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NFT: Mets fans..Mets trade for CF Keon Broxton from Brewers

superspynyg : 1/5/2019 1:52 pm
I did not see it posted..which is odd.

Gave up RP Wahl and two prospects.


will delete if I missed the thread.
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In reading the Brewers fans comments  
SJGiant : 1/5/2019 2:51 pm : link
About the trade, many of them will miss him. Some understand there was no room on the major league roster for him. Great teammate and great with the fans.
The Mets led the majors with reliever pitchers on their 40 man  
ZGiants98 : 1/5/2019 2:56 pm : link
Swapping one for OF depth is really a no brainer when you think about it. Bachelor, Zamora, Drew Smith, Hanhold... most of these guys won't even make the team and are rostered.
Really don't see this as a plus move.  
larryflower37 : 1/5/2019 2:58 pm : link
Great defender but he brings nothing to the table offensively and is only a year younger than Lagares.
I think Lagares is a better option.
I like it  
giantsFC : 1/5/2019 2:58 pm : link
I don’t think it effects a free agent singing as they are cheap and won’t sign a heavy hitter anyway.

What this tells me is that nothing has changed at all and it’s the same half assed, half-in Mets who advertise as a top 5 market team but run it like a bottom to mid level team
Mets have no deprh  
spike : 1/5/2019 2:58 pm : link
So this is the right move regardless of Lagares status
RE: Really don't see this as a plus move.  
Shecky : 1/5/2019 3:01 pm : link
In comment 14248310 larryflower37 said:
Quote:
Great defender but he brings nothing to the table offensively and is only a year younger than Lagares.
I think Lagares is a better option.


Again, Broxtonis asulerstar, who can’t make contact. Not a defensive specialist. It Leegares. Upside is Grenderson, downside is... there is none... I HATE losing Hill, but this is the exact move every Mets fan has been bitching has been missing for the last x number of years.
He could be useful as a late inning defensive replacement or as a  
Ira : 1/5/2019 3:01 pm : link
pinch runner.
Lagares isn't a better option bc he can't stay healthy  
Eric on Li : 1/5/2019 3:04 pm : link
he may well be the better player but it's hard to be better from the DL. If he beats out Broxton and stays healthy, great. Based on his track record it's unlikely. It's a good luxury to have 2 excellent defensive CF'ers on the roster, and both have some offensive abilities.

I do think this may be a precursor for a Lagares trade. Possibly as part of a package to bring back a pitcher like Minor.
I wouldn’t count on. legares trade  
Shecky : 1/5/2019 3:09 pm : link
It damn would that salary relief be HUGE for a signing!!! See if the Giants will take him off our hands for some intl money lol
RE: I wouldn’t count on. legares trade  
Eric on Li : 1/5/2019 3:20 pm : link
In comment 14248323 Shecky said:
Quote:
It damn would that salary relief be HUGE for a signing!!! See if the Giants will take him off our hands for some intl money lol


I could see it either way - no issue keeping him and hoping in a contract year he actually stays healthy. We know in terms of upside he could probably still be a 3-4 fwar CF in a healthy year. Not many of those out there. On the flip side we know he won't stay healthy and with Broxton in the fold you could replace Lagares with a more reliable player like Jon Jay and save some money to spend elsewhere. Maybe even Marwin.

I'm still holding out hope for 1 or 2 more relievers and a SP like Gio.
this is a nothingburger  
JerrysKids : 1/5/2019 3:21 pm : link
......
.  
ZGiants98 : 1/5/2019 3:22 pm : link
adamgfisher
I really like this move for the Mets. Keon Broxton is just the type of depth they need. But Adam Hill (4th rounder from last year’s draft) is a good get for the Brewers. 92-95 with a swing and miss slider. Also note that Broxton is out of options.
RE: .  
Shecky : 1/5/2019 3:27 pm : link
In comment 14248332 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
adamgfisher
I really like this move for the Mets. Keon Broxton is just the type of depth they need. But Adam Hill (4th rounder from last year’s draft) is a good get for the Brewers. 92-95 with a swing and miss slider. Also note that Broxton is out of options.


Adam is a very, very smart man...

