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Regardless of your opinion of Eli

Chris684 : 12/18/2018 8:31 am
I wouldn't just assume Eli is back next season.

A bunch of threads about this yesterday and when I heard the the press clip from Shurmur this morning when he was asked basically "do you want Eli back next season?" His response was "yea, I'd like all these players back next season"

I actually took that as not that strong an endorsement.

As has been pointed out, Gettleman had a reputation in Carolina for taking a hard line/attempting to moving on from some pretty big players in Carolina.

Also, Shurmur has been pretty secretive and unpredictable especially with some of his decisions at the QB position so far. Whether it was going with Lauletta in the preseason game we all had Webb pegged to start, to Webb's outright release, to keeping Tanney around, and finally the quick promotion and even quicker demotion of Lauletta the last few weeks. In each of the cases above Shurmur either said nothing or the opposite of what he actually wound up doing to the media.

In each of the losing seasons since 2013, someone has taken the fall, although if it happens, I have a feeling this might be more of a mutual thing especially if the Giants are in on a QB early.



When Shurmur says Eli has years left  
cjac : 12/18/2018 8:40 am : link
did he say it would definitely be with the NYG?

If the Giants can manage to draft the next 10-15 year QB in this years draft, they will cut him before June 1 and save 17 million. its that simple
I agree with your  
I Love Clams Casino : 12/18/2018 8:41 am : link
assessment on how Shurmur and Gettleman operate however, I disagree with the conclusion that this translates into Eli not being here next year.

There's simply nobody else to do the job as effectively as Eli can right now, and I think both DG and Shurmur know this
He'll probably be back  
jeff57 : 12/18/2018 8:43 am : link
.
.  
Britt in VA : 12/18/2018 8:44 am : link
"Would you like Eli Manning back next year?"

"Yes, I would like all of the players back, I think there is something to having experience."

"Do you think Eli has years left?"

"Yes, yes I do."

Doesn't sound that vague to me, although I don't know what else he would be expected to say.
His response is basically what it should have been  
Chris684 : 12/18/2018 8:47 am : link
Respectful, non-earth shattering and entirely non-committal one way or another.
Shurmur’s saying all the right things right now.......  
Simms11 : 12/18/2018 8:52 am : link
There is no other alternative at QB yet. I’m pretty certain there’s going to be a very long discussion about Eli in the off-season. There’s a number of ways they could go.....keep Eli, cut him, and sign one of the available Free Agent QBs, draft one and then cut him or keep him around his last year let him start first half a season and then let the rookie play.

Quite the dilemma. If they don’t cut Eli until after the draft they won’t have the cap savings to spend in Free Agency on more Oline or Dline talent and if they cut him before Free Agency, then they’re definitely forced to find a QB replacement as I don’t think they’re too high on Lauletta right now.
Taking anything  
joeinpa : 12/18/2018 8:56 am : link
From that interview with Mike is probably not too valid.

It s Eli Manning, there are two games left, why would he do anything but endorse Eli.

I don’t think they know yet what they are doing with Eli. But I think there is good chance they move on.

Does no one value consistency?  
njurygiants : 12/18/2018 9:13 am : link
Why does everyone assume that Shurmur and Gettleman want to start over again with a new QB learning the system.

Isn't it a sign of bad teams, when every year you reset the QB, Offense Coordinator or Headcoach, so you never really get to learn a system. There were many QBs who people called busts in bad teams where they had to learn a new system every year or two, and once they moved on to good teams and had a chance to learn a system over multiple year they became quality starters.

I think people underestimate how much Shurmur would want Eli back just to have a QA that has a year in his system under his belt, rather than risking starting a rookie QB that has to learn his system and how to play in the NFL.
RE: Does no one value consistency?  
jeff57 : 12/18/2018 9:18 am : link
In comment 14224391 njurygiants said:
Quote:
Why does everyone assume that Shurmur and Gettleman want to start over again with a new QB learning the system.

Isn't it a sign of bad teams, when every year you reset the QB, Offense Coordinator or Headcoach, so you never really get to learn a system. There were many QBs who people called busts in bad teams where they had to learn a new system every year or two, and once they moved on to good teams and had a chance to learn a system over multiple year they became quality starters.

