You don’t have to say it. We know it’s way too early and so much will change, especially after the combine. Still, for discussion purposes only, the top 6 picks:
1-Cards: Joey Bosa, DE
2-Niners: Q. Williams, DT
3-Jets: Jonah Williams, OT
4-Raiders: Josh Allen, OLB/DE
5-Bucs: Greedy Williams, CB
6-Giants: Dwayne Haskins, QB
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Dep026, what does that have to do with the play of Dwayne Haskins?
Washingtons defense is ranked high because the teams they played are putrid. Thats my point.
Haskins is a project. He has skills, everyone agrees on that. But are his skills because of the system/OL/WRs abilities?
IMO, I dont think he is as mobile as people think. I think playing against bigger and faster defenses will negate the mobility he has. Plus, I have seen him play a lot this year - probably the 2nd most team I watched this year and when pressured, which was a rarity, it wasnt pretty.
he did have some monster games. And I know Michigan was one of them - but he wasnt breathed on in that game and took advantage of a guy who shouldnt have been playing. Kudos to him for that, but that wont happen in the NFL where almost every player belongs.
So the guys rips apart and completely embarrassed the top ranked Michigan defense and “all he did” was pick on a player that shouldn’t have been there. Lol you’re reaching big time to discredit a great performance
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In comment 14243958 JonC said:
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I was ready to let Eli go with McAdoo.
JonC, I’m with you with moving on from Eli. Drafting ANY QB is a risk. There is not exact science. It just seems like we love some prospects and not others. Everyone has an opinion and is entitled to it. But it seems like we are good with waiting for the perfect prospect which doesn’t exist.
It's picking the best players for your system and maximizing those limited resources, rather than viewing it as waiting for the perfect QB to arrive.
Look at how damaging the failed Flowers and Apple picks were to this franchise. Those were need picks, and fans tend to demand need picks as they only view their football team in the moment, with only the next season in view. NYG picked the best OT and CB on their board out of need in respective drafts and it killed us.
I think the Flowers and Apple picks were bad picks based on the scouting/ talent evaluators not the fact that they were needs. We needed a left guard last year so Gettleman picked Hernandez who had a solid year and should improve. The point is you can’t keep ignoring the biggest need/ weakness on this team at the expense of every other player just because you’re afraid it may not work out.
At #10 draft ILB Devin White.
ROUND 2 - Draft QB Drew Lock, Missouri.
ROUND 3 (f/ Denver) - Draft C Tyler Biadasz, Wisconsin
ROUND 4 - Draft Edge rusher Austin Bryant, Clemson
ROUND 4 (f/NO) - Draft WR Riley Ridley from Georgia.
I think that's incredibly optimistic. I think Lock and Bryant go earlier and Ridley may go ahead of all the guys you just mentioned except White.
I watched the Washington game, they are a really good college defense and while he didn't have an amazing game, he had a great feel for the pocket and once he settled in, he was throwing dimes all over the field while going through his reads. Good presence in the pocket, not shaky and didn't seem flustered really. Now...you could say he didn't seem flustered because he had lots of time to throw and wasn't really facing a OSU type team on the other side...sure, I accept that argument. But to me, he had the look and feel of "NFL QB" when I was watching him play.
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Dep026, what does that have to do with the play of Dwayne Haskins?
Washingtons defense is ranked high because the teams they played are putrid. Thats my point.
Haskins is a project. He has skills, everyone agrees on that. But are his skills because of the system/OL/WRs abilities?
IMO, I dont think he is as mobile as people think. I think playing against bigger and faster defenses will negate the mobility he has. Plus, I have seen him play a lot this year - probably the 2nd most team I watched this year and when pressured, which was a rarity, it wasnt pretty.
he did have some monster games. And I know Michigan was one of them - but he wasnt breathed on in that game and took advantage of a guy who shouldnt have been playing. Kudos to him for that, but that wont happen in the NFL where almost every player belongs.
I can respect your opinion but if not Haskins, who do you think is worthy of being drafted to play QB for us?
I just wish he would tell me how to score some chicks.
So the guys rips apart and completely embarrassed the top ranked Michigan defense and “all he did” was pick on a player that shouldn’t have been there. Lol you’re reaching big time to discredit a great performance
I said he played well. But the fact of the matter is that his OL completey shut down a dominating OL. This cannot be refuted whatsoever. Winovich, Gary, Hudson, etc didnt even touch him. And Brandon Watson was a guy who didnt belong on the field cause he was consistently picked on all year. Re-watch the game. All Haskins did was find whoever he was guarding or whoever Gil was guarding (came in for an injured Bush). Dom Brown played man basically the whole game and Haskins OL gave him all day for his WRs to expose bad players.
