The ARI Cardinals - Kyler Murray - Josh Rosen

How do you view Kyler Murray. How do you compare him to Mayfield ?(knowing your grades are far from done)

Would be interesting. But wasn't Kingsbury just praising Josh Rosen yesterday? I thought I read something.

In comment 14256291 Jarvis said:

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How do you view Kyler Murray. How do you compare him to Mayfield ?(knowing your grades are far from done)

He's previously said he does not like him and believes his best position in the NFL is RB. I wonder if he's changed that opinion.

My goodness, he was awful this season. I like the idea, but I can't trade that pick for him.

using the first pick for a 5’9”, 170 lb QB would be incredulous.

And I really like Kyler Murray.

What were your thoughts on Rosen's rookie year?

"Kyler is a freak…..I would take him with the first pick of the draft if I could."


(via @EricKellyTV) pic.twitter.com/N9m99DkTNr
u can - ( New Window )

I want to reserve the right to do my full work on him, but my initial thought is "No Way".

Second, Rosen's rookie year was abysmal. But if you thought NYG's line was bad, go watch ARI. It may have been the worst OL the NFL has seen in years. Rosen had no shot back there. And the throws he did make, his arm talent is already among the best. Still has a ways to go but, as I thought last year, he is the top QB in that class.

In comment 14256298 bw in dc said:

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using the first pick for a 5’9”, 170 lb QB would be incredulous. And I really like Kyler Murray.

I'm in the exact same boat.

In comment 14256304 Sy'56 said:

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Second, Rosen's rookie year was abysmal. But if you thought NYG's line was bad, go watch ARI. It may have been the worst OL the NFL has seen in years. Rosen had no shot back there. And the throws he did make, his arm talent is already among the best. Still has a ways to go but, as I thought last year, he is the top QB in that class.

You want to tell me trade down, recoup our third round pick, then trade that for Rosen? Fine. But, #6 is too rich for my blood.

It would need to be on draft day. No way Arizon takes Murray number 1 overall and pass on Bosa. They'll take Bosa number 1 and if Murray is still there at 6, which he should be, then that is when the trade would happen.

...

In comment 14256310 shockeyisthebest8056 said:

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In comment 14256304 Sy'56 said: Quote: Second, Rosen's rookie year was abysmal. But if you thought NYG's line was bad, go watch ARI. It may have been the worst OL the NFL has seen in years. Rosen had no shot back there. And the throws he did make, his arm talent is already among the best. Still has a ways to go but, as I thought last year, he is the top QB in that class. You want to tell me trade down, recoup our third round pick, then trade that for Rosen? Fine. But, #6 is too rich for my blood.

If Rosen was in this draft...#6 would be more than worth it.

Interesting thread

for Rosen? Think they'd bite? We get to keep #6 that way and draft a DL or edge rusher.

for Rosen in a heartbeat. I would probably give another pick on top of it. You would end up having come out of the 2018 draft with the best QB and best player. Totally worth it

#6 would be ridiculous for a guy who will be out of a job and, as you said, had an abysmal year.

and when it came down to whom to select at #2 overall, I would have been equally happy with Darnold or Rosen instead of Saquon, and I loved Saquon and had been following him closely since early in 16.

UCLA vs USC in 2017, Rosen looked like a better NFL prospect than Darnold, hands down. In general, I've rarely seen a QB suffer more drops from his receivers than Rosen suffered at UCLA over 16 & 17. His receivers were abysmal.

In comment 14256298 bw in dc said:

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using the first pick for a 5’9”, 170 lb QB would be incredulous. And I really like Kyler Murray.

Where do you take that height and weight from? I’ve read 5’10 and 5’11 with everything saying either 190 and 195 pounds. Not saying you are wrong or trying to start an argument just really wonder what his actual size is. I remember last year Mayfield was shrinking by the week and he measured and weighed out pretty much as listed at the combine.

In comment 14256319 mattyblue said:

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for Rosen in a heartbeat. I would probably give another pick on top of it. You would end up having come out of the 2018 draft with the best QB and best player. Totally worth it

Your best QB was the fourth QB to come off the board in 2018. That happened for a reason.