I think people underestimate how much Shurmur would want Eli back just to have a QA that has a year in his system under his belt, rather than risking starting a rookie QB that has to learn his system and how to play in the NFL.


Hate to break it to you but the Giants are a bad team.
RE: When Shurmur says Eli has years left  
Diver_Down : 12/18/2018 9:32 am : link
In comment 14224344 cjac said:
Quote:
did he say it would definitely be with the NYG?

If the Giants can manage to draft the next 10-15 year QB in this years draft, they will cut him before June 1 and save 17 million. its that simple


$12M. The roster bonus is due at the beginning of the league year a month before the draft. You can designate a player a post-June 1st cut and spread the cap hit from the signing bonus over 2 years ($6.2M), but any bonus paid has to hit the cap that same year. So if Manning collects his RB and then is waived after the draft with a post-June 1st designation, then the dead cap for next year would be $8.1M and $3.1M in 2020. The Giants aren't going to worry about kicking $3.1M for an additional year and would just eat the dead cap next year for $11.2M.

If such a scenario plays out, then Kyle and the Rookie can compete to start.
Chris - Great observation  
ZogZerg : 12/18/2018 9:57 am : link
I completely agree with your thoughts.
At minimal, it sounds like a decision hasn't been made yet.
RE: Does no one value consistency?  
Carson53 : 12/18/2018 10:00 am : link
In comment 14224391 njurygiants said:
Quote:
Why does everyone assume that Shurmur and Gettleman want to start over again with a new QB learning the system.

Isn't it a sign of bad teams, when every year you reset the QB, Offense Coordinator or Headcoach, so you never really get to learn a system. There were many QBs who people called busts in bad teams where they had to learn a new system every year or two, and once they moved on to good teams and had a chance to learn a system over multiple year they became quality starters.

I think people underestimate how much Shurmur would want Eli back just to have a QA that has a year in his system under his belt, rather than risking starting a rookie QB that has to learn his system and how to play in the NFL.
.

I think not making the playoffs 8 out of the last
10 years is pretty consistent. This is why I have trouble with any argument that goes along the lines, of well
they don't have anyone better than Eli....or they don't have a heir apparent., etc.
I am not sure what exactly you are losing by having a different QB.
I don't want to see another year of Eli myself, not like they are making the playoffs with him around here.
I would go the stopgap measure on a QB, and also draft one for the near future.
I don't see any of the QB's coming out ready to play myself.
RE: Does no one value consistency?  
UberAlias : 12/18/2018 10:13 am : link
In comment 14224391 njurygiants said:
Quote:
Why does everyone assume that Shurmur and Gettleman want to start over again with a new QB learning the system.

Isn't it a sign of bad teams, when every year you reset the QB, Offense Coordinator or Headcoach, so you never really get to learn a system. There were many QBs who people called busts in bad teams where they had to learn a new system every year or two, and once they moved on to good teams and had a chance to learn a system over multiple year they became quality starters.

I think people underestimate how much Shurmur would want Eli back just to have a QA that has a year in his system under his belt, rather than risking starting a rookie QB that has to learn his system and how to play in the NFL.
The consistency here has been being a bad losing football team for years. Eli is not the QB he was when he was winning SBs, and his track record since then has been losing football. That's the sort of consistency you would hope as an organization they are trying to turn a corner on. Unfortunately it seems they are more intent on trying to rekindle magic from 7 years ago that ain't going to happen.
I think Eli will be back  
section125 : 12/18/2018 10:17 am : link
next season, there is no viable alternative.
Oone scout's opinion  
jeff57 : 12/18/2018 10:18 am : link
Quote:
"They're never going to figure it out until they get the balls to cut Eli. As long as he's holding them back, they ain't winning again." - NFC pro scout

Link - ( New Window )
Big picutre  
dep026 : 12/18/2018 10:18 am : link
people are too fixated on "Eli" and not the Giants. We are not going to make the playoffs next year whether Eli is the QB or not. DG is constant with one thing from the start of his tenure. And thats to dominate at the point of attack.

