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CFT: Rose Bowl, OSU vs. Washington.

SFGFNCGiantsFan : 1/1/2019 4:59 pm
I thought I'd start a new thread for this game since I'm sure a lot of us want to see Haskins. Also, The Snake is 'retiring' after this game to teach leadership courses in Columbus.
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And also, can't stress this enough  
Sy'56 : 1/1/2019 7:12 pm : link
Getting a QB in top 10 is VERY MUCH about how hard he works. His approach to the game and life. Most never get access to that information, but it is vital.

RE: And also, can't stress this enough  
cokeduplt : 1/1/2019 7:13 pm : link
In comment 14243303 Sy'56 said:
Quote:
Getting a QB in top 10 is VERY MUCH about how hard he works. His approach to the game and life. Most never get access to that information, but it is vital.


Great point
Haskins would be a great pick if the Ohio State oline comes with him!  
SterlingArcher : 1/1/2019 7:16 pm : link
.
RE: RE: I Honestly Don't Know What More You Want to See  
twostepgiants : 1/1/2019 7:16 pm : link
Sy-

But can you get someone better in 2020?

Is the 4th, 5th best QB on the board in 2020 better then the first QB on the board in 2019?

Shouldnít that be the question?

If the Giants do not QB now- it has to be because you think you can compete for the playoffs next season and therefore you will have a pick at least in the 15-20 range.

What QB can you get in 2020 at that spot? Will they be a better prospect then Haskins or LOck or Jones?

Itís simoly not possible to think you are better with Eli in 2019 and you will have a shot at Tua or Fromm in 2020. Those 2 things donít go together.



n comment 14243300 Sy'56 said:
Quote:
In comment 14243298 Giants38 said:


Quote:


You people are all waiting for the perfect prospect. Sy - he's going top 10 - you can lock that in.

He may not be perfect, he may not have started 50 games in college. But he throws accurately at all levels, has mobility, and works through progressions. So he has to work on some things and is not a finished product. That means you pass on him? That is a ridiculous evaluation method. Every prospect has something to work on.



If he comes out, I agree he is going top 10.

Question is, do I think I can get a better prospect later? Next year? It's not just about being worthy or not. It's about, do you like someone better?
RE: I Honestly Don't Know What More You Want to See  
PatersonPlank : 1/1/2019 7:17 pm : link
In comment 14243298 Giants38 said:
Quote:
You people are all waiting for the perfect prospect. Sy - he's going top 10 - you can lock that in.

He may not be perfect, he may not have started 50 games in college. But he throws accurately at all levels, has mobility, and works through progressions. So he has to work on some things and is not a finished product. That means you pass on him? That is a ridiculous evaluation method. Every prospect has something to work on.


Just chill out. There is a long way to go on all teams evaluating QB's, and you really don't have a clue what you are talking about.
Haskins looks like the real deal.  
Dave in Hoboken : 1/1/2019 7:17 pm : link
.
Good lord west coast football  
B in ALB : 1/1/2019 7:20 pm : link
Is complete dogshit. Washington doesn't belong here. Pac-12 Champs is the best looking ugly chick.
twostep  
Sy'56 : 1/1/2019 7:21 pm : link
No, I can't guarantee that. But I would never want to settle on someone just because I am picking at the top of the draft. Especially when there are some ELITE level pass rushers. Don't forget, those are awfully important too and NYG is naked there. I don't want to game the system, too much of your control. But I am just so against picking a QB high because "you're supposed to". That has gotten a lot of teams in trouble AND the best QBs in the NFL have NOT been taken in the top 10.

I'm not saying Haskins fits in to that equation, I am just talking about principle. I'll have my grade on Haskins in March.

Haskins  
Paulie Walnuts : 1/1/2019 7:22 pm : link
Is dropping dimes.. i like him
RE: RE: I Honestly Don't Know What More You Want to See  
Giants38 : 1/1/2019 7:22 pm : link
In comment 14243309 PatersonPlank said:
Quote:
In comment 14243298 Giants38 said:


Quote:


You people are all waiting for the perfect prospect. Sy - he's going top 10 - you can lock that in.

He may not be perfect, he may not have started 50 games in college. But he throws accurately at all levels, has mobility, and works through progressions. So he has to work on some things and is not a finished product. That means you pass on him? That is a ridiculous evaluation method. Every prospect has something to work on.



