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Odell, is now the time to trade him?

Jim in Forest Hills : 1/2/2019 8:38 am
To start, trading OBJ (or wanting to trade him) should only happen if you think it's part of a long term solution to righting the ship. If your plans are short term, winning in 2019/2020 by all means keep him on the roster.

OBJ is expensive and has gotten hurt two years running. He is also mercurial and has shown he can be difficult to handle and required "speaking to." Would he be a new QBs best friend or worst enemy?

OBJ has trade value, a lot of it. He has shown he is a top tier player and competitor, I think there would be considerable competition for his services. OBJ would net a nice haul, minimum a 1st rd pick, but could he net more?

I also think its a slippery slope in that I dont think you can explore trading him and then NOT trade him. Once official word got out that he is being shopped its got to happen, so you'd have to properly assess his value.

If a team like the Jets or SF offered you a 2nd rd pick this year and a 1st next year, would you bite?

I’d only bite  
Earl the goat : 1/2/2019 8:40 am : link
If it’s a first this year and either a second this year or next

The daily trade  
section125 : 1/2/2019 8:41 am : link
OBJ thread....

NO!
It's not the best time  
Chris684 : 1/2/2019 8:41 am : link
but they still can.

The time to trade him was prior to last year's draft or obviously prior to signing him to all that money.
A few things to consider  
JonC : 1/2/2019 8:44 am : link
OB wasn't quite the same explosive force he was pre-injury. It remains to be seen if he'll return to that form in time.

Second, his trade value before signing the new contract wasn't what many fans felt it would be. The pricey contract included now in trading for him suggests his trade value could be even lower.

With Eli likely to return in '19, the big roster change figures to be OV and perhaps a few other defensive players who aren't worth their contract, imo.
Here we go....  
GiantsRage2007 : 1/2/2019 8:50 am : link
Why re-sign him if you are just going to then trade him? Do you like dead money hitting the cap?
Yeah let’s trade 1 of the best WR in the NFL  
GoBlue6599 : 1/2/2019 8:54 am : link
So we can spend the next 5 years trying to find the next OBJ... Eli locks into OBJ to much and somehow that’s OBJ fault
If he was really EVER going to be traded,  
Big Blue '56 : 1/2/2019 8:55 am : link
I’m not sure an unsigned OBJ would be enticing to a prospective trade partner, imv. So teams might have been hesitant to pull the trigger, assuming the Giants were amenable in the first place.

Now, with contract in place, teams now know for certain whether or not their cap situation could handle such a transaction. I don’t believe the possibility of a trade is far less than last year, assuming, once again, the Giants are willing to part with him.
Sure a team is going to offer 2 high picks for a WR  
GoBlue6599 : 1/2/2019 8:56 am : link
Keep Dreaming
If we were going with a new, young QB in 2019...  
bw in dc : 1/2/2019 8:57 am : link
I’d keep OBJ. He’d be the security blanket a young QB needs.

If Eli comes back, there is less need to keep OBJ because the team is going nowhere again. If a few things fall into place, they may notch 8-9 wins. They are not better than the Eagles or Cowboys. So under this, trade OBJ and try to maximize as much draft equity as possible...
he is much more tradeable now, and would fetch more  
ron mexico : 1/2/2019 8:59 am : link

1)he has shown that the broken ankle is not an issue
2)the acquiring team gets his recently paid signing bonus paid for

that said, it would be a bad move for the Giants
RE: Sure a team is going to offer 2 high picks for a WR  
section125 : 1/2/2019 8:59 am : link
In comment 14243825 GoBlue6599 said:
Quote:
Keep Dreaming


What did the Cowboys trade for Amari Cooper, who is an excellent WR, but he is not OBJ?
Every team in the league dreams of an having an OBJ and a Barkley  
BillT : 1/2/2019 9:00 am : link
It’s an ideal combination for an offense happy league and folks want to end it before it even really begins? How does that make any sense.
RE: If we were going with a new, young QB in 2019...  
section125 : 1/2/2019 9:02 am : link
In comment 14243826 bw in dc said:
Quote:
I’d keep OBJ. He’d be the security blanket a young QB needs.

If Eli comes back, there is less need to keep OBJ because the team is going nowhere again. If a few things fall into place, they may notch 8-9 wins. They are not better than the Eagles or Cowboys. So under this, trade OBJ and try to maximize as much draft equity as possible...


So, a new, young, green QB means the Giants will go to the playoffs and Eli means they will not?
And two years from now, that new (2020 draft vs 2019), young, green QB will not need the OBJ security blanket?
This was a Florio article  
Dave on the UWS : 1/2/2019 9:03 am : link
I doubt we are shopping him. But any smart GM and organization ALWAYS listen. If they get an offer they can't refuse, THEN they would consider it.
RE: The daily trade  
USAF NYG Fan : 1/2/2019 9:07 am : link
In comment 14243797 section125 said:
Quote:
OBJ thread....

NO!

To be fair, I think it's better than the 10 Eli Manning threads posted per day. I'm surprised this thread made it 6 follow up posts before someone found a way to mention Eli in a thread that had nothing to do with him.

In this case I get what the OP is saying. Long term and depending on the picks we would be compensated for I might consider it but that dead money hit is really hard to swallow. I don't think anyone would offer the picks I would need to see though. A high 1st this year and next year's 1st. Next year's 1st being more important to me than this years. Maybe this years' high 2nd rounder and next year's 1st rounder. Short term, hell no.
RE: RE: Sure a team is going to offer 2 high picks for a WR  
GoBlue6599 : 1/2/2019 9:10 am : link
In comment 14243831 section125 said:
Quote:
In comment 14243825 GoBlue6599 said:


Quote:


Keep Dreaming



What did the Cowboys trade for Amari Cooper, who is an excellent WR, but he is not OBJ?

1 pick which Will be in the 20”s... Raider fans get to watch Cooper and Mack lead there team to the playoffs..
Lets model our organization behind the Raiders.. only team worse then the Giants
Yippee take all our good players ... we stink but at least we have draft picks and cap room. Keep preparing for a future that’ll never come
Then we can trade up in 2020 for a QB right... It’s that easy... Meanwhile teams picking at the top of the draft won’t need these QBs who BBI swears are so good... lol some of you people live in a fantasy land
RE: RE: The daily trade  
section125 : 1/2/2019 9:14 am : link
In comment 14243839 USAF NYG Fan said:
Quote:
In comment 14243797 section125 said:


Quote:


OBJ thread....

NO!


To be fair, I think it's better than the 10 Eli Manning threads posted per day. I'm surprised this thread made it 6 follow up posts before someone found a way to mention Eli in a thread that had nothing to do with him.



We just had one yesterday concerning the 49ers trade rumors was my point. And no neither daily thread(Eli or OBJ) is better than the other.
RE: RE: RE: Sure a team is going to offer 2 high picks for a WR  
section125 : 1/2/2019 9:16 am : link
In comment 14243845 GoBlue6599 said:
Quote:
In comment 14243831 section125 said:


Quote:


In comment 14243825 GoBlue6599 said:


Quote:


Keep Dreaming



What did the Cowboys trade for Amari Cooper, who is an excellent WR, but he is not OBJ?


1 pick which Will be in the 20”s... Raider fans get to watch Cooper and Mack lead there team to the playoffs..
Lets model our organization behind the Raiders.. only team worse then the Giants
Yippee take all our good players ... we stink but at least we have draft picks and cap room. Keep preparing for a future that’ll never come
Then we can trade up in 2020 for a QB right... It’s that easy... Meanwhile teams picking at the top of the draft won’t need these QBs who BBI swears are so good... lol some of you people live in a fantasy land


WTH do the Raiders have to do with anything other than they traded Cooper for a 1st round pick?

If you are saying don't trade away our elites like the Raiders did, I agree.
RE: RE: Sure a team is going to offer 2 high picks for a WR  
Ten Ton Hammer : 1/2/2019 9:16 am : link
In comment 14243831 section125 said:
Quote:
In comment 14243825 GoBlue6599 said:


Quote:


Keep Dreaming



What did the Cowboys trade for Amari Cooper, who is an excellent WR, but he is not OBJ?


Amari Cooper has a shred of a percent of Beckham's talent and resume to this point. And the Cowboys were blasted and mocked for overpaying.

Beckham's actual value is high enough that trades are unrealistic. It has to start at two first round picks, and not mid or low first round picks.
Season has been over for 3 days  
SuperRonJohnson : 1/2/2019 9:20 am : link
and this trade OBJ crap is starting!
RE: Here we go....  
Diver_Down : 1/2/2019 9:21 am : link
In comment 14243815 GiantsRage2007 said:
Quote:
Why re-sign him if you are just going to then trade him? Do you like dead money hitting the cap?


The argument could be made that by signing and then trading him, his value is more to a partner. They don't have to pay the signing bonus and they have him under contract for years. With no signing bonus on their cap, the risk is low as it amounts to a year-to-year contract.

Trading him before the big contract, then the new team gets the player and the burden of the contract.

When you get in to the accounting, what is the value of picks as it pertains to moneyball? Do you think Cleveland actually wanted Brock or did they want the pick that came with it? They ate the cap hit for Brock but received the high pick in return.
RE: he is much more tradeable now, and would fetch more  
CromartiesKid21 : 1/2/2019 9:22 am : link
In comment 14243830 ron mexico said:
Quote:

1)he has shown that the broken ankle is not an issue
2)the acquiring team gets his recently paid signing bonus paid for

that said, it would be a bad move for the Giants


HI think we have to stop to think that maybe Odell is not 100% of what he was before he broke his ankle?

Just on the eye test, he doesn't seem to have the same kind of explosion or change of direction ability. I mean, Eli isn't what he once was; but maybe it isn't all on him. One thing that Odell could always do is take a 7 yard slant to the house, but he hasn't shown the ability to be able to do that this season.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Sure a team is going to offer 2 high picks for a WR  
GoBlue6599 : 1/2/2019 9:23 am : link
In comment 14243854 section125 said:
Quote:
In comment 14243845 GoBlue6599 said:


Quote:


In comment 14243831 section125 said:


Quote:


In comment 14243825 GoBlue6599 said:


Quote:


Keep Dreaming



What did the Cowboys trade for Amari Cooper, who is an excellent WR, but he is not OBJ?


1 pick which Will be in the 20”s... Raider fans get to watch Cooper and Mack lead there team to the playoffs..
Lets model our organization behind the Raiders.. only team worse then the Giants
Yippee take all our good players ... we stink but at least we have draft picks and cap room. Keep preparing for a future that’ll never come
Then we can trade up in 2020 for a QB right... It’s that easy... Meanwhile teams picking at the top of the draft won’t need these QBs who BBI swears are so good... lol some of you people live in a fantasy land



WTH do the Raiders have to do with anything other than they traded Cooper for a 1st round pick?

If you are saying don't trade away our elites like the Raiders did, I agree.

Yes that is what I’m saying.. we can have the best WR RB and TE in the NFL next season why trade that away for some unknown draft pick Why because a bunch of overweight 50 year old men don’t think OBJ is classy enough?
Is someone going to post this every day until September  
upstatenyg : 1/2/2019 9:24 am : link
Season has been over for 3 days, and every day a new thread.

Obviously the PFT piece was click bait after Antonio brown tweeted at them.

If anyone thinks this is the off season where OBJ and AB both get traded and their respective teams get first rounders in return, they are crazy.

RE: RE: he is much more tradeable now, and would fetch more  
GoBlue6599 : 1/2/2019 9:26 am : link
In comment 14243865 CromartiesKid21 said:
Quote:
In comment 14243830 ron mexico said:


Quote:



1)he has shown that the broken ankle is not an issue
2)the acquiring team gets his recently paid signing bonus paid for

that said, it would be a bad move for the Giants



HI think we have to stop to think that maybe Odell is not 100% of what he was before he broke his ankle?

Just on the eye test, he doesn't seem to have the same kind of explosion or change of direction ability. I mean, Eli isn't what he once was; but maybe it isn't all on him. One thing that Odell could always do is take a 7 yard slant to the house, but he hasn't shown the ability to be able to do that this season.

With all that said he still had 1000 yards and 6 tds in 12 games.. not to shabby.
No  
Ssanders9816 : 1/2/2019 9:26 am : link
What’s for lunch today? Tuna sandwich?!
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Sure a team is going to offer 2 high picks for a WR  
Diver_Down : 1/2/2019 9:27 am : link
In comment 14243870 GoBlue6599 said:
Quote:
In comment 14243854 section125 said:


Quote:


In comment 14243845 GoBlue6599 said:


Quote:


In comment 14243831 section125 said:


Quote:


In comment 14243825 GoBlue6599 said:


Quote:


Keep Dreaming



What did the Cowboys trade for Amari Cooper, who is an excellent WR, but he is not OBJ?


1 pick which Will be in the 20”s... Raider fans get to watch Cooper and Mack lead there team to the playoffs..
Lets model our organization behind the Raiders.. only team worse then the Giants
Yippee take all our good players ... we stink but at least we have draft picks and cap room. Keep preparing for a future that’ll never come
Then we can trade up in 2020 for a QB right... It’s that easy... Meanwhile teams picking at the top of the draft won’t need these QBs who BBI swears are so good... lol some of you people live in a fantasy land



WTH do the Raiders have to do with anything other than they traded Cooper for a 1st round pick?

If you are saying don't trade away our elites like the Raiders did, I agree.


Yes that is what I’m saying.. we can have the best WR RB and TE in the NFL next season why trade that away for some unknown draft pick Why because a bunch of overweight 50 year old men don’t think OBJ is classy enough?


Ah, the ageism argument. These old men have forgotten more about football than you will ever learn. Stay classy.
The Amari Cooper setting the price argument  
NoPeanutz : 1/2/2019 9:28 am : link
doesn't work. Sometimes (often) moron teams pay too much for an asset, and instead of setting the price for buyers, it scares buyers away because better assets become too expensive, and the seller cannot settle for something less than what the inferior asset fetched.

The Jets trading up to #3 in 2018 is a perfect case of this. We all got excited since we figured the Jets set the price. Instead, nobody wanted to compete with their offer for #2, and it prevented us from entertaining lower offers.
RE: RE: If we were going with a new, young QB in 2019...  
bw in dc : 1/2/2019 9:28 am : link
In comment 14243834 section125 said:
Quote:
In comment 14243826 bw in dc said:


Quote:


I’d keep OBJ. He’d be the security blanket a young QB needs.

If Eli comes back, there is less need to keep OBJ because the team is going nowhere again. If a few things fall into place, they may notch 8-9 wins. They are not better than the Eagles or Cowboys. So under this, trade OBJ and try to maximize as much draft equity as possible...



So, a new, young, green QB means the Giants will go to the playoffs and Eli means they will not?
And two years from now, that new (2020 draft vs 2019), young, green QB will not need the OBJ security blanket?


I didn’t say that, or mean to imply that.

The point is getting the post-Manning era started. And keeping an asset for the development of the next gen QB.
RE: RE: RE: The daily trade  
USAF NYG Fan : 1/2/2019 9:29 am : link
In comment 14243851 section125 said:
Quote:
In comment 14243839 USAF NYG Fan said:


Quote:

We just had one yesterday concerning the 49ers trade rumors was my point. And no neither daily thread(Eli or OBJ) is better than the other.


