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Quarterback options for 2019 and beyond

GoBlue : 1/4/2019 5:19 pm
There is not a franchise quarterback in this draft. The Giants are in a win now state. I believe that we can get Derrick Carr from a trade. Jon Gruden is not afraid to trade star players. This season for Carr wasnít great but he didnít have a lot of talent around him. He didnít have support from his teammates either. This could be a new chapter in his career.
Based on the thread title  
Diver_Down : 1/4/2019 5:21 pm : link
are we to assume that you will iterate other options? I only see one.
Why would we want a quarterback  
Jay on the Island : 1/4/2019 5:22 pm : link
that "didnít have support from his teammates"? We have to trade assets to get an average QB who has a big contract? I don't want to sign Foles but I would much rather sign him than trade draft picks for Derek Carr.
I Agree  
lax counsel : 1/4/2019 6:19 pm : link
That there likely isn't a franchise qb in the 2019 draft, though I've come around a bit on Drew Lock (but not at number 6). However, Derek Carr is an average qb on a large contract that will not be worth the cap space and draft picks it will take to get him.

The most realistic scenario to find the next franchise qb is that the Giants position themselves to obtain one of the qbs in what should be a strong 2020 class (whether that be through acquiring additional draft picks or embracing a lost season- which is less likely).
Just for the sake of conversation, GoBlue  
CT Charlie : 1/4/2019 6:19 pm : link
I'd be curious how you define a "franchise quarterback" and which current franchise quarterbacks you had identified with confidence prior to the draft.

For consideration: Is a franchise quarterback one who will be a starter for a minimum of 5 years? More? Is he someone who must be capable of winning a Super Bowl? Would you consider Foles one? How about Hostetler?

My opinion is that identifiable franchise quarterbacks (without defining them) are rare. Andrew Luck was a good bet, but I don't think there was a consensus about ANY of the Big 5 from last season, even though it was considered a strong group: Darnold, Mayfield, Rosen, Allen, and Jackson. And even after a full season, only Mayfield (who wasn't a consensus #1 by a long shot) seems to be a sure thing.
RE: Just for the sake of conversation, GoBlue  
lax counsel : 1/4/2019 6:30 pm : link
In comment 14247756 CT Charlie said:
Quote:
I'd be curious how you define a "franchise quarterback" and which current franchise quarterbacks you had identified with confidence prior to the draft.

For consideration: Is a franchise quarterback one who will be a starter for a minimum of 5 years? More? Is he someone who must be capable of winning a Super Bowl? Would you consider Foles one? How about Hostetler?

My opinion is that identifiable franchise quarterbacks (without defining them) are rare. Andrew Luck was a good bet, but I don't think there was a consensus about ANY of the Big 5 from last season, even though it was considered a strong group: Darnold, Mayfield, Rosen, Allen, and Jackson. And even after a full season, only Mayfield (who wasn't a consensus #1 by a long shot) seems to be a sure thing.


My personal thoughts on a franchise qb:

(1) Qb regularly has his team in contention (not necessarily winning the super bowl but are playoff regulars or at least in the hunt the last week of the season) and can raise the play of his team when it isn't at is best (see Manning 2011) and cover for other areas of deficiency.

(2) Top 10 statistically on a year to year basis.

(3) Long term starter at the position where the franchise does not have to worry about who will be its qb in 1,5,10 years (barring major injury)

(4) When in the playoffs can raise his play, and make the "clutch" play (see Manning 2011 NFCC game and throw to Manning to Manningham throw in 46)

No, I do not consider Foles or Hoss as a franchise player, merely ones who did a nice mop up job when the starter did the bulk of the work (Giants were 11-3 when Simms went down, Eagles were 11-2 when Wentz went down), or solid back-ups and spot starters.

It is very difficult to find that type of guy, which is why when you have the opportunity you must draft him.
I would offer the Bills two 1st round draft picks for  
GeofromNJ : 1/4/2019 6:42 pm : link
Josh Allen. If they yes, the Giants are set for the next ten years.
RE: I would offer the Bills two 1st round draft picks for  
arcarsenal : 1/4/2019 6:51 pm : link
In comment 14247778 GeofromNJ said:
Quote:
Josh Allen. If they yes, the Giants are set for the next ten years.