Just chill out. There is a long way to go on all teams evaluating QB's, and you really don't have a clue what you are talking about.


No, you don't have a clue what you are talking about, if you think one of these guys is falling to the second round. Do you see what Haskins is doing to one of the best secondaries in all of college football? And you think he might fall to the second round?
RE: Good lord west coast football  
BigBlueDownTheShore : 1/1/2019 7:23 pm : link
In comment 14243313 B in ALB said:
Quote:
Is complete dogshit. Washington doesn't belong here. Pac-12 Champs is the best looking ugly chick.


PAC-12 Champs = Sarah Jessica Parker of NCAA football 😂
.  
BleedBlue : 1/1/2019 7:24 pm : link
haskins is a player. even before this game he has been solid. he throws with good accuracy and can def move some to extend plays. this washington defense is pretty damn good too. you have to like haskins.

if yo udont want him at 6, slide backk into late first for jones if he is there, i tyhink he is gonna be a solid pro too
All I know is BBI  
dep026 : 1/1/2019 7:24 pm : link
Keeps telling me Washington and temple have good defenses and all I see is guys are running WIDE OPEN.


Maybe posters should take into account quality of competition before using stats on defenses that are getting lit up.
Haskins  
Devour the Day : 1/1/2019 7:25 pm : link
Its one game but hell he looks pretty good to me.
Good mobility, nice reads, progression, accuracy and solid arm.
RE: I mean  
GmanND : 1/1/2019 7:26 pm : link
In comment 14243180 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
If too much time to throw is a knock on Haskins, why are we enamored with Tua?

Heís looked human against good defenses.

Washington is dropping 7 and 8, of course heís going to have time.


I've been wondering this same thing. Seems many are enamoured with Tua but knock Haskins. Anyone willing to chime in how their situations are different or how their traits/skills are significantly different? I'm personally worried about Tua's durability.
RE: I mean  
GmanND : 1/1/2019 7:27 pm : link
In comment 14243180 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
If too much time to throw is a knock on Haskins, why are we enamored with Tua?

Heís looked human against good defenses.

Washington is dropping 7 and 8, of course heís going to have time.


I've been wondering this same thing. Seems many are enamoured with Tua but knock Haskins. Anyone willing to chime in how their situations are different or how their traits/skills are significantly different? I'm personally worried about Tua's durability.
Eli  
Sammo85 : 1/1/2019 7:28 pm : link
Peyton, Elway, and the immortal Trent Dilfer are the only QB top 10 picks to win a SB in the last 18-20 years. Dilfer is obviously an outlier in that group.

Flacco, Roethlisberger, Wilson, Brady, Brees, Rodgers, Warner, Brad Johnson all taken outside top 10 in Round 1 and later.

Trent Dilfer was taken 6th in his draft year. Just saying (not to scare anyone).
There is no way anyone can get a read on this guy  
Chip : 1/1/2019 7:28 pm : link
when he gets absolutely no pressure and has all day to look around to find a wr. Dak Prescott looked with the Cowboys a couple of seasons ago when he had all day to throw and now doesn't look all that great. Great Arm good accuracy but I wouldn't touch him with the sixth pick. Without seeing this guy play with pressure its nothing more than a crap shoot.
I know it's Ohio State  
B in ALB : 1/1/2019 7:29 pm : link
But this Washington team is horrible. They don't do anything at an elite level to be playing in the Rose Bowl.
I would not take Haskins at 6.  
Sammo85 : 1/1/2019 7:30 pm : link
Thereís elite talent defensively available. You take that elite talent.
Tua scares me more than anyone  
UConn4523 : 1/1/2019 7:32 pm : link
heís a gamer, and would love to have a player of his character on the Giants. But I simply donít trust him holding up to NFL hits.

Haskins looks like he can take a beating, kind of like Roethlisberger in the pocket. If he checked the boxes, Iíd support the pick at 6.
Agree with Sy  
Dave on the UWS : 1/1/2019 7:32 pm : link
As far as we can tell heís got the physical talent. What gives me pause is his lack of experience. Thereís a long way to go before April. Jones looked great too in his bowl game. Guys emerge every year. The winter will be interesting around here.
I know thereís Rose Bowl conference tradition  
Kyle in NY : 1/1/2019 7:33 pm : link
But this game should be Ohio State versus Georgia. This is a talent mismatch and that could be a great game to decide the best of the playoff snubs.
For a guy who's started like 50 games  
B in ALB : 1/1/2019 7:34 pm : link
Browning is terrible.