No you are right. Don't get me wrong there. I guess I've accepted it at this point even though the Eli ones have gotten ridiculous. We can't get everyone to do a search before they post new threads. Even then, sometimes the previous thread titles are so bad that you can't find the similar thread in a search anyway.

Now I'm committing another popular faux pas by talking about something other than the subject of the thread. LOL!
RE: RE: he is much more tradeable now, and would fetch more  
ron mexico : 1/2/2019 9:29 am : link
In comment 14243865 CromartiesKid21 said:
Quote:
In comment 14243830 ron mexico said:


Quote:



1)he has shown that the broken ankle is not an issue
2)the acquiring team gets his recently paid signing bonus paid for

that said, it would be a bad move for the Giants



HI think we have to stop to think that maybe Odell is not 100% of what he was before he broke his ankle?

Just on the eye test, he doesn't seem to have the same kind of explosion or change of direction ability. I mean, Eli isn't what he once was; but maybe it isn't all on him. One thing that Odell could always do is take a 7 yard slant to the house, but he hasn't shown the ability to be able to do that this season.


I can only think on 1 instance where he was able to catch the ball cleanly and didn't have a soft zone on top to prevent exactly that.

Yes the time to trade him is now.. and I mean RIGHT NOW  
blueblood : 1/2/2019 9:33 am : link
so all these stupid threads can just stop...

you know what..

we should trade Barkley right now too. his value will never be higher and he is under contract for the next 4 years on the cheap.. imagine how much we could get for him..

see how stupid that sounds..
RE: Yes the time to trade him is now.. and I mean RIGHT NOW  
Diver_Down : 1/2/2019 9:38 am : link
In comment 14243891 blueblood said:
Quote:
so all these stupid threads can just stop...

you know what..

we should trade Barkley right now too. his value will never be higher and he is under contract for the next 4 years on the cheap.. imagine how much we could get for him..

see how stupid that sounds..


You are trying to make a correlation to the two players. Barkley has no injury history. Has already set franchise records in his rookie year. Has not been called out by the owner. Has not had to be talked to by the owner regarding his actions. Has never been suspended and fined (Google how much OBJ has been fined what is known publicly).
Keep Odell  
Giantophile : 1/2/2019 9:41 am : link
give him a young QB to play with...and more importantly give a young QB odell.

It's crazy how much people overvalue draft picks over known commodities here. Odell is a special player -- the kind you are HOPING to select (once a decade, maybe) in the draft. And we can afford him, we're fine with the ever-increasing cap.

The idea is to win football games, not get as many picks as you can.
RE: RE: Yes the time to trade him is now.. and I mean RIGHT NOW  
blueblood : 1/2/2019 9:42 am : link
In comment 14243902 Diver_Down said:
Quote:
In comment 14243891 blueblood said:


Quote:


so all these stupid threads can just stop...

you know what..

we should trade Barkley right now too. his value will never be higher and he is under contract for the next 4 years on the cheap.. imagine how much we could get for him..

see how stupid that sounds..



You are trying to make a correlation to the two players. Barkley has no injury history. Has already set franchise records in his rookie year. Has not been called out by the owner. Has not had to be talked to by the owner regarding his actions. Has never been suspended and fined (Google how much OBJ has been fined what is known publicly).


Did we Trade Lawrence Taylor??? NO...

OK...
I think after three or so years  
Ten Ton Hammer : 1/2/2019 9:43 am : link
the league is probably tired of watching him catch a 7 yard pass and tear through the defense. The approach to defense changes when you make a name for yourself. And as much as the Giants ran slants for him with McAdoo, of course the league would take steps to defend it.

There are probably other ways of measuring any perception of decline than putting a quota on the number of times he puts the offense on his back and makes a game-saving play out of nothing. That may not be the best way to measure whether he's the same player.
If you can get a 1st and 2nd this year  
DC Gmen Fan : 1/2/2019 9:47 am : link
plus a 1st next year then you trade him
It is all about the return..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 1/2/2019 9:50 am : link
if you get an offer for a 1st rounder and a 2nd rounder, you'd likely pull the trigger.

The Giants hold all the leverage here and can see if somebody will be as stupid as Dallas to offer a ridiculous return.
Didn't they shop him for two 1s last year?  
Ten Ton Hammer : 1/2/2019 9:52 am : link
They now have him on a fair contract and there's less reason to trade him now than there was in the summer. Why do it?
The Redskins  
DC Gmen Fan : 1/2/2019 10:01 am : link
are definitely stupid enough to make a trade like that.
If it can be shown ....  
Mike From Brielle : 1/2/2019 10:04 am : link
that other teams are behind or contributing this rash of trade OBJ or cut Eli threads can that constitute tampering or disrupting another teams operations off the field?
RE: RE: Here we go....  
GiantsRage2007 : 1/2/2019 10:05 am : link
In comment 14243864 Diver_Down said:
Quote:
In comment 14243815 GiantsRage2007 said:


Quote:


Why re-sign him if you are just going to then trade him? Do you like dead money hitting the cap?



The argument could be made that by signing and then trading him, his value is more to a partner. They don't have to pay the signing bonus and they have him under contract for years. With no signing bonus on their cap, the risk is low as it amounts to a year-to-year contract.

Trading him before the big contract, then the new team gets the player and the burden of the contract.

When you get in to the accounting, what is the value of picks as it pertains to moneyball? Do you think Cleveland actually wanted Brock or did they want the pick that came with it? They ate the cap hit for Brock but received the high pick in return.


Yea, I see what you are saying.

I guess the same argument can be made than that he is more attractive to keep - we've paid the bonus etc...

It seems like unless he's gone awol like AB in Pitt, then the best possible return is a pick that could yield a player like OBJ... not a strong argument to trade him imo.
RE: RE: RE: Here we go....  
ron mexico : 1/2/2019 10:09 am : link
In comment 14243965 GiantsRage2007 said:
Quote:
In comment 14243864 Diver_Down said:


Quote:


In comment 14243815 GiantsRage2007 said:


Quote:


Why re-sign him if you are just going to then trade him? Do you like dead money hitting the cap?



The argument could be made that by signing and then trading him, his value is more to a partner. They don't have to pay the signing bonus and they have him under contract for years. With no signing bonus on their cap, the risk is low as it amounts to a year-to-year contract.

Trading him before the big contract, then the new team gets the player and the burden of the contract.

When you get in to the accounting, what is the value of picks as it pertains to moneyball? Do you think Cleveland actually wanted Brock or did they want the pick that came with it? They ate the cap hit for Brock but received the high pick in return.



Yea, I see what you are saying.

I guess the same argument can be made than that he is more attractive to keep - we've paid the bonus etc...

It seems like unless he's gone awol like AB in Pitt, then the best possible return is a pick that could yield a player like OBJ... not a strong argument to trade him imo.


Plus you basically have to add $16 mil to the rookie contract if you are only getting one pick in return, so its not like the rookie will be dirt cheap.

Obviously you don’t look to trade him. However unlikely, if  
Jim in Hoboken : 1/2/2019 10:09 am : link
Niners approach you 2 this year and 1 next, you’d have to do it.
The idea of them having  
joeinpa : 1/2/2019 10:12 am : link
The 2 and 6th pick is pretty exciting

Top edge rusher and Giants like Haskins at 6!

Giants have won nothing with O’Dell, why some of you mock the idea of trading a wide receiver, no matter how good, to improve the team is short sighted

This is Barkley s team going forward, also maybe other weapons like Ingram get a chance to shine

For all his talent, Giants offense without him last 4 games, except for Titans, was still pretty good

Argument could be made elements were a big factor in that game
RE: The idea of them having  
GoBlue6599 : 1/2/2019 10:17 am : link
In comment 14243976 joeinpa said:
Quote:
The 2 and 6th pick is pretty exciting

Top edge rusher and Giants like Haskins at 6!

Giants have won nothing with O’Dell, why some of you mock the idea of trading a wide receiver, no matter how good, to improve the team is short sighted

This is Barkley s team going forward, also maybe other weapons like Ingram get a chance to shine

For all his talent, Giants offense without him last 4 games, except for Titans, was still pretty good

Argument could be made elements were a big factor in that game

We mock it because it’s a fantasy, the 49ers are going to Offer the #2 pick in the draft... lol why even discuss such fallacy?
RE: If we were going with a new, young QB in 2019...  
Rafflee : 1/2/2019 10:19 am : link
In comment 14243826 bw in dc said:
Quote:
I’d keep OBJ. He’d be the security blanket a young QB needs.

If Eli comes back, there is less need to keep OBJ because the team is going nowhere again. If a few things fall into place, they may notch 8-9 wins. They are not better than the Eagles or Cowboys. So under this, trade OBJ and try to maximize as much draft equity as possible...


Great Player----but Certainly NOT The "Security Blanket Type"!!!!
So many holes, I would listen to offers  
ij_reilly : 1/2/2019 10:27 am : link
I'm not big on trading Beckham, but I would certainly listen to offers. The team has so many holes. And the situation, short term, looks worse if the Giants go QB (Jones?) in round 1.

I think the 49ers is a possibility.

Swap 1s this year. Giants get 49ers 1 next year. And 49ers 2 either this year or next. Preferably this year, of course. If the 49ers won't give a 2, then the Giants have to get their 3 this year.

So the worst deal with the 49ers would be:
Giants send Beckham and Round 1 #6 pick to 49ers
Giants receive
Round 1 #2 pick
Round 3 #2 pick (I think it is the second pick of the round)
2020 Round 1

But I really don't like that 3rd round pick. I want the second pick of the second round.

This puts the Giants into the all-too-familiar two hole in this years draft. There's your QB selection. Or a possible trade down, the goal being to get more quality draft selections.

I don't think it's a horrible deal, for both teams.

All assuming the cap numbers work, of course.
RE: So many holes, I would listen to offers  
GoBlue6599 : 1/2/2019 10:31 am : link
In comment 14244000 ij_reilly said:
Quote:
I'm not big on trading Beckham, but I would certainly listen to offers. The team has so many holes. And the situation, short term, looks worse if the Giants go QB (Jones?) in round 1.

I think the 49ers is a possibility.

Swap 1s this year. Giants get 49ers 1 next year. And 49ers 2 either this year or next. Preferably this year, of course. If the 49ers won't give a 2, then the Giants have to get their 3 this year.

So the worst deal with the 49ers would be:
Giants send Beckham and Round 1 #6 pick to 49ers
Giants receive
Round 1 #2 pick
Round 3 #2 pick (I think it is the second pick of the round)
2020 Round 1

But I really don't like that 3rd round pick. I want the second pick of the second round.

This puts the Giants into the all-too-familiar two hole in this years draft. There's your QB selection. Or a possible trade down, the goal being to get more quality draft selections.

I don't think it's a horrible deal, for both teams.

All assuming the cap numbers work, of course.

Complete fantasy...Wake me up when the 9ers consider that
.  
arcarsenal : 1/2/2019 10:48 am : link
No.

People don't understand the cap implications. It makes no sense to trade Beckham right now.

Not only does it not make sense from a cap perspective, it makes even less sense because...

1. He is coming off an injury and we'd be selling low - we won't get fair value
2. It creates another very large roster hole - we will probably need to use what we get in return to plug it.

NYG aren't going to deal Beckham now.
The time to trade him  
ThatLimerickGuy : 1/2/2019 10:50 am : link
was last off season when I was screaming from the rooftops for them to do it. Now you are 90 million dollars invested in the guy and are trading from a negative position.

2018 Odell is a small problem- he wouldn't play with a bruised leg and also just disappeared not to be seen at all during games on the sideline with his teammates like every other injured or inactive superstar team leader would be.

My bigger issue is 2020 Odell or 2021 Odell when he is coming up for a contract and we have a rookie or young QB and he isn't "getting his". It's going to be a shit show and you all know it.

You can't win with the guy unless it is with a VERY strong locker room where he isn't a leader but just needs to shut up and fall in line- like the Patriots. The Giants don't have the cache to force him to do that and you get the current version of Odell. I just pray that his poor attitude and lifestyle choice of being a celebrity 1st and a football player 2nd doesn't infect Barkley.

arc...  
bw in dc : 1/2/2019 10:52 am : link
Fair value? Oakland got a #1 for Cooper, who was coming off a bad season, and playing poorly again for Oakland this year.
RE: The time to trade him  
arcarsenal : 1/2/2019 10:53 am : link
In comment 14244044 ThatLimerickGuy said:
Quote:
was last off season when I was screaming from the rooftops for them to do it. Now you are 90 million dollars invested in the guy and are trading from a negative position.

2018 Odell is a small problem- he wouldn't play with a bruised leg and also just disappeared not to be seen at all during games on the sideline with his teammates like every other injured or inactive superstar team leader would be.

My bigger issue is 2020 Odell or 2021 Odell when he is coming up for a contract and we have a rookie or young QB and he isn't "getting his". It's going to be a shit show and you all know it.

You can't win with the guy unless it is with a VERY strong locker room where he isn't a leader but just needs to shut up and fall in line- like the Patriots. The Giants don't have the cache to force him to do that and you get the current version of Odell. I just pray that his poor attitude and lifestyle choice of being a celebrity 1st and a football player 2nd doesn't infect Barkley.


If you're going to make things up, what's the point?

He wouldn't play on a bruised leg?

Bullshit. He did what he was told by the staff and said he would absolutely have tried to play if they told him he could give it a go.

It's also disingenuous to just call it a "bruise" and make it sound like he didn't want to play when he wasn't actually hurt. He is legitimately injured and there's no reason to force him out there in meaningless football games and risk making it worse. It would be negligent for the team to do given their investment.
It doesn't make any sense  
pjcas18 : 1/2/2019 10:54 am : link
at any point to trade Beckham unless his injuries are long-term.

It's a crazy cycle people for some reason want to embark upon.

Hope for a good draft pick, get one and draft a player you need, and then hope that player becomes elite.

So that happened with Beckham, even with the time he's missed he's on a record setting pace for a WR.

People now want to trade him and hope to trade Odell Beckham and then somehow get a player who is an elite WR.....like ODell Beckham.

Makes zero sense, even with the contract Beckham has.
RE: arc...  
arcarsenal : 1/2/2019 10:54 am : link
In comment 14244046 bw in dc said:
Quote:
Fair value? Oakland got a #1 for Cooper, who was coming off a bad season, and playing poorly again for Oakland this year.


And everyone thought Dallas grossly overpaid. Don't expect offers like that to come around often. Especially not on a player coming off injury with a larger $$$ commit.
Only if the Giants were virtually guaranteed to receive  
baadbill : 1/2/2019 10:57 am : link
Beckham's current value to the team. I emphasize "virtually guaranteed" (meaning odds were overwhelming value Giants received would exceed Beckham's current worth).

I am not interested in multiple players whose combined value is arguably in excess of Beckham. I strongly believe you win championships in this League with HOF players - and I would not want the Giants to give up a HOF player without being guaranteed they get a HOFer in return.

In that regard, either the Giants get an existing HOF player in exchange (at greater value) or they get enough #1 picks that they have a legitimate shot at a HOF draft pick (probably 10 first round picks ... i.e. forget about it via the draft)
RE: RE: arc...  
bw in dc : 1/2/2019 11:07 am : link
In comment 14244052 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
In comment 14244046 bw in dc said:


Quote:


Fair value? Oakland got a #1 for Cooper, who was coming off a bad season, and playing poorly again for Oakland this year.



And everyone thought Dallas grossly overpaid. Don't expect offers like that to come around often. Especially not on a player coming off injury with a larger $$$ commit.