I read posts like this and wonder if people even think before they throw up on their keyboard.

Dave Gettleman literally just passed on Josh Allen in the draft - but, now he's going to want to pony up not just one first rounder to get a hold of Josh Allen, now he's going to want to pony up two of them!

I guess the original draft cost of pick 2 overall wasn't steep enough - if we want Josh Allen, we really have to make sure we burn some valuable assets to do it!

Beyond that, why is Buffalo trading the QB they literally just drafted?

This suggestion couldn't make less sense if you wanted it to.

(Spoiler alert - NYG will never ever offer this to the Bills. Erase it from your 'idea' bank and pretend you never suggested it)
.  
arcarsenal : 1/4/2019 6:57 pm : link
As for the OP...

Derek Carr would be a terrible move for the Giants.

We'd be better off sticking with Eli for another year and drafting a QB this year or next.

Carr doesn't elevate the Giants in a way that results in any more wins than Eli can. Even now.

I really believe the worst thing you can do is wind up on the hook for a non-rookie deal with significant money involved on a QB we didn't draft that another team doesn't want. See Kirk Cousins in Minnesota. And Cousins only cost money.... Carr is going to cost draft capital and then he's costing 20M+ against the cap in addition to that.

It's not a smart move.
I commend your patience, Arc.  
Diver_Down : 1/4/2019 6:58 pm : link
Taking the time to respond to such nonsense and even point out the flaws in Geo's logic deserves the recognition. I personally wish I had the 2 seconds back from reading his response.
RE: I commend your patience, Arc.  
arcarsenal : 1/4/2019 7:15 pm : link
In comment 14247792 Diver_Down said:
Quote:
Taking the time to respond to such nonsense and even point out the flaws in Geo's logic deserves the recognition. I personally wish I had the 2 seconds back from reading his response.


Suggestions like that just blow my mind. People think the NFL is Madden. It doesn't work that way.
You certainly can't engineer an outcome two drafts out...  
bw in dc : 1/4/2019 7:24 pm : link
There is too much time and too many things that can happen between now and April 2020.

The plan should be to draft a QB in this draft in rounds two or three. Whereas the conventional wisdom thinks there aren't any franchise QBs this year, I think there is terrific upside with Grier and Lock.

So you think Carr would work better than Eli did behind this oline?  
SterlingArcher : 1/4/2019 7:28 pm : link
Please, stop the madness!
RE: I would offer the Bills two 1st round draft picks for  
GFAN52 : 1/4/2019 7:33 pm : link
In comment 14247778 GeofromNJ said:
Quote:
Josh Allen. If they yes, the Giants are set for the next ten years.


...  
Toth029 : 1/4/2019 8:04 pm : link
Josh Allen is green but under the right coach will be a menace. That arm and his mobility are lethal.
RE: RE: Just for the sake of conversation, GoBlue  
Dutch77 : 1/4/2019 8:12 pm : link
In comment 14247767 lax counsel said:
Quote:
In comment 14247756 CT Charlie said:


Quote:


I'd be curious how you define a "franchise quarterback" and which current franchise quarterbacks you had identified with confidence prior to the draft.

For consideration: Is a franchise quarterback one who will be a starter for a minimum of 5 years? More? Is he someone who must be capable of winning a Super Bowl? Would you consider Foles one? How about Hostetler?

My opinion is that identifiable franchise quarterbacks (without defining them) are rare. Andrew Luck was a good bet, but I don't think there was a consensus about ANY of the Big 5 from last season, even though it was considered a strong group: Darnold, Mayfield, Rosen, Allen, and Jackson. And even after a full season, only Mayfield (who wasn't a consensus #1 by a long shot) seems to be a sure thing.



My personal thoughts on a franchise qb:

(1) Qb regularly has his team in contention (not necessarily winning the super bowl but are playoff regulars or at least in the hunt the last week of the season) and can raise the play of his team when it isn't at is best (see Manning 2011) and cover for other areas of deficiency.

(2) Top 10 statistically on a year to year basis.

