucs.

In comment 14216693 KWALL2 said:

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And gave up a 4th to pay ogletree 10-11 million/year. We could have kept him and still had the 4th rounder without Ogletree, Barwin (useless) and Omameh (less than useless).

No they didn't. They got the 69th overall pick and 108th overall pick. They gave up JPP and the 102nd overall pick.

reportedly an addition by subtraction in the locker room. He always struck me as somewhat of a clown, certainly not a leadership type. Not every guy needs to be a Justin Tuck, but we were devoid of tone-setters in that defensive huddle. JPP’s was as much a part of culture change as anything else, and we got a decent haul for him, all things considered.

“Thank u, next,” as they say!

That 3rd turned into BJ Hill. The 4th was Kyle Lauletta.

They took Lorenzo Carter with their own 3rd.

That is a win.

Tampa Bay traded the Giants 4th round pick to Minnesota, and it turned into Ohio State DE Jaylen Holmes.

Has the natural talent and athleticism to be a great/dominant player, but never seemed to want to put the effort in to achieve his potential. It seemed liked every other season he was mailing it in on Sundays.

has been quite good for the Giants. This trade is a win for the Giants going forward. It’s not even close. Good for JPP. I hope he’s happy and continues to do well for a few years more. His time here was done.

But, he was/is worth no where near the money the Giants paid.
The Giants best move of the off season was trading JPP and getting rid of that ridiculous contract AND getting a 3rd round pick and a fine addition to our D.

on this team, he would have gotten rid of him 3 years before we actually did

I really liked JPP! But his last few years were nothing to right home about. Given his contract and lack of production, it was a good move by Getts.

I am happy to see playing well but it always make me question players that go from so so production to high level production in situations like this. It happens a lot when it’s contract time, but just by looking at the stat line JPP has reverted back to 2011 JPP which is a far cry from his last few years in NY. That can’t all be system, coaches, etc.

than she earned or deserves ... and 2011 is long gone.

is a guy that would get stoned at the line of scrimmage all game then get a sack. Then, he'd have a two sack game against some bottom feeder team. His stats looked good, but if you watched the games you knew that the stats didn't tell the whole story.

But he didn’t play that well here. Between his back injury and his hand he went through long stretches of mediocrity. The Bucs rolled the dice and won (and got him for less money than we would have paid) but his time here was over.

Ultimately JPP's injuries have sapped him in critical points and the last contract after he had abdominal surgery was not wise.

But as far as career and all that, take a look at his production against Justin Tuck.

Is better then JPP

In comment 14216786 TommyWiseau said:

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Is better then JPP

Of course he is ... In Giants land

Jpp never worked Hard he never hustled ....Somehow he managed 70 career sacks, easy feat to accomplish in the NFL

if you understand what you're watching, it isn't hard to see it.

point being overlooked is that JPP is not a 3-4 DL.

In comment 14216786 TommyWiseau said:

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Is better then JPP

What are you smoking?

In comment 14216773 JonC said:

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than she earned or deserves ... and 2011 is long gone.

Haha perfect analogy

In comment 14216821 FatMan in Charlotte said:

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point being overlooked is that JPP is not a 3-4 DL.

he could play DE in the 3-4. He is plenty stout enough

It's amazing what morale can do for people/productivity. I think that is true in any industry.

to discredit their own players.

He's 7th all time in team history in sacks behind Justin Tuck. By any measure it was a successful Giants career and he had a brilliant run as the best defensive player on a team that won a super bowl. And despite losing parts of his hand, rehabbing back to playable condition, and tons of video evidence which illustrated that he played the run just as ably as he rushed the passer, you've got couch warriors calling him a lazy low-effort player and happily buying into the not-evidenced idea that he was somehow a locker room problem.

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Man, there is a pervasive habit of Giants fans Ten Ton Hammer : 9:08 am : link : reply to discredit their own players.

Doesn't one just have to open a thread about Eli Manning, Ogletree, Solder, Beckham or Collins to realize this?

Heck, add Gettleman and Shurmur to it too.

If your comments are directed at me ... you're free to believe what you choose. I know what I see in terms of football on the field, the effort was not always there, and it was not always due to injury. JPP v2011 was gone shortly thereafter. I can tell you for a fact he was traded because he was deemed a negative, a wildcard, under-performing, etc.