But the market has been set in terms of draft compensation, whether Dallas overpaid or not. My guess is Dallas feels like they got fair value based on the return on that investment so far.

OBJ is considerably more accomplished than Cooper. And it's reasonable to say his injuries are more fluke than chronic or something wrong structurally. There are teams like the 9ers who have ample cap space and draft capital to move. So the contract could be absorbed.

I'm mixed on the idea, but I don't agree at all that fair compensation is not going to be there.
RE: RE: The time to trade him  
ThatLimerickGuy : 1/2/2019 11:08 am : link
In comment 14244048 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
In comment 14244044 ThatLimerickGuy said:


Quote:


was last off season when I was screaming from the rooftops for them to do it. Now you are 90 million dollars invested in the guy and are trading from a negative position.

2018 Odell is a small problem- he wouldn't play with a bruised leg and also just disappeared not to be seen at all during games on the sideline with his teammates like every other injured or inactive superstar team leader would be.

My bigger issue is 2020 Odell or 2021 Odell when he is coming up for a contract and we have a rookie or young QB and he isn't "getting his". It's going to be a shit show and you all know it.

You can't win with the guy unless it is with a VERY strong locker room where he isn't a leader but just needs to shut up and fall in line- like the Patriots. The Giants don't have the cache to force him to do that and you get the current version of Odell. I just pray that his poor attitude and lifestyle choice of being a celebrity 1st and a football player 2nd doesn't infect Barkley.




If you're going to make things up, what's the point?

He wouldn't play on a bruised leg?

Bullshit. He did what he was told by the staff and said he would absolutely have tried to play if they told him he could give it a go.

It's also disingenuous to just call it a "bruise" and make it sound like he didn't want to play when he wasn't actually hurt. He is legitimately injured and there's no reason to force him out there in meaningless football games and risk making it worse. It would be negligent for the team to do given their investment.


Wait a minute...if Odell didn't have a bruised leg what was his injury that kept him out of the last few games? Does he have a major soft tissue injury? A broken bone?

I've seen it called a hematoma in a few places, which is by definition a bruise.

You can't just deny factual information because it suits your narrative.

I understand Beckham has all of the talent in the world. I'd love him more than any player in history if his attitude was like a Barkley, who just plays his ass off, doesn't fuck with the team, doesn't get suspended, and most importantly doesn't put himself above the team. Like it or not, Beckham has embarrassed the Giants franchise a few times now.

What I find amazing is that in the small clique of BBI it is borderline sacrilegious to be anti-Beckham but when you randomly talk to Giant fans in the real world there is MUCH more sentiment that people want him gone and are sick of him.
This is  
Photoguy : 1/2/2019 11:09 am : link
getting old. Fast.


Just stop it.


LOL.  
FatMan in Charlotte : 1/2/2019 11:14 am : link
and Nicks was just "dogging" it too.

Lower leg injuries can be very problematic, especially hematomas. They often result in pressure and swelling that can affect nerves and circulation.

But yeah, he's just taking it easy on a simple bruise.
Blue6599  
joeinpa : 1/2/2019 11:14 am : link
Ok, I kind of agree with that point

But there are people here who state they wouldn’t OBJ for just the 2 pick, that they would need another 1, Now that s fantasy land
RE: RE: RE: The time to trade him  
arcarsenal : 1/2/2019 11:17 am : link
In comment 14244076 ThatLimerickGuy said:
Quote:
In comment 14244048 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


In comment 14244044 ThatLimerickGuy said:


Quote:


was last off season when I was screaming from the rooftops for them to do it. Now you are 90 million dollars invested in the guy and are trading from a negative position.

2018 Odell is a small problem- he wouldn't play with a bruised leg and also just disappeared not to be seen at all during games on the sideline with his teammates like every other injured or inactive superstar team leader would be.

My bigger issue is 2020 Odell or 2021 Odell when he is coming up for a contract and we have a rookie or young QB and he isn't "getting his". It's going to be a shit show and you all know it.

You can't win with the guy unless it is with a VERY strong locker room where he isn't a leader but just needs to shut up and fall in line- like the Patriots. The Giants don't have the cache to force him to do that and you get the current version of Odell. I just pray that his poor attitude and lifestyle choice of being a celebrity 1st and a football player 2nd doesn't infect Barkley.




If you're going to make things up, what's the point?

He wouldn't play on a bruised leg?

Bullshit. He did what he was told by the staff and said he would absolutely have tried to play if they told him he could give it a go.

It's also disingenuous to just call it a "bruise" and make it sound like he didn't want to play when he wasn't actually hurt. He is legitimately injured and there's no reason to force him out there in meaningless football games and risk making it worse. It would be negligent for the team to do given their investment.



Wait a minute...if Odell didn't have a bruised leg what was his injury that kept him out of the last few games? Does he have a major soft tissue injury? A broken bone?

I've seen it called a hematoma in a few places, which is by definition a bruise.

You can't just deny factual information because it suits your narrative.

I understand Beckham has all of the talent in the world. I'd love him more than any player in history if his attitude was like a Barkley, who just plays his ass off, doesn't fuck with the team, doesn't get suspended, and most importantly doesn't put himself above the team. Like it or not, Beckham has embarrassed the Giants franchise a few times now.

What I find amazing is that in the small clique of BBI it is borderline sacrilegious to be anti-Beckham but when you randomly talk to Giant fans in the real world there is MUCH more sentiment that people want him gone and are sick of him.


You know what you're doing - you're diminishing the injury because you don't like the player and want to frame it as him being lazy/not wanting to play - since that would fit your narrative.

Not all bruises are the same, and some are legitimate football injuries. Beckham didn't sit out the final month of the season with a black and blue, but that's what you want people to think.

I also don't care about your anecdotal evidence regarding "real world fans" who are so different than the conglomerate of fans here. I can just counter it by saying the exact opposite. Who cares?
RE: LOL.  
ThatLimerickGuy : 1/2/2019 11:19 am : link
In comment 14244085 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
and Nicks was just "dogging" it too.

Lower leg injuries can be very problematic, especially hematomas. They often result in pressure and swelling that can affect nerves and circulation.

But yeah, he's just taking it easy on a simple bruise.


No. Nicks had compartment syndrome, a rare condition that caused insufficient blood supply to his leg AND more importantly Nicks had a major ankle injury (which required surgery) after Aqib Talib took him out after Nicks torched him.

2019- New Year same Fatman. Ill informed.

RE: RE: LOL.  
YAJ2112 : 1/2/2019 11:25 am : link
In comment 14244093 ThatLimerickGuy said:
Quote:
In comment 14244085 FatMan in Charlotte said:


Quote:


and Nicks was just "dogging" it too.

Lower leg injuries can be very problematic, especially hematomas. They often result in pressure and swelling that can affect nerves and circulation.

But yeah, he's just taking it easy on a simple bruise.



No. Nicks had compartment syndrome, a rare condition that caused insufficient blood supply to his leg AND more importantly Nicks had a major ankle injury (which required surgery) after Aqib Talib took him out after Nicks torched him.

2019- New Year same Fatman. Ill informed.


uh, he was being sarcastic about Nicks dumbass. Way to be "informed".
Trading obj  
wdjk1955 : 1/2/2019 11:27 am : link
This post is so stupid.
RE: RE: RE: RE: The time to trade him  
ThatLimerickGuy : 1/2/2019 11:29 am : link
In comment 14244091 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
In comment 14244076 ThatLimerickGuy said:


Quote:


In comment 14244048 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


In comment 14244044 ThatLimerickGuy said:


Quote:


was last off season when I was screaming from the rooftops for them to do it. Now you are 90 million dollars invested in the guy and are trading from a negative position.

2018 Odell is a small problem- he wouldn't play with a bruised leg and also just disappeared not to be seen at all during games on the sideline with his teammates like every other injured or inactive superstar team leader would be.

My bigger issue is 2020 Odell or 2021 Odell when he is coming up for a contract and we have a rookie or young QB and he isn't "getting his". It's going to be a shit show and you all know it.

You can't win with the guy unless it is with a VERY strong locker room where he isn't a leader but just needs to shut up and fall in line- like the Patriots. The Giants don't have the cache to force him to do that and you get the current version of Odell. I just pray that his poor attitude and lifestyle choice of being a celebrity 1st and a football player 2nd doesn't infect Barkley.




If you're going to make things up, what's the point?

He wouldn't play on a bruised leg?

Bullshit. He did what he was told by the staff and said he would absolutely have tried to play if they told him he could give it a go.

It's also disingenuous to just call it a "bruise" and make it sound like he didn't want to play when he wasn't actually hurt. He is legitimately injured and there's no reason to force him out there in meaningless football games and risk making it worse. It would be negligent for the team to do given their investment.



Wait a minute...if Odell didn't have a bruised leg what was his injury that kept him out of the last few games? Does he have a major soft tissue injury? A broken bone?

I've seen it called a hematoma in a few places, which is by definition a bruise.

You can't just deny factual information because it suits your narrative.

I understand Beckham has all of the talent in the world. I'd love him more than any player in history if his attitude was like a Barkley, who just plays his ass off, doesn't fuck with the team, doesn't get suspended, and most importantly doesn't put himself above the team. Like it or not, Beckham has embarrassed the Giants franchise a few times now.

What I find amazing is that in the small clique of BBI it is borderline sacrilegious to be anti-Beckham but when you randomly talk to Giant fans in the real world there is MUCH more sentiment that people want him gone and are sick of him.



You know what you're doing - you're diminishing the injury because you don't like the player and want to frame it as him being lazy/not wanting to play - since that would fit your narrative.

Not all bruises are the same, and some are legitimate football injuries. Beckham didn't sit out the final month of the season with a black and blue, but that's what you want people to think.

I also don't care about your anecdotal evidence regarding "real world fans" who are so different than the conglomerate of fans here. I can just counter it by saying the exact opposite. Who cares?


I don't think Beckham is lazy at all.

I DO know that the Giants had a chance after the Philly game to make the playoffs and were getting hot after the Redskins game, and Beckham didn't play in the Titans game because he had a leg bruise. That isn't conjecture or narrative it is a fact.

Now if you want to say that the medical staff absolutely refused to let him play, then you can believe that. I'd like to think that one of the highest paid guys on the team would want to show grit and leadership and demand to play, at least in a limited basis OR if he absolutely couldn't play then let him be out there with the guys on the bench helping watch the Ipads and coaching up guys like Coleman and Fowler. That is what leaders do.

Beckham doesn't care about the Giants. He has always been a me first guy and as I keep saying you can't win with the guy unless the team is SO good that he is forced to toe the line and just play. The Giants aren't close to that point, hence why he should have been traded a while ago.
In times like this it's always important to retain perspective.  
Ten Ton Hammer : 1/2/2019 11:31 am : link
TLG hate-patrols beckham's instagram for things to whine about. Let that sink in and consider how that colors in his opinions.
Why is this constantly brought  
tyrik13 : 1/2/2019 11:32 am : link
Up? He’s not getting traded no time soon! If they were going to trade him they would’ve done it instead of signing him to a huge contract. Just stop already
.  
arcarsenal : 1/2/2019 11:34 am : link
He did want to play. He said he simply does what he is told to do by the staff. The Giants didn't think forcing him onto the field at less than 100% was a smart decision once the playoffs were off the table and every fan should agree.

If it was Barkley, I know you wouldn't care that he sat out. But because it's Beckham, he "doesn't care about the Giants"

He doesn't care about the Giants, but he hosted team dinners every week to watch TNF with his teammates. Every guy on the team praises him effusively. But you think he doesn't care about the team, so I guess we're all just supposed to believe that instead...

Rich.
Not going to happen  
Beer Man : 1/2/2019 11:58 am : link
DG just shot it down, "We didn't sign him to trade him"
No no no  
5BowlsSoon : 1/2/2019 12:00 pm : link
Ridiculous speculation if you ask me. It’s okay to have a few superstars on the team, you know.
Plus  
Beer Man : 1/2/2019 12:01 pm : link
I think the team realizes that if they can fix the OL, this O has the very real potential to be lethal; and will create a lot of sleepless nights for opposing DCs.
TLG is a sad, sad poster  
UConn4523 : 1/2/2019 12:01 pm : link
I’m fine with people not liking Beckham, or wanting him traded. What’s lame are opinions stated as facts that are easily debunked.

This dude is psycho and his obsession with Beckham is embarrassing.
RE: TLG is a sad, sad poster  
figgy2989 : 1/2/2019 12:03 pm : link
In comment 14244193 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
I’m fine with people not liking Beckham, or wanting him traded. What’s lame are opinions stated as facts that are easily debunked.

This dude is psycho and his obsession with Beckham is embarrassing.


Aren't you looking forward to free agency, where he will use "insider info" to tease the board, then cry that he won't share anything he is hearing because we are not worthy?
He’s the worst  
UConn4523 : 1/2/2019 12:06 pm : link
He says he’s a lawyer too. He seems like a guy with great ethics.
Wait  
figgy2989 : 1/2/2019 12:08 pm : link
Lawyers have ethics?

RE: RE: TLG is a sad, sad poster  
Ten Ton Hammer : 1/2/2019 12:09 pm : link
In comment 14244195 figgy2989 said:
Quote:
In comment 14244193 UConn4523 said:


Quote:


I’m fine with people not liking Beckham, or wanting him traded. What’s lame are opinions stated as facts that are easily debunked.

This dude is psycho and his obsession with Beckham is embarrassing.



Aren't you looking forward to free agency, where he will use "insider info" to tease the board, then cry that he won't share anything he is hearing because we are not worthy?


The only insider info he has is what Odell ordered for lunch. That's the only thing anyone should believe since he stalks his social media like a mall cop.
RE: TLG is a sad, sad poster  
ThatLimerickGuy : 1/2/2019 12:09 pm : link
In comment 14244193 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
I’m fine with people not liking Beckham, or wanting him traded. What’s lame are opinions stated as facts that are easily debunked.

This dude is psycho and his obsession with Beckham is embarrassing.


Jesus. What did I say was a fact that is just my opinion?

Yes I don't like the guy, but nothing I say isn't true. Name one thing in this thread. You can't.

That is what is sad. People will defend the guy to the end in spite of actions that are just not those of a winning player.

I'm not a Beckham Barkley or Eli fan, I am a Giant fan. I want to win. Having Beckham doesn't further that objective in my OPINION.
.  
arcarsenal : 1/2/2019 12:13 pm : link
You literally just said Beckham "doesn't care about the Giants"

Plainly stated.

You know this how? What is it based on? A penalty he committed 2 seasons ago?

Get over it already, dude.
Boy  
figgy2989 : 1/2/2019 12:14 pm : link
You do have a pretty high opinion of yourself.
Beckham suffers a lot of what Eli suffers from lately  
pjcas18 : 1/2/2019 12:16 pm : link
for fans who look for scapegoats.

Giants haven't won much during Beckham's tenure therefore the Giants cannot win with Beckham.

that's how some people draw conclusions and the flimsy "logic" they use.

Realistically there are many reasons the Giants have been losing during Beckham's tenure, I do not view him as one of them, other than not being able to stay on the field enough.

when you trade Beckham, you create a hole that has to be filled and objectively I am comfortable saying Beckham is very likely the best wide receiver in NY Giants history.

Whoever the Giants try and fill that hole with will cost a lot of money as a FA (negating the contract argument) and/or be worse than Beckham putting the franchise in a worse spot than they were in with Beckham in terms of winning.