(3) Long term starter at the position where the franchise does not have to worry about who will be its qb in 1,5,10 years (barring major injury)

(4) When in the playoffs can raise his play, and make the "clutch" play (see Manning 2011 NFCC game and throw to Manning to Manningham throw in 46)

No, I do not consider Foles or Hoss as a franchise player, merely ones who did a nice mop up job when the starter did the bulk of the work (Giants were 11-3 when Simms went down, Eagles were 11-2 when Wentz went down), or solid back-ups and spot starters.

It is very difficult to find that type of guy, which is why when you have the opportunity you must draft him.


The 1st criteria in your statement was a QB who regularly has his team in contention. Whatís your definition of regularly? Weíve only been to the playoffs 6 times in the past 14 years and twice in the last 7.
RE: ...  
arcarsenal : 1/4/2019 8:12 pm : link
In comment 14247841 Toth029 said:
Quote:
Josh Allen is green but under the right coach will be a menace. That arm and his mobility are lethal.


The accuracy isn't close to lethal, though. He got picked off more than he threw TD passes and he's completing like.. half of his passes. Which is terrible.

Allen is far from a lock to be anything more than average. Jeff George and JaMarcus Russell had big arms too. Doesn't matter if the other stuff isn't there.

I saw nothing from Josh Allen this year outside of better than advertised mobility that makes me feel like we missed on this player whatsoever. I would have been furious if we took this guy over Barkley.
The more I think about it, the more I want Haskins  
Sean : 1/4/2019 8:46 pm : link
I like what Iíve seen from him. He has the size, a very good arm & I like his poise. If Gettleman & Shurmur have a conviction about him, they should jump on the opportunity.

I get the Ďwait until 2020Ē mentality, but whose to say we will be in the opportunity to draft any of them? A year is forever in the NFL, if we are picking 15, can we get to the top 5 if needed? A lot of what ifs.

If Haskins has a high grade, get it done now.
I want Lawrence so freaking bad.  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 1/4/2019 8:53 pm : link
He's like that insanely hot chick you pine for, but will never approach.

I know he's not coming out till 21, but I'd sacrifice two more garbage years for him while we build up the roster for our next franchise QB.
Give me the Josh Allen from Kentucky  
rasbutant : 1/4/2019 9:01 pm : link
Thatís what people should be talking about. Not a QB on another team.
RE: I want Lawrence so freaking bad.  
Sean : 1/4/2019 9:26 pm : link
In comment 14247866 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
Quote:
He's like that insanely hot chick you pine for, but will never approach.

I know he's not coming out till 21, but I'd sacrifice two more garbage years for him while we build up the roster for our next franchise QB.


2021 is an eternity away. Whose to say he doesnít get hurt? New regime in place? So many things could happen between now and then.
RE: Give me the Josh Allen from Kentucky  
Rjanyg : 1/4/2019 9:35 pm : link
In comment 14247867 rasbutant said:
Quote:
Thatís what people should be talking about. Not a QB on another team.


I amen to this.
I think no matter the year  
joeinpa : 1/4/2019 9:36 pm : link
Or who is entering the draft, the mantra, ďThere is no franchise quarterback in this class ď will be a part of the discussion on BBI.

RE: RE: RE: Just for the sake of conversation, GoBlue  
lax counsel : 1/4/2019 9:57 pm : link
In comment 14247845 Dutch77 said:
Quote:
In comment 14247767 lax counsel said:


Quote:


In comment 14247756 CT Charlie said:


Quote:


I'd be curious how you define a "franchise quarterback" and which current franchise quarterbacks you had identified with confidence prior to the draft.

For consideration: Is a franchise quarterback one who will be a starter for a minimum of 5 years? More? Is he someone who must be capable of winning a Super Bowl? Would you consider Foles one? How about Hostetler?

My opinion is that identifiable franchise quarterbacks (without defining them) are rare. Andrew Luck was a good bet, but I don't think there was a consensus about ANY of the Big 5 from last season, even though it was considered a strong group: Darnold, Mayfield, Rosen, Allen, and Jackson. And even after a full season, only Mayfield (who wasn't a consensus #1 by a long shot) seems to be a sure thing.