Spending a top 10 pick on a QB with as many holes on the front line that we have doesnt seem wise. Especially if their questions about the QBs in the draft to begin with. I fully expect...

Eli to be the QB next year
DG to draft a Ferrell/Gary/Allen in the first round
DG to draft a RT in the 2nd round.
DG to trade pick to move up to get a C.

Whether you agree or not, this is probably going to be the course of action. And if those 3 draft picks become impact players for the future - it most certainly is the right course.
Diver, you are correct about the cap.....  
Doomster : 12/18/2018 10:25 am : link
RE: When Shurmur says Eli has years left
Diver_Down : 9:32 am : link : reply

$12M. The roster bonus is due at the beginning of the league year a month before the draft. You can designate a player a post-June 1st cut and spread the cap hit from the signing bonus over 2 years ($6.2M), but any bonus paid has to hit the cap that same year. So if Manning collects his RB and then is waived after the draft with a post-June 1st designation, then the dead cap for next year would be $8.1M and $3.1M in 2020. The Giants aren't going to worry about kicking $3.1M for an additional year and would just eat the dead cap next year for $11.2M.

If such a scenario plays out, then Kyle and the Rookie can compete to start.


But if the rookie actually has to compete against Lauletta, unless we have an OL(where SB can carry this offense), next year will be a shit show....
Doom -  
Diver_Down : 12/18/2018 10:34 am : link
I was just emphasizing the cap dilemma and it isn't as simple as "saving $17M". If you don't pay the RB, then we eat $6.2M and need to sign a placeholder which makes the net savings zero. In which case, you keep Eli. If you don't sign a placeholder, then the Giants have Kyle under contract. Tanney is an ERFA and might not be tendered so we would be telegraphing to the entire league our draft intention in a limited class. Any other team that also wants a QB will know the floor and will trade up ahead of us to get one. If we end up on like a jilted bride on draft night, I suppose we could always give old Eli a call. But if I am him, there is no way I'm picking up the phone.
You don't..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 12/18/2018 10:36 am : link
save a dime if you go out and sign a stop-gap like Foles. You actually invest more in the QB position in that scenario, or a similar one
RE: You don't..  
Britt in VA : 12/18/2018 10:40 am : link
In comment 14224588 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
save a dime if you go out and sign a stop-gap like Foles. You actually invest more in the QB position in that scenario, or a similar one


And you think Foles is going to sign a short term deal? Hell no, you're looking at an Alex Smith level deal for Foles.
RE: Does no one value consistency?  
rsjem1979 : 12/18/2018 10:42 am : link
In comment 14224391 njurygiants said:
Quote:
Why does everyone assume that Shurmur and Gettleman want to start over again with a new QB learning the system.



Because a young QB gives a coach an opportunity to put his stamp on the team, plus some leeway while the QB adapts to life in the NFL. If Shurmur isn't interested in being a part of the rebuild here, he should pack his bags.

Gettleman is the moron who thought this team could legitimately compete, so who knows what the hell is going on in his head.
the only reason you sign a stop gap  
hitdog42 : 12/18/2018 10:42 am : link
is if you believe a different and cheaper skill set can offer a better look at the offense, and still leaves you with the opportunity to find the QB of the future.
Foles is not that guy. its unclear who that guy is.
i have a major issue with bringing eli back at 23.5 ont he cap though. its basically saying you dont value money or performance doesnt matter (for a while now)- and you dont value cap space. and you are cool with watching the same style play over and over again
Again..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 12/18/2018 10:47 am : link
with this bullshit??

Quote:
Gettleman is the moron who thought this team could legitimately compete, so who knows what the hell is going on in his head.


He turned over the roster by 70% and more than half the starters are different.

I'm assuming that because we drafted Barkley, that's the reason this statement is made so often. It isn't close to being true, yet people who probably are morons have no problem calling the GM one.

Great.
As Bruce Arians was saying  
mittenedman : 12/18/2018 10:48 am : link
on the broadcast, just keeping sawing wood. It's year 1 of a new system on both sides of the ball which is always messy transitioning. He thought Eli was doing a good job picking up the offense and they had to continue building the OLine.