It's not a math problem, the Giants are better with Beckham (in my opinion).
RE: .  
ThatLimerickGuy : 1/2/2019 12:20 pm : link
In comment 14244230 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
You literally just said Beckham "doesn't care about the Giants"

Plainly stated.

You know this how? What is it based on? A penalty he committed 2 seasons ago?

Get over it already, dude.


How can that be a fact? That is my opinion based on the circumstances as presented.

I think a lot of the grief I get on this topic is because deep down people are conflicted. Even the most ardent supporter of the guy has to admit that he isn't a boy scout.

I know my approach isn't perfect but I can always defend my position without really attacking the poster. That is how you know you are on the right side of things.

If I say "Beckham should be traded" and the responses are that "TLG is a lawyer with no ethics" or "He will claim he has inside info and is a joke" then I always know I am ahead because that is nonsense.

Tell me why I am wrong let's debate the issue. I can respect that I am not foolish enough to say my opinion is the only valid one.

RE: Beckham suffers a lot of what Eli suffers from lately  
ThatLimerickGuy : 1/2/2019 12:21 pm : link
In comment 14244238 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
for fans who look for scapegoats.

Giants haven't won much during Beckham's tenure therefore the Giants cannot win with Beckham.

that's how some people draw conclusions and the flimsy "logic" they use.

Realistically there are many reasons the Giants have been losing during Beckham's tenure, I do not view him as one of them, other than not being able to stay on the field enough.

when you trade Beckham, you create a hole that has to be filled and objectively I am comfortable saying Beckham is very likely the best wide receiver in NY Giants history.

Whoever the Giants try and fill that hole with will cost a lot of money as a FA (negating the contract argument) and/or be worse than Beckham putting the franchise in a worse spot than they were in with Beckham in terms of winning.

It's not a math problem, the Giants are better with Beckham (in my opinion).


See that is fair. Good Points. While I may disagree with some of it at least you bring a valid argument to the table. Thank You.
Are..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 1/2/2019 12:21 pm : link
you fucking serious??

Quote:
Jesus. What did I say was a fact that is just my opinion?

Yes I don't like the guy, but nothing I say isn't true. Name one thing in this thread. You can't.


Nothing isn't true?? What about the inference that Beckham doesn't care about the team and was happy to sit out?

Typical shit posting. Takes veiled shot at players based on "insider" information, obsesses about what sexuality player's exhibit, and consistently opines on the effort of people you have no fucking clue about.

Then lectures the board on what the rest of the "outside world" thinks. TLG is at least unifying. Where most here can't agree on anything, he's universally regarded as a cockmonkey, and believe me, the gay reference isn't lost.....
So....  
figgy2989 : 1/2/2019 12:24 pm : link
As a lawyer with ethics, how do you explain your Aaron Rodgers slander? Seems to be a pretty unethical to state such rumors.
Or when you were insinuating  
figgy2989 : 1/2/2019 12:26 pm : link
That Odell was a homosexual last off season? Ethical?
The thing that keeps him going is that people still react to him  
Ten Ton Hammer : 1/2/2019 12:26 pm : link
like he's actually a normal person presenting reasoned and informed opinions.
figgy..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 1/2/2019 12:28 pm : link
he made those claims because of "insider" info and said, "Don't shoot the messenger".

The Beckham rumors were pretty funny as he ferociously defended the fact that he doesn't obsess about sexuality, even though it was his main impetus for any posts about two prominent NFL guys.
Ha!  
figgy2989 : 1/2/2019 12:29 pm : link
That's right, then didn't he proceed to lambaste posters in another thread on a different topic calling them homophobes?

Good times...
RE: RE: .  
arcarsenal : 1/2/2019 12:31 pm : link
In comment 14244245 ThatLimerickGuy said:
Quote:
In comment 14244230 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


You literally just said Beckham "doesn't care about the Giants"

Plainly stated.

You know this how? What is it based on? A penalty he committed 2 seasons ago?

Get over it already, dude.



How can that be a fact? That is my opinion based on the circumstances as presented.

I think a lot of the grief I get on this topic is because deep down people are conflicted. Even the most ardent supporter of the guy has to admit that he isn't a boy scout.

I know my approach isn't perfect but I can always defend my position without really attacking the poster. That is how you know you are on the right side of things.

If I say "Beckham should be traded" and the responses are that "TLG is a lawyer with no ethics" or "He will claim he has inside info and is a joke" then I always know I am ahead because that is nonsense.

Tell me why I am wrong let's debate the issue. I can respect that I am not foolish enough to say my opinion is the only valid one.


Because you're not trying to debate anything. You're simply spinning your disdain of Beckham into more nonsense.... like stating that he doesn't care about the team or making it seem like he had no interest in playing the final month of the season when everything he said himself was evidence to the contrary.

It's never about the player on the field with you, it's always a matter of him "embarrassing" the franchise or his personality.

He's literally done virtually nothing wrong in years, and we're still harping on shit from years ago. Why? Where does it get us?

And why does an NFL player need to be a Boy Scout to be rosterable? It's football, not a fucking election.

Your constant need to validate your own opinions and stances is strange. It's like you need to convince yourself that you're on the "right side of things" regularly here for some unknown reason or prove that you're more logical than anyone else - when it's actually often the opposite.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I am not conflicted whatsoever when it comes to Beckham. It's easy for me to worry about what he does on the football field and how he impacts the Giants and leave all the other stuff at the curb. None of the extracurricular stuff interests me much. When he gets arrested or does something off the field that will negatively impact the Giants, wake me up... until then, what he does on his own time is his business, not mine.
RE: RE: TLG is a sad, sad poster  
UConn4523 : 1/2/2019 12:34 pm : link
In comment 14244217 ThatLimerickGuy said:
Quote:
In comment 14244193 UConn4523 said:


Quote:


I’m fine with people not liking Beckham, or wanting him traded. What’s lame are opinions stated as facts that are easily debunked.

This dude is psycho and his obsession with Beckham is embarrassing.



Jesus. What did I say was a fact that is just my opinion?

Yes I don't like the guy, but nothing I say isn't true. Name one thing in this thread. You can't.

That is what is sad. People will defend the guy to the end in spite of actions that are just not those of a winning player.

I'm not a Beckham Barkley or Eli fan, I am a Giant fan. I want to win. Having Beckham doesn't further that objective in my OPINION.


Your opinion isn't objective, that's the hilarious part. You have an agenda on every thread that involves Odell. You are pretty much the furthest thing from objective. Being in the minority doesn't make you objective, not sure if you knew that or not.

In your previous post you said that Beckham didn't want to play and didn't care about the team. Then someone responded and stated the team docs didn't clear him, but since you are so objective you didn't buy that.

The amount of time you spend on a guy you hate so much is bizarre.
I hope Odell is at a party with Aaron Rodgers  
UConn4523 : 1/2/2019 12:35 pm : link
one day and someone scoops a pic of them hanging out together. I can only imagine the posts from TLG when that happens.
Hang on, it's 12:30  
Ten Ton Hammer : 1/2/2019 12:36 pm : link
He's gotta make sure Beckham isn't shooting basketball so he can blast him for not taking his rehab seriously. He'll get back to the keyboard in a moment
We could see..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 1/2/2019 12:41 pm : link
pictures of Rodgers fucking some chick and TLG would say it was just an elaborate ruse to distance himself from the Midwest Gay Club.
RE: I hope Odell is at a party with Aaron Rodgers  
ThatLimerickGuy : 1/2/2019 12:45 pm : link
In comment 14244295 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
one day and someone scoops a pic of them hanging out together. I can only imagine the posts from TLG when that happens.


Pro Tip: When you need to resort to attacking the messenger that means that your own rebuttal to the message is weak.

Again- I have my opinion and yes I am abrasive with it. If that bothers some people I apologize for that, but the message should not be lost.

I never said it was a FACT that Beckham didn't play because he isn't a team guy. I said he has a bruised leg and disappeared from the team when they had a chance to make the playoffs, both from playing OR from being on the sideline during home games (like other superstar team leaders) to help out. What is untrue about that? Nothing.

It is my OPINION that he isn't a team guy because of that. It is difficult for some of you to distinguish between the two because reality doesn't suit the narrative that Odell is this great player who gets a bad rap. Every piece of grief he gets he has brought on himself. I don't want to see my star player spearing other players getting ejected. I don't want to see my star player in a hotel room with drugs on video. I don't want to see my star player shirtless on a boat in the week leading up to a playoff game when he shits the bed.

Maybe these things don't bother you guys but it is my OPINION that it bothers me. Different strokes for Different folks I guess.

Also FYI, notice the usual suspects who bring up the nonsense that should have passed years ago just because again- they can't attack the message so they go right for the messenger.
The nonsense that should have passed years ago...  
figgy2989 : 1/2/2019 12:48 pm : link
yet you continue to bring up the spearing of Josh Norman.
And when has Odell ever been ejected from a game?  
figgy2989 : 1/2/2019 12:49 pm : link
.
thanks for the pro tip  
UConn4523 : 1/2/2019 12:49 pm : link
couldn't give two shits about you or your opinion. I respect most posters on this board, you aren't one of them. Plenty of those I do respect have also wanted to trade Odell, and they don't spew the nonsense you do.

Pro tip, you say odell brings everything upon himself, take a good look in the mirror at his spitting image.
RE: Are..  
ThatLimerickGuy : 1/2/2019 12:50 pm : link
In comment 14244254 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
you fucking serious??



Quote:


Jesus. What did I say was a fact that is just my opinion?

Yes I don't like the guy, but nothing I say isn't true. Name one thing in this thread. You can't.



Nothing isn't true?? What about the inference that Beckham doesn't care about the team and was happy to sit out?

Typical shit posting. Takes veiled shot at players based on "insider" information, obsesses about what sexuality player's exhibit, and consistently opines on the effort of people you have no fucking clue about.

Then lectures the board on what the rest of the "outside world" thinks. TLG is at least unifying. Where most here can't agree on anything, he's universally regarded as a cockmonkey, and believe me, the gay reference isn't lost.....


I'm the enemy here - but gay slurs towards me are cool because you are a BBI thought cabal leader? You have been here a while go ahead and re-read the Welcome to the Corner Forum post. I'm not a dick I won't report you for the anti-gay harassment, but I do find your repeated harping on that one issue curious...hmmmm.
.  
arcarsenal : 1/2/2019 12:50 pm : link
The boat was 2 years ago. Norman was over 3 years ago.

How much longer are you going to hold onto this stuff? It's getting really sad at this point. I can't even imagine how you dealt with being dumped when you were younger.... good lord.

And again, it's the way you're wording the injury stuff. He "disappeared" from the team when they were in the playoff hunt. Again - bullshit. He didn't disappear. He was not healthy enough to play and was told that by the team doctors. It has nothing to do with his not wanting to be out there. You know what you're doing and trying to play the victim card per usual. It's tiring.
We are attacking..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 1/2/2019 12:51 pm : link
the message! The pure bullshit rumors of player's sexuality is attacking the message.

For Christ's sake, even look at this steaming pile of horseshit:

Quote:
Again- I have my opinion and yes I am abrasive with it. If that bothers some people I apologize for that, but the message should not be lost.


The message shouldn't be lost?? What. The. Fuck.

An unverified rumor that Rodgers and Beckham are gay shouldn't be lost? Fuck - that kind of nonsense shouldn't just be lost - it should never be brought up unless you have concrete evidence.

Your "messages" are constantly attacked. As well as you. And rightfully so. Fucking cockmonkey
RE: We are attacking..  
ThatLimerickGuy : 1/2/2019 12:54 pm : link
In comment 14244329 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
the message! The pure bullshit rumors of player's sexuality is attacking the message.

For Christ's sake, even look at this steaming pile of horseshit:



Quote:


Again- I have my opinion and yes I am abrasive with it. If that bothers some people I apologize for that, but the message should not be lost.



The message shouldn't be lost?? What. The. Fuck.

An unverified rumor that Rodgers and Beckham are gay shouldn't be lost? Fuck - that kind of nonsense shouldn't just be lost - it should never be brought up unless you have concrete evidence.

Your "messages" are constantly attacked. As well as you. And rightfully so. Fucking cockmonkey


I think you brought up the gay stuff today man. Nice straw man in the Beckham should be traded discussion. I might do the same if it was tough to refute the points being made.

Please stop calling me gay slurs and let's stick to the discussion. You've now done it twice.
Is it..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 1/2/2019 12:55 pm : link
a gay slur or an apian slur? Or maybe even a poultry slur?
RE: .  
ThatLimerickGuy : 1/2/2019 12:56 pm : link
In comment 14244328 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
He was not healthy enough to play and was told that by the team doctors. It has nothing to do with his not wanting to be out there.


That is your opinion. I respect it while I disagree.
That actually..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 1/2/2019 12:57 pm : link
isn't an opinion. The team doctors didn't clear him to play.

That's the difference between opinion and fact. One is easily verifiable.
RE: RE: .  
arcarsenal : 1/2/2019 12:57 pm : link
In comment 14244345 ThatLimerickGuy said:
Quote:
In comment 14244328 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


He was not healthy enough to play and was told that by the team doctors. It has nothing to do with his not wanting to be out there.



That is your opinion. I respect it while I disagree.


It's not an opinion. He said himself that he is simply doing what the doctors tell him to. Which part of that are you faulting him for? If he did the opposite and made a big stink about not wanting to listen to them, you'd be calling him an unhinged lunatic.

He can't win.
he didn't practice  
UConn4523 : 1/2/2019 1:01 pm : link
so how can you possibly "disagree" that he wasn't declared. What do you actually have to go on other than your "opinion" that isn't based on any facts at all.

Here's the facts. He didn't practice and he didn't play. What else am I missing? As of 12/27 he wasn't practicing...fact or no?
You would think that a lawyer  
figgy2989 : 1/2/2019 1:01 pm : link
should be able to discern between opinion and fact.

this is bizarre  
UConn4523 : 1/2/2019 1:03 pm : link
Beckham doesn't practice. He doesn't play. He then says he was told he wasn't cleared to play. None of these are facts, they are instead opinions?

How can anyone take you seriously?
Water is wet  
Ten Ton Hammer : 1/2/2019 1:04 pm : link
"I respectfully disagree".

Phrasing it politely doesn't make it legitimate.
Reminds..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 1/2/2019 1:06 pm : link
me of the line from "A Few Good Men".

I strenuously object!
Yes .... Please trade him!!!!!  
chitt17 : 1/2/2019 1:18 pm : link
For whatever you can get!!!
Ok  
ThatLimerickGuy : 1/2/2019 1:22 pm : link
Let me put it this way.

Odell has no structural or even soft tissue injury. He has a bruise/hematoma.

Now again- let me be the first to say that NONE of us know the subjective amount of pain that Odell is in. Hence, we form OPINIONS on whether a player with a bruised leg (or whatever you want to classify the injury as if that doesn't suit you) is able to play or not.

It is absolutely true that for all we know Odell was begging to play but the trainers and doctors would not allow it, even when they were technically in the middle of a playoff race. It is also possible that Odell made a business decision to not push through a bruised leg. NOBODY can ever know the reality to that because only Odell really knows how he feels, which is why, on a discussion message board, we discuss and form opinions.

What I DO know is that some players, in that situation, push through being hurt. We find out sometimes that guys play with torn ACL's and meniscus tears or other major injuries. I'm not suggesting that anyone should do that.