My personal thoughts on a franchise qb:

(1) Qb regularly has his team in contention (not necessarily winning the super bowl but are playoff regulars or at least in the hunt the last week of the season) and can raise the play of his team when it isn't at is best (see Manning 2011) and cover for other areas of deficiency.

(2) Top 10 statistically on a year to year basis.

(3) Long term starter at the position where the franchise does not have to worry about who will be its qb in 1,5,10 years (barring major injury)

(4) When in the playoffs can raise his play, and make the "clutch" play (see Manning 2011 NFCC game and throw to Manning to Manningham throw in 46)

No, I do not consider Foles or Hoss as a franchise player, merely ones who did a nice mop up job when the starter did the bulk of the work (Giants were 11-3 when Simms went down, Eagles were 11-2 when Wentz went down), or solid back-ups and spot starters.

It is very difficult to find that type of guy, which is why when you have the opportunity you must draft him.



The 1st criteria in your statement was a QB who regularly has his team in contention. Whatís your definition of regularly? Weíve only been to the playoffs 6 times in the past 14 years and twice in the last 7.


I guess I would say, if the player had a 15 year career, contention something like at least 10 for those years, maybe 12. Thatís my thought, and again contention doesnít necessarily mean they are in the SB or even NFCC game every year, it could mean they had a good season but maybe were the odd man out from the playoffs at 10 wins. I would say the Giants were in contention pretty much every year from 2005-2012.
RE: The more I think about it, the more I want Haskins  
Dutch77 : 1/4/2019 10:13 pm : link
In comment 14247863 Sean said:
Quote:
I like what Iíve seen from him. He has the size, a very good arm & I like his poise. If Gettleman & Shurmur have a conviction about him, they should jump on the opportunity.

I get the Ďwait until 2020Ē mentality, but whose to say we will be in the opportunity to draft any of them? A year is forever in the NFL, if we are picking 15, can we get to the top 5 if needed? A lot of what ifs.

If Haskins has a high grade, get it done now.


Completely agree Sean.
RE: I Agree  
giantstock : 1/4/2019 10:44 pm : link
In comment 14247755 lax counsel said:
Quote:

The most realistic scenario to find the next franchise qb is that the Giants position themselves to obtain one of the qbs in what should be a strong 2020 class (whether that be through acquiring additional draft picks or embracing a lost season- which is less likely).


I would love to wait for 2020 but for those of you who seem to think it will be easy to get a top tier QB-- where do you expect the Gmen to finish next year? WOuld you say 8-8 with a decent QB and picking up two OL in FA along with drafting defense in rd 1 and possibly rd 2?

SO what draft picks do you have to give to get the elite QB? All the other teams knwo that the QB's are elite, right? SO where's the plan to get one? WHich GMen draft picks or players are you trading to entice the other team?

IMO what gets lost (a particular idiot that regularly posts on here using for example Arizona and Josh ROsen as an example.) is that the 2020 QB's are supposedly elite and better than this last class. They are are considered elite. Other teams that stink (not all teams that stink have a super future QB) WANT elite QB's so you can't use "Arizona" as an example.

Who are you trading or how many draft picks are yo giving up for the elite Qb considering these QB's will be more highly thought of in the future than what most rotten teams have right now.
let's see what happens before  
Doomster : 1/4/2019 10:46 pm : link
March 17th....
2020 draft  
mattyblue : 1/4/2019 11:45 pm : link
Should never enter the minds of the Giants. You cannot have the mentality that you will be able to get one just by trading up. Do you want to send Saquon and picks to move up? It will be very hard to trade up when multiple teams will want to.

Personally, I like Haskins and Jones a great deal. People talk about the class of QBs last year, this year, and next year. Really itís all meaningless because you are talking about 1 QB. If the Giants like one of those 2 or even Grier or Lock they will take them. No matter what all the Mel Kipers of the world say.
Draft Daniel Jones  
jnoble : 1/5/2019 2:04 am : link
Sit him behind Eli or if Eli leaves this off-season start him from week one and run a more ground based offense centered around Barkley until Jones gets more confident and can air it out more.
Problem solved. You're all welcome.
RE: Draft Daniel Jones  
mattyblue : 1/5/2019 4:28 am : link
In comment 14247928 jnoble said:
Quote:
Sit him behind Eli or if Eli leaves this off-season start him from week one and run a more ground based offense centered around Barkley until Jones gets more confident and can air it out more.
Problem solved. You're all welcome.