I know I am mentioning a ton of guys who you never heard of and probably wouldnt have a clue because you dont know shit about shit. But it makes a difference.
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In comment 14243959 Dutch77 said:
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Dep026, what does that have to do with the play of Dwayne Haskins?
Washingtons defense is ranked high because the teams they played are putrid. Thats my point.
Haskins is a project. He has skills, everyone agrees on that. But are his skills because of the system/OL/WRs abilities?
IMO, I dont think he is as mobile as people think. I think playing against bigger and faster defenses will negate the mobility he has. Plus, I have seen him play a lot this year - probably the 2nd most team I watched this year and when pressured, which was a rarity, it wasnt pretty.
he did have some monster games. And I know Michigan was one of them - but he wasnt breathed on in that game and took advantage of a guy who shouldnt have been playing. Kudos to him for that, but that wont happen in the NFL where almost every player belongs.
I can respect your opinion but if not Haskins, who do you think is worthy of being drafted to play QB for us?
I wanted Darnold last year. This year..... I would say either Haskins or Jones maybe in the 2nd round, but not at 6.
Jacob Eason has me intrigued for next year.
That's a tough question. Are we getting Winston without the extra shit? If so yes.
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I was ready to let Eli go with McAdoo.
JonC, I’m with you with moving on from Eli. Drafting ANY QB is a risk. There is not exact science. It just seems like we love some prospects and not others. Everyone has an opinion and is entitled to it. But it seems like we are good with waiting for the perfect prospect which doesn’t exist.
I think it would be good to move on from Eli for several reasons.
One- even with Eli returning, this is NOT a playoff team- too many holes on defense to fix in one off-season.
Two- Eli probably only has one or two good years left- better for him to go to a team ready to compete and needs to buy some time at QB while making a playoff run.
Three- whoever replaces Eli is going to measured against him unfairly. Better to do that with some short term vet QB rather than a rookie who may wilt under that microscope. I think it is better to let the next high pick QB be someone who isn't replacing a franchise legend, but is instead replacing a journeyman.
Winston has the talent to be a franchise QB. It's the mental aspects and consistency that he lacks.
In your hypothetical, are we assuming Haskins has the same decision making issues as Winston?
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is Jameis Winston of the Bucs. Almost the same size, comparable arm strength, both can run ok but don't use it to really gain yards (just to get out of trouble), and both seem like leaders that their team mates like. So would everyone be ok committing to a player like Winston at QB, or would you want better? Remember Winston is still young.
That's a tough question. Are we getting Winston without the extra shit? If so yes.
I think I agree with you. Winston with extra shit would work for me. Have him sit in 2019 and learn behind Eli, then take over in 2020.
If you can get a similarly talented and (hopefully) more mature Winston in the draft, you run to the podium.
Not sure how quickly after the season they run the #s, but Football Outsiders had Mayfield as their top QB from the start:
https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-analysis/2018/qbase-2018
I’d be good with that.
Mayfield
Jackson
Rosen
Darnold
Rudolph
Falk
Lauletta
Allen
Now, it's way too early to make any definitive statements about the QBs, but they look to have nailed the Mayfield pick and you can argue they ranked the top 4 correctly as well.
Did you watch Wentz at all at NDSU?
He jumped off the screen with his arm and athleticism. It was clear he was a D1 player who happened to be playing for a 1-AA school. He was 6'5", 235 and ran a 4.7 forty. Haskins is not the physical specimen that Wentz was/is.
I mean he's a PP. He's not a scrambler. I'm guessing he'll run in the 4.9s or maybe 5's
I'll bet he beats Eli's and Peyton's time - ha ha
[quote] I could see a scenario where we trade OBJ, pick up some draft picks, and start building the team more around Barkley. Pick up a game changing DE in the first, go OL 2,3 or 4.
If we go QB, I like Will Grier. [/quote
Grier is a bum, benefited from a system designed to make QBs look good I.e see Geno Smith. We’re not trading OBJ so get off that wagon and Haskins is a different QB from anything Meyer ever put on the field. If he’s the pick so be it.
The arm strength and accuracy are very impressive.
Height will be interesting. Greater than or equal to 6'3" would be better than 6'2" or less.
Strength wise, he is fine.
It is interesting and encouraging that he seems to be so poised as it relates to moving defenders with his eyes so early in his career.
At #10 draft ILB Devin White.
ROUND 2 - Draft QB Drew Lock, Missouri.
