So what was I supposed to see there. That the OSU line adjusted very well to the overload and blitz on the offenses left side. And the fact that the line gave him all day long to hit a SHALLOW crossing route to a guy that was open by 5 yards...
Ok he saw the overload, walked to the line and made sure they knew who the mike was...
WOW, I'm impressed.
sarcasm off
Exactly.
Haskins is a fraud.
I beginning to think your issue with Haskins is deeper than his game.
So what was I supposed to see there. That the OSU line adjusted very well to the overload and blitz on the offenses left side. And the fact that the line gave him all day long to hit a SHALLOW crossing route to a guy that was open by 5 yards...
Ok he saw the overload, walked to the line and made sure they knew who the mike was...
WOW, I'm impressed.
sarcasm off
The point is most college QBs don’t get that responsibility. You seem to not want to like Haskins, instead of keeping an open mind. You’ve made yours up, and anyone who thinks other wise doesn’t know what they’re talking about.
I've watched plenty of Haskins. He is not impressive. Not a 1st round prospect.
Gettleman is an elite scout, and if you think he will be fooled by Haskins, you are out of your mind.
Gettleman isn't an idiot. He is not drafting Haskins.
Can we ban the dupe
For stating a fact?
Haskins is an awful QB.
Gettleman isn't drafting him.
You are either naive or completely retarded if u think otherwise.
When I watch his game there are some things that concern me, bu there are concerns about almost every guy.
My point about Haskins is that he has not played long enough, and he has played with surrounding talent that is so superior to the opponent, that I think it's almost impossible to make a meaningful evaluation.
In the past prospect like this have a higher than normal bust rate. I don't like taking that kind of a chance at #6. At #38, yes, not #6.
When I watch his game there are some things that concern me, bu there are concerns about almost every guy.
My point about Haskins is that he has not played long enough, and he has played with surrounding talent that is so superior to the opponent, that I think it's almost impossible to make a meaningful evaluation.
In the past prospect like this have a higher than normal bust rate. I don't like taking that kind of a chance at #6. At #38, yes, not #6.
I wouldn't even take him at #38.
He's Byron Leftwich 2.0
Just a really really bad QB
Watch his tape against Michigan State, Purdue, Penn State, Nebraska. He is painful to watch. Everything he does is slow.
Kyle Lauletta fits Pat Shurmur/Dave Gettleman more than Haskins ever will.
When I watch his game there are some things that concern me, bu there are concerns about almost every guy.
My point about Haskins is that he has not played long enough, and he has played with surrounding talent that is so superior to the opponent, that I think it's almost impossible to make a meaningful evaluation.
In the past prospect like this have a higher than normal bust rate. I don't like taking that kind of a chance at #6. At #38, yes, not #6.
All the 2020 QBs you want have played with better talent then nearly every team they play. How is that a knock? Why are they more certain of prospects?
I dismiss it because you state for a FACT that he is worth the #6 pick. Which is absolutely contrary to what almost every REAL expert out there is saying. And they have the benefit of all 14 games, talking to people around them, and in some cases probably talking to Haskins himself. So yeah, I tend to dismiss you're non-expert opinion as fact.
I’m calling BS here. Which “real expert” has said Haskins isn’t worth a top 6 pick? You stated this on another thread and your only point of reference was McShay who gave him the same grade he gave Mayfield last year and a higher one than he gave anyone in 2017. Not to mention, right there with Goff and Wentz.
They see a guy standing in clean pockets with all day to throw, throwing to wide open receivers because the secondary is forced to back off due to the time in the pocket, and pile up easy manufactured stats, and scream "Look at his production!"
Zero conceptual understanding of what makes a good NFL QB.
When I watch his game there are some things that concern me, bu there are concerns about almost every guy.
My point about Haskins is that he has not played long enough, and he has played with surrounding talent that is so superior to the opponent, that I think it's almost impossible to make a meaningful evaluation.
In the past prospect like this have a higher than normal bust rate. I don't like taking that kind of a chance at #6. At #38, yes, not #6.
Again, this is untrue. 3 QBs since the 70’s have made 15 or fewer starts and been first round picks. One bust (Sanchez), one hit (Cam Newton) and one jury is still out (Trubisky)
So what was I supposed to see there. That the OSU line adjusted very well to the overload and blitz on the offenses left side. And the fact that the line gave him all day long to hit a SHALLOW crossing route to a guy that was open by 5 yards...
Ok he saw the overload, walked to the line and made sure they knew who the mike was...
WOW, I'm impressed.
sarcasm off
Exactly.
Haskins is a fraud.
I beginning to think your issue with Haskins is deeper than his game.
It's exactly his game.
Haskins is a horrible QB
See link Link - ( New Window )
I watched it, what are your issues?
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: A good example of Haskins and his checks Â
So what was I supposed to see there. That the OSU line adjusted very well to the overload and blitz on the offenses left side. And the fact that the line gave him all day long to hit a SHALLOW crossing route to a guy that was open by 5 yards...
Ok he saw the overload, walked to the line and made sure they knew who the mike was...
WOW, I'm impressed.
sarcasm off
Exactly.
Haskins is a fraud.
I beginning to think your issue with Haskins is deeper than his game.
It's exactly his game.
Haskins is a horrible QB
See link Link - ( New Window )
I watched it, what are your issues?
You sure you want to open up that can of worms? We could be here all night listening to his issues.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: A good example of Haskins and his checks Â
So what was I supposed to see there. That the OSU line adjusted very well to the overload and blitz on the offenses left side. And the fact that the line gave him all day long to hit a SHALLOW crossing route to a guy that was open by 5 yards...
Ok he saw the overload, walked to the line and made sure they knew who the mike was...
WOW, I'm impressed.
sarcasm off
Exactly.
Haskins is a fraud.
I beginning to think your issue with Haskins is deeper than his game.
It's exactly his game.
Haskins is a horrible QB
See link Link - ( New Window )
I watched it, what are your issues?
He is really really bad in everything u look for in an NFL franchise QB?
Slow in everything he does, inaccurate, a sloth with no footwork, horrendous deep ball, throws a duck at the slightest hint of pressure, never makes an NFL throw, is totally useless under pressure, gets easy manufactured Completions in Urban Meyer's system.
Urban Meyer QBs don't succeed in the NFL for a reason. They are system QBs. Their gaudy stats in college are fraudulent and deceiving to casual football fans who don't know any better (like many in this thread). Alex Smith is the #1 Urban Meyer QB and he only did well in Andy Reid's West Coast college offense, and was mediocre at his peak.
This guy Haskins is worse than Alex Smith. Far worse.
So what was I supposed to see there. That the OSU line adjusted very well to the overload and blitz on the offenses left side. And the fact that the line gave him all day long to hit a SHALLOW crossing route to a guy that was open by 5 yards...
Ok he saw the overload, walked to the line and made sure they knew who the mike was...
WOW, I'm impressed.
sarcasm off
Exactly.
Haskins is a fraud.
I beginning to think your issue with Haskins is deeper than his game.
It's exactly his game.
Haskins is a horrible QB
See link Link - ( New Window )
I watched it, what are your issues?
He is really really bad in everything u look for in an NFL franchise QB?
Slow in everything he does, inaccurate, a sloth with no footwork, horrendous deep ball, throws a duck at the slightest hint of pressure, never makes an NFL throw, is totally useless under pressure, gets easy manufactured Completions in Urban Meyer's system.