Eric - Santiago signing today too will help the pen imo. And regardless if Legares is moved or not, no one is handing Broxton the starting job.
The more I look at it the more I like this move  
Eric on Li : 1/5/2019 3:43 pm : link
below are career wrc+ for other CF's we've discussed (and best single season):

Broxton - 93 (111)
Margot - 85 (90)
JBJ - 92 (123)
Inciarte - 94 (100)
Buxton - 76 (90)
Mallex - 102 (117)

Broxton is probably the worst option of that list despite the similar numbers, but he was also almost definitely the cheapest to acquire - probably by a good margin. Pre-arb salary and only costs a bunch of minor league relievers, this is a good roll of the dice.
RE: RE: I wouldn’t count on. legares trade  
Earl the goat : 1/5/2019 3:43 pm : link
In comment 14248330 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
In comment 14248323 Shecky said:


Quote:


It damn would that salary relief be HUGE for a signing!!! See if the Giants will take him off our hands for some intl money lol



I could see it either way - no issue keeping him and hoping in a contract year he actually stays healthy. We know in terms of upside he could probably still be a 3-4 fwar CF in a healthy year. Not many of those out there. On the flip side we know he won't stay healthy and with Broxton in the fold you could replace Lagares with a more reliable player like Jon Jay and save some money to spend elsewhere. Maybe even Marwin.

I'm still holding out hope for 1 or 2 more relievers and a SP like Gio.



Would love Gio as the 4/5 lefty starter with Matz
What is Gios asking price.
I worry about Vargas as the 5th starter. Hope Brodie can dump him
Signing Gio would give the Mets top rotation in baseball
most of writers / sites seemed to predict 2 years 24m for Gio  
Eric on Li : 1/5/2019 3:46 pm : link
which seems like a great value for a guy who has been steady as it gets. Even his slightly down year last year was worth 2 fwar and we know he has great career #'s in Citi field.
Heading in I would labeled our holes/order of importance as:  
ZGiants98 : 1/5/2019 3:57 pm : link
1.) Bat that can hit added somewhere
2.) Closer
3.) Catcher who can hit
4.) SU reliever/can also close
5.) Starting caliber OF while Cespedes is out
6.) More late inning bullpen help
7.) LOOGY
8.) Backend SP pushing Vargas to pen
9.) Bench help/OF depth

So far Brody has checked off 1, 2, 3, 4, and 9. Can he fill every hole?
few more points on Broxton - his 2018 was really odd  
Eric on Li : 1/5/2019 4:02 pm : link
he only hit .179 and his babip of .217 was over 100 points lower than his career average (crazy low for a fast guy). His strikeouts came down but so did his hard hit % and exit velocities according to statcast. Despite the negatives he still posted an 84 wrc, but it's also a small sample size bc he didn't play as much as the 2 years prior (Cain). He's got some upside if he can make a little more contact and even his baseline is a good insurance policy for Lagares, though the inconsistency making contact is not ideal for a part time bench guy. Still seems like there's more upside than someone like Billy Hamilton though.
Not comparing him to Cain....But  
ZGiants98 : 1/5/2019 4:04 pm : link
First 700 career ABs:

Player A: 313 OBP, 700 OPS, 12 HR, 31 SB
Player B: 313 OBP, 730 OPS, 33 HR, 50 SB

A is Cain.
B is Broxton.
I wouldn't pay much attention to what  
ZGiants98 : 1/5/2019 4:07 pm : link
Broxton did last year offensively. 83 abats is literally nothing. He got boxed out when they acquired Yelich and Cain and pretty much rode the bench all year. The 2016-2017 sample is likely a better indicator of who he is.
He had over 300 ABs  
Metnut : 1/5/2019 5:28 pm : link
in AAA last year and couldn’t put up a 100 wRC. He turns 29 in May.

He’s ok and needed depth but I prefer a player like Pollock who can actually hit MLB pitching. Hopefully we add another OF.
Some of the beats are saying they are done in OF  
Eric on Li : 1/5/2019 5:54 pm : link
if they aren't trading Lagares I don't think it's unfair to say they're in pretty decent shape while also giving themselves some flexibility in the scenario that Cespedes does actually come back.

Watching Broxton highlights he reminds me of Mike Cameron. He really covers ground in CF.
Broxton robs Seager - ( New Window )
I won't be surprised one bit  
debo_GIANTS : 1/5/2019 6:07 pm : link
if this was our last acquisition in the outfield.

He is out of options and probably won't make it through waivers.

