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Eli's ability to throw off-balance/weird arm angles

Osi Osi Osi OyOyOy : 1/3/2019 11:27 am
How would you guys grade this aspect of Eli's game? For his career and and in 2018.

IMO it's one of his biggest weaknesses at this point in his career and it's really noticeable when you compare him to some of the top QBs in the league. Our OL obviously needs to improve but Eli "needs" a clean pocket more than most QBs because he can't make "all arm" throws with consistent accuracy.
He needs  
Les in TO : 1/3/2019 11:28 am : link
To work on his side arm and left handed tosses
.  
arcarsenal : 1/3/2019 11:30 am : link
Eli isn't a good improv QB - he really has never been. He's always been a set and throw guy.

His bread and butter is the PA rollout. Eli is actually great out of the pocket on those and always looks really comfortable, but when it comes to little sidearm flips or tough angle throws like we've seen Mahomes, Rodgers, and Stafford master... that's definitely not Eli's forte.

That weird left handed attempt against Tennessee in 2010 kinda sums Eli up when it comes to that stuff.
Yeah it’s definitely his biggest declining trait  
UConn4523 : 1/3/2019 11:31 am : link
he just doesn’t have enough creative ability anymore (due to simply getting old and nothing being very mobile to begin with) to handle broken plays. He needs very good circumstances to be successful which is in part the lines fault but he just doesn’t have it anymore.
Not his most redeeming quality for sure  
Snacks : 1/3/2019 11:37 am : link
but keep in mind Eli is a dinosaur in today's NFL. Pure pocket passer. His game was never based on throwing from weird angles/situations.

It became crystal clear to me over the last couple of years just how important mobility is in a QB in today's NFL. OL play around the league has declined and college is not sending as many NFL ready OL to the NFL like it did back in the day.

I miss my grand daddy's NFL. ;)

Still believe most important ingredient for success  
joeinpa : 1/3/2019 11:46 am : link
In a quarterback in the NFL is ability to read defenses and make plays from the pocket. For this reason Eli can still be effective with a decent O line, as he was for much of the second half.

However, he is often overwhelmed by the athleticism around him and when you compare him to young mobile quarterbacks who can also do what he does well, it demonstrates how much mobility adds to the position
RE: Still believe most important ingredient for success  
Thegratefulhead : 1/3/2019 11:50 am : link
In comment 14245932 joeinpa said:
Quote:
In a quarterback in the NFL is ability to read defenses and make plays from the pocket. For this reason Eli can still be effective with a decent O line, as he was for much of the second half.

However, he is often overwhelmed by the athleticism around him and when you compare him to young mobile quarterbacks who can also do what he does well, it demonstrates how much mobility adds to the position
This is dead on. With Eli's age and the current state of our roster, we will not win another playoff game with Eli Manning? Wagers?
He's actually gotten pretty good at throwing on the run...  
BillKo : 1/3/2019 11:53 am : link
........not that he's running around crazy. But when flushed out and he's able to avoid tacklers, he's pretty good.

Eli's not really making the side arm throws you see guys like Mahomes or Stafford are able to do. That's just in his game.

And agreed his best moving throw is the play action fake to the left, and rollout right to hit the WR on a comeback.
he needs a  
Pep22 : 1/3/2019 12:02 pm : link
perfect situation in terms of time and space to step into a throw; avoiding anything...be it a threat of a sack, a DLs attempt to swat the ball out of his hands or creating a passing angle --- are just not things he is capable of, especially these days.

People talk about athleticism in terms of the forty, but there is something to being fluid and coordinated (i.e. Big Ben, Stafford...guys that couldn't crack 5.0 in the forty but are adept at avoidance skills)
Thats never been in Eli's skill set  
JerseyCityJoe : 1/3/2019 12:14 pm : link
What bothers me more is as Eli aged a stiff wind would knock him down.
Eli used to be pretty good...  
2ndroundKO : 1/3/2019 12:52 pm : link
at that. Not sure why some think that was never part of his arsenal. 2011 Eli was amazing at side-stepping, creating angles—whatever he needed to do.

That has declined over the years.

Another fallacy is the idea that this sort of QB can’t be successful or that you need to be a pure pocket passer. Eli in 2011 was both. Many elite QBs are.

When you can evade the rush, buy time and consisrently make plays, it slows down the defense—that gives you the clean pocket later in the game. When the opposite is true, the defense begins to pin their ears back.
The most important QB quality is accuracy  
since1925 : 1/3/2019 12:52 pm : link
Eli made two incredibly accurate throws against Dallas, dropping balls, 30 years downfield, into a bucket. For the most part, he has retained his accuracy.

This was NOT because of dump offs. His YPA this year was 7.5. Middle of the league. Other notable YPA - Roethlisberger, Brady and Mariota at 7.6 YPA - Prescott, Rogers and Trubiski at 7.4., Foles, Luck, Stafford, Newton, Carr and many others were further down the list. The best in the league (with 300+ passing attempts) was Mahomes at 8.8.

That was Eli's best YPA since 2011. In short, he is not declining in any significant way when it comes to accuracy. At least, not to my eyeballs or in numbers. His accuracy is a reflection of his protection.



RE: He needs  
Gman11 : 1/3/2019 2:10 pm : link
In comment 14245887 Les in TO said:
Quote:
To work on his side arm and left handed tosses


Us old guys remember Fran Tarkenton used to try those type of throws to avoid a sack. The only problem is it usually had the same results and it wasn't good.
Always a weakness for Eli  
KWALL2 : 1/3/2019 3:14 pm : link
If feet weren’t set he wasn’t consistent. Not very good throwing on the move to either side or from different angles.
RE: Always a weakness for Eli  
Go Terps : 1/3/2019 3:29 pm : link
In comment 14246251 KWALL2 said:
Quote:
If feet weren’t set he wasn’t consistent. Not very good throwing on the move to either side or from different angles.


Yup. Biggest reason he's not a great fit in the WCO, and why hiring two WCO coordinators as head coaches have been mystifying decisions.
RE: RE: Always a weakness for Eli  
mrvax : 1/3/2019 3:35 pm : link
In comment 14246283 Go Terps said:
Quote:
In comment 14246251 KWALL2 said:


Quote:


If feet weren’t set he wasn’t consistent. Not very good throwing on the move to either side or from different angles.



Yup. Biggest reason he's not a great fit in the WCO, and why hiring two WCO coordinators as head coaches have been mystifying decisions.


Agree. That makes no sense to me.
RE: RE: Always a weakness for Eli  
widmerseyebrow : 1/3/2019 4:10 pm : link
In comment 14246283 Go Terps said:
Quote:
In comment 14246251 KWALL2 said:


Quote:


If feet weren’t set he wasn’t consistent. Not very good throwing on the move to either side or from different angles.



Yup. Biggest reason he's not a great fit in the WCO, and why hiring two WCO coordinators as head coaches have been mystifying decisions.


Spot on.
I don't think Eli...  
Mike From Brielle : 1/3/2019 5:09 pm : link
is washed up. I think for a long time McAdoo was blaming Eli for his offense not clicking and people didn't realize / notice how bad the o-line had really become. Least of all McAdoo evidently. When McAdoo tried to shift a supposedly high mobility fairly high draft pick quarterback in there the offense still fizzled and didn't run as well as when Eli was in there. This year when the O-line situation finally stabilized somewhat Eli and the passing game improved, the running game improved, and even the defense improved (more rest with the opposing offense under greater pressure). When McAdoo's mentor (Reese) handed out too many big contracts, him and McAdoo needed a scape goat.
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