I would love this, but a lot of people will disagree. Hoping DG is on board with him. I like him more than Haskins but Haskins has one hell of a season.
Bias  
Nomad Crow on the Madison : 1/5/2019 7:09 am : link
I cannot tell if it's just my "I hate Ohio State" bias or not, but I do not have any interest in Dwayne Haskins for the Giants. I do not see him as a legitimate first round talent. He has started too few games, seems very stiff athletically, played with far superior talent than his opponents, threw a simplified route tree.

If we have to draft a QB, I would prefer to pick Daniel Jones in the second round if he lasts that long (and he might), or Gardner Minshew or Clayton Thorson in the fourth/fifth round. Thorson, in particular, intrigues me because of his arm talent and his toughness. He certainly elevated the play of those around him. He had success with NO TALENT around him. Put Haskins on that 2017 Northwestern team, and see how he does.
Iím warming up to Jones.  
Giant John : 1/5/2019 7:25 am : link
Giants will decide.
I no longer believe that  
section125 : 1/5/2019 7:27 am : link
a classic franchise QB is needed to win in the NFL. Perhaps the definition of franchise QB has changed. (Moved from the Eli, TB, Rivers type QB)

Dak Prescott, Russell Wilson are not classics and they win. Lamar Jackson (an extreme) is winning for now. Not sure you would call Patrick Mahomes a classic Franchise QB.

I'd look for an accurate QB, with an above average arm and smart(reads and playbook). Mobility is a must. I think this type can be found into the 3rd round rather than top 10 picks of the draft.

There is more to this than what I posted above. I have not really thought about it beyond watching these younger kids play and win with less than perfect classic franchise credentials.

Plus, finding the types of oline that can protect the TBs and Eli's is getting harder and harder as they do not teach that type of protection in college as before.

Just a point of discussion.
RE: I no longer believe that  
Deejboy : 1/5/2019 7:40 am : link
In comment 14247948 section125 said:
Quote:
a classic franchise QB is needed to win in the NFL. Perhaps the definition of franchise QB has changed. (Moved from the Eli, TB, Rivers type QB)

Dak Prescott, Russell Wilson are not classics and they win. Lamar Jackson (an extreme) is winning for now. Not sure you would call Patrick Mahomes a classic Franchise QB.

I'd look for an accurate QB, with an above average arm and smart(reads and playbook). Mobility is a must. I think this type can be found into the 3rd round rather than top 10 picks of the draft.

There is more to this than what I posted above. I have not really thought about it beyond watching these younger kids play and win with less than perfect classic franchise credentials.

Plus, finding the types of oline that can protect the TBs and Eli's is getting harder and harder as they do not teach that type of protection in college as before.

Just a point of discussion.

You basically described Ryan Finley who no one is really talking about in the draft. I expect him to move up some boards during the Senior Bowl.
RE: I no longer believe that  
giantstock : 1/5/2019 11:05 am : link
In comment 14247948 section125 said:
Quote:
a classic franchise QB is needed to win in the NFL. Perhaps the definition of franchise QB has changed. (Moved from the Eli, TB, Rivers type QB)

Dak Prescott, Russell Wilson are not classics and they win. Lamar Jackson (an extreme) is winning for now. Not sure you would call Patrick Mahomes a classic Franchise QB.

I'd look for an accurate QB, with an above average arm and smart(reads and playbook). Mobility is a must. I think this type can be found into the 3rd round rather than top 10 picks of the draft.

There is more to this than what I posted above. I have not really thought about it beyond watching these younger kids play and win with less than perfect classic franchise credentials.

Plus, finding the types of oline that can protect the TBs and Eli's is getting harder and harder as they do not teach that type of protection in college as before.

Just a point of discussion.


I think relying on non-1st round picks is disastrous because you need to get lucky. IMO you don't need a super QB but it is more likely you get a good QB in 1st 10 picks than in 3rd round.