Fun guy to watch in the field but he is an automatic out.
We still need a big bat in the OF.
they bet a lot on Cano being the "big bat"  
Eric on Li : 1/5/2019 6:19 pm : link
im not saying it was a good bet, just that it seems like the plan is to count on Cano to be the key 100 rbi guy in the middle of the lineup for at least 1 or 2 years. Once he got on the field last year he did hit (136 rc+) as much as Machado (141) and Harper (135) - they basically viewed him as a dollar store version of adding a high level hitter relative to the price tag on the other 2. I think it's a short sighted decision but they may end up being right.

At this point I have more issues with the depth of the pitching staff than the lineup all things considered.

Right now, the thing I most want the Mets to do is  
Ira : 1/5/2019 8:50 pm : link
extend deGrom and Wheeler. With that staff and an improved pen, they don't need the Yankees lineup.
MLBTR/Rosenthal saying the 60 million Grandal deal was  
ZGiants98 : 1/5/2019 8:55 pm : link
"essentially correct"



MLBTR - he report that free-agent catcher Yasmani Grandal rejected a four-year, $60MM proposal from the Mets earlier this winter is “essentially accurate,” Rosenthal writes. While the Mets didn’t submit a formal offer to Grandal, the two sides did discuss a deal in the $55MM to $60MM neighborhood, per Rosenthal, who adds the 30-year-old was aiming for a contract worth closer to $65MM. The Mets balked at Grandal’s request, though, and then signed the No. 2 catcher available, Wilson Ramos. There’s now “doubt” Grandal’s next contract will approach what the Mets were willing to give him, Rosenthal relays.
More from Rosenthal on the Mets, who – in need of starting depth – are considering left-hander Derek Holland and righty Josh Tomlin in free agency. Holland easily had the stronger year of the two in 2018, which figures to make him the more difficult hurler to sign. He should be able to net a major league contract this winter, whereas the Mets are hoping to land someone on a non-guaranteed pact, Rosenthal reports. With that in mind, the 34-year-old Tomlin may be a more realistic option, as he endured a miserable 2018 with the Indians. However, the 34-year-old was successful at times from 2014-17 under ex-Tribe pitching coach and current Mets manager Mickey Callaway.
The beats have been wrong about literally everything  
ZGiants98 : 1/5/2019 8:56 pm : link
this offseason and haven't seen a single thing coming outside of the Cano deal and Realmuto stuff (Shecky already confirmed BVW was purposely leaking stuff in both cases likely for bargaining purposes)
Herrera on a 1 year deal to re-establish his value would be very smart  
Eric on Li : 1/5/2019 8:58 pm : link
believe he worked with Eiland in KC. Would be a nice depth addition. Could take it slow with him in ST too.
Jealous the Yanks signed Britten  
ZGiants98 : 1/5/2019 8:58 pm : link
I see him bouncing back this year. That would been a sweet move for the Mets.
I still think the Mets have a few more moves in them...  
ZGiants98 : 1/5/2019 9:01 pm : link
Seems like a lot of the guys they were in on earlier are asking for the moon still (Pollock wants 6 years??). There is still a ton of quality relievers available.

As we get closer to February prices should drop a bit.
RE: The beats have been wrong about literally everything  
Eric on Li : 1/5/2019 9:01 pm : link
In comment 14248836 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
this offseason and haven't seen a single thing coming outside of the Cano deal and Realmuto stuff (Shecky already confirmed BVW was purposely leaking stuff in both cases likely for bargaining purposes)


Is your point that you think they are going to add another OF? They are at $150m right now counting Wright & Cespedes fully, so I agree they should have it in their budget to spend another $10-20m just to get back to what they spent last year, though I think it's better served on the pitching staff at this point.
RE: I still think the Mets have a few more moves in them...  
Eric on Li : 1/5/2019 9:05 pm : link
In comment 14248849 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
Seems like a lot of the guys they were in on earlier are asking for the moon still (Pollock wants 6 years??). There is still a ton of quality relievers available.

As we get closer to February prices should drop a bit.


So we agree, there are no excuses for ownership to not spend another $10-20m in salary towards this team next year?
RE: RE: I still think the Mets have a few more moves in them...  
ZGiants98 : 1/5/2019 9:07 pm : link
In comment 14248858 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
In comment 14248849 ZGiants98 said:


Quote:


Seems like a lot of the guys they were in on earlier are asking for the moon still (Pollock wants 6 years??). There is still a ton of quality relievers available.