This game is really pissing me off. Another reason for an 8-team playoff. Eliminate the pretenders from playing in the big games.
RE: For a guy who's started like 50 games  
Kyle in NY : 1/1/2019 7:35 pm : link
In comment 14243339 B in ALB said:
Quote:
Browning is terrible.

This game is really pissing me off. Another reason for an 8-team playoff. Eliminate the pretenders from playing in the big games.


Heís really bad. Completely agree. Itís time for playoff expansion. This game is just pointless, even as an Ohio State fan, it feels a tad bit empty
RE: Eli  
Giants38 : 1/1/2019 7:35 pm : link
In comment 14243326 Sammo85 said:
Quote:
Peyton, Elway, and the immortal Trent Dilfer are the only QB top 10 picks to win a SB in the last 18-20 years. Dilfer is obviously an outlier in that group.

Flacco, Roethlisberger, Wilson, Brady, Brees, Rodgers, Warner, Brad Johnson all taken outside top 10 in Round 1 and later.

Trent Dilfer was taken 6th in his draft year. Just saying (not to scare anyone).


You're right. We should probably pick QBs at 199 or scoop them up as UDFAs and hope that they turn out to be like Brady or Warner. We picked a QB (Webb) in the third round and another (Lauletta) in the fourth, but amazingly those picks have not resulted in titles.
RE: I know thereís Rose Bowl conference tradition  
dep026 : 1/1/2019 7:35 pm : link
In comment 14243338 Kyle in NY said:
Quote:
But this game should be Ohio State versus Georgia. This is a talent mismatch and that could be a great game to decide the best of the playoff snubs.


Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes

Absolutely correct.
RE: I know thereís Rose Bowl conference tradition  
UConn4523 : 1/1/2019 7:36 pm : link
In comment 14243338 Kyle in NY said:
Quote:
But this game should be Ohio State versus Georgia. This is a talent mismatch and that could be a great game to decide the best of the playoff snubs.


Was saying the same thing. Even if they stuck with a 4 team playoff there is no reason the bowls canít then be 5 vs 6 and 7 vs 8. The actual bowl rules are ridiculous.
Totally  
Kyle in NY : 1/1/2019 7:38 pm : link
The bowl syste has been upended by the playoff anyway so who cares about conference affiliations and just give the best matchups possible
This  
Sammo85 : 1/1/2019 7:40 pm : link
is a real bad Rose Bowl game. Very little juice or energy.

Only thing this is showing is  
BigBlueDownTheShore : 1/1/2019 7:40 pm : link
That Ohio State should have been the 1 loss team in the playoffs.
RE: Only thing this is showing is  
Jon in NYC : 1/1/2019 7:43 pm : link
In comment 14243347 BigBlueDownTheShore said:
Quote:
That Ohio State should have been the 1 loss team in the playoffs.


Then they shouldn't have given up a combined 100 points to Purdue and Maryland.
Gettleman is not reaching for a Qb this year  
MetsAreBack : 1/1/2019 7:43 pm : link
If he didn't last year - for a Rb in a perceived historic qb class - he isn't this year. I'm not worried. We will get a pass rusher.

And on Sunshine - yes he looked great against Notre Dame as he has all year .... but that haircut is a red flag man... and in all seriousness, for teams to be willing to tank and go 0-16 for him .,, does anyone have a read on his work ethic, ability to thrive under stress, deficit, media, his passion for gameplanning, etc?
RE: RE: RE: RE: Haskins looks good  
bw in dc : 1/1/2019 7:45 pm : link
In comment 14243240 Dutch77 said:
Quote:
Against some of the best defenses his completion% was under 50. Stop with the Lock nonsense.


Lock was under 50% against Georgia and SC. Fair enough. Those were not great showings.

On the other had, do you want to compare the talent around Luck to the talent around Haskins?

Let's ask Sy, for kicks since he is neutral, who has more pro prospects on their current offensive squads? Missouri or Ohio State.