This is a waste of time.

He definitely took some plays easy, but there were seasons when he was playing 90% of the snaps in games played.

Again, I'm not trying to make him out to be more than he was. He definitely had some attitude and maturity issues. And as much praise as he should get for rehabbing back from the hand, he cost the team that year.

But his productivity is really hard to argue. I mean he's like right behind Jason Sehorn on passes defended and Justin Tuck on sacks.

a key role in franchise history.

There are plenty of people more than willing to mount a spirited and aggressive defense for certain players. Some of them just take it overboard. On the opposite end of the spectrum, guys who have helped put trophies in the case, and who's only misstep was getting hurt and playing on teams that were poorly constructed, eh who cares. Not that great anyway.

It's weird.

In comment 14216851 JonC said:

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If your comments are directed at me ... you're free to believe what you choose. I know what I see in terms of football on the field, the effort was not always there, and it was not always due to injury. JPP v2011 was gone shortly thereafter. I can tell you for a fact he was traded because he was deemed a negative, a wildcard, under-performing, etc. This is a waste of time.

My comments are not directed at any one person, because you are certainly not the only poster who exhibits this behavior.

And I'm not familiar with your line of work in this area, so don't take this as some kind of personal attack. I just don't know you. But for what reason would someone take your word for it that you know for a fact any of why he was traded.

solid career with the Giants and it being time to move on from him are not mutually exclusive.

It was the right move to trade him when they did.

In comment 14216859 christian said:

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He definitely took some plays easy, but there were seasons when he was playing 90% of the snaps in games played. Again, I'm not trying to make him out to be more than he was. He definitely had some attitude and maturity issues. And as much praise as he should get for rehabbing back from the hand, he cost the team that year. But his productivity is really hard to argue. I mean he's like right behind Jason Sehorn on passes defended and Justin Tuck on sacks.

For me, it's a tale of two careers and two personalities. He was everything you want from a player in 2011, and then that player rarely surfaced again for whatever reason(s). It doesn't make sense to me to overlook it ... I can appreciate all he did for NYG and at the same time recognize his shortcomings, and why it was time to move. I would've moved on the offseason before he blew off his fingers, but Reese et al were desperate.

I've presented tons of sourced info here over the years, and was told by several in the know. It was no surprise either. I'll leave it at that, I don't expect everyone to jump onboard.

BUT he has always played better with a chip on his shoulder. Would he have come into this season with the same attitude if the Giants hadn't traded him? I doubt it.

I've always liked JPP, we likely don't win the SB in 2011 without him, so I wish him the best of luck. If he gets the pro bowl nod, good for him.

In comment 14216693 KWALL2 said:

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And gave up a 4th to pay ogletree 10-11 million/year. We could have kept him and still had the 4th rounder without Ogletree, Barwin (useless) and Omameh (less than useless).

How much was JPP getting paid again?

Olgetree has 5 INTs this year. When was the last time a Giants 'backer was this active in pass defense, Armstead?

In comment 14216816 JonC said:

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if you understand what you're watching, it isn't hard to see it.

Sure whatever u say.. the facts speak for themselves if you know what you’re watching

that I know what I'm watching. There's good and there's not good, and some tend to try and overlook the latter.

Had the potential to be elite, but never displayed the consistency (2011 aside) and many fans tend to hold that against him for whatever reasons.

Trading him was the right move though as he's no a $13M/year player and has played a lot of snaps over the years. I don't know if he was a + or - in the locker room, just going by his on field performance.

The trade itself turned into a HR for the Giants though. While JPP is outperforming Hill this year and is (arguably) likely to do so in 2019 as well, he's not worth >10x the cap hit and I'd wager Hill in 2020+ will be a more productive player (and still dirt cheap thru 2021).

happy for him. Who isn't? I thought he'd never play again after what happened with his hand. Now he's not only playing, he's doing so at a very high level.

But he didn't fit here in our new 3-4, and we needed to begin to clear cap space.

We got Hill with the third round pick we got for JPP. We also flipped fourth round picks with the Bucs.

This is a rare trade where both teams got very fair value.

Most here know that you know what you're talking about and have a good eye. But the air of superiority and saying stuff like "if you understand what you're watching" comes off as condescending, and perhaps rubs some the wrong way, ultimately undermining your analysis. Just my two cents