As we get closer to February prices should drop a bit.



So we agree, there are no excuses for ownership to not spend another $10-20m in salary towards this team next year?


I dont know about "no excuses". I certainly dont want them to force bad deals and I do think a lot of the heavy leg work is done. But yes. I'd like to see them add another 10-15 mil filling out the pen, etc. for sure.
RE: RE: The beats have been wrong about literally everything  
ZGiants98 : 1/5/2019 9:09 pm : link
In comment 14248850 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
In comment 14248836 ZGiants98 said:


Quote:


this offseason and haven't seen a single thing coming outside of the Cano deal and Realmuto stuff (Shecky already confirmed BVW was purposely leaking stuff in both cases likely for bargaining purposes)



Is your point that you think they are going to add another OF? They are at $150m right now counting Wright & Cespedes fully, so I agree they should have it in their budget to spend another $10-20m just to get back to what they spent last year, though I think it's better served on the pitching staff at this point.


No that wasn't my point. My point was the beats haven't seen anything coming and have been continually wrong. So maybe BVW is still talking to outfielders or maybe he's not. My point was I wouldnt trust anything the beats say one way or another. Also I think we were in the 150-160 range last year to start, not 170.
I dont hate Vargas like most people here do.  
ZGiants98 : 1/5/2019 9:11 pm : link
After a very weird and inconsistent 4-5 games to the season dealing with injuries and inconsistent playing time he pitched to a 4.30 ERA/4.40 FIP the rest of the season which is pretty much exactly what we signed him to do.

I'd almost rather sign another upper tier reliever freeing up Lugo to swing back into the rotation if Vargas falters or there are any injuries. I see the logic for a "Gio" too though. I just dont think these are huge needs, more luxuries.
yea a lot of guys out there so presumably there will be fmv deals  
Eric on Li : 1/5/2019 9:12 pm : link
I'd still be curious about Ottovino and Gio G, and if you can get either on a 2 year deal I think you have to consider it. But beyond them I think there are a lot of guys who will likely end up on 1 year deals. Herrera, Cody Allen, Brach, Perez, Madson, Wilson, Warren. If they trade Plawecki a 1 year deal for Maldonado as backup probably wouldn't cost much more than cutting TDA.
RE: RE: RE: The beats have been wrong about literally everything  
Eric on Li : 1/5/2019 9:17 pm : link
In comment 14248865 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:

No that wasn't my point. My point was the beats haven't seen anything coming and have been continually wrong. So maybe BVW is still talking to outfielders or maybe he's not. My point was I wouldnt trust anything the beats say one way or another. Also I think we were in the 150-160 range last year to start, not 170.


The $10-20m included insurance money. I think they were $155m last year. So the minimum they should have is $5m and they've said they are going to reinvest Wright's money (~11m?) at least. Even if Cespedes just misses half the year I think they'd get at least another $5-10m back too.
Id love to swap Plawecki and a prospect  
ZGiants98 : 1/5/2019 9:19 pm : link
for Minor. That fills two needs. Minor is your first lefty out of the pen and he also adds backend SP depth if needed.

From there if you can get M Gone for 10 AAV/3-4 years I'd pounce on that and the lineup/bench is essentially set.

Payroll is now 160-ish million. Last move would be one more reliever on hopefully steal. Allen for 5-6 AAV?

Offseason done and Im ready to rock.
I also dont mind the Ramos/TDA tandem  
ZGiants98 : 1/5/2019 9:22 pm : link
Less playing time for TDA hopefully keeps him fresher and less likely to get injured. Even bigger reason is we have Nido on the 40 and he's a good defender. Worst case scenario, TDA gets injured again and you call up a defensive specialist in Nido anyway to be the backup.
RE: I also dont mind the Ramos/TDA tandem  
Eric on Li : 1/5/2019 9:43 pm : link
In comment 14248902 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
Less playing time for TDA hopefully keeps him fresher and less likely to get injured. Even bigger reason is we have Nido on the 40 and he's a good defender. Worst case scenario, TDA gets injured again and you call up a defensive specialist in Nido anyway to be the backup.


TDA won't even be 12 months from TJS in April. If you trade Plawecki and he isn't ready to go who is the backup catcher? Nido and Blanco combined for -1.2 fwar last year.
Give TDA extended spring traininf  
spike : 1/5/2019 9:48 pm : link
Don’t rush him back. Let Plawecki be the backup.