Let's for argument sake say that you are all right and I am wrong, that Beckham took his desire to play all the way up to John Mara who just refused to risk his 90 million dollar investment. Again for all we know that could have happened. Where was Beckham during the home games? Turn on any game and you see the team leaders (unless they are recovering from major surgery of some kind) in street clothes on the sideline.

Let's end it here- I get it- I hate Beckham, you guys will constantly apologize for the guy. We are all entitled to our opinions.

What I don't appreciate is being ganged up on, personally attacked and the gay slurs. That is uncalled for.
RE: Ok  
YAJ2112 : 1/2/2019 1:25 pm : link
In comment 14244390 ThatLimerickGuy said:
Quote:
Let me put it this way.

Odell has no structural or even soft tissue injury. He has a bruise/hematoma.

Now again- let me be the first to say that NONE of us know the subjective amount of pain that Odell is in. Hence, we form OPINIONS on whether a player with a bruised leg (or whatever you want to classify the injury as if that doesn't suit you) is able to play or not.

It is absolutely true that for all we know Odell was begging to play but the trainers and doctors would not allow it, even when they were technically in the middle of a playoff race. It is also possible that Odell made a business decision to not push through a bruised leg. NOBODY can ever know the reality to that because only Odell really knows how he feels, which is why, on a discussion message board, we discuss and form opinions.

What I DO know is that some players, in that situation, push through being hurt. We find out sometimes that guys play with torn ACL's and meniscus tears or other major injuries. I'm not suggesting that anyone should do that.

Let's for argument sake say that you are all right and I am wrong, that Beckham took his desire to play all the way up to John Mara who just refused to risk his 90 million dollar investment. Again for all we know that could have happened. Where was Beckham during the home games? Turn on any game and you see the team leaders (unless they are recovering from major surgery of some kind) in street clothes on the sideline.

Let's end it here- I get it- I hate Beckham, you guys will constantly apologize for the guy. We are all entitled to our opinions.

What I don't appreciate is being ganged up on, personally attacked and the gay slurs. That is uncalled for.


Please list all the times that a player has not been cleared by the team doctors and still played.
Whoa..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 1/2/2019 1:31 pm : link
how the fuck can you even make this statement?

Quote:
Ok
ThatLimerickGuy : 1:22 pm : link : reply
Let me put it this way.

Odell has no structural or even soft tissue injury. He has a bruise/hematoma.


You honestly have no clue what the extent of the injury is or if swelling/bruising led to complications. Even this is presenting things as facts that truly aren't.

You are the fucking worst.
.  
arcarsenal : 1/2/2019 1:31 pm : link
Players do not always travel with the team or stand on the sidelines when they're hurt. Especially when they're dealing with leg injuries. This is again, you looking for ways to try and prove that he's somehow not a team player or doesn't care about the team when it's just a lot of massive reach theories or things that have no factual evidence behind them.

What benefit is there in pushing Beckham to play when the playoffs are out of reach? We invested a lot of money in this player. Risking further injury in games that don't matter would be borderline negligent. There was no reason for NYG to do that. It's more important that we have him on the field at 100% for game 1 in 2019.

You keep trying to minimize the injury or make it seem like he simply elected to not play. If you actually read what he had to say about it, you'd know that wasn't true. But then you wouldn't be able to criticize him, so I understand why you'd choose not to gather all of the facts here before jumping to typical conclusions.
I will say this about Odell  
dep026 : 1/2/2019 1:34 pm : link
he lives in NYC and orders Dominoes.

Thats just inexcusable.
So now we have someone getting on OBJ  
Eman11 : 1/2/2019 1:36 pm : link
For not being on the sidelines during games when he's out injured. When you have no idea where he was or why?

It's entirely possible and likely there are legitimate team reasons why he wasn't out there eg, he's getting treatment, they didn't want him standing around for hours on it etc.

Why the need to jump to the worst on him about something you have no idea about?
no one is apologizing for him  
UConn4523 : 1/2/2019 1:38 pm : link
we are simply stating that you are incorrect in your assessment of his injury. That isn't an apology, that's you being wrong.
RE: no one is apologizing for him  
ThatLimerickGuy : 1/2/2019 1:46 pm : link
In comment 14244413 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
we are simply stating that you are incorrect in your assessment of his injury. That isn't an apology, that's you being wrong.


By your and Fatman's logic we can never discuss the extent of a player's injury. If you read what I wrote I openly say that only one person knows the true extent of the injury and that is Odell.

I openly admit that my take is an opinion based on a generalization of leg bruises. I am no more incorrect in my assessment than anyone else other than Odell or someone who has examined him.

What I am doing is looking at this from a big picture perspective based on the circumstantial information available. Notice that I don't question Landon Collins, or Olivier Vernon for missing games. Why? Because they have never been anything but professionals in the way they act on and off of the field, so they have earned the benefit of the doubt. Beckham has not.

RE: RE: no one is apologizing for him  
ron mexico : 1/2/2019 1:51 pm : link
In comment 14244433 ThatLimerickGuy said:
Quote:
In comment 14244413 UConn4523 said:


Quote:


we are simply stating that you are incorrect in your assessment of his injury. That isn't an apology, that's you being wrong.



By your and Fatman's logic we can never discuss the extent of a player's injury. If you read what I wrote I openly say that only one person knows the true extent of the injury and that is Odell.

I openly admit that my take is an opinion based on a generalization of leg bruises. I am no more incorrect in my assessment than anyone else other than Odell or someone who has examined him.

What I am doing is looking at this from a big picture perspective based on the circumstantial information available. Notice that I don't question Landon Collins, or Olivier Vernon for missing games. Why? Because they have never been anything but professionals in the way they act on and off of the field, so they have earned the benefit of the doubt. Beckham has not.


really?

Collins who has leaked out the locker-room dirty laundry on multiple occasions or take a knee Vernon?
LOL..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 1/2/2019 1:51 pm : link
even this is incorrect:

Quote:
If you read what I wrote I openly say that only one person knows the true extent of the injury and that is Odell.


I'm pretty sure the doctors and trainers know more about the extent of Odell's injury - probably even more than him!

Your ignorance on the subject of injuries is staggering.
RE: RE: no one is apologizing for him  
Big Blue '56 : 1/2/2019 1:52 pm : link
In comment 14244433 ThatLimerickGuy said:
Quote:
In comment 14244413 UConn4523 said:


Quote:


we are simply stating that you are incorrect in your assessment of his injury. That isn't an apology, that's you being wrong.



By your and Fatman's logic we can never discuss the extent of a player's injury. If you read what I wrote I openly say that only one person knows the true extent of the injury and that is Odell.

I openly admit that my take is an opinion based on a generalization of leg bruises. I am no more incorrect in my assessment than anyone else other than Odell or someone who has examined him.

What I am doing is looking at this from a big picture perspective based on the circumstantial information available. Notice that I don't question Landon Collins, or Olivier Vernon for missing games. Why? Because they have never been anything but professionals in the way they act on and off of the field, so they have earned the benefit of the doubt. Beckham has not.


Quote:


Notice that I don't question Landon Collins, or Olivier Vernon for missing games. Why? Because they have never been anything but professionals in the way they act on and off of the field, so they have earned the benefit of the doubt. Beckham has not.



I’m curious in a “ non gang up” kind of way: Is there a statute of limitations on earning the benefit of the doubt? He has been rather quiet on the off the field circuit for several years now
.  
arcarsenal : 1/2/2019 1:54 pm : link
Am I missing some sort of laundry list of off-field transgressions that are on Odell Beckham's resume?

I don't understand why this guy is talked about like an actual criminal. What has he done wrong recently? Appear in an old video where some girl is doing blow near him and he isn't?

Did he commit any penalties or do anything on the field this year that hurt the Giants?

We keep going back to shit from 2-3 years ago because that's all there is. The boat and Josh Norman... the boat and Josh Norman... oh, and the kicking net.

A neverending carousel of complaining about the same 3 incidents - none of which had any impact on the 2018 Giants, nor will they have any impact on anything that happens going forward.

What is there to be gained by not letting this stuff go? It's old news.
RE: RE: no one is apologizing for him  
Eman11 : 1/2/2019 1:56 pm : link
In comment 14244433 ThatLimerickGuy said:
Quote:
In comment 14244413 UConn4523 said:


Quote:


we are simply stating that you are incorrect in your assessment of his injury. That isn't an apology, that's you being wrong.



By your and Fatman's logic we can never discuss the extent of a player's injury. If you read what I wrote I openly say that only one person knows the true extent of the injury and that is Odell.

I openly admit that my take is an opinion based on a generalization of leg bruises. I am no more incorrect in my assessment than anyone else other than Odell or someone who has examined him.

What I am doing is looking at this from a big picture perspective based on the circumstantial information available. Notice that I don't question Landon Collins, or Olivier Vernon for missing games. Why? Because they have never been anything but professionals in the way they act on and off of the field, so they have earned the benefit of the doubt. Beckham has not.


You're wrong about a couple of things here. One being OBJ is the only one who know the extent of his leg injury. I'd say the team DRs,trainers and coaches know exactly how injured he is since he wasn't cleared to practice or play.

This isn't an instance of a team saying a player is fit and the player saying he can't go. It's just the opposite in fact.

You're criticizing him for off the field stuff and not being on the field when he's done everything he could all off season to get back from a nasty injury. That seems like a bit of a hypocritical claim to me.
RE: .  
ron mexico : 1/2/2019 1:56 pm : link
In comment 14244454 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
Am I missing some sort of laundry list of off-field transgressions that are on Odell Beckham's resume?

I don't understand why this guy is talked about like an actual criminal. What has he done wrong recently? Appear in an old video where some girl is doing blow near him and he isn't?

Did he commit any penalties or do anything on the field this year that hurt the Giants?

We keep going back to shit from 2-3 years ago because that's all there is. The boat and Josh Norman... the boat and Josh Norman... oh, and the kicking net.

A neverending carousel of complaining about the same 3 incidents - none of which had any impact on the 2018 Giants, nor will they have any impact on anything that happens going forward.

What is there to be gained by not letting this stuff go? It's old news.


you are forgetting the fact that he played a basketball free throw game in his basement. This just happened this past month.
He kicked the kicking net.  
Ten Ton Hammer : 1/2/2019 1:57 pm : link
Everyone knows how that can throw a team into disarray.
RE: RE: RE: no one is apologizing for him  
YAJ2112 : 1/2/2019 1:58 pm : link
In comment 14244459 Eman11 said:
Quote:
In comment 14244433 ThatLimerickGuy said:


Quote:


In comment 14244413 UConn4523 said:


Quote:


we are simply stating that you are incorrect in your assessment of his injury. That isn't an apology, that's you being wrong.



By your and Fatman's logic we can never discuss the extent of a player's injury. If you read what I wrote I openly say that only one person knows the true extent of the injury and that is Odell.

I openly admit that my take is an opinion based on a generalization of leg bruises. I am no more incorrect in my assessment than anyone else other than Odell or someone who has examined him.

What I am doing is looking at this from a big picture perspective based on the circumstantial information available. Notice that I don't question Landon Collins, or Olivier Vernon for missing games. Why? Because they have never been anything but professionals in the way they act on and off of the field, so they have earned the benefit of the doubt. Beckham has not.




You're wrong about a couple of things here. One being OBJ is the only one who know the extent of his leg injury. I'd say the team DRs,trainers and coaches know exactly how injured he is since he wasn't cleared to practice or play.

This isn't an instance of a team saying a player is fit and the player saying he can't go. It's just the opposite in fact.

You're criticizing him for off the field stuff and not being on the field when he's done everything he could all off season to get back from a nasty injury. That seems like a bit of a hypocritical claim to me.


not to mention that he played with the injury for a week before going to the team doctors when it wasn't improving.
.  
arcarsenal : 1/2/2019 2:00 pm : link
Antonio Brown has been a far bigger distraction - and they're still having problems with him there. They need to hold some sort of presser today about it because it turned into a major problem. This is the 2nd year in a row they're having internal issues with this guy.

Yet, 2 years ago, most of the OBJ detractors here were wondering why he couldn't act more like Brown.

Or maybe he could be more like Julio Jones and start groveling for more money right after he just got paid.

This irrational, obsessive disdain for Beckham that certain people have is just something I'll never quite understand. The amount of incidents compared to the amount of complaining about him and declarations that he needs to be traded just don't seem to reflect one another accurately.
arc..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 1/2/2019 2:02 pm : link
the most ironic thing is that for the last part of two seasons now, Beckham has been off the grid with injuries. Yet people keep referencing his attitude - with n o example to point to other than peeing in the end zone, kicking a net and earholing a guy. All done years ago
Wasn't he fined by Shurmur this year  
Go Terps : 1/2/2019 2:03 pm : link
?
RE: RE: LOL.  
Hsilwek92 : 1/2/2019 2:05 pm : link
In comment 14244093 ThatLimerickGuy said:
Quote:
In comment 14244085 FatMan in Charlotte said:


Quote:


and Nicks was just "dogging" it too.

Lower leg injuries can be very problematic, especially hematomas. They often result in pressure and swelling that can affect nerves and circulation.

But yeah, he's just taking it easy on a simple bruise.



No. Nicks had compartment syndrome, a rare condition that caused insufficient blood supply to his leg AND more importantly Nicks had a major ankle injury (which required surgery) after Aqib Talib took him out after Nicks torched him.

2019- New Year same Fatman. Ill informed.


Lol. Ok. Stick to breaking Midwest Underground Gay Scene news you clown.
RE: Wasn't he fined by Shurmur this year  
ron mexico : 1/2/2019 2:05 pm : link
In comment 14244479 Go Terps said:
Quote:
?


yeah he was fined for the interview, whats your point?

I'm sure lots of players got fined this year.
.  
arcarsenal : 1/2/2019 2:06 pm : link
I'm just looking for like one actual thing he's done recently that warrants this criticism.

How many years need to go by before we stop with the Norman, boat, and kicking net things?

There has been no repeat of the Norman incident since - they've played against each other several times and Beckham has done nothing even with Norman trying to trigger him on a few occasions.

That the kicking net thing was even ever a "thing" is hilarious. I've seen Tom Brady spike his helmet, coolers, scream and yell... no one ever cares about it. Brady is just a fiery competitor while Beckham is some malcontent lunatic who can't control himself.

The double-standards and bullshit are endless when it comes to the people who don't like this guy. The goalposts just move and move and move no matter what he does or doesn't do.

He can't win. I say it all the time. No matter what he does, people find a way. And if there's nothing new to criticize, just make things up or go back to the Josh Norman well.

Rinse and repeat.
My point is FMIC and arc are saying there are no recent issues  
Go Terps : 1/2/2019 2:07 pm : link
Well he was fined by the coach recently. And want the video with the coke this past spring?
*wasn't  
Go Terps : 1/2/2019 2:08 pm : link
.
RE: My point is FMIC and arc are saying there are no recent issues  
Hsilwek92 : 1/2/2019 2:09 pm : link
In comment 14244488 Go Terps said:
Quote:
Well he was fined by the coach recently. And want the video with the coke this past spring?


Again, what’s your point?
RE: My point is FMIC and arc are saying there are no recent issues  
arcarsenal : 1/2/2019 2:11 pm : link
In comment 14244488 Go Terps said:
Quote:
Well he was fined by the coach recently. And want the video with the coke this past spring?