Urban Meyer QBs don't succeed in the NFL for a reason. They are system QBs. Their gaudy stats in college are fraudulent and deceiving to casual football fans who don't know any better (like many in this thread). Alex Smith is the #1 Urban Meyer QB and he only did well in Andy Reid's West Coast college offense, and was mediocre at his peak.
This guy Haskins is worse than Alex Smith. Far worse.
Slow in everything he does, inaccurate, a sloth with no footwork, horrendous deep ball, throws a duck at the slightest hint of pressure; sounds like you're describing Eli. Plus you said he's inaccurate, I didn't realize a 70% season completion percentage was inaccurate (67% in that Purdue game you linked).
Do not waste a pick on a QB in this draft in any round. The time to do so was last spring and perhaps in 2020. OL, Edge, LB’s, FS.
Explain what you dislike about his game.
Urban Meyers isn’t known to produce pro ready QB’s. Alex Smith’s career was very underwhelming. The class itself sucks. I don’t want to take a player and feel like he was forced. It’s a strong defensive draft. We have issues at just about every position on defense. I’m fairly confident when all the testing, pro days, in private interviews/workouts are completed, the data will suggest that Haskins is not worthy of #6.
So basically nothing about Haskins himself or his play? You don’t like him bc of his coach and this QB class and how it will make you feel? That pretty much sums up most of the Haskins naysayers. Fact is, kid is the real deal.
RE: RE: Lol... did Haskins kick your dog or something? Â
So what was I supposed to see there. That the OSU line adjusted very well to the overload and blitz on the offenses left side. And the fact that the line gave him all day long to hit a SHALLOW crossing route to a guy that was open by 5 yards...
Ok he saw the overload, walked to the line and made sure they knew who the mike was...
WOW, I'm impressed.
sarcasm off
Exactly.
Haskins is a fraud.
I beginning to think your issue with Haskins is deeper than his game.
It's exactly his game.
Haskins is a horrible QB
See link Link - ( New Window )
I watched it, what are your issues?
He is really really bad in everything u look for in an NFL franchise QB?
Slow in everything he does, inaccurate, a sloth with no footwork, horrendous deep ball, throws a duck at the slightest hint of pressure, never makes an NFL throw, is totally useless under pressure, gets easy manufactured Completions in Urban Meyer's system.
Urban Meyer QBs don't succeed in the NFL for a reason. They are system QBs. Their gaudy stats in college are fraudulent and deceiving to casual football fans who don't know any better (like many in this thread). Alex Smith is the #1 Urban Meyer QB and he only did well in Andy Reid's West Coast college offense, and was mediocre at his peak.
This guy Haskins is worse than Alex Smith. Far worse.
Slow in everything he does, inaccurate, a sloth with no footwork, horrendous deep ball, throws a duck at the slightest hint of pressure; sounds like you're describing Eli. Plus you said he's inaccurate, I didn't realize a 70% season completion percentage was inaccurate (67% in that Purdue game you linked).
Eli processes quickly and makes quick decisions. Haskins literally the opposite. Slow in everything.
Manufactured completions (Urban Meyer's system) doesn't mean he's accurate.
Do not waste a pick on a QB in this draft in any round. The time to do so was last spring and perhaps in 2020. OL, Edge, LB’s, FS.
Explain what you dislike about his game.
Urban Meyers isn’t known to produce pro ready QB’s. Alex Smith’s career was very underwhelming. The class itself sucks. I don’t want to take a player and feel like he was forced. It’s a strong defensive draft. We have issues at just about every position on defense. I’m fairly confident when all the testing, pro days, in private interviews/workouts are completed, the data will suggest that Haskins is not worthy of #6.
So basically nothing about Haskins himself or his play? You don’t like him bc of his coach and this QB class and how it will make you feel? That pretty much sums up most of the Haskins naysayers. Fact is, kid is the real deal.
You're clearly a casual football fan who doesn't understand the game. Haskins is far from the real deal. The guy blows.
I wouldn't take Haskins with the #38 pick, let alone the #6 pick.
Gettleman won't take him...and you will see on draft day. Gettleman is an elite scout. He doesn't get fooled by complete frauds like garbage ass Haskins.
So what was I supposed to see there. That the OSU line adjusted very well to the overload and blitz on the offenses left side. And the fact that the line gave him all day long to hit a SHALLOW crossing route to a guy that was open by 5 yards...
Ok he saw the overload, walked to the line and made sure they knew who the mike was...
WOW, I'm impressed.
sarcasm off
Exactly.
Haskins is a fraud.
I beginning to think your issue with Haskins is deeper than his game.
It's exactly his game.
Haskins is a horrible QB
See link Link - ( New Window )
I watched it, what are your issues?
He is really really bad in everything u look for in an NFL franchise QB?
Slow in everything he does, inaccurate, a sloth with no footwork, horrendous deep ball, throws a duck at the slightest hint of pressure, never makes an NFL throw, is totally useless under pressure, gets easy manufactured Completions in Urban Meyer's system.
Urban Meyer QBs don't succeed in the NFL for a reason. They are system QBs. Their gaudy stats in college are fraudulent and deceiving to casual football fans who don't know any better (like many in this thread). Alex Smith is the #1 Urban Meyer QB and he only did well in Andy Reid's West Coast college offense, and was mediocre at his peak.
This guy Haskins is worse than Alex Smith. Far worse.
Slow in everything he does, inaccurate, a sloth with no footwork, horrendous deep ball, throws a duck at the slightest hint of pressure; sounds like you're describing Eli. Plus you said he's inaccurate, I didn't realize a 70% season completion percentage was inaccurate (67% in that Purdue game you linked).
Eli processes quickly and makes quick decisions. Haskins literally the opposite. Slow in everything.
Manufactured completions (Urban Meyer's system) doesn't mean he's accurate.
Not quick enogh to avoid being sacked 87 times the pst 2 years.
Do not waste a pick on a QB in this draft in any round. The time to do so was last spring and perhaps in 2020. OL, Edge, LB’s, FS.
Explain what you dislike about his game.
Urban Meyers isn’t known to produce pro ready QB’s. Alex Smith’s career was very underwhelming. The class itself sucks. I don’t want to take a player and feel like he was forced. It’s a strong defensive draft. We have issues at just about every position on defense. I’m fairly confident when all the testing, pro days, in private interviews/workouts are completed, the data will suggest that Haskins is not worthy of #6.
So basically nothing about Haskins himself or his play? You don’t like him bc of his coach and this QB class and how it will make you feel? That pretty much sums up most of the Haskins naysayers. Fact is, kid is the real deal.
You're clearly a casual football fan who doesn't understand the game. Haskins is far from the real deal. The guy blows.
I wouldn't take Haskins with the #38 pick, let alone the #6 pick.
Gettleman won't take him...and you will see on draft day. Gettleman is an elite scout. He doesn't get fooled by complete frauds like garbage ass Haskins.
Do not waste a pick on a QB in this draft in any round. The time to do so was last spring and perhaps in 2020. OL, Edge, LB’s, FS.
Explain what you dislike about his game.
Urban Meyers isn’t known to produce pro ready QB’s. Alex Smith’s career was very underwhelming. The class itself sucks. I don’t want to take a player and feel like he was forced. It’s a strong defensive draft. We have issues at just about every position on defense. I’m fairly confident when all the testing, pro days, in private interviews/workouts are completed, the data will suggest that Haskins is not worthy of #6.