In comment 14256304 Sy'56 said:

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I want to reserve the right to do my full work on him, but my initial thought is "No Way". Second, Rosen's rookie year was abysmal. But if you thought NYG's line was bad, go watch ARI. It may have been the worst OL the NFL has seen in years. Rosen had no shot back there. And the throws he did make, his arm talent is already among the best. Still has a ways to go but, as I thought last year, he is the top QB in that class.

Every QB taken in the first round showed flashes. Mayfield may win ROTY. Darnold finished the last quarter of the season well. Allen was incredible in his ability to get yards rushing. I think he led the league in rushing yards from Thanksgiving on. LJax was a greater threat in the running game than even I thought. And like you said, Rosen showed off his great throwing ability in small spurts.

But you are right. Rosen’s supporting cast was a train wreck. That oline was a sieve. The good thing was he survived without being injured like he was too often at UCLA.

Undoubtedly the talent is there...

In comment 14256315 Sy'56 said:

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If Rosen was in this draft...#6 would be more than worth it.

But he isn't in this draft. We got to see him this past season and it's safe to say of the 4 teams that drafted QBs early in the first round, Arizona is easily the least enamored. I understand their OL is worse than the Giants and it wasn't remotely all Rosen's fault. However, the Jets, Bills, and Browns aren't trading their young QB for the 6th pick or any pick. If Rosen impressed as much as those three, it wouldn't matter how much KK loves Murray. We simply would not be having this discussion.

Like I said earlier, I like the idea of trading for him. I just don't like the idea of trading the 6th pick in the draft for him.

The key to whether Josh Rosen could be a viable trade option will depend on how Gettleman and Shurmur graded him last year.

In comment 14256331 shockeyisthebest8056 said:

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In comment 14256315 Sy'56 said: Quote: If Rosen was in this draft...#6 would be more than worth it. But he isn't in this draft. We got to see him this past season and it's safe to say of the 4 teams that drafted QBs early in the first round, Arizona is easily the least enamored. I understand their OL is worse than the Giants and it wasn't remotely all Rosen's fault. However, the Jets, Bills, and Browns aren't trading their young QB for the 6th pick or any pick. If Rosen impressed as much as those three, it wouldn't matter how much KK loves Murray. We simply would not be having this discussion. Like I said earlier, I like the idea of trading for him. I just don't like the idea of trading the 6th pick in the draft for him.

Disagree about the Bills and Josh Allen. The guy had a 52% completion percentage. It was 56% in college and historically that doesn't improve from college to the NFL. Allen might never be accurate enough to be a good QB in the NFL.

Thankfully you aren't the GM

but I'm still concerned about his concussion history.

Had a 66.7 passer rating. Eli had a 55.4 rating his rookie season.

In comment 14256297 shockeyisthebest8056 said:

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My goodness, he was awful this season. I like the idea, but I can't trade that pick for him.

His team wasn’t very good. Put him on the Browns this past year with those weapons and defense and you would see him flourish. Can’t compare mayfield situation to Rosen, darnold or Allen. I think darnold and Allen actually showed more promise than what mayfield did. That’s just my opinion. When it’s all said and done I would say darnold Allen Rosen and then mayfield in that order.

Can you imagine if such a deal could be worked out. All the bitching on BBI about the Giants not taking Darnold or Rosen in 2017 would end. Both crowds (take QB, take Barkley)from last year would be happy as we would have Barkley and Rosen.


All kidding aside, Rosen would easily be the best QB in this draft, and certainly worthy of the #6 pick.

That would be awesome!

I know these would be different circumstance but the fact remains...

A few weeks ago this guy in my office who works as an independent contractor with NFL clubs cap departments mentioned that Arizona had soured on Rosen because of his personality. He thought he could be had in a trade and thought the Giants may explore it. He actually said he thought Rosen would be a Giant.

This guy has a rep for being a blowhard, so I just nodded and went on with my day, thinking that rumor was so far out there it couldn’t be true. Maybe it does have legs.

of the day.