They still have 2 non-starting calibre players up front in Pulley & Wheeler. Push those guys to backup roles and bring in a C (draft) and RT (FA) and you've got a nasty OLine next year. The C battle can be Halapio, 2nd-year Evan Brown, Pulley and the 2nd round pick. There are some interesting big boy RT's available in free agency including Ja'Juan James. I see James as a Kareem McKenzie-like pickup.

Do this, use the 1st round pick on an Edge Rusher (or best available defensive player) and let the coaches develop their systems and I see a contender next year. This is a young team overall that should improve with experience.
And P.S.  
mittenedman : 12/18/2018 10:50 am : link
Send Pat Shurmur to a seminar on basic clock management and game theory.
RE: Again..  
Britt in VA : 12/18/2018 10:51 am : link
In comment 14224607 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
with this bullshit??



Quote:


Gettleman is the moron who thought this team could legitimately compete, so who knows what the hell is going on in his head.



He turned over the roster by 70% and more than half the starters are different.

I'm assuming that because we drafted Barkley, that's the reason this statement is made so often. It isn't close to being true, yet people who probably are morons have no problem calling the GM one.

Great.


Darnold - Rebuild
Barkley - Win now for Eli at all costs
The ideal scenario...  
Milton : 12/18/2018 11:00 am : link
If there is a prospect they believe has a future as franchise QB in the NFL, draft him in round one and let him and Lauletta sit behind Eli for the year. The $17.5M Eli is due next season won't hamstring them. Add a free agent OT to compete with Wheeler and Elgton Jenkins in the second round to compete with Halapio and/or Brown. Use the middle rounds to add a WR and fill out the defense with hungry young talent.

And then see what the 2019 season brings.

I could totally See  
Jim Bur(n)t : 12/18/2018 11:03 am : link
Case Keenum here next yr as "a backup".
Not sure why other teams  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 12/18/2018 11:04 am : link
Can throw in street FA QBs and be somewhat servicable, while our mid round QBs have total meltdowns.
Take the best available  
GeorgeAdams33 : 12/18/2018 11:08 am : link
In the draft we should take the best available player. If it happens to be a QB we like then that's wonderful, but you don't force it when you have Eli Manning. No need to fix what's not broken. Watch DG, the "moron" build a playoff team with Eli at the helm next year. He is still the best QB in the division.
Giants should cut Eli or he should retire  
GoBlue6599 : 12/18/2018 11:34 am : link
Giants need to find a guy in this years draft and sign a guy who can start for 6-8 games
What is the..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 12/18/2018 11:38 am : link
purpose of signing a guy who can start for 6-8 games?

Isn't that what the Browns did with Tyrod Taylor? What did that accomplish?
By the types of free agents he brought in, of course he thought this  
Jim in Hoboken : 12/18/2018 11:40 am : link
team could compete. We can debate until the cows come home whether or not Eli is holding the team back, but this season proves that RB is a position that should be low on a rebuilding team’s priority list. BPA sounds good on paper, but a great RB means little if the OL sucks or QB play is subpar.
RE: What is the..  
hitdog42 : 12/18/2018 11:43 am : link
In comment 14224687 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
purpose of signing a guy who can start for 6-8 games?

Isn't that what the Browns did with Tyrod Taylor? What did that accomplish?


you can evaluate the offense through a different lens.
maybe the lens for what you envision your next QB
RE: RE: Does no one value consistency?  
joe48 : 12/18/2018 11:46 am : link
In comment 14224532 UberAlias said:
Quote:
In comment 14224391 njurygiants said:


Quote:


Why does everyone assume that Shurmur and Gettleman want to start over again with a new QB learning the system.

Isn't it a sign of bad teams, when every year you reset the QB, Offense Coordinator or Headcoach, so you never really get to learn a system. There were many QBs who people called busts in bad teams where they had to learn a new system every year or two, and once they moved on to good teams and had a chance to learn a system over multiple year they became quality starters.

I think people underestimate how much Shurmur would want Eli back just to have a QA that has a year in his system under his belt, rather than risking starting a rookie QB that has to learn his system and how to play in the NFL.