So basically nothing about Haskins himself or his play? You don’t like him bc of his coach and this QB class and how it will make you feel? That pretty much sums up most of the Haskins naysayers. Fact is, kid is the real deal.
You're clearly a casual football fan who doesn't understand the game. Haskins is far from the real deal. The guy blows.
I wouldn't take Haskins with the #38 pick, let alone the #6 pick.
Gettleman won't take him...and you will see on draft day. Gettleman is an elite scout. He doesn't get fooled by complete frauds like garbage ass Haskins.
Do not waste a pick on a QB in this draft in any round. The time to do so was last spring and perhaps in 2020. OL, Edge, LB’s, FS.
Explain what you dislike about his game.
Urban Meyers isn’t known to produce pro ready QB’s. Alex Smith’s career was very underwhelming. The class itself sucks. I don’t want to take a player and feel like he was forced. It’s a strong defensive draft. We have issues at just about every position on defense. I’m fairly confident when all the testing, pro days, in private interviews/workouts are completed, the data will suggest that Haskins is not worthy of #6.
So basically nothing about Haskins himself or his play? You don’t like him bc of his coach and this QB class and how it will make you feel? That pretty much sums up most of the Haskins naysayers. Fact is, kid is the real deal.
You're clearly a casual football fan who doesn't understand the game. Haskins is far from the real deal. The guy blows.
I wouldn't take Haskins with the #38 pick, let alone the #6 pick.
Gettleman won't take him...and you will see on draft day. Gettleman is an elite scout. He doesn't get fooled by complete frauds like garbage ass Haskins.
Good thing you're not the GM.
Don't worry....the real GM won't be drafting Haskins.
Do not waste a pick on a QB in this draft in any round. The time to do so was last spring and perhaps in 2020. OL, Edge, LB’s, FS.
Explain what you dislike about his game.
Urban Meyers isn’t known to produce pro ready QB’s. Alex Smith’s career was very underwhelming. The class itself sucks. I don’t want to take a player and feel like he was forced. It’s a strong defensive draft. We have issues at just about every position on defense. I’m fairly confident when all the testing, pro days, in private interviews/workouts are completed, the data will suggest that Haskins is not worthy of #6.
So basically nothing about Haskins himself or his play? You don’t like him bc of his coach and this QB class and how it will make you feel? That pretty much sums up most of the Haskins naysayers. Fact is, kid is the real deal.
You're clearly a casual football fan who doesn't understand the game. Haskins is far from the real deal. The guy blows.
I wouldn't take Haskins with the #38 pick, let alone the #6 pick.
Gettleman won't take him...and you will see on draft day. Gettleman is an elite scout. He doesn't get fooled by complete frauds like garbage ass Haskins.
I dismiss it because you state for a FACT that he is worth the #6 pick. Which is absolutely contrary to what almost every REAL expert out there is saying. And they have the benefit of all 14 games, talking to people around them, and in some cases probably talking to Haskins himself. So yeah, I tend to dismiss you're non-expert opinion as fact.
I’m calling BS here. Which “real expert” has said Haskins isn’t worth a top 6 pick? You stated this on another thread and your only point of reference was McShay who gave him the same grade he gave Mayfield last year and a higher one than he gave anyone in 2017. Not to mention, right there with Goff and Wentz.
Here is an article (granted its from Nov 3rd but it makes the same point I am making about experience)
[url]https://heavy.com/sports/2018/11/dwayne-haskins-is-the-ohio-st-qb-a-first-round-selection/[url]
Quote:
Rivals' MIKE FARRELL'S take
“This is a really weak quarterback class compared to last year, and I’m not sure Haskins would have been a first-rounder last April with Baker Mayfield, Sam Darnold, Josh Allen, Josh Rosen and Lamar Jackson. However, who else are you going to take in the first round, if not Haskins? With Herbert coming back and guys like Jones, Grier and Lock being second- or third-rounders, you know someone will make Haskins a first-rounder. I’m a little bit surprised at his development in college because I didn’t see him as a Heisman candidate, but he’s done a great job under the tutelage of Day. Will he be an NFL star? I don’t see it, but I’ve certainly been wrong before.”
Mike Farrell's view coincides with mine... The only reason Haskins will get pushed up into top 20 or higher is because there are no other choices... Experts are moving him up for that reason as well... Just because there isn't a better choice at QB doesn't make him a good pick especially as high as #6.
Do not waste a pick on a QB in this draft in any round. The time to do so was last spring and perhaps in 2020. OL, Edge, LB’s, FS.
Explain what you dislike about his game.
Urban Meyers isn’t known to produce pro ready QB’s. Alex Smith’s career was very underwhelming. The class itself sucks. I don’t want to take a player and feel like he was forced. It’s a strong defensive draft. We have issues at just about every position on defense. I’m fairly confident when all the testing, pro days, in private interviews/workouts are completed, the data will suggest that Haskins is not worthy of #6.
So basically nothing about Haskins himself or his play? You don’t like him bc of his coach and this QB class and how it will make you feel? That pretty much sums up most of the Haskins naysayers. Fact is, kid is the real deal.
You're clearly a casual football fan who doesn't understand the game. Haskins is far from the real deal. The guy blows.
I wouldn't take Haskins with the #38 pick, let alone the #6 pick.
Gettleman won't take him...and you will see on draft day. Gettleman is an elite scout. He doesn't get fooled by complete frauds like garbage ass Haskins.
Good thing you're not the GM.
Don't worry....the real GM won't be drafting Haskins.
Let me guess he called you and said as much right.
So says who? You?
Now you are the expert?
What do you have backing you up?
A bunch of mocks... As I said before mocks don't count, that is the GUESS as to what team will do in the draft. Its not a ranking.
When I watch his game there are some things that concern me, bu there are concerns about almost every guy.
My point about Haskins is that he has not played long enough, and he has played with surrounding talent that is so superior to the opponent, that I think it's almost impossible to make a meaningful evaluation.
In the past prospect like this have a higher than normal bust rate. I don't like taking that kind of a chance at #6. At #38, yes, not #6.
Again, this is untrue. 3 QBs since the 70’s have made 15 or fewer starts and been first round picks. One bust (Sanchez), one hit (Cam Newton) and one jury is still out (Trubisky)
Uh talk about cherry picking a stat...
Read and learn about how college games started relates to NFL success.
This is old wisdom that has not changed...
Here is an article from 2008 http://www.espn.com/nfl/news/story?id=3350135
Quote:
However, there is a more complex reason why games started is an important indicator. In general, NFL scouts do an excellent job of talent evaluation when they have enough information. The more film that exists of a player, the easier it is to find weaknesses. When scouts don't get sufficient information, they place too much weight on "measurables" and off-field workouts, and make mistakes like Couch, Leaf or Akili Smith.
Sometimes, when a player starts a lot of games, scouts have enough film to figure out that he is truly a "system quarterback," and not an NFL prospect. That's why Kliff Kingsbury and Chris Leak were not drafted high despite strong college numbers. Because of the assumption that scouts can do their job with the right information, these projections apply only to quarterbacks chosen in the first two rounds.
When I watch his game there are some things that concern me, bu there are concerns about almost every guy.
My point about Haskins is that he has not played long enough, and he has played with surrounding talent that is so superior to the opponent, that I think it's almost impossible to make a meaningful evaluation.
In the past prospect like this have a higher than normal bust rate. I don't like taking that kind of a chance at #6. At #38, yes, not #6.