Rosen was my choice for QB last year. Yes I would trade #6 for Rosen. But Murray will not be a high 1st rounder. He is way to small for probably 30 out of 32 teams. Seems to be a high character guy, crazy fast and quick with a VG arm.

Sign me up.

In comment 14256358 Jimmy Googs said:

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I know these would be different circumstance but the fact remains...

THey passed on him for what the considered a better player. Who knows if he was their highest rated QB or not. They passed on Chubb and Nelson, too. You don't think they would take either if they had the chance?

.

In comment 14256358 Jimmy Googs said:

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I know these would be different circumstance but the fact remains...

We didn’t pass on Rosen. We passed on every qb for a generational freak talent. We would have passed on mayfield as well and I truly believe that DG wanted Barkley all along. I would 100 percent trade the six overall for Rosen right now and I beleive to get him would cost more than that

Kliff Kingsbury back on October 28, 2018:

"Kyler is a freak.....I would take him with the first pick of the draft if I could."

👀👀👀
(via @EricKellyTV)

said yesterday that Arizona should/could draft Haskins and trade Josh Rosen. It's interesting that a similar idea has developed. if the Cardinals are willing to trade a known quantity for an unknown quantity, that seems to not be a great endorsement of Rosen by the people who saw him up close every day.

Over trading for Rosen

In comment 14256373 twostepgiants said:

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Kliff Kingsbury back on October 28, 2018: "Kyler is a freak.....I would take him with the first pick of the draft if I could." 👀👀👀 (via @EricKellyTV)

Haha, well now he could

Nothing would scream 'directionless franchise' more than quitting on a QB after one year in which the team fielded a horrific roster and then fired their first year head coach.

If he’s for sale, I would absolutely pull the trigger on the #6. You release Eli, save the $$, and finally feel as if this thing is moving forward.

you keep and continue to develop him and use use the best picks in the draft to rebuild that OL.

Getting rid of him after 1 year is nonsense, imo. Their new HC might not even last 2 years there for all we know and then what?

Will never happen, imv, especially if JR is as good or has the potential to be good as you guys say he is.

In comment 14256379 Ten Ton Hammer said:

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Nothing would scream 'directionless franchise' more than quitting on a QB after one year in which the team fielded a horrific roster and then fired their first year head coach.

Add to it, that in the introductory presser, they admitted that they would like to run a 3-4 a year after they switched to the 4-3. Keim said he is looking for a veteran coach to install the new defense. I would trade them Bettcher.

In comment 14256376 NikkiMac said:

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Over trading for Rosen

You might, but Rosen is the better QB. I like Haskins, but Rosen is better.

In comment 14256326 mattyblue said:

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Where do you take that height and weight from? I’ve read 5’10 and 5’11 with everything saying either 190 and 195 pounds. Not saying you are wrong or trying to start an argument just really wonder what his actual size is. I remember last year Mayfield was shrinking by the week and he measured and weighed out pretty much as listed at the combine.

You’re right. I will use his height/weight out of high school when he was a college prospect. To me, he looks like the same kid. In their roster guide, Oklahoma just rounds up to make him seem bigger... ; )

I love the kid’s skills, have been touting him all year as the most prolific dual threat QB I’ve ever seen in college. But his size is going to be a very big deal for the draft - even if he’s 5’10”, 190. Manziel looked very small on TV. Murray looks even smaller...

is 5'9

But if Rosen can be had in a trade, I would like to get an extra pick from AZ along with Rosen, like at least their 3rd round pick.

So we trade our 6th pick overall for Rosen and Arizona’s 3rd round pick which is the first pick of the 3rd round.

I would so that for sure.

to take his lumps last year is worth the #6 pick.

Instead of Rosen marinating on the bench "learning" from Eli we are able to dissect his value behind the worst OL in the NFL past 10 years is very valuable

In comment 14256397 CromartiesKid21 said:

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to take his lumps last year is worth the #6 pick. Instead of Rosen marinating on the bench "learning" from Eli we are able to dissect his value behind the worst OL in the NFL past 10 years is very valuable

Also, Arizona would eat the signing bonus and we would pick up the valuable 5th year option.