Was he doing coke in the video? No? Then remind me why I am supposed to give a shit.
RE: .  
Now Mike in MD : 1/2/2019 2:12 pm : link
In comment 14244473 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
Antonio Brown has been a far bigger distraction - and they're still having problems with him there. They need to hold some sort of presser today about it because it turned into a major problem. This is the 2nd year in a row they're having internal issues with this guy.

Yet, 2 years ago, most of the OBJ detractors here were wondering why he couldn't act more like Brown.

Or maybe he could be more like Julio Jones and start groveling for more money right after he just got paid.

This irrational, obsessive disdain for Beckham that certain people have is just something I'll never quite understand. The amount of incidents compared to the amount of complaining about him and declarations that he needs to be traded just don't seem to reflect one another accurately.


Agreed completely. You could name dozens of players who have been far bigger on-field distractions than OBJ. What about Rodgers, who is universally considered a gigantic a$$hole and who probably undermined McCarthy. What about Cam Newton? What about Brady who consistently yells at teammates on the sidelines? What about Bell who held out for an entire season? These guys can be considered much bigger on-field distractions than OBJ but most fans would take those guys in a heartbeat. We never hear a single teammate complaining about OBJ. The guy hates losing and cares about how he plays. Trains hard. Showed up for camp this year despite his contract situation and never complained about basically having to prove himself to get a contract he deserved, yet fans are all over this guy like he is TO reincarnate. The reality is most top flight WRs are not Larry Fitzgerald. Most have a diva level and are a little different. Comes with the territory for the most part
.  
arcarsenal : 1/2/2019 2:13 pm : link
Beyond that - wasn't the video like 2 years old? I don't even think it was recent.
Ben Roethlisberger is a gigantic diva and potentially a sex criminal  
Ten Ton Hammer : 1/2/2019 2:13 pm : link
And he constantly throws his own teammates under the bus.
And there was also the back and forth involving Mara and his dad  
Go Terps : 1/2/2019 2:17 pm : link
So in the past ten months or so:

- video with the coke
- called out by Mara, who then was called out by his dad (do we think his dad shot that off without Beckham knowing it?)
- fined by the head coach

So yeah it's not a body in the trunk, but this past year hasn't passed uneventfully for Beckham and the Giants.
Don't forget when  
pjcas18 : 1/2/2019 2:19 pm : link
Odell attended a jump suit party at Drake's house with Gronk and Amendola.

Surprised no one got arrested for this. f-ing me-first distraction.


arc  
Go Terps : 1/2/2019 2:19 pm : link
The video was shot in March.
RE: And there was also the back and forth involving Mara and his dad  
ron mexico : 1/2/2019 2:25 pm : link
In comment 14244526 Go Terps said:
Quote:
So in the past ten months or so:

- video with the coke
- called out by Mara, who then was called out by his dad (do we think his dad shot that off without Beckham knowing it?)
- fined by the head coach

So yeah it's not a body in the trunk, but this past year hasn't passed uneventfully for Beckham and the Giants.


1 he wasn't doing coke, at worst he was smoking a blunt. I mean whats the point of being a pro athlete if you can't party in hotel rooms with chicks?
2 and three are the same thing

lets weigh that vs 1000 yards in 12 games in a dysfunctional offense.
Did you see the Mike Tomlin quote today...  
bw in dc : 1/2/2019 2:26 pm : link
when he was asked if having a diva WR is ultimately bad for a football team.

Tomlin: "Yes."

And he meant that sh-t.
RE: RE: And there was also the back and forth involving Mara and his dad  
baadbill : 1/2/2019 2:33 pm : link
In comment 14244544 ron mexico said:
Quote:
... I mean whats the point of being a pro athlete if you can't party in hotel rooms with chicks?...


I have to assume this was said tongue in cheek... if not, take away the word "pro" ... being a professional, at anything, involves fucking maturity and certainly not being a fucking kid who would say what you just said.
Clearly a man who has never seen the Super Bowl Shuffle Bears  
Ten Ton Hammer : 1/2/2019 2:36 pm : link
And the 70s raiders kind of disproved that you had to have a gray flannel suit mentality to be a successful professional football player, did they not? Al Davis made it his mission to collect talented players with misfit personalities and turn them into winners.
RE: arc  
arcarsenal : 1/2/2019 2:38 pm : link
In comment 14244532 Go Terps said:
Quote:
The video was shot in March.


That's when it was released. From what I remember, people pointed out that he was missing tattoos he had at the time, so it appeared the video was old.

Regardless, I'll ask it again... if he wasn't actually doing coke in the video, why do I care?

Are we going to play up a naivety card now where we act surprised to find out that star athletes may find themselves in situations other than being in the film room studying plays?

Let's compare that list that contains virtually nothing of relevance to this and decide what a distraction REALLY looks like...

• Brown took to Instagram to publicly call out his girlfriend and mother of his children for not taking care of her children from a previous relationship.
• Brown skipped most of OTAs after he saw Roethlisberger wasn't there. Roethlisberger later admitted he had a pre-planned family vacation during the optional practices.
• Brown slammed the media on the first day of mandatory minicamp, appearing to question why he plays, saying, “Am I playing football to make a lot of money or am I playing football to take care of my family?” Brown continued, saying the media puts pressure on him and that he is unable to go out in public because of it.
• Brown showed up in a helicopter to training camp.
• Brown disappeared for a week during training camp. Mike Tomlin claimed that he had been sent to Pittsburgh for medical tests, but Brown was filmed in a pool in Miami.
• Brown reportedly called Bouchette a “racist” after Bouchette tweeted that Brown was limping at training camp. He then called Bouchette a “clown” on Twitter. Reportedly, Brown apologized to Bouchette.
• Brown showed up more than four hours late to an event at Children’s Hospital, offering no explanation as to why he was so late.
• Brown makes a joke in a GQ article about cheating on his girlfriend and mother of children, saying “it’s kind of hard to keep it in my pants.”
• Brown threatened to assault ESPN’s The Undefeated reporter Jesse Washington, saying “wait to I see you bro we gone see what your jaw like.” Brown then issued a public apology, then went on a strange tirade to media in which he called himself an ”exceptionalism.”
• Brown was spotted by CBS cameras hugging former Browns offensive coordinator Todd Haley during a game against Cleveland. He then was caught bragging about reaching 10,000 career receiving yards to Haley on team’s Snapchat, minutes after the 21-21 tie.
• Brown was seen yelling at his offensive coordinator Randy Fichtner and wide receivers coach Darryl Drake on the sideline. He then left the locker room before media could ask him about it vs Chiefs.
• Brown tweeted "trade me let's find out" when criticized on Twitter by former Steelers public relations staffer Ryan Scarpino.
• Brown failed to show up for Monday meetings after the Chiefs game. He then told the media he was “pissed off” because “we suck.”
• Brown was sued for trashing his Florida apartment and then claimed he had $80,000 in cash and a gun stolen from him. He was also sued for tossing furniture from the 14th floor of his apartment building, nearly hitting and, potentially, killing a 22-month-old toddler.
• Brown was cited for driving in excess of 100 miles per hour on McKnight Road, which was over 55 miles per hour more than the posted speed limit. Brown reportedly told police that he was late for a team meeting.
• Brown repeatedly posted his personal accolades on social media after Steelers losses, including a crucial 31-28 loss in New Orleans.
• Brown reportedly got into a disagreement with Roethlisberger in practice, throws a football at him and leaves practice.
• Brown reportedly skips the team’s walk through the day before Bengals game, shows up before the game, is told he won’t play and leaves at halftime.
All of these incidents, some major, some minor, have occurred since the last offseason. Brown, who will turn 31 in July, is set to have a base salary of $12,625,000 in 2019. He is signed through the 2021 season.
RE: RE: no one is apologizing for him  
UConn4523 : 1/2/2019 2:39 pm : link
In comment 14244433 ThatLimerickGuy said:
Quote:
In comment 14244413 UConn4523 said:


Quote:


we are simply stating that you are incorrect in your assessment of his injury. That isn't an apology, that's you being wrong.



By your and Fatman's logic we can never discuss the extent of a player's injury. If you read what I wrote I openly say that only one person knows the true extent of the injury and that is Odell.

I openly admit that my take is an opinion based on a generalization of leg bruises. I am no more incorrect in my assessment than anyone else other than Odell or someone who has examined him.

What I am doing is looking at this from a big picture perspective based on the circumstantial information available. Notice that I don't question Landon Collins, or Olivier Vernon for missing games. Why? Because they have never been anything but professionals in the way they act on and off of the field, so they have earned the benefit of the doubt. Beckham has not.


That still makes no sense. You should be questioning the medical staff if you think Odell's injury isn't major. If he wasn't cleared how is that Beckham's fault?
RE: RE: RE: And there was also the back and forth involving Mara and his dad  
ron mexico : 1/2/2019 2:42 pm : link
In comment 14244564 baadbill said:
Quote:
In comment 14244544 ron mexico said:


Quote:


... I mean whats the point of being a pro athlete if you can't party in hotel rooms with chicks?...



I have to assume this was said tongue in cheek... if not, take away the word "pro" ... being a professional, at anything, involves fucking maturity and certainly not being a fucking kid who would say what you just said.


No its not tongue in cheek at all.

And I'm not a kid. My days of partying in hotel rooms are (mostly) over, but I sure as fuck don't regret them. I mean whats the point of achieving some success if you can't enjoy it.

Also  
UConn4523 : 1/2/2019 2:44 pm : link
Landon Collins threw Apple under the bus (not something I had a problem with) but why isn't that on your radar as not being a good teammate?
RE: RE: RE: no one is apologizing for him  
Now Mike in MD : 1/2/2019 2:45 pm : link
In comment 14244587 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
In comment 14244433 ThatLimerickGuy said:


Quote:


In comment 14244413 UConn4523 said:


Quote:


we are simply stating that you are incorrect in your assessment of his injury. That isn't an apology, that's you being wrong.



By your and Fatman's logic we can never discuss the extent of a player's injury. If you read what I wrote I openly say that only one person knows the true extent of the injury and that is Odell.

I openly admit that my take is an opinion based on a generalization of leg bruises. I am no more incorrect in my assessment than anyone else other than Odell or someone who has examined him.

What I am doing is looking at this from a big picture perspective based on the circumstantial information available. Notice that I don't question Landon Collins, or Olivier Vernon for missing games. Why? Because they have never been anything but professionals in the way they act on and off of the field, so they have earned the benefit of the doubt. Beckham has not.




That still makes no sense. You should be questioning the medical staff if you think Odell's injury isn't major. If he wasn't cleared how is that Beckham's fault?


Isn't it also possible that the team saw he was still getting back from last year's injury and with this quad injury and the fact that we were going nowhere, just said let's shut him down, get better, and come back next year when hopefully we have something to play for with you at 100 percent. Either way, not his fault or decision.
arc  
Go Terps : 1/2/2019 2:46 pm : link
It was March 8 of 2018. See link below. Can't blame him for hanging out with that chick. I also can't blame him if he did lines off her ass. I know I would have at his age. That doesn't mean it would go over any better with Mara or the NFL.

As for Antonio Brown, I agree he's a scumbag and wouldn't want him anywhere near my team. I don't know why that makes Beckham look better.
Link - ( New Window )
RE: Ben Roethlisberger is a gigantic diva and potentially a sex criminal  
ThatLimerickGuy : 1/2/2019 2:47 pm : link
In comment 14244515 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
And he constantly throws his own teammates under the bus.


What does Ben have to do with this? Or Antonio Brown? Both are assholes and not the Giant's problem.

The amount of mental gymnastics necessary to defend Beckham is crazy. Do you not realize that there is a world where you don't need to cowtow to and coddle a guy who you paid 90 million to?

Just shut up, show up and catch the fucking ball and there will be no issues.

Beckham could SO easily just tow the line publicly and bang whores and do lines every night and nobody would care if he didn't get caught.

The problem is what I said earlier. Beckham's top priority is being a celebrity and his second is a football player. That is fine lots of guys are like that but they fucking show up every week and at least pretend to give a shit about the team who made them mega millionaires.

Beckham tells Josina Anderson he cant say if he wants to be a Giant. Go fuck yourself then. Go do your thing somewhere else because my interest is in seeing the Giants win rings, not coddle a man child.

RE: Also  
Go Terps : 1/2/2019 2:48 pm : link
In comment 14244600 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
Landon Collins threw Apple under the bus (not something I had a problem with) but why isn't that on your radar as not being a good teammate?


Is that to me? I thought that was horseshit from Collins.
.  
arcarsenal : 1/2/2019 2:50 pm : link
Well, this is from the linked article...

Quote:
“People say that we did drugs, but no way. No way,” she said. “[Beckham] was completely against that.”


It certainly looks to me like the girl was. But that's her prerogative. If Beckham didn't, the video is basically useless. The guy is eating pizza. Who cares.

This incident just never seemed to be a "thing" to me - he's literally doing nothing illegal in the video. I'm not sure why it's supposed to bother me that he's in it. I would have done the same thing.

The NFL didn't do anything about it and neither did Mara, so I guess they didn't care that much either.
RE: RE: Ben Roethlisberger is a gigantic diva and potentially a sex criminal  
Ten Ton Hammer : 1/2/2019 2:51 pm : link
In comment 14244611 ThatLimerickGuy said:
Quote:
Do you not realize that there is a world where you don't need to cowtow to and coddle a guy who you paid 90 million to?


Do you not realize that you make it a point to go looking for what he does off the field? You're the person that consumes TMZ, then bitches at the player for being on TMZ.
RE: RE: I hope Odell is at a party with Aaron Rodgers  
Gatorade Dunk : 1/2/2019 2:53 pm : link
In comment 14244315 ThatLimerickGuy said:
Quote:
In comment 14244295 UConn4523 said:


Quote:


one day and someone scoops a pic of them hanging out together. I can only imagine the posts from TLG when that happens.



Pro Tip: When you need to resort to attacking the messenger that means that your own rebuttal to the message is weak.

Again- I have my opinion and yes I am abrasive with it. If that bothers some people I apologize for that, but the message should not be lost.

I never said it was a FACT that Beckham didn't play because he isn't a team guy. I said he has a bruised leg and disappeared from the team when they had a chance to make the playoffs, both from playing OR from being on the sideline during home games (like other superstar team leaders) to help out. What is untrue about that? Nothing.

It is my OPINION that he isn't a team guy because of that. It is difficult for some of you to distinguish between the two because reality doesn't suit the narrative that Odell is this great player who gets a bad rap. Every piece of grief he gets he has brought on himself. I don't want to see my star player spearing other players getting ejected. I don't want to see my star player in a hotel room with drugs on video. I don't want to see my star player shirtless on a boat in the week leading up to a playoff game when he shits the bed.

Maybe these things don't bother you guys but it is my OPINION that it bothers me. Different strokes for Different folks I guess.

Also FYI, notice the usual suspects who bring up the nonsense that should have passed years ago just because again- they can't attack the message so they go right for the messenger.

Pro tip: the fact that you continue to post here despite the fact that you're universally regarded as a joke is generally seen as proof that you're an attention-starved troll.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I genuinely feel sorry for you. Maybe 2019 is the year when things finally turn around for you!
RE: arc  
ron mexico : 1/2/2019 2:54 pm : link
In comment 14244609 Go Terps said:
Quote:
It was March 8 of 2018. See link below. Can't blame him for hanging out with that chick. I also can't blame him if he did lines off her ass. I know I would have at his age. That doesn't mean it would go over any better with Mara or the NFL.