Again, this is untrue. 3 QBs since the 70’s have made 15 or fewer starts and been first round picks. One bust (Sanchez), one hit (Cam Newton) and one jury is still out (Trubisky)
Uh talk about cherry picking a stat...
Read and learn about how college games started relates to NFL success.
This is old wisdom that has not changed...
Here is an article from 2008
http://www.espn.com/nfl/news/story?id=3350135
Quote:
However, there is a more complex reason why games started is an important indicator. In general, NFL scouts do an excellent job of talent evaluation when they have enough information....
Uh, from your article
Quote:
Chad Henne (47 starts, 59.7 percent completion rate)
Henne is the type of player scouts never miss on -- a four-year starter from an elite college program. His 59.7 percent completion rate isn't bad, but it isn't that good either. Henne never displayed the consistency of an elite quarterback while at Michigan, but he did show an NFL arm.
Henne's college stats are quite similar to those of another big-time recruit from a big-time school who had an inconsistent career -- Carson Palmer. Palmer started 45 games and completed 59.1 percent of passes, but finished on a positive note by winning the Rose Bowl and Heisman Trophy and consequently went No. 1 overall. Henne didn't finish as strong, and isn't quite as good a prospect, but isn't as far off as some might think. After a nice performance at the Senior Bowl, he seems to have an outside shot at the first round, and would be a good pick there. He is a virtual lock to be at least an above-average professional.
LOL
RE: RE: RE: To be clear, I don't DISLIKE Haskins Â
Here is an actual peer reviewed study done which shares the underlying methodology used. Their conclusion:
Quote:
In sports statistics circles, much has been made about a projection system (Lewin, 2006) for quarterbacks which uses the number of games started in college and college completion percentage to predict future NFL success. In our analyses, these variables were only associated with an indicator of playing at least 48 NFL games, but they were not related to any of our other outcome measures. Generally, college and combine performance statistics provided no additional predictive ability beyond year drafted and draft position. Indeed, in most cases, including college/combine measurements degraded predictive performance, suggesting that the amount of statistical noise in these predictors overwhelms any predictive value they might have.
The reason people hone in on games played in college has nothing to do with predicting future success. It has to do with evaluators distrust in their ability to evaluate a player with limited data available to them. Hence, why conclusions drawn are subject to the law of small numbers.
It's very obvious that you and your dupe sxdxca come to the table with preconceived notions and then try and find data to back up those notions, especially when called out on it. You shared an article from 2008 that claims to have done a study without sharing the underlying methodology. In the real world, that gets thrown out immediately and when you went to backup your claim about the "real experts" all saying Haskins wasn't worthy of a high draft selection you shared an article from heavy.com and Chris Trappasso...
Guys like Greg Gabriel, Dan Orlovsky, Boomer, Dane Brugler, Todd McShay, Eric Galko, Jordan Reid, and many others think very highly of Haskins. Does that mean he'll be an all-pro and has no holes in his game? No, he's raw and has mechanical issues to work on. But he has sky high upside. It's not nearly as black and white as some here seem to feel strongly about. But hey, never let the facts get in the way of a good narrative!
When I watch his game there are some things that concern me, bu there are concerns about almost every guy.
My point about Haskins is that he has not played long enough, and he has played with surrounding talent that is so superior to the opponent, that I think it's almost impossible to make a meaningful evaluation.
In the past prospect like this have a higher than normal bust rate. I don't like taking that kind of a chance at #6. At #38, yes, not #6.
Again, this is untrue. 3 QBs since the 70’s have made 15 or fewer starts and been first round picks. One bust (Sanchez), one hit (Cam Newton) and one jury is still out (Trubisky)
Uh talk about cherry picking a stat...
Read and learn about how college games started relates to NFL success.
This is old wisdom that has not changed...
Here is an article from 2008
http://www.espn.com/nfl/news/story?id=3350135
Quote:
However, there is a more complex reason why games started is an important indicator. In general, NFL scouts do an excellent job of talent evaluation when they have enough information....
Uh, from your article
Quote:
Chad Henne (47 starts, 59.7 percent completion rate)
Henne is the type of player scouts never miss on -- a four-year starter from an elite college program. His 59.7 percent completion rate isn't bad, but it isn't that good either. Henne never displayed the consistency of an elite quarterback while at Michigan, but he did show an NFL arm.
Henne's college stats are quite similar to those of another big-time recruit from a big-time school who had an inconsistent career -- Carson Palmer. Palmer started 45 games and completed 59.1 percent of passes, but finished on a positive note by winning the Rose Bowl and Heisman Trophy and consequently went No. 1 overall. Henne didn't finish as strong, and isn't quite as good a prospect, but isn't as far off as some might think. After a nice performance at the Senior Bowl, he seems to have an outside shot at the first round, and would be a good pick there. He is a virtual lock to be at least an above-average professional.
LOL
Evaluating is still a crapshoot. What more games started allows the evaluators is more data points about the player to reduce the risk of failure. WIth more datapoints some players eliminate themselves, others don't. Nothing is surefire. I never said it was.
Neither is Jones, although I like him better.
Both would be, dare I say a 'Reach'.
Haskins to me has beast or bust written all over him,
would be very leery with that pick!
Quote:
In comment 14252957 .McL. said:
Quote:
In comment 14252859 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
. Haskins blitz - ( New Window )
So what was I supposed to see there. That the OSU line adjusted very well to the overload and blitz on the offenses left side. And the fact that the line gave him all day long to hit a SHALLOW crossing route to a guy that was open by 5 yards...
Ok he saw the overload, walked to the line and made sure they knew who the mike was...
WOW, I'm impressed.
sarcasm off
Exactly.
Haskins is a fraud.
I beginning to think your issue with Haskins is deeper than his game.
It's exactly his game.
Haskins is a horrible QB
See link
Link - ( New Window )
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In comment 14252979 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
In comment 14252957 .McL. said:
Quote:
In comment 14252859 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
. Haskins blitz - ( New Window )
So what was I supposed to see there. That the OSU line adjusted very well to the overload and blitz on the offenses left side. And the fact that the line gave him all day long to hit a SHALLOW crossing route to a guy that was open by 5 yards...
Ok he saw the overload, walked to the line and made sure they knew who the mike was...
WOW, I'm impressed.
sarcasm off
The point is most college QBs don’t get that responsibility. You seem to not want to like Haskins, instead of keeping an open mind. You’ve made yours up, and anyone who thinks other wise doesn’t know what they’re talking about.
I've watched plenty of Haskins. He is not impressive. Not a 1st round prospect.
Gettleman is an elite scout, and if you think he will be fooled by Haskins, you are out of your mind.
Gettleman isn't an idiot. He is not drafting Haskins.
Can we ban the dupe
For stating a fact?
Haskins is an awful QB.
Gettleman isn't drafting him.
You are either naive or completely retarded if u think otherwise.
Link - ( New Window )
My point about Haskins is that he has not played long enough, and he has played with surrounding talent that is so superior to the opponent, that I think it's almost impossible to make a meaningful evaluation.
In the past prospect like this have a higher than normal bust rate. I don't like taking that kind of a chance at #6. At #38, yes, not #6.
Everything he does is slow.
Byron Leftwich 2.0
Atrocious.
Link - ( New Window )
You have to be football retarded to think this guy is a good QB.
He is atrocious
Link - ( New Window )
My point about Haskins is that he has not played long enough, and he has played with surrounding talent that is so superior to the opponent, that I think it's almost impossible to make a meaningful evaluation.