ROUND 3 (f/ Denver) - Draft C Tyler Biadasz, Wisconsin
ROUND 4 - Draft Edge rusher Austin Bryant, Clemson
ROUND 4 (f/NO) - Draft WR Riley Ridley from Georgia.
We don’t need an ILB, Tyler Biadasz, if he declares won’t make it to the 3rd round, we need a pass rush badly, and Austin Bryant ain’t it. I’d be ok with Lock in the second but rather Daniel Jones
[quote] I could see a scenario where we trade OBJ, pick up some draft picks, and start building the team more around Barkley. Pick up a game changing DE in the first, go OL 2,3 or 4.
If we go QB, I like Will Grier. [/quote
Grier is a bum, benefited from a system designed to make QBs look good I.e see Geno Smith.
Can you be lazier with your analysis? Grier plays nothing like Geno Smith. Yes, they both went to Morgantown. After that, there are no similarities.
Can you even think of a team that consistently drafts solely via the BPA approach and supports your claim? I can't.
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find reasons not to take a QB. Should be especially fun with Haskins.
Cause we dont see the value or see better player?
Yeah, thats a lot of fun.
If you're being honest with yourself, you'd realize that your opinion regarding the relative value of QB prospects in the draft will be treated about as objectively as a vegan reviewing porterhouse steaks.
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In comment 14243921 oldutican said:
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find reasons not to take a QB. Should be especially fun with Haskins.
Cause we dont see the value or see better player?
Yeah, thats a lot of fun.
If you're being honest with yourself, you'd realize that your opinion regarding the relative value of QB prospects in the draft will be treated about as objectively as a vegan reviewing porterhouse steaks.
So if I say I like a QB - it doesnt matter either....
Ah the new BBI. Where the posters are shittier than the Giants.
Even Barkley filled a gaping hole (no pun intended) for the Giants though. And with Flowers/Apple the issue is the players taken as much as the positions they tried to fill. If Peat had been selected instead of Flowers, many wouldn't feel like the Giants "reached" for a player, though the result may not have been much better. Similarly, if Reeese had selected Hargreaves (who most draft pundits had ranked higher) the pick wouldn't be considered a reach even though Hargreaves hasn't been much better.
In other words, the issue with the Giants drafting was in evaluating the players themselves and not necessarily how they weight BPA and need.
If they pick an ILB at #6, it's not a great sign regarding the talent level of the top prospects.
As to Haskins - I just don't think he's close to BPA at the #6 spot. And the D is a much, much bigger need in the draft. Don't force a QB pick.
Winston is a low maturity/intelligence gamble. He's got some football moxie and was overrated imo coming off that FSU title team. But, he's been a disappointment (as suspected he would be) in the NFL to far.
I wouldn't use Winston as any sort of shining beacon, nor try to downplay Wentz's college tape.
Ed Oliver at 6? Thoughts on him?
To me, I don't think a NT makes sense. They need an edge, whether is be from the 5-tech DT/DE to play up front or 7-tech pass rushing OLB like Josh Allen.
I caught a bit of Gettleman's conference and a very interesting tidbit was when he was asked about trading Snacks Harrison. He said that Snacks was playing the 1-tech, Tomlinson the 3-tech, and Hill was playing the 5-tech, and that really Tomlinson was a 1-tech and Hill was really a 3-tech. So the trade allowed those two players to play their more natural positions. The takeaway from that is that a dominating 5-tech with elite pass-rush talent would fit this team like a glove.
R Smith
Floyd
Mack
Barr
Kuechly
Von Miller
Aldon Smith
Rolando McClain
Of those 8, only Smith, Kuechly and McClain are ILBs. The rest were drafted as edge rushers.
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In comment 14243930 dep026 said:
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In comment 14243921 oldutican said:
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find reasons not to take a QB. Should be especially fun with Haskins.
Cause we dont see the value or see better player?
Yeah, thats a lot of fun.
If you're being honest with yourself, you'd realize that your opinion regarding the relative value of QB prospects in the draft will be treated about as objectively as a vegan reviewing porterhouse steaks.
So if I say I like a QB - it doesnt matter either....
Ah the new BBI. Where the posters are shittier than the Giants.
Ah, dep - don't kid yourself, you were part of the old BBI too. So some of the posters have been shitty for a while.
R Smith
Floyd
Mack
Barr
Kuechly
Von Miller
Aldon Smith
Rolando McClain
Of those 8, only Smith, Kuechly and McClain are ILBs. The rest were drafted as edge rushers.
Well it's not that rare, those 3 guys are about 38% of your list there!