As for Antonio Brown, I agree he's a scumbag and wouldn't want him anywhere near my team. I don't know why that makes Beckham look better. Link - ( New Window )


By their lack of response, neither Mara or the NFL gave a shit. Neither did Gettleman based on his response. Why? because they live in the real world where this is nothing.


RE: RE: Also  
UConn4523 : 1/2/2019 2:54 pm : link
In comment 14244614 Go Terps said:
Quote:
In comment 14244600 UConn4523 said:


Quote:


Landon Collins threw Apple under the bus (not something I had a problem with) but why isn't that on your radar as not being a good teammate?



Is that to me? I thought that was horseshit from Collins.


No, TLG. He said he doesn't question Collins because he's earned it by being a good teammate. Which makes no sense if you are ok with him calling out Apple (I am, totally understand why others may not be).

I don't mind Beckham criticism, he's earned his fair share. I just don't like opinions being passed off as facts. Its bullshit, doesn't matter what side of the argument you are on.
The timing of this thread is fucking hilarious  
Dave in Hoboken : 1/2/2019 2:56 pm : link
considering the GM said literally 3 hours after this thread was created that they're not trading him.
How are any of us coddling Beckham?  
UConn4523 : 1/2/2019 2:56 pm : link
we don't know him or associate with him. We are commenting on a message board. When i'm not on BBI i don't think about Beckham until a Giants game is on.
.  
Big Blue '56 : 1/2/2019 2:56 pm : link
Quote:


The problem is what I said earlier. Beckham's top priority is being a celebrity and his second is a football player. That is fine lots of guys are like that but they fucking show up every week and at least pretend to give a shit about the team who made them mega millionaires.



If his number 1 priority is being a celebrity, why has he had the best WR stst start in the history of the NFL?
Terps is handling this well  
BigBlueCane : 1/2/2019 2:59 pm : link
and he's correct.
RE: RE: RE: I hope Odell is at a party with Aaron Rodgers  
ron mexico : 1/2/2019 3:00 pm : link
In comment 14244625 Gatorade Dunk said:
Quote:
In comment 14244315 ThatLimerickGuy said:


Quote:


In comment 14244295 UConn4523 said:


Quote:


one day and someone scoops a pic of them hanging out together. I can only imagine the posts from TLG when that happens.



Pro Tip: When you need to resort to attacking the messenger that means that your own rebuttal to the message is weak.

Again- I have my opinion and yes I am abrasive with it. If that bothers some people I apologize for that, but the message should not be lost.

I never said it was a FACT that Beckham didn't play because he isn't a team guy. I said he has a bruised leg and disappeared from the team when they had a chance to make the playoffs, both from playing OR from being on the sideline during home games (like other superstar team leaders) to help out. What is untrue about that? Nothing.

It is my OPINION that he isn't a team guy because of that. It is difficult for some of you to distinguish between the two because reality doesn't suit the narrative that Odell is this great player who gets a bad rap. Every piece of grief he gets he has brought on himself. I don't want to see my star player spearing other players getting ejected. I don't want to see my star player in a hotel room with drugs on video. I don't want to see my star player shirtless on a boat in the week leading up to a playoff game when he shits the bed.

Maybe these things don't bother you guys but it is my OPINION that it bothers me. Different strokes for Different folks I guess.

Also FYI, notice the usual suspects who bring up the nonsense that should have passed years ago just because again- they can't attack the message so they go right for the messenger.


Pro tip: the fact that you continue to post here despite the fact that you're universally regarded as a joke is generally seen as proof that you're an attention-starved troll.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I genuinely feel sorry for you. Maybe 2019 is the year when things finally turn around for you!


I would say he is a troll, but the fact that he was complaining about his fantasy football schedule tells me that unfortunately he is like this in real life as well.

RE: RE: RE: RE: And there was also the back and forth involving Mara and his dad  
baadbill : 1/2/2019 3:17 pm : link
In comment 14244594 ron mexico said:
Quote:
In comment 14244564 baadbill said:


Quote:


In comment 14244544 ron mexico said:


Quote:


... I mean whats the point of being a pro athlete if you can't party in hotel rooms with chicks?...



I have to assume this was said tongue in cheek... if not, take away the word "pro" ... being a professional, at anything, involves fucking maturity and certainly not being a fucking kid who would say what you just said.



No its not tongue in cheek at all.

And I'm not a kid. My days of partying in hotel rooms are (mostly) over, but I sure as fuck don't regret them. I mean whats the point of achieving some success if you can't enjoy it.


You honestly equate "partying in hotel rooms" as being a measure of business success? Holy crap. It probably has little to do with business success - but if there is a correlation, it is almost certainly an inverse relationship.

RE: RE: RE: Also  
ThatLimerickGuy : 1/2/2019 3:17 pm : link
In comment 14244628 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
In comment 14244614 Go Terps said:


Quote:


In comment 14244600 UConn4523 said:


Quote:


Landon Collins threw Apple under the bus (not something I had a problem with) but why isn't that on your radar as not being a good teammate?



Is that to me? I thought that was horseshit from Collins.



No, TLG. He said he doesn't question Collins because he's earned it by being a good teammate. Which makes no sense if you are ok with him calling out Apple (I am, totally understand why others may not be).

I don't mind Beckham criticism, he's earned his fair share. I just don't like opinions being passed off as facts. Its bullshit, doesn't matter what side of the argument you are on.


Apple quit on the team last year. Remember that game (for some reason SF comes to mind) when he just gave up?

He deserved it and Collins did the right thing.

Apples (no pun intended) and Oranges.

The premise of this thread quickly went from "should we trade beckham" to "attack anyone who wants to trade beckham".

I'm not surprised because that is the general take around here and I personally know a lot of BBIers offline who tell me "it's not worth arguing with those mongos so we let them stay in their echo chamber of self righteousness all day and keep saying the same thing back and forth".

It's a Giants message board but when any opinion, supported by facts, whether you agree or not, is presented that is contrary to what is popular this place freaks out.

Let's have a real discussion on Beckham and if you think he will ever win a ring with the Giants. I'd love to do that without the name calling and bullshit of people just attacking the messenger. I'm sure I can be enlightened and I am sure I can enlighten anyone who has an open mind. I'd love to do that anytime, via e-mail or on here or whatever.

I'm not saying people are successful because they party  
ron mexico : 1/2/2019 3:20 pm : link
in hotel rooms with hot chicks.


I'm saying being successful allows people to party in hotel rooms with hot chicks. And partying in hotel rooms with hot chicks it a lot of fun.


Ok TLG lets have a discussion about his behavior  
ron mexico : 1/2/2019 3:24 pm : link
Is it appropriate to criticize OBJ for posting a video of him playing a free throw basket ball game in his basement with a family member?

Follow up question, should people who do criticize such things be taken seriously?


RE: Ok TLG lets have a discussion about his behavior  
ThatLimerickGuy : 1/2/2019 3:31 pm : link
In comment 14244693 ron mexico said:
Quote:
Is it appropriate to criticize OBJ for posting a video of him playing a free throw basket ball game in his basement with a family member?

Follow up question, should people who do criticize such things be taken seriously?



Well...fair question.

If we realize that Beckham contract is 18 million a year, and he missed 4 games with the leg bruise, that is about 5 million dollars worth of salary collected while not playing.

Sure maybe it isn't a big deal to you and it's not my $$ per se (although I pay my season ticket dues just like everyone else who has them) but is it good optics to be doing that? My question is whether it is a smart thing or a dumb thing to do. Shouldn't he think before posting that "hey maybe I shouldn't be posting this right now"? Isn't that common sense?

If Beckham called out a WR  
UConn4523 : 1/2/2019 3:34 pm : link
like Collins did with Apple you’d be all over it. You are so full of shit.
RE: RE: Ok TLG lets have a discussion about his behavior  
ron mexico : 1/2/2019 3:35 pm : link
In comment 14244710 ThatLimerickGuy said:
Quote:
In comment 14244693 ron mexico said:


Quote:


Is it appropriate to criticize OBJ for posting a video of him playing a free throw basket ball game in his basement with a family member?

Follow up question, should people who do criticize such things be taken seriously?





Well...fair question.

If we realize that Beckham contract is 18 million a year, and he missed 4 games with the leg bruise, that is about 5 million dollars worth of salary collected while not playing.

Sure maybe it isn't a big deal to you and it's not my $$ per se (although I pay my season ticket dues just like everyone else who has them) but is it good optics to be doing that? My question is whether it is a smart thing or a dumb thing to do. Shouldn't he think before posting that "hey maybe I shouldn't be posting this right now"? Isn't that common sense?


Can you explain what playing a game in his basement has to do with missing time. Just so we can follow this "common sense". Because I'm having a hard time connecting the dots here. Why is it bad optics? Educate me.
.  
arcarsenal : 1/2/2019 3:46 pm : link
It's funny - I don't even know what video we're talking about with the basement or basketball or whatever is in question here. I've never seen it and I think this is the first I've even heard about it. I'm constantly accused of being a "fanboy" or apologist, yet I have barely any idea what Beckham does off the field if it isn't football related or widely reported.

It also seems like he's often criticized for something that would be a total non-issue if it was someone else and that the guys who don't like him spend more time closely following his off-field actions than those who do.
RE: RE: RE: Ok TLG lets have a discussion about his behavior  
ThatLimerickGuy : 1/2/2019 3:47 pm : link
In comment 14244715 ron mexico said:
Quote:
In comment 14244710 ThatLimerickGuy said:


Quote:


In comment 14244693 ron mexico said:


Quote:


Is it appropriate to criticize OBJ for posting a video of him playing a free throw basket ball game in his basement with a family member?

Follow up question, should people who do criticize such things be taken seriously?





Well...fair question.

If we realize that Beckham contract is 18 million a year, and he missed 4 games with the leg bruise, that is about 5 million dollars worth of salary collected while not playing.

Sure maybe it isn't a big deal to you and it's not my $$ per se (although I pay my season ticket dues just like everyone else who has them) but is it good optics to be doing that? My question is whether it is a smart thing or a dumb thing to do. Shouldn't he think before posting that "hey maybe I shouldn't be posting this right now"? Isn't that common sense?




Can you explain what playing a game in his basement has to do with missing time. Just so we can follow this "common sense". Because I'm having a hard time connecting the dots here. Why is it bad optics? Educate me.


Sure.

If you aren't fit to earn your 1.2 million dollar paycheck for a week, are you fit to be shooting jumpers in your basement? If the answer is yes, that he felt OK enough to do that but not play an NFL football game (which is probably the actual case), is it smart to post social media posts of you doing that, or would it be wiser to just keep any physical activity that you are doing private? That is what I mean by bad optics.
Optics are only a concern  
Ten Ton Hammer : 1/2/2019 3:53 pm : link
In that people like you, who have no interest in what a player does off the field "allegedly", will make it a point to update the community as to what he posts on Instagram.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Ok TLG lets have a discussion about his behavior  
ron mexico : 1/2/2019 3:55 pm : link
In comment 14244734 ThatLimerickGuy said:
Quote:
In comment 14244715 ron mexico said:


Quote:


In comment 14244710 ThatLimerickGuy said:


Quote:


In comment 14244693 ron mexico said:


Quote:


Is it appropriate to criticize OBJ for posting a video of him playing a free throw basket ball game in his basement with a family member?

Follow up question, should people who do criticize such things be taken seriously?





Well...fair question.

If we realize that Beckham contract is 18 million a year, and he missed 4 games with the leg bruise, that is about 5 million dollars worth of salary collected while not playing.

Sure maybe it isn't a big deal to you and it's not my $$ per se (although I pay my season ticket dues just like everyone else who has them) but is it good optics to be doing that? My question is whether it is a smart thing or a dumb thing to do. Shouldn't he think before posting that "hey maybe I shouldn't be posting this right now"? Isn't that common sense?




Can you explain what playing a game in his basement has to do with missing time. Just so we can follow this "common sense". Because I'm having a hard time connecting the dots here. Why is it bad optics? Educate me.



Sure.

If you aren't fit to earn your 1.2 million dollar paycheck for a week, are you fit to be shooting jumpers in your basement? If the answer is yes, that he felt OK enough to do that but not play an NFL football game (which is probably the actual case), is it smart to post social media posts of you doing that, or would it be wiser to just keep any physical activity that you are doing private? That is what I mean by bad optics.


See this is exactly why no one takes you seriously.

Shooting jumpers? he was playin on one of these in a room with 8' ceinings. There was no jumping going on.



I think the real answer is that OBJ should understand that a portion of the fan base are unhinged miserable fucks and that he should never show any enjoyment, ever, unless its directly related to the giants winning and even then the display of enthusiasm should consist of handing the ball to the ref and a firm handshake with his team mates.
.  
arcarsenal : 1/2/2019 3:59 pm : link
TLG... honest question.

If you don't like Odell Beckham (and, by your own admission, you most certainly do not...), then why do you spend time following what he does off the field?

I don't really get that.

I don't use Instagram or really any social media - but it's like me being on Instagram, following Kanye West, and then complaining about everything he does. I could just... not follow him and ignore the things he does in his spare time if they bother me. And I would if that were the case.

Unless you think it's important to "keep tabs" on him to make sure he's not doing something terrible like playing a arcade basketball game that does not put him in any more jeopardy of injury than lifting a fork to eat dinner, I don't see the point.

He obviously bothers you, but you continue to gravitate towards anything with his name on it. It's a strange dynamic.
RE: .  
Eman11 : 1/2/2019 4:06 pm : link
In comment 14244753 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
TLG... honest question.

If you don't like Odell Beckham (and, by your own admission, you most certainly do not...), then why do you spend time following what he does off the field?

I don't really get that.

I don't use Instagram or really any social media - but it's like me being on Instagram, following Kanye West, and then complaining about everything he does. I could just... not follow him and ignore the things he does in his spare time if they bother me. And I would if that were the case.

Unless you think it's important to "keep tabs" on him to make sure he's not doing something terrible like playing a arcade basketball game that does not put him in any more jeopardy of injury than lifting a fork to eat dinner, I don't see the point.

He obviously bothers you, but you continue to gravitate towards anything with his name on it. It's a strange dynamic.


I think it's more like following him waiting and hoping something shady pops up so he can post " see, see, I told you so" type of shit.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Also  
Gatorade Dunk : 1/2/2019 4:27 pm : link
In comment 14244680 ThatLimerickGuy said:
Quote:
The premise of this thread quickly went from "should we trade beckham" to "attack anyone who wants to trade beckham".

I'm not surprised because that is the general take around here and I personally know a lot of BBIers offline who tell me "it's not worth arguing with those mongos so we let them stay in their echo chamber of self righteousness all day and keep saying the same thing back and forth".

See, this is where you get things mixed up. It's not "attack anyone who wants to trade [B]eckham," it's "point out what a fraudulent troll ThatLimerickGuy is." There's a difference.

And I'm fairly certain that you know precisely zero BBI members in any context other than this board unless you knew them before you signed up. Who are these über-knowledgeable fans (who just happen to agree with you)? It's rather convenient that they just "let [us] stay in [our] echo chamber" don't you think? Doesn't that result in the exact same outcome as these supposed BBIers not actually existing in the first place?