In the past prospect like this have a higher than normal bust rate. I don't like taking that kind of a chance at #6. At #38, yes, not #6.
I wouldn't even take him at #38.
He's Byron Leftwich 2.0
Just a really really bad QB
Watch his tape against Michigan State, Purdue, Penn State, Nebraska. He is painful to watch. Everything he does is slow.
Kyle Lauletta fits Pat Shurmur/Dave Gettleman more than Haskins ever will.
My point about Haskins is that he has not played long enough, and he has played with surrounding talent that is so superior to the opponent, that I think it's almost impossible to make a meaningful evaluation.
In the past prospect like this have a higher than normal bust rate. I don't like taking that kind of a chance at #6. At #38, yes, not #6.
All the 2020 QBs you want have played with better talent then nearly every team they play. How is that a knock? Why are they more certain of prospects?
Quote:
And dismiss it anyway because I’m “not an expert”
Ok. Nobody here should discuss prospects then.
I dismiss it because you state for a FACT that he is worth the #6 pick. Which is absolutely contrary to what almost every REAL expert out there is saying. And they have the benefit of all 14 games, talking to people around them, and in some cases probably talking to Haskins himself. So yeah, I tend to dismiss you're non-expert opinion as fact.
I’m calling BS here. Which “real expert” has said Haskins isn’t worth a top 6 pick? You stated this on another thread and your only point of reference was McShay who gave him the same grade he gave Mayfield last year and a higher one than he gave anyone in 2017. Not to mention, right there with Goff and Wentz.
Quote:
.
You have to be football retarded to think this guy is a good QB.
He is atrocious
Link - ( New Window )
12/18
What are some of your previous handles?
Zero conceptual understanding of what makes a good NFL QB.
My point about Haskins is that he has not played long enough, and he has played with surrounding talent that is so superior to the opponent, that I think it's almost impossible to make a meaningful evaluation.
In the past prospect like this have a higher than normal bust rate. I don't like taking that kind of a chance at #6. At #38, yes, not #6.
Again, this is untrue. 3 QBs since the 70’s have made 15 or fewer starts and been first round picks. One bust (Sanchez), one hit (Cam Newton) and one jury is still out (Trubisky)
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In comment 14253066 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
.
You have to be football retarded to think this guy is a good QB.
He is atrocious
Link - ( New Window )
12/18
What are some of your previous handles?
Ad hominem attack
Haskins is really really bad, and Dave Gettleman knows it.
He will be there at 6, and the Giants will easily pass without thinking twice.
Bottom line.
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In comment 14252971 SaqBar999 said:
Quote:
In comment 14252957 .McL. said:
Quote:
In comment 14252859 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
. Haskins blitz - ( New Window )
So what was I supposed to see there. That the OSU line adjusted very well to the overload and blitz on the offenses left side. And the fact that the line gave him all day long to hit a SHALLOW crossing route to a guy that was open by 5 yards...
Ok he saw the overload, walked to the line and made sure they knew who the mike was...
WOW, I'm impressed.
sarcasm off
Exactly.
Haskins is a fraud.
I beginning to think your issue with Haskins is deeper than his game.
It's exactly his game.
Haskins is a horrible QB
See link Link - ( New Window )
I watched it, what are your issues?
Quote:
In comment 14253007 Dutch77 said:
Quote:
In comment 14252971 SaqBar999 said:
Quote:
In comment 14252957 .McL. said:
Quote:
In comment 14252859 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
. Haskins blitz - ( New Window )
So what was I supposed to see there. That the OSU line adjusted very well to the overload and blitz on the offenses left side. And the fact that the line gave him all day long to hit a SHALLOW crossing route to a guy that was open by 5 yards...
Ok he saw the overload, walked to the line and made sure they knew who the mike was...
WOW, I'm impressed.
sarcasm off
Exactly.
Haskins is a fraud.
I beginning to think your issue with Haskins is deeper than his game.
It's exactly his game.
Haskins is a horrible QB
See link Link - ( New Window )
I watched it, what are your issues?
You sure you want to open up that can of worms? We could be here all night listening to his issues.
Quote:
In comment 14253007 Dutch77 said:
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In comment 14252971 SaqBar999 said:
Quote:
In comment 14252957 .McL. said:
Quote:
In comment 14252859 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
. Haskins blitz - ( New Window )
So what was I supposed to see there. That the OSU line adjusted very well to the overload and blitz on the offenses left side. And the fact that the line gave him all day long to hit a SHALLOW crossing route to a guy that was open by 5 yards...
Ok he saw the overload, walked to the line and made sure they knew who the mike was...
WOW, I'm impressed.
sarcasm off
Exactly.
Haskins is a fraud.
I beginning to think your issue with Haskins is deeper than his game.
It's exactly his game.
Haskins is a horrible QB
See link Link - ( New Window )
I watched it, what are your issues?
He is really really bad in everything u look for in an NFL franchise QB?
Slow in everything he does, inaccurate, a sloth with no footwork, horrendous deep ball, throws a duck at the slightest hint of pressure, never makes an NFL throw, is totally useless under pressure, gets easy manufactured Completions in Urban Meyer's system.
Urban Meyer QBs don't succeed in the NFL for a reason. They are system QBs. Their gaudy stats in college are fraudulent and deceiving to casual football fans who don't know any better (like many in this thread). Alex Smith is the #1 Urban Meyer QB and he only did well in Andy Reid's West Coast college offense, and was mediocre at his peak.
This guy Haskins is worse than Alex Smith. Far worse.
Yea I think we’re done here. Back under the bridge for you.
The talk of Haskins-to-Giants is extremely annoying because
1) He sucks on the football field
2) It's never ever happening. I'll bet everything I own the Giants won't draft him.
Yea I think we’re done here. Back under the bridge for you.
He doesn't make NFL throws. All manufactured easy completions to wide open receivers.
Urban Meyer System QB, a poor man's Alex Smith. Nothing more.
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In comment 14253056 SaqBar999 said:
Quote:
In comment 14253007 Dutch77 said:
Quote:
In comment 14252971 SaqBar999 said:
Quote:
In comment 14252957 .McL. said:
Quote:
In comment 14252859 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
. Haskins blitz - ( New Window )
So what was I supposed to see there. That the OSU line adjusted very well to the overload and blitz on the offenses left side. And the fact that the line gave him all day long to hit a SHALLOW crossing route to a guy that was open by 5 yards...
Ok he saw the overload, walked to the line and made sure they knew who the mike was...
WOW, I'm impressed.
sarcasm off
Exactly.
Haskins is a fraud.
I beginning to think your issue with Haskins is deeper than his game.
It's exactly his game.
Haskins is a horrible QB
See link Link - ( New Window )
I watched it, what are your issues?
He is really really bad in everything u look for in an NFL franchise QB?
Slow in everything he does, inaccurate, a sloth with no footwork, horrendous deep ball, throws a duck at the slightest hint of pressure, never makes an NFL throw, is totally useless under pressure, gets easy manufactured Completions in Urban Meyer's system.
Urban Meyer QBs don't succeed in the NFL for a reason. They are system QBs. Their gaudy stats in college are fraudulent and deceiving to casual football fans who don't know any better (like many in this thread). Alex Smith is the #1 Urban Meyer QB and he only did well in Andy Reid's West Coast college offense, and was mediocre at his peak.
This guy Haskins is worse than Alex Smith. Far worse.