RE: Only thing this is showing is  
MetsAreBack : 1/1/2019 7:45 pm : link
In comment 14243347 BigBlueDownTheShore said:
Quote:
That Ohio State should have been the 1 loss team in the playoffs.


Nonsense. The best four regular season teams got in. Sometimes NFL playoff games end in blowouts too.

I also think far too much time elapses between final game and playoffs in college. ND was flat and overwhelmed by the moment all night... four weeks between games played a part in that.
RE: twostep  
ajr2456 : 1/1/2019 7:47 pm : link
In comment 14243314 Sy'56 said:
Quote:
No, I can't guarantee that. But I would never want to settle on someone just because I am picking at the top of the draft. Especially when there are some ELITE level pass rushers. Don't forget, those are awfully important too and NYG is naked there. I don't want to game the system, too much of your control. But I am just so against picking a QB high because "you're supposed to". That has gotten a lot of teams in trouble AND the best QBs in the NFL have NOT been taken in the top 10.

I'm not saying Haskins fits in to that equation, I am just talking about principle. I'll have my grade on Haskins in March.


The best QBs havenít been taken in the top 10? Sure Rodgers, Brees and Wilson werenít, but look around the league at the young crop who are working their way toward the top of the league.

Mahomes - 10th
Goff - 1st
Baker - 1st
Wentz when healthy - 2nd
Luck 1st

Cam, Stafford and Ryan have been very good QBs and taken in the top 5. Yes thereís elite pass rushers but if they think Haskins is a good enough NFL QB you take him. You canít predict where you end up in future drafts and if you end up in the teens youíve screwed yourself either by missing out or trading a bunch of picks for a QB. Conversely if you take Haskins and he has a good year one but you still end up high, youíre getting a kings ransom for the pick.
RE: Gettleman is not reaching for a Qb this year  
Sy'56 : 1/1/2019 7:47 pm : link
In comment 14243349 MetsAreBack said:
Quote:
If he didn't last year - for a Rb in a perceived historic qb class - he isn't this year. I'm not worried. We will get a pass rusher.

And on Sunshine - yes he looked great against Notre Dame as he has all year .... but that haircut is a red flag man... and in all seriousness, for teams to be willing to tank and go 0-16 for him .,, does anyone have a read on his work ethic, ability to thrive under stress, deficit, media, his passion for gameplanning, etc?


Lawrence will be a Luck-caliber QB prospect. Everything is top tier, on and off the field.
RE: Only thing this is showing is  
B in ALB : 1/1/2019 7:49 pm : link
In comment 14243347 BigBlueDownTheShore said:
Quote:
That Ohio State should have been the 1 loss team in the playoffs.


Disagree. Washington is terrible. Thus game just reinforces the fact that the Pac-12 shouldn't have a free pass to the Rose Bowl.

The best teams should be playing in these games. Not a three - loss pretender from a lousy conference.
RE: All I know is BBI  
Dutch77 : 1/1/2019 7:51 pm : link
What the hell are you talking about?


In comment 14243320 dep026 said:
Quote:
Keeps telling me Washington and temple have good defenses and all I see is guys are running WIDE OPEN.


Maybe posters should take into account quality of competition before using stats on defenses that are getting lit up.
RE: RE: twostep  
Sy'56 : 1/1/2019 7:51 pm : link
In comment 14243355 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
In comment 14243314 Sy'56 said:


Quote:


No, I can't guarantee that. But I would never want to settle on someone just because I am picking at the top of the draft. Especially when there are some ELITE level pass rushers. Don't forget, those are awfully important too and NYG is naked there. I don't want to game the system, too much of your control. But I am just so against picking a QB high because "you're supposed to". That has gotten a lot of teams in trouble AND the best QBs in the NFL have NOT been taken in the top 10.

I'm not saying Haskins fits in to that equation, I am just talking about principle. I'll have my grade on Haskins in March.




The best QBs havenít been taken in the top 10? Sure Rodgers, Brees and Wilson werenít, but look around the league at the young crop who are working their way toward the top of the league.

Mahomes - 10th
Goff - 1st
Baker - 1st
Wentz when healthy - 2nd
Luck 1st

Cam, Stafford and Ryan have been very good QBs and taken in the top 5. Yes thereís elite pass rushers but if they think Haskins is a good enough NFL QB you take him. You canít predict where you end up in future drafts and if you end up in the teens youíve screwed yourself either by missing out or trading a bunch of picks for a QB. Conversely if you take Haskins and he has a good year one but you still end up high, youíre getting a kings ransom for the pick.