IMO your pov is destined for QB Hell. And I don't want Dak Prescott. I want Mahomes. DOn't care whether you call him "franchise" but Mahomes is great and dak ain't.

I do expect Cowboys ot win but Dak is extrmely limited. Mahomes is a stud. I epxect Mahomes tpyes and Goff types over their career ot lead them more playoff victories than dak. Dak had the benefit this year of being in an awful division.
Davis Webb says hi  
GFAN52 : 1/5/2019 11:19 am : link
.
Iíve agreed with the BBI consensus on Dak  
cosmicj : 1/5/2019 11:49 am : link
Limited but decent player. But I have to say I was really impressed with his play week 17. That game winning throw was a thing of beauty. And I can point to other moments in the game that genuinely impressed me. Is BBI underestimating him? Young QBs after all do show growth and Dak has been playing at least acceptably from the get-go. I am concerned :(
.  
arcarsenal : 1/5/2019 11:56 am : link
I think Dak is good value on his current deal - the return they've gotten on the draft pick has actually been quite good.

We're talking about a QB with a cap hit under 1M. It's basically a steal for Dallas at this point - even if you aren't a believer in Prescott.

The problem with Prescott is that the value is there now, but it won't be if they give him a new, big-money deal. Once his cap hit is about 25x what it is now, things will change there.

It's not an easy decision to make. I think the fear of moving backwards will be too much for Dallas to let Dak walk. I think they'll pay him. I wouldn't, personally - and I think it'll hurt Dallas more than it'll help, but I get why they'd do it.
This site has continually undervalued Dak's game  
Jimmy Googs : 1/5/2019 12:01 pm : link
The guy is a leader, makes plays with his arm and feet and is mobility makes him a nice threat in the red zone. Has played well in second half along with rest of the team.

If he can improve his ball security as he stands tall in pocket than Dallas is a tough out...
I think you guys don't know who is a franchise QB and who is  
wgenesis123 : 1/5/2019 1:57 pm : link
not. I remember everyone saying the Chiefs were crazy to trade up for their guy. After all, he was not a franchise QB. I remember everyone saying Wentz was a much better prospect than Goff. Was Andy Reid that smart or did he just know you have to roll the dice on someone or you end up with nothing? If the Giants end up taking a chance on someone like Haskins I am not going to judge the call. I am just going to wait and see what we got.
RE: I think you guys don't know who is a franchise QB and who is  
arcarsenal : 1/5/2019 1:59 pm : link
In comment 14248243 wgenesis123 said:
Quote:
not. I remember everyone saying the Chiefs were crazy to trade up for their guy. After all, he was not a franchise QB. I remember everyone saying Wentz was a much better prospect than Goff. Was Andy Reid that smart or did he just know you have to roll the dice on someone or you end up with nothing? If the Giants end up taking a chance on someone like Haskins I am not going to judge the call. I am just going to wait and see what we got.


Everyone?

Sure, let's just paint the entire board with one broad brush and claim everyone had the same opinions on all of these QB's.

Makes sense.
That belays the point. However if I am not sure about  
wgenesis123 : 1/5/2019 2:12 pm : link
Andy Reid, well how can I be sure about you Arc!
I don't believe predicting the future of these young QB's  
wgenesis123 : 1/5/2019 2:15 pm : link
is an exact science for anyone.
Mind boggling logic  
idiotsavant : 1/5/2019 2:20 pm : link
Whereas some, fearing ones inability to "engineer an outcome" (of QB search) a year and a half in advance (2020 draft) draw the conclusion that drafting a question mark at QB in round 3 this year (instead of a offensive line actual value pick at spot, like guard or center, or a D back or a lb) somehow mitigates that risk. It mitigates nothing. But take the center, guard or dbacks anyway bc that how you build a team to set the stage for a better 2020.

Just silly, chicken thinking to get scared and draft a marginal QB right now.
Never said they should pick a QB this year. Just said if they  
wgenesis123 : 1/5/2019 2:39 pm : link
do I will reserve any judgement and wait and see what we got. If they believe in a QB I want them to take him. If like last year they do not, I am fine with that too! What I don't believe is that you guys know there are no franchise QB's in this draft. There may be no one that fits your prototype. All that proves is no one fits your prototype. Some players exceed expectations in every draft. Some are even QB's.
Seems to me that teams that win  
idiotsavant : 1/5/2019 4:11 pm : link
Have a unit or two, a thing or two, that they really exceed at or what have you. A thing that's unique in the league therefore hard to prep for.