Slow in everything he does, inaccurate, a sloth with no footwork, horrendous deep ball, throws a duck at the slightest hint of pressure; sounds like you're describing Eli. Plus you said he's inaccurate, I didn't realize a 70% season completion percentage was inaccurate (67% in that Purdue game you linked).
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In comment 14252667 The_Boss said:
Quote:
Do not waste a pick on a QB in this draft in any round. The time to do so was last spring and perhaps in 2020. OL, Edge, LB’s, FS.
Explain what you dislike about his game.
Urban Meyers isn’t known to produce pro ready QB’s. Alex Smith’s career was very underwhelming. The class itself sucks. I don’t want to take a player and feel like he was forced. It’s a strong defensive draft. We have issues at just about every position on defense. I’m fairly confident when all the testing, pro days, in private interviews/workouts are completed, the data will suggest that Haskins is not worthy of #6.
So basically nothing about Haskins himself or his play? You don’t like him bc of his coach and this QB class and how it will make you feel? That pretty much sums up most of the Haskins naysayers. Fact is, kid is the real deal.
Quote:
Your issues with Haskins seem to be about far more than football.
The talk of Haskins-to-Giants is extremely annoying because
1) He sucks on the football field
2) It's never ever happening. I'll bet everything I own the Giants won't draft him.
If you know it’s not happening then why do you care? STFU and go away
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In comment 14253109 Dutch77 said:
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In comment 14253056 SaqBar999 said:
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In comment 14253007 Dutch77 said:
Quote:
In comment 14252971 SaqBar999 said:
Quote:
In comment 14252957 .McL. said:
Quote:
In comment 14252859 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
. Haskins blitz - ( New Window )
So what was I supposed to see there. That the OSU line adjusted very well to the overload and blitz on the offenses left side. And the fact that the line gave him all day long to hit a SHALLOW crossing route to a guy that was open by 5 yards...
Ok he saw the overload, walked to the line and made sure they knew who the mike was...
WOW, I'm impressed.
sarcasm off
Exactly.
Haskins is a fraud.
I beginning to think your issue with Haskins is deeper than his game.
It's exactly his game.
Haskins is a horrible QB
See link Link - ( New Window )
I watched it, what are your issues?
He is really really bad in everything u look for in an NFL franchise QB?
Slow in everything he does, inaccurate, a sloth with no footwork, horrendous deep ball, throws a duck at the slightest hint of pressure, never makes an NFL throw, is totally useless under pressure, gets easy manufactured Completions in Urban Meyer's system.
Urban Meyer QBs don't succeed in the NFL for a reason. They are system QBs. Their gaudy stats in college are fraudulent and deceiving to casual football fans who don't know any better (like many in this thread). Alex Smith is the #1 Urban Meyer QB and he only did well in Andy Reid's West Coast college offense, and was mediocre at his peak.
This guy Haskins is worse than Alex Smith. Far worse.
Slow in everything he does, inaccurate, a sloth with no footwork, horrendous deep ball, throws a duck at the slightest hint of pressure; sounds like you're describing Eli. Plus you said he's inaccurate, I didn't realize a 70% season completion percentage was inaccurate (67% in that Purdue game you linked).
Eli processes quickly and makes quick decisions. Haskins literally the opposite. Slow in everything.
Manufactured completions (Urban Meyer's system) doesn't mean he's accurate.
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In comment 14252699 Josh in the City said:
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In comment 14252667 The_Boss said:
Quote:
Do not waste a pick on a QB in this draft in any round. The time to do so was last spring and perhaps in 2020. OL, Edge, LB’s, FS.
Explain what you dislike about his game.
Urban Meyers isn’t known to produce pro ready QB’s. Alex Smith’s career was very underwhelming. The class itself sucks. I don’t want to take a player and feel like he was forced. It’s a strong defensive draft. We have issues at just about every position on defense. I’m fairly confident when all the testing, pro days, in private interviews/workouts are completed, the data will suggest that Haskins is not worthy of #6.
So basically nothing about Haskins himself or his play? You don’t like him bc of his coach and this QB class and how it will make you feel? That pretty much sums up most of the Haskins naysayers. Fact is, kid is the real deal.
You're clearly a casual football fan who doesn't understand the game. Haskins is far from the real deal. The guy blows.
I wouldn't take Haskins with the #38 pick, let alone the #6 pick.
Gettleman won't take him...and you will see on draft day. Gettleman is an elite scout. He doesn't get fooled by complete frauds like garbage ass Haskins.
I’m starting to think he is Paul Dottino
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In comment 14253129 SaqBar999 said:
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In comment 14253109 Dutch77 said:
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In comment 14253056 SaqBar999 said:
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In comment 14253007 Dutch77 said:
Quote:
In comment 14252971 SaqBar999 said:
Quote:
In comment 14252957 .McL. said:
Quote:
In comment 14252859 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
. Haskins blitz - ( New Window )
So what was I supposed to see there. That the OSU line adjusted very well to the overload and blitz on the offenses left side. And the fact that the line gave him all day long to hit a SHALLOW crossing route to a guy that was open by 5 yards...
Ok he saw the overload, walked to the line and made sure they knew who the mike was...
WOW, I'm impressed.
sarcasm off
Exactly.
Haskins is a fraud.
I beginning to think your issue with Haskins is deeper than his game.
It's exactly his game.
Haskins is a horrible QB
See link Link - ( New Window )
I watched it, what are your issues?
He is really really bad in everything u look for in an NFL franchise QB?
Slow in everything he does, inaccurate, a sloth with no footwork, horrendous deep ball, throws a duck at the slightest hint of pressure, never makes an NFL throw, is totally useless under pressure, gets easy manufactured Completions in Urban Meyer's system.
Urban Meyer QBs don't succeed in the NFL for a reason. They are system QBs. Their gaudy stats in college are fraudulent and deceiving to casual football fans who don't know any better (like many in this thread). Alex Smith is the #1 Urban Meyer QB and he only did well in Andy Reid's West Coast college offense, and was mediocre at his peak.
This guy Haskins is worse than Alex Smith. Far worse.
Slow in everything he does, inaccurate, a sloth with no footwork, horrendous deep ball, throws a duck at the slightest hint of pressure; sounds like you're describing Eli. Plus you said he's inaccurate, I didn't realize a 70% season completion percentage was inaccurate (67% in that Purdue game you linked).
Eli processes quickly and makes quick decisions. Haskins literally the opposite. Slow in everything.
Manufactured completions (Urban Meyer's system) doesn't mean he's accurate.
Not quick enogh to avoid being sacked 87 times the pst 2 years.
Quote:
you regale us some more about Dottino? That was enthralling earlier.
I’m starting to think he is Paul Dottino
LOL
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In comment 14252745 The_Boss said:
Quote:
In comment 14252699 Josh in the City said:
Quote:
In comment 14252667 The_Boss said:
Quote:
Do not waste a pick on a QB in this draft in any round. The time to do so was last spring and perhaps in 2020. OL, Edge, LB’s, FS.
Explain what you dislike about his game.
Urban Meyers isn’t known to produce pro ready QB’s. Alex Smith’s career was very underwhelming. The class itself sucks. I don’t want to take a player and feel like he was forced. It’s a strong defensive draft. We have issues at just about every position on defense. I’m fairly confident when all the testing, pro days, in private interviews/workouts are completed, the data will suggest that Haskins is not worthy of #6.
So basically nothing about Haskins himself or his play? You don’t like him bc of his coach and this QB class and how it will make you feel? That pretty much sums up most of the Haskins naysayers. Fact is, kid is the real deal.