The consistency here has been being a bad losing football team for years. Eli is not the QB he was when he was winning SBs, and his track record since then has been losing football. That's the sort of consistency you would hope as an organization they are trying to turn a corner on. Unfortunately it seems they are more intent on trying to rekindle magic from 7 years ago that ain't going to happen.
Consistency is not having a playoff victory in 12 of the last 15 years.
RE: What is the..  
GoBlue6599 : 12/18/2018 11:47 am : link
In comment 14224687 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
purpose of signing a guy who can start for 6-8 games?

Isn't that what the Browns did with Tyrod Taylor? What did that accomplish?

No I agree ..only if the Giants don’t want to start the rookie right away would that guy play .
LOL..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 12/18/2018 11:49 am : link
Quote:
Consistency is not having a playoff victory in 12 of the last 15 years.



You do realize you can say that for more than half of the NFL, and every team in our division except the Eagles, right?
Eli is looking to be the best option for 2019,  
MOOPS : 12/18/2018 11:51 am : link
so he'll most likely be back.
We'll likely be drafting too low to get a franchise QB in the draft without giving up boku draft picks, if one is even available.
And the FAs that will probably be available will be recycled failures, the best of whom will demand a premium and will not be a solution.
Gotta face reality.
Eli will obviously have a big factor in this decision  
Chris684 : 12/18/2018 12:05 pm : link
Does Eli want to take a shot with a more complete team? So far the answer has been no. He seems to have settled into the NYC area nicely, has young kids presumably settled in schools and seems to enjoy that stability, but that's so far.

Has this year changed anything for him? What about if hypothetically the Giants take someone like Haskins? It appears he does not want to be a placeholder.

I guess the point is, there are about a million variables at play here other than the Giants want Eli back, so he's back. There's no telling if he and NYG wind up on the same page in the end.
BBI does Analysis Bass ackwards  
Reb8thVA : 12/18/2018 4:03 pm : link
Instead of collecting the evidence and forming a judgment the BBI cognoscenti make their judgment and twist the evidence to support that judgment.
RE: Eli will obviously have a big factor in this decision  
Photoguy : 12/18/2018 11:28 pm : link
In comment 14224764 Chris684 said:
Quote:
Does Eli want to take a shot with a more complete team? So far the answer has been no. He seems to have settled into the NYC area nicely, has young kids presumably settled in schools and seems to enjoy that stability, but that's so far.

Has this year changed anything for him? What about if hypothetically the Giants take someone like Haskins? It appears he does not want to be a placeholder.

I guess the point is, there are about a million variables at play here other than the Giants want Eli back, so he's back. There's no telling if he and NYG wind up on the same page in the end.



Eli will do what his heart tells him, I think. He might get some input from Archie and Peyton, but I don't see him moving his family for one year. We won't know until the season's over though. I'd like him to stick around as part of the organization, and maybe management could work that into a sweetheart deal where he does do the placeholder/mentor thing and give way at some point in the season. We'll see, I guess.
I want Eli back for two reasons  
Canton : 12/18/2018 11:57 pm : link
For one, I will enjoy seeing the meltdowns, from all the miserable Eli haters, for another season. They are pure gold.

And secondly, to see Eli continue padding his stats for the Giants record book, and eventual hall of fame.
If we keep trotting Eli out there every game during each losing  
Jimmy Googs : 12/19/2018 3:50 am : link
season after losing season, how does a viable alternative appear exactly?

In fact, how does any alternative appear?

When does this "lame-duck" term approach end exactly...
RE: If we keep trotting Eli out there every game during each losing  
micky : 12/19/2018 5:19 am : link
In comment 14225611 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
season after losing season, how does a viable alternative appear exactly?

In fact, how does any alternative appear?

When does this "lame-duck" term approach end exactly...


Never...and hopefully so to enjoy watching the people here melt down with the losses and wonder each season is like the last. 😂🤣😂
RE: RE: If we keep trotting Eli out there every game during each losing  
Giantology : 12/19/2018 6:33 am : link
In comment 14225612 micky said:
Quote:
In comment 14225611 Jimmy Googs said:


Quote:


season after losing season, how does a viable alternative appear exactly?

In fact, how does any alternative appear?

When does this "lame-duck" term approach end exactly...