Nido is trade bait.
RE: Give TDA extended spring traininf  
Eric on Li : 1/5/2019 9:49 pm : link
In comment 14248982 spike said:
Quote:
Don’t rush him back. Let Plawecki be the backup.


Nido is trade bait.


nobody is trading anything for Nido.
RE: RE: I also dont mind the Ramos/TDA tandem  
ZGiants98 : 1/5/2019 9:58 pm : link
In comment 14248965 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
In comment 14248902 ZGiants98 said:


Quote:


Less playing time for TDA hopefully keeps him fresher and less likely to get injured. Even bigger reason is we have Nido on the 40 and he's a good defender. Worst case scenario, TDA gets injured again and you call up a defensive specialist in Nido anyway to be the backup.



TDA won't even be 12 months from TJS in April. If you trade Plawecki and he isn't ready to go who is the backup catcher? Nido and Blanco combined for -1.2 fwar last year.


I know TJ Rivera had a massive setback last year but typical recovery time from Tommy John for position players is 6-8 months. Everything Ive heard is TDA is expected to be ready for the spring and BVW is fielding offers on Plawecki.
TdA is not expected  
Shecky : 1/5/2019 11:07 pm : link
To go north with the big club to open the season
Interesting..  
ZGiants98 : 1/6/2019 2:16 am : link
Thx. So is Plawecki available or not? What’s the plan? Nido until TDA is ready?
if they trade Plawecki they need to add another catcher  
Eric on Li : 1/6/2019 10:09 am : link
which is why those rumors are somewhat surprising. But if he can bring back something decent (like Minor) it might be worth doing since you can always sign a Maldonado or even Mesoraco for a year as a backup.

I find it odd we haven't heard any rumors around Dom Smith. They are talking about Alonso possibly breaking ST with the big club, McNeil playing everywhere like Zobrist, but no mention of Dom being anywhere in their plans or in any trade rumors. The Rangers don't appear to have much in their system at 1b so maybe he ends up a fit for 1 of their relievers.
My plan  
pjcas18 : 1/6/2019 10:36 am : link
all along for the off-season was:

1. Improve the BP (check, not finished by i'll check this box and it's not how I would have done it - but the Mets may have the best 1/2 combo at the back of the bullpen in baseball)

2. Improve the rotation (need some work here - don't give me budget numbers, I'd sign one of the better available pitchers)

3. Improve the defense (I think by adding Cano and for now Broxton and maybe getting Lagares back this is semi-checked - the combo of Lagares/Broxton in CF with Nimmo and Conforto at the corners should help the OF and McNeil (hopefully more than Frazier), Rosario, and Cano should help the IF - not sure who is playing IB? Dom? he was supposed to be a plus defender - any day now we should get the pictures of Smith being in the best shape of his life like we used to get with Flores every year)

I said all along the Mets shouldn't try and build a murderer's row, they should accentuate their strength (starting pitching) and take advantage of the market (relief pitching) and improve the D - the model the SF Giants 3 WS in 5 years teams used.

I think they can do that, although they're probably in a better division than SF was when they won those three titles.

Now..not to contradict myself, but the Mets should absolutely be in on both Harper and Machado as I've said repeatedly, but sadly we all realize that's not likely so need to have alternative plans to build a contender.

basically had the same hope  
Eric on Li : 1/6/2019 10:46 am : link
they added 2 great pieces in the BP, I just hope they don't get penny wise and pound foolish. The Yankees have built a monster pen the last few years to great effect and they continue to do it - supposedly still in on Ottavino even after signing Britton (on top of Betances/Chapman). Keep adding. Callaway and Eiland have ties to Herrera and Allen, for 1 year why not?

Also happy to add the combo of Lagares/Broxton in CF and even Ramos behind the plate. 2 good upgrades up the middle.
Herrera would be a DREAM addition  
Shecky : 1/6/2019 11:20 am : link
But have to assume he gets what he holds out for, and it isn’t money but opportunity (ie Red Sox etc)
RE: Herrera would be a DREAM addition  
allstarjim : 1/8/2019 1:37 pm : link
In comment 14249584 Shecky said:
Quote:
But have to assume he gets what he holds out for, and it isn’t money but opportunity (ie Red Sox etc)


Herrera to White Sox. So scratch him off the list.
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