You're clearly a casual football fan who doesn't understand the game. Haskins is far from the real deal. The guy blows.
I wouldn't take Haskins with the #38 pick, let alone the #6 pick.
Gettleman won't take him...and you will see on draft day. Gettleman is an elite scout. He doesn't get fooled by complete frauds like garbage ass Haskins.
Good thing you're not the GM.
Quote:
In comment 14252745 The_Boss said:
Quote:
In comment 14252699 Josh in the City said:
Quote:
In comment 14252667 The_Boss said:
Quote:
Do not waste a pick on a QB in this draft in any round. The time to do so was last spring and perhaps in 2020. OL, Edge, LB’s, FS.
Explain what you dislike about his game.
Urban Meyers isn’t known to produce pro ready QB’s. Alex Smith’s career was very underwhelming. The class itself sucks. I don’t want to take a player and feel like he was forced. It’s a strong defensive draft. We have issues at just about every position on defense. I’m fairly confident when all the testing, pro days, in private interviews/workouts are completed, the data will suggest that Haskins is not worthy of #6.
So basically nothing about Haskins himself or his play? You don’t like him bc of his coach and this QB class and how it will make you feel? That pretty much sums up most of the Haskins naysayers. Fact is, kid is the real deal.
You're clearly a casual football fan who doesn't understand the game. Haskins is far from the real deal. The guy blows.
I wouldn't take Haskins with the #38 pick, let alone the #6 pick.
Gettleman won't take him...and you will see on draft day. Gettleman is an elite scout. He doesn't get fooled by complete frauds like garbage ass Haskins.
Lol this guy.
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you regale us some more about Dottino? That was enthralling earlier.
I’m starting to think he is Paul Dottino
Wow, nailed it
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In comment 14253212 Josh in the City said:
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In comment 14252745 The_Boss said:
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In comment 14252699 Josh in the City said:
Quote:
In comment 14252667 The_Boss said:
Quote:
Do not waste a pick on a QB in this draft in any round. The time to do so was last spring and perhaps in 2020. OL, Edge, LB’s, FS.
Explain what you dislike about his game.
Urban Meyers isn’t known to produce pro ready QB’s. Alex Smith’s career was very underwhelming. The class itself sucks. I don’t want to take a player and feel like he was forced. It’s a strong defensive draft. We have issues at just about every position on defense. I’m fairly confident when all the testing, pro days, in private interviews/workouts are completed, the data will suggest that Haskins is not worthy of #6.
So basically nothing about Haskins himself or his play? You don’t like him bc of his coach and this QB class and how it will make you feel? That pretty much sums up most of the Haskins naysayers. Fact is, kid is the real deal.
You're clearly a casual football fan who doesn't understand the game. Haskins is far from the real deal. The guy blows.
I wouldn't take Haskins with the #38 pick, let alone the #6 pick.
Gettleman won't take him...and you will see on draft day. Gettleman is an elite scout. He doesn't get fooled by complete frauds like garbage ass Haskins.
Good thing you're not the GM.
Don't worry....the real GM won't be drafting Haskins.
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In comment 14252745 The_Boss said:
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In comment 14252699 Josh in the City said:
Quote:
In comment 14252667 The_Boss said:
Quote:
Do not waste a pick on a QB in this draft in any round. The time to do so was last spring and perhaps in 2020. OL, Edge, LB’s, FS.
Explain what you dislike about his game.
Urban Meyers isn’t known to produce pro ready QB’s. Alex Smith’s career was very underwhelming. The class itself sucks. I don’t want to take a player and feel like he was forced. It’s a strong defensive draft. We have issues at just about every position on defense. I’m fairly confident when all the testing, pro days, in private interviews/workouts are completed, the data will suggest that Haskins is not worthy of #6.
So basically nothing about Haskins himself or his play? You don’t like him bc of his coach and this QB class and how it will make you feel? That pretty much sums up most of the Haskins naysayers. Fact is, kid is the real deal.
You're clearly a casual football fan who doesn't understand the game. Haskins is far from the real deal. The guy blows.
I wouldn't take Haskins with the #38 pick, let alone the #6 pick.
Gettleman won't take him...and you will see on draft day. Gettleman is an elite scout. He doesn't get fooled by complete frauds like garbage ass Haskins.
#38? I would, sign me up!
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In comment 14252970 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
And dismiss it anyway because I’m “not an expert”
Ok. Nobody here should discuss prospects then.
I dismiss it because you state for a FACT that he is worth the #6 pick. Which is absolutely contrary to what almost every REAL expert out there is saying. And they have the benefit of all 14 games, talking to people around them, and in some cases probably talking to Haskins himself. So yeah, I tend to dismiss you're non-expert opinion as fact.
I’m calling BS here. Which “real expert” has said Haskins isn’t worth a top 6 pick? You stated this on another thread and your only point of reference was McShay who gave him the same grade he gave Mayfield last year and a higher one than he gave anyone in 2017. Not to mention, right there with Goff and Wentz.
CBS has him ranked 25th
https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/news/2019-nfl-draft-prospect-rankings-dwayne-haskins-josh-allen-and-other-prospects-raise-stock-after-bowl-games/
Here is an article (granted its from Nov 3rd but it makes the same point I am making about experience)
[url]https://heavy.com/sports/2018/11/dwayne-haskins-is-the-ohio-st-qb-a-first-round-selection/[url]
Rivals' MIKE FARRELL'S take
“This is a really weak quarterback class compared to last year, and I’m not sure Haskins would have been a first-rounder last April with Baker Mayfield, Sam Darnold, Josh Allen, Josh Rosen and Lamar Jackson. However, who else are you going to take in the first round, if not Haskins? With Herbert coming back and guys like Jones, Grier and Lock being second- or third-rounders, you know someone will make Haskins a first-rounder. I’m a little bit surprised at his development in college because I didn’t see him as a Heisman candidate, but he’s done a great job under the tutelage of Day. Will he be an NFL star? I don’t see it, but I’ve certainly been wrong before.”
Mike Farrell's view coincides with mine... The only reason Haskins will get pushed up into top 20 or higher is because there are no other choices... Experts are moving him up for that reason as well... Just because there isn't a better choice at QB doesn't make him a good pick especially as high as #6.
Do I need to continue?
Over.
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In comment 14253243 SaqBar999 said:
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In comment 14253212 Josh in the City said:
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In comment 14252745 The_Boss said:
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In comment 14252699 Josh in the City said:
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In comment 14252667 The_Boss said:
Quote:
Do not waste a pick on a QB in this draft in any round. The time to do so was last spring and perhaps in 2020. OL, Edge, LB’s, FS.
Explain what you dislike about his game.
Urban Meyers isn’t known to produce pro ready QB’s. Alex Smith’s career was very underwhelming. The class itself sucks. I don’t want to take a player and feel like he was forced. It’s a strong defensive draft. We have issues at just about every position on defense. I’m fairly confident when all the testing, pro days, in private interviews/workouts are completed, the data will suggest that Haskins is not worthy of #6.
So basically nothing about Haskins himself or his play? You don’t like him bc of his coach and this QB class and how it will make you feel? That pretty much sums up most of the Haskins naysayers. Fact is, kid is the real deal.
You're clearly a casual football fan who doesn't understand the game. Haskins is far from the real deal. The guy blows.
I wouldn't take Haskins with the #38 pick, let alone the #6 pick.