Never...and hopefully so to enjoy watching the people here melt down with the losses and wonder each season is like the last. 😂🤣😂


micky, serious question. Are you a New York Giants fan?
RE: RE: When Shurmur says Eli has years left  
Scyber : 12/19/2018 7:21 am : link
In comment 14224421 Diver_Down said:
Quote:
In comment 14224344 cjac said:


Quote:


did he say it would definitely be with the NYG?

If the Giants can manage to draft the next 10-15 year QB in this years draft, they will cut him before June 1 and save 17 million. its that simple



$12M. The roster bonus is due at the beginning of the league year a month before the draft. You can designate a player a post-June 1st cut and spread the cap hit from the signing bonus over 2 years ($6.2M), but any bonus paid has to hit the cap that same year. So if Manning collects his RB and then is waived after the draft with a post-June 1st designation, then the dead cap for next year would be $8.1M and $3.1M in 2020. The Giants aren't going to worry about kicking $3.1M for an additional year and would just eat the dead cap next year for $11.2M.

If such a scenario plays out, then Kyle and the Rookie can compete to start.


I thought the post June 1st designation was to split up the "accelerated" signing bonus cap hit from future years? In this case Eli does not have any signing bonus cap hit over future years so I don't think the post June 1st designation buys the Giants anything in this case.

The options are (I think):
1) Cut him before his roster bonus is due (3/17): $17 million savings, $6.2 dead cap
2) Cut him after his roster bonus is paid (3/17): $12 million savings, $11.2 dead cap
3) Let him play out his contract: $23.2 million cap hit
4) Get him to take a pay cut (unlikeliest of all options): ????
RE: RE: RE: If we keep trotting Eli out there every game during each losing  
micky : 12/19/2018 8:25 am : link
In comment 14225619 Giantology said:
Quote:
In comment 14225612 micky said:


Quote:


In comment 14225611 Jimmy Googs said:


Quote:


season after losing season, how does a viable alternative appear exactly?

In fact, how does any alternative appear?

When does this "lame-duck" term approach end exactly...



Never...and hopefully so to enjoy watching the people here melt down with the losses and wonder each season is like the last. 😂🤣😂



micky, serious question. Are you a New York Giants fan?


Yes..a sarcastic one here
RE: RE: RE: When Shurmur says Eli has years left  
Diver_Down : 12/19/2018 8:38 am : link
In comment 14225633 Scyber said:
Quote:
In comment 14224421 Diver_Down said:


Quote:


In comment 14224344 cjac said:


Quote:


did he say it would definitely be with the NYG?

If the Giants can manage to draft the next 10-15 year QB in this years draft, they will cut him before June 1 and save 17 million. its that simple



$12M. The roster bonus is due at the beginning of the league year a month before the draft. You can designate a player a post-June 1st cut and spread the cap hit from the signing bonus over 2 years ($6.2M), but any bonus paid has to hit the cap that same year. So if Manning collects his RB and then is waived after the draft with a post-June 1st designation, then the dead cap for next year would be $8.1M and $3.1M in 2020. The Giants aren't going to worry about kicking $3.1M for an additional year and would just eat the dead cap next year for $11.2M.

If such a scenario plays out, then Kyle and the Rookie can compete to start.



I thought the post June 1st designation was to split up the "accelerated" signing bonus cap hit from future years? In this case Eli does not have any signing bonus cap hit over future years so I don't think the post June 1st designation buys the Giants anything in this case.

The options are (I think):
1) Cut him before his roster bonus is due (3/17): $17 million savings, $6.2 dead cap
2) Cut him after his roster bonus is paid (3/17): $12 million savings, $11.2 dead cap
3) Let him play out his contract: $23.2 million cap hit
4) Get him to take a pay cut (unlikeliest of all options): ????