Could be quick RPO, could be D line and pass rush, could be super see ol pass pro (but that's hard without the good and many runs as we have seen) Anything.

My guess, we go nuts on D broadly and OL for 2019.

The 'identity' for 2019 would be lots of running on O and wrecking shit on D. Pass rush and run stopping at same time.

For 2020 all the O theory and nuance will get a fresh look and the big investment with the stage having been set by having a line and a legit D.

I know it's hard for fans to envision a draft without WRs and qbs...but come 2020 it's going to have made sense looking back.

Set.The.Stage.

With a D and an OL, as the Ravens showed, you can start to do shit on O that orherwsise don't work.
RE: Seems to me that teams that win  
giantstock : 1/6/2019 6:35 am : link
In comment 14248393 idiotsavant said:
Quote:
Have a unit or two, a thing or two, that they really exceed at or what have you. A thing that's unique in the league therefore hard to prep for.

Could be quick RPO, could be D line and pass rush, could be super see ol pass pro (but that's hard without the good and many runs as we have seen) Anything.

My guess, we go nuts on D broadly and OL for 2019.

The 'identity' for 2019 would be lots of running on O and wrecking shit on D. Pass rush and run stopping at same time.

For 2020 all the O theory and nuance will get a fresh look and the big investment with the stage having been set by having a line and a legit D.

I know it's hard for fans to envision a draft without WRs and qbs...but come 2020 it's going to have made sense looking back.

Set.The.Stage.

With a D and an OL, as the Ravens showed, you can start to do shit on O that orherwsise don't work.


I don't agree with how yo'ure looking at this. WITHOUT the elite qb going forward you CANNOT have an explosive offense. Thus you're running game WILL BE compromised in 2019.

What makes the GMe n unique is Barkley --- and if healthy OBJ. They don't have near the defense to be like the Ravens - so how many years will it take? In 202 theteam will be 7-9 or 8-8 mroe likely so they aren't gettignt h QB. SO they have to trade up-- when do you then expect the Gmen defense to be any good?

****Instead of being Baltimore -- the Gmen should try to be more like KC. Ill take KC's outlook over the next 5 years over Baltimore's. And that starts with a high=powered offense. ANd in order to get that-- you need a QB.

OFC they've got to like the guy. So if they like for example Haskins and he is projected to be a good to very good NFL QB-- you take him -- and now you're "SET THE STAGE" for being great in the NFC with an incredible high-powered offense just like KC is doing in the AFC.

**THe Giants are closer to kC type of team than Baltimore. The Giants have a window of prime for Barkley. We know before 2019 season starts that Barkley will be wasted. Each year you further delay getting THAT QB it's another wasted year with Barkley.
In 2nd paragraph I meant to say  
giantstock : 1/6/2019 6:49 am : link


The 2019 team will be something like 7-9 or 8-8 if Eli is brought back - you get TWO OL in FA and you start building the D through the draft. That will lead them to 7-9 or 8-8. If you want to trade up after 2019 for a Qb - you're taking away from drafting DEFENSE in 2020- so the defense will still SUCK. You aren't turning that defense around in ONE year.


Many of you think it's so easy to get a QB. And it's easy to trade up. Well it could be if you're covered at many other positions but the Gmen's defense is pathetic. You are taking away opportunities to build the defense up if you trade up. Secondly, if Gmen are 7-9 or 8-8 think about/propose a trade that would entice a lousy team to bypass an elite QB to sell to you while you know you have a solid defense behind you.
The chiefs traded up 17 spots  
dep026 : 1/6/2019 7:58 am : link
And their defense is pathetic. Is it not?
RE: The chiefs traded up 17 spots  
giantstock : 1/6/2019 8:11 am : link
In comment 14249371 dep026 said:
Quote:
And their defense is pathetic. Is it not?


Yes it is which is why I said the Gmen should try to be more like them. It's easier to become the Chiefs than Baltimore.
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