Gettleman won't take him...and you will see on draft day. Gettleman is an elite scout. He doesn't get fooled by complete frauds like garbage ass Haskins.
Good thing you're not the GM.
Don't worry....the real GM won't be drafting Haskins.
Let me guess he called you and said as much right.
Lol. I thought you wanted experts? Chris Traspasso is awful and Mike covers high school recruiting.
So says who? You?
Now you are the expert?
What do you have backing you up?
A bunch of mocks... As I said before mocks don't count, that is the GUESS as to what team will do in the draft. Its not a ranking.
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When I watch his game there are some things that concern me, bu there are concerns about almost every guy.
My point about Haskins is that he has not played long enough, and he has played with surrounding talent that is so superior to the opponent, that I think it's almost impossible to make a meaningful evaluation.
In the past prospect like this have a higher than normal bust rate. I don't like taking that kind of a chance at #6. At #38, yes, not #6.
Again, this is untrue. 3 QBs since the 70’s have made 15 or fewer starts and been first round picks. One bust (Sanchez), one hit (Cam Newton) and one jury is still out (Trubisky)
Uh talk about cherry picking a stat...
Read and learn about how college games started relates to NFL success.
This is old wisdom that has not changed...
Here is an article from 2008
http://www.espn.com/nfl/news/story?id=3350135
However, there is a more complex reason why games started is an important indicator. In general, NFL scouts do an excellent job of talent evaluation when they have enough information. The more film that exists of a player, the easier it is to find weaknesses. When scouts don't get sufficient information, they place too much weight on "measurables" and off-field workouts, and make mistakes like Couch, Leaf or Akili Smith.
Sometimes, when a player starts a lot of games, scouts have enough film to figure out that he is truly a "system quarterback," and not an NFL prospect. That's why Kliff Kingsbury and Chris Leak were not drafted high despite strong college numbers. Because of the assumption that scouts can do their job with the right information, these projections apply only to quarterbacks chosen in the first two rounds.
certainly 14 is wayyyyy below that benchmark.
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In comment 14253069 .McL. said:
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When I watch his game there are some things that concern me, bu there are concerns about almost every guy.
My point about Haskins is that he has not played long enough, and he has played with surrounding talent that is so superior to the opponent, that I think it's almost impossible to make a meaningful evaluation.
In the past prospect like this have a higher than normal bust rate. I don't like taking that kind of a chance at #6. At #38, yes, not #6.
Again, this is untrue. 3 QBs since the 70’s have made 15 or fewer starts and been first round picks. One bust (Sanchez), one hit (Cam Newton) and one jury is still out (Trubisky)
Uh talk about cherry picking a stat...
Read and learn about how college games started relates to NFL success.
This is old wisdom that has not changed...
Here is an article from 2008
http://www.espn.com/nfl/news/story?id=3350135
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However, there is a more complex reason why games started is an important indicator. In general, NFL scouts do an excellent job of talent evaluation when they have enough information....
Uh, from your article
Chad Henne (47 starts, 59.7 percent completion rate)
Henne is the type of player scouts never miss on -- a four-year starter from an elite college program. His 59.7 percent completion rate isn't bad, but it isn't that good either. Henne never displayed the consistency of an elite quarterback while at Michigan, but he did show an NFL arm.
Henne's college stats are quite similar to those of another big-time recruit from a big-time school who had an inconsistent career -- Carson Palmer. Palmer started 45 games and completed 59.1 percent of passes, but finished on a positive note by winning the Rose Bowl and Heisman Trophy and consequently went No. 1 overall. Henne didn't finish as strong, and isn't quite as good a prospect, but isn't as far off as some might think. After a nice performance at the Senior Bowl, he seems to have an outside shot at the first round, and would be a good pick there. He is a virtual lock to be at least an above-average professional.
LOL
Here is an actual peer reviewed study done which shares the underlying methodology used. Their conclusion:
The reason people hone in on games played in college has nothing to do with predicting future success. It has to do with evaluators distrust in their ability to evaluate a player with limited data available to them. Hence, why conclusions drawn are subject to the law of small numbers.
It's very obvious that you and your dupe sxdxca come to the table with preconceived notions and then try and find data to back up those notions, especially when called out on it. You shared an article from 2008 that claims to have done a study without sharing the underlying methodology. In the real world, that gets thrown out immediately and when you went to backup your claim about the "real experts" all saying Haskins wasn't worthy of a high draft selection you shared an article from heavy.com and Chris Trappasso...
Guys like Greg Gabriel, Dan Orlovsky, Boomer, Dane Brugler, Todd McShay, Eric Galko, Jordan Reid, and many others think very highly of Haskins. Does that mean he'll be an all-pro and has no holes in his game? No, he's raw and has mechanical issues to work on. But he has sky high upside. It's not nearly as black and white as some here seem to feel strongly about. But hey, never let the facts get in the way of a good narrative!
Link - ( New Window )
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In comment 14253073 SaqBar999 said:
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In comment 14253066 ajr2456 said:
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.
You have to be football retarded to think this guy is a good QB.
He is atrocious
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12/18
What are some of your previous handles?
Ad hominem attack
Haskins is really really bad, and Dave Gettleman knows it.
He will be there at 6, and the Giants will easily pass without thinking twice.
Bottom line.
Ah, the classic Simo defense tactic. Go visit your dad in the clink.
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In comment 14253096 Strahan91 said:
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In comment 14253069 .McL. said:
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When I watch his game there are some things that concern me, bu there are concerns about almost every guy.
My point about Haskins is that he has not played long enough, and he has played with surrounding talent that is so superior to the opponent, that I think it's almost impossible to make a meaningful evaluation.
In the past prospect like this have a higher than normal bust rate. I don't like taking that kind of a chance at #6. At #38, yes, not #6.
Again, this is untrue. 3 QBs since the 70’s have made 15 or fewer starts and been first round picks. One bust (Sanchez), one hit (Cam Newton) and one jury is still out (Trubisky)
Uh talk about cherry picking a stat...
Read and learn about how college games started relates to NFL success.
This is old wisdom that has not changed...
Here is an article from 2008
http://www.espn.com/nfl/news/story?id=3350135
Quote:
However, there is a more complex reason why games started is an important indicator. In general, NFL scouts do an excellent job of talent evaluation when they have enough information....
Uh, from your article
Quote:
Chad Henne (47 starts, 59.7 percent completion rate)
Henne is the type of player scouts never miss on -- a four-year starter from an elite college program. His 59.7 percent completion rate isn't bad, but it isn't that good either. Henne never displayed the consistency of an elite quarterback while at Michigan, but he did show an NFL arm.
Henne's college stats are quite similar to those of another big-time recruit from a big-time school who had an inconsistent career -- Carson Palmer. Palmer started 45 games and completed 59.1 percent of passes, but finished on a positive note by winning the Rose Bowl and Heisman Trophy and consequently went No. 1 overall. Henne didn't finish as strong, and isn't quite as good a prospect, but isn't as far off as some might think. After a nice performance at the Senior Bowl, he seems to have an outside shot at the first round, and would be a good pick there. He is a virtual lock to be at least an above-average professional.
LOL
Evaluating is still a crapshoot. What more games started allows the evaluators is more data points about the player to reduce the risk of failure. WIth more datapoints some players eliminate themselves, others don't. Nothing is surefire. I never said it was.
Neither is Jones, although I like him better.
Both would be, dare I say a 'Reach'.
Haskins to me has beast or bust written all over him,
would be very leery with that pick!