The post-June 1st designation can be used on 2 players per year. There is no limit requiring future years of signing bonus remaining. If a dead cap (usually pro-rated signing bonus, but could also be a combination of other guarantees such as salary) is large enough where a team would like to gain relief by splitting the cap hit over multiple seasons, they can do so by designating the player as such (the player can be released at any time - doesn't have to be 6/1.) The point I was making that any bonuses earned in the calendar year must be accounted for on the cap that year and can't be deferred. If the Giants opt to pay the roster bonus, it must be accounted for on the cap in 2019. If there was a release of Manning, the Giants aren't likely to seek any cap savings with a post 6/1 cut. They would just eat the dead cap hit. The roster bonus was constructed to give the team option on his contract. But this year, it might serve as insurance until after the draft.
RE: LOL..  
ron mexico : 12/19/2018 8:55 am : link
In comment 14224722 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:


Quote:


Consistency is not having a playoff victory in 12 of the last 15 years.




You do realize you can say that for more than half of the NFL, and every team in our division except the Eagles, right?


we are currently 13th in season since post season appearances and 12th in seasons since post season wins (possibly moving up to 11th if the Rams win a game)

So we are in the bottom half of the league in both categories, although the distribution is far from a normal bell curve
Link - ( New Window )
actually we could move up to 10th in seasons since playoff wins  
ron mexico : 12/19/2018 8:56 am : link
if both Chicago and LA win games
RE: RE: RE: RE: When Shurmur says Eli has years left  
Scyber : 12/19/2018 9:55 am : link
In comment 14225695 Diver_Down said:
Quote:


The post-June 1st designation can be used on 2 players per year. There is no limit requiring future years of signing bonus remaining. If a dead cap (usually pro-rated signing bonus, but could also be a combination of other guarantees such as salary) is large enough where a team would like to gain relief by splitting the cap hit over multiple seasons, they can do so by designating the player as such (the player can be released at any time - doesn't have to be 6/1.) The point I was making that any bonuses earned in the calendar year must be accounted for on the cap that year and can't be deferred. If the Giants opt to pay the roster bonus, it must be accounted for on the cap in 2019. If there was a release of Manning, the Giants aren't likely to seek any cap savings with a post 6/1 cut. They would just eat the dead cap hit. The roster bonus was constructed to give the team option on his contract. But this year, it might serve as insurance until after the draft.


Post June 1st does not "split" the hit of a bonus. It accelerates all "future" bonus cap hit to the following year instead of the current year. Everything owed the current year still applies to the current years cap. Manning has no "future" money past 2019. Post June 1st cut designation means nothing to the Giants or Manning in this case. You can't extend a cap hit past the life of a contract.

https://overthecap.com/explaining-the-june-1st-designation/

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After June 1st only the current years expense remains on the books after the player is released. The balance accelerates onto the following years salary cap.

Manning  
giantfan2000 : 12/19/2018 11:10 am : link
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4) Get him to take a pay cut (unlikeliest of all options): ????


Manning has made the most money from his contracts in NFL history
Manning wants to end career with Giants and he wants to play one more year

Gettleman holds ALL the cards

There are 3 scenarios in upcoming year
1. Manning gets cut and Giants pick up stopgap QB for a year or two while they rebuild and figure out their long term QB situation
2. Manning gets cut and Giants draft QB and pickup stopgap QB while they rebuild
3. Manning stays and takes big payout for last year. (drafting QB does't matter one way or another in this scenario)

Manning takes huge pay cut and incentive laced contract and plays one more year.
I think this is likeliest of all scenarios
oops  
giantfan2000 : 12/19/2018 11:10 am : link
3. Manning stays and takes big payout
meant to say PAY CUT not payout
Ehh...I don't agree that Gettleman holds all the cards  
Scyber : 12/19/2018 11:22 am : link
The Roster Bonus deadline of 3/17 works in Eli's favor. Since its before the draft & only a few days into FA, its unlikely the Giants will have a replacement QB before that date hits. And once that date hits, the Cap incentive for cutting him goes from $17 million saved down to $12 million saved. Not a huge difference, but it might be enough to flip the value chart in Eli's favor.
all the cards  
giantfan2000 : 12/19/2018 12:23 pm : link
News Flash -- No one is going to pick up Eli Manning if he is cut from Giants
because Eli will only sign with another team if there is commitment from team that Eli will be starter and no team will do this.

so the choice for Eli is get cut and your career is over or do whatever you can to make your contract as easy on the Giants as possible so you can end your career with Giants gracefully.

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