You seem to think you're some sort of hero for an unspoken truth, carrying the flag for all of the anonymous Giants fans that share your opinion but not your voice. You're not. You're a joke that doesn't appear to ever have a punchline.
RE: Ok  
clatterbuck : 1/2/2019 4:52 pm : link
In comment 14244390 ThatLimerickGuy said:
Quote:
Let me put it this way.

Odell has no structural or even soft tissue injury. He has a bruise/hematoma.

Now again- let me be the first to say that NONE of us know the subjective amount of pain that Odell is in. Hence, we form OPINIONS on whether a player with a bruised leg (or whatever you want to classify the injury as if that doesn't suit you) is able to play or not.

It is absolutely true that for all we know Odell was begging to play but the trainers and doctors would not allow it, even when they were technically in the middle of a playoff race. It is also possible that Odell made a business decision to not push through a bruised leg. NOBODY can ever know the reality to that because only Odell really knows how he feels, which is why, on a discussion message board, we discuss and form opinions.

What I DO know is that some players, in that situation, push through being hurt. We find out sometimes that guys play with torn ACL's and meniscus tears or other major injuries. I'm not suggesting that anyone should do that.

Let's for argument sake say that you are all right and I am wrong, that Beckham took his desire to play all the way up to John Mara who just refused to risk his 90 million dollar investment. Again for all we know that could have happened. Where was Beckham during the home games? Turn on any game and you see the team leaders (unless they are recovering from major surgery of some kind) in street clothes on the sideline.

Let's end it here- I get it- I hate Beckham, you guys will constantly apologize for the guy. We are all entitled to our opinions.

What I don't appreciate is being ganged up on, personally attacked and the gay slurs. That is uncalled for.


You have no factual basis for making any statement about the nature or extent of Beckham's injury. None. Zippo. What is a fact is that team doctors would not clear him to play, regardless of his pain tolerance. Did it ever occur to you the team was making a "business decision" about the risk of further injury? Do you think Shurmur would for a moment countenance putting a player on the field that hasn't been medically cleared? Do you think management/ownership would let him? We all have opinions. We all post them. Some on the site are more informed, and base comments on deeper knowledge of the game, institutional memory about the team, and sometimes, inside information. I wouldn't put your posts about Beckham in that category.
RE: .  
ThatLimerickGuy : 1/2/2019 5:29 pm : link
In comment 14244753 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
TLG... honest question.

If you don't like Odell Beckham (and, by your own admission, you most certainly do not...), then why do you spend time following what he does off the field?

I don't really get that.

I don't use Instagram or really any social media - but it's like me being on Instagram, following Kanye West, and then complaining about everything he does. I could just... not follow him and ignore the things he does in his spare time if they bother me. And I would if that were the case.

Unless you think it's important to "keep tabs" on him to make sure he's not doing something terrible like playing a arcade basketball game that does not put him in any more jeopardy of injury than lifting a fork to eat dinner, I don't see the point.

He obviously bothers you, but you continue to gravitate towards anything with his name on it. It's a strange dynamic.


Actually a good question.

I follow and interact with a ton of Giants both past and present on social media.

Beckham shows up in my feed the same as anyone else. If Halapio was doing something dumb and someone started a thread asking if we should hold onto him I would say the same.thing.

Beckham is just a lightning rod because a) he is great and b) he enjoys the celebrity lifestyle.

Now if you are saying that I should just avoid the Beckham threads because there is really no "discussion" other than how he is a boy scout choir boy then I agree with you and will note it going forward.

My opinion is well known by now. I don't need to be called every name under the sun and gay on BBI about it.
No one called you gay  
UConn4523 : 1/2/2019 6:20 pm : link
rather, you were mocked for calling Aaron Rodgers gay because of some rumors that you’ve been privy to for years now, apparently. You are the joke, is it that hard to understand?

You are one of the first posters on any Beckham thread and your post reads the same every time. “I told you guys for a long time now but you can’t win with Beckham. He only cares about himself, etc.” you are a played out record that brings nothing new, insightful, or interesting to Beckham threads. You constantly contradict yourself, and you state opinions as facts.

Again, you are a joke.
RE: RE: .  
arcarsenal : 1/2/2019 6:31 pm : link
In comment 14244873 ThatLimerickGuy said:
Quote:
In comment 14244753 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


TLG... honest question.

If you don't like Odell Beckham (and, by your own admission, you most certainly do not...), then why do you spend time following what he does off the field?

I don't really get that.

I don't use Instagram or really any social media - but it's like me being on Instagram, following Kanye West, and then complaining about everything he does. I could just... not follow him and ignore the things he does in his spare time if they bother me. And I would if that were the case.

Unless you think it's important to "keep tabs" on him to make sure he's not doing something terrible like playing a arcade basketball game that does not put him in any more jeopardy of injury than lifting a fork to eat dinner, I don't see the point.

He obviously bothers you, but you continue to gravitate towards anything with his name on it. It's a strange dynamic.



Actually a good question.

I follow and interact with a ton of Giants both past and present on social media.

Beckham shows up in my feed the same as anyone else. If Halapio was doing something dumb and someone started a thread asking if we should hold onto him I would say the same.thing.

Beckham is just a lightning rod because a) he is great and b) he enjoys the celebrity lifestyle.

Now if you are saying that I should just avoid the Beckham threads because there is really no "discussion" other than how he is a boy scout choir boy then I agree with you and will note it going forward.

My opinion is well known by now. I don't need to be called every name under the sun and gay on BBI about it.


No one's calling you gay, dude. I don't know why you think this.

I don't think I've even attacked you personally at all here. I certainly disagree with you on several fronts, but I think I've kept it fairly adult and stayed away from anything off-top for the most part.

I also don't think Beckham is a choir boy - the difference is that I don't need him to be and don't care if he isn't. I always have the same, consistent logic when it comes to this stuff...

If a player stays out of legal trouble, works hard at his craft, and falls in line when it comes to being a team player and having a team-first mentality, I don't care what he does in his spare time.

Now, some of you guys disagree with me on his being a team-first guy, but I do believe he is very invested in his teammates and the Giants.

He's constantly taking young players under his wing (Shepard, Barkley) and pumping them up/challenging them to be better. He's held team dinners with several players on a weekly basis (including defensive players), he showed up to camp this year when almost every one of his peers in a similar contract scenario did not.

Literally the worst thing Odell Beckham has done in the last 2-3 years is do a stupid interview with Lil Wayne. It caused a stir for about 2 days and then everyone was over it. It wasn't even a big deal - in retrospect, though, it's just one of those things he needs to learn to avoid. And I think Shurmur made that clear to him.

Outside of that, I don't understand what all of this bellyaching is really over. He wasn't even called for a personal foul or unsporsmanlike conduct penalty once this year unless I'm mistaken. What's he doing that's so terrible/embarrassing the franchise?
RE: No one called you gay  
ThatLimerickGuy : 1/2/2019 6:49 pm : link
In comment 14244925 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
rather, you were mocked for calling Aaron Rodgers gay because of some rumors that you’ve been privy to for years now, apparently. You are the joke, is it that hard to understand?

You are one of the first posters on any Beckham thread and your post reads the same every time. “I told you guys for a long time now but you can’t win with Beckham. He only cares about himself, etc.” you are a played out record that brings nothing new, insightful, or interesting to Beckham threads. You constantly contradict yourself, and you state opinions as facts.

Again, you are a joke.


No I was called a c*ckmonkey twice.

Whatever you are right I am staying off Beckham threads. You guys win. You beat me down to the point that I will stop trying to put forth a different opinion on a message board. Congrats guys. Go ahead and worship the guy who said he doesn't even know if he wants to be a Giant in a public interview. In the end history will prove me right, as usual, and the rats will scurry to deflect and defend.
It’s actually a word that describes a male pornstar  
UConn4523 : 1/2/2019 6:51 pm : link
it doesn’t address orientation. So no one called you gay.
No one called you gay  
ron mexico : 1/2/2019 6:53 pm : link
But your obsession with OBJ , the Midwest gay club scene and penchant for being overly dramatic could lead some to certain conclusion..,
RE: RE: No one called you gay  
arcarsenal : 1/2/2019 6:59 pm : link
In comment 14244959 ThatLimerickGuy said:
Quote:
In comment 14244925 UConn4523 said:


Quote:


rather, you were mocked for calling Aaron Rodgers gay because of some rumors that you’ve been privy to for years now, apparently. You are the joke, is it that hard to understand?

You are one of the first posters on any Beckham thread and your post reads the same every time. “I told you guys for a long time now but you can’t win with Beckham. He only cares about himself, etc.” you are a played out record that brings nothing new, insightful, or interesting to Beckham threads. You constantly contradict yourself, and you state opinions as facts.

Again, you are a joke.



No I was called a c*ckmonkey twice.

Whatever you are right I am staying off Beckham threads. You guys win. You beat me down to the point that I will stop trying to put forth a different opinion on a message board. Congrats guys. Go ahead and worship the guy who said he doesn't even know if he wants to be a Giant in a public interview. In the end history will prove me right, as usual, and the rats will scurry to deflect and defend.


The bolded part is why you annoy people.

I'm honestly just trying to point it out to you so you can see it - because I'm not sure you do.

But stuff like that is why you're attacked here. And because you keep claiming people are calling you "gay" (and seem extremely bothered by it...) when no one has called you that or used it as an insult.

It's aggravating. It's like everyone keeps trying to show you something that is right out in the open and you just keep ignoring it despite it being right there in front of you. That's why these threads always turn out this way.

I was super critical of Beckham earlier in the season. So, to act like we're all these unabashed worshippers is all just hot air hyperbolic nonsense.
RE: Boy  
figgy2989 : 1/2/2019 7:05 pm : link
In comment 14244232 figgy2989 said:
Quote:
You do have a pretty high opinion of yourself.


Figured I would add this again to support arc’s comment.
RE: Are..  
ThatLimerickGuy : 1/2/2019 7:13 pm : link
In comment 14244254 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
TLG is at least unifying. Where most here can't agree on anything, he's universally regarded as a cockmonkey, and believe me, the gay reference isn't lost.....


Don't change what was said.

Again. Let's debate this issue fairly and rationally. Ill admit when someone makes a good point. Seems like nobody else can do that here and immediately go personal. I see that as weakness in the argument.
It was..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 1/2/2019 7:20 pm : link
tongue in cheek. Oh, there I go again!!

Cockmonkey vs. cocksucker. Learn the difference.

Embrace it.

Cockmonkey.
And the..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 1/2/2019 7:22 pm : link
definition of cockmonkey seems to fit very well - like a glove:

Quote:
An idiot of immense proportion, usually amazingly arrogant and annoying.
Wear..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 1/2/2019 7:23 pm : link
it proudly:
No  
Torrag : 1/2/2019 7:33 pm : link
I want two things in regards to Beckham for 2019. I want to see what he can do next season in this offense now that it's got a few scalps on the wall and gained some confidence as a group.

I'd also like to try and get him a full slate of 16 games so that if we do look to trade him in 2020 we aren't undercutting our own return.

This isn't the offseason to deal him imo.
RE: arc...  
NINEster : 1/2/2019 8:03 pm : link
In comment 14244046 bw in dc said:
Quote:
Fair value? Oakland got a #1 for Cooper, who was coming off a bad season, and playing poorly again for Oakland this year.


Cooper has had some very good years. Top 10 since he came out, close to top 5.
RE: Wear..  
ThatLimerickGuy : 1/2/2019 8:38 pm : link
In comment 14245009 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
it proudly:


Lol...relax. Don't do that man I'm not going to get you banned or suspended from your precious BBI. Own it. It is all good just don't lie and try to walk it back.
Walk..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 1/2/2019 8:39 pm : link
it back? Because you have no fucking clue what a cockmonkey means?

You are a fucking peach.
By the way..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 1/2/2019 11:16 pm : link
don't you find it a bit ironic that you have no qualms about speculating on Rodgers or Beckham's sexuality, but seem to be a bit unhinged about the term cockmonkey?
RE: RE: No one called you gay  
Hsilwek92 : 1/2/2019 11:42 pm : link
In comment 14244959 ThatLimerickGuy said:
Quote:
In comment 14244925 UConn4523 said:


Quote:


rather, you were mocked for calling Aaron Rodgers gay because of some rumors that you’ve been privy to for years now, apparently. You are the joke, is it that hard to understand?

You are one of the first posters on any Beckham thread and your post reads the same every time. “I told you guys for a long time now but you can’t win with Beckham. He only cares about himself, etc.” you are a played out record that brings nothing new, insightful, or interesting to Beckham threads. You constantly contradict yourself, and you state opinions as facts.

Again, you are a joke.



No I was called a c*ckmonkey twice.

Whatever you are right I am staying off Beckham threads. You guys win. You beat me down to the point that I will stop trying to put forth a different opinion on a message board. Congrats guys. Go ahead and worship the guy who said he doesn't even know if he wants to be a Giant in a public interview. In the end history will prove me right, as usual, and the rats will scurry to deflect and defend.


Jesus fucking Christ you are a drama queen. Get the fuck over yourself man.

And where is this, “Different point of view.” you’re supposedly giving? Every fucking Odell thread with you is the same god damn thing. First you post something like, “Well, if they had listened to me...” which you did in this thread; then you go down a rabbit hole of untrue bullshit and cite them as facts. Clock-fucking-work. I’d say it’s impressive if it weren’t so sad

As far as the Midwest Gay Scene thing, that’s your fault ignoramous. You post something as stupid as that as fact and you deserve all the flack you get for it. Stop with the woe is me act.

Christ.
This guy loves the attention  
Ten Ton Hammer : 1/3/2019 9:30 am : link
even the bad kind.
RE: RE: arc...  
YAJ2112 : 1/3/2019 9:38 am : link
In comment 14245065 NINEster said:
Quote:
In comment 14244046 bw in dc said:


Quote:


Fair value? Oakland got a #1 for Cooper, who was coming off a bad season, and playing poorly again for Oakland this year.



Cooper has had some very good years. Top 10 since he came out, close to top 5.


Say what? Cooper has finished in the top 10 in yards once since he came out - 8th in 2016. He's never been top 10 in catches or TDs. Where are all these very good years?
If the Giants are moving away from Eli  
AnnapolisMike : 1/3/2019 10:33 am : link
and going to Lauletta or another young QB, it might be a good time to do it. Why pay the money for a WR when your are two years away. OBJ is nice to have....but he is a luxury on a team trying to completely rebuild.

Like others have said an acquiring team knows what they are getting into with the $'s. They are not responsible for his bonus money against the cap. It would make sense for a team that needs a few last pieces.
Gettleman confirmed yesterday that Beckham is part  
Dave in Hoboken : 1/3/2019 10:39 am : link
of the solution going forward. It's alot of the other parts of the roster that we'll be moving on from soon enough.
RE: If the Giants are moving away from Eli  
Ten Ton Hammer : 1/3/2019 12:34 pm : link
In comment 14245793 AnnapolisMike said:
Quote:
and going to Lauletta or another young QB, it might be a good time to do it. Why pay the money for a WR when your are two years away. OBJ is nice to have....but he is a luxury on a team trying to completely rebuild.



I wouldn't say he's a luxury. A talent like that makes the game easier for a young QB. The second you trade him away and start with a new QB, you're just going to go looking for players that can help the new QB succeed. As soon as they got Eli, the Giants went out and paid good money for an offensive playmaker.

Trading away Beckham creates a gaping hole in the roster that you'd have to spend a day 1 pick on to try to fill, and there's a high chance that player has nowhere near the impact. With some chance that player doesn't even work out.
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