Just a personal rule. I have to see a guy do it for 2 years before I say "one of the best in the game". Remember Alex Smith looked pretty freaking good playing in that KC offense too. So yes, a few of your names are valid. I'm not saying just wait no matter what, I am simply stating you don't HAVE to get your QB in the top 10 in order to get an elite/very good QB.

Tom Brady. Drew Brees. Aaron Rodgers. Russell Wilson. Derek Carr. Dak Prescott. Jimmy Garroppolo (maybe). Kirk Cousins (maybe).
RE: RE: Only thing this is showing is  
Eman11 : 1/1/2019 7:53 pm : link
In comment 14243352 MetsAreBack said:
Quote:
In comment 14243347 BigBlueDownTheShore said:


Quote:


That Ohio State should have been the 1 loss team in the playoffs.



Nonsense. The best four regular season teams got in. Sometimes NFL playoff games end in blowouts too.

I also think far too much time elapses between final game and playoffs in college. ND was flat and overwhelmed by the moment all night... four weeks between games played a part in that.


Well I think Georgia was one of the four best teams in the regular season. Better than OU or OSU but the committee thought otherwise and I understand why they went the way they did.

I think Georgia will show how good they are again tonight.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Haskins looks good  
Dutch77 : 1/1/2019 7:54 pm : link
Why do need I hear from Sy? You brought it up. Tell me the number pro prospects for both?


In comment 14243351 bw in dc said:
Quote:
In comment 14243240 Dutch77 said:


Quote:


Against some of the best defenses his completion% was under 50. Stop with the Lock nonsense.



Lock was under 50% against Georgia and SC. Fair enough. Those were not great showings.

On the other had, do you want to compare the talent around Luck to the talent around Haskins?

Let's ask Sy, for kicks since he is neutral, who has more pro prospects on their current offensive squads? Missouri or Ohio State.



The gap  
BigBlueCane : 1/1/2019 7:55 pm : link
between those with $$$ to spend on resources in CFB and those who don't, will dictate more shit games like this one going forward.

And at QB, the only one who checks the boxes is Jones. He's another Cutcliffe product, probably one of the very few in the draft that has been taught to process the amount of information an NFL QB will need.

His red flag should only be medical/durability.
RE: RE: Only thing this is showing is  
dep026 : 1/1/2019 7:55 pm : link
In comment 14243352 MetsAreBack said:
Quote:
In comment 14243347 BigBlueDownTheShore said:


Quote:


That Ohio State should have been the 1 loss team in the playoffs.



Nonsense. The best four regular season teams got in. Sometimes NFL playoff games end in blowouts too.

I also think far too much time elapses between final game and playoffs in college. ND was flat and overwhelmed by the moment all night... four weeks between games played a part in that.


I think OSU beats Oklahoma.
I think some of you  
Sy'56 : 1/1/2019 7:55 pm : link
are struggling on how to use the "quote" portion of the message board
RE: .  
Dutch77 : 1/1/2019 7:56 pm : link
If you think he gets past Jacksonville at 7, youíre delusional.


In comment 14243319 BleedBlue said:
Quote:
haskins is a player. even before this game he has been solid. he throws with good accuracy and can def move some to extend plays. this washington defense is pretty damn good too. you have to like haskins.

if yo udont want him at 6, slide backk into late first for jones if he is there, i tyhink he is gonna be a solid pro too
Dutch77  
B in ALB : 1/1/2019 7:57 pm : link
What are you doing with the quote feature? Holy shit. Is it really that difficult?
Sy  
Sammo85 : 1/1/2019 7:58 pm : link
What are your thoughts on DreíMont Jones as a prospect and NFL transition?
RE: I think some of you  
dep026 : 1/1/2019 7:58 pm : link
In comment 14243369 Sy'56 said:
Quote:
are struggling on how to use the "quote" portion of the message board


Lol
...  
Jon in NYC : 1/1/2019 7:58 pm : link
I don't know

In comment 14243369 Sy'56 said:
Quote:
are struggling on how to use the "quote" portion of the message board